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Karoth Tyu
FATAL REVELATIONS
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Posted - 2006.09.02 23:45:00 -
[31]
Sounds like someone had a bad trip thru HED-GP.
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Siege
Minmatar Siegecraft Bounty Hunting
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Posted - 2006.09.02 23:49:00 -
[32]
Nah, I think he just doesn't want to do any PvP, but wants to get all the benefits that controlling the open PvP areas offer to you.
He wants to play 'Veldspar Tycoon'
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Ozzie Asrail
Hybrid Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.09.02 23:51:00 -
[33]
I love gatecamps, some of my most fun fights have been at gates.
Nothing like all sitting cloaked with enemies all around, all quiet on TS while waiting for the regroup and all hell to break loose.
Gates are choakpoints, they are supposed to be a place where PvP happens. -----
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Miri Tirzan
Caldari Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.09.03 00:21:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Miri Tirzan on 03/09/2006 00:22:28 Actually, what the Op is suggesting does not sound that bad. All it means is that anyone coming though on Auto Pilot is going to get wacked for not paying attention. Pilots that are paying attention can decide not to fully enter that system.
Dont agree with the warp disrupters not working, but I do think that it is game consistant if you cannot fire weapons at a ship within x km of the gate due to the spacial disturbance caused by the gate.
Just to make it fair, the ships within this zone cannot target anyone and drones launched are distroyed. The cloaked timer can go away (though this may be bad for covert ops ships).
This way the campers have all the advantages but it is not a given that everyone though will be killed. This also lets the camper and the campee reach a fiscial solution, if the campers are pirates, or someone willing to pay an alliance for entrance into their space.
This does not reflect the opinion of my Corp or Alliance. svetlana - "whining gets you stuff. that is why humans got to the top of the food chain and all the other animals got nerfed."
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ArcticShadow
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Posted - 2006.09.03 00:31:00 -
[35]
So you wouldnt mind having travel times, even with instas, doubled?
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Sorja
E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2006.09.03 00:54:00 -
[36]
Very interesting idea.
It's indeed simple and would help with many issues like lag upon loading a system when jumping on the ennemy. A fleet would have the opportunity to jump in without emergency warps, that would be a whole different gaming experience.
With such a system, it would be easier to coordinate an attack, assigning each pilot his orders, many won't like it, but I don't see anything wrong with it since it works both ways.
There would be drawbacks though, like tons of pilots flocking near gates, but is it really different from what we have today?
New larger bubbles would be needed to encompass the gate and all of the safety zone plus 5km so interdictors and warp bubbles can still be effective.
I think this idea needs a closer look before being discarded (the pre-pubescent flamers on these boards need to be discarded asap though, they are getting annoying).
____________________ Darko1107 > does anything in ascn space have tech II fittings? Quillan Rage > Iron ships |
Arkanor
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2006.09.03 00:55:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Baldour Ngarr
Originally by: Akerria
Originally by: Yello1 Its where you enter the playing field without the ability to see what you are getting into.
Ummm.... It's called scouting first using an alt.
And your alt escapes how?
My main complaint is that the current system encourages (forces?) use of alts.
TBH there's enough tools available already, if you're going to make a jump, sh** or get off the pot.
Originally by: Ghosthowl WoW = hardcore paladins smashin dat face.
Originally by: HippoKing I just cried, you know that? |
Infinity Ziona
Feet Corporation
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Posted - 2006.09.03 01:15:00 -
[38]
Well as much as I am forced to gate camp I think the OP is correct. It is spawn camping, a type of play which is illegal or at least frowned apon greatly in other games.
While people may say 'thats what makes EvE great' thats not true imo. The thing that makes EvE great is its variability and choice; I dont see much choice when it comes to gate evasion or gate camping.
While EvE should be unfair, it shouldnt be so unfair that its impossible for a single person to act once in combat to avoid death.
I think this is the opposite of the insta problem. Instas on one hand give you almost 100% protection while massive gatecamps give you 100% victory and 100% protection.
Both of these need to be addressed. We need more vulnerability time, less ability to overpoweringly gank while being completely protected.
Solutions for this problem:
1. The faster and more violent a ships death, the more likely loot will be destroyed. 20 ships instapopping 1 ship - 0 loot.
2. Each additional lock on a targetted ship requires % more locking time. The 20th ship locking will take a looong time to get a lock due to interference from the other locks.
Click Me
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Cattraknoff
Caldari Sha Kharn Corp Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.09.03 01:39:00 -
[39]
Sentry guns protect the carebears in empire.
0.0 isn't for wusses, well not the uber-wusses, just wuss-lite.
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Miss Overlord
Gallente Garoun Investment Bank
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Posted - 2006.09.03 01:43:00 -
[40]
leave the gates but bring jump clone usage down to 12 hours instead of 24 hours.
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Infinity Ziona
Feet Corporation
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Posted - 2006.09.03 02:53:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Miss Overlord leave the gates but bring jump clone usage down to 12 hours instead of 24 hours.
Jump clones already contribute to EvE being too small. Its supposed to be a galaxy, not a pond.
If you live in 0.0 and get those benefits then you also get the penalties and one of those is longer travel and less stations and the possibility of being killed more often.
Fixing the gate camps would be superior to further carebearifying EvE imo.
Click Me
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Sirial Soulfly
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Posted - 2006.09.03 03:08:00 -
[42]
Good idea, fully agree with the OP.
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Powder Monkey
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Posted - 2006.09.03 03:13:00 -
[43]
Boo hoo, go back to WOW and your ******* battlegrounds and PVE (normal) servers.
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Ecky X
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Posted - 2006.09.03 03:21:00 -
[44]
I don't think there need to be any fixes. If you have no friends and go wandering through 0.0, you are asking for trouble. I don't ever run into gatecamps because I'm in an alliance, and friends don't let friends get gatecamped.
There is a reason Eve has corps and alliances.
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F'nog
Amarr Celestial Horizon Corp. Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.09.03 03:59:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Baldour Ngarr
Originally by: Akerria
Originally by: Yello1 Its where you enter the playing field without the ability to see what you are getting into.
Ummm.... It's called scouting first using an alt.
And your alt escapes how?
If you're in a noob ship or shuttle and have a free clone, who cares if he dies?
Originally by: DB Preacher
The only time BoB's backs are to the wall is when backdoor bandit is in local.
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ElrondMD
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Posted - 2006.09.03 04:24:00 -
[46]
Edited by: ElrondMD on 03/09/2006 04:24:07 I dont see how gatecamping can be related to Spawn camping.
Spawn camping allows you to kill a player whos making a involuntry entrance to that area, they are spawning, they have no choice. Gate Jumping? If you are jumping into 0.0 space by yourself, in a ship that is not able to beat scramblers, why shouldnt you die?
If 10 people are willing to spend their day on a gate protecting their space. why on earth shouldnt they be killing the vast majority of solo traffic? If those 10 ships found you anywhere else you'de be dead too.
In a game as big as Eve there must be chokepoints, or the only fight you would ever get would be agaisnt carebear miners or in giant fleet ops that live alot to be desired at the moment.
You want to get into enemy space? Bring a force worthy of such an incursion and earn your right to be there. Otherwise stick to your high sec and low sec system and buy a box of tissues.
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DefJam101
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Posted - 2006.09.03 04:34:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Powder Monkey Boo hoo, go back to WOW and your ******* battlegrounds and PVE (normal) servers.
Will you guys stop just bashing WoW or some other game in order to make EVE seems better? Your a bad example for EVE community, since we don't need to bash other games to make EVE a "superior" MMO, it just is. So stop bashing other MMOs to put EVE on top, it's kinda pathetic....
To OP:Gates are meant to be chokepoints, it should always be dangerous to jump into a new system, regardless.
Plus, if there were no gatecamps the entire economy woudl crash, EVE is about more than blowing ships up, or running missions :D
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Skawl
GeoTech
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Posted - 2006.09.03 04:37:00 -
[48]
planetside had something similar with it's warp in points, other fantasy MMOs have similar with their towns. You just end up with people stepping over the magic line and back for hours on end and not much else.
Much better would be a way to scan a gate to see what ships are within a couple of hundred k of the gate.
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JoeT
Amarr Devils collective
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Posted - 2006.09.03 04:43:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Yello1 ROLFMAO
So you think thats good game play? Shooting at something that doesnt get to shoot back? How lousy is your self esteem that that sounds like a good time to you?
My idea does nothing to detract from the gate camper. He still gets to fight it out with the ships that are big enough to fight. He loses the chance to pod n00bs or people trying to get from A to B in their shuttle craft. Hardly a detraction from game play, is it? And who knows, maybe the Shuttle will still kick in his stabs and shield boosts and try to make a run for it.
How is that detracting from what "Eve is"????
Making play FUN is bad? Gimme a break.
And btw, its simple enough to make a rationalization that explains why - the stargates are big mojo, they interfere with warp bubbles and weapons systems.
O'Rly?
I dont happen to find mining fun. Shooting people is. Not everyone goes to belts. Everyone goes thur a gate. Targets are at a gate. So are senties. They shoot. I shoot. Fun :) Take a nice break and read this:
Linkage
in case your too lazy and want to complain its not fun cause you have to click on stuff:
ò Enter space with security status below 0.5 at own risk. You can NEVER expect to be safe in unsecured space regardless of sentry guns, CONCORD presence, and such.
ò Don't expect CONCORD to keep you immune to attacks or ship losses. Like in the real world, law enforcers often arrive too late at the scene of the crime, and even though they able to punish the criminal, they can't always prevent the crime.
ò Don't rely on Sentry Guns to keep you a 100% safe. Especially not when traveling in unsecured space. There are several tactical ways to avoid sentry gun fire, which are NOT considered to be an exploit.
---
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smeggy
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.09.03 19:50:00 -
[50]
There are plenty of ways to get past a gate camp. Low sec is as it implies. It is low security a type of badlands where you have no cover from the cowards of concorde. 0.0 is anarcic (spelling not ftw). However there are people about in low sec who try to break these camps. I know I have been killed at gates before however Ive broken up enough gate camps to know that they are not always effective and in many ways are fun to break up. If your not able to operate in low sec thats fine there are plenty of areas for you to operate with no problem at all.
Dont ask for a change that isnt necessary and has been a major part of eve game play for 3 years. You want to shut down gate camps then a lot of players of eve would have nothing to do that includes pirates and hunters. I am not normally the one to say adapt, however again I will say if your not ready for low security risk then dont come out to a .4 system where your not able to be under the control of eve cops.
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DukDodgerz
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Posted - 2006.09.03 20:10:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Baldour Ngarr He is actually suggesting a viable idea. You jump into a system, there's guys camping it, you can EITHER turn round and jump back, OR, stay and fight/run.
It's just that CCP don't want that sort of a game. You are not given the option of avoiding trouble in EVE, except by staying out of low-sec altogether. As soon as you break for 0.4 space, you accept the fact that someone might gank you without you being remotely able to avoid him.
you are right, OP's suggestion has merit (needs tweaking), but CCP wants a game catered to gank and grief and will have it.
sadly the niche of gamers that like that play style (gank/grief) is small, and will never see the subscriptions as high as games that do not allow gank/grief.
It is CCP's choice to cater to a minority 'niche' or to the majority as other companies have.
FRODO HAS FAILED; BUSH HAS THE RING!!! The HippoKing spots a new post |
Mortania
Minmatar Carbide Industries
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Posted - 2006.09.03 20:24:00 -
[52]
Can people stop saying it's been like this for 3 years. It hasn't.
The situation now is out of hand. On both sides. Everyone now has instas which breaks things and everyone now instaganks which breaks things, both things need to be fixed.
The OP is suggesting a way for people to make gates consensual or find a way around, which seems like choice, which is EVE's strength.
If people really want easy non-consenual kills (and that's generally what gate camps are), there are many other options, but it should take work, just as it should take work for people in 0.0 and low sec to travel through rough areas.
If you really believe what we have is fine, then I can't help but suspect that you are letting your playstyle cloud your judgement (either being an insta lover or a spawn camper).
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tookar
Amarr Krookid
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Posted - 2006.09.03 20:34:00 -
[53]
I like the idea if we could also have a modules that stops people going through gates! no retreating back through the gate but a time to see who killed you and have a bnit of a lauugh before you die :) tbh a module that stops people jumping would be awesome on its own :)
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Trista Kriegs
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Posted - 2006.09.04 09:39:00 -
[54]
I think a better solution is to give people information rather than stop gate camping.
Add a filter to the map to show the number of players within 300km of a gate in the system. Systems with large numbers within this zone would be brighter and when the mouse hovers over the system you would get a list of the the gate names and the number of players within the 300km zone next to them.
There is still the oppotunity to gate camp but the traveller has a fighting chance.
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Pesadel0
Vagabundos
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Posted - 2006.09.04 09:53:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Mortania Can people stop saying it's been like this for 3 years. It hasn't.
The situation now is out of hand. On both sides. Everyone now has instas which breaks things and everyone now instaganks which breaks things, both things need to be fixed.
The OP is suggesting a way for people to make gates consensual or find a way around, which seems like choice, which is EVE's strength.
If people really want easy non-consensual kills (and that's generally what gate camps are), there are many other options, but it should take work, just as it should take work for people in 0.0 and low sec to travel through rough areas.
If you really believe what we have is fine, then I can't help but suspect that you are letting your playstyle cloud your judgement (either being an insta lover or a spawn camper).
WTF "non-consensual" you got to be kidding rigth? Half of the people i kill in gates and belts are "non-consensual" do you want to bring PVP flags to eve too,scrap that 99.9% of them donŠt want to PVP.
EVE strength is in FREEDOM in freedom to do what ever you want ,low sec and 0.0 are dangerous areas you get there POP, you get popped simple as that.
I donŠt mean to sound rash or anything but the OP is just another one that got killed and now wants to make things more easy for him ,and harder for the pirates.
Go back to *insert here elves and flowers Game" and leave my EVE alone.
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Riho
Mercenary Forces
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Posted - 2006.09.04 10:29:00 -
[56]
id like a skill and a module.... mybe HI slot.. to scan gates on the other side :P but i think it would be quite hard to put in the game.
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Mortania
Minmatar Carbide Industries
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Posted - 2006.09.04 20:37:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Pesadel0
Originally by: Mortania Can people stop saying it's been like this for 3 years. It hasn't.
The situation now is out of hand. On both sides. Everyone now has instas which breaks things and everyone now instaganks which breaks things, both things need to be fixed.
The OP is suggesting a way for people to make gates consensual or find a way around, which seems like choice, which is EVE's strength.
If people really want easy non-consensual kills (and that's generally what gate camps are), there are many other options, but it should take work, just as it should take work for people in 0.0 and low sec to travel through rough areas.
If you really believe what we have is fine, then I can't help but suspect that you are letting your playstyle cloud your judgement (either being an insta lover or a spawn camper).
WTF "non-consensual" you got to be kidding rigth? Half of the people i kill in gates and belts are "non-consensual" do you want to bring PVP flags to eve too,scrap that 99.9% of them donŠt want to PVP.
EVE strength is in FREEDOM in freedom to do what ever you want ,low sec and 0.0 are dangerous areas you get there POP, you get popped simple as that.
I donŠt mean to sound rash or anything but the OP is just another one that got killed and now wants to make things more easy for him ,and harder for the pirates.
Go back to *insert here elves and flowers Game" and leave my EVE alone.
You understand the whole empire vs. 0.0 thing right? Why CCP set this up in the first place? To allow for a wide range of play. CCP wants areas of consensual PvP combat only. Again to allow for the FREEDOM you so crave for. Just because your FREEDOM includes spawn camping, it doesn't mean that it's the game everyone wants to play.
If it were always PvP all the time anywhere at any moment, you'd have a game like Neocron, which is gone precisely because they didn't get the balance right.
Don't get me wrong, low sec should be dangerous, but it shouldn't be trivial for gatecampers or travellers. The system as it is now is broken for both sides. For travellers with instas it's pretty much trivial to travel, for gatecampers it's trivial to pop people without instas.
There is no risk for either party. Which is lame. Makes both sides carebears and that sucks.
The OP is on to something with creating a zone which allows for reaction and thought, something that is sorely lacking as things stand now. And isn't that what we are here for to engage our brains and enjoy ourselves?
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Kirex
Gallente Vale Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2006.09.04 20:47:00 -
[58]
Who are you to say somebodys game play is horrible? What if I tell you carebearing is horrible?
Click above for my killboard stats. |
RedLion
Caldari Gloria Victis
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Posted - 2006.09.04 20:49:00 -
[59]
I don't see gatecamping as a big factor in EVE.
Compared to other games that have a much higher load time on zones, and much shorter duels, then we start talking about the unfair.
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TZeer
Eve Defence Force Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.09.04 20:54:00 -
[60]
This is the second clueless suggestion I have seen today...
If u are afraid for your stuff, stick to empire space.
1: Don`t fly anything u cant afford to loose
2: Don`t fly anything u cant afford to loose
3: Check map
4: Don`t fly anything u cant afford to loose
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