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Nahia Senne
Fortunis Novum
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Posted - 2006.11.19 20:47:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Nahia Senne on 19/11/2006 20:47:52 many people who started their characters recently are angry, while to older players it doesn't matter that much. 800 SP less or more, wont change a lot for someone who's already highly skilled.
so, a proposal to heal all the pain and suffering this change will bring... give everyone extra 800k SP!
how should this be done..
1. faster skill training until you reach the goal of +800k SP?
2. issuing special "drug" that causes training boost for limited period of time? give one per non trial account when kali hits. heck, in the future, you can issue these as xmas presents
3. train whatever skill is set for kali downtime up to 800k sp? this would probably be the easiest solution.
4. some other way? dunno, discuss!
Make ECCM viable! Give it 25% to scanning resolution! |
Sharcy
Out Siders Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.11.20 08:33:00 -
[2]
No.
Okay okay, you asked for discussion... CCP has already stated that they wanted to give new subscribers a better starting point so that they have less of a sense of uselessness when they come into the game compared to the 30m SP vets. What you're suggesting counteracts that effort completely. Besides, are you playing this game for the fun of it, or to get the most SP? --
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Rede
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Posted - 2006.11.20 08:46:00 -
[3]
Max SP of course... What else it could be..? :)
Actually when I started Eve about year and half ago at some point it was very frustrating to be so restricted what you could do.
First there was need for training learnings, once a while I trained some "basic" skills like mechanics to be able to use very basic items like t1 hardeners on my ship, or even very basic guns. I've friends who have tried Eve but due complexity and very restricted starting (you need weeks to be able to do anything "real") they didn't even finished that trial time. They gave up.
"It looks nice and skills system was nice instead of XP whoring, but I couldn't do a thing so hard to say is it worth of 15Ç/month or not..."
So I don't really mind that it's easier to start Eve. It would be nice to be able to use frigs, few guns and basic modules without excessive training.
And it really would be nice to get back that 800k SP which at least I've missed due various reasons...
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Jurushy
SteelVipers YouWhat
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Posted - 2006.11.20 09:54:00 -
[4]
well everyone who play EvE has a really hard start the older player like me more than the new one
SP are not the most importent thing in this game. the player skills behind the charakter are more important
and... this system is something like a test can u manage to play this game or or if u have the skills u will be able to play eve more then the 14d trail if not than u give up
our devs say this a POD pilot is something like elite that also means to the pleyer we can play an really adult and komplex game all other play WoW
btw i hab 48 mil SP and only 30%-40% of them are usefull if i fly a ship that meand that i have only 20 milion or even less really in use
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Pyrmo
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Posted - 2006.11.20 10:24:00 -
[5]
Has the CCP confirmed that the new characters in kali have 800 sp boost?
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Imperil
Northern Intelligence SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 10:25:00 -
[6]
Remake your character in Kali? Problem solved!
Support POS Overhaul - Read it NOW! |
Ithildin
Gallente The Corporation The Corporation Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 10:43:00 -
[7]
OR CCP could do this:
Make an algorithm that goes through all characters and set their skills appropriatly. Say an Intaki Industrialist (like me) would be missing 3 levels of Mining (I don't). If I did, the game would grant me those three levels pro bono (but since I don't miss Mining V, I'd not get it). Same goes for, for example, Metallurgy (which, I believe would be at level IV), everyone with an Industrialist-like character creation history would get that skill to level IV (or something like 90k SP) if they didn't already have that or more (meaning even a 3 year vet like me would get a tiny boost of a few thousand skill points)
That would make it so that those with fewer skill points would potentially benefit more than those with more skill points (we've most likely already got all the skills past the starting levels).
Everyone benefits fairly, no one get free-bies. - EVE is sick. |
Tronjay
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Posted - 2006.11.20 11:20:00 -
[8]
I agree completely with Iltihdin, give all existing players a fair bonus as compensation. Furthermore CCP could grant the players to freely compensate 500k sp on wathever skill they like. Lets stay fair to player who started to play eve 3-5 months ago.
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Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 11:26:00 -
[9]
Tbh, I don't see any reason why they couldn't just give everyone 800k sp extra.
Its not for the vets or semi-vets, to whom 800k realy doesn't matter all that much. Its for those guys who have ben playing over a month, just gotten past the 1 million sp mark, and are now being told that if they'd started now instead of 5 weeks ago they'd have practically started at the point they are now. Because thats harsh. If they could have 800k extra, it'd *help* to even the noob / vet divide, not counteract it. -----------------------------------------------
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Lord WarATron
Amarr Out Siders Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.11.20 11:32:00 -
[10]
Well, there are 3 Options
1. Do nothing - Which is most likely 2. Give a item of SP uberness to those the day before Kali, - Possible abuse as people will spam alts to farm these 3. Just give everyone a 800k SP boost the day before Kali on their current skill.
Anyhow I think option 1 is most realistic. --- Slot 10 Akemons Modified 'Noble'Zet 5000 implant +8% Armour FREE |
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Protunia
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.11.20 11:38:00 -
[11]
Oh Please dear GOD!! LMAO!!
Come on drop it already they aint giving anyone a boost of SP other than the new characters created after kali possibly.
I want all the minutes I missed training time when the server was down or I forgot to check my skills when I first started. Should I get those back?? Should they go back and track down who lost how much SP and make sure every one is up to snuff?? Hell hows about they just offer you can Pay for SP?? like $5 for 250k SP?? My Character Stats |
James Potkukelkka
BGG Freelancer Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 11:44:00 -
[12]
While at it, why not give new players 10M sp?
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Shadowsword
Gallente COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2006.11.20 11:52:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Nahia Senne Edited by: Nahia Senne on 19/11/2006 20:47:52 many people who started their characters recently are angry, while to older players it doesn't matter that much. 800 SP less or more, wont change a lot for someone who's already highly skilled.
so, a proposal to heal all the pain and suffering this change will bring... give everyone extra 800k SP!
See it that way: Noobs will start with about 1-month worth of skills free. Does this affect your character? Not in the least. So why should you care?
It also bring for those who wish to have alts an already effective character, so that's a good thing, even for veterans... ------------------------------------------ Every ship has a base 60-70% resist against the primary damage type of the race that is the least able to vary it's damage types. |
Ashira Twilight
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Posted - 2006.11.20 12:01:00 -
[14]
Whine whine whine whine whine. "Noobs get an almost-one-month head start! I want a head start!"
If you're playing now, you already got a head start on the people who will be making these 800 sp starting characters. Everybody that starts playing a game like this wants to "level up and play with the big boys". So tell me, how do you catch up with characters like Dr Caymus?
Maybe we should strip some skillpoints from the characters with the most? That would be fair, right?
Let noobs get their free sp. They still have a month and a half to train learning skills, and I'm sure most of us know how painful that is.
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Kepa Nimo
Gallente The Lookers
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Posted - 2006.11.20 12:07:00 -
[15]
As a sweetner maybe CCP could allow a respec of sp up to a max respec of 800k, therefore, current players get a one-off chance to re jig their skills to get rid of the ones they dont need so much, thus it wil be like getting 800k new sp.
Thoughts?
Kepa
"Its all for nothing, if you dont have your FREEDOM!!"
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Luke Pubcrawler
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Posted - 2006.11.20 14:12:00 -
[16]
I don't especially care about the 800k extra SP newbies will get, however I have been playing long enough for it not to really impct me. Now I have 4mill SP or so it is not that relevant, however if I had only been playing a month and saw a brand new character with more SP that me I would be unhappy.
CCP don't have to give existing characters anything and if they don't I won't really mind. However it would be nice (and good PR with the existing playerbase) if they made some sort of goodwill gesture.
"at the last downtime before Kali all skills currently in training will have X sp added" or something similar. It does not have to be the full 800k pts - just a friendly gesture.
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Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Freelancer Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 14:19:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Ashira Twilight Whine whine whine whine whine. "Noobs get an almost-one-month head start! I want a head start!"
If you're playing now, you already got a head start on the people who will be making these 800 sp starting characters. Everybody that starts playing a game like this wants to "level up and play with the big boys". So tell me, how do you catch up with characters like Dr Caymus?
Maybe we should strip some skillpoints from the characters with the most? That would be fair, right?
Let noobs get their free sp. They still have a month and a half to train learning skills, and I'm sure most of us know how painful that is.
I do believe you miss the point. Its the noobs who are gonna get hurt by the 800k thing, not vets- I've got 15 million SP or something like that, 800k really doesn't matter to me. But the poor newbs who have been playing 2 months and only have 1.2 million SP, thats just cruel. "If you'd not started playing for 1 month, you'd be like a whole month ahead of where you are now! Tough **** though, this is only to help noobs, not uber vets like you" -----------------------------------------------
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U Fester
Amarr dante's enterprises
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Posted - 2006.11.20 14:30:00 -
[18]
I am a newb with 1.5 mill SP and I do not agree with the 800K SP right off the bat. There are sectors of space a player can play in while they get their SP up. This way they earn their SP and learn the game at the same time. I think giving 800K to a person because they start on a specific date is wrong. What if I know nothing about EVE and read a review on MMORPG and downloaded the trial two weeks before Kali was released. Someone who started two days after I did would have over a two week jump bonus SP ahead of me ?!?!?! How is that fair to new players. I would have to delete my character and start over. That is a waste of time and where is the fun in that.
IMHO New Characters should not get 800K in SP and neither should Experienced Players. Learning the skills is part of the game. That is what seperates this form WoW and the others. If I wanted to advance overnight I would play EQ2 group with a high player and heal the whole time and advance like you wouldn't believe.
Leave the new character creation as it is... Just Fine.
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Apocalypsox
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Posted - 2006.11.20 15:18:00 -
[19]
Im not very impressed with this...I Have had my character for almost 2 months, training constantly, and i have a mear 950k skills to show. Now why did i make my character months ago when i could have waited and got nearly all my skills already there?
Ok, So maybe im just bitter about them nerfing my hurricane. But i might be bitter about them screwing existing accounts so much too.
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Viictoria
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Posted - 2006.11.20 15:47:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Apocalypsox Im not very impressed with this...I Have had my character for almost 2 months, training constantly, and i have a mear 950k skills to show. Now why did i make my character months ago when i could have waited and got nearly all my skills already there?
Ok, So maybe im just bitter about them nerfing my hurricane. But i might be bitter about them screwing existing accounts so much too.
Ok first of all, you could have potentially a LOT more SP than you have. If you start the right kind of character, and the right skill path you can get a high starting SP, somewheres around 300k. Doing the learning skill regime, and training them in the proper order, and possibly fitting a few implants in early, will make your SP gain skyrocket. You could have the coveted "800k SP" in 2 weeks probably.
The SP "boost" is not even 800k considering new players can start with 300k now. Another thing is that if they choose to spread out their starting skill choices like characters can now, they will dilute their total SP score and end up lower. I'm not sure the highest possible SP for a new character will be but I've seen the biggest was in fact between 800-900k.
Anyway, all this is irrelevant when you realize that the total potential "free" training time a new character gets is close to 2 weeks. It's not a massive advantage, by any means. And if you have that many after TWO MONTHS you only have yourself to blame.
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D'onryu Shoqui
Vengeance of the Fallen Imperium Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 15:50:00 -
[21]
Edited by: D''onryu Shoqui on 20/11/2006 15:49:52 bad idea it would let longtime players get 800k in a rank 14 skill or whatever really easy, compared to a younger players who might not have any useful high rank skills at all ------------------------- I am a nobody of IMP my views are my own. |
Jaxtet
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.11.20 15:58:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Apocalypsox Im not very impressed with this...I Have had my character for almost 2 months, training constantly, and i have a mear 950k skills to show. Now why did i make my character months ago when i could have waited and got nearly all my skills already there?
Ok, So maybe im just bitter about them nerfing my hurricane. But i might be bitter about them screwing existing accounts so much too.
I'm 2 months old and have 1.8 mill skill points. If all you have is 950k even the 800 SP boost wouldn't help you out too much. - It's great to have a life outside of a video game, ain't it?«
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Ithildin
Gallente The Corporation The Corporation Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 16:18:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Tronjay I agree completely with Iltihdin, give all existing players a fair bonus as compensation. Furthermore CCP could grant the players to freely compensate 500k sp on wathever skill they like. Lets stay fair to player who started to play eve 3-5 months ago.
That is the most interesting spelling of my name I've seen to date. It almost beat Sundri Elaption's "Ittlidding".
I'm not talking about giving all players something, I'm talking about giving all players the foundation skill levels.
See the starter skillpoints as these "foundation skill levels". At release of Kali, each player would get the "foundation skill levels" as near appropriate to their starting school as possible. This means that the "foundation skills" would have a "minimum value" that everyone of that graduation category would get.
Three examples: 1. Take, for example, Arvandor (my alt). She's a graduate of Federation Navy Academy. Her focus is entirely on Gallente war ships. From what I'm suggesting, she would get NOTHING since she's got max skills already.
2. Take Ithildin. He's a hard-core miner in his school background, but is specialized in Gallente and Amarr war ships. He's got most of the skills a beginner industrialist has, but is lacking a few. Ithildin would get less than 100k skillpoints (in skills I really have no use for).
3. Take Zhan Sijian (my other alt). He's a Federation Navy Academy graduate. His skill focus is on MINMATAR war ships and weapons (he's also rather new). Since the foundation skills would have him at slightly higher levels of Hybrid weapons and Gallente starships, he benefits the most of my characters - but nowhere near as much as a bloke who started his char a day before Kali release. (In reality, Zhan would most likely not gain anything by my proposition, either)
At no point would CCP hand out free skill points - all they hand out are the skill levels you would've been expected to have given your race, bloodline, and school. This is not compensation, veterans would benefit little to nothing from it.
The only drawback is that noob-alt-spies and similar misfits would benefit a lot from it. Too bad they don't enforce a one-character-per-account OR force us to declare our main (and then have alts officially tied to these mains). - EVE is sick. |
Imhotep Khem
Total Mayhem.
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Posted - 2006.11.20 21:24:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Imhotep Khem on 20/11/2006 21:25:10 And Justice for all.
Historically, CCP has never compensated us for SP lost due to servers being down extra days and whatnot. This is no different. They should do it, but they have not proven to have this level of honor. ____ "If your not dyin' your not tryin'." "Are you prepared to go all the way, Alexi?" DuGalle |
nutbar
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2006.11.20 21:40:00 -
[25]
CCP likely won't give SP to everyone (like they have avoided in the past due to downtimes etc..) because chances are, they don't know how to do it.
Who's to say that when they give the SP, it will be to a skill that the person wanted? What if the existing skill in training doesn't need as much as is to be given - what next? What about a character not training any skill?
Giving everyone 800k SP will solve all these complaints easily - only problem is, how to dish it out. If the SP system had a form of an SP "bank", then perhaps that could work - but I have no idea if that's the case or if they're willing to implement something like that for a likely 1-off deal of giving SP out.
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Espionage
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Posted - 2006.11.20 21:46:00 -
[26]
I have certain reservations seeing toons potentially being able to start with soo many key skills at level 5. Personally I think the skill point total is fine provided that it not be possible to pre-rank any of them past Level 3 or 4. Its bad enough you can start a character right now with Gunnery 5 if you wish. The changes in Kali seem to allow for a character that could be using T2 guns in no time flat.
A friend of mine who wants to play the game told me he was going to wait a few weeks for this patch to come out before starting to play simply because of the amount of time he could potentially shave off from having to train.
800k may seem like a wad of spit in the ocean to someone with SP into the double digit millions but its a substantial amount of training time shaved off. The character I am posting with has almost maxed learning (Adv 4 on all) and a set of +4 implants and she pulls in something like 2200+ sp/hour (cant get exact figure, no EveMon at this PC). Personally I would love a free ~15 days worth of training to just magically appear. I can think of a few key skills I could just have fininshed or a nice chunk taken out of if they gave me this (bship 5 comes to mind @ 32D).
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Accura
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Posted - 2006.11.22 13:17:00 -
[27]
we are all missing one point here it seems they are giving us a free expansion is that not enough for you guys to worry about 880k sp ?
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