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Khanh'rhh
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2949
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 09:50:00 -
[121] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote:Probably most of the trolls here don't actually understand what this weapon damage adjustment means
We do, it means the game would be completely broken and the only ship worth flying would be a battleship. Battleships are balanced, but they are balanced for their role. Since you don't understand their role, you don't understand why they are balanced.
Don't worry though, I'm sure telling everyone with years of experience they are wrong is a completely sound strategy, and your 5 minutes of experience will illuminate us all.
Of course, what we all know is that you're not even talking about PVP at all (since the cases of a battleship dying in the way you are wailing about are very few and far between, and preclude that the battleship pilot is either AFK, a new player in a ship without support skills, or just very very bad at the game) but you're talking about elite frigates in some mission that got you killed, likely because you're a new player in a ship without the support skills for it. "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930 |
Lephia DeGrande
Luxembourg Space Union
302
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 09:57:00 -
[122] - Quote
@Tacomaco, what you should aim for is more difference between alpha(Volley) and dps, the tracking mechanic is pretty much the most balanced mechanic i know at any game!
Maybe is tweaking alpha/dps a new Way to go?
BUT BE AWARE!! Frigs should be a bit OP because its the most accessible class at the Game, if your suggsestion Break this feature you would harm Eve!
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Egravant Alduin
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
69
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 10:54:00 -
[123] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote:Egravant Alduin wrote: If eve wanted to be more realistic there should be automatic weapons which they could shoot 30-40 rounds each weapon per cycle time or RPS as used in current gun systems.
Realism in game may or may not be good. In War Thunder ground forces they have realistic tank combat where tanks one-shot each other. The players in closed beta quit after 1-2 days. Combat games need a combat system and the one in Eve is only half complete. The small scale PvP in Eve is very bad because of the ship imbalance. Small ships with small weapons have the upper hand over larger ships with large weapons. There is no penalty for attacking a large ship with a small one. I only proposed a small change, to adjust the weapon damage based on the weapon signature and target signature. This will lead to larger range of ships that can be used in PvP. As an indirect effect it will require more output from the industry and more income for miners. Everyone would benefit from this. Probably most of the trolls here don't actually understand what this weapon damage adjustment means. Then again you don't really need to understand what's discussed here in order to troll, right?
There is a "penalty" bigger ships have high hps and tanking abilities.I still think though this sin t enough since i know frigatesthat can deal 400-500 dps which is a lot compared to a battleship which is 10 time bigger which deal 1000 dmage and terrible applied damage while frigates will have 100% applied damage. |
Tacomaco
No Taxes just fun
45
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 11:52:00 -
[124] - Quote
Khanh'rhh wrote: We do, it means the game would be completely broken and the only ship worth flying would be a battleship. Battleships are balanced, but they are balanced for their role. Since you don't understand their role, you don't understand why they are balanced.
At first glance it would look like everyone would be flying battleships around. But there is always the risk of loosing an expensive ship and right now it's the problem that you can loose a 200mil ship to 2-3 frigates. After the change to the dmg adjustment you would risk loosing the Battleship but only to 2-3 cruiser equipped at least with medium weapons.
A large ship like a BS should be relative immune to attack from 2-3 frigates equipped to fight small ships. Their small weapons aren't designed to handle large targets the same way the large weapons aren't designed to attack small ones. Simple.
After this change the small specialized ships can be diversified even more. Right now there is a specialized small ship that can equip Large missiles. The stealth bombers.
Small ships equipped with large weapons should be able to destroy large ships as they do now. Even more, another destroyer variant can be added to the game, a gun ship that can quip Large turret weapons.
Something like a Catalyst version that get 99.65% reduction to large turret power needs the same way the stealth bomber gets for torpedo Launcher. If the ship fits only large weapons it can handle large targets but can't handle small ones.
Right weapon for right target. Except that now the small weapons are the right weapon for everything.
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Lephia DeGrande
Luxembourg Space Union
304
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 14:00:00 -
[125] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote:A large ship like a BS should be relative immune to attack from 2-3 frigates equipped to fight small ships. Their small weapons aren't designed to handle large targets the same way the large weapons aren't designed to attack small ones. Simple.
I would be VERY carefully with this statement, high precision due the good Signature of small guns can pierce specific weakpoints much easier then big and vague shots.
For example, a broadsword strike can be absorbed by plate Armor while a small knife can pierce throught specific weakpoints between the plates, while the sword does have more impact the knife is easier to wield. |
Khanh'rhh
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2951
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 14:10:00 -
[126] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote:A large ship like a BS should be relative immune to attack from 2-3 frigates equipped to fight small ships
They already are. The entire problem here, is that you don't have a literal clue what you are talking about. You are piling assumptions on top of misunderstanding, and concluding that 2+2 = 163.
Small vs large is balanced by EHP and DPS.
A well-fit PVP battleship will do 800+ dps, and have 150,000 ehp, or about 80,000 ehp and an active tank of 500+ dps
A well-fit PVP frigate will do 150 dps, have 5000 ehp, or an active tank of about 50 dps.
In 95/100 scenarios, the battleship won't be bothering to try to kill the frigate, it will ignore it.
Your whole argument is basically "isk tanking" - the concept that the cost of the ship should inherently relate to it's power and how effective it should be. It took CCP a while, but when they realised there were 1500+ titans in the game, when they predicted a small handful based on price, they realised it was a flawed concept.
Eve is the most balanced game I can think of. Every pilot and every ship has a role to play and can perform it well enough to warrant being there. Compare that to other MMO's where there's months of grind to even meet the entry requirements, and it's balanced on gear, and you have a much worse situation.
You should be embracing the fact that as a new player you can be relevant to end-game content in week one, not wailing and crying like a baby that you can't pay-to-win. "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930 |
Khanh'rhh
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2951
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 14:11:00 -
[127] - Quote
FYI if you want to lean on "but in the real world" nonsense straw-men arguments again, then stop ignoring the posts where people have given real-world examples of small, cheap attack forces causing massive amounts of damage to larger, much more expensive military hardware. "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930 |
Khanh'rhh
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2951
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 14:15:00 -
[128] - Quote
FYI #2 - the majority of the most popular hulls for PVP are all battleships. "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930 |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1225
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 17:33:00 -
[129] - Quote
Egravant Alduin wrote:
There is a "penalty" bigger ships have high hps and tanking abilities.I still think though this sin t enough since i know frigatesthat can deal 400-500 dps which is a lot compared to a battleship which is 10 time bigger which deal 1000 dmage and terrible applied damage while frigates will have 100% applied damage.
in that particular case ur talkin about paper thin enyo's. they maybe good against battle ships, but a fleet stabber or navy slicer will hurt these enyos. its all about the rock paper scissors. EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
Xe'Cara'eos
A Big Enough Lever
117
|
Posted - 2014.03.30 03:23:00 -
[130] - Quote
Khanh'rhh wrote:FYI #2 - the majority of the most popular hulls for PVP are all battleships. yeah - but that's nullsec doctrine fleets - I'll bet 100 isk! For posting an idea into F&I: come up with idea, try and think how people could abuse this, try to fix your idea - loop the process until you can't see how it could be abused, then post to the forums to let us figure out how to abuse it..... If your idea can be abused, it WILL be. |
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Khanh'rhh
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2964
|
Posted - 2014.03.31 08:58:00 -
[131] - Quote
Xe'Cara'eos wrote:Khanh'rhh wrote:FYI #2 - the majority of the most popular hulls for PVP are all battleships. yeah - but that's nullsec doctrine fleets - I'll bet 100 isk! It's really anywhere. A BS hull is supremely common:
- In highsec station / gate camps - In larger lowsec fleets - In lowsec station / gate camps - Very common in serious FW fleets - In NPC 0.0, you will see a lot being used in syndicate / provi - In WHs with triage support when you are defending (though this will often just be more T3s) - In most sov 0.0 doctrines
In most places, the "DPS" fleet role will very often be a battleship hull, with other ships taking up about 40% of a fleet by number and acting as support/logi. T2 and T3 cruisers see fleet use, but both have serious drawbacks and are usually fielded as a rock-to-their-paper style counter. "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930 |
Lidia Caderu
Harbingers of Chaos Inc The East India Co.
27
|
Posted - 2014.03.31 09:57:00 -
[132] - Quote
So basically there have to be one more modifier to damage based on ratio of size cannon/launcher to size of target (not sig). Not bad idea actually. |
Juan Thang
Old American Syndicate Silent Infinity
27
|
Posted - 2014.03.31 10:47:00 -
[133] - Quote
When shooting a small and fast target with a big gun its hard, when shooting something large and slow with a fast guns its easy... Not exactly hard to work out mechanics. If they can break your tank with their 170~ dps then your either doing it wrong or its fair game. Similarly if you did hit the frig, which the pilot would have to be pretty stupid to stop moving completely or move on dead away or towards you... then they would die in 1 or 2 hits instead of the 150 hits it will take them to grind through your hp.
Again This mechanic is fine. Go play WoW. |
Tacomaco
No Taxes just fun
47
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 07:33:00 -
[134] - Quote
Lidia Caderu wrote:So basically there have to be one more modifier to damage based on ratio of size cannon/launcher to size of target (not sig). Not bad idea actually.
Of course it's a good idea.
If you look at who's against it, you'll see it's only players with frigates don't want this. Take for example this Juan fan boy above( whenyou tell people to stop playing and gtfo, you are a fanboy). I looked at 3 pages of his kills, all the ships he lost are frigate and destroyer size. Why frigate, because that's where the exploits are...
They just love to exploit this imbalance in the combat system to go with rookie ships or 300k isk hulls after medium size or even large ships 50-100 times more expensive. This huge ISK imbalance must be addressed for small scale PvP.
Maybe this is balanced in large fleets but the day to day PvP is done in small combat of 2-4 ships. Outside the Eve community does anyone see this game as a PvP game? Of course not, it's see as some ganker paradise because of this PvP imbalance.
Even if CCP makes this dmg adjustment for weapon/target sizes it will take some time to wash the bad reputation Eve got because of thie PvP imbalance
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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
327
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 09:03:00 -
[135] - Quote
Actually I don't mind the balance the way it is...think of rl battleships. Their 15" guns can't track small high speed MTB's, even the secondary armament would struggle which was why the MTB Destroyer (guess what that got shortened to) was developed. A BS should always fly in a fleet with smaller escort. It's only in missions that it is really possibly to fly a BS solo. Try taking corpies along in frigs and dessies on a mission and see how much faster the mission goes and how much more fun it is for the newer less skilled players. |
King Fu Hostile
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
6
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 09:44:00 -
[136] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote:Lidia Caderu wrote:So basically there have to be one more modifier to damage based on ratio of size cannon/launcher to size of target (not sig). Not bad idea actually. Of course it's a good idea. If you look at who's against it, you'll see it's only players with frigates don't want this. Take for example this Juan fan boy above( whenyou tell people to stop playing and gtfo, you are a fanboy). I looked at 3 pages of his kills, all the ships he lost are frigate and destroyer size. Why frigate, because that's where the exploits are... They just love to exploit this imbalance in the combat system to go with rookie ships or 300k isk hulls after medium size or even large ships 50-100 times more expensive. This huge ISK imbalance must be addressed for small scale PvP. Maybe this is balanced in large fleets but the day to day PvP is done in small combat of 2-4 ships. Outside the Eve community does anyone see this game as a PvP game? Of course not, it's see as some ganker paradise because of this PvP imbalance. Even if CCP makes this dmg adjustment for weapon/target sizes it will take some time to wash the bad reputation Eve got because of thie PvP imbalance
There is no PVP imbalance between a BS and a frigate, the BS wins and can't be killed by a frigate if both are fit for PVP and flown by competent pilots. The frigate has no way to break the tank of a combat BS.
Your argument is based on a fallacy stemming from a lack of understanding of PVP.
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Khanh'rhh
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2968
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 13:54:00 -
[137] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote:If you look at who's against it, you'll see it's only players with frigates don't want this Actually, as you have already admitted, literally everyone in Eve doesn't want this.
Your other posts (particularly the ones that had to be deleted in the new player section) reveal your motive; you seem to hate new players, and are trying to troll them. This change can only harm new players, and you know it.
Your concept that "one player should beat 2-4 players" because their setup costs more is dumb, and un-eve. You are also incredibly narrow minded and don't seem to see how this utterly breaks the game if you scale it up so that there isn't just one battleship on field fighting 2-4 frigates.
This has been explained to you over and over again in very simple terms, using real-world examples to dispel your "it's not realistic" strawman.
Based on the fact that you shut up till someone says something new you can selectively quote and say the same thing about, I have to conclude you are either a very poorly skilled debater, or an above-average troll. "Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual, issued in the 1930 |
seth Hendar
I love you miners
507
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 14:07:00 -
[138] - Quote
Egravant Alduin wrote:Tacomaco wrote:Egravant Alduin wrote: If eve wanted to be more realistic there should be automatic weapons which they could shoot 30-40 rounds each weapon per cycle time or RPS as used in current gun systems.
Realism in game may or may not be good. In War Thunder ground forces they have realistic tank combat where tanks one-shot each other. The players in closed beta quit after 1-2 days. Combat games need a combat system and the one in Eve is only half complete. The small scale PvP in Eve is very bad because of the ship imbalance. Small ships with small weapons have the upper hand over larger ships with large weapons. There is no penalty for attacking a large ship with a small one. I only proposed a small change, to adjust the weapon damage based on the weapon signature and target signature. This will lead to larger range of ships that can be used in PvP. As an indirect effect it will require more output from the industry and more income for miners. Everyone would benefit from this. Probably most of the trolls here don't actually understand what this weapon damage adjustment means. Then again you don't really need to understand what's discussed here in order to troll, right? There is a "penalty" bigger ships have high hps and tanking abilities.I still think though this sin t enough since i know frigatesthat can deal 400-500 dps which is a lot compared to a battleship which is 10 time bigger which deal 1000 dmage and terrible applied damage while frigates will have 100% applied damage. out of the SB, the max frig i can come up with would be the dardevil and it does top a tad under 300 dps vith void, wich has a terribad range.
and since SB uses torpedoes, they do have BS like damage application, also engaging almost any other frig with a regular 400+dps SB will end only one way: your fit on a killboard |
seth Hendar
I love you miners
507
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 14:11:00 -
[139] - Quote
King Fu Hostile wrote:Tacomaco wrote:Lidia Caderu wrote:So basically there have to be one more modifier to damage based on ratio of size cannon/launcher to size of target (not sig). Not bad idea actually. Of course it's a good idea. If you look at who's against it, you'll see it's only players with frigates don't want this. Take for example this Juan fan boy above( whenyou tell people to stop playing and gtfo, you are a fanboy). I looked at 3 pages of his kills, all the ships he lost are frigate and destroyer size. Why frigate, because that's where the exploits are... They just love to exploit this imbalance in the combat system to go with rookie ships or 300k isk hulls after medium size or even large ships 50-100 times more expensive. This huge ISK imbalance must be addressed for small scale PvP. Maybe this is balanced in large fleets but the day to day PvP is done in small combat of 2-4 ships. Outside the Eve community does anyone see this game as a PvP game? Of course not, it's see as some ganker paradise because of this PvP imbalance. Even if CCP makes this dmg adjustment for weapon/target sizes it will take some time to wash the bad reputation Eve got because of thie PvP imbalance There is no PVP imbalance between a BS and a frigate, the BS wins and can't be killed by a frigate if both are fit for PVP and flown by competent pilots. The frigate has no way to break the tank of a combat BS. Your argument is based on a fallacy stemming from a lack of understanding of PVP. not completely true
pvp fit are often buffer fits, so given enought time, the frig can chew throught the BS tank.
now, said frig can kite / sig tank BS, wich means the only way the BS can survive / kill the frig is that it does carry either ECM drones / modules, to GTFO, or neut.
what you say is true for active / regen fittings tho (some regen, and very case specific, because some nasty frigs can pull a lot of DPS) |
seth Hendar
I love you miners
507
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 14:54:00 -
[140] - Quote
Shizuken wrote:Nariya Kentaya wrote: just so you know, historically, zodiacs HAVE done severe damage to larger ships, high caliber weaponry and the occasional RPG is nothing to laugh at, even with a battleships armored plating.
Except the battleship was not trying to shoot back with its main battery. It had 20mm and .50 cal guns to do that. No such equivalency exists in EvE. you, like OP, seems to lack game mechanics knowledge
1- the main drawback of frig weapons, when engagin BC / BS, is the range, meaning you will be in range of point/web (10km), and neut (med neut is around 12-15k, large is up to 30k)
2- bc and BS can defend themselves against frigs, using scram, web, neuts, and drones and many of those can cumulate several
3- nothing prevents you from fitting frig sized weapons on your BS, meaning you can hit those pesky bugger, out of the SB, the opposite is not true for the frig.
now, if you manage to get your bs killed by frigs, even 2-3 of them, i kindly suggest the following:
1- stop whining 2- REALLY stop whining 3- learn fitting 101 4- learn game mechanics 5- once done, come back to this threads, and realise how dumb you were back then, and pray that your post stay burried |
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Arun Tadaruwa
State War Academy Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 15:18:00 -
[141] - Quote
Well look at that, making EVE-reality analogies.
I'm sory, but EVE isn't a realistic game.
Besides, gameplay comes before realism. The change you're proposing hinders gameplay, since it removes the ability to strike up the power scale.
If this game was totally realistic, it'd be tedious.
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Ella Echerie
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
9
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 15:42:00 -
[142] - Quote
The mechanics are fine. If you want to you can fit your battleship with anit-frigate weaponry and systems and it will be very very strong against frigates.
Basically what seth said ^. |
Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
1245
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 15:51:00 -
[143] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote: If you look at who's against it, you'll see it's only players with frigates don't want this.
ur the only one who wants this, everyone else flies ships from frigates to BS.#
edit- Quote:This huge ISK imbalance must be addressed for small scale PvP
isk is not a balancing factor in combat. its merely a deterrent.
just because a ship costs five times the isk does not mean it should take five ships to kill. with eve players setting the price of ships, this perception of cost = power is outright wrong. EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY?No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided""So it will be up to a pilot to remain vigilant wherever they may be flying and be ready for anything at any time" |
Adrie Atticus
Unicorn Love Hurts
52
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 17:38:00 -
[144] - Quote
Daichi Yamato wrote:Tacomaco wrote: If you look at who's against it, you'll see it's only players with frigates don't want this.
ur the only one who wants this, everyone else flies ships from frigates to BS.# edit- Quote:This huge ISK imbalance must be addressed for small scale PvP isk is not a balancing factor in combat. its merely a deterrent. just because a ship costs five times the isk does not mean it should take five ships to kill. with eve players setting the price of ships, this perception of cost = power is outright wrong.
Yep, with "more = more" -logic, Etana should be able to clear off dozens of Thanatoses solo. |
oohthey ioh
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6
|
Posted - 2014.04.01 18:08:00 -
[145] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote:Samwise Everquest wrote: You also realize that bigger ships have more EPH than smaller ships?
And the fanboyz pounce..... You realize that you completely ignore the fact that it's not about hit points. It's like saying that a tank has more hit points and if you shoot at it with with a machine gun it just takes longer to destroy it than it takes to destroy a car. When in fact it can't be destroyed... But I kinda understand why the fanboyz would be scared about this change. You would have to fight bigger ships with ships of their own size. Probably if you have some skill at making money you would afford some ship bigger than a frigate. Just keep the game like this, pvp for the poor man....
If it's made out of the same material then yes, a tank has more Hitpionts, if it's not the same material then it will still have more hitpionts, reason it will take more Hits to take down.
what you are trying to say dose make sense but that is already in the game, by giving the bigger ships more HP.
If you have a small brick wall one layer thick is going so many hits to take down, you a wall 3 times the size and 3 layers thick it will take even more shot to take down, but the bullets are going to do the same damage, just going to take more damage to take it down?!?!?! the bullets aren't "oh **** the wall is huge, let do less damage". so to take down the wall you bring a bigger gun, but that means the small wall will be taking down pretty fast so lets keep the small wall moving so the biger gun can't hit it... that is how the game is balanced at the moment.
and it's not hard to hit something smaller then you, you could always web them, paint them, keep range so on....
you looking at it wrong, you looking at as boring pain numbers not percentages, if small ships do 50% the damage to a bigger ships it's just the same as the bigger ship has 200% hitpionts and you doing 100% damage.
can go on but can't be asked.
sorry for poor grammar and spelling.
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Tacomaco
No Taxes just fun
47
|
Posted - 2014.04.02 09:06:00 -
[146] - Quote
oohthey ioh wrote: what you are trying to say dose make sense but that is already in the game, by giving the bigger ships more HP.
Of course larger ships have more hit points, it takes more materials to build and are larger.
The issue here is right weapon for the right target. The only reason some players don't like it is simply because it's not in the game.
Here is another example, rockets. Larger rockets hit small ships but do less damage because of the target signature, target speed, explosion speed and radius. So it's ok for big rockets to do less damage to small ships because it's balanced like that. There weren't designed to take out small ships.
The question is why should a light missile or rockets to full damage to large ships when they were designed to do their full damage to small fast ships?
Well, CCP keep the game broken like it's now. When new games like Star Citizen come out see how many of the PvP-ers still play Eve just for the PvP. It's easy now when Eve doesn't have completion. I wouldn't be surprised CCP will make quite a lot of changes to PvP once the completion start draining the player base.
Oh, well, there will still be miners in Eve... |
King Fu Hostile
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
13
|
Posted - 2014.04.02 11:27:00 -
[147] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote:
The question is why should a light missile or rockets to full damage to large ships when they were designed to do their full damage to small fast ships?
Because they do so little damage even at max capacity.
Do you still think that a frigate wins a battleship, btw?
|
Tacomaco
No Taxes just fun
48
|
Posted - 2014.04.02 12:16:00 -
[148] - Quote
Juan Thang wrote: Similarly if you did hit the frig, which the pilot would have to be pretty stupid to stop moving completely or move on dead away or towards you... then they would die in 1 or 2 hits instead of the 150 hits it will take them to grind through your hp.
Kill BS with frigate? This guy thinks so. He probably exploits that all the time.
How about this question, can a destroyer equipped with small weapons destroy a Battleship? Does it have the dps to burn the battleship tank? I think we all know the answer...
In 8 pages nobody has provided one single argument why the small weapons shouldn't be rebalanced. Sry guys, but "we like it(cause we can exploit it)" or "it's in the game for years" or "battleship has lots of hp" aren't arguments. 6 year old kids use this kind of arguments when they want something. When you don't like what's written here, could you at least write your comment so it doesn't look like it's taken from the warcraft forum?
Again: why large and medium ships with large/medium weapons should lose their effectiveness against small ships when the small ships don't lose anything? |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
331
|
Posted - 2014.04.02 12:34:00 -
[149] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote:Juan Thang wrote: Similarly if you did hit the frig, which the pilot would have to be pretty stupid to stop moving completely or move on dead away or towards you... then they would die in 1 or 2 hits instead of the 150 hits it will take them to grind through your hp. Kill BS with frigate? This guy thinks so. He probably exploits that all the time. How about this question, can a destroyer equipped with small weapons destroy a Battleship? Does it have the dps to burn the battleship tank? I think we all know the answer... In 8 pages nobody has provided one single argument why the small weapons shouldn't be rebalanced. Sry guys, but "we like it(cause we can exploit it)" or "it's in the game for years" or "battleship has lots of hp" aren't arguments. 6 year old kids use this kind of arguments when they want something. When you don't like what's written here, could you at least write your comment so it doesn't look like it's taken from the warcraft forum? Again: why large and medium ships with large/medium weapons should lose their effectiveness against small ships when the small ships don't lose anything?
The weapons in Eve are firing hypersonic shot, plasma bolts, anti-matter shells etc etc...these don't just hit armour, they vaporize chunks of it. Your armour reps try to mitigate ths by replacing material with paste, patching the scrap back in place, buffing fields around the hull etc etc. It is entirely conceivable that e.g. anti-matter will work perfectly from a small gun against a large target as non of it is wasted in an explosion radius to get the target. you practically can't miss. The BS shell on the other hand would need to be proximity fused to hit a frigate otherwise the chances of hitting would be negligible. Proximity fuse means blast radius means less damage than a direct hit against say another BS. |
King Fu Hostile
Imperial Collective Unsettled.
13
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Posted - 2014.04.02 12:36:00 -
[150] - Quote
Tacomaco wrote:Juan Thang wrote: Similarly if you did hit the frig, which the pilot would have to be pretty stupid to stop moving completely or move on dead away or towards you... then they would die in 1 or 2 hits instead of the 150 hits it will take them to grind through your hp. Kill BS with frigate? This guy thinks so. He probably exploits that all the time.
No, what do you think? Everyone else in this thread knows the answer, and it's no, a PVP fit BS will obliterate a frigate. but do you think this is not the case?
Quote:In 8 pages nobody has provided one single argument why the small weapons shouldn't be rebalanced. Sry guys, but "we like it(cause we can exploit it)" or "it's in the game for years" or "battleship has lots of hp" aren't arguments. 6 year old kids use this kind of arguments when they want something. When you don't like what's written here, could you at least write your comment so it doesn't look like it's taken from the warcraft forum?
Again: why large and medium ships with large/medium weapons should lose their effectiveness against small ships when the small ships don't lose anything?
In 8 pages nobody has provided one single argument why small weapons wouldn't be balanced as they are. Sry mate, but "I don't have a clue but my mission boat was violenced and therefore my cluelesness must be an exploit" isn't an argument. 3 year old kid uses that kind of argument when he wants something.
Again: Why should small ships lose their weapon effectiness against larger targets? Do you understand the tracking and explosion mechanics behind the current situation? |
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