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Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.05.27 20:05:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Batolemaeus on 27/05/2008 20:09:51 Edited by: Batolemaeus on 27/05/2008 20:07:41 Everyone who regularly scans for hidden goodies in New Eden knows it. Everyone hates it. You know what i am talking about:
(notify) No scan signatures detected
One time is not so an annoyance. Two times is still okay. Thirty? Or maybe fifty? Heck, i even had Sites that took me three or even more full sets of Quests.
In my opinion, this has to stop. After many unsuccessful scans one wonders if there is anything to be found in that system. Even if a multispectral tells you that there is a pesky radar site waiting to be found, after your third wasted set of quest probes without any result, you will be frustrated and throw your rigged covops with your 60m sisters probe launcher into the next reprocessing plant and go on emorage.
That's what i will do now.
Situational Awareness Expanded
Not so long ago, it was very difficult to tell if you were warpjammed by people. No flashing red, no Aura complaining, nothing but a small blue animation between the tackler and you. People were angry. CCP added a little icon to the overview, indicating what type(s) of ewar someone was using against you. People were happy again. There were still people getting scrammed all over New Eden, but now people knew it in advance, not at the point they wanted to warp out.
Why not have something similar done with scanning? The problem is not that a site can have such a low signature, that it will takes ages to scan it down. The problem is, that a probe either hits or fails, and most likely fails a lot of time before picking something up.
The Solution
In order to improve scanning, the feedback coming from probes has to be improved. No binary feedback, but a lot more diversed.
Let's assume a system with three sites of different strength. When scanning, you will see a cloud around that side, indicating the chance that a site is within it. With the first scans, you will have a lot of errors in it and false positives, but the more often you scan, the better the result will be, and the less false positives will show up. Once you are done, the map could look like this:
Linky
(Green regions symbolize the highest chance, orange medium, red is low chance. You start with small red areas that become thicker and thicker the closer you get to a final result. Once you have a larger green area, you will finally get a beacon to warp to.)
In my opinion, this would vastly improve scanning for basically anything, both for ships, and anything exploration related.
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Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.05.28 16:34:00 -
[2]
Quote:
[ 2008.05.28 15:29:18 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:31:56 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:34:32 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:37:17 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:39:54 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:42:31 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:45:13 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:47:48 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:50:25 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:53:00 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:55:39 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 15:58:15 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:00:51 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:03:27 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:06:04 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:08:40 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:11:17 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:13:55 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:16:31 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:19:08 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:21:44 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:24:20 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected [ 2008.05.28 16:26:57 ] (notify) No scan signatures detected
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Alton Jin
Astromechanica Maxima Astromechanica Federatis
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Posted - 2008.05.28 20:49:00 -
[3]
bad luck
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JAQUE ALERA
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Posted - 2008.05.29 02:09:00 -
[4]
/Signed
3 hours to find a drone site or a low reward site makes for a grumpy explorer. I also use Sister quest probes which also adds to the frustration when it takes 15-20 probes to scan down a site. All lvl 4 skills btw.
I also would vote for a change of loot drops in radar sites. The Serpentis and Centum sites I usually scan down drop loot worth little to literally nothing. Exploring could use a little love from the devs.
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Joe Starbreaker
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Posted - 2008.05.29 02:48:00 -
[5]
I do like the idea of lots of false positives and "maybes" that have to be gradually eliminated by scanning. It wouldn't actually take fewer licks to get to the center of the tootsie pop, but it'd be more interesting to watch.
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Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.05.29 08:30:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Joe Starbreaker I do like the idea of lots of false positives and "maybes" that have to be gradually eliminated by scanning. It wouldn't actually take fewer licks to get to the center of the tootsie pop, but it'd be more interesting to watch.
Actually, i think it would be a tad faster, because if i know where to look, i can make some bookmarks and improve coverage of that area. But i think that wouldn't be too serious, as it takes a careful planning to get those bookmarks..
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Manfred Rickenbocker
The Elliance Delta.Green
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Posted - 2008.05.29 22:42:00 -
[7]
Well, it'd be nice if they just highlighted that things were found, yet you dont have a lock on them yet. This would help alleviate the frustration and paranoia from not knowing if you placed your probes right. Also, since probing is afk time consuming, it'd be nice if there was a *ding* to let you know you had results, or if it auto-cycled to start scanning again if nothing was found (kinda like how arch/sal/hack modules work). A dev blog a while back hinted that they might give it an overhaul, but thats awfully non-committal. ------------------------ Peace through superior firepower: a guiding principle for uncertain times. |
Chee
hirr Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.06.16 00:11:00 -
[8]
Yes im annoyed if Im scanning for hours with no result, but in the end the reward is worth it, you just have to keep on going. Its already more profitable (alot!) then ratting, making it easier would screw the balance. Im glad theres a part in eve that isnt easy :)
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I I
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Posted - 2008.06.16 02:04:00 -
[9]
agree, totally. it needs improvement. either better scan results or much much better rewards for the 15+ers. Maybe a better probe with better skills , something. You can spend more isk on the probes then the rewards, not to mention the high amounts of risk. It's one area that takes u away from other types of gameplay and is a nice change. The ones that scan within reason are pretty fun just to go threw the motions, the long scan ones can be so freakin time consuming and just not worth it.
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pi314159265
Solstice Systems Development Concourse Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.06.16 07:55:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Chee Yes im annoyed if Im scanning for hours with no result, but in the end the reward is worth it, you just have to keep on going. Its already more profitable (alot!) then ratting, making it easier would screw the balance. Im glad theres a part in eve that isnt easy :)
Exactly what i was going to say. When u run explorations, u run the risk of not earning anything for hours but landing on something big. While ratting/mining gurantees certain amount of isk for sure. The game needs this balance to function properly. If not, then everyone would be exploring, then by that time people would biatch about sites not spawning fast enough?
The Glorious Nation of Khazikstan... |
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Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.06.16 12:27:00 -
[11]
Originally by: pi314159265
Exactly what i was going to say. When u run explorations, u run the risk of not earning anything for hours but landing on something big.
With my proprosed change, this would not change at all.
The only thing that would change, is that scanning would not feel like playing the one armed bandit, but working towards something. Actually pinpointing a signature, working yourself towards the result.
Currently, scanning often resolves around dropping quests at your bookmarks, cloaking, and then clicking "analyze" every 120 seconds for over one hour, then dropping new probes.
I don't call that fun and interesting gameplay tbh.
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Lake
Caldari Infinite Improbability Inc Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2008.08.09 11:31:00 -
[12]
Random reinforcement schedules, while addictive, are generally really frustrating. Something that moves towards more player interaction would be a great improvement, wether it's this suggestion or something else or just making it a 100% chance until something better can be implemented. -- eve-mail.net (thread) Instant Messaging and E-mail for EVE players |
Gamtu
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Posted - 2008.08.09 18:01:00 -
[13]
I personally don't mind spending the time to scan something down. I look at it like mining, it can be mind numbing at times waiting to get a result from probes.
What I don't like is spending a very long time scanning for a gravimetric site. Then once it's been located, finding nothing but floating debris in the site. Nothing to mine, no containers to hack, nothing but scenery.
I had this happen the other day. I spent 5 hours scanning this thing out and got nothing.
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Gamtu
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Posted - 2008.08.10 18:39:00 -
[14]
I have some suggestions for a complex probing overhaul.
When a complex has been emptied of it's goods it should no longer show up on multispectral probe scans. Even if a pilot is sitting in a complex holding the complex open after all the goods have been looted the complex should not show up on multispectral scans. I've spent hours scanning and all I find is an empty complex. There needs to be a way to communicate this to a pilot who may have scanned out the complex prior to it's being emptied and is now sitting in the system with 6 quest probes out scanning his heart out looking for a now non-existant complex. This is annoying. Not fun.
Create a "Claim Stake" probe. This probe would be launched within eyesite of a complex. When launched it would hold the complex open for a period of time. Preferably long enough so a pilot could dock at a station, jump out of whatever ship he used to scan down the complex and get into a proper ship. Also it would mask the complex from being detected by multispectral probes. Only one Claim Stake probe should be able to be launched at a complex. After that not even the pilot who originally discoverd the complex could launch another claim stake probe at that complex. When a claim stake probe has been launched any other pilot in the system that is scanning for complex's with scan probes would receive a message indicating that a claim stake probe has been launched. Depending on the circumstances the pilot could then make the decision to launch another multispectral probe and scan again or move on to a new system.
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Keith F
Caldari United Society Starfleet
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Posted - 2008.08.10 23:43:00 -
[15]
maybe a simpler way would be for multispec hits(types) to stay displayed or added to your journal,until you dock/leave system, and when a plex is finished it deletes. this could work the same as a mission,ie your journal flashes and a completed message sent to everyone that had probed it or entered it.
I have had sites that show as ie Grav and started probing only to find it was in use and finished while i was looking for it, only finding this out by bringing in a alt and re multispec for it. Another problem may accour if said site is completed and a new site of same type respawns (which does happen) Maybe Multispec probes need to last for 1hr and allow other probes to exist inside them so you can at least run a multi every 30 mins to check or even have it scan alongside your other probes
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Terranid Meester
Tactical Assault and Recon Unit
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Posted - 2008.08.11 00:22:00 -
[16]
I say limited range (10au?) multispectral probes will solve many problems. They wouldn't invalidate the system wide multispecs and you will be able to make a more precise assessment of where a signature is found. You would have to be careful that aquired bookmarking skills are not made obsolete by limited range multispecs.
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Vorononv Circut
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Posted - 2008.08.11 00:57:00 -
[17]
I like it. No gameplay changes, but saves sanity.
/approved
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