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Tam Elbran
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:25:00 -
[1]
Until...
I got my first real warp scrambled and gank...
So being ****ed....I researched how to prevent this...Warp Core Stabilizer...Just what the doctor ordered.
Wait...
-50% Scan resolution bonus
-50% Target resolution bonus
This of course makes it useless for anything but travel.
Well certainly the Warp Core Destabilizer must have some penalties to go with it...course not.
Can anyone anywhere explain the logic of a design decision like that?
(1337 d3wd replies will be actively ignored)
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Elysarian
Minmatar dudetruck corp
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:27:00 -
[2]
Surely the WCS is primarily for "travelling" (i.e. getting away from people who want to kill you)?
Or am I missing something here? ===================================== It smells of spoon! ===================================== |
Cedric Diggory
Perfunctory Oleaginous Laocoon Mugwumps
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:30:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Tam Elbran Until...
I got my first real warp scrambled and gank...
So being ****ed....I researched how to prevent this...Warp Core Stabilizer...Just what the doctor ordered.
Wait...
-50% Scan resolution bonus
-50% Target resolution bonus
This of course makes it useless for anything but travel.
Well certainly the Warp Core Destabilizer must have some penalties to go with it...course not.
Can anyone anywhere explain the logic of a design decision like that?
(1337 d3wd replies will be actively ignored)
Blame the ***abond pilots. They nerfed WCS into the ground by fitting loads of them and zooming around at ridiculous speeds being nearly impossible to lock down by anything other than a gang of other ***abond pilots.
For a while it was ***abond (and nanophoon, to be fair) online. The evil penalties on WCS are to prevent them being used on combat ships: If you want to fight, you fight. If you want to flee, you fit WCS. ---
Originally by: 7shining7one7 no.. you're f'ing insane.
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Tam Elbran
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:31:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Elysarian Surely the WCS is primarily for "travelling" (i.e. getting away from people who want to kill you)?
Or am I missing something here?
You are.
Once fitted to your ship you get those penalties which severally hurt your capabilities for ratting, mining, whatever. So if you want to defend yourself from that ganking/griefing technique you virtually cripple your ship. On the flipside, those employing that ganking/griefing technique have no penalties.
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Kosume Ike
Amarr GoldenWind
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:33:00 -
[5]
The solution is clear and self evident. You got 2 options:
1) Fit a warp disruptor yourself and kill the guy trying to kill you.
2) Don't be there when someone tries to gank you - hint, low sec asteroid belts and rancer gates are not where you want to be if you are adverse to violence.
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Dred 'Morte
New European Regiment Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:33:00 -
[6]
Actually, I'm pretty sure double-microwarpdrive ravens spewing long range perfect hitting torpedoes with 2 to 5 WCS were the reason for the WCS nerf. Correct me if I'm wrong.
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Morlar
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:35:00 -
[7]
Just out of curiosity, do you recall the security status of the system you were killed in?
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Jericho thePure
Amarr The 13th Armored Headhunters
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:36:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Tam Elbran Until...
I got my first real warp scrambled and gank...
So being ****ed....I researched how to prevent this...Warp Core Stabilizer...Just what the doctor ordered.
Wait...
-50% Scan resolution bonus
-50% Target resolution bonus
This of course makes it useless for anything but travel.
Well certainly the Warp Core Destabilizer must have some penalties to go with it...course not.
Can anyone anywhere explain the logic of a design decision like that?
(1337 d3wd replies will be actively ignored)
And that is exactly what they are meant for.. travel. You see.. they did not always have that penalty but in time things change in the name of balance. Warp core stabs got nerfed thank god. ------------------------------------------------- - Sig
"All those moments, will be lost in time like tears in rain...... time to die ..." |
Montross 0
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:37:00 -
[9]
oh noes
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Tam Elbran
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:37:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Morlar Just out of curiosity, do you recall the security status of the system you were killed in?
0.4
So yes, I know...expect to be attacked...the security status of the system is irrelevant to the discussion at hand though.
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Tam Elbran
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:38:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Tam Elbran on 16/02/2009 16:38:52
Originally by: Jericho thePure And that is exactly what they are meant for.. travel. You see.. they did not always have that penalty but in time things change in the name of balance. Warp core stabs got nerfed thank god.
Made it easier for you to grief?
EDIT: I'd also bet they weren't meant just for travel, but thanks to people finding ways to abuse them, they were made useless.
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Cedric Diggory
Perfunctory Oleaginous Laocoon Mugwumps
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:40:00 -
[12]
Ooh, I'd forgotten about the multiple microwarpdrives! ---
Originally by: 7shining7one7 no.. you're f'ing insane.
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Wu Jiaqiu
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:48:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Tam Elbran Until...
I got my first real warp scrambled and gank...
So being ****ed....I researched how to prevent this...Warp Core Stabilizer...Just what the doctor ordered.
Wait...
-50% Scan resolution bonus
-50% Target resolution bonus
This of course makes it useless for anything but travel.
Well certainly the Warp Core Destabilizer must have some penalties to go with it...course not.
Can anyone anywhere explain the logic of a design decision like that?
(1337 d3wd replies will be actively ignored)
If you don't want to be killed stay in high sec 0.5+ space.
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Grunanca
Mean Corp Mean Coalition
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:49:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Tam Elbran Edited by: Tam Elbran on 16/02/2009 16:38:52
Originally by: Jericho thePure And that is exactly what they are meant for.. travel. You see.. they did not always have that penalty but in time things change in the name of balance. Warp core stabs got nerfed thank god.
Made it easier for you to grief?
EDIT: I'd also bet they weren't meant just for travel, but thanks to people finding ways to abuse them, they were made useless.
Well, fitting a warp scrambler takes up cap and a mid slot... So yeah, no penalty for the griefer I can really see your point....
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H Lecter
Gallente The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:50:00 -
[15]
Edited by: H Lecter on 16/02/2009 16:52:51
Quote: EDIT: I'd also bet they weren't meant just for travel, but thanks to people finding ways to abuse them, they were made useless.
I had written a helpful answer, then I detected this whine and deleted it. Hope you did not see it...
My opinion may or may not be shared by my alliance |
Kazzac Elentria
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:50:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Kosume Ike The solution is clear and self evident. You got 2 options:
1) Fit a warp disruptor yourself and kill the guy trying to kill you.
2) Don't be there when someone tries to gank you - hint, low sec asteroid belts and rancer gates are not where you want to be if you are adverse to violence.
Actually there is a third option.
Train ECM |
Sobach
Gallente Fourth Circle
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:52:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Tam Elbran Edited by: Tam Elbran on 16/02/2009 16:38:52
Made it easier for you to grief?
EDIT: I'd also bet they weren't meant just for travel, but thanks to people finding ways to abuse them, they were made useless.
From what you've said, it sounds like you simply got killed by a pirate in a low sec system, how is that griefing? WCS is supposed to be a fail-safe for players to flee from hostiles when other methods of evasion have failed. They're not supposed to be a "fit this for complete safety" module, and there shouldn't be one.
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Jericho thePure
Amarr The 13th Armored Headhunters
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:55:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Tam Elbran Edited by: Tam Elbran on 16/02/2009 16:38:52
Originally by: Jericho thePure And that is exactly what they are meant for.. travel. You see.. they did not always have that penalty but in time things change in the name of balance. Warp core stabs got nerfed thank god.
Made it easier for you to grief?
EDIT: I'd also bet they weren't meant just for travel, but thanks to people finding ways to abuse them, they were made useless.
If you can't handle grief then EVE is not for you. Yes n00b, they are in fact meant for travel as the penalty on them shows and EVE is a better place now that the penalty exists.
P.S. Stab monkey kill mails always make me lol. ------------------------------------------------- - Sig
"All those moments, will be lost in time like tears in rain...... time to die ..." |
Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:55:00 -
[19]
Someone fit specifically to kill your ship SHOULD have an advantage. They're fit to do one thing and do it well, kill you. You're trying to fit to do 2 things, escape and whatever else you were trying to do before the pirate showed up. |
Jericho thePure
Amarr The 13th Armored Headhunters
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:57:00 -
[20]
Also god kills a kitten every time someone fits a Warp Core Stab, so think of the kittens. ------------------------------------------------- - Sig
"All those moments, will be lost in time like tears in rain...... time to die ..." |
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Mastin Dragonfly
Absolutely No Retreat Blade.
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:06:00 -
[21]
Shooting at someone in this game does not equal griefing.
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Dantes Revenge
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:07:00 -
[22]
Actually, the heavy dictor effectively nerfed WCS to uselessness. Fit a whole rack of them and still get scrambled. Gate gankers have the I-Win button back again because there's no real counter unless you're fast and agile enough to get out of it's range before popping.
-- There's a simple difference between kinky and perverted. Kinky is using a feather to get her in the mood. Perverted is using the whole chicken. All this has happened before and will happen again |
War Fairy
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:09:00 -
[23]
You seem to be making the assumption that the game should work the way you want. The people who created the game however think the game should work the way they want.
WCS exist to make you safer during travel, hence the combat penalty. They are not designed to be used during combat. Hence the penalties.
There are tools to prevent a gank. They 're known as guns, armor reppers, MWD, AB, web, shield boosters.
Next time I recommend a mwd/ab and web. If you slow down your opponent you can sometimes get out of scram range.
Run back to the gate since they can't follow you due to aggro?
Also I recommend keeping an eye on local and not linger in an area with unknown people.
Use your scanner to see if anyone is coming toward you.
Cloak?
Also it doesn't matter how many WCS you have. Eventually you'll run into a HIC so I suggest a more active defense than WCS anyways.
tl;dr This is Eve. There are no magic make me immune to attack combat set ups. Only travel setups are good for decling combat.
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Niko Takahashi
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:14:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Grunanca
Originally by: Tam Elbran Edited by: Tam Elbran on 16/02/2009 16:38:52
Originally by: Jericho thePure And that is exactly what they are meant for.. travel. You see.. they did not always have that penalty but in time things change in the name of balance. Warp core stabs got nerfed thank god.
Made it easier for you to grief?
EDIT: I'd also bet they weren't meant just for travel, but thanks to people finding ways to abuse them, they were made useless.
Well, fitting a warp scrambler takes up cap and a mid slot... So yeah, no penalty for the griefer I can really see your point....
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Tam Elbran
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:14:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Mastin Dragonfly Shooting at someone in this game does not equal griefing.
You guys can call killing someone far below you in strength just because you can anything you want, it won't change reality.
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Tam Elbran
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:17:00 -
[26]
I took the simpler approach, that is an I win button.
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Hiroshima Jita
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:21:00 -
[27]
Huzzah you've realized EVE is a large scal griefing engine!
Instead of npcing like WoW most of the end game content or any of the not boring content is pvp out in space where people can shoot at each other. Its like unreal tournament only with every death you lose something of semi real value. Somebody run the math on PLEX but I think I've calculated that my average explosion costs me about 1.5-3$ in real life money (If you assume PLEX sets a reliable method for comparing isk to real money). So its like if you took unreal tournament and mixed it in with poker.
Given that highsec greifing is actually pretty rare despite the numerous complaints, most newbies don't realize what EVE is until they stray into lowsec. Its the major turning point in a players EVE experience, and there are three options.
1 EMORAGEQUIT
2 Never leave highsec
3 Learn 2 kill ppl
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Ak'athra J'ador
Amarr The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc.
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:22:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Ak''athra J''ador on 16/02/2009 17:26:19
its the same in other games. there are always methods which prevent you from escaping. eve has ships called tacklers, dedicated to one thing alone (except when they are in a gang and there is like a gazzilion of them ), to keep you down, till others kill you. if you are tackled and see you are about to die, try to kill the tackler. try to brake his lock. get out of range or jam him if you can.
if you are angry because a dedicated group of players who are good at what they do managed to kill you, then i am sorry but none of the games out there is for you. i mean if you fly solo and crash into a gatecamp, you better be a fast ship, a cloaky ship or bait with remote-rep waiting on the other side.
its not greefing, its simple pvp. if you want to prevent it don't fly where there might be gatecamps, or fly in ships that can get through, and yes, this does mean you cant do everything in the same ship.
best solution, join a corp and don't fly solo. to young to join a corp you say? not true, there are corps out there for noobs, try the eve-uni (though i haven't herd from them in a while so not sure they still operate)
note: when you see you are abbout to pop, find a celestial object, any object (station, planet...) amd spam the align and the warp button. your ship will blow up, but your pod will get out (obviously wont work in bubbles).
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Nierna
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:24:00 -
[29]
someone moving to lowsec before he is ready (that is mainly in mindset. even with low SP you can avoid a gank if you know what your doing) are just asking to be taken down.
theres 2 rules in eve: 1. concord will destroy your ship if you shoot someone in highsec your not at war with and has not agressed you. 2. you will lose your ship. the only thing you can do is postpone the blowup date.
note point 2.
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Narcil Starwind
Exa Utopia
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:25:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Dred 'Morte Actually, I'm pretty sure double-microwarpdrive ravens spewing long range perfect hitting torpedoes with 2 to 5 WCS were the reason for the WCS nerf. Correct me if I'm wrong.
No double Micro-Warpdrives have been gone for a long long time. You can thank the vegabond pilots and probably burn eden for the WCS being nerfed. Basically any group using WCS on every combat fit, giving them little to no consequences when they start a fight.
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