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Rally Wixx
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Posted - 2006.10.26 00:40:00 -
[1]
Tux said himself, it's either tank or gank on this ship, can do both extremely well, but cannot due them at the same time.
Frankly, crunching a few numbers, thinking creatively about the 4 mid and 7 lows, your character's implants, and it does exactly what Tux said it would, and I am frightened as hell about fighting one that is in the hand's of an intelligent and well versed Amarr specialized PvPer who chooses to set it up as a gank ship.
I know that the silent sect of the Amarr population, the more reasonable and frankly more intelligent ones, will be able to realize the huge benefits of having a couple of these in any operation.
I don't fly a lick of Amarr, but heretics are definitely going to burn to this bad boy. The Amarr deserve this ship. But go ahead and keep whining, forum goers, since you never take all angles into consideration and have no clue how rigs will affect the Abaddon, go ahead and talk yourself mute. Hopefully Tux won't listen.
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Areconus
Caldari Cereal Killerz Chimaera Pact
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Posted - 2006.10.26 00:42:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Rally Wixx Tux said himself, it's either tank or gank on this ship, can do both extremely well, but cannot due them at the same time.
Frankly, crunching a few numbers, thinking creatively about the 4 mid and 7 lows, your character's implants, and it does exactly what Tux said it would, and I am frightened as hell about fighting one that is in the hand's of an intelligent and well versed Amarr specialized PvPer who chooses to set it up as a gank ship.
I know that the silent sect of the Amarr population, the more reasonable and frankly more intelligent ones, will be able to realize the huge benefits of having a couple of these in any operation.
I don't fly a lick of Amarr, but heretics are definitely going to burn to this bad boy. The Amarr deserve this ship. But go ahead and keep whining, forum goers, since you never take all angles into consideration and have no clue how rigs will affect the Abaddon, go ahead and talk yourself mute. Hopefully Tux won't listen.
You see things my way
Gloria Stitz-
"Try not to bring reality in to these forums Otherwise we might take the game seriously" |
Zaethiel
Murder-Death-Kill Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2006.10.26 00:48:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Zaethiel on 26/10/2006 00:49:57 the abbadon is nice and all but it renders the other two battleships useless. All i cna hope for is that the abbadon wont have cap problems or CPU problems. Also the hyperion is going to be an insane overpowered beast. _________________________________________
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Stephar
The High Priest
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Posted - 2006.10.26 00:54:00 -
[4]
Those of you that like it so much should train for it. It will be cheaper to fit than the other tier 3 battleships considering the current prices of lasers. Knock yourself out.
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Stamm
Amarr Three Holdings Rule of Three
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Posted - 2006.10.26 00:56:00 -
[5]
That's exactly what I said yesterday :)
Scared to fly it. Scared to go up against it.
I'm not so sure it will obsolete the geddon and/or apoc.
For a geddon v abaddon you drop 1 laser, and you replace it with nicer cap.
For the apoc v abaddon you drop lots of damage and replace it with lots of cap.
That'll hold true for PvE anyway - and to be frank both the apoc and geddon are very similar for PvE as it is, we're getting a third ship to play around with fittings with and come out with pretty much the same effect.
As far as PvP is concerned, well, the Abaddon looks like the better ship, but with nos getting a nerf and combat being longer, sustainable cap is a real asset, and in order to do that with the abaddon, you have to drop DPS.
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Krulla
Minmatar Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2006.10.26 00:58:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Krulla on 26/10/2006 00:58:26 I agree, the Abbadon will be a beast.
Fitted with Megapulse and plates, it will not only have massive DPS (On par with the Megathron, I belive?) but also a mean tank... Of course, you cannot sustain it for long (long enough, more than two minutes with a cap booster), but then, what gank ship can? The gankageddon runs out of cap eventually, and I don't see anyone complain about that.
It also makes the geddon completely obsolete. In gank fitting, it both outdamages and out tanks the gankageddon.
The Abbadon is the only tier 3 BS which really scares me, to be honest.
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Elenath
Gallente Aliastra
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Posted - 2006.10.26 00:59:00 -
[7]
Agreed.
I'll let all the Amarr whiners see if they can manipulate the Devs into being foolish enough to believe that Amarr ships are having issues.
Till then I'm going to fly the Hell outta this ship. It's one scary mother.
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Scordite
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Posted - 2006.10.26 00:59:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Zaethiel All i cna hope for is that the abbadon wont have cap problems
Funny.
----------------------------------------------- The only legitimate use of the BLINK tag: Schr÷dinger's cat is [BLINK] not [/BLINK] dead. |
meppa
Black Omega Security The OSS
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Posted - 2006.10.26 01:07:00 -
[9]
Personally won't fly abbadon if it comes out in this form. Megapulses and plates combination (which seems to be only concept worth trying) needs still cap charges and must be remote repped after every engagement as it won't have room for armour reppers. Even in this form it is very unreliable and prone to nossing. To be honest apoc does this job much better because of more stable capasitor.
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Lithalnas
Amarr
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Posted - 2006.10.26 01:10:00 -
[10]
might I suggest two solutions. Large Cap battery and Cap booster
Just a note the cap booster would kill any shield booster you would have, the thing is Amarr players have no incentive to use the Abaddon as a shield tank.
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meppa
Black Omega Security The OSS
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Posted - 2006.10.26 01:11:00 -
[11]
I would suggest that instead of using all your slots to cap boosting try out apoc with more damage mods to get same effect.
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Hitomi Ayame
Royal Knights of Khanid Order of the Khanid Crown
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Posted - 2006.10.26 01:11:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Krulla Edited by: Krulla on 26/10/2006 00:58:26 I agree, the Abbadon will be a beast.
Fitted with Megapulse and plates, it will not only have massive DPS (On par with the Megathron, I belive?) but also a mean tank... Of course, you cannot sustain it for long (long enough, more than two minutes with a cap booster), but then, what gank ship can? The gankageddon runs out of cap eventually, and I don't see anyone complain about that.
It also makes the geddon completely obsolete. In gank fitting, it both outdamages and out tanks the gankageddon.
The Abbadon is the only tier 3 BS which really scares me, to be honest.
The Abbadon gets 1 more turret. The Geddon gets 2 more heavy drones. I fail to see how the Abbadon meaningfully does more damage than the Geddon in Megapulse range.
Indeed, the only time the Abbadon is going to out damage the Geddon is outside of drone control range. If you want a reason to use the Abbadon over the Geddon, Megapulse damage is not it, and you're going to have to look at fitting Mega Beams (which are so-so) or most likely, Tachyons. You can do some pretty sick damage with Tachyons, for sure, but you absolutely shoot your cap in the foot.
No, the only time the Abbadon will excel with lasers is as a passive-tanked Tachyon boat. Perfect for big ole fleet fights, I know. But honestly? I don't give a crap about big ole fleet fights. I do small gang PvP, and quite frankly the Abbadon is pretty much useless for me. I'd much prefer a ship that more than 10-20% of the playerbase has a use for. - - - Hitomi Ayame, Lady Marshal, Royal Knights of Khanid
The Royal Knights of Khanid are now recruiting! |
Nir
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Posted - 2006.10.26 01:30:00 -
[13]
The Armageddon has more flexible damage in the form of its drones and doesn't need cap booster charges just to fire its damn guns.
All the tests being done at the moment to compare cap use and how long it can fire don't mean jack sh*t in real PvP because they don't factor in the almighty Nosferatu. Even 2 Heavy Nos which is common in many BS setups, would leave this ship crippled in a matter of seconds. Then of course there is the 50% HP increase and plate/extender boosts. Combat is going to last longer and time is this ships worst enemy.
On top of that the Abaddon is a logistical nightmare, 3 times more expensive and for what? :|
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Areconus
Caldari Cereal Killerz Chimaera Pact
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Posted - 2006.10.26 01:35:00 -
[14]
Short and simple way to fix Amarr is to decrease gun cap use by an amount so that it maintains the same cap/damage ratio as other races...then we wont have so many whiners
Gloria Stitz-
"Try not to bring reality in to these forums Otherwise we might take the game seriously" |
Lithalnas
Amarr
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Posted - 2006.10.26 01:57:00 -
[15]
Quote: Short and simple way to fix Amarr is to decrease gun cap use by an amount so that it maintains the same cap/damage ratio as other races...then we wont have so many whiners
However, all the other races require ammo, and reloading of said ammo, Amarr's ammo is our cap, we should have terrable time with cap because its the price we pay for not having to buy ammo all the time, as well as not running out of ammo in the middle of an hour long fleet battle/chase around the server.
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Aeaus
Tabula Rasa Systems The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2006.10.26 02:01:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Lithalnas
Quote: Short and simple way to fix Amarr is to decrease gun cap use by an amount so that it maintains the same cap/damage ratio as other races...then we wont have so many whiners
However, all the other races require ammo, and reloading of said ammo, Amarr's ammo is our cap, we should have terrable time with cap because its the price we pay for not having to buy ammo all the time, as well as not running out of ammo in the middle of an hour long fleet battle/chase around the server.
I would rather crystals degenerate then our capacitor be our ammo. Because frankly for PVP, it sucks.
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Siakel
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Posted - 2006.10.26 02:26:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Krulla Edited by: Krulla on 26/10/2006 00:58:26 I agree, the Abbadon will be a beast.
Fitted with Megapulse and plates, it will not only have massive DPS (On par with the Megathron, I belive?) but also a mean tank... Of course, you cannot sustain it for long (long enough, more than two minutes with a cap booster), but then, what gank ship can? The gankageddon runs out of cap eventually, and I don't see anyone complain about that.
It also makes the geddon completely obsolete. In gank fitting, it both outdamages and out tanks the gankageddon.
The Abbadon is the only tier 3 BS which really scares me, to be honest.
http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/8159/closerangeamarrbsdpsxl8.jpg
Aye. Terrifying Megapulse DPS. Clearly worth the horrid cap use. Add in that it needs an injector to run the Pulses, and the 'Geddon can fit an EANM in the extra low to get the extra resists and you've got.. the same ship, only one uses over double the capacitor. Woo!
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paeronsoda
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Posted - 2006.10.26 02:40:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Rally Wixx I don't fly a lick of Amarr
Nuff said
FFS if ur scared of something that runs out of cap in 1-2 minutes while having the worst damage type and can be trackin disrupted to hell or just nossed to death in seconds, u probably fly a mining barge or hauler.
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Dillius Archania
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Posted - 2006.10.26 02:43:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Siakel
Originally by: Krulla Edited by: Krulla on 26/10/2006 00:58:26 I agree, the Abbadon will be a beast.
Fitted with Megapulse and plates, it will not only have massive DPS (On par with the Megathron, I belive?) but also a mean tank... Of course, you cannot sustain it for long (long enough, more than two minutes with a cap booster), but then, what gank ship can? The gankageddon runs out of cap eventually, and I don't see anyone complain about that.
It also makes the geddon completely obsolete. In gank fitting, it both outdamages and out tanks the gankageddon.
The Abbadon is the only tier 3 BS which really scares me, to be honest.
http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/8159/closerangeamarrbsdpsxl8.jpg
Aye. Terrifying Megapulse DPS. Clearly worth the horrid cap use. Add in that it needs an injector to run the Pulses, and the 'Geddon can fit an EANM in the extra low to get the extra resists and you've got.. the same ship, only one uses over double the capacitor. Woo!
Nice graph.
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Marskalkur
Amarr The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2006.10.26 04:55:00 -
[20]
how many of you fit lasers on your mega/temp/? how many of you fit hybrids on your temp/apoc? how many of you fit projectiles on your mega/apoc?
make it so that only amarr ships can use energy guns, gallente/caldari ships can only use hybrid guns and minmatar ships only use projectile guns.
then we can get these ships bonuses sorted out for Amarr!
this "10% bonus to Large Energy Turret capacitor use" is starting to get old.
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Lienzo
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Posted - 2006.10.26 05:14:00 -
[21]
*Tries to think of something inflammatory*
How about this: if all the T2 long range ammo is getting nerfed from 100%->80%, then Amarr get hit a bit worse.
This is because changes to range only affect optimals, and both hybrids and projectiles get much more falloff. If we pulled both hybrid and projectiles back an extra 5% it might just help keep the T1 users in the game.
Muahahaha. That ought to stoke the fire.
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Azerrad InExile
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Posted - 2006.10.26 05:17:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Lienzo *Tries to think of something inflammatory*
How about this: if all the T2 long range ammo is getting nerfed from 100%->80%, then Amarr get hit a bit worse.
This is because changes to range only affect optimals, and both hybrids and projectiles get much more falloff. If we pulled both hybrid and projectiles back an extra 5% it might just help keep the T1 users in the game.
Muahahaha. That ought to stoke the fire.
Nah.. it just nerfs everyone but Rokh pilots.
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Deathbarrage
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Posted - 2006.10.26 05:36:00 -
[23]
problem is due to difference in drone space the abaddon is inferior to the geddon while it's supposed to improve it
I can live with it fortunately i fly multiple races,
it's just a broken BS
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Murukan
Minmatar The Priory Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2006.10.26 06:20:00 -
[24]
heh but rally amarr want a ship that can sustain tachyons, a dual rep tank, and out dps a megathron point blank all rolled into one. Say anything positive about an amarr ship and that just means you are some clueless noob.
In rust we trust!!!
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LWMaverick
Quam Singulari Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2006.10.26 07:00:00 -
[25]
Im sure i can find a decent setup for it, and kill stuff in it.
But i doubt that it will be any better, or bring anything new to the table, compared to the geddon and the (oh so vber ) apoc.
/Mav
<3 |
Wilfan Ret'nub
Singularity.
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Posted - 2006.10.26 07:14:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Siakel http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/8159/closerangeamarrbsdpsxl8.jpg
Aye. Terrifying Megapulse DPS.
That's not Megapulse DPS. That's T2 Ogres and Megapulse DPS. ------ No ISK, no fun |
Forsch
Auctoritan Syndicate Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2006.10.26 07:54:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Hitomi Ayame No, the only time the Abbadon will excel with lasers is as a passive-tanked Tachyon boat. Perfect for big ole fleet fights, I know. But honestly? I don't give a crap about big ole fleet fights. I do small gang PvP, and quite frankly the Abbadon is pretty much useless for me. I'd much prefer a ship that more than 10-20% of the playerbase has a use for.
Exactely my thoughts.
While we already have 2 quite similar ships, we're now getting a 3rd that again does the same job. I would have wished for something different for once. Like Caldari... they have a missile ship, a rail ship and an EW ship. Amarr now have 3 turret ships.
Forsch Defender of the empire
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Sniser
4S Corporation Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2006.10.26 08:10:00 -
[28]
you should begin to see how abaddon with megapulses + plates have powergrid free and how geddon dont. And you should begin to look what energy turrets rigs need to be fitted ;)
Now think how dmg or rof rigs are begin applied to 8 guns instead 7. Later free your mind :D
Im only worried about malestorm and abaddon have the same powergrid but AC and Artys use less PG to fit
It's great being Amarr, ain't it? |
Forsch
Auctoritan Syndicate Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2006.10.26 08:33:00 -
[29]
Maybe it's just me but I was under the impression that rigs should be used to add a flavor to your ship, a surprise, give it another direction.. but not to make it usable...
Forsch Defender of the empire
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Sniser
4S Corporation Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2006.10.26 08:51:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Forsch Maybe it's just me but I was under the impression that rigs should be used to add a flavor to your ship, a surprise, give it another direction.. but not to make it usable...
you cant look a ship without counting them. Ships before where made without thinking about rigs so they are balanced just looking their stats. But Bs tier 3 and BC tier 2 have been made with rigs in mind. You only need run some numbers to see why i say that. New Bs gallente or caldari after their guns + tanks dont have enough grid(because they fit a mwd). Abaddon with 15km optimal really dont need mwd, maybe just an ab and anyways it have more pg. Most other ships will fit rigs upgrading another things or fit an rcu t2 to have enough grid to fit those turret rigs, but they are already wasting a low slot to do it
It's great being Amarr, ain't it? |
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