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Tamoko
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Posted - 2008.05.05 15:21:00 -
[1]
Hello,
I'm having a hell of a time trying to complete a WC4. I'm doing the Serpentis & Guristas version. The problems start on the last Serpentis room. I've ended up just declining the mission whenever it pops.
I'm have two accounts, and I'm wondering if it's possible to get a second ship into the final room without aggro sliding over to it. I'd be willing to drag along an osprey to remote shield rep if ships don't change targets - Unfortunately, I heard somewhere that they do in this particular gem of a mission. Could someone confirm or debunk that for me? ---
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Kusha'an
Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.
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Posted - 2008.05.05 15:45:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Kusha''an on 05/05/2008 15:46:34
I'm assuming you're talking about the last room. You only have to destroy the group that aggroes you, so kite them until you've done so. Then simply fly over and pick up the stranded crewmembers and leave.
If you're talking about the 2nd room, you can use a Domi with sentry drones and kill the aggroing group, then pick off the rest without aggro.
WC is a great mission - you can farm it for a week, destroying everything in the first room and both second rooms, leaving the final room alone. Everything resets at downtime and voila there's another 40 million isk waiting for you. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand? |
Tamoko
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Posted - 2008.05.05 15:51:00 -
[3]
Quote: you can use a Domi with sentry drones and kill the aggroing group, then pick off the rest without aggro.
Because everyone has the skills to fly a domi, right? =\
Quote: You only have to destroy the group that aggroes you
I get full room aggro without firing a single shot. Every time. And it's absolutely overwhelming. The last time I went in, I couldn't get a single BS rat past shields (with a cruise raven) before I was capped out. ---
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Kusha'an
Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.
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Posted - 2008.05.05 15:54:00 -
[4]
Your sarcasm is unwelcome as I was only trying to answer your question. I was flying a Domi in level 4 missions after 3 months in game, so I guess "skills to fly a Domi" is relative. Nevertheless, good luck getting help with this mission since you seem to have a nasty attitude. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand? |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2008.05.05 16:22:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Kusha'an Your sarcasm is unwelcome as I was only trying to answer your question. I was flying a Domi in level 4 missions after 3 months in game, so I guess "skills to fly a Domi" is relative. Nevertheless, good luck getting help with this mission since you seem to have a nasty attitude.
because suggesting to go fly a domi is lovely advice
first off no you should not have full aggro upon warp in. 3 serp frigs 2 angel spies, 3 serp battle cruisers, and 3 serp battleships is the initial aggro from my memory.
the way I do it is, shoot the bcs first, 3 volleys each then start on the battleships kill the serp frigs with drones and DO NOT shoot the angel spies at all, as that will cause full aggro.
then do the same with the other spawn, and then the last spawn.
if you have that 2nd account sit him in a drake and have him work on the bc/frigs while your raven takes the battleships
if that doesn't work well you should rework your fit and think about training up your skills a bit more
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Pwett
Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony
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Posted - 2008.05.05 16:53:00 -
[6]
for the Angel version, you can shoot the spies, so long as it's only you - NEITHER gangmates NOR drones can not hit them or else they will trigger full aggro from the room.
_______________ Pwett CEO, Founder, & Executor <Q> QUANT Hegemony
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Kusha'an
Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.
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Posted - 2008.05.05 17:01:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Kusha''an on 05/05/2008 17:02:42
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton
Originally by: Kusha'an Your sarcasm is unwelcome as I was only trying to answer your question. I was flying a Domi in level 4 missions after 3 months in game, so I guess "skills to fly a Domi" is relative. Nevertheless, good luck getting help with this mission since you seem to have a nasty attitude.
because suggesting to go fly a domi is lovely advice
Chainsaw, I respect your opinion and your posts. Having said that, go back and read the OP and tell me where it says which ship the OP was flying. It is not unreasonable for me to assume a Domi, nor did I EVER suggest that he/she "go fly a Domi." I merely offered advice based on how I fly the mission.
If I really was trying to be a d!ck I could have assumed a Raven and flamed the OP for being incompetent. Nobody should have trouble flying level 4 missions in a Raven, since Ravens uberpwn level 4s, right? ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand? |
Dede Dumdedum
Gallente Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2008.05.05 17:30:00 -
[8]
kush, you could have assumed raven when the op spoke of remote shld rep, or just answered his question. your advice may be sound, but it doesn't address getting full room aggro for no apparent reason. speaking of how lucrative a mission is that the op can't run due to bug or bad luck drawing full aggro wouldn't help anyone's attitude.
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Kusha'an
Gallente Equinox Industrial Co.
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Posted - 2008.05.05 17:37:00 -
[9]
Hey, it wasn't my intent to offend. I've had the all-aggro happen to me in WC room 2 before, more than once, and I've just warped out. But it doesn't discourage me from finishing the mission.
Jeez everybody's so touchy.
Note to self: Mentioning "Dominix" to Raven pilots really p!sses them off for some reason. Avoid helping them from now on, just let them continue to whine and quit. ---- What part of "shorn't" do you not understand? |
Veryez
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Posted - 2008.05.05 17:56:00 -
[10]
To answer your question, WC has always had tough aggro. It earlier versions, the second ship would pull heavy aggro. Even in it's current version drones will pull aggro themselves. I don't believe it's possible to take a second ship into the second room without it drawing full aggro. That being said, it is possible for a t2 cruise raven to complete the mission solo. Warp into the area, and only shoot at stuff that agresses on you first, Align for warp out, and try to pull one group at a time. It's not hard, but requires some thought. Trust me, when you (finally) pull the 4.5 mil overseer (has happened to me twice) it will make ALL your efforts worth it. |
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Randolf Sightblinder
Ex Coelis
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Posted - 2008.05.05 21:01:00 -
[11]
Unless they've changed it DO NOT shoot the "spy ships" doing so will pull agro from the entire room, or at least it used it. if you are using drones keep careful control of them, once the room is woke if you pull them in or one goes pop most of the time they switch to you.
Randolf
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Tamoko
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Posted - 2008.05.05 21:08:00 -
[12]
Thanks for the replies. Could we please drop the Dominix line of "conversation"? I intentionally didn't respond to prevent further prorogation of the conflict, and it wont serve anyone to argue further about it. Thank you.
Now, there's clearly something wrong if I'm getting the entire pocket aggroed on to me. I'm pretty sure I'm not stupid enough to shoot the Angel Spies (I've been told before that they aggro the whole mission), but I can't think of anything else that would have caused so much aggro so quickly. All I remember is a whole screen-length of overview flashing red, and my shields going down faster than an XLSB would fill them back up.
I don't think I got a definitive answer on the second account: Is it safe to bring in an untanked cruiser as long as I let the initial aggro drop onto my raven, first? ---
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Leandro Salazar
The Blackguard Wolves Black Star Alliance
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Posted - 2008.05.05 21:18:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 05/05/2008 21:20:13
Originally by: Tamoko Thanks for the replies. Could we please drop the Dominix line of "conversation"? I intentionally didn't respond to prevent further prorogation of the conflict, and it wont serve anyone to argue further about it. Thank you.
Now, there's clearly something wrong if I'm getting the entire pocket aggroed on to me. I'm pretty sure I'm not stupid enough to shoot the Angel Spies (I've been told before that they aggro the whole mission), but I can't think of anything else that would have caused so much aggro so quickly. All I remember is a whole screen-length of overview flashing red, and my shields going down faster than an XLSB would fill them back up.
I don't think I got a definitive answer on the second account: Is it safe to bring in an untanked cruiser as long as I let the initial aggro drop onto my raven, first?
Are you launching your drones? Maybe they pop a shot at the spies without your okay... Otherwise I would say it must be a bug, I never experienced such a think in WC myself. It does strange things when a second entity is there, but when it is just you, aggro in WC has been very consistent for me.
You want ME for the CSM!
There is no 'n' in turret There is no 'r' in faction
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Tamoko
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Posted - 2008.05.05 21:27:00 -
[14]
Quote: Are you launching your drones?
I don't think so. It's possible, but I'm pretty good about holding them until I feel it's safe. The experience I had in that room was hit the accel gate, land in the pocket, then have a dozen and a half ships right in my face and lots of frantic keymashing to get out asap. ---
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Hanneshannes
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Posted - 2008.05.05 22:10:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Tamoko
Quote: Are you launching your drones?
I don't think so. It's possible, but I'm pretty good about holding them until I feel it's safe. The experience I had in that room was hit the accel gate, land in the pocket, then have a dozen and a half ships right in my face and lots of frantic keymashing to get out asap.
I don't launch my drones until I have full aggro or am shooting the last group.
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Veryez
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Posted - 2008.05.06 02:01:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Are you launching your drones? Maybe they pop a shot at the spies without your okay... Otherwise I would say it must be a bug, I never experienced such a think in WC myself. It does strange things when a second entity is there, but when it is just you, aggro in WC has been very consistent for me.
I don't think that's the case, I think this is one of the missions that sees drones as a 'support/second ship' and causes the whole room to aggro. I do not launch my drones until I'm fairly confident I can tank the rest of the room, and watch them closely - they tend to get shot up in this mission pretty fast. Even eve-survival has the comment 'drones aggro' in the mission.
With good skill you can kill the frigates/intercepters even w/cruise missiles (just takes time).
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Ukradka Loota
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.05.06 09:41:00 -
[17]
I've done Angel/Sansha WC quite a number of times. WRT aggro, in the room after initial gates you get full agro if you shoot/drone 2 spy tacklers. And of course aggro from each group separately when you tickle them. No other aggros, surprise or not. Done it in gang and with logistics ship.
In the final room you get mandatory aggro from 2bs+3hac group. Kill it, take the crew and all's finished. But you also may occasionally get partial or full aggro from the rest of the rats at warp-in. Probably it is triggered by warping in too close to tackler frigs or smth like this. Can turn out nasty, as they scramble. Cost me my logistics once. |
Lord WarATron
Amarr Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.05.06 10:39:00 -
[18]
Just hit the gates and jump. You will need the key from zor to skip first gate, but second gate just kill anything that is scraming you/webbing you and make a run for it. You dont need to kill anything other than the small group that aggros you on last stage.
Very quick mission and you can do 4+ of these a hour if you are that lucky to get them in a row. |
Leruta
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Posted - 2008.05.06 11:21:00 -
[19]
do you guys really get aggro from the whole room when you shoot the angel spies? that's weird, because they are usually my first target when i arrive in the second room.
i warp in and target all frigs that are shooting at me (including the spies) .. then i take them down with my cruise missiles .. i don't use my drones for these 5 (6?) frigs .. meanwhile i'm slowboating (webbed to 5 m/s) to the accelaration gate
after that i take down the bc and bs that are still shooting at me .. then i take down the bs from the second spawn (the one with the core grand and/or core lord admirals), ignoring the frigs and bc
after that i fire at the bs from the last spawn and when i have aggro from all remaining rats i release my drones and let them take down the frigs .. when i'm finished with the bs and bc my drones are usually done with the frigs
i do it this way every time i get the serp/guristas version of wc lvl 4 and i never got aggro from the whole room .. and i have done a lot of wc lvl 4
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Lodia
Jaegermeister Bedlam Consortium
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Posted - 2008.05.06 11:22:00 -
[20]
stupid forums made me post with an alt ^^
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Kery Nysell
Caldari Nysell Incorporated
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Posted - 2008.05.06 11:34:00 -
[21]
Hmmm ...
It's quite hard to tell without seeing it "live", and I'm not sure I've done the same version as you (Guristas vs Serpentis, according to my agents the Guris are defending their territories, and I know there is a Serpentis vs Guristas version where the Serps are defending, but I don't know any other differences between the two).
In the version I had, I could launch my drones (in passive mode) without problems, even before firing a single shot, and they never aggroed something.
I took a corp-mate with me in a frigate to kill the small things, and as long as I was there first, with my big tanking ship, and made sure I had the initial group firmly aggroed on me, he could warp in and kill the frigs (but NOT the Spies that trigger a full aggro), again without problems.
I've seen you mention a dozen and a half ships aggroing you when you warp in the Serpentis Base (second pocket), that about normal, IIRC you get aggroed by the 2 Spies and a "battlegroup" (2 BS, 3 BCs, 4 frigs, forgot the number of cruisers), with 3 other "battlegroups" waiting and sometimes an Overseer. But, here's a little know fact, those Angel Spies actually do some EXPLOSIVE damage ... the first time I took my Raven with 2 KIN + 2 THERM hardeners in that mission, I had a really nasty surprise, I had to warp out asap ... those two Spies were doing more damage than the 10 other ships shooting me combined !
So, in short after that long wall of text : getting full aggro without doing anything looks like a bug, you should be able to take a gang-mate in that mission (but untanked ? risky ...), and finally NPCs switching targets is a "feature" now (has been for several months in fact), you have to take that possibility in your mission tactics (that's also why I've been saying for the past 3 years that lvl 1~4 missions are meant for solo play, the group mechanics in those levels are truly horrendous, but that's another debate entirely). <~ sig starts here
My Skills |
Pwett
Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony
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Posted - 2008.05.06 15:11:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Pwett for the Angel version, you can shoot the spies, so long as it's only you - NEITHER gangmates NOR drones can not hit them or else they will trigger full aggro from the room.
Since this seems to have been missed before. _______________ Pwett CEO, Founder, & Executor <Q> QUANT Hegemony
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Wet Ferret
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Posted - 2008.05.06 19:37:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Pwett
Originally by: Pwett for the Angel version, you can shoot the spies, so long as it's only you - NEITHER gangmates NOR drones can not hit them or else they will trigger full aggro from the room.
Since this seems to have been missed before.
Heh. If it makes you feel better, I have tested this in the Serpentis / Guristas WC and it seems to be accurate. I kill the spies after I finish clearing the rest of the initial agro, wait awhile to see if anything else agroes me, and so far nothing has. |
Jill Antaris
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2008.05.06 20:04:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Jill Antaris on 06/05/2008 20:05:46 Done the Angel/Sansha and Angel/Blood Version with 2 Ships by helping other people. Aggro is fine as long as you donŠt shoot the Spy Frigs in the 2. Stage.
In the 3. Stage the 2. Ship took aggro once(but It was a new pilote I helped, preaty shure he just shoot another Spawn than I did so he got the aggro).
Set Drones to passive for the 2. and 3. Stage and you will have no Problems at all. ----------------------
Nerf Lasers! Thay need far to less CPU and Grid to Fit. Still using not enught Cap and do far to mutch Damage. O wait... they allready did... =( |
Raskor
Crossflow Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.05.07 03:08:00 -
[25]
I've experienced the issue where full (or near full) aggro in 2nd room, even before firing a shot. But, given that I fly in a passive tanked Vulture, it's not a problem. Once my CS has the aggro, the Raven comes in to clean up.
Now, I don't much bother with the Guristas room anymore. Too many HAC's with high resists. Takes too long to kill. Plus the Raven died once to full on aggro in that room.
Course that was before the handy new feature for knowing which of the 8 frigs have you scrammed when your minimalist tank is rapidly failing... |
Xplained
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.05.07 11:20:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Tamoko Hello,
I'm having a hell of a time trying to complete a WC4. I'm doing the Serpentis & Guristas version. The problems start on the last Serpentis room. I've ended up just declining the mission whenever it pops.
I'm have two accounts, and I'm wondering if it's possible to get a second ship into the final room without aggro sliding over to it. I'd be willing to drag along an osprey to remote shield rep if ships don't change targets - Unfortunately, I heard somewhere that they do in this particular gem of a mission. Could someone confirm or debunk that for me?
Perhaps you need to concentrate more on your engineering skills, i can easily tank all aggro in this room/afk
yep, Mods stole my sig! |
Sanzorz
Amarr EVEfan.dk
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Posted - 2008.05.07 11:58:00 -
[27]
Do have me excused if you're talking about the 2nd room and not the 3rd (last) room.
I've noticed full aggro on last stage, if you don't warp straigth into the zone. If your ship ain't properly turned it can end up at a place in the zone which triggers full aggro. Align correctly along with the acc gate and activate it. That solved it for me :)
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