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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Hepren D'narr
Gallente Downfall inc.
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Posted - 2009.03.12 13:51:00 -
[241]
Originally by: NightmareX
Originally by: Fistme
Originally by: Hepren D'narr How about... Boost Blasters damage (something x 1.5 like), a bit more optimal but less falloff. Then, boost AC:s giving them more tracking and falloff (maybe some damage increase needed? idk). How does that sound?
Sounds broken...
It sounds alot more than just broken tbh.
It called more like making PVP combat in EVE extremely unbalanced. And doing that is more then just broken.
Care to explain why? It would make Blaster really effecitve at close range and AC's would work at their intented range well better then now.
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Ig Neus
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Posted - 2009.03.12 13:52:00 -
[242]
Originally by: Tzar'rim
I would argue that the Rokh actually is one of the best blasterships, if used in a fleet. For solo/small gang however the mega is king. Same thing for the Mael; great in fleet, not so good solo/small gang.
Well generally fleet warfare is about sniping or at least long range battleships. No Blastership has a place there. Rokh, just like Maelstrom, is a nice ship for small gangs as well, as long as you have people to tackle for you so you do not have to gimp your tank.
Personally, if I were to crosstrain for another Battleship, it would probably be Maelstrom. Not because it is the best (Abaddon takes that spot) but because I prefer the idea of actively tanking ~1000 DPS for over 2 mins without even using my Cap Booster and doing close to 1150 DPS (yes yes this is EFT number, not real one) using Hail.
Anyway, my point is that while Rokh can be a nice Battleship even for small gangs (under same conditions as any other shield tank, aka you do not have to fit scrambler/web in your mediums), it has one deffensive bonus (that helps in close range fights but does not influence blasters) and a mainly sniping offensive bonus. So it is not a nice platform to use for evaluating Blasters.
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Tzar'rim
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Posted - 2009.03.12 13:54:00 -
[243]
Well yes, not fleet... fleet, but shortrange. We're talking about blasters remember :P
Self-proclaimed idiot
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NightmareX
Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil
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Posted - 2009.03.12 14:05:00 -
[244]
Originally by: Hepren D'narr
Originally by: NightmareX
Originally by: Fistme
Originally by: Hepren D'narr How about... Boost Blasters damage (something x 1.5 like), a bit more optimal but less falloff. Then, boost AC:s giving them more tracking and falloff (maybe some damage increase needed? idk). How does that sound?
Sounds broken...
It sounds alot more than just broken tbh.
It called more like making PVP combat in EVE extremely unbalanced. And doing that is more then just broken.
Care to explain why? It would make Blaster really effecitve at close range and AC's would work at their intented range well better then now.
Do i really need to explan why?.
Are you guys so stupid to not see why it would be really really bad for PVP and why it would make combat / PVP unbalanced in EVE?.
Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise |
MenanceWhite
Amarr SniggWaffe
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Posted - 2009.03.12 14:14:00 -
[245]
Originally by: Hepren D'narr Care to explain why?
Because then you'll suddenly find killer taranis and feroxes flying around while at the same time pushing the AC more towards range direction where it's still outclassed by pulse lasers. ---
Originally by: Torfi There's alot. That can be done. With.. corpses
Originally by: Oveur
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Hepren D'narr
Gallente Downfall inc.
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Posted - 2009.03.12 14:15:00 -
[246]
Try it. I would like to hear why it would make PvP so unbalanced. I myself have done some gallante pvp, but I want like to hear your opinion about this issue.
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sophisticatedlimabean
Gallente Delinquent Habits
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Posted - 2009.03.12 14:32:00 -
[247]
Originally by: NightmareX
Nope, your wrong. Or for me your totally wrong.
My stats and results of actually flying a ship and test a ship to it's limits, it worth 5678567300 times more for ME than silly EFT numbers.
Sissi stats and sissi opinions for a full time sissi warrior and all of it worthless for TQ and as such worthless for this thread as its about blasters in actual pvp on TQ.
My views may reflect those of my corp/alliance, but if you wanna know for sure ask em for gods sake. |
Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.03.12 14:34:00 -
[248]
Originally by: prodalt
Originally by: Liang Nuren
I know what you're saying... but there's alot of people that are saying that what you see *on sisi* doesn't line up with what they see *on tq*. And TQ *DOES* take precedence. So if you want to refute them... use TQ to do so.
-Liang
They're both anecdotal and spurious accounts
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NightmareX
Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil
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Posted - 2009.03.12 14:35:00 -
[249]
Edited by: NightmareX on 12/03/2009 14:36:18
Originally by: sophisticatedlimabean
Originally by: NightmareX
Nope, your wrong. Or for me your totally wrong.
My stats and results of actually flying a ship and test a ship to it's limits, it worth 5678567300 times more for ME than silly EFT numbers.
Sissi stats and sissi opinions for a full time sissi warrior and all of it worthless for TQ and as such worthless for this thread as its about blasters in actual pvp on TQ.
So you mean my stats that actually are worth more than you even can imagine are not worth anything on TQ, when they helps me with alot of things on TQ only because it's from sisi?.
I don't care if i get the stats from my self or my dog on Sisi or even from santa claus. As long the stats are helping me on many things, then i'm happy.
Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise |
Alpha Prime
Destructive Influence KenZoku
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Posted - 2009.03.12 16:00:00 -
[250]
All i know is that today i setup a Megathron for gank with Neutron and 3x mag2's and i was hitting a Rohk for 2-300 on his hull when he wasn't moving. And i got maxed skills for blasters. None of us were moving. So final conclusion is that L-Blasters SUXX atm.
Oveur 2006: We're going to make blobwarfare less effective. Oveur 2008: We're installing better code so players can bring bigger blobs.
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Tzar'rim
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Posted - 2009.03.12 16:07:00 -
[251]
Originally by: Alpha Prime
All i know is that today i setup a Megathron for gank with Neutron and 3x mag2's and i was hitting a Rohk for 2-300 on his hull when he wasn't moving. And i got maxed skills for blasters. None of us were moving. So final conclusion is that L-Blasters SUXX atm.
Yes because the thing that got changed was blaster damage, that's why it's "crap" now. With this sort of reasoning, why are you in the corp you're in?
Self-proclaimed idiot
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NightmareX
Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil
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Posted - 2009.03.12 16:13:00 -
[252]
Edited by: NightmareX on 12/03/2009 16:17:24
Originally by: Alpha Prime
All i know is that today i setup a Megathron for gank with Neutron and 3x mag2's and i was hitting a Rohk for 2-300 on his hull when he wasn't moving. And i got maxed skills for blasters. None of us were moving. So final conclusion is that L-Blasters SUXX atm.
If the Rokh had a Damage Control II fitted, then yes, those damages are normal.
Before the hull resists, you would take 550-650 damage per gun, it will be random on what the damage will be from time to time. So take 600 damage per gun for example before DC II x 7 guns. That will be 4200 damage. And 4200 damage per volley will pop a non Damage Control II fitted Rokh in hull in 3 volleys.
And that's normal. Seems pretty accurate to me.
Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise |
Alpha Prime
Destructive Influence KenZoku
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Posted - 2009.03.12 16:34:00 -
[253]
Exactly my point. L-Blaster damage is only good on paper. Once everything is taken into account, the damage isn't that good. You have to realize that Kin&Them damage is the overall mostly resisted types. Considering the HP-buff, the insane Cap-use and ****ty tracking, blasters currently have way too much speaking against the use of them.
A Battleship setup with blasters needs to be able to rip through other ships, just like they did pre-castor when a Megathron with 5 Neutrons could **** a raven once it got close.
Oveur 2006: We're going to make blobwarfare less effective. Oveur 2008: We're installing better code so players can bring bigger blobs.
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NightmareX
Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil
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Posted - 2009.03.12 16:57:00 -
[254]
Originally by: Alpha Prime A Battleship setup with blasters needs to be able to rip through other ships, just like they did pre-castor when a Megathron with 5 Neutrons could **** a raven once it got close.
Yeah, but wasn't the HP buff to all ships because ships should last longer in PVP then?.
Don't whine that ship doesn't instapop to you when they are in Hull, because it's not supposed to be like that.
Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise |
Ig Neus
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Posted - 2009.03.12 16:58:00 -
[255]
Originally by: Alpha Prime You have to realize that Kin&Them damage is the overall mostly resisted types. /Edit: And everything does good damage on unresisted Hull. Try a t2 1400 or t2 Tachy....
A) No way. EM is mostly tanked type on the vast majority of Gallente and Amarr Battleships that fit Trimarks + EANMs. It is also the same for Minmatar Armor tanked Battleships. Things can be different on tech 2 boats but we are discussing Battleship class weapons here and they usually are used against Battleships.
B) Hull has same resistances to each damage type (0). So everything does good damage on unresisted Hull but Blasters do the best since they do the best generally.
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Alpha Prime
Destructive Influence KenZoku
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Posted - 2009.03.12 17:02:00 -
[256]
Originally by: NightmareX
Yeah, but wasn't the HP buff to all ships because ships should last longer in PVP then?.
Don't whine that ship doesn't instapop to you when they are in Hull, because it's not supposed to be like that.
No. Its supposed to be like if you get a blastership next to you, shooting you, you're dead unless you can warp away or the blastership gets jammed. THAT is how it's suppose to be. I always like to compared Blasterships with Mike Tyson. If you stay out of range from his arms, you're fine. But if you get hit... R.I.P.
Oveur 2006: We're going to make blobwarfare less effective. Oveur 2008: We're installing better code so players can bring bigger blobs.
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marakor
Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers
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Posted - 2009.03.12 17:05:00 -
[257]
Originally by: Alpha Prime
Originally by: NightmareX
Yeah, but wasn't the HP buff to all ships because ships should last longer in PVP then?.
Don't whine that ship doesn't instapop to you when they are in Hull, because it's not supposed to be like that.
No. Its supposed to be like if you get a blastership next to you, shooting you, you're dead unless you can warp away or the blastership gets jammed. THAT is how it's suppose to be. I always like to compared Blasterships with Mike Tyson. If you stay out of range from his arms, you're fine. But if you get hit... R.I.P.
The problem is that the other boxers especially amarr boxers have only 30% less power (after standard resists) and 1000% more reach.
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Liang Nuren
No Salvation Blackguard Coalition
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Posted - 2009.03.12 17:30:00 -
[258]
Originally by: Ig Neus
Personally, if I were to crosstrain for another Battleship, it would probably be Maelstrom. Not because it is the best (Abaddon takes that spot) but because I prefer the idea of actively tanking ~1000 DPS for over 2 mins without even using my Cap Booster and doing close to 1150 DPS (yes yes this is EFT number, not real one) using Hail.
Yeah... about that. Hail L was crap *before* they nerfed webs. Now it doesn't even bear mentioning.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
Ig Neus
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Posted - 2009.03.12 17:43:00 -
[259]
Edited by: Ig Neus on 12/03/2009 17:44:01
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Ig Neus
Personally, if I were to crosstrain for another Battleship, it would probably be Maelstrom. Not because it is the best (Abaddon takes that spot) but because I prefer the idea of actively tanking ~1000 DPS for over 2 mins without even using my Cap Booster and doing close to 1150 DPS (yes yes this is EFT number, not real one) using Hail.
Yeah... about that. Hail L was crap *before* they nerfed webs. Now it doesn't even bear mentioning.
-Liang
Well Liang I fly together with people in Gank Megathrons camping war targets in stations. And I mean literally staying on the undock point and waiting.
So targets we attack get enough webs (1/Megathron + some from tacklers :p)on them and Range is not a big issue either.
This probably is the reason I find Blaster ships (and Hail L) to be ok :P
Edit : When not camping something, I hate flying Battleships. In fact I generally hate flying anything bigger than Cruiser but I can understand the need of flying bigger things for those situations ;p
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Liang Nuren
No Salvation Blackguard Coalition
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Posted - 2009.03.12 17:48:00 -
[260]
Ya but even in situations like that, Hail is pretty crap (I've used it a bit myself there). About the only time I'd recommend it is if you're hitting a cap ship.
-Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org |
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Zubakis
Bambooule
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Posted - 2009.03.12 17:51:00 -
[261]
Originally by: Ig Neus
Well Liang I fly together with people in Gank Megathrons camping war targets in stations. And I mean literally staying on the undock point and waiting.
So targets we attack get enough webs (1/Megathron + some from tacklers :p)on them and Range is not a big issue either.
This probably is the reason I find Blaster ships (and Hail L) to be ok :P
Yeah, that's what blasterships good at, sit at undock point and gank stuff
I want a Mike Tyson. -- Zuba |
Ig Neus
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Posted - 2009.03.12 18:09:00 -
[262]
Originally by: Liang Nuren Ya but even in situations like that, Hail is pretty crap (I've used it a bit myself there). About the only time I'd recommend it is if you're hitting a cap ship.
-Liang
I'll take your word for that since I have 0 Skill Points in Projectiles... :P
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NightmareX
Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil
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Posted - 2009.03.12 18:30:00 -
[263]
Originally by: Zubakis
Originally by: Ig Neus
Well Liang I fly together with people in Gank Megathrons camping war targets in stations. And I mean literally staying on the undock point and waiting.
So targets we attack get enough webs (1/Megathron + some from tacklers :p)on them and Range is not a big issue either.
This probably is the reason I find Blaster ships (and Hail L) to be ok :P
Yeah, that's what blasterships good at, sit at undock point and gank stuff
I want a Mike Tyson.
Or just warp in right on top of the target(s) and blast them to hell, woooooosssshhhh.
Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise |
JadeMako
Aliastra
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Posted - 2009.03.12 18:51:00 -
[264]
Originally by: NightmareX
Or just warp in right on top of the target(s) and blast them to hell, woooooosssshhhh.
Yeah gosh its fun doing that on Sisi *shucks*
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LLM Raoul
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Posted - 2009.03.12 19:01:00 -
[265]
I'm not skilled or experienced but I can tell by the way people that play Minnie fit and cherish their ships that maybe they're not the best, but they sure as hell have bastard ships from hell that are fast, fun, and versatile.
My training currently is going towards the Hurricane (both Arty and AC) for missioning and low-sec piracy, and my long term plan involves the Vaga.
The Vaga is an art and it's very much like weed: a state of spirit that causes addiction.
Sidenote: Zealot cross-training seems like an absolute must for the low-sec pirate. So for full versatility cross-train this if you ain't in any hurry. Besides... Who cares about proficiency and time spent on training etc.? Minnie ships I said + Zealot at the end is teh win.
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NightmareX
Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil
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Posted - 2009.03.12 19:03:00 -
[266]
Edited by: NightmareX on 12/03/2009 19:05:32
Originally by: JadeMako
Originally by: NightmareX
Or just warp in right on top of the target(s) and blast them to hell, woooooosssshhhh.
Yeah gosh its fun doing that on Sisi *shucks*
LOL.
Well, you can still do it on TQ to, duh, it just take 2 clicks. 1. Jump in. 2. Warp to one of your gang mates that are pretty close to them.
Easy peasy.
Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise |
marakor
Gallente Anti Lag Forum Smackers
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Posted - 2009.03.12 19:09:00 -
[267]
Originally by: NightmareX Edited by: NightmareX on 12/03/2009 19:05:32
Originally by: JadeMako
Originally by: NightmareX
Or just warp in right on top of the target(s) and blast them to hell, woooooosssshhhh.
Yeah gosh its fun doing that on Sisi *shucks*
LOL.
Well, you can still do it on TQ to, duh, it just take 2 clicks. 1. Jump in. 2. Warp to one of your gang mates that are pretty close to them.
Easy peasy.
Maybe kill the first ship and then spend the rest of the fight mwding around trying to get into range and doing crap dmg.....
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Ad Valorem
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Posted - 2009.03.12 19:16:00 -
[268]
Originally by: marakor
Originally by: NightmareX
LOL.
Well, you can still do it on TQ to, duh, it just take 2 clicks. 1. Jump in. 2. Warp to one of your gang mates that are pretty close to them.
Easy peasy.
Maybe kill the first ship and then spend the rest of the fight mwding around trying to get into range and doing crap dmg.....
And target is either completely stationary with multi webs on it and preferably a target painter, or is battleship size or bigger (and hope he is also staying pretty still)
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NightmareX
Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil
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Posted - 2009.03.12 19:17:00 -
[269]
Edited by: NightmareX on 12/03/2009 19:18:57
Originally by: marakor Maybe kill the first ship and then spend the rest of the fight mwding around trying to get into range and doing crap dmg.....
Your doing it wrong then pal.
Use your brain a little and you will not have any problems.
Gosh, i really like those who still think a Megathron is the easy mode ship as it was before.
But no, it's not. You have to use your brain way more now than you had to do earlier.
Check out my new flash web page: Dark Paradise |
heslookinatu
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Posted - 2009.03.12 19:37:00 -
[270]
Originally by: NightmareX Edited by: NightmareX on 12/03/2009 19:29:29
Originally by: marakor Maybe kill the first ship and then spend the rest of the fight mwding around trying to get into range and doing crap dmg.....
Your doing it wrong then pal.
Use your brain a little and you will not have any problems.
Gosh, i really like those who still think a Megathron is the easy mode ship as it was before.
But no, it's not. You have to use your brain way more now than you had to do earlier.
Welcome to the same world as us Minmatarians where almost everything in EVE have been on Hard Mode since the start.
How do you use your brain to make your ship move faster? if the gang is sitting 20km apart from each other, you have to mwd to ~5km fight the first ship as its about to die mwd to the next one while your gang can keep doing damage.
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