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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 09:48:00 -
[1]
Originally by: Virgil Aquilis http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=696474
I made a thread here that has to do with the Raptor change: GeneralNukeEm was right. The Raptor wouldn't be able to fit 3 125mm railgun IIs on Tranq right now, and with 4 less powergrid it hasn't got a chance. It's already the worst interceptor, why would you nerf it further?
Didn't you get the memo? Caldari ships have too much grid.
And the comment about range with T2 ammo in the dev blog... Seriously, what are you thinking? Being an interceptor, it tends to, you know... run its mwd... which tends to, you know... increase tracking requirements for its weapons, which isn't exactly what spike s encourages.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 10:13:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Nazriel
Originally by: Cevin North
Your MWD drains more capacitor now, so requires higher skills and forces you to fit a cap recharger to keep your ship running.
It doesn't drain more. 5% less penalty to max capacitor capacity for Microwarpdrive usage per level - old bonus You will just have less max cap level after boost, with mwd fitted, but it might be compensated by +250 max capacitor buff in blog.
Are you deliberately trying to misunderstand what he said?
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 11:50:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Miyamoto Uroki
Vulture needs more damage? It's a gang assist module ship, not a damage dealer. Fit three gang mods in it and there goes your dps anyways. Vulture is fine.
So can we reduce weapon hardpoints to 4 for all fleet command ships? According to you no one needs them anyway.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 11:52:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Karina Sasieko
Honestly now a HAM Cerberus will outperform the Deimos in terms of dps and tank (even when dual rep deimos - profanity) - and it can dish the damage out from 130km safe from web, nos, etc.
WTB HAMs with 130km range.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 12:05:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Grimpak
Originally by: Ogul
Originally by: Karina Sasieko
Honestly now a HAM Cerberus will outperform the Deimos in terms of dps and tank (even when dual rep deimos - profanity) - and it can dish the damage out from 130km safe from web, nos, etc.
WTB HAMs with 130km range.
well he's wrong.
you can hit with jav HAM's at 115km range
On more than one account. Jav HAMs do a whopping 6.25% more damage than T1 heavy missiles (hard to outdamage blasters with that), a sensor booster is needed to actually lock 115km (decreasing its tank even more).
But let's just all pretend that this HAM Cerberus simultaneously outdamaging, outtanking and outranging a Deimos is actually possible.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 13:02:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Ogul on 02/02/2008 13:04:37
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
that or make tracking disruptors blow up a gun's signature resolution. until defender missles get a boost, have this work against missles aswell.
You do know that signature resolution on a turret works exactly the same way as its tracking?
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 14:54:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
Originally by: Ogul
You do know that signature resolution on a turret works exactly the same way as its tracking?
sure, but sig res can be applied to missles ^^
Do you realize that there is no module available to improve missile explosion properties? Do you realize that (unlike turrets) oversized missiles never do full damage to their targets?
Oh yes, sure. Let's nerf missiles some more...
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 15:34:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Cordial Ripper why arnt any anti-caldari modules improved ? beter yet why is always caldari boosted (alongside with special races boost) and how come in this improvment minmatar and gallente get's kicked in the behind again ?
Modern people... they forget so fast. After 2 years of Caldari nerfs we get one boost patch and suddenly it's always Caldari that get boosted.
Concerning your other question: Gallente and Minmatar have been the king and queen of PvP for quite some time now.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 16:11:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Aslann
Originally by: Ogul
But let's just all pretend that this HAM Cerberus simultaneously outdamaging, outtanking and outranging a Deimos is actually possible.
I wonder how much DPS a blaster deimos does at 100km, ow thats right, 0. Might not outtank the deimos (with its 'wonderfull' new bonus), but 2 out of 3 isnt bad tbh :P
And what does that have to do with anything?
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 17:01:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Audri Fisher
I did not know that a Cerb could launch Hams out to 130km... are these Jav Hams with max skills/implants?
The funny thing about that is that heavy missile launchers with faction ammo will 1) do more damage, 2) are easier to fit, 3) have more range and 4) allow you to use FOF missiles.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 18:54:00 -
[11]
Originally by: J Valkor Good start. I don't quite understand what the Deimos pilots are complaining about since their MWD thing was replaced by a clean buff to their cap. Is it the slot lay out that is bugging you guys?
The new Deimos will have less cap (unless you decide not to fit an mwd, which no one in his right mind would actually suggest) and less low slots in exchange for another mid slot that no one wants. Hard to understand, isn't it?
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 19:02:00 -
[12]
Originally by: SirSpectre
Originally by: Nazriel
Finally, a poster who noticed it. 1375 cap * 1.25 * 0.8125 vs 1625 cap * 1.25 * 0.75
120+ more max cap after change. And that is with repair amount bonus.
But slot layout really should become 5\4\6 instead.
The penalty for teh MWD bonus is actually .9375 and not .8125. Look up a bit for my post and see the math.
You are both wrong. The Thorax/Deimos ship bonus complety removes the mwd cap penalty at cruiser level 5.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.02 19:13:00 -
[13]
Originally by: J Valkor
So the 5% completely canceled out the penalty for fitting MWDs?
Yes, it did.
Originally by: J Valkor
So you lost 150ish cap in exchange for, at max, 37.5% better repping?
That's about 11% less total cap and recharge rate. On top of that the lost low slot will reduce tank hitpoints or damage.
All that for a ship bonus on a hull that as a rule does not fit dual reps ever and prefers a buffer tank anyway? And this is supposed to make it tank better?
Originally by: J Valkor
And I don't suppose, at all, that anything can be fit in the extra mid to completely counter act that?
And what good does an additional slot that has to be used to counteract the changes that actually brought it into existence?
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.03 03:36:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Originally by: Ogul
Modern people... they forget so fast. After 2 years of Caldari nerfs we get one boost patch and suddenly it's always Caldari that get boosted.
Concerning your other question: Gallente and Minmatar have been the king and queen of PvP for quite some time now.
One? Evidently the increase in agility and the boost to torpedoes and ECM are soo 2 years ago.
Excuse me? The boosts to torpedoes and ECM indeed happened in the same patch and only recently if I am not mistaken. And there are only 2 ships that can use torpedoes anyway and one of them is a Minmatar one. ECM had a history of how many nerfs at that point? (And after the whining about the jamming ship boosts it will be nerfed again, no doubt.) The agility "boost" was actually an unnerf and long overdue.
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Or a lot of indirect boosts, like nerfing droned or adding neut towers in a big percentage of the new missions and almost all the level 5?
Sure, list every nerf that didn't specifically target Caldari as a Caldari boost...
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Granted, Caldari have not been king of the hill in large scale or 1 to 1 PvP for more than 2 years, but they have good ships for small/medium scale PvP and the best for PvE, while the use of active tanks or guns in PvE is constantly discuraged.
Actually PvE is the only place where I can make an active tank work well, unlike the majority of PvP situations where a buffer tank is more desirable.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.03 13:32:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
Originally by: Ogul Do you realize that there is no module available to improve missile explosion properties? Do you realize that (unlike turrets) oversized missiles never do full damage to their targets?
Oh yes, sure. Let's nerf missiles some more...
painter? web?
now - tell me a module to counter a crippled falloff
And painters and webs don't benefit turrets? In addition to tracking computers that have no missile equivalent? Never mind the fact that missiles already suffer far more damage reduction trying to shoot small or fast targets...
And yes, falloff reduction deserves a counter, the easiest way would be another script for tracking computers. And if any anti-missile ewar should ever make it on TQ, they better include some counters as well.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.03 13:58:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Ogul on 03/02/2008 14:05:03
Originally by: Roemy Schneider
Originally by: Ogul Never mind the fact that missiles already suffer far more damage reduction trying to shoot small or fast targets...
numbers plz
Numbers like 100% turret damage to frig sized targets with sufficiently low transversal - regardless of turret signature resolution?
Or the fact that damage reduction due to a certain projection of velocity is obviously less prominent than damage reduction based on velocity itself?
Target painters benefitting turrets hitting small and fast targets while they are completey irrelevant for missiles trying to hit fast targets?
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.03 18:29:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Goumindong
How about missiles losing damage at high speeds slower than turrets.
Not true.
Originally by: Goumindong
Missiles not having to worry about optimal ranges and falloff.
You are implying that missiles have infinite range here?
Originally by: Goumindong
Missiles hitting for 100% of damage against any target webbed with its MWD on.
A definite advantage over turrets that hit for 100% even if the mwd is off.
Originally by: Goumindong
Painters helping missiles against small targets without their MWD on where is completly irrelevent for turrets?
You are right, turrets don't need their targets painted in that case, your point being?
Originally by: Goumindong
They have different strengths, but accross the board, missiles do better average damage than turrets to targets.
No.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.03 19:22:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Goumindong
Originally by: Ogul ...
And im sure you have proof of this, no?
Also, missile explosion velocty falloff is 1500, and they do not have to worry about angular velocity, which makes your rebuttals for point 2, 3, and 4 false.
If you want proof you should have provided some of your own in the first place.
And I am repeating myself by saying that angular velocity is only a projection while missiles suffer from the target's velocity in any direction.
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Ogul
Caldari ZiTek Deepspace Explorations Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.04 14:23:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Buyerr
it's called balance. and on that note, the cerb will need a bonus to the close range, or rather the ham needs balance to get in line with torps and rockets needs the same..
Or it might just be that fitting close range weaponry on a ship with dual range bonuses isn't the smartest of moves.
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