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Ab'del Abu
Atlantis Ascendant
332
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Posted - 2015.07.22 19:22:24 -
[1] - Quote
It's happening oO
http://imgur.com/a/iYCHQ |
Asuka Solo
Knights of Azrael Circle-Of-Two
2987
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Posted - 2015.07.22 21:06:13 -
[2] - Quote
If it is true, yay more incursions!
Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!
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Ultim8Evil
Full Spectrum Inc Fidelas Constans
181
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Posted - 2015.07.22 21:08:10 -
[3] - Quote
RIP Amarr LP Store
Follow me on Twitter for literally no good reason @TheUltim8Evil
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NFain
Elysian Ascent Empyreus
131
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Posted - 2015.07.22 21:48:34 -
[4] - Quote
A really large piece of me wishes there was still a storyline connected after incursions were released. The Sansha Nation need the boot badly, if they rotated incursions and factions it'd be pretty cool. |
Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
11878
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Posted - 2015.07.23 00:27:40 -
[5] - Quote
This thread is obviously a lie, because according to people on this forum CCP doesn't care about PVE and hasn't added any pve content in like 14 years even though EVE is only 12 years old... |
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
914
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Posted - 2015.07.23 02:18:24 -
[6] - Quote
The end of Amarr empire is near...lets hope they are not sansha with more tanks and more ganks. |
Barrogh Habalu
Forever Winter Absolute Zero.
946
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Posted - 2015.07.23 06:44:20 -
[7] - Quote
Pend Insurance should brace themselves, for drifters are coming.
Oh well, it's not like they are making any profits anyway...
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1153
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Posted - 2015.07.23 07:18:28 -
[8] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:This thread is obviously a lie, because according to people on this forum CCP doesn't care about PVE and hasn't added any pve content in like 14 years even though EVE is only 12 years old...
they seem to add more pve stuff than anything else, funny that huh.
they will allow supers in these and we can watch carebears welp officer fit pve nyx's doing stupid ****
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
2608
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Posted - 2015.07.23 07:53:52 -
[9] - Quote
damn, i read it again. Dissapoint. |
Aladar Dangerface
13. Enigma Project
195
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Posted - 2015.07.23 08:28:42 -
[10] - Quote
I just hope they are not some lame, **** easy way for risk-averse carebears to farm isk. We already have this with sansha incursions.
Let them be actually dangerous or only in dangerous space, wh space would be cool
I don't need twitter.
I'm already following you.
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1153
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Posted - 2015.07.23 08:32:37 -
[11] - Quote
Aladar Dangerface wrote:I just hope they are not some lame, **** easy way for risk-averse carebears to farm isk. We already have this with sansha incursions. Let them be actually dangerous or only in dangerous space, wh space would be cool
it would actually make sense for them to be in wormholes
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Jaantrag
19
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Posted - 2015.07.23 08:36:05 -
[12] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Aladar Dangerface wrote:I just hope they are not some lame, **** easy way for risk-averse carebears to farm isk. We already have this with sansha incursions. Let them be actually dangerous or only in dangerous space, wh space would be cool it would actually make sense for them to be in wormholes
well drifters are coming and amarr is defending .. so .. not really sense for em to be in wh-s ... or meybe add offencive missions that take the fleet to wh space .. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2299
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 08:37:50 -
[13] - Quote
Aladar Dangerface wrote:I just hope they are not some lame, **** easy way for risk-averse carebears to farm isk. We already have this with sansha incursions. Let them be actually dangerous or only in dangerous space, wh space would be cool It's almost like Sansha incursions ARE dangerous. And people die to them on a daily basis. Just like any content with a predictable AI (even drifters) people can optimise and if you always take the best most efficient people as your benchmark you are going to get a terribly flawed view on what is going on. Calling pilots who incursion risk adverse is laughable, considering the amount of teamwork and thus reliance on OTHER people that goes on. You can't risk manage other peoples actions fully. So true risk adverse people don't incursion.
However let me also remind you of risk/reward comparision. If they are more dangerous than Sansha incursions, they must pay out that much more. Meaning once people master Drifter sites..... they will pay out even larger sums of money. |
Avvy
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2015.07.23 08:40:21 -
[14] - Quote
Barrogh Habalu wrote:Pend Insurance should brace themselves, for drifters are coming.
Oh well, it's not like they are making any profits anyway...
Don't get me started on insurance.
40 million ship best insurance on it is less than 0.5 million.
Now that's not insurance that's an insult. |
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1153
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Posted - 2015.07.23 08:41:27 -
[15] - Quote
Jaantrag wrote:Lan Wang wrote:Aladar Dangerface wrote:I just hope they are not some lame, **** easy way for risk-averse carebears to farm isk. We already have this with sansha incursions. Let them be actually dangerous or only in dangerous space, wh space would be cool it would actually make sense for them to be in wormholes well drifters are coming and amarr is defending .. so .. not really sense for em to be in wh-s ... or meybe add offencive missions that take the fleet to wh space ..
well there is that but they also stage from wormholes and judging by the defence of these things unless they allow capitals into highsec or remove the doomsday then seems wormholes will be best place for them, i guess time will tell, highsec doesnt need another mega money carebear activity
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Avvy
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2015.07.23 08:52:03 -
[16] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Jaantrag wrote:Lan Wang wrote:Aladar Dangerface wrote:I just hope they are not some lame, **** easy way for risk-averse carebears to farm isk. We already have this with sansha incursions. Let them be actually dangerous or only in dangerous space, wh space would be cool it would actually make sense for them to be in wormholes well drifters are coming and amarr is defending .. so .. not really sense for em to be in wh-s ... or meybe add offencive missions that take the fleet to wh space .. well there is that but they also stage from wormholes and judging by the defence of these things unless they allow capitals into highsec or remove the doomsday then seems wormholes will be best place for them, i guess time will tell, highsec doesnt need another mega money carebear activity
Yesterday flew from Amarr space to Minmatar came arcoss 4 reds NPCs at a gate, then they just vanished. 5 jumps later 4 more reds at a gate (on overview) then they vanished again.
If those are the incursion rats, then I'm not sure what they're supposed to be doing as they don't seem to be doing much at all. |
Aladar Dangerface
13. Enigma Project
195
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Posted - 2015.07.23 08:53:17 -
[17] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Aladar Dangerface wrote:I just hope they are not some lame, **** easy way for risk-averse carebears to farm isk. We already have this with sansha incursions. Let them be actually dangerous or only in dangerous space, wh space would be cool It's almost like Sansha incursions ARE dangerous. And people die to them on a daily basis. Just like any content with a predictable AI (even drifters) people can optimise and if you always take the best most efficient people as your benchmark you are going to get a terribly flawed view on what is going on. Calling pilots who incursion risk adverse is laughable, considering the amount of teamwork and thus reliance on OTHER people that goes on. You can't risk manage other peoples actions fully. So true risk adverse people don't incursion. However let me also remind you of risk/reward comparision. If they are more dangerous than Sansha incursions, they must pay out that much more. Meaning once people master Drifter sites..... they will pay out even larger sums of money. I agree they should pay out more than incursions if they are in dangerous space, the risk:reward ratio of incursions is highly skewed compared to other forms of pve an imo should get nerfed a little.
In Incursions you only have to deal with rats killing you. In other areas of space you have to deal with the chances of rats killing you and also the very likely scenario of other players killing you this is why incursions risk:reward is not balanced, (don't give me the **** that players kill incursion runners, it doesn't happen often enough to make it a valid counter argument) now im not say nerf incursion payouts until they are not worht running but they should not pay out as much as they do, somewhere between the average L4 mission ad the curent incursion payout level i would say.
I don't need twitter.
I'm already following you.
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1153
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Posted - 2015.07.23 08:55:52 -
[18] - Quote
Avvy wrote:Lan Wang wrote:Jaantrag wrote:Lan Wang wrote:Aladar Dangerface wrote:I just hope they are not some lame, **** easy way for risk-averse carebears to farm isk. We already have this with sansha incursions. Let them be actually dangerous or only in dangerous space, wh space would be cool it would actually make sense for them to be in wormholes well drifters are coming and amarr is defending .. so .. not really sense for em to be in wh-s ... or meybe add offencive missions that take the fleet to wh space .. well there is that but they also stage from wormholes and judging by the defence of these things unless they allow capitals into highsec or remove the doomsday then seems wormholes will be best place for them, i guess time will tell, highsec doesnt need another mega money carebear activity Yesterday flew from Amarr space to Minmatar came arcoss 4 reds NPCs at a gate, then they just vanished. 5 jumps later 4 more reds at a gate (on overview) then they vanished again. If those are the incursion rats, then I'm not sure what they're supposed to be doing as they don't seem to be doing much at all.
may have been seekers scanning stuff, i wouldnt shoot them they will just call in friends (drifters) and you die :)
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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ashley Eoner
486
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Posted - 2015.07.23 11:04:07 -
[19] - Quote
Aladar Dangerface wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:Aladar Dangerface wrote:I just hope they are not some lame, **** easy way for risk-averse carebears to farm isk. We already have this with sansha incursions. Let them be actually dangerous or only in dangerous space, wh space would be cool It's almost like Sansha incursions ARE dangerous. And people die to them on a daily basis. Just like any content with a predictable AI (even drifters) people can optimise and if you always take the best most efficient people as your benchmark you are going to get a terribly flawed view on what is going on. Calling pilots who incursion risk adverse is laughable, considering the amount of teamwork and thus reliance on OTHER people that goes on. You can't risk manage other peoples actions fully. So true risk adverse people don't incursion. However let me also remind you of risk/reward comparision. If they are more dangerous than Sansha incursions, they must pay out that much more. Meaning once people master Drifter sites..... they will pay out even larger sums of money. I agree they should pay out more than incursions if they are in dangerous space, the risk:reward ratio of incursions is highly skewed compared to other forms of pve an imo should get nerfed a little. In Incursions you only have to deal with rats killing you. In other areas of space you have to deal with the chances of rats killing you and also the very likely scenario of other players killing you this is why incursions risk:reward is not balanced, (don't give me the **** that players kill incursion runners, it doesn't happen often enough to make it a valid counter argument) now im not say nerf incursion payouts until they are not worht running but they should not pay out as much as they do, somewhere between the average L4 mission ad the curent incursion payout level i would say. Only rats Code, goons, and other groups that swing by to pipe bomb or suicide gank you.
Then there's the moving of your ships and god help you if you move your blinged out BS through eudama/niarja at the wrong time.
Risk exists and can be mitigated just like in other areas of space.
You don't even want to know how much isk I'm making in null while mostly AFK.
Done right level 4s can net more an hour than what you can get running incursions. |
Anthar Thebess
1236
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 11:12:00 -
[20] - Quote
Burn Amarr - drifter version. I hope that drifters will camp gates , and kill people on them.
Capital Remote AID Rebalance
Way to solve important nullsec issue. CSM members do your work.
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1155
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Posted - 2015.07.23 11:39:41 -
[21] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:Burn Amarr - drifter version. I hope that drifters will camp gates , and kill people on them.
carebears will go mad!
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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ashley Eoner
486
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Posted - 2015.07.23 12:06:14 -
[22] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Anthar Thebess wrote:Burn Amarr - drifter version. I hope that drifters will camp gates , and kill people on them. carebears will go mad! Bigger issue would be another game aspect to drive away new players thus helping the decline in numbers. |
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1528
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 18:50:28 -
[23] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:well there is that but they also stage from wormholes and judging by the defence of these things unless they allow capitals into highsec or remove the doomsday then seems wormholes will be best place for them, i guess time will tell, highsec doesnt need another mega money carebear activity This seems like somewhat of a reskin to the activity highsec already has. It effectively adds nothing. Though it might actually detract from money making prospects as we won't be intimately familiar with the sites and thus able to optimize every encounter. |
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
3852
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 19:50:44 -
[24] - Quote
Wow, Incursions Again! Right after Sovereignty Again and as EVE re-development progresses towards Apochrypha Again!
73% of EVE characters stay in high security space. 62% of EVE subscribers barely PvP. 40% of all new accounts just "level up their Ravens". Probably that's why PvE content in EVE Online is sub-par and CCP is head over heels for PvP...
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Daemun Khanid
Sanctus Imperialis
128
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Posted - 2015.07.23 20:13:46 -
[25] - Quote
Making drifter incursions just feels to me like they took a cool developing story line and said "meh, we're done. Here are some new npc's to shoot at. " it's basicaly saying the story line is essentially dead in the water, all thats left is pew pew the bad guys. Just sansha's in less horny ships. If this is all thats to become of the drifter storyline then I'm very dissapointed. Almost as anti-climatic as sarum's titan visit the other day.
Daemun of Khanid
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1164
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 20:19:05 -
[26] - Quote
Daemun Khanid wrote:Making drifter incursions just feels to me like they took a cool developing story line and said "meh, we're done. Here are some new npc's to shoot at. " it's basicaly saying the story line is essentially dead in the water, all thats left is pew pew the bad guys. Just sansha's in less horny ships. If this is all thats to become of the drifter storyline then I'm very dissapointed. Almost as anti-climatic as sarum's titan visit the other day.
Amen.
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Hal Morsh
Aliastra Gallente Federation
347
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Posted - 2015.07.23 21:41:11 -
[27] - Quote
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Wow, Incursions Again! Right after Sovereignty Again and as EVE re-development progresses towards Apochrypha Again!
No worries, if walking around becomes a thing I get to watch peoples heads pop. Regardless of my opinion.
Dun'Gal > Hal is simply an imperfect ai, though if drunkeness ever gets programmed into ai's I foresee both a hilarious and tragic end to humanity.
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2300
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 21:53:39 -
[28] - Quote
Daemun Khanid wrote:Making drifter incursions just feels to me like they took a cool developing story line and said "meh, we're done. Here are some new npc's to shoot at. " it's basicaly saying the story line is essentially dead in the water, all thats left is pew pew the bad guys. Just sansha's in less horny ships. If this is all thats to become of the drifter storyline then I'm very dissapointed. Almost as anti-climatic as sarum's titan visit the other day. This assumes they don't keep stats on the drifter sites, how many are won vs lost, and then develop the story further because of it. There needs to be some fleet PvE in all areas of space, but providing they leave normal incursions running, nothing says Drifter 'incursions' have to be a full time thing but it provides a mechanic for them to provide content over a reasonable period for a storyline without constant Dev spawning. |
Velarra
421
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Posted - 2015.07.23 22:14:12 -
[29] - Quote
Standings & consequences. |
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
3852
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 22:39:11 -
[30] - Quote
Velarra wrote:Standings & consequences.
But they don't want to be your friends. They just want to kill you. So it's all about them hating you more and more until hell frezes.
My first thought when Seekers appeared, was that it would be cool to assist them if attacked. I really like the idea of friendly NPCs which were useful for something. Yet back then I thought, "but, !!CCP!!; they will never come pu with that".
And here we are. I stopped killing Seekers since i don't trust CCP to be sensible enough to give a way out if I happen to burn out this character. Now there's rumors of Incursions...
73% of EVE characters stay in high security space. 62% of EVE subscribers barely PvP. 40% of all new accounts just "level up their Ravens". Probably that's why PvE content in EVE Online is sub-par and CCP is head over heels for PvP...
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Daemun Khanid
Sanctus Imperialis
130
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Posted - 2015.07.23 22:41:45 -
[31] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Daemun Khanid wrote:Making drifter incursions just feels to me like they took a cool developing story line and said "meh, we're done. Here are some new npc's to shoot at. " it's basicaly saying the story line is essentially dead in the water, all thats left is pew pew the bad guys. Just sansha's in less horny ships. If this is all thats to become of the drifter storyline then I'm very dissapointed. Almost as anti-climatic as sarum's titan visit the other day. This assumes they don't keep stats on the drifter sites, how many are won vs lost, and then develop the story further because of it. There needs to be some fleet PvE in all areas of space, but providing they leave normal incursions running, nothing says Drifter 'incursions' have to be a full time thing but it provides a mechanic for them to provide content over a reasonable period for a storyline without constant Dev spawning.
If they continue to actually develop the story in a way that influences the game/universe then it's all fine and good. It just feel's like a nail in the coffin. If nothing else effecting the EvE universe happens with the drifters then it will just be a very elaborate way to have introduced Entosis links and a new NPC faction to pew pew....Zzzzzz.
Daemun of Khanid
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2300
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Posted - 2015.07.23 22:48:45 -
[32] - Quote
Daemun Khanid wrote:
If they continue to actually develop the story in a way that influences the game/universe then it's all fine and good. It just feel's like a nail in the coffin. If nothing else effecting the EvE universe happens with the drifters then it will just be a very elaborate way to have introduced Entosis links and a new NPC faction to pew pew....Zzzzzz.
Remember Sansha incursions storyline stalled because no-one was left who knew what was meant to be happening with the story..... |
Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
11887
|
Posted - 2015.07.23 22:56:44 -
[33] - Quote
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Wow, Incursions Again! Right after Sovereignty Again and as EVE re-development progresses towards Apochrypha Again!
And despite your angst you will pay your sub(s) to a company you seem to have a lot of disdain for again despite the facts that CCP never seems to give you anything you want and paying them assures that they never need to.
Complete sane behavior, don't ever let anyone tell you different, especially me while I'm rolling in the isk from these new incursions.... |
NFain
Elysian Ascent Empyreus
132
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 04:27:12 -
[34] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Wow, Incursions Again! Right after Sovereignty Again and as EVE re-development progresses towards Apochrypha Again! And despite your angst you will pay your sub(s) to a company you seem to have a lot of disdain for again despite the facts that CCP never seems to give you anything you want and paying them assures that they never need to. Complete sane behavior, don't ever let anyone tell you different, especially me while I'm rolling in the isk from these new incursions....
And to be honest Apocrypha was probably the best expansion post revelations.... |
DaReaper
Net 7
2399
|
Posted - 2015.07.24 04:31:46 -
[35] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Daemun Khanid wrote:
If they continue to actually develop the story in a way that influences the game/universe then it's all fine and good. It just feel's like a nail in the coffin. If nothing else effecting the EvE universe happens with the drifters then it will just be a very elaborate way to have introduced Entosis links and a new NPC faction to pew pew....Zzzzzz.
Remember Sansha incursions storyline stalled because no-one was left who knew what was meant to be happening with the story.....
if thats the case, and it might be if that whole team lest, they are now better documenting the story and have it woven into the tapestry of all releases. which is kinda what the EP i suppose to do, set the passe and the overall goals. In theory, if say the entire team working the story leaves, then new team should have notes and a way to look up what was next. But this is ccp we are talking about, so.. i still hope
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
Yes i am optimistic about eve.. i'm giving it till dec 31st 2016 before i doom n gloom
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Rawketsled
Generic Corp Name
243
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Posted - 2015.07.24 05:58:37 -
[36] - Quote
Just needs the Seeker AI turned up to 11.
Get them to fight more like players. There's ML techniques that you could train off the server logs. |
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
3855
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Posted - 2015.07.24 06:52:36 -
[37] - Quote
NFain wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:Wow, Incursions Again! Right after Sovereignty Again and as EVE re-development progresses towards Apochrypha Again! And despite your angst you will pay your sub(s) to a company you seem to have a lot of disdain for again despite the facts that CCP never seems to give you anything you want and paying them assures that they never need to. Complete sane behavior, don't ever let anyone tell you different, especially me while I'm rolling in the isk from these new incursions.... And to be honest Apocrypha was probably the best expansion post revelations....
My issue is not with "Apochyrpha" but with "Again". Even if, or when, the new space with new structures and new gates is implemented succesfully, it still will be a repeat of past glories. The only people who will appreciate it are those who play the game, which is a consequence of implementing customer oriented design... but the collateral damage is that those who don't play the game don't feel interested with the goals designed for those playing the game. Unless you aim for non-customers, customer oriented design shuts the door to new blood.
Nothing currently in the works answers the key question: "Why should you start playing EVE now?"
"Because they're repeating stuff that worked years ago" is not the right answer. Not when the game is old, its population is dwindling and it fails to retain 80% of all new players.
73% of EVE characters stay in high security space. 62% of EVE subscribers barely PvP. 40% of all new accounts just "level up their Ravens". Probably that's why PvE content in EVE Online is sub-par and CCP is head over heels for PvP...
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Barrogh Habalu
Forever Winter Absolute Zero.
953
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Posted - 2015.07.24 08:56:27 -
[38] - Quote
Daemun Khanid wrote:If they continue to actually develop the story in a way that influences the game/universe then it's all fine and good. I'll slip some negativity here and say that it will also be a minor case of "rip sandbox" when player-generated content is being replaced with GMs (or devs in this particular case) screwing around with people by drifter proxies. I mean, one thing is when someone does PvE and gets suicide ganked for his trouble. Another thing when basically the same happens to him by NPC hand... Doesn't that feel a bit shallow? Is EVE there yet that it must have bots trying to actively do stuff in order to provide content?
I don't know. Sansha incursions still feel more like tools for players, of resource deposit variety, drifters actively interfering with everything is something else...
Rawketsled wrote:Just needs the Seeker AI turned up to 11.
Get them to fight more like players. There's ML techniques that you could train off the server logs. They need to act without being tied to grid and simple spawning/despawning mechanisms in order for that to work.
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
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Silverdaddy
Ourapheh Holdings
65
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Posted - 2015.07.24 18:04:37 -
[39] - Quote
I got my hopes up... the first screen shot seemed to imply that you could chose sides, but the descriptions of the "Amarr" encounters show otherwise. Grrrrrrr.
The problem with slavery is that only half of the manacles are visible. The Holder, supposed master, is equally bound by the gilded chains of privilege and wealth.
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DrysonBennington
Aliastra Gallente Federation
227
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Posted - 2015.07.25 05:48:37 -
[40] - Quote
If PVE with Drifters actually involved them attacking POS and other Player Owned Structures it would be more interesting. |
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Xylem Viliana
Protomonolithic
314
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Posted - 2015.07.31 21:33:15 -
[41] - Quote
it happened, sort of
Safizon currently under assault by possibly 100+ drifters |
Pryce Caesar
Evil Young Flesh
3
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Posted - 2015.08.01 23:14:00 -
[42] - Quote
Xylem Viliana wrote:it happened, sort of
Safizon currently under assault by possibly 100+ drifters
So I read in the news. It like this event is the prelude for a future update revolving around the Drifters. For my part, I hope that it could be a prelude for Drifter ships to be made available to Capsuleers. It'd be interesting to see a new class of ship.
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Xylem Viliana
Protomonolithic
314
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Posted - 2015.08.02 07:42:30 -
[43] - Quote
Pryce Caesar wrote:Xylem Viliana wrote:it happened, sort of
Safizon currently under assault by possibly 100+ drifters So I read in the news. It like this event is the prelude for a future update revolving around the Drifters. For my part, I hope that it could be a prelude for Drifter ships to be made available to Capsuleers. It'd be interesting to see a new class of ship.
Won't happen. But ccp did not deny that the current lore may provide us with a new ship that the Amarr are working on. Drifter ships are nice but would kill any format of balance as things stand. |
Aeon Plex
Entropy of Annihilation Circle-Of-Two
28
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Posted - 2015.08.11 19:32:51 -
[44] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:Burn Amarr - drifter version. I hope that drifters will camp gates , and kill people on them.
Awesome. And camp WH entrances and exits... Let's get this f*kin party started and make the world really come alive to join the capsuleers in creating the dynamic of New Eden...
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Ned Thomas
Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave
1732
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Posted - 2015.08.11 23:58:18 -
[45] - Quote
Just thought I'd pop in and mention that there was a mass test on Singularity today to test drive Drifter incursions. By all accounts, players got their asses handed to them by the new AI. Afterwards, Paradox confirmed that the Drifter incursions will spread to adjacent systems over time. I do believe that in addition to incursion sites, Drifters will attack you on stations, gates, wormholes....pretty much anywhere you can sit in space.
Don't have many other details. I did ask if anyone tried to help the Drifters and was told everyone died too quickly to find out.
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Onward to Thera with Eve Scout
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Victory Myel
Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance
0
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 02:13:58 -
[46] - Quote
Asuka Solo wrote:If it is true, yay more incursions! |
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
39492
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 02:18:24 -
[47] - Quote
Victory Myel wrote:Asuka Solo wrote:If it is true, yay more incursions! Well, the Galatea feedback thread in the Test Server forum seems to be fairly clear.
Coming in the next release:
Team Space Glitter
Updates to behavior NPCs (Drifters and Amarr Navy) for NPC vs NPC combat Defense of the Throne Worlds incursion
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Glathull
Warlock Assassins
1084
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 03:23:25 -
[48] - Quote
Please let this be the beginning of caps in high sec. please please please please please.
I honestly feel like I just read fifty shades of dumb. --CCP Falcon
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Oxide Ammar
211
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 04:27:41 -
[49] - Quote
There are no blingy enough BS in fleet with logi that could be able to tank 700K omni dmg that drifters do in this incursion, is this new drifter incursion for capital ships ? dreads and carriers
Lady Areola Fappington: -áSolo PVP isn't dead!-á You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
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Barrogh Habalu
Forever Winter Absolute Zero.
1018
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 05:16:52 -
[50] - Quote
Oxide Ammar wrote:There are no blingy enough BS in fleet with logi that could be able to tank 700K omni dmg that drifters do in this incursion, is this new drifter incursion for capital ships ? dreads and carriers Or people will actually have to *gasp* expend ships.
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
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Oxide Ammar
211
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 05:31:36 -
[51] - Quote
Barrogh Habalu wrote:Oxide Ammar wrote:There are no blingy enough BS in fleet with logi that could be able to tank 700K omni dmg that drifters do in this incursion, is this new drifter incursion for capital ships ? dreads and carriers Or people will actually have to *gasp* expend ships.
What is the incentive for me to lose every time I sit doing incursion a 2-3 bill worth BS just because " Dude you just got DD'd by drifter and we can't do anything about it !".....31 mill like in HQ ? I think I'll pass on this.
Lady Areola Fappington: -áSolo PVP isn't dead!-á You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
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Barrogh Habalu
Forever Winter Absolute Zero.
1018
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 05:41:16 -
[52] - Quote
Oxide Ammar wrote:What is the incentive for me to lose every time I sit doing incursion a 2-3 bill worth BS just because " Dude you just got DD'd by drifter and we can't do anything about it !".....31 mill like in HQ ? I think I'll pass on this. Nobody said you must fly 2-3 bil BS. Not like you will suddenly get Drifter site when warping into what looks like Sansha site. Like I've mentioned already, caps are off limits in sites right now, so there's that. As for incentives, well... Payout/h - Expenditure/h = ISK/hour, the latter can still be considerable. Don't forget your insurance, and loot your wrecks (if drifters don't pop them, that's it).
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
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Arthur Aihaken
Perkone Caldari State
4558
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 07:35:53 -
[53] - Quote
So how do Drifter Incursions work then? Teams wait for the token player to show up who will unwittingly take the DD? "Looks like we're going to need another Timmy..."
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon That Escalated Quickly.
1622
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 07:38:39 -
[54] - Quote
There are going to be large fleets with very fast small ships
TunDraGon is recruiting!
"Also, your boobs [:o] " -á
CCP Eterne, 2012
"When in doubt...make a di++k joke."-áRobin Williams - RIP
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Oxide Ammar
211
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 07:42:23 -
[55] - Quote
Barrogh Habalu wrote:Oxide Ammar wrote:What is the incentive for me to lose every time I sit doing incursion a 2-3 bill worth BS just because " Dude you just got DD'd by drifter and we can't do anything about it !".....31 mill like in HQ ? I think I'll pass on this. Nobody said you must fly 2-3 bil BS. Not like you will suddenly get Drifter site when warping into what looks like Sansha site. Like I've mentioned already, caps are off limits in sites right now, so there's that. As for incentives, well... Payout/h - Expenditure/h = ISK/hour, the latter can still be considerable. Don't forget your insurance, and loot your wrecks (if drifters don't pop them, that's it).
Have you ever seen incursion fleet done in T1 cheap BS with T2 fitting ? It takes ages to finish the site. Also your math is flawed because if CCP followed this they need to make site payout huge.
Lady Areola Fappington: -áSolo PVP isn't dead!-á You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
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Anthar Thebess
1265
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 09:00:28 -
[56] - Quote
This is getting interesting. Drifter incursions in higsec/lowsec/nullsec but Sansha incursions only in lowsec and nullsec.
Finally CCP! Good move.
Capital Remote AID Rebalance
Way to solve important nullsec issue. CSM members do your work.
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afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1791
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 11:37:50 -
[57] - Quote
Eugene Kerner wrote:There are going to be large fleets with very fast small ships
More likely fleets of fully insured T1 battleships.
Basically "pay 30m-50m to play incursions" :)
The like the idea of them spreading, that is fairly amusing. |
Barrogh Habalu
Forever Winter Absolute Zero.
1020
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 12:00:14 -
[58] - Quote
Oxide Ammar wrote:Have you ever seen incursion fleet done in T1 cheap BS with T2 fitting ? It takes ages to finish the site. Also your math is flawed because if CCP followed this they need to make site payout huge. I've seen worse. I've started there. Payout was still better than what people with that kind of skills and ships could get anywhere in hisec still, and arguably better than null ratting in half-decent ships was at the time. And I'm talking accepting BCs and shield fitting amarr ships and no T2 guns whatsoever because :newbfleet: level of badness.
It's a matter of comparison with what you think ISK/hour should be. And we don't know CCP plans for existing content...
Speaking of payout - it's currently meh apparently. Again, we don't know what it will become eventually. New items for unique LP? More ISK? Something else? Maybe payout will be in the form of keeping your hisec space where you can farm Sansha/L4s Drifter-gank-free, I don't know. I mean, they did say that incursions will spread (from my understanding - unless stopped) and that drifters will gank people anywhere in space for sh*** and giggles, right?
Oxide Ammar wrote:Edit: I'm not demanding a capital incursion, but by the look from the numbers and DD dmg (~700k omni dmg as they say) I thought the only ships they can tank that was capital ships since they have enough buffer, but since we aren't obligated to fly blingy pirate BS I'm just gonna park bowhead with 3 fitted Hyperions just in case. -.- Something tells me that it will be a way to go unless something will be discovered about DDs or people will just decide it's not worth the trouble.
Anthar Thebess wrote:This is getting interesting. Drifter incursions in higsec/lowsec/nullsec but Sansha incursions only in lowsec and nullsec.
Finally CCP! Good move. "Yay CCP doing something in my imagination!"
And before we proceed with moving Sansha to low/null entirely, can we please axe NPC kill stats and incursion influence levels from across the galaxy to know where exactly we must head in order to gank juicy battleship fleet?
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
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afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1792
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 12:18:12 -
[59] - Quote
Does anyone really think anyone will run incursions in low/null sec? Really?
Sack that crap, for that effort wormholes are what you do. |
Arthur Aihaken
Perkone Caldari State
4561
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 14:54:51 -
[60] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:but Sansha incursions only in lowsec and nullsec. When did this change happen?
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1338
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 15:40:57 -
[61] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Anthar Thebess wrote:but Sansha incursions only in lowsec and nullsec. When did this change happen? It hasn't been announced but the writing is on the wall for the Sansha incurions in highsec. These Drifter ones are significantly harder and feature guaranteed ship loss so no one will run them if both co-exist. They will either have to pay significantly more than the Sansha incursions, which isn't going to happen as CCP thinks incursions already pay too much, or the Sansha ones will be removed from highsec/have their payouts slashed dramatically.
I think politically it would be easier for CCP to just move the Sansha ones to low and null, and make the Drifters highsec only so the whining from incursions runners can be countered with "but we replaced it with exciting new PvE like you have been asking for!".
It's a good solution. CCP can increase risk on highsec incursion runners with a mechanism they can tune as players figure the Drifters out to keep things challenging and less easy-mode farmable as the Sansha ones have been for many years now.
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Oxide Ammar
211
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 16:26:47 -
[62] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Arthur Aihaken wrote:Anthar Thebess wrote:but Sansha incursions only in lowsec and nullsec. When did this change happen? It hasn't been announced but the writing is on the wall for the Sansha incurions in highsec. These Drifter ones are significantly harder and feature guaranteed ship loss so no one will run them if both co-exist. They will either have to pay significantly more than the Sansha incursions, which isn't going to happen as CCP thinks incursions already pay too much, or the Sansha ones will be removed from highsec/have their payouts slashed dramatically. I think politically it would be easier for CCP to just move the Sansha ones to low and null, and make the Drifters highsec only so the whining from incursions runners can be countered with "but we replaced it with exciting new PvE like you have been asking for!". It's a good solution. CCP can increase risk on highsec incursion runners with a mechanism they can tune as players figure the Drifters out to keep things challenging and less easy-mode farmable as the Sansha ones have been for many years now.
Did you read the **** you just posted ?
Lady Areola Fappington: -áSolo PVP isn't dead!-á You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1338
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 16:35:38 -
[63] - Quote
Oxide Ammar wrote:Black Pedro wrote:Arthur Aihaken wrote:Anthar Thebess wrote:but Sansha incursions only in lowsec and nullsec. When did this change happen? It hasn't been announced but the writing is on the wall for the Sansha incurions in highsec. These Drifter ones are significantly harder and feature guaranteed ship loss so no one will run them if both co-exist. They will either have to pay significantly more than the Sansha incursions, which isn't going to happen as CCP thinks incursions already pay too much, or the Sansha ones will be removed from highsec/have their payouts slashed dramatically. I think politically it would be easier for CCP to just move the Sansha ones to low and null, and make the Drifters highsec only so the whining from incursions runners can be countered with "but we replaced it with exciting new PvE like you have been asking for!". It's a good solution. CCP can increase risk on highsec incursion runners with a mechanism they can tune as players figure the Drifters out to keep things challenging and less easy-mode farmable as the Sansha ones have been for many years now. Did you read the **** you just posted ? Of course, I wrote it. What is your point? |
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
6955
|
Posted - 2015.08.12 18:21:11 -
[64] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:So how do Drifter Incursions work then? Teams wait for the token player to show up who will unwittingly take the DD? "Looks like we're going to need another Timmy..."
I wonder if they'll call it the "Kenny".
Bring back DEEEEP Space!
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2370
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 00:09:06 -
[65] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Bunch of drivel
You know a Null Incursion is over 200% more profitable than a high-sec incursion now right? And that's assuming that a 50% larger fleet can't run the incursion sites even faster than a High Incursion fleet. There is no writing on the wall for incursions in High Sec, not unless CCP wants to make it obvious that this is no longer a sandbox, and that Null Sec is the new theme park end game space. |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1343
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 06:30:44 -
[66] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Black Pedro wrote:Bunch of drivel
You know a Null Incursion is over 200% more profitable than a high-sec incursion now right? And that's assuming that a 50% larger fleet can't run the incursion sites even faster than a High Incursion fleet. There is no writing on the wall for incursions in High Sec, not unless CCP wants to make it obvious that this is no longer a sandbox, and that Null Sec is the new theme park end game space. Why do incursion runners get so defensive over the topic of how much they make? Deep down, they must know that something about the risk vs. reward is out of whack.
Look, CCP has already said they think incursion income is too high (2014 CSM Minutes, pg. 125). Therefore, they are very unlikely to raise incursion income significantly overall. Yet, how will the get players to run this new, more dangerous content that has not been min/maxed and features guaranteed ship loss via this Doomsday?
There only option is to re-balance the incursion rewards so that the new content pays much more than the old content. Therefore, CCP will rebalance the payouts so the Drifter incursions provide income similar (or perhaps a little higher to cover ship losses) to the current incursions, and the current Sansha ones will either take a massive hit in income or be removed completely from highsec.
There really is no other option if they want players to run the new content. And since they just spent significant development hours making this content, they will want players to run the new content.
It will be fine though. CCP is not taking your Golden Goose away. The are just replacing it with one that will bite you occasionally. There will be a period of adjustment while players figure out the content, and they will have to factor in loosing a ship from time-to-time in their profit calculations, but highsec end-game PvE content will live on.
Incursions won't be nearly as farmable, especially if CCP keep changing the Drifters to adapt to player tactics as they have so far, but they will again be the moderately challenging PvE group content they were designed to be, instead of the simple, watch-Netflix-while-I-farm-for-a-PLEX content they have been for the last few years. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2371
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 06:51:50 -
[67] - Quote
If you think HQ fleets are simple, go into an incursion, recruit 40 people from the public incursion channel, run HQ sites. Start your timer at the second you start trying to form a fleet. Stop it at the end of the last site. Also include the time to fly from whereever you are right now to the incursion system. Then calculate your actual income at the end of a week.
The fact the Incursion communities make it look easy is because they have spent literally years putting together a well oiled machine and training people in all aspects of incursions, and what to do when ganks occur, how to avoid gankers while moving, and how to be an efficient fleet member.
TLDR: Incursions are not easy, Incursion communities are just good. |
Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
59
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 07:12:29 -
[68] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:If you think HQ fleets are simple, go into an incursion, recruit 40 people from the public incursion channel, run HQ sites. Start your timer at the second you start trying to form a fleet. Stop it at the end of the last site. Also include the time to fly from whereever you are right now to the incursion system. Then calculate your actual income at the end of a week.
The fact the Incursion communities make it look easy is because they have spent literally years putting together a well oiled machine and training people in all aspects of incursions, and what to do when ganks occur, how to avoid gankers while moving, and how to be an efficient fleet member.
TLDR: Incursions are not easy, Incursion communities are just good. Oh man you should of seen the stupid things we tried in the early days LOL. |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1344
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 07:20:31 -
[69] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:TLDR: Incursions are not easy, Incursion communities are just good. Hey man, tell yourself whatever narrative you need to keep logging in.
Perhaps the incursion community can tell themselves that they are so good, that they forced CCP to make the content harder? It's true in a sense. Whatever you need to protect your egos is fine with me.
Once the Sansha incursions have been replaced by the Drifter ones you will get your chance to show who's really good and actually enjoys running the content, and who is just there to farm using strategies pioneered by others. I would think you would be happy to hear the news that CCP is revamping your main content and giving you a new challenge. |
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1369
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 07:23:05 -
[70] - Quote
if thats the aim of drifter incursions it sounds good and i can see the use of 5bil machs switched for t2/meta optimised fits
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1344
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 07:29:53 -
[71] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:if thats the aim of drifter incursions it sounds good and i can see the use of 5bil machs switched for t2/meta optimised fits Yup. They will be optimized and people will make ISK doing them but at least ships will be destroyed. Since there will actually be risk that your ship will blow up, the fact that you can't use a max-pimp boat because of the doomsday will mean the ISK/h will be kept a little more under control.
And if CCP decides the incursion runners are getting "too good", they can dial up the Drifters like they have been doing since they were introduced.
It's a much better system than the static, and farmable Sansha we have had for too long. I'm glad CCP has finally gotten around to cranking the risk up a bit in highsec after doing it everywhere else. |
Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
59
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 07:32:30 -
[72] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:TLDR: Incursions are not easy, Incursion communities are just good. Hey man, tell yourself whatever narrative you need to keep logging in. Perhaps the incursion community can tell themselves that they are so good, that they forced CCP to make the content harder? It's true in a sense. Whatever you need to protect your egos is fine with me. Once the Sansha incursions have been replaced by the Drifter ones you will get your chance to show who's really good and actually enjoys running the content, and who is just there to farm using strategies pioneered by others. I would think you would be happy to hear the news that CCP is revamping your main content and giving you a new challenge. It won't show anything as by the end of the first day people will have it figured out and be farming it.
Even if CCP changed the setup on a near daily basis it'll be figured out very quickly and well farmed before the day is over. |
Barrogh Habalu
Forever Winter Absolute Zero.
1022
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 08:04:14 -
[73] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:You know a Null Incursion is over 200% more profitable than a high-sec incursion now right?
Kinete Jenius wrote:What really cracks me up is Black Pedro though. People already farm sleeper sites and such while watching netflix.
That is because you guys don't get into your ships to do it less profitable for them and require them to pay attention to what's going on, I suppose. I mean, you are doing things with ISK you make anyway, right?
Kinete Jenius wrote:It won't show anything as by the end of the first day people will have it figured out and be farming it.
Even if CCP changed the setup on a near daily basis it'll be figured out very quickly and well farmed before the day is over.
If it's not farmable than few people will run it and CCP will invest time/effort/money on new content that no one runs.
I'm not sure why you have such a problem with incursions being farmed but not a variety of other sites/locations being farmed. I don't think farmability is the problem. Point is not that CCP should make it impossible to farm but that they will be able to adjust sites as they see fit every time they think it's due without upsetting community too much since the latter are already conditioned to take looses and adapt by very nature of sites. That said, basic mech should remain consistent IMO otherwise players will feel like being cheated and from my experience it's absolutely not fun to play with video game equivalent of "rocks fall, everybody dies" game master.
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1344
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 08:10:46 -
[74] - Quote
Kinete Jenius wrote:Even if CCP changed the setup on a near daily basis it'll be figured out very quickly and well farmed before the day is over.
I'm not sure why you have such a problem with incursions being farmed but not a variety of other sites/locations being farmed. Incursions pay way too much for the little amount for risk and effort they currently requires. That was not always the case, but they have been beaten through optimization. Most, but not all people, run them to simply to make ISK and they are far too easy at that now. Yes, that is because the Incursion community has been good at min/maxing the system, but still they were never intended to be farmed at no risk but rather were suppose to be somewhat challenging group PvE content.
Incursions are especially insidious as a farmable income source as they are risk-free. There is no practical player-driven counter and they provide no additional content to the sandbox. At least someone farming wormhole escalations or ratting in nullsec is risking ships that can serve as targets for other players. Further that risk-free nature attracts players from other spaces who are just looking to farm something for an income depleting the population there.
The new Drifter incursions will be more difficult, and the DD builds some real risk into them. We'll see how CCP tunes them, but I can tell you that the rational for removing the Sansha incursions and replacing them with Drifters is to increase the risk on highsec players (primarily through the new AI and the Doomsday). That does not mean that incursions will not be lucrative. It will just mean that players will lose more ships (stimulating the economy) and will have to pay more attention to these adaptable NPCs.
Fine by me. I have no problem with a group PvE activity in highsec. I just have a problem with one that has little risk and difficulty for the top-tier income like the current ones.
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1370
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 08:29:07 -
[75] - Quote
Kinete Jenius wrote:Black Pedro wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:TLDR: Incursions are not easy, Incursion communities are just good. Hey man, tell yourself whatever narrative you need to keep logging in. Perhaps the incursion community can tell themselves that they are so good, that they forced CCP to make the content harder? It's true in a sense. Whatever you need to protect your egos is fine with me. Once the Sansha incursions have been replaced by the Drifter ones you will get your chance to show who's really good and actually enjoys running the content, and who is just there to farm using strategies pioneered by others. I would think you would be happy to hear the news that CCP is revamping your main content and giving you a new challenge. It won't show anything as by the end of the first day people will have it figured out and be farming it. Even if CCP changed the setup on a near daily basis it'll be figured out very quickly and well farmed before the day is over. If it's not farmable than few people will run it and CCP will invest time/effort/money on new content that no one runs. I'm not sure why you have such a problem with incursions being farmed but not a variety of other sites/locations being farmed.
but its more interesting content right? thats what all highsec wants and keep complaining about? interesting and harder pve, farming something isnt hard, but at the end of the day if you dont run them then thats your issue, ccp provided you with what you asked for but you choose not to run them because they are too hard.
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1345
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 08:42:50 -
[76] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Kinete Jenius wrote: It won't show anything as by the end of the first day people will have it figured out and be farming it.
Even if CCP changed the setup on a near daily basis it'll be figured out very quickly and well farmed before the day is over.
If it's not farmable than few people will run it and CCP will invest time/effort/money on new content that no one runs.
I'm not sure why you have such a problem with incursions being farmed but not a variety of other sites/locations being farmed.
but its more interesting content right? thats what all highsec wants and keep complaining about? interesting and harder pve, farming something isnt hard, but at the end of the day if you dont run them then thats your issue, ccp provided you with what you asked for but you choose not to run them because they are too hard. Indeed. Even if people are "farming" by the end of the day at least someone actually had to play the game to figure out the best strategy.
That is in contrast to the current situation where you read a guide once that someone else wrote years ago and repeat for months on end at no risk and with no challenge.
Highsec incursions are about about to get more interesting, dynamic and harder. If players choose not to run them because they are not farmable, it kinda says something about the content in the first place. If you want to farm, at least go to a space where you have to put something on the line.
Time to adapt incursion runners and actually play the game. All those previous optimizations are about to be thrown out the window. |
Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
59
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 09:00:38 -
[77] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Kinete Jenius wrote:Even if CCP changed the setup on a near daily basis it'll be figured out very quickly and well farmed before the day is over.
I'm not sure why you have such a problem with incursions being farmed but not a variety of other sites/locations being farmed. Incursions pay way too much for the little amount for risk and effort they currently requires. That was not always the case, but they have been beaten through optimization. Most, but not all people, run them to simply to make ISK and they are far too easy at that now. Yes, that is because the Incursion community has been good at min/maxing the system, but still they were never intended to be farmed at no risk but rather were suppose to be somewhat challenging group PvE content. Incursions are especially insidious as a farmable income source as they are risk-free. There is no practical player-driven counter and they provide no additional content to the sandbox. At least someone farming wormhole escalations or ratting in nullsec is risking ships that can serve as targets for other players. Further that risk-free nature attracts players from other spaces who are just looking to farm something for an income depleting the population there. The new Drifter incursions will be more difficult, and the DD builds some real risk into them. We'll see how CCP tunes them, but I can tell you that the rational for removing the Sansha incursions and replacing them with Drifters is to increase the risk on highsec players (primarily through the new AI and the Doomsday). That does not mean that incursions will not be lucrative. It will just mean that players will lose more ships (stimulating the economy) and will have to pay more attention to these adaptable NPCs. Fine by me. I have no problem with a group PvE activity in highsec. I just have a problem with one that has little risk and difficulty for the top-tier income like the current ones. I can make more isk per account per hour doing other activities. I just do incursions because they amuse me currently.
You can at any point provide risk for incursion runners. You refuse to HTFU and take on that burden instead demanding that CCP does the work for you.
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1372
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 09:15:08 -
[78] - Quote
here we go again...everyone knows fighting 5bil battleship fleets with ample logi isnt really going to happen when concord are watching your back, hense why you dont do them in null and lowsec because you would get smashed and you know it.
what other activities in highsec can you make more isk per account with same risks again?
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1345
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 09:18:45 -
[79] - Quote
Kinete Jenius wrote:I can make more isk per account per hour doing other activities. I just do incursions because they amuse me currently.
You can at any point provide risk for incursion runners. You refuse to HTFU and take on that burden instead demanding that CCP does the work for you. I cannot. It is not possible for one or a couple players to gank an active incursion group because of the attentive logi. The free protection of highsec scales quite well with numbers so incursion runners are pretty much invincible. I would need several times more players than the incursion group to do it and I do not have the resources.
I had hoped that one day I would be proven wrong and someone would stop the farmers (even the Goons tried but failed), but I won't get the chance as it seems now CCP has killed the incursion farms for us. Can't say I am going to complain though.
I don't see why you are so defensive. If you enjoy the current incursions, I am sure the challenge of the new ones will "amuse" you as well. And if they prove too hard for you, you can just go back to your "other activities" that make you more ISK.
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Oxide Ammar
212
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 10:05:53 -
[80] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:here we go again...everyone knows fighting 5bil battleship fleets with ample logi isnt really going to happen when concord are watching your back, hense why you dont do them in null and lowsec because you would get smashed and you know it.
what other activities in highsec can you make more isk per account with same risks again?
Provide me with kill report happened recently of low sec/null sec fleet got totally wiped because of another fleet managed to kill them.
The 5 bill incursion pirate BS is about efficiency not ******* show off, you can work your math to figure out the difference between scrub T1 BS with T2 fit vs Vindi with blue fit. If you can't comprehend what I'm say then keep babbling about risk vs reward stereo typing. Please tell us more about the risk vs. reward in nullsec for the carrier ratters who are aligned to POS somewhere and waiting for neut to enter system and warp away.
Lady Areola Fappington: -áSolo PVP isn't dead!-á You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1373
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 10:24:30 -
[81] - Quote
Oxide Ammar wrote:Lan Wang wrote:here we go again...everyone knows fighting 5bil battleship fleets with ample logi isnt really going to happen when concord are watching your back, hense why you dont do them in null and lowsec because you would get smashed and you know it.
what other activities in highsec can you make more isk per account with same risks again? Provide me with kill report happened recently of low sec/null sec fleet got totally wiped because of another fleet managed to kill them. The 5 bill incursion pirate BS is about efficiency not ******* show off, you can work your math to figure out the difference between scrub T1 BS with T2 fit vs Vindi with blue fit. If you can't comprehend what I'm say then keep babbling about risk vs reward stereo typing. Please tell us more about the risk vs. reward in nullsec for the carrier ratters who are aligned to POS somewhere and waiting for neut to enter system and warp away.
well if its such a great thing why dont you do them in lowsec and null, enlighten me why you are so caught up with remaining in highsec to do incursions? oh yeah carriers and ratting supers die all the time in nullsec and lowsec so what you talking about?
you are a hypocrite, if your incursion fleets are so great go do the incursions in low and null, but you wont because you know highsec is safer and you dont need to risk your ships to do them when the payout is not worth the risk. yes risk vs reward is the reason you stay in highsec
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2374
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 10:30:43 -
[82] - Quote
Or possibly that most of the incursion community live in high sec. And thus don't do them in low and null because it's hostile space belonging to other corps and alliances.... But that doesn't fit so nicely with your story. Nor does the fact that the communities have built themselves around being inclusive while low and null by their very nature require more closed trusted Corp groups. Or the fact that some of those corps and alliances who live out there actually do do low sec and null incursions. |
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1375
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 10:37:02 -
[83] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Or possibly that most of the incursion community live in high sec. And thus don't do them in low and null because it's hostile space belonging to other corps and alliances.... But that doesn't fit so nicely with your story. Nor does the fact that the communities have built themselves around being inclusive while low and null by their very nature require more closed trusted Corp groups. Or the fact that some of those corps and alliances who live out there actually do do low sec and null incursions.
most of the incursion community are npc alts from null alliances
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2374
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 10:40:32 -
[84] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote: most of the incursion community are npc alts from null alliances
Citation required.
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Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1375
|
Posted - 2015.08.13 10:45:21 -
[85] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Lan Wang wrote: most of the incursion community are npc alts from null alliances
Citation required.
you know its true you're just refusing to accept it
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
59
|
Posted - 2015.08.14 03:36:12 -
[86] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:I cannot. It is not possible for one or a couple players to gank an active incursion group because of the attentive logi. The free protection of highsec scales quite well with numbers so incursion runners are pretty much invincible. I would need several times more players than the incursion group to do it and I do not have the resources. I had hoped that one day I would be proven wrong and someone would stop the farmers (even the Goons tried but failed), but I won't get the chance as it seems now CCP has killed the incursion farms for us. Can't say I am going to complain though. I don't see why you are so defensive. If you enjoy the current incursions, I am sure the challenge of the new ones will "amuse" you as well. And if they prove too hard for you, you can just go back to your "other activities" that make you more ISK. It is quite possible to gank incursion runners and your lack of imagination or inexperience is working against you.
They "failed" with the pipebomb because they panicked during the lag and turned on then off their smart bombs. if they had just hit the hotkeys once and let things roll it would of went far better. Regardless they still managed to get kills.
Lan Wang wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:Lan Wang wrote: most of the incursion community are npc alts from null alliances
Citation required. you know its true you're just refusing to accept it That's a lie.
My citation is the tax rate on NPC corps. Spend 20 minutes and look for yourself at an incursion. One man corps galore. |
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1554
|
Posted - 2015.08.14 04:01:23 -
[87] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:It hasn't been announced but the writing is on the wall for the Sansha incurions in highsec. These Drifter ones are significantly harder and feature guaranteed ship loss so no one will run them if both co-exist. They will either have to pay significantly more than the Sansha incursions, which isn't going to happen as CCP thinks incursions already pay too much, or the Sansha ones will be removed from highsec/have their payouts slashed dramatically.
I think politically it would be easier for CCP to just move the Sansha ones to low and null, and make the Drifters highsec only so the whining from incursions runners can be countered with "but we replaced it with exciting new PvE like you have been asking for!".
It's a good solution. CCP can increase risk on highsec incursion runners with a mechanism they can tune as players figure the Drifters out to keep things challenging and less easy-mode farmable as the Sansha ones have been for many years now.
The writing is on the wall for a drifter incursion in Amarr space, but as it has existed on sisi the scope doesn't suggest a global highsec swap. Rather just the next phase of this storyline for now.
The feature is actually named "Defense of the Throne worlds" after all.
And from what has been said, no, it's not going to be any politically easier to swap the drifter incursions in. Not if player feedback is any part of that equation.
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1358
|
Posted - 2015.08.14 06:09:24 -
[88] - Quote
Kinete Jenius wrote:It is quite possible to gank incursion runners and your lack of imagination or inexperience is working against you. It is not. You can mess with them from the inside, or gank them when they move between incursions, But an active incursion with 4B tanked ships covered by attentive logi are invincible, at least to anyone without a hundred players and ten of billions of ISK to throw at the problem (which could still fail anyway due to server limitations). I don't have that.
Anything else are just stories you incursion runners tell yourselves around the campfire to scare each other. Like the boogeyman, they don't exist. You are 100% safe from gankers and the lack of ganks on the killboards proves that statistic.
Tyberius Franklin wrote:]The writing is on the wall for a drifter incursion in Amarr space, but as it has existed on sisi the scope doesn't suggest a global highsec swap. Rather just the next phase of this storyline for now.
The feature is actually named "Defense of the Throne worlds" after all.
And from what has been said, no, it's not going to be any politically easier to swap the drifter incursions in. Not if player feedback is any part of that equation.
Players will not have a choice - they are going to rage anout the loss of their easy ISK no matter what. There is a clear pattern in that almost all changes since CCP Seagull has been in charge have been to increase risk for players (to stimulate loss and the economy) so it makes sense that that train is about to arrive in highsec.
Unless this incursion turns out to be just a one-off that goes for a few weeks, they will replace Sansha in all of highsec. Players will just move out of Domain and ignore them otherwise. I expect though that CCP will want to make sure they are working, so probably both will co-exist for a bit (maybe they'll be in the Throne Worlds for a few weeks/months, and when they spread to all of highsec is when Sansha leaves), but I also wouldn't be surprised if the day this goes on Tranquility is the day after the last Sansha incursion took place in highsec. |
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1554
|
Posted - 2015.08.14 07:22:22 -
[89] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Players will not have a choice - they are going to rage anout the loss of their easy ISK no matter what. There is a clear pattern in that almost all changes since CCP Seagull has been in charge have been to increase risk for players (to stimulate loss and the economy) so it makes sense that that train is about to arrive in highsec. IF that comes to pass sure, but that doesn't justify the claim of it being politically better. Fundamentally no one has a real choice in CCP's decisions, this is no different. I just responded to the statement you made suggesting drifter incursions would somehow make such a change more widely accepted. (That or misunderstood what "politically better" meant)
Black Pedro wrote:Unless this incursion turns out to be just a one-off that goes for a few weeks, they will replace Sansha in all of highsec. Players will just move out of Domain and ignore them otherwise. I expect though that CCP will want to make sure they are working, so probably both will co-exist for a bit (maybe they'll be in the Throne Worlds for a few weeks/months, and when they spread to all of highsec is when Sansha leaves), but I also wouldn't be surprised if the day this goes on Tranquility is the day after the last Sansha incursion took place in highsec. The first line here seems rather presumptuous. There isn't much reason to believe the events here couldn't be used elsewhere for further story developments or even coexist long term with some for of unique reward. As they are now they are tied to one empire and we really have no idea how things will play out. As it stands this prophecy itself isn't very convincing for any evidence presented in it's favor (of which there is none more than any other theory including single run event).
I'd love to know where the faith comes from for this theory. If it's just the stance you believe they have on incursions it should be noted the most recent thing they did to them was giving a buff.
As far as people moving out of Domain, there was no mandate to stay in any incursion constellation ever, why would that change now? |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1360
|
Posted - 2015.08.14 07:55:56 -
[90] - Quote
Tyberius Franklin wrote:IF that comes to pass sure, but that doesn't justify the claim of it being politically better. Fundamentally no one has a real choice in CCP's decisions, this is no different. I just responded to the statement you made suggesting drifter incursions would somehow make such a change more widely accepted. (That or misunderstood what "politically better" meant) I meant that there would be less of an uproar if they just remove the old ones, rather than nerf the payout to the levels that would be necessary to make players choose the Drifter ones over the Sansha ones. It would be politically easier for CCP to claim they are replacing the old, tired incursions with exciting new ones. Then CCP isn't "nerfing" anything, just making them better.
In any case though people are going to whine and complain. It happened when they increased risk in wormholes with the spawning changes, and the change to warpable anomalies. Anytime CCP messes with people's comfortable income source there will be complaints.
Tyberius Franklin wrote: The first line here seems rather presumptuous. There isn't much reason to believe the events here couldn't be used elsewhere for further story developments or even coexist long term with some for of unique reward. As they are now they are tied to one empire and we really have no idea how things will play out. As it stands this prophecy itself isn't very convincing for any evidence presented in it's favor (of which there is none more than any other theory including single run event).
I'd love to know where the faith comes from for this theory. If it's just the stance you believe they have on incursions it should be noted the most recent thing they did to them was giving a buff. It is just simple logic. There is no way an "easy" incursion can live next to a "hard" incursion. If they pay the same, 95% of the people will run the "easy" one. They cannot buff the "hard" payout significantly as incursions already pay a lot (see the CSM minutes I linked above) so the only choice is to reduce the payout for the "old" or remove the "old" completely.
Now it could a one-off event for lore, or provide some unique reward, or CCP could do something completely unexpected with them. I have no inside information. But really, incursions (and all NPC PvE really) are due for a revamp so I doubt CCP would spend the time developing this unless they intended to make them a permanent part of the game. If so, there is no real way for them to keep both incursions, at least if they want these new ones to be run at all.
We'll all find out in time I guess. |
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Prt Scr
569th Freelancers
153
|
Posted - 2015.08.14 08:33:42 -
[91] - Quote
SPOILER ALERT;
This is all part of CCP's plans for structures. We know that they do not like massed outposts in null sec and so they plan do remove them and replace them with citadels. However so as not to show favouritism to the established null sec power power blocks they are going to use the drifters to remove them all :)
u+É-¦ssn+¦ p+ɦ¥+¦ -ç,u+É+ö -¦ -çnq -Ä+¦+¦os +»,-¦
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Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
59
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Posted - 2015.08.14 20:26:49 -
[92] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:It is not. You can mess with them from the inside, or gank them when they move between incursions, but an active incursion with 4B tanked ships covered by attentive logi are invincible, at least to anyone without a hundred players and tens of billions of ISK to throw at the problem (which could still fail anyway due to server limitations). I don't have that.
Anything else are just stories you incursion runners tell yourselves around the campfire to scare each other. Like the boogeyman, they don't exist. You are 100% safe from gankers and the lack of ganks on the killboards proves that statistic.
I can't believe you're so clueless that you actually think the best time to try to gank incursion runners is when their ships are using anti-gank fits and their bling isn't even guaranteed to be on board. No wonder you've had no success.
I've had several gank attempts on my main fleet and my booster. Unlike most incursion runners my booster has a fat tank (280k ehp) so it took 10 catas fairly easily. That gank fleet went on to take out a few boosters and some incursion runners (battleships). Those ganks caused people to mostly stop running incursions in that focus. I continued to run as I have logi that have 10x the EHP and 2x the repping power of logi normally used by public fleets. I did make damned sure to pay extra attention to local and dscan.
I have run from gank fleets before and I've gotten away simply because of either luck or because I pay attention to local and dscan (I'm always creating safe spots too).
At this point I'm torn in that while I would love to give you information on avenues of attack I also don't want to help someone attack me :P |
Alex Rax
The Stormcrows Stella Nova
5
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Posted - 2015.08.15 14:55:57 -
[93] - Quote
It's a shame i have -9.99 Amarr rep otherwise I'd participate. |
Kuronaga
Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback
403
|
Posted - 2015.08.15 16:07:36 -
[94] - Quote
Alex Rax wrote:It's a shame i have -9.99 Amarr rep otherwise I'd participate.
Having to sacrifice one ship for every drifter you kill?
Think I'll pass on that one.
Nice to see Amarr getting smacked around by those mechanics though. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2389
|
Posted - 2015.08.15 22:36:37 -
[95] - Quote
Alex Rax wrote:It's a shame i have -9.99 Amarr rep otherwise I'd participate. Then fix it, It won't take long between diplomacy and SoE epic arcs done in fleet while you sit in a pod. If you are serious don't make excuses, do something. |
Lisbethae Kashuken
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.08.25 18:17:57 -
[96] - Quote
Not sure if you really failed to read the info or it was fake, thus swiftly discarded, but someone wrote that it was confirmed the Drifters incursions would spread to nearby systems ( if they aren't completed i suppose ). If this is true, it doesn't matter if you LIKEit or not, you'll just have to do those sites, unless you want every highsec system camped by Drifters. Once again, not sure if the information is correct, but if it is, then players will HAVE TO run those sites or suffer the consequences !
I'm talking about this quote:
Quote: Afterwards, Paradox confirmed that the Drifter incursions will spread to adjacent systems over time. I do believe that in addition to incursion sites, Drifters will attack you on stations, gates, wormholes....pretty much anywhere you can sit in space. |
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
351
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Posted - 2015.08.25 18:48:45 -
[97] - Quote
No one plays EvE for the isk.
IMO CCP is doing a great job here. Fozzy SOV, more Lore, Citadels, drifters. Adding storytelling and changes in the game mechanics go hand in hand. Making it easier to accept the changes and adapt the chaning situation.
I like what came until now and i am curios whats next.
Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
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Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
7053
|
Posted - 2015.08.25 19:26:14 -
[98] - Quote
So... a new type of incursion with ships that can Death Ray a bling boat.
And what's this? If nobody does the PVe it might affect the regions of the high-exalted PVP? I gotta look that one up.
Methinks CCP has gone "Viking" on us.
BRING THE PAIN!!!!!
I'm up to three accounts now, and for 8 out of 9 of my years playing I only had ONE.
Bring back DEEEEP Space!
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Pryce Caesar
Cloak and Daggers Fidelas Constans
10
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Posted - 2015.08.26 01:33:19 -
[99] - Quote
Lisbethae Kashuken wrote:Not sure if you really failed to read the info or it was fake, thus swiftly discarded, but someone wrote that it was confirmed the Drifters incursions would spread to nearby systems ( if they aren't completed i suppose ). If this is true, it doesn't matter if you LIKEit or not, you'll just have to do those sites, unless you want every highsec system camped by Drifters. Once again, not sure if the information is correct, but if it is, then players will HAVE TO run those sites or suffer the consequences ! I'm talking about this quote: Quote: Afterwards, Paradox confirmed that the Drifter incursions will spread to adjacent systems over time. I do believe that in addition to incursion sites, Drifters will attack you on stations, gates, wormholes....pretty much anywhere you can sit in space.
That is going to be freakin' murder if new players end up in parts of space where the Drifter incursion has spread - or any player for that matter.
I still hope that, with the prominence of Drifter ships in the game, that the possibility will be opened up that players will be able to fly Drifter ships, but that the Drifter ships will require very high skill levels in certain areas. |
Leonis Perthshire
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
18
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Posted - 2015.08.26 01:50:54 -
[100] - Quote
If someone could try etnosis one drifter ship and then primary it might be would help. Becusse when the etnosis thing was discover drifter attack them and if they did that is because they consider it a risk for them.
GÇ£If you win, you live. If you lose, you die. If you donGÇÖt fight, you canGÇÖt win!GÇ¥ GÇô Eren Jaeger
White Maul
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Kuronaga
Fatal Absolution
407
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Posted - 2015.08.26 02:20:17 -
[101] - Quote
Leonis Perthshire wrote:If someone could try etnosis one drifter ship and then primary it might be would help. Becusse when the etnosis thing was discover drifter attack them and if they did that is because they consider it a risk for them.
Yea because I'm sure nobody has tried that yet. |
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
935
|
Posted - 2015.08.26 03:11:54 -
[102] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:Lan Wang wrote: most of the incursion community are npc alts from null alliances
Citation required. you know its true you're just refusing to accept it
That does not mean they are from same null sec block/group and they all like to kiss their overlord ass for pat on a back in 99% of cases when inc groups roam in low sec/null for incursion or plain ol pvp spyes ratted out group for blob overload....
For something like this you need closed group of ppl that want fun not to kiss ass. |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
2089
|
Posted - 2015.08.26 09:50:42 -
[103] - Quote
Well drifters incursions are supposed to grow if not tackled. So if no onerunsthem, they willt ake over all high sec and then no more sansha incursions until someone deal with the drifter incursion.
So.. think well.. want to keep your sansha incursion income? deal with the drifter incursion BEFORE it is too large to deal with. LEave that one alive for 6 months and then I will laugh so much as the sansha runners cry all day because there is no more space for sansha incursions to spawn.
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
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Snagletooth Johnson
Snagle Material Services CAStabouts
285
|
Posted - 2015.08.26 12:15:28 -
[104] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Well drifters incursions are supposed to grow if not tackled. So if no onerunsthem, they willt ake over all high sec and then no more sansha incursions until someone deal with the drifter incursion.
So.. think well.. want to keep your sansha incursion income? deal with the drifter incursion BEFORE it is too large to deal with. LEave that one alive for 6 months and then I will laugh so much as the sansha runners cry all day because there is no more space for sansha incursions to spawn.
What if it grows into Null/Sov instead of Hisec? Will goons just charge them rent? |
Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
329
|
Posted - 2015.08.26 12:24:14 -
[105] - Quote
Wonder if this will turn into a game of chicken between CCP and the players. See who blinks first. |
Gimme Sake
State War Academy Caldari State
216
|
Posted - 2015.08.26 12:30:43 -
[106] - Quote
Why not make drifter incursions take over/destroy sov structures then expanding to nearby systems when one is overrun?
"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
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Rawketsled
Generic Corp Name
264
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Posted - 2015.08.26 12:40:54 -
[107] - Quote
If the reward for ending a Drifter incursion grew with time, then there'd become a point where it's economical to headshot an incursion to take the payment.
And farming it would be a risky proposition because someone will be tempted to come and take it from you. |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
2093
|
Posted - 2015.08.26 14:44:43 -
[108] - Quote
Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Kagura Nikon wrote:Well drifters incursions are supposed to grow if not tackled. So if no onerunsthem, they willt ake over all high sec and then no more sansha incursions until someone deal with the drifter incursion.
So.. think well.. want to keep your sansha incursion income? deal with the drifter incursion BEFORE it is too large to deal with. LEave that one alive for 6 months and then I will laugh so much as the sansha runners cry all day because there is no more space for sansha incursions to spawn. What if it grows into Null/Sov instead of Hisec? Will goons just charge them rent?
It will not affect their income as much as it will affect sansha runners. Also high sec is much closer to khanid than goonland :)
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
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Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
2093
|
Posted - 2015.08.26 14:46:33 -
[109] - Quote
Rawketsled wrote:If the reward for ending a Drifter incursion grew with time, then there'd become a point where it's economical to headshot an incursion to take the payment.
And farming it would be a risky proposition because someone will be tempted to come and take it from you.
Peopel still do nto get it? These incursions are not there to be profitable. They are there to be a MENACE that you CANNOT ignore. BEcause it will make your OTHER activities unprofitable.
Remember, a sansha incursion cannot spawn on a constellation where a system is in the drifter one, and the drifter icnursion is GROWING !!!!! Each day more systems...
In a few months there will be no space for new sansha incursions
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
|
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
935
|
Posted - 2015.08.26 14:49:57 -
[110] - Quote
^ that is awesome |
|
Aladar Dangerface
13. Enigma Project
223
|
Posted - 2015.08.26 15:14:45 -
[111] - Quote
Kagura Nikon wrote:Rawketsled wrote:If the reward for ending a Drifter incursion grew with time, then there'd become a point where it's economical to headshot an incursion to take the payment.
And farming it would be a risky proposition because someone will be tempted to come and take it from you. Peopel still do nto get it? These incursions are not there to be profitable. They are there to be a MENACE that you CANNOT ignore. BEcause it will make your OTHER activities unprofitable. Remember, a sansha incursion cannot spawn on a constellation where a system is in the drifter one, and the drifter icnursion is GROWING !!!!! Each day more systems... In a few months there will be no space for new sansha incursions God I hope this happens, then they move to low and null, until someone fights back.
We already have to fight each other for space, it would be kinda cool if we had to fight npcs as well.
I don't need twitter.
I'm already following you.
|
Spc One
The Chodak Void Alliance
292
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 02:15:33 -
[112] - Quote
I tryed it on sisi with level 5 archon carrier, they will insta kill a carrier in triage:
01:12:56Combat299618 from Apollo Tyrannos - Hits 01:13:04Combat231027 from Apollo Tyrannos - Hits
|
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
449
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 02:28:29 -
[113] - Quote
Spc One wrote:I tryed it on sisi with level 5 archon carrier, they will insta kill a carrier in triage:
01:12:56Combat299618 from Apollo Tyrannos - Hits 01:13:04Combat231027 from Apollo Tyrannos - Hits
So far the most viable tactics kind of base around old pvp. fast and cheap ships, spider tanks. Insurance an forbid high end mods. Be ready to re-ship.
With the earnings you get, even with insurance, I might say steer clear of even using a bs unless in the largest sites. Will take planning, that is for sure. |
Nami Kumamato
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
611
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 08:53:14 -
[114] - Quote
Look to the prophecies - "the hunger of Nothing" will spread across the Universe. I wonder for how long they can be left unchecked :D
As someone said - let's see who blinks first :D
Fornicate The Constabulary !
|
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1485
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 08:56:45 -
[115] - Quote
Markus Reese wrote:Spc One wrote:I tryed it on sisi with level 5 archon carrier, they will insta kill a carrier in triage:
01:12:56Combat299618 from Apollo Tyrannos - Hits 01:13:04Combat231027 from Apollo Tyrannos - Hits
So far the most viable tactics kind of base around old pvp. fast and cheap ships, spider tanks. Insurance an forbid high end mods. Be ready to re-ship. With the earnings you get, even with insurance, I might say steer clear of even using a bs unless in the largest sites. Will take planning, that is for sure. Yup. The new normal.
Didn't everyone say they want new and more challenging PvE? PvE that was more like PvP?
That's what the Drifters are. They are going to regularly explode ships. They are going to change behaviour and be more unpredictable. Even when players figure out a viable strategy, the Drifters are going to adapt.
The incursion farm sun is setting. No more cookie-cutter builds and on rails content. Time for everyone to get on board the new, risker incursion train! |
Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
332
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 09:51:41 -
[116] - Quote
Am I the only one that remembers the last time CCP tried to get HS people to 'work together' and how hilariously catastrophic that went? If there's not enough reward to motivate the HS population then nothing is going to happen. So long as there are more profitable things to do than drifter incursions the HS people are not going to blink. I have a feeling this is gonna backfire on CCP, again, just like the last time. |
Anthar Thebess
1281
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 10:34:10 -
[117] - Quote
I think that drifter incursions will end up in alpha ships , and hit & run tactics. We will see.
I hope that CCP will move sansha incursion to low/null only.
Capital Remote AID Rebalance
Way to solve important nullsec issue. CSM members do your work.
|
Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
332
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 10:35:57 -
[118] - Quote
Is there a range limit on the DD weapon on the drifter ships? Maybe CCP wants to promote some kind of 'kiting' doctrine because it's almost never used these days.
|
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
326
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 10:48:56 -
[119] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Didn't everyone say they want new and more challenging PvE? PvE that was more like PvP? Hard to call that challanging, it's suicidal. They oneshoot everything. What is happening with NPC station there? Are they using E-link on them?
"-What are you doing?"
"-Docking."(...)
-"It's not possible"
-"No, it's necessary."
|
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1487
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 10:59:19 -
[120] - Quote
Jeremiah Saken wrote:Black Pedro wrote:Didn't everyone say they want new and more challenging PvE? PvE that was more like PvP? Hard to call that challanging, it's suicidal. They oneshoot everything. What is happening with NPC station there? Are they using E-link on them? Ships are intended to explode in this game. Capsuleers are immortal, you remember? There is no such thing as suicide.
It seems like years of consequence-free PvE content as raised a cohort of players that have forgotten the first rule of Eve - don't fly what you cannot afford to lose.
Incursion runners are now going to lose ships on occasion, even if they do everything correctly. Just go get another one like every other Eve player has to from time-to-time. That, or go back to farming L4s until CCP gets around to revamping those as well. |
|
Barrogh Habalu
Forever Winter Absolute Zero.
1041
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 11:41:51 -
[121] - Quote
Gimme Sake wrote:Why not make drifter incursions take over/destroy sov structures then expanding to nearby systems when one is overrun? Make them attack everything inside the system, explorers, ratters, miners, Pos, stations etc. Add NPC stations and mission runners to that list while we are at it
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
|
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
327
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 11:58:44 -
[122] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Ships are intended to explode in this game. Capsuleers are immortal, you remember? There is no such thing as suicide.
It seems like years of consequence-free PvE content as raised a cohort of players that have forgotten the first rule of Eve - don't fly what you cannot afford to lose.
Incursion runners are now going to lose ships on occasion, even if they do everything correctly. Just go get another one like every other Eve player has to from time-to-time. That, or go back to farming L4s until CCP gets around to revamping those as well. I didn't look who's I'm quoting, sorry. If "challanging" is oneshooting everything below titan, good for you. If I get shooted despite any action I perform, do you called that a fight? If reward will be greater than risk (losing ships to them) it's still stupid as hell. Obligatory loses? Propably new module/ship will come to deal with them.
"-What are you doing?"
"-Docking."(...)
-"It's not possible"
-"No, it's necessary."
|
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1488
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 12:12:25 -
[123] - Quote
Jeremiah Saken wrote:I didn't look who's I'm quoting, sorry. If "challanging" is oneshooting everything below titan, good for you. If I get shooted despite any action I perform, do you called that a fight? If reward will be greater than risk (losing ships to them) it's still stupid as hell. Obligatory loses? Propably new module/ship will come to deal with them. CCP just wants to stimulate losses to drive the economy.
Losing one ship in a fleet does not make it not a fight. The rest of the fleet will destroy the drifter and the evil NPCs will be defeated again.
Players will find ways to beat these Drifters and not lose ships all the time. But on occasion, more than happens now, ships will be doomsdayed off the field by the Drifters.
I am not sure why people are having such a hard time with this concept. Ships can explode, even while doing PvE. If they never explode, how is that challenging? Sounds like that means the content has been well and truly beaten if you can never fail. |
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
327
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 12:26:18 -
[124] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:CCP just wants to stimulate losses to drive the economy.
Losing one ship in a fleet does not make it not a fight. The rest of the fleet will destroy the drifter and the evil NPCs will be defeated again.
Players will find ways to beat these Drifters and not lose ships all the time. But on occasion, more than happens now, ships will be doomsdayed off the field by the Drifters. My first thought acutally. Now imagine drifters can destroy assets on NPC stations and they are heading for Amarr...gates would be hot from jumps
"-What are you doing?"
"-Docking."(...)
-"It's not possible"
-"No, it's necessary."
|
Jenn aSide
Ascendent. Test Alliance Please Ignore
12239
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 12:42:16 -
[125] - Quote
Some of y'all are missing the big picture.
If you look at CCP's development of PVE content over the years, you notice a pattern: They make something, and that something is general built upon a high minded but ultimately unrealistic principle (like risk/reward being higher the further you go into danger, not understanding that many people will simply stay in safety and bleet on a forum about how they need mroe reward in safe space lol).
They will then see how things go, notice the unintended consequences. THEN they will put out a new version that learns from the lesson of the 1st thing. They did it with missions ,up to lvl 4s in high sec, 5s in low sec, pirate 4s in npc null, each level of mission haivng mroe and more battleship NPCs. They finally figured out that the problem with missions in dangerous space was that battleships took so long to kill that those missions became targets for people trying to force pvp.
So the fix was missions like the pirate epic arcs and FW missions and lately burner missions. Mission for fast, small ships that can survive in dangerous space and finish the mission quickly. And it works, people farm FW missions and low sec/null sec burners.
I think the same will happen with incursions. They made these incursions that resulted in very little incursion activity in low and null but great big whopping blobby blinged out incursion farming communities in high sec, because high sec is so safe and the incursions so predictable that risking a 5 bil isk ship isn't a risk at all.
So NOW they are making incursions that more resemble what the originals should have been: Desperate affairs for cheaper ships where losses are unavoidable but not fighting at all is a worse option. You can't just bling your way to glory with a Drifter Incursion, you NEED to fly cheap as possible and be prepared to replace that lose. As others in this thread suggest, it might even been intended as a boon for the economy, because frankly, other forms of pve are so predictable and safe that ship losses are rare without outside player interference.
I take back my previous opinion of Drifter Incursions. BRAVO CCP, no you are getting it. For you nay says, just make a disposable Moa or Maller fleet and lets have at them Drifters. |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1489
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 12:52:24 -
[126] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:I think the same will happen with incursions. They made these incursions that resulted in very little incursion activity in low and null but great big whopping blobby blinged out incursion farming communities in high sec, because high sec is so safe and the incursions so predictable that risking a 5 bil isk ship isn't a risk at all.
So NOW they are making incursions that more resemble what the originals should have been: Desperate affairs for cheaper ships where losses are unavoidable but not fighting at all is a worse option. You can't just bling your way to glory with a Drifter Incursion, you NEED to fly cheap as possible and be prepared to replace that lose. As others in this thread suggest, it might even been intended as a boon for the economy, because frankly, other forms of pve are so predictable and safe that ship losses are rare without outside player interference.
I take back my previous opinion of Drifter Incursions. BRAVO CCP, no you are getting it. For you nay says, just make a disposable Moa or Maller fleet and lets have at them Drifters. Exactly. These feel much more like the original intention of the Sansha Incursions - group content that is challenging, unpredictable and perhaps even a little forced on you to shake those who just endless grind the same missions in the same place out of their comfort zone. Ships will be lost and stories will be made, more interesting stories than "I just made another 800M ISK last weekend doing the exact same thing I did the weekend before while watching Game of Thrones".
I hope so anyway. Let's hope CCP gets it right and sticks to their guns unlike last time the incursion community threw a tantrum when the ISK faucet was closed just a bit.
|
Lex Gabinia
Res Repetundae
3
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 13:02:31 -
[127] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Exactly. These feel much more like the original intention of the Sansha Incursions - group content that is challenging, unpredictable and perhaps even a little forced on you to shake those who just endless grind the same missions in the same place out of their comfort zone.
Why should a sandbox game force anyone to do anything? If someone is happy grinding missions leave them be I say. If someone wants to gank miners in high sec, have fun. I'm sure some people relocate during Sansha incursions to continue their missions and mining thereby not forcibly subjected to content of which they have no interest.
I ask again Pedro, why would a sandbox based game force players to do anything? |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1490
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 13:16:04 -
[128] - Quote
Lex Gabinia wrote: Why should a sandbox game force anyone to do anything? If someone is happy grinding missions leave them be I say. If someone wants to gank miners in high sec, have fun. I'm sure some people relocate during Sansha incursions to continue their missions and mining thereby not forcibly subjected to content of which they have no interest.
I ask again Pedro, why would a sandbox based game force players to do anything?
They aren't. But Eve is a living, breathing universe, or at least CCP is trying to make it so. There are good design reasons to mix things up, provide new content and opportunities for people to meet each other. If players want to flee from the incursion and set up shop somewhere else, there is nothing wrong with that at all.
But at least something is happening. How long can players sit in the same system running the same mission by themselves? Actually, we know this as CCP gave us some numbers on it - about 24 months. After 24 months of that players burn out and leave the game, while players that socially interact with other players, engage in conflict and the greater universe of New Eden stay much longer. Incursions increase slightly the chance of that happening and breaking solo PvE'ers out of the rut.
But Eve is a sandbox, play as you want. I think though that most reasonable people will agree that a universe where something is happening is more interesting than one that remains perpetually the same.
|
Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
332
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 13:18:08 -
[129] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Some of y'all are missing the big picture.
If you look at CCP's development of PVE content over the years, you notice a pattern: They make something, and that something is general built upon a high minded but ultimately unrealistic principle (like risk/reward being higher the further you go into danger, not understanding that many people will simply stay in safety and bleet on a forum about how they need mroe reward in safe space lol).
They will then see how things go, notice the unintended consequences. THEN they will put out a new version that learns from the lesson of the 1st thing. They did it with missions ,up to lvl 4s in high sec, 5s in low sec, pirate 4s in npc null, each level of mission haivng mroe and more battleship NPCs. They finally figured out that the problem with missions in dangerous space was that battleships took so long to kill that those missions became targets for people trying to force pvp.
So the fix was missions like the pirate epic arcs and FW missions and lately burner missions. Mission for fast, small ships that can survive in dangerous space and finish the mission quickly. And it works, people farm FW missions and low sec/null sec burners.
I think the same will happen with incursions. They made these incursions that resulted in very little incursion activity in low and null but great big whopping blobby blinged out incursion farming communities in high sec, because high sec is so safe and the incursions so predictable that risking a 5 bil isk ship isn't a risk at all.
So NOW they are making incursions that more resemble what the originals should have been: Desperate affairs for cheaper ships where losses are unavoidable but not fighting at all is a worse option (the original incursions changed the entire constellation to batop all other actvity, meant to encourage people to kill the incursion as soon as possible). You can't just bling your way to glory with a Drifter Incursion, you NEED to fly cheap as possible and be prepared to replace that lose. As others in this thread suggest, it might even been intended as a boon for the economy, because frankly, other forms of pve are so predictable and safe that ship losses are rare without outside player interference.
I take back my previous opinion of Drifter Incursions. BRAVO CCP, no you are getting it. For you nay says, just make a disposable Moa or Maller fleet and lets have at them Drifters. As Goons and nullseccers love to say these days, you can't change human nature and behavior. It's a nice little fantasy but why should a mission runner undock in a ship that has a high probability of exploding and join with people they do not know (in a game that is designed such that you can not trust anyone, even your closest friend) if the rewards are so much worse than what can be made by undocking in a ship that they know will not exploded and make much more isk? All you're going to get forcing people to do something for less pay or even negative pay is resentment. But hay if CCP feels that there's too many people in EVE then this could be a good way to remedy that.
To be honest what will probably happen is that as the incursions hit HS the payouts will increase(something something RP reasons) so that your traditional sansha incursion runners will be motivated to run them.
Give people a reason to do something that isn't 'make the beatings stop'. |
Jenn aSide
Ascendent. Test Alliance Please Ignore
12240
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 13:23:58 -
[130] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:
I hope so anyway. Let's hope CCP gets it right and sticks to their guns unlike last time the incursion community threw a tantrum when the ISK faucet was closed just a bit.
I remember the last time. They claimed that "it's not about the money, it's about the community!". But when CCP turned of the money,the community died lol. CCP had to un-nerf incursions to get people to come back. I was on these forums talking to the defenders of unbalanced incursions saying "but I thought it wasn't about the money lol".
People say they want excitement and danger and unpredictability, but that's just them not understanding themselves. What people really want is comfort and safety and predictability, even in a video game. That's why people freak out when CCP goes to fix things (not that every attempt is a good one of course).
|
|
Prados
The Old Comrades Association A.W.A.C.S and Friends
0
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 13:29:39 -
[131] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:I think though that most reasonable people will agree that a universe where something is happening is more interesting than one that remains perpetually the same.
The beauty of Eve, since the beginning, is that something IS always happening. The tools are given by CCP and the memorable content, at least since I started in 2004, is made by the players. I think incursions are fantastic as they bring together people from various corps and alliances, etc. But the content is still driven by the players based on the "tool" of incursions that CCP provided.
I also think CODE, or groups like it, is fantastic as it generates content. Hell, I miss Hulkageddon. EvE thrives on player created content grown from pushing the boundaries of the tools created by CCP. THIS is what makes it unique among MMO's.
Something is always happening in EVE; if you think not, then go make something happen. |
Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
332
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 13:35:36 -
[132] - Quote
Prados wrote:Black Pedro wrote:I think though that most reasonable people will agree that a universe where something is happening is more interesting than one that remains perpetually the same.
The beauty of Eve, since the beginning, is that something IS always happening. The tools are given by CCP and the memorable content, at least since I started in 2004, is made by the players. I think incursions are fantastic as they bring together people from various corps and alliances, etc. But the content is still driven by the players based on the "tool" of incursions that CCP provided. I also think CODE, or groups like it, is fantastic as it generates content. Hell, I miss Hulkageddon. EvE thrives on player created content grown from pushing the boundaries of the tools created by CCP. THIS is what makes it unique among MMO's. Something is always happening in EVE; if you think not, then go make something happen. Unless you're in null sec because screw fozzie sov right :P |
Lex Gabinia
Res Repetundae
3
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 13:51:25 -
[133] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote: After 24 months of that players burn out and leave the game, while players that socially interact with other players, engage in conflict and the greater universe of New Eden stay much longer.
Can one not socially interact by being a member of a mining, industrial, mission running corp that has no interest in Incursions, PvP or low or null sec space?
I know a fellow, half way across the world from me, that has played over 10 years and never engaged in combat PvP. He rarely leaves his one small area of "home" space. He likes to make things, mine and run missions. He runs a small corporation with 30+ members. Those 30 members were recruited by him under those conditions. Most of his members are "solo PvE'ers" who do the occasional mining operation and sometimes run a mission with one or two corp members. He has members from six continents and the average time in game for his corp members is over 5 years.
I do not think the EVE population is as black and white as you think it is. I think classifying this play style as a "rut" is a bit insulting to those players. I think the game is big enough and varied enough to allow for all play styles simultaneously.
|
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1491
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 14:13:19 -
[134] - Quote
Lex Gabinia wrote: Can one not socially interact by being a member of a mining, industrial, mission running corp that has no interest in Incursions, PvP or low or null sec space?
Of course that is possible. I am not sure why you are so defensive.
But there is a huge collection of "leveling my Raven" players who do nothing else but run missions by themselves or solo mine who end up quitting Eve early. Far from it for me to tell them how to spend their free time, but I can see why CCP would want to encourage them to engage more with the game and incursions are one way to do it. There is a small chance that if an incursion shows up, they might choose to join up with other players to fight, or if not, at least move somewhere else and potentially meet new people.
Incursions probably have a very low success rate at that, but it is better than nothing. |
Lex Gabinia
Res Repetundae
3
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 14:39:48 -
[135] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Of course that is possible. I am not sure why you are so defensive. But there is a huge collection of " leveling my Raven" players who do nothing else but run missions by themselves or solo mine who end up quitting Eve early. Far from it for me to tell them how to spend their free time, but I can see why CCP would want to encourage them to engage more with the game and incursions are one way to do it. There is a small chance that if an incursion shows up, they might choose to join up with other players to fight, or if not, at least move somewhere else and potentially meet new people. Incursions probably have a very low success rate at that, but it is better than nothing.
I would couch my argument not so much as defensive but more astonished. Astonished that people continue to think there is a proper or better way to play EvE. Also, I'm not picking on you personally it's just that I've been seeing a theme, and you're the one I chose to respond to. ;)
Some people will love the game and stay until it well and truly dies (soon (tm)). Others will enjoy the game for a few years or months and move on. I would suggest that that is more a reflection of their overall gaming style than anything else and that no amount of player or CCP created content will change this.
|
Jenn aSide
Ascendent. Test Alliance Please Ignore
12247
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 14:50:47 -
[136] - Quote
Lex Gabinia wrote:Black Pedro wrote:Of course that is possible. I am not sure why you are so defensive. But there is a huge collection of " leveling my Raven" players who do nothing else but run missions by themselves or solo mine who end up quitting Eve early. Far from it for me to tell them how to spend their free time, but I can see why CCP would want to encourage them to engage more with the game and incursions are one way to do it. There is a small chance that if an incursion shows up, they might choose to join up with other players to fight, or if not, at least move somewhere else and potentially meet new people. Incursions probably have a very low success rate at that, but it is better than nothing. I would couch my argument not so much as defensive but more astonished. Astonished that people continue to think there is a proper or better way to play EvE. Also, I'm not picking on you personally it's just that I've been seeing a theme, and you're the one I chose to respond to. ;) Some people will love the game and stay until it well and truly dies (soon (tm)). Others will enjoy the game for a few years or months and move on. I would suggest that that is more a reflection of their overall gaming style than anything else and that no amount of player or CCP created content will change this.
Your 'astonishment' comes from a misunderstanding of what is being said. No one is making any judgments about how anyone plays (and why people always thin this is beyond me), Black Pedro is just stating a fact, people that interact in certain ways stay longer, and if CCP is going to pick a direction to develop in, it's wiser to develop the game in a way that facilitates interaction.
The fact that you know someone that oddly stays tied to a small area of a video game isn't particularity relevant. No one is trying to tell him or you how to play, but rather we're having a discussion about how things really work in this game.
Also, the idea that nothing CCP does will affect whether people stay or leave is demonstrably false, monocle-gate proved that.
|
Daerrol
Work In Progress.
234
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 15:24:16 -
[137] - Quote
Hey guys. This doesn't kill the sandbox. Fozzie sov doesn't kill the sandbox. Sandbox means you can go around doing what you want. If you want to engage this new content you can. If you don't want to, you can go to the over 2000+ systems not effected by drifter incursions and do stuff there.
No one is forcing anything. |
Lex Gabinia
Res Repetundae
3
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 15:27:28 -
[138] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote: Your 'astonishment' comes from a misunderstanding of what is being said. No one is making any judgments about how anyone plays (and why people always thin this is beyond me), Black Pedro is just stating a fact, people that interact in certain ways stay longer, and if CCP is going to pick a direction to develop in, it's wiser to develop the game in a way that facilitates interaction.
The fact that you know someone that oddly stays tied to a small area of a video game isn't particularity relevant. No one is trying to tell him or you how to play, but rather we're having a discussion about how things really work in this game.
Also, the idea that nothing CCP does will affect whether people stay or leave is demonstrably false, monocle-gate proved that.
I think a clear judgment is being made if something is referred to as a "rut" style of game play. You're statement that "someone that oddly stays tied to a small area of a video game..." is clearly judgmental. I think to them that is "how things really work in this game."
I agree that the major tenet of the game is player interaction. One must interact with players from something as simple as buying a T1 module to getting the last bit of ice out of the belt before the other person to full on PvP (combat and market). However, I stand by my assertion that a gamers play style is more about their personal goals than any construct in which they play. Those who focus on leveling up will focus on that in any game. Those who "grief" will do so in any game.
Monocle gate, WIS, Incarna gate, however you choose to refer to that is a many layered subject (pay-to-win, shiny new things over fixing broken mechanics, CCP arrogance, product delivered falling WAY short of product promised, etc.) Not to mention it actually is something that a large portion of people believed would drive more player interaction. Nonetheless, there would still be people that would never leave their pods and go walk about a station. I'd guess some people left because the ambulation never happened. See the constant push and pull?
Finally if it is a fact that people who "interact in certain ways stay longer" and Sansha Incursions have generated this interaction then why the negative attitude about them? And I don't care about the ISK argument, anyone playing as long as you or I has no trouble making ISK as needed. |
Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
332
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 15:29:44 -
[139] - Quote
Daerrol wrote:Hey guys. This doesn't kill the sandbox. Fozzie sov doesn't kill the sandbox. Sandbox means you can go around doing what you want. If you want to engage this new content you can. If you don't want to, you can go to the over 2000+ systems not effected by drifter incursions and do stuff there.
No one is forcing anything. I think people are talking about the fact that (theoretically) if no one does anything the incursion will eventually cover all of K-space so there will be nowhere to go to, thus forcing you to either run the incursions or not undock. |
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
452
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 16:15:10 -
[140] - Quote
Anize Oramara wrote: I think people are talking about the fact that (theoretically) if no one does anything the incursion will eventually cover all of K-space so there will be nowhere to go to, thus forcing you to either run the incursions or not undock.
A theoretical possibility, but not one that is high risk.
If it was a potential threat to those in low and null security, those of us in empire countering them will be able to make arrangements.
First off, is high sec will be defended. We will be down by khanid and figure out how to fight them and then push them back. If just impossible to get players and supplies to do so, I am sure CCP will tweak their power or else we will "find" new technology to counter more effectively.
With tactics and strategy, we should be able to start forcing them back. that will then come down to those that live in the lowsec/nullsec affected. Essentially you pirates can protect and scout for us incursion runners as we clear your space. So is interesting. If a problem in pirate space, pirates can clear them, or can ask nicely and those of us who specialize in drifter ops can do it as well. With of course the final site resulting in a big gank....
If that happens... well next one that pops up, you are on your own. An armistice so to speak if needed |
|
Estella Osoka
Perkone Caldari State
714
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 16:25:30 -
[141] - Quote
I welcome our new Drifter Overlords! |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
2094
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 16:57:09 -
[142] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:I think that drifter incursions will end up in alpha ships , and hit & run tactics. We will see.
I hope that CCP will move sansha incursion to low/null only.
No need, the drifter incursions if unchecked will do that for CPP. They will take all high sec and no more sanshas in high sec, until drifters are driven off.
"If brute force does not solve your problem.... then you are surely not using enough!"
For the rest hire PoH |
Recruitment
|
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
4023
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 19:08:38 -
[143] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:I think the same will happen with incursions. They made these incursions that resulted in very little incursion activity in low and null but great big whopping blobby blinged out incursion farming communities in high sec, because high sec is so safe and the incursions so predictable that risking a 5 bil isk ship isn't a risk at all.
So NOW they are making incursions that more resemble what the originals should have been: Desperate affairs for cheaper ships where losses are unavoidable but not fighting at all is a worse option. You can't just bling your way to glory with a Drifter Incursion, you NEED to fly cheap as possible and be prepared to replace that lose. As others in this thread suggest, it might even been intended as a boon for the economy, because frankly, other forms of pve are so predictable and safe that ship losses are rare without outside player interference.
I take back my previous opinion of Drifter Incursions. BRAVO CCP, no you are getting it. For you nay says, just make a disposable Moa or Maller fleet and lets have at them Drifters. Exactly. These feel much more like the original intention of the Sansha Incursions - group content that is challenging, unpredictable and perhaps even a little forced on you to shake those who just endless grind the same missions in the same place out of their comfort zone. Ships will be lost and stories will be made, more interesting stories than "I just made another 800M ISK last weekend doing the exact same thing I did the weekend before while watching Game of Thrones". I hope so anyway. Let's hope CCP gets it right and sticks to their guns unlike last time the incursion community threw a tantrum when the ISK faucet was closed just a bit.
IF they move to highsec... IF there's a meaningful reward... IF there's a point (=dead drifters + rewards) to play logi for those poor devils in Amarr Navy... IF risk/reward balances as my previous interactions or better (losses: 900 million; rewards: 150 million, fun: good enough)
...then I may bother to RP and "defend my homeland". Specially if it's viable without flying in multi-billion fits.
What I won't do is move a multi-bilion ship to low, risk being ganked or whatever, in order to earn less than a Level 4 and then lose my ship in the process. My time is more valuable than that.
73% of EVE characters stay in high security space. 62% of EVE subscribers barely PvP. 40% of all new accounts just "level up their Ravens". Probably that's why PvE content in EVE Online is sub-par and CCP is head over heels for PvP...
|
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
455
|
Posted - 2015.08.27 19:14:57 -
[144] - Quote
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote: IF they move to highsec... IF there's a meaningful reward... IF there's a point (=dead drifters + rewards) to play logi for those poor devils in Amarr Navy... IF risk/reward balances as my previous interactions or better (losses: 900 million; rewards: 150 million, fun: good enough)
...then I may bother to RP and "defend my homeland". Specially if it's viable without flying in multi-billion fits.
What I won't do is move a multi-bilion ship to low, risk being ganked or whatever, in order to earn less than a Level 4 and then lose my ship in the process. My time is more valuable than that.
Everything so far is pointing to fast, low cost and insurable staple ships like cruisers. If insured, should make okay isk even if lose ships. Alpha potential alone makes bling ships an assured loss of isk over time. The big part right now is tactics. High sec is safe as long as there are players and even some profit with fun. Low sec, well that is the inhabitants of the people who live there if we clear....
Hrm... Wonder what happens if drifters get to the new eden system... |
Snagletooth Johnson
Snagle Material Services CAStabouts
285
|
Posted - 2015.08.29 12:28:02 -
[145] - Quote
Drifters invade Uedema. Hilarity ensues. |
Gimme Sake
State War Academy Caldari State
219
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:12:21 -
[146] - Quote
Barrogh Habalu wrote:Gimme Sake wrote:Why not make drifter incursions take over/destroy sov structures then expanding to nearby systems when one is overrun? Make them attack everything inside the system, explorers, ratters, miners, Pos, stations etc. Add NPC stations and mission runners to that list while we are at it
Absolutely anything they encounter. Purpose being to make players get together and react to the threat without a "material" motivation.
"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
|
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1404
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:16:54 -
[147] - Quote
Gimme Sake wrote:Barrogh Habalu wrote:Gimme Sake wrote:Why not make drifter incursions take over/destroy sov structures then expanding to nearby systems when one is overrun? Make them attack everything inside the system, explorers, ratters, miners, Pos, stations etc. Add NPC stations and mission runners to that list while we are at it Absolutely anything they encounter. Purpose being to make players get together and react to the threat without a "material" motivation.
not everyone wants to shoot npc's, we aint all carebears
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
|
Gimme Sake
State War Academy Caldari State
219
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:20:59 -
[148] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Gimme Sake wrote:Barrogh Habalu wrote:Gimme Sake wrote:Why not make drifter incursions take over/destroy sov structures then expanding to nearby systems when one is overrun? Make them attack everything inside the system, explorers, ratters, miners, Pos, stations etc. Add NPC stations and mission runners to that list while we are at it Absolutely anything they encounter. Purpose being to make players get together and react to the threat without a "material" motivation. not everyone wants to shoot npc's, we aint all carebears
You miss the point here, which is not shooting npcs but the forcing a reaction (other than docking up) to an unavoidable risk element.
"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
|
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1404
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:26:22 -
[149] - Quote
well its kinda just forcing everyone to do pve, could just turn out to be a 3rd party fight where the defenders end up getting out numbered by attackers because someone decided to drop ships on the defenders while the npc's were attacking, pvp + pve mixed together, that would cause tears
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
|
Gimme Sake
State War Academy Caldari State
219
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:27:49 -
[150] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:well its kinda just forcing everyone to do pve, could just turn out to be a 3rd party fight where the defenders end up getting out numbered by attackers because someone decided to drop ships on the defenders while the npc's were attacking, pvp + pve mixed together, that would cause tears
Well, thats Eve, no?
"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
|
|
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1404
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:40:40 -
[151] - Quote
nah i like fighting players not npc's
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
|
Gimme Sake
State War Academy Caldari State
219
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:48:11 -
[152] - Quote
So you suggest Eve getting rid of any form of lore except for player created content?
"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
|
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1404
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:51:14 -
[153] - Quote
no i suggest more letting people decide if they want to shoot npc's or not, it should be an option not a case of getting pinged to clear a bunch of npc's at silly am because they are attacking something
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
|
Gimme Sake
State War Academy Caldari State
219
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:52:28 -
[154] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:no i suggest more letting people decide if they want to shoot npc's or not, it should be an option not a case of getting pinged to clear a bunch of npc's at silly am because they are attacking something
I'm pretty sure that was the intention behind Sansha incursions...
"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
|
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1404
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:54:33 -
[155] - Quote
Gimme Sake wrote:Lan Wang wrote:no i suggest more letting people decide if they want to shoot npc's or not, it should be an option not a case of getting pinged to clear a bunch of npc's at silly am because they are attacking something I'm pretty sure that was the intention behind Sansha incursions...
yeah its all optional...dont know where you're going with this now
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
|
Yang Aurilen
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
839
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:54:45 -
[156] - Quote
Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Drifters invade Uedema. Hilarity ensues.
Who's gonna cry more? The carebear haulers or CODE?
Post with your NPC alt main and not your main main alt!
|
Gimme Sake
State War Academy Caldari State
219
|
Posted - 2015.09.01 13:57:52 -
[157] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Gimme Sake wrote:Lan Wang wrote:no i suggest more letting people decide if they want to shoot npc's or not, it should be an option not a case of getting pinged to clear a bunch of npc's at silly am because they are attacking something I'm pretty sure that was the intention behind Sansha incursions... yeah its all optional...dont know where you're going with this now
I'm not going anywhere except wonder what is the deal with a new type of incursion, like the topic of the thread suggests.
"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
|
Arthur Aihaken
Chig
4615
|
Posted - 2015.09.02 02:06:40 -
[158] - Quote
Eugene Kerner wrote:There are going to be large fleets with very fast small ships So Frigates/Interceptors/Cruisers Online is fast becoming a reality then.
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
|
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
7127
|
Posted - 2015.09.02 02:31:39 -
[159] - Quote
Yang Aurilen wrote:Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Drifters invade Uedema. Hilarity ensues. Who's gonna cry more? The carebear haulers or CODE?
That's a good question.
Bring back DEEEEP Space!
|
Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
0
|
Posted - 2015.09.02 02:55:30 -
[160] - Quote
Is there any group dedicated to investigate events like this one? in fact new events also? |
|
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2431
|
Posted - 2015.09.02 05:02:47 -
[161] - Quote
Astrid Farnsworth wrote:Is there any group dedicated to investigate events like this one? in fact new events also? Arek'Jaalan, and Live Events are player channels, the Out of Character/Intergalactic Summit channels are CCP run for roleplay events also. |
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1458
|
Posted - 2015.09.02 05:42:27 -
[162] - Quote
Yang Aurilen wrote:Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Drifters invade Uedema. Hilarity ensues. Who's gonna cry more? The carebear haulers or CODE?
CODE has the odd person that can actually PvP.
But shooting at AFK haulers being driven by an NPC autopilot is about as carebear as it comes.
|
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
51691
|
Posted - 2015.09.02 06:36:33 -
[163] - Quote
Read this whole thread, ironic to see low / null sec anti-PvE players complain about players doing high sec PvE content.
Despite all of the changes made to the game, seems this topic will never change..
DMC
'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
|
Snagletooth Johnson
Snagle Material Services CAStabouts
291
|
Posted - 2015.09.02 12:41:16 -
[164] - Quote
Yang Aurilen wrote:Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Drifters invade Uedema. Hilarity ensues. Who's gonna cry more? The carebear haulers or CODE? Just another day in Uedema for carebear haulers. Code, on the other hand, will get one shot killed trying to get in on the kill mail. No 5 sec timer on Drifters, just targeted.."Wha-" BOOM!
Good news, salvaging as a profession is now back on!!!!!
WOOOOT!!!! |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1526
|
Posted - 2015.09.02 12:54:53 -
[165] - Quote
Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Yang Aurilen wrote:Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Drifters invade Uedema. Hilarity ensues. Who's gonna cry more? The carebear haulers or CODE? Just another day in Uedema for carebear haulers. Code, on the other hand, will get one shot killed trying to get in on the kill mail. No 5 sec timer on Drifters, just targeted.."Wha-" BOOM! Good news, salvaging as a profession is now back on!!!!! WOOOOT!!!! Um. You do realize that CODE. gankers already get one-shotted after each of their enforcement actions by CONCORD?
|
Snagletooth Johnson
Snagle Material Services CAStabouts
291
|
Posted - 2015.09.02 20:11:02 -
[166] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Yang Aurilen wrote:Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Drifters invade Uedema. Hilarity ensues. Who's gonna cry more? The carebear haulers or CODE? Just another day in Uedema for carebear haulers. Code, on the other hand, will get one shot killed trying to get in on the kill mail. No 5 sec timer on Drifters, just targeted.."Wha-" BOOM! Good news, salvaging as a profession is now back on!!!!! WOOOOT!!!! Um. You do realize that CODE. gankers already get one-shotted after each of their enforcement actions by CONCORD? Um, you do realize thats after they agress and a timer runs out....that don't happen with drifters. |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1533
|
Posted - 2015.09.03 05:23:30 -
[167] - Quote
Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Black Pedro wrote:Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Yang Aurilen wrote:Snagletooth Johnson wrote:Drifters invade Uedema. Hilarity ensues. Who's gonna cry more? The carebear haulers or CODE? Just another day in Uedema for carebear haulers. Code, on the other hand, will get one shot killed trying to get in on the kill mail. No 5 sec timer on Drifters, just targeted.."Wha-" BOOM! Good news, salvaging as a profession is now back on!!!!! WOOOOT!!!! Um. You do realize that CODE. gankers already get one-shotted after each of their enforcement actions by CONCORD? Um, you do realize thats after they agress and a timer runs out....that don't happen with drifters. Uh ok. They also get shot without aggressing by the faction police. Not quite a one-shot, but they are dead none-the-less if they are in space for any length of time.
Probably you should get you salvage ships there today if you want that profit. No point in waiting for Drifters. |
Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
1
|
Posted - 2015.09.07 03:00:52 -
[168] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Astrid Farnsworth wrote:Is there any group dedicated to investigate events like this one? in fact new events also? Arek'Jaalan, and Live Events are player channels, the Out of Character/Intergalactic Summit channels are CCP run for roleplay events also.
Great info thanks. |
Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
1
|
Posted - 2015.10.19 01:53:05 -
[169] - Quote
So they silently retire it, any news of when will it be back.? |
NFain
Elysian Ascent Empyreus
157
|
Posted - 2015.10.19 02:56:30 -
[170] - Quote
Astrid Farnsworth wrote:So they silently retire it, any news of when will it be back.?
Not silently retiring it. Check the eve updates pages it's coming back soon. |
|
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1572
|
Posted - 2015.10.19 03:18:10 -
[171] - Quote
NFain wrote:Astrid Farnsworth wrote:So they silently retire it, any news of when will it be back.? Not silently retiring it. Check the eve updates pages it's coming back soon.
Drifters II - the Battle for Somewhere or Other Insignificant in Losec.
Coming soon to a system near new. Watch this space. |
Indahmawar Fazmarai
4047
|
Posted - 2015.10.19 07:42:18 -
[172] - Quote
Hasikan Miallok wrote:NFain wrote:Astrid Farnsworth wrote:So they silently retire it, any news of when will it be back.? Not silently retiring it. Check the eve updates pages it's coming back soon. Drifters II - the Battle for Somewhere or Other Insignificant in Losec. Coming soon to a system near new. Watch this space.
Drifter Incursions set a new record in feature irrelevance. They'll be back someday but I wonder how many people will notice/care...
CCP Seagull: "EVE should be a universe where the infrastructure you build and fight over is as player driven and dynamic as the EVE market is now".
62% of players: "We're not interested. May we have Plan B, please?"
CCP Seagull: "What Plan B?"
|
Dun Bar
Inner Shadow Did he say Jump
30
|
Posted - 2015.11.09 05:19:35 -
[173] - Quote
so just run some test on these new drifter incursions.....
first run, before we could even wipe our butts, guardian was armor was gone, got reps on it as it was dd'd off field. then when m8's ship got poped they scrambled his pod but couldn't hit it. had to bring in another bs so they would switch agro so he could warp out. which was funny as heck. then we tried nestors. they had a navy apoc primaried and reps we're holding... then out of nowhere, nestor got dd'd lol
oh btw there back on sisi |
Nuu
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2015.11.09 06:59:17 -
[174] - Quote
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:Hasikan Miallok wrote:NFain wrote:Astrid Farnsworth wrote:So they silently retire it, any news of when will it be back.? Not silently retiring it. Check the eve updates pages it's coming back soon. Drifters II - the Battle for Somewhere or Other Insignificant in Losec. Coming soon to a system near new. Watch this space. Drifter Incursions set a new record in feature irrelevance. They'll be back someday but I wonder how many people will notice/care... Sansha incursions started this same way. After experimental phase, they introduced current system. |
Bla5to Frigate
The Praxus Consortium
6
|
Posted - 2015.11.09 21:47:46 -
[175] - Quote
Dun Bar wrote:so just run some test on these new drifter incursions.....
first run, before we could even wipe our butts, guardian was armor was gone, got reps on it as it was dd'd off field. then when m8's ship got poped they scrambled his pod but couldn't hit it. had to bring in another bs so they would switch agro so he could warp out. which was funny as heck. then we tried nestors. they had a navy apoc primaried and reps we're holding... then out of nowhere, nestor got dd'd lol
oh btw there back on sisi
How many were on grid? Were they acting individually or with military precision like they were being FC'd and given specific targets? |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2681
|
Posted - 2015.11.09 21:48:56 -
[176] - Quote
Dun Bar wrote:so just run some test on these new drifter incursions.....
first run, before we could even wipe our butts, guardian was armor was gone, got reps on it as it was dd'd off field. then when m8's ship got poped they scrambled his pod but couldn't hit it. had to bring in another bs so they would switch agro so he could warp out. which was funny as heck. then we tried nestors. they had a navy apoc primaried and reps we're holding... then out of nowhere, nestor got dd'd lol
oh btw there back on sisi They go back live on tonight's downtime supposedly. And yea, that sounds pretty much as well as anyone has managed. |
Dun Bar
Inner Shadow Did he say Jump
30
|
Posted - 2015.11.10 06:13:16 -
[177] - Quote
Bla5to Frigate wrote:Dun Bar wrote:so just run some test on these new drifter incursions.....
first run, before we could even wipe our butts, guardian was armor was gone, got reps on it as it was dd'd off field. then when m8's ship got poped they scrambled his pod but couldn't hit it. had to bring in another bs so they would switch agro so he could warp out. which was funny as heck. then we tried nestors. they had a navy apoc primaried and reps we're holding... then out of nowhere, nestor got dd'd lol
oh btw there back on sisi How many were on grid? Were they acting individually or with military precision like they were being FC'd and given specific targets?
military precision like they were being FC'd and given specific targets.
they where all shooting same target with primary weapon and then one would use secondary aka dd on logi. |
Pryce Caesar
Cloak and Daggers Fidelas Constans
20
|
Posted - 2015.11.11 17:12:35 -
[178] - Quote
Dun Bar wrote:Bla5to Frigate wrote:Dun Bar wrote:so just run some test on these new drifter incursions.....
first run, before we could even wipe our butts, guardian was armor was gone, got reps on it as it was dd'd off field. then when m8's ship got poped they scrambled his pod but couldn't hit it. had to bring in another bs so they would switch agro so he could warp out. which was funny as heck. then we tried nestors. they had a navy apoc primaried and reps we're holding... then out of nowhere, nestor got dd'd lol
oh btw there back on sisi How many were on grid? Were they acting individually or with military precision like they were being FC'd and given specific targets? military precision like they were being FC'd and given specific targets. they where all shooting same target with primary weapon and then one would use secondary aka dd on logi.
Well, the Drifters are officially back in the game, but I've heard there may be some kind of bug that makes them easier than they should be. |
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
742
|
Posted - 2015.11.11 17:52:11 -
[179] - Quote
Pryce Caesar wrote:
Well, the Drifters are officially back in the game, but I've heard there may be some kind of bug that makes them easier than they should be.
More than that.
The bug is that drifters attack other drifters.
Therefore, warp in, wait. Kill the last stand. If lucky, they already fired off their doomsdays and voila. Free isk, no ships lost.
In the defense ones, no shots are required because the Amarr navy kills them
So grab your small cheap gank fleet, fly in and shoot the last standing. FREE LP AND ISK!
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
|
Pryce Caesar
Cloak and Daggers Fidelas Constans
20
|
Posted - 2015.11.11 18:09:07 -
[180] - Quote
Ouch. That is a pretty big bug. No wonder the Incursions flyers seem to be doing so well. |
|
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
743
|
Posted - 2015.11.11 18:17:42 -
[181] - Quote
Pryce Caesar wrote:Ouch. That is a pretty big bug. No wonder the Incursions flyers seem to be doing so well.
Yuppers.
Advantage is that it shows a mechanic that cannot be farmed once implemented properly. As more control is gained, site spawn rate seems to decrease to the point where the final trigger is available and that seems to be clear remaining sites. There does not appear to be a final boss style of clearing like the Sansha have.
Overall, once corrected of the bugs, they will be very dangerous sites. Right now, it is just money rain. Was so bad, I am trying to imagine they still arent released....
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
|
Indahmawar Fazmarai
4106
|
Posted - 2015.11.11 23:13:50 -
[182] - Quote
Markus Reese wrote:Pryce Caesar wrote:
Well, the Drifters are officially back in the game, but I've heard there may be some kind of bug that makes them easier than they should be.
More than that. The bug is that drifters attack other drifters. Therefore, warp in, wait. Kill the last stand. If lucky, they already fired off their doomsdays and voila. Free isk, no ships lost. In the defense ones, no shots are required because the Amarr navy kills them So grab your small cheap gank fleet, fly in and shoot the last standing. FREE LP AND ISK!
Houm... I can't seem to find any care. I am devoid of emotions to feel about it.
CCP Seagull: "EVE should be a universe where the infrastructure you build and fight over is as player driven and dynamic as the EVE market is now".
62% of players: "We're not interested. May we have Plan B, please?"
CCP Seagull: "What Plan B?"
|
Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
3
|
Posted - 2015.11.12 00:59:02 -
[183] - Quote
People expect that everything have to work out fine at the first try. Thats why one CCP ask us player to test the drifters on sisi but if we dont well why do we pic that much on the cure t problems. So they did not get sufficient tested in sisi so ccp bring it to new eden how ever it is so they get people trAin it. The problem of this approach not everybody have sufficient isk to waist in ship.
So basically we are the lab rats of this show. |
Esrevid Nekkeg
Justified and Ancient
665
|
Posted - 2015.11.12 02:54:19 -
[184] - Quote
Astrid Farnsworth wrote:... So basically we are the lab rats of this show. We have been lab rats since we started playing. For some players that means since the dawn of EvE...
Here I used to have a sig of our old Camper in space. Now it is disregarded as being the wrong format.
Looking out the window I see one thing: Nothing wrong with the format of our Camper! Silly CCP......
|
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
745
|
Posted - 2015.11.12 03:45:50 -
[185] - Quote
Astrid Farnsworth wrote:People expect that everything have to work out fine at the first try. Thats why one CCP ask us player to test the drifters on sisi but if we dont well why do we pic that much on the cure t problems. So they did not get sufficient tested in sisi so ccp bring it to new eden how ever it is so they get people trAin it. The problem of this approach not everybody have sufficient isk to waist in ship.
So basically we are the lab rats of this show.
Don't get me wrong, I understand the problem and pretty sure CCP is fixing it. Keeping it mum is the best decision too.
These problems didn't show in Sisi either.
Lastly, is only wasted isk if a person goes gungho without attempting to get intelligence or focus on it. If a person wants to get in right off the bat, there is communities specializing in drifters that a person can take part with. Lots of isk and time spent by them to get info.
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
|
Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
3
|
Posted - 2015.11.12 05:23:10 -
[186] - Quote
Markus Reese wrote:Astrid Farnsworth wrote:People expect that everything have to work out fine at the first try. Thats why one CCP ask us player to test the drifters on sisi but if we dont well why do we pic that much on the cure t problems. So they did not get sufficient tested in sisi so ccp bring it to new eden how ever it is so they get people trAin it. The problem of this approach not everybody have sufficient isk to waist in ship.
So basically we are the lab rats of this show. Don't get me wrong, I understand the problem and pretty sure CCP is fixing it. Keeping it mum is the best decision too. These problems didn't show in Sisi either. Lastly, is only wasted isk if a person goes gungho without attempting to get intelligence or focus on it. If a person wants to get in right off the bat, there is communities specializing in drifters that a person can take part with. Lots of isk and time spent by them to get info.
Cool, you also thanks to don't get me wrong. I know might be its difficult but they will also need to improve the isk vs risk factor. If this driftcursion dont pay good isk it will be less popular.
Fun to have a nice discussion in the interweb. It |
Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
3
|
Posted - 2015.11.12 05:24:33 -
[187] - Quote
Esrevid Nekkeg wrote:Astrid Farnsworth wrote:... So basically we are the lab rats of this show. We have been lab rats since we started playing. For some players that means since the dawn of EvE...
truth hurts |
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
746
|
Posted - 2015.11.12 05:44:54 -
[188] - Quote
Astrid Farnsworth wrote: Cool, you also thanks to don't get me wrong. I know might be its difficult but they will also need to improve the isk vs risk factor. If this driftcursion dont pay good isk it will be less popular.
Fun to have a nice discussion in the interweb. It
Also agree that payout needs a tweak. There are some issues so I did number crunching on it for theorycraft. IiRC, 16m for a medium site and they clear fast and three ships lost. Cruiser potentially. with full insurance, that is probably 15m isk to replace. In early sansha, after a fight where a ship was lost, each person chipped in a small portion to cover ship. Therefore, three ships down est. Would be a 12m net payout. But they are fast, like a burner mission. Good isk/h if well set up and doesnt exclude lower SP players. Very nice and accessible for the new guys.
There is one major issue though. It is capsules in site do not seem to get a reward. So no isk, no lp. To split that out of survivors earnings is a serious chunk of change.
I actually wasnt orginally expecting them to be so good for the new players considering the AI. As an experience, it really will do wonders for players to get comfortable with ship loss and fleet ops. While caracals are the mainstay, some tweakimg and theorycrafting puts some good numbers to non caracal fleets. Really isn't a one is best.
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
|
Ransu Asanari
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
471
|
Posted - 2015.11.12 11:49:49 -
[189] - Quote
After downtime today, it looks like the Drifters no longer attack each other. |
Pryce Caesar
Cloak and Daggers Fidelas Constans
20
|
Posted - 2015.11.15 15:27:35 -
[190] - Quote
Ransu Asanari wrote:After downtime today, it looks like the Drifters no longer attack each other.
And because of that down-time, it looks like no one has been able to or wants to try and make a dent in their Incursions, anymore (last I checked). I suppose they are just too much for normal Incursion flyers to handle. |
|
Soldarius
O C C U P Y
1434
|
Posted - 2015.11.15 18:20:13 -
[191] - Quote
Well, they are live, and do absolutely nothing. Went into a site and they all just sit there doing nothing. Amarr and Drifters. All in a big circle singing Kumbaya. Hisec, losec, doesn't matter. They'll fir back if you fire on them. Otherwise, whats the point? I thought they were supposed to be at war?
http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
|
Specia1 K
State War Academy Caldari State
116
|
Posted - 2015.11.17 08:40:32 -
[192] - Quote
If you want the honey, sometimes you gotta go poke the nest
Storylines quite often have unlock events that need to be achieved before the next chapter unfolds. Don't expect CCP to just hand out the candy |
Valacus
Streets of Fire
14
|
Posted - 2015.11.17 20:44:31 -
[193] - Quote
Eh, if there's nothing in it but a 16m payout, no one will do drifter incursions. Sansha incursions pay more and the infostructure and network is already established. They will tell you everything you need to know about running Sansha incursions, fit your ship for you, and even provide SRP if your ship is lost because FC or logi dropped the ball. It's a safe bet and the community is very welcoming to new comers, because they know without enough people the sites aren't runnable. If drifter incursions guarantee that someone will lose their ship, no one is going to do them. It makes no sense to do them. No one wants to lose a ship in PvE. You get nothing in return. At least in PvP you get a killboard filled with the blood of your enemies as well as your own. With drifters you just get a loss mail. |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1983
|
Posted - 2015.11.17 20:55:27 -
[194] - Quote
Valacus wrote:Eh, if there's nothing in it but a 16m payout, no one will do drifter incursions. Sansha incursions pay more and the infostructure and network is already established. They will tell you everything you need to know about running Sansha incursions, fit your ship for you, and even provide SRP if your ship is lost because FC or logi dropped the ball. It's a safe bet and the community is very welcoming to new comers, because they know without enough people the sites aren't runnable. If drifter incursions guarantee that someone will lose their ship, no one is going to do them. It makes no sense to do them. No one wants to lose a ship in PvE. You get nothing in return. At least in PvP you get a killboard filled with the blood of your enemies as well as your own. With drifters you just get a loss mail. Tick, tock, tick, tock...
The sun is setting on the Sansha Incursions for the reasons outlined above. The only question that remains is will they be removed during the December 8th expansion, or one of the releases in the beginning of the new year? |
Valacus
Streets of Fire
14
|
Posted - 2015.11.17 21:10:35 -
[195] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Valacus wrote:Eh, if there's nothing in it but a 16m payout, no one will do drifter incursions. Sansha incursions pay more and the infostructure and network is already established. They will tell you everything you need to know about running Sansha incursions, fit your ship for you, and even provide SRP if your ship is lost because FC or logi dropped the ball. It's a safe bet and the community is very welcoming to new comers, because they know without enough people the sites aren't runnable. If drifter incursions guarantee that someone will lose their ship, no one is going to do them. It makes no sense to do them. No one wants to lose a ship in PvE. You get nothing in return. At least in PvP you get a killboard filled with the blood of your enemies as well as your own. With drifters you just get a loss mail. Tick, tock, tick, tock... The sun is setting on the Sansha Incursions for the reasons outlined above. The only question that remains is will they be removed during the December 8th expansion, or one of the releases in the beginning of the new year?
I highly doubt it. CCP has changed entire balancing plans to accommodate Sansha incursion runners. Wanna know one of the main reasons they won't get rid of off grid boosters? Starts with an "i". |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1983
|
Posted - 2015.11.17 21:24:36 -
[196] - Quote
Valacus wrote:[I highly doubt it. CCP has changed entire balancing plans to accommodate Sansha incursion runners. Wanna know one of the main reasons they won't get rid of off grid boosters? Starts with an "i". Hey, no sweat off my back if you keep your head buried in the sand.
What's more likely: that CCP would spend thousands of developer hours building new Incursions that they release balanced such that no one runs them, or that they have the audacity to remove the farmfest that are the five-year old Sansha Incursions?
Incursions aren't going away, they are just being replaced with a slightly more dangerous and dynamic version. As you pointed out there is no way they can coexist, therefore the only conclusion is the Sansha ones are going away and probably sooner rather than later.
But feel free to believe whatever you want. |
Lan Wang
V I R I I Ineluctable.
1839
|
Posted - 2015.11.17 21:25:24 -
[197] - Quote
Valacus wrote:Black Pedro wrote:Valacus wrote:Eh, if there's nothing in it but a 16m payout, no one will do drifter incursions. Sansha incursions pay more and the infostructure and network is already established. They will tell you everything you need to know about running Sansha incursions, fit your ship for you, and even provide SRP if your ship is lost because FC or logi dropped the ball. It's a safe bet and the community is very welcoming to new comers, because they know without enough people the sites aren't runnable. If drifter incursions guarantee that someone will lose their ship, no one is going to do them. It makes no sense to do them. No one wants to lose a ship in PvE. You get nothing in return. At least in PvP you get a killboard filled with the blood of your enemies as well as your own. With drifters you just get a loss mail. Tick, tock, tick, tock... The sun is setting on the Sansha Incursions for the reasons outlined above. The only question that remains is will they be removed during the December 8th expansion, or one of the releases in the beginning of the new year? I highly doubt it. CCP has changed entire balancing plans to accommodate Sansha incursion runners. Wanna know one of the main reasons they won't get rid of off grid boosters? Starts with an "i".
everything has been nerfed dont seem so naive that incursions wont get the nerf bat treatment
Recruiting V I R I I Small Gang Nullsec PVP
Drinking rum before 10am makes you a pirate, not an alcoholic | Angel Cartel | Serpentis |
|
Specia1 K
State War Academy Caldari State
119
|
Posted - 2015.11.17 21:25:50 -
[198] - Quote
Valacus wrote:Black Pedro wrote:Valacus wrote:Eh, if there's nothing in it but a 16m payout, no one will do drifter incursions. Sansha incursions pay more and the infostructure and network is already established. They will tell you everything you need to know about running Sansha incursions, fit your ship for you, and even provide SRP if your ship is lost because FC or logi dropped the ball. It's a safe bet and the community is very welcoming to new comers, because they know without enough people the sites aren't runnable. If drifter incursions guarantee that someone will lose their ship, no one is going to do them. It makes no sense to do them. No one wants to lose a ship in PvE. You get nothing in return. At least in PvP you get a killboard filled with the blood of your enemies as well as your own. With drifters you just get a loss mail. Tick, tock, tick, tock... The sun is setting on the Sansha Incursions for the reasons outlined above. The only question that remains is will they be removed during the December 8th expansion, or one of the releases in the beginning of the new year? I highly doubt it. CCP has changed entire balancing plans to accommodate Sansha incursion runners. Wanna know one of the main reasons they won't get rid of off grid boosters? Starts with an "i".
"I"sboxer?
No wait, they did that one already |
Pryce Caesar
Cloak and Daggers Fidelas Constans
20
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 01:22:35 -
[199] - Quote
In other words, if people want to unlock more storyline content, people will have to jump into the inferno and go fight against the Drifters.
I'm not quite experienced enough in general to go up against monsters like the Drifters, but I'm eager to see what will happen when people do. After all, no one has been able to budge their influence much in the Incursion as a whole. Drifters seem to be too much for normal Incursion goers. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2712
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 01:44:46 -
[200] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Hey, no sweat off my back if you keep your head buried in the sand.
What's more likely: that CCP would spend thousands of developer hours building new Incursions that they release balanced such that no one runs them, or that they have the audacity to remove the farmfest that are the five-year old Sansha Incursions?
Incursions aren't going away, they are just being replaced with a slightly more dangerous and dynamic version. As you pointed out there is no way they can coexist, therefore the only conclusion is the Sansha ones are going away and probably sooner rather than later.
But feel free to believe whatever you want. Tell you what, you go put together a group that can run Drifter incursions in a way that is profitable at all. Then work out what your income per hour is counting all the time spent reshipping, the fact that the pilots who die get no payout because pods don't count and drifters pod as well, and all the logistical time shipping all those replacement ships to the drifter incursions. Then come back with your 'slightly more dangerous' rubbish again. Currently drifter incursions are at best lvl 1 or 2 mission level income. |
|
Specia1 K
State War Academy Caldari State
120
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 02:15:04 -
[201] - Quote
Pryce Caesar wrote:In other words, if people want to unlock more storyline content, people will have to jump into the inferno and go fight against the Drifters. I'm not quite experienced enough in general to go up against monsters like the Drifters, but I'm eager to see what will happen when people do. After all, no one has been able to budge their influence much in the Incursion as a whole. Drifters seem to be too much for normal Incursion goers.
Niether am I, mate. But that isn't stopping me from having fun with them I've been poking with them since the first day they showed up. And they can die like everything else.
DARE to do something different! To be first! If all you care about is killboards, stats or I$K? ...sigh... |
Esrevid Nekkeg
Justified and Ancient
760
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 02:23:52 -
[202] - Quote
Personally I do not care for the profitability, the logistics involved or the probability of losing ships in a PvE activity. Although I am aware that that is probably a minority standpoint.
What I do care about is that I can't seem to find other people willing to actually try to fight the current Drifter incursions. I have asked around a lot. Freely translated the most common answer given comes down to this: 'We haven't figured out yet how to run them without losses'.
That saddens me a bit.
Here I used to have a sig of our old Camper in space. Now it is disregarded as being the wrong format.
Looking out the window I see one thing: Nothing wrong with the format of our Camper! Silly CCP......
|
Pryce Caesar
Cloak and Daggers Fidelas Constans
21
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 04:34:19 -
[203] - Quote
Esrevid Nekkeg wrote:Personally I do not care for the profitability, the logistics involved or the probability of losing ships in a PvE activity. I would not mind it being a net loss in Isk, in time, in ships. Although I am aware that that is probably a minority standpoint.
What I do care about is that I can't seem to find other people willing to actually try to fight the current Drifter incursions. I have asked around a lot. Freely translated the most common answer given comes down to this: 'We haven't figured out yet how to run them without losses'.
That saddens me a bit.
Well, that is basically the formula a lot of people like to go for when it comes to playing games: they want to find the methodology that will incur the most profit with the least amount of risk first before they make an attempt. In this case, the Drifters appear to be far tougher than anything to be seen of the Sansha Incursions. They are among the most advanced ships in the game.
Even if a man can take on a flight of three Drifter Cruisers and one Battleship, the Incursions are about facing all of that in groups big enough to make fielding a fleet necessary. I believe that, in that scenario, the risk would out-weigh the benefits in the eyes of normal Incursion goers, since I would think that the Drifters are advanced enough that the normal Sansha tactics would not work against them.
Granted, I say this when I am not making any attempts on the Incursions myself, because I'm located quite far away from them and I feel I would lack the skill level necessary to take them head-on, even in a fleet.
It is sad that people are not diving at the opportunity to take on the Drifters, especially after all the work CCP put into fixing the issues that initially plagued them.
At the rate things are going, I would not be surprised if people only started fighting back when the Drifters are spread out enough to become a major problem to the livelihoods of players in those regions and those around.
They are an Incursion designed to spread their influence the longer they are left alone, after all.
It almost makes me wonder what would happen if the Incursions spread into the Throne Worlds themselves. After all, the Incursions ARE about the Throne Worlds' defense. |
Persifonne
The Scope Gallente Federation
64
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 05:20:35 -
[204] - Quote
Pryce Caesar wrote:Esrevid Nekkeg wrote:Personally I do not care for the profitability, the logistics involved or the probability of losing ships in a PvE activity. I would not mind it being a net loss in Isk, in time, in ships. Although I am aware that that is probably a minority standpoint.
What I do care about is that I can't seem to find other people willing to actually try to fight the current Drifter incursions. I have asked around a lot. Freely translated the most common answer given comes down to this: 'We haven't figured out yet how to run them without losses'.
That saddens me a bit. Well, that is basically the formula a lot of people like to go for when it comes to playing games: they want to find the methodology that will incur the most profit with the least amount of risk first before they make an attempt. In this case, the Drifters appear to be far tougher than anything to be seen of the Sansha Incursions. They are among the most advanced ships in the game. Even if a man can take on a flight of three Drifter Cruisers and one Battleship, the Incursions are about facing all of that in groups big enough to make fielding a fleet necessary. I believe that, in that scenario, the risk would out-weigh the benefits in the eyes of normal Incursion goers, since I would think that the Drifters are advanced enough that the normal Sansha tactics would not work against them. Granted, I say this when I am not making any attempts on the Incursions myself, because I'm located quite far away from them and I feel I would lack the skill level necessary to take them head-on, even in a fleet. It is sad that people are not diving at the opportunity to take on the Drifters, especially after all the work CCP put into fixing the issues that initially plagued them. At the rate things are going, I would not be surprised if people only started fighting back when the Drifters are spread out enough to become a major problem to the livelihoods of players in those regions and those around. They are an Incursion designed to spread their influence the longer they are left alone, after all. It almost makes me wonder what would happen if the Incursions spread into the Throne Worlds themselves. After all, the Incursions ARE about the Throne Worlds' defense. World of Warcraft HEROIC 25man and 10man end raid content was legit. In BC, Wrath of Linch King, Heroic raids were legit and took weeks and weeks of practice and weeks and weeks of good end game content.
EVES LOL-PVE IS. THE. WORST. IN. TH . BIZ. CURRENTLY
Seriously eve pve is just horrible.
1 SECOND SERVER TICKS.. I REST MY CASE. 1 HZ SERVER TICKS LOL. WIRST IN INDUSTRY PVE CONTENT BRB
|
Specia1 K
State War Academy Caldari State
120
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 05:36:06 -
[205] - Quote
Just stop it. Seriously. |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1991
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 09:53:20 -
[206] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote: Tell you what, you go put together a group that can run Drifter incursions in a way that is profitable at all. Then work out what your income per hour is counting all the time spent reshipping, the fact that the pilots who die get no payout because pods don't count and drifters pod as well, and all the logistical time shipping all those replacement ships to the drifter incursions. Then come back with your 'slightly more dangerous' rubbish again. Currently drifter incursions are at best lvl 1 or 2 mission level income.
Don't worry, I have faith that the Incursion community will figure something out once they are pulled off the teat of the Sansha faucet. It is exciting new group content that is tied deeply into the lore of the Eve universe after all!
I wonder if they will announce something during the o7 show tomorrow? Nah, the news will probably come via a Scope video over the next few weeks or, on the outside, a few months. I mean, the writing is on the wall and CCP Affinity practically said they are going away at some point at Eve Vegas.
|
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
1845
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 10:04:30 -
[207] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote: Tell you what, you go put together a group that can run Drifter incursions in a way that is profitable at all. Then work out what your income per hour is counting all the time spent reshipping, the fact that the pilots who die get no payout because pods don't count and drifters pod as well, and all the logistical time shipping all those replacement ships to the drifter incursions. Then come back with your 'slightly more dangerous' rubbish again. Currently drifter incursions are at best lvl 1 or 2 mission level income.
Don't worry, I have faith that the Incursion community will figure something out once they are pulled off the teat of the Sansha faucet. It is exciting new group content that is tied deeply into the lore of the Eve universe after all! I wonder if they will announce something during the o7 show tomorrow? Nah, the news will probably come via a Scope video over the next few weeks or, on the outside, a few months. I mean, the writing is on the wall and CCP Affinity practically said they are going away at some point at Eve Vegas.
death to blitzing and afk pve, but i guess this is what the pve community was crying for now they will have to actually work for the isk instead of this min/max bull
Recruiting V I R I I Small Gang Nullsec PVP
Drinking rum before 10am makes you a pirate, not an alcoholic | Angel Cartel | Serpentis |
|
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2712
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 10:16:20 -
[208] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote: death to blitzing and afk pve, but i guess this is what the pve community was crying for now they will have to actually work for the isk instead of this min/max bull
You can also go and do drifter incursions and show the incursion community how to do them then. Rather than sitting in your cheap seats and throwing peanuts at people who you think should be going out and losing lots of ships on your behalf.
Basically, put up or shut up. Until you have done better you have no leg to stand on accusing others with regards to lazyness or milking. |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
1845
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 10:31:05 -
[209] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Lan Wang wrote: death to blitzing and afk pve, but i guess this is what the pve community was crying for now they will have to actually work for the isk instead of this min/max bull
You can also go and do drifter incursions and show the incursion community how to do them then. Rather than sitting in your cheap seats and throwing peanuts at people who you think should be going out and losing lots of ships on your behalf. Basically, put up or shut up. Until you have done better you have no leg to stand on accusing others with regards to lazyness or milking.
well you see your comment is kinda meh, the pve'ers are constantly complaining about lack of any new and challenging content in highsec then when you get given it you are not happy because the challenging content may result in you losing a ship.
From the link pedro posted it seems ccp are taking the moans of the pve'ers and actually giving you something more engaging and challenging so what is the issue? because you may lose a ship and a pod or the payout isnt as much as you want?
I dont intend to do drifter incursions because frankly incursions in general are the most boring, lazy and overpaid activity in eve, the lazyness becomes an issue to me when the highsec pve'ers continuously try and remove content from low and null because they feel they shouldnt have to travel to get more challenging content, so when you start trying to remove my content to benefit yourself it becomes my issue and gives me ground to argue :)
Recruiting V I R I I Small Gang Nullsec PVP
Drinking rum before 10am makes you a pirate, not an alcoholic | Angel Cartel | Serpentis |
|
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2712
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 10:47:50 -
[210] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:
well you see your comment is kinda meh, the pve'ers are constantly complaining about lack of any new and challenging content in highsec then when you get given it you are not happy because the challenging content may result in you losing a ship.
From the link pedro posted it seems ccp are taking the moans of the pve'ers and actually giving you something more engaging and challenging so what is the issue? because you may lose a ship and a pod or the payout isnt as much as you want?
I dont intend to do drifter incursions because frankly incursions in general are the most boring, lazy and overpaid activity in eve, the lazyness becomes an issue to me when the highsec pve'ers continuously try and remove content from low and null because they feel they shouldnt have to travel to get more challenging content, so when you start trying to remove my content to benefit yourself it becomes my issue and gives me ground to argue :)
So you want to remove 'my' content (Content I actually haven't run in a while because the communities became toxic but meh), because you have a view on it that doesn't actually reflect reality. And then accuse people of being lazy because they aren't mindlessly feeding ships into the meat grinder that are drifter incursions.
All the while sitting in your ivory tower of 'But I'm not interested in that sort of content, but you should be because it's engaging and challenging & doesn't payout well, even though the reason I claim I'm not interested is because it's boring and lazy & it's too easy money
Reread what you just wrote, seriously, you claim drifter incursions are lazy, overpaid and boring but that people aren't doing them because they are challenging and low payout..... That is exactly why I'm challenging you to actually put up and run your own fleets here. Because you are talking about something you don't have the slightest clue about, and applying blatant double standards. |
|
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
1846
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 11:13:20 -
[211] - Quote
hmmm think you're wrong, i wasnt talking about drifter incursions, i was talking about sansha incursions being lazy, boring and overpaid along with all the other content you guys complain about in highsec then when ccp finally give you something you still aint happy because they dont payout as much as previous content or they pose a risk of loss
The common moans i see from highsec pve'ers on the forums pretty much weekly: "bring lvl 5's to highsec", "we need more group pve", "pirate missions into highsec", "more challenging pve in highsec", so all you guys try to do is remove my content that i risk my ships for because you are too lazy to move out of highsec to do it, because you know its a risk that you aint willing to take, just like losing a ship in drifter incursions.
I also do not sit in my ivory throne and complain about the content which is available to me, if i want to do something different i get off my a$$ and go and find that content, whether it be pirate lvl 4's in nullsec or lvl 5 missions in lowsec to 10/10 deds in sov space, you are the only one sitting on an ivory throne complaining about content not being spoonfed to you properly.
yes i will quite happily fc a fleet of blinged out faction battleships into any incursion, gimme a time and place where this glorious welp can happen, but we both know i could never fc any incursion fleet for many reasons
Drinking rum before 10am makes you a pirate, not an alcoholic | Angel Cartel | Serpentis |
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Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
572
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 11:27:33 -
[212] - Quote
To be fair, no-one takes the tools who ask for lv5 mission in HS or pirate missions in HS seriously. You're applying a blanket judgment on all HS players because of one or two tools/trolls.
Also, realistically if the new incursions doesn't pay out a decent amount (doesn't have to match sansha incursions necessarily) then no one is going to run it, and why should they? People are going to be losing ships and from what I understand theres nothing they can do currently to avoid that.
So less isk, guaranteed ship losses and no more flying around in shiny ships. It's cool, you don't have to run incursions to make plenty of isk in HS. From a Dev perspective, if no one runs content they spent months working on then it's a failure and wasted money and that's something that gets people fired.
A guide (Google Doc) to Hi-Sec blitzing and breaking the 200mill ISK/H barrier
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Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
1846
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 11:37:47 -
[213] - Quote
Anize Oramara wrote:To be fair, no-one takes the tools who ask for lv5 mission in HS or pirate missions in HS seriously. You're applying a blanket judgment on all HS players because of one or two tools/trolls.
Also, realistically if the new incursions doesn't pay out a decent amount (doesn't have to match sansha incursions necessarily) then no one is going to run it, and why should they? People are going to be losing ships and from what I understand theres nothing they can do currently to avoid that.
So less isk, guaranteed ship losses and no more flying around in shiny ships. It's cool, you don't have to run incursions to make plenty of isk in HS. From a Dev perspective, if no one runs content they spent months working on then it's a failure and wasted money and that's something that gets people fired.
but people do take it seriously and its not a few people/trolls it happens quite often and usually ends up in threadnaughts of arguments, its not really a blanket judgement because if these arguments never really happened then ccp would not bother in enhancing the pve experience as requested by the pve'ers leading into the whole batch of plans ccp have detailed in the link already posted.
I agree people wont do drifter incursions or any other new pve if it doesnt pay out as well as sansha incursions and is not mix/maxable or blitzable. so sansha incursions need and will get the nerf bat eventually to bring it in line with other activities.
Drinking rum before 10am makes you a pirate, not an alcoholic | Angel Cartel | Serpentis |
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Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1992
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 11:57:31 -
[214] - Quote
Anize Oramara wrote: Also, realistically if the new incursions doesn't pay out a decent amount (doesn't have to match sansha incursions necessarily) then no one is going to run it, and why should they? People are going to be losing ships and from what I understand theres nothing they can do currently to avoid that.
So less isk, guaranteed ship losses and no more flying around in shiny ships. It's cool, you don't have to run incursions to make plenty of isk in HS. From a Dev perspective, if no one runs content they spent months working on then it's a failure and wasted money and that's something that gets people fired.
Indeed. Probably CCP will take a few weeks or months to play around with new Incursions, to tweak them a bit and let players figure them out a little so they can complete them while it is still reasonably profitable, but no matter what the Sansha version is not long for this world. No one will run the new content if easily farmable, more profitable and completely min-maxed Incursions are on offer at the same time as the more difficult and dynamic new ones which pay less. CCP will not increase the payout of the Drifter ones (they already said they think they are paying too much in last year's CSM minutes and CCP Quants latest numbers don't refute that) so the only choice is to put a bullet in the head of the Sansha ones.
I expect that the new payout structure is what CCP thinks Incursions should be paying, and this perhaps might drift up a bit depending on how much ship loss (and there will always be some) is needed to finished these which I suspect even CCP isn't sure about. Players will now have the choice to engage with this new content for what it is - challenging and new group PvE content, or look elsewhere for easy, no-risk ISK that probably the majority of players current Incursion runners exploit the Sansha for.
Perhaps CCP Affinity's promised devblog will fill us in on some more details of how the transition is going to take place. |
Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
572
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 11:59:43 -
[215] - Quote
Edit: This is in reply to Lan Wang :)
No, people with even a remote sense of reality do not take them seriously. Basing an argument on them is extremely weak. People are tools and trolls and complaining about what people say is silly, especially on a forum behind a mask of anonymity.
Most of the new PvE that CCP is adding is actually pretty good in terms of getting a lot of HS players introduced to PvP content and that should be encouraged. However doing it with a stick is not the right way. You don't have to get 100% of PVE players into PvP, just 10%. You need the rest of the PvE players or your SOE combat probe launchers will cost 100mill instead of 35mill. Same with Meta capital mods and implants. They have their place.
A guide (Google Doc) to Hi-Sec blitzing and breaking the 200mill ISK/H barrier
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2712
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 12:02:55 -
[216] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:
but people do take it seriously and its not a few people/trolls it happens quite often and usually ends up in threadnaughts of arguments, its not really a blanket judgement because if these arguments never really happened then ccp would not bother in enhancing the pve experience as requested by the pve'ers leading into the whole batch of plans ccp have detailed in the link already posted.
I agree people wont do drifter incursions or any other new pve if it doesnt pay out as well as sansha incursions and is not mix/maxable or blitzable. so sansha incursions need and will get the nerf bat eventually to bring it in line with other activities.
Except what you are 'agreeing' with is not what any of us have said. Also Sansha incursions are not actually as lucrative as you think. Ignore the 'proof' certain people are crowing about, since if you looked at the number of people who engage in dedicated PvE of other kinds, you would get equally low percentages of the player base producing just as much income if not vastly more.
But what we have been saying is not that drifter incursions are 'a little less' profitable. What we are saying is that currently you are likely to operate at a serious loss attempting drifter incursions. And this is from actual attempts. At best you might be able to turn a profit somewhere along the lines of lvl 1 missions or combat anomalies, with huge effort and logistical support shipping thousands of hulls and their fittings a day to be consumed in sacrificial pyres.
So, if you want to pretend like people are whining because 'drifters aren't easy farm', go prove us wrong. Come up with a way to kill them efficiently and that doesn't require insane logistics to do so, and lead fleets through it. People will fly them if you can show a way. And since you said you want engaging and challenging PvE content, why aren't YOU doing them. |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
1846
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 12:18:31 -
[217] - Quote
think you need to stop scan reading posts and actually read things before posting...
im not looking for more "engaging content" i move to new areas to do the content thats already provided, i dont sit daily and bore myself out by doing the same activity over and over again while monitoring my isk/hour.
please, ive done incursions and know the isk thats made so dont try and tell us it aint lucrative.
You guys are the ones complaining about the state of highsec pve yet you are asking me to go do incursions and show you how its done, textbook pve'ers spoonfeeding lazyness
Drinking rum before 10am makes you a pirate, not an alcoholic | Angel Cartel | Serpentis |
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Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
572
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 12:33:34 -
[218] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:You guys are the ones complaining about the state of highsec pve yet you are asking me to go do incursions and show you how its done, textbook pve'ers spoonfeeding lazyness Ha
Hahahahaha
A guide (Google Doc) to Hi-Sec blitzing and breaking the 200mill ISK/H barrier
|
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2714
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 12:38:10 -
[219] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:think you need to stop scan reading posts and actually read things before posting... im not looking for more "engaging content" i move to new areas to do the content thats already provided, i dont sit daily and bore myself out by doing the same activity over and over again while monitoring my isk/hour. please, ive done incursions and know the isk thats made so dont try and tell us it aint lucrative. You guys are the ones complaining about the state of highsec pve yet you are asking me to go do incursions and show you how its done, textbook pve'ers spoonfeeding lazyness As expected, you come up with excuses to justify why you are superior, and why we all suck for not doing drifter incursions already. If you actually were serious, you would have taken up the challenge to lead discovery of totally new content. Instead you just sit around acting as if you are superior but when challenged you fail to show anything. |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
1846
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 12:49:25 -
[220] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Lan Wang wrote:think you need to stop scan reading posts and actually read things before posting... im not looking for more "engaging content" i move to new areas to do the content thats already provided, i dont sit daily and bore myself out by doing the same activity over and over again while monitoring my isk/hour. please, ive done incursions and know the isk thats made so dont try and tell us it aint lucrative. You guys are the ones complaining about the state of highsec pve yet you are asking me to go do incursions and show you how its done, textbook pve'ers spoonfeeding lazyness As expected, you come up with excuses to justify why you are superior, and why we all suck for not doing drifter incursions already. If you actually were serious, you would have taken up the challenge to lead discovery of totally new content. Instead you just sit around acting as if you are superior but when challenged you fail to show anything.
What excuses justify im more superior? because i go looking for content in a sandbox rather than expect everything to be placed in front of me? i really dont know where you're going with this, are you just wanting someone else to do drifter incursions or any new pve so they can tell you the best way to do it?
Drinking rum before 10am makes you a pirate, not an alcoholic | Angel Cartel | Serpentis |
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Darkon Gatland
The Ashen Lion Syndicate
22
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 17:54:36 -
[221] - Quote
People are working on it.
Check out the "Defence of the Throne Worlds" Channel. |
Valacus
Streets of Fire
21
|
Posted - 2015.11.18 21:58:15 -
[222] - Quote
They're still going to have to do better with drifter incursions than they are right now. If you don't make it worth while for incursion runners, they simply won't do it. "HAHAHA, but we'll remove sansha incursions!" So people will either grind lvl 4s or just quit the game. If you know anything about players, you know you can't force them to do content, especially by removing other content. That's an asinine way of going about the process. Just make the new content desirable and the rest will take care of itself. |
Black Pedro
Yammerschooner
1996
|
Posted - 2015.11.19 05:58:51 -
[223] - Quote
Valacus wrote:They're still going to have to do better with drifter incursions than they are right now. If you don't make it worth while for incursion runners, they simply won't do it. "HAHAHA, but we'll remove sansha incursions!" So people will either grind lvl 4s or just quit the game. If you know anything about players, you know you can't force them to do content, especially by removing other content. That's an asinine way of going about the process. Just make the new content desirable and the rest will take care of itself. It's the only way in a persistent universe, single economy game. You can't keep buffing the payout of every new bit of content (like say is done in WoW) or eventually everything is paying an absurd amount of money and inflation destroys the economy. Rewards need to be rebalanced and/or content removed.
You have a bit of time still until the Sansha era closes. Maybe you should spend some of it reading Eve Survival to polish up your L4 skills or start browsing Steam for another game then? |
Kaelynne Rose
WTB Somalians
52
|
Posted - 2015.11.19 06:38:06 -
[224] - Quote
Valacus wrote:They're still going to have to do better with drifter incursions than they are right now. If you don't make it worth while for incursion runners, they simply won't do it. "HAHAHA, but we'll remove sansha incursions!" So people will either grind lvl 4s or just quit the game. If you know anything about players, you know you can't force them to do content, especially by removing other content. That's an asinine way of going about the process. Just make the new content desirable and the rest will take care of itself. I remember very very clearly when incursions started and their introduction.
There was no magical grand influx of players into the game because of them. Yet if ccp nerfs them, suddenly there shall be aass exodus cuz those players only keep playomg to run incursions erryday??
Those idiots obviously need saved from incursion comms if they are tbat addicted. Also dude you are ignorant.
No freaking joined eve just to run incursions. So if they go away it aint like ccp is taking a hatchet to these sad peoples only play style. ... Lkke ccp did with ....
AWOX REMOVAL/HARD NERF CANFLIP REMOVAL SUICIDE GANK NERF AFTER GANK NERF FOR OVER 5 YEARS MINER/MISSIONER BUFF STEADY BUFFING LOL CRIMEWATCH FREAKING NINJA SALVAGINING CONCORD BUFFS
Etc etc
You incursion bears aint been nerfed for over 5years. Its your turn. People do play solely to partake in the actions i listed above yet ccp said **** off we are nerfing yo ****
Aint nobody gonna quit eve cuz their only goal in life is to run incursions 5 hours a day. And if so, gtfo |
Anize Oramara
The Arch Dashing Dashers
576
|
Posted - 2015.11.19 07:55:28 -
[225] - Quote
Kaelynne Rose wrote:Valacus wrote:They're still going to have to do better with drifter incursions than they are right now. If you don't make it worth while for incursion runners, they simply won't do it. "HAHAHA, but we'll remove sansha incursions!" So people will either grind lvl 4s or just quit the game. If you know anything about players, you know you can't force them to do content, especially by removing other content. That's an asinine way of going about the process. Just make the new content desirable and the rest will take care of itself. I remember very very clearly when incursions started and their introduction. There was no magical grand influx of players into the game because of them. Yet if ccp nerfs them, suddenly there shall be aass exodus cuz those players only keep playomg to run incursions erryday?? Those idiots obviously need saved from incursion comms if they are tbat addicted. Also dude you are ignorant. No freaking joined eve just to run incursions. So if they go away it aint like ccp is taking a hatchet to these sad peoples only play style. ... Lkke ccp did with .... AWOX REMOVAL/HARD NERF CANFLIP REMOVAL SUICIDE GANK NERF AFTER GANK NERF FOR OVER 5 YEARS MINER/MISSIONER BUFF STEADY BUFFING LOL CRIMEWATCH FREAKING NINJA SALVAGINING CONCORD BUFFS Etc etc You incursion bears aint been nerfed for over 5years. Its your turn. People do play solely to partake in the actions i listed above yet ccp said **** off we are nerfing yo **** Aint nobody gonna quit eve cuz their only goal in life is to run incursions 5 hours a day. And if so, gtfo Your extremely eloquently framed rebuttal aside, a lot of people run incursions to plex their accounts. If it's no longer the easy isk it used to be then yes they will reduce the number of accounts they have or quit all together.
I mean there are lv4 missions that pay out really well, IF you have the skills for it. Incursions don't share that many skills with lv4/burner blitzing unfortunately so we'll see.
A guide (Google Doc) to Hi-Sec blitzing and breaking the 200mill ISK/H barrier
|
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2716
|
Posted - 2015.11.19 10:14:03 -
[226] - Quote
Incursions have actually been nerfed at least twice in the last few years. So learn what you are talking about first. And Null/Low incursions have been buffed, and there is now a dedicated lowsec incursion community (I believe it is the russians) who feature in the last economic dev blogs incursion figures, since those of us who watch incursion journals have been aware they have been running for several months now, ever since the buff to low/null incursion running in the form of larger fleet sizes. Exactly how lucrative it is you would have to ask them, but they sure haven't folded under pressure.
Anyway, drifter incursions have been nerfed with CCP changing how the DD works in such a way that there are 'counters'. Even if those counters do force some niche fits which will be laughable in any PvP environment like low security. CCP, please consider the effect of low security on the drifter incursions and consider increasing fleet size. Also consider that if ship loss is expected working out a better way to do payout, since anyone who loses their ship doesn't get payout unless they can reship fast enough back into site, which is silly. |
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
40853
|
Posted - 2015.11.19 11:18:28 -
[227] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Incursions have actually been nerfed at least twice in the last few years. Really? What nerfs were those recently?
In Hyperion (Aug 2014), all incursions were buffed: https://public-crest.eveonline.com/killmails/50245545/3ec3d27e33272ad851e485b6c2e860e0f34e5260/
In Inferno (April 2012), incursions were buffed to provide higher rewards than they provided when rolled out in 2010 (no devblog I can find). After monitoring, the buff was found to be too good, so the buffs were rolled back slightly in June.
I don't have anything against how people earn their ISK or incursions. Good luck to whatever method others use. I'm just interested in what nerfs there have been.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2716
|
Posted - 2015.11.19 22:37:06 -
[228] - Quote
The revamp in Hyperion basically didn't affect highsec incursions which are the ones everyone complained about, however utterly hammered scout sites as runnable content. Scouts used to be used as fleet training even thought the payout was miserable. Hyperion made them utterly laughable as they were mainly jamming frigates. The Low & Null buff I referred to started with hyperion though, however I don't think you are particularly targeting low & null incursions anyway. Assaults also have never been out of balance, and the NCN wall referred to in Hyperion was making them far to tedious and finicky to run.
I sure don't remember any 'higher' reward with inferno, I do remember some massive slams to vanguards however. I don't have blogs handy on them either. But there most certainly was the great vanguard nerf, as between the nerfs to vanguards a couple of smaller communities actually folded. And Vanguards were actually the excessive moneymaker at the time.
A better income analysis showing dedicated hours of incursion runners (then remember most people spend 50% of their time on wait list). Hours of lvl 6 WH escalation running. Hours of null 10/10 and anom grinding. And how much income each of those categories actually makes would be something I'd be curious to see. But the figures in the economic blog were pointless with regards to saying if incursions earn to much since they included the miner who killed a 1.0 belt rat as 'doing PvE' so give us no clue how many people are running dedicated income earning and how many people are doing an abstract belt rat or single mission per log in. |
Valacus
Streets of Fire
23
|
Posted - 2015.11.19 23:00:46 -
[229] - Quote
Black Pedro wrote:Valacus wrote:They're still going to have to do better with drifter incursions than they are right now. If you don't make it worth while for incursion runners, they simply won't do it. "HAHAHA, but we'll remove sansha incursions!" So people will either grind lvl 4s or just quit the game. If you know anything about players, you know you can't force them to do content, especially by removing other content. That's an asinine way of going about the process. Just make the new content desirable and the rest will take care of itself. It's the only way in a persistent universe, single economy game. You can't keep buffing the payout of every new bit of content (like say is done in WoW) or eventually everything is paying an absurd amount of money and inflation destroys the economy. Rewards need to be rebalanced and/or content removed. You have a bit of time still until the Sansha era closes. Maybe you should spend some of it reading Eve Survival to polish up your L4 skills or start browsing Steam for another game then?
They don't have to buff Drifter incursions beyond Sansha, but right now they're not even remotely close to Sansha incursions. Why would you run Drifter when Sansha pays more and doesn't require someone to blow up for it? Even if I lose just a cheap ship, I still have to run home, get a new one, fit it out, and come back. That's time wasted on top of the lame payout. "Oh, but just carry like a zillion with you!" Oh yea, I'll get right on that. It won't take any time at all to haul a huge bag of ships around just so I can do content. |
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
40860
|
Posted - 2015.11.19 23:44:39 -
[230] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:The Low & Null buff I referred to started with hyperion though, however I don't think you are particularly targeting low & null incursions anyway But what nerfs have CCP implemented on highsec incursions, that you mentioned earlier?
I can't see any in any of the patch notes or release information going back, but I'm no expert. Nothing against incursions as a source of income for people.
I'm just interested in what the nerfs have been and the original info from CCP about them.
In terms of inferno buffs, the original devblog link seems to be broken (and doesn't appear to be in the devblog list going right through 2012 individually), but this is the info on rolling back the changes slightly that occurred in June 2012:
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/incursions-update/
That was just a rollback of the buffs a bit because they were initially too good not an overall nerf, as far as I can find from other sources.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2015.11.20 01:22:36 -
[231] - Quote
Kaelynne Rose wrote:Valacus wrote:They're still going to have to do better with drifter incursions than they are right now. If you don't make it worth while for incursion runners, they simply won't do it. "HAHAHA, but we'll remove sansha incursions!" So people will either grind lvl 4s or just quit the game. If you know anything about players, you know you can't force them to do content, especially by removing other content. That's an asinine way of going about the process. Just make the new content desirable and the rest will take care of itself. I remember very very clearly when incursions started and their introduction. There was no magical grand influx of players into the game because of them. Yet if ccp nerfs them, suddenly there shall be aass exodus cuz those players only keep playomg to run incursions erryday?? Those idiots obviously need saved from incursion comms if they are tbat addicted. Also dude you are ignorant. No freaking joined eve just to run incursions. So if they go away it aint like ccp is taking a hatchet to these sad peoples only play style. ... Lkke ccp did with .... AWOX REMOVAL/HARD NERF CANFLIP REMOVAL SUICIDE GANK NERF AFTER GANK NERF FOR OVER 5 YEARS MINER/MISSIONER BUFF STEADY BUFFING LOL CRIMEWATCH FREAKING NINJA SALVAGINING CONCORD BUFFS Etc etc You incursion bears aint been nerfed for over 5years. Its your turn. People do play solely to partake in the actions i listed above yet ccp said **** off we are nerfing yo **** Aint nobody gonna quit eve cuz their only goal in life is to run incursions 5 hours a day. And if so, gtfo You need to look at the eve offline and look at the concurrent players. You'll notice that it peaked during the incursion release. So clearly incursions brought a lot of life to the game. Post that patch CCP has been mostly focusing on pvp aspects either directly via nerfs/buffs of ships/components or semi directly via fozziesov.
|
Kinete Jenius
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2015.11.20 01:46:36 -
[232] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Nevyn Auscent wrote:The Low & Null buff I referred to started with hyperion though, however I don't think you are particularly targeting low & null incursions anyway But what nerfs have CCP implemented to incursions, that you mentioned earlier? I can't see any in any of the patch notes or release information going back, but I'm no expert. Nothing against incursions as a source of income for people. I'm just interested in what the nerfs have been and the original info from CCP about them. In terms of inferno buffs, the original devblog link seems to be broken (and doesn't appear to be in the devblog list going right through 2012 individually), but this is the info on rolling back the changes slightly that occurred in June 2012: http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/incursions-update/ That was just a rollback of the buffs a bit because they were initially too good not an overall nerf, as far as I can find from other sources. For example, the wikipedia page on expansions indicates that rewards were buffed in Inferno: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expansions_of_Eve_Online#Inferno There are other third-party gaming websites that also refer to buffs in Inferno. You used to be able to blitz sites and the NPCs were much easier to deal with. Those were probably the biggest nerfs effectively as while pay was the same the time between payout increased dramatically. There's been various tweaks done by CCP over the years that didn't involve payout but did decrease overall isk per hour.
So if you're just looking for straight payout decreases I can see why you're having issues finding more then a few minor looking nerfs.
The first link is talking about rolling back some of the nerfs that CCP hammered incursions with. THey made it so influence built so fast it was tough getting HQ fleets to run. They also overkilled on the payout nerf especially on VGs. So they rolled that back too. Although you can see in that dev post that CCP is talking about the NPC and trigger nerf I stated earlier.
That Wikipedia link makes me scratch my head as it was inferno that released the nerfs to incursions not buffs. Someone got that badly wrong. Your first link clearly shows that is the case as it's commenting about rolling back the inferno nerfs and the date is post inferno. Not sure if someone just screwed up when they edited that section of the wiki or if it's malicious. |
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari End of Life
40861
|
Posted - 2015.11.20 03:16:16 -
[233] - Quote
Kinete Jenius wrote:[quote=Scipio Artelius]You used to be able to blitz sites and the NPCs were much easier to deal with. Those were probably the biggest nerfs effectively as while pay was the same the time between payout increased dramatically. There's been various tweaks done by CCP over the years that didn't involve payout but did decrease overall isk per hour.
So if you're just looking for straight payout decreases I can see why you're having issues finding more then a few minor looking nerfs.
The first link is talking about rolling back some of the nerfs that CCP hammered incursions with. THey made it so influence built so fast it was tough getting HQ fleets to run. They also overkilled on the payout nerf especially on VGs. So they rolled that back too. Although you can see in that dev post that CCP is talking about the NPC and trigger nerf I stated earlier.
That Wikipedia link makes me scratch my head as it was inferno that released the nerfs to incursions not buffs. Someone got that badly wrong. Your first link clearly shows that is the case as it's commenting about rolling back the inferno nerfs and the date is post inferno. Not sure if someone just screwed up when they edited that section of the wiki or if it's malicious. Thanks. I'll go look for the patch notes on those, but excellent info, thanks.
Come Win At Eve - Join The Vendunari
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Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
3
|
Posted - 2015.11.28 21:07:34 -
[234] - Quote
will ccp give any clue on news or its all up to the players? |
Dun Bar
Inner Shadow Did he say Jump
30
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Posted - 2015.11.30 05:51:52 -
[235] - Quote
You can run the sites have at least 1 person per drifter, everyone in crucifers with 3 TD's each. tag drifters, each person is assigned a tag. orbit a can 5000, doing the small sites we had zero losses, in the mediums we would lose a few but at 10mil a pop we had them stocked so they reshipped and came back in right away. When DD is about to go off and he breaks lock, u have enough time to re lock and get TD's on him to make it miss. |
Daniela Doran
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
276
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Posted - 2015.11.30 06:08:02 -
[236] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:Burn Amarr - drifter version. I hope that drifters will camp gates , and kill people on them.
I think the drifters will only attack those that attacks them and that may includes incursions so no more free relaxing trips for incursioners when traveling from site to site. |
Vollhov
Viziam Amarr Empire
400
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Posted - 2015.12.04 19:05:38 -
[237] - Quote
Now you will fly to a new invasion
- The ISK and LP rewards for Drifter Incursions have been increased.
http://community.eveonline.com/news/patch-notes/patch-notes-for-december-release/
Thanks you -í-íP Falcon "that helped to quit EVE"
Saint Nadalya
Vostroyans firstborn
W40k Forever
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Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
999
|
Posted - 2015.12.04 20:43:55 -
[238] - Quote
Scipio Artelius wrote:Kinete Jenius wrote:[quote=Scipio Artelius]You used to be able to blitz sites and the NPCs were much easier to deal with. Those were probably the biggest nerfs effectively as while pay was the same the time between payout increased dramatically. There's been various tweaks done by CCP over the years that didn't involve payout but did decrease overall isk per hour.
So if you're just looking for straight payout decreases I can see why you're having issues finding more then a few minor looking nerfs.
The first link is talking about rolling back some of the nerfs that CCP hammered incursions with. THey made it so influence built so fast it was tough getting HQ fleets to run. They also overkilled on the payout nerf especially on VGs. So they rolled that back too. Although you can see in that dev post that CCP is talking about the NPC and trigger nerf I stated earlier.
That Wikipedia link makes me scratch my head as it was inferno that released the nerfs to incursions not buffs. Someone got that badly wrong. Your first link clearly shows that is the case as it's commenting about rolling back the inferno nerfs and the date is post inferno. Not sure if someone just screwed up when they edited that section of the wiki or if it's malicious. Thanks. I'll go look for the patch notes on those, but excellent info, thanks.
Yep DDD days kill Deltol to spawn next wave repeat 2 more times and in 2 min time you earned 10mill isk current site time is 5min.
Along with that CCP in their infinite wisdom nerf ed isk payment and fiddle with NPC ship spawns and or tanks...that in return almost killed incursions their own content from 3-4 high sec incursions at any given time only one could be run there was simply no enough ppl interested enough to run them.
AND all the weeps.from blue sec foaming on their mouth nose and eyelids from rage how dare CCP to give their"grunt monkeys" and "renters scrubs" option to earn isk beyond their borders (aperently when you have all dunk you can threat ppl as garbage).
Battleship AU nerfs nered income as well. |
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
799
|
Posted - 2015.12.04 20:55:41 -
[239] - Quote
Same here. It isnt even orbit can. It is let drifters orbit you. The hives are a technical challenge, so they are fun. Also unpredictable. So fun.
Drifter incursion? Mission running has more fun. The fact that running l2 missions in an op absolution is more technical says alot. Same with burner missions and one trick pony mish in that. Those even tell you what to fit....
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
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Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
4
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Posted - 2016.01.22 04:46:17 -
[240] - Quote
So its still broken till some fay caboos CCP say its fix. |
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Indahmawar Fazmarai
4528
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Posted - 2016.01.22 21:05:51 -
[241] - Quote
Astrid Farnsworth wrote:So its still broken till some fay caboos CCP say its fix.
They're not broken. They just are being ignored.
CCP Seagull: "EVE should be a universe where the infrastructure you build and fight over is as player driven and dynamic as the EVE market is now".
62% of players: "We're not interested. May we have Plan B, please?"
CCP Seagull: "What Plan B?"
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Jenn aSide
Ascendent. Test Alliance Please Ignore
13422
|
Posted - 2016.01.22 23:10:02 -
[242] - Quote
Drifter Incursions are what Incursions should have been. Lucrative but tough and with a cost, something serious Group PVErs only would have liked. Instead we got these easily farmable Sansha Incursions which spawn entitled communities of fair-weather only incursion runners (who, despite claiming "it's about the community" fled the content en mass when CCP balanced the rewards the 1st time).
There is no hope for Drifter Incursions so long as the current Sansha one's exist.
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
2923
|
Posted - 2016.01.23 06:33:33 -
[243] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote: There is no hope for Drifter Incursions so long as the current Sansha one's exist.
Go on then, actually run them yourself and show the rest of us how it's done and how they are actually lucrative but practical to run. You want to go on about 'fair weather' people, you need to actually put up yourself, or you are even worse than the people you are complaining about and not even prepared to try. |
Caleb Seremshur
Gladiators of Rage RAZOR Alliance
727
|
Posted - 2016.01.23 10:54:44 -
[244] - Quote
Nevyn Auscent wrote:Jenn aSide wrote: There is no hope for Drifter Incursions so long as the current Sansha one's exist.
Go on then, actually run them yourself and show the rest of us how it's done and how they are actually lucrative but practical to run. You want to go on about 'fair weather' people, you need to actually put up yourself, or you are even worse than the people you are complaining about and not even prepared to try.
I thought the whole point of the drifter incursions was to create npcs that could waste peoplea money. And they would expand and lock down systems/entosis things in order to derive a response.
In other words they were a mechanical antagonist purely instituted to waste our time.
Veteran and solo/small gang PVP advocate.
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Indahmawar Fazmarai
4528
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Posted - 2016.01.23 11:00:00 -
[245] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:(...)
There is no hope for Drifter Incursions so long as the current Sansha one's exist.
Why? "Risk" is the decisison maker factor in risk/reward assessment. Removing a certain degree of reward won't push people to take a higher risk in order to keep the higher reward, but may drive them away from the game by lack of reward for their chosen risk. Whereas higher risk for a marginally higher reward leads to failed features being abandoned by PvErs.
CCP Seagull: "EVE should be a universe where the infrastructure you build and fight over is as player driven and dynamic as the EVE market is now".
62% of players: "We're not interested. May we have Plan B, please?"
CCP Seagull: "What Plan B?"
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Olivia Moon
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2016.01.23 13:24:00 -
[246] - Quote
Just recently resubbed and get into digging up some incursion info and training T2 weapons on the way for sansha. Drifter's is actually one that have been known to me recently. And have been out for almost a year when the early 2015, The Scope was still about Drifters emergence and then it developed into conflict with Amarr Empire, I honestly had no thought that it would become the second incursion coming into the game!
Actually I should say that the lore is really doing a wonderful job in bring new content into the universe. Or I should say I have been really into the lore since day 1 in EVE. Did a lot of research about the Jovians and Drifters and shattered wormholes stuff. Can't wait to fight those beasts! |
Astrid Farnsworth
Broke and Famous
4
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Posted - 2016.01.23 23:33:55 -
[247] - Quote
What ccp need to do its have it whit a higher reward. And then you will actually see people trying to run it. The reason i think is broken for us capsuler dont have any idea how to get the driffters . And also ccp dont give us any clue about it, how to kill them. |
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