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CCP Phantom
C C P C C P Alliance
3954
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Posted - 2014.01.16 23:30:00 -
[1] - Quote
As you may have noticed, CCP (and especially there Team Game of Drones) is very interested in your opinion, preferences and behavior regarding Science & Industry in EVE.
As part of this investigation you can take part in a survey which was created to specifically support this investigation. Please take part in this survey which can be found here.
Please use the following thread for further discussions and feedback regarding the survey: Survey for Science & Industry - Your opinion matters!
Thank you! CCP Phantom - Senior Community Representative - Volunteer Manager |
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Far Wanderer
Bank of Far
0
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Posted - 2014.02.07 06:08:00 -
[2] - Quote
Thank you for providing a link to the survey! Very much appreciated. |
H3llHound
Koshaku Gentlemen's Agreement
12
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Posted - 2014.02.11 22:54:00 -
[3] - Quote
have the results from the survey been looked at already/prioritized? |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
225
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Posted - 2014.02.28 23:48:00 -
[4] - Quote
Two key things for me:
Tidy up the S&I interface:
It would be great to standardize the S&I interface so that PI, Manufacture and invention etc used the same style. e.g. when setting up the schematics in P&I you set a number of runs (or unlimited to just run as many times as possible). Factories default to feed products back to the storage that the precursor goods came from. The ability to save factory layouts as templates would be great.
Create real S&I missions
Moving dolls and 'special deliveries' is a bit lame. Real S&I missions that require creating specific items from PI, inventing BPC's from BPO's, reverse engineering items for empires, Epic Arc chains of S&I missions to create required items for Empire projects (stargates maybe?). Different reward mechanisms like moon mining rights tags that give an hours mining (or whatever time is appropriate) to be gathered up and used as and when or access tags that allow trips through empire gates into the new regions of space when they come online. |
Allison A'vani
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
61
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Posted - 2014.03.07 21:22:00 -
[5] - Quote
You all need to swallow the fact that it is awful old python and redo the POS system. Most end game S&I uses POSes, any serious inverter, manufacturer, or researcher uses POSes due to the time bonuses (except for the rapid and advanced assembly arrays, they are literally useless due to the increased material cost). The entire t2 production process, POSes, moon miner mining, simple reactions, and then advances reactions, inventing on the t1 BPCs (t2 BPOs are an entirely different discussion), only the end construction components are even thought to be made in a station due to how fast they produce, and t2 ships are all also produced in stations due to the increase ME cost of using an advanced ship assembly array.
Not to mention the fact that supers and titans have to be produced in a POS.
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Cpt Swagg
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
8
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Posted - 2014.04.14 10:28:00 -
[6] - Quote
hi |
Vapuk Kripit
Straight Luck No Skill
0
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Posted - 2014.04.16 08:09:00 -
[7] - Quote
I believe a major priority should be to address POCO taxes.
The emergence of griefer-like taxation levels in HISEC is starting to make PI unviable for noobs like me starting out in EVE.
This is an ISK hungry game - and it is a very attractive option to sink a lot of time and effort in to getting a PI operation underway so that new players can enjoy the broad range of gaming experiences EVE offers.
But if that investment can be quixotically put at risk when a griefer corporation takes over the POCO and whacks taxes right up to >30% - it means there is no real return on investment.
I've already had to write off one PI base for this thing. And the same corporation has started taking over POCOs (and upping the tax rates) where I relocated to.
I thought PI was introduced partially as a way of engaging newbie players by offering the lower level returns in hisec to allow them to get a toe-hold in the game - griefer taxes effectively close off this avenue - is this the desired effect?
I do not know enough about the mechanics of the game to suggest how this should be addressed, but there is no sanction on a griefer corp doing this. One option would be for POCO owner to receive a penalty for liquidated bases - to be reimbursed to the PI owner.
Alternatively, some provisional taxation burdens on POCO owners - again - so that if a base is liquidated due to griefer taxation, the POCO owners have to pay future taxes based on prior revenue records. Again incentivising retaining PI bases.
I know to those that just want to harvest tears - these may be small penalties - but in hisec, there has to be some kind of expecation of some consequences of griefing? There is for ganking! And taxation griefing can easily have the same ISK impact on PI base owners! |
Cymion
Void.Tech Get Off My Lawn
0
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Posted - 2014.04.22 04:41:00 -
[8] - Quote
I never saw it in the survey, so I'm going to pose my question here.
Any chance of PI being overhauled with the rest of the industry stuff? I.E. the UI could def use some love (ability to save favorite layouts to reduce clicking around for 30 minutes at a time when setting up a new planet, etc)
Would also love to be able to resize the science & industry window so it doesn't take up a sizeable chunk of my screen when trying to warp to POCO's etc to pick up. But that's just me, perhaps there's a better way and I'm too dumb to find it thus far;) |
Unknown Servent
Orbital Requisition of KAIOP
0
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Posted - 2014.05.14 01:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
I would love empire based industry to be allowed to flourish a lot more. I feel the mega alliances in null sec pretty much got the game by the balls.
Here is my suggestion Allow of empire P.I. to be worth while Allow ABC minerals to be scanned down I dont just mean Jaspet .... but make it rare and in limited amount just like Ice fields are now CCP please stop trying to force player into low sec/null sec
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Deltarus Shadowflight
Oceanic Casual Gamers Group
0
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Posted - 2014.05.17 18:01:00 -
[10] - Quote
Im voting for a PI remake as well. Its an awesome idea and I have only just started having a go at it but the way its set out and the extreme lack of information is painful. After reading a few guides and two days of testing... plus more then a few million ISK, I finally got my head around it. I just want to get some materials flowing in for me to maybe roll on to trying manufacturing next. But after all the time and money I have thrown at PI just trying to learn it, it will take sometime before I feel comfortable moving along.
In regards to people taking over the POCO in highsec, if you look at it from a real world angle in the fact of how a corporation would really try to screw over and squeeze every last dollar out of someone... I can see how that would make sense. From a player in a game trying to make a buck and have fun... this kills it. |
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Vitank
Miners In Possession Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere
0
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Posted - 2014.06.26 16:44:00 -
[11] - Quote
CCP/Moderator, -It seemed to fit with this topic. -I'm not sure this is on the right thread, please move accordingly.
======================== UI Suggestions ========================
Why not make the S&I UI (to start with) a modular approach, similar to what CMS like Drupal does for website building? This would allow many of us to customize the view based on our needs.
======================== Simplified overview example ======================== 1-Pick width.
2-Pick # of column
- 1 column
- 2 column
- 3 column
3-Input column size 4-Chose module for each column 5-Save setting 6-Assign to a button
======================== Modules example for production ======================== 1a-Materials required (Text) 1b-Materials required (S-Icon) 1c-Materials required (L-Icon)
2a-Skills required (Text) ... 3a-ME level total (Text) ... 4a-ME level breakdown (Text) ... 5a-PE level (Text) ... 6a-PE level breakdown (Text) ... 7a-Cost of job installation (Text) ... 8a-BPO Search Box
etc....
======================== Other items to make it work ======================== -Give ability to Import / Export settings (like fits)
- Share with your corp mates / alliance, etc
-Give the ability to open the S&I with specific settings (Via buttons in Neo comm)
- Ability to separate/customize your view based on the job you are currently doing:
- Install job,
- Deliver Jobs,
- Review BPO, etc)
-Ability for modules to "overflow" in next column. -Ability for modules more then one column.
-This way, CCP can create the "default" and user friendly UI. -The community can create the "power user" and "Job Specify" UI. -Add modules with the right hooks could be a lot simpler to implement, then re-writing an entire UI just for a small change. -You could easily add PI module, Research modules, etc.
Players would end up with a "dashboard" approach based on the Industry they currently perform.
V |
Electrified Circuits
Fault Line Industries Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere
17
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Posted - 2014.06.27 20:34:00 -
[12] - Quote
PI |
Calico Jack Rose
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
0
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Posted - 2014.06.28 07:40:00 -
[13] - Quote
CCP I have to say that the whole not having to have standings to anchor a pos in high sec is about the craziest thing I have heard in a while are you trying to turn high sec in to null sec or what? I mean seriously before jumping the gun on things such as this why not get more player opinions as to what we think would make this game better after all we are the ones who keep it going. I may be completely wrong and if so apologies to all who took the time to read it but if things keep going in this direction theirs no point in having borders thus no point in playing because it takes the fun out of it for the little guys because if its that easy to place a pos then everyone will just pay mercs to clear out everyone until the next person comes along willing to pay to have them kicked out. Also War Decks! all one has to do is war deck and let it expire and not be out much while the people being WD is out of everything they worked hard for its pretty pathetic the people that can actually afford a war have nothing to stand in their way from WDing at will it needs to be fixed. MAke anyone who war decks pay a weekly fee no matter what so that atleast it cost them something to take everything from another player. |
ChataJohn
Aegis Enterprise
2
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Posted - 2014.07.07 20:31:00 -
[14] - Quote
If our opinion really mattered you would refrain from requiring the prints to be located in the PoS - having one is unsafe enough as it is without further chances to lose our shirts. It is not as if there is no in-system travel, comms, or copy technology...
If we wanted war red war - we wouldn't do Industry.
I also think you should truly randomize the Universe's mineral content across the board - elements don't necessarily segregate according to levels of human organization, police activity or State control. lol.
My only other major grip is - wtf is with not allowing drones on some ships? If it were a real world scenario in any venue - ships captains would have every weapon they could cram on or in them whether the ship was designed for it or not. I mean come on - Freighters with no drones - really? I'd have the damn things hanging off my ship like Christmas ornaments if there were no room inside ... |
Albert Wittmann
19
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Posted - 2014.07.22 16:16:00 -
[15] - Quote
Hello CCP,
i want the old UI back, the new UI eat half of my screen for this flashy blueprint-cake! When i haven't activated a blueprint, then minimize this blueprint-cake please. As an industryworker i need at first pure overview, not blinky blinky, im so shiny, watch me, im so blinky shiny.
I want my green "ready"-status back, was fine visible, but now i have to search for a darkgrey slow flashing button, make the button green.
Oh, and the babyblue color is bad readable, if you have mediumgrey as theme like me.
And do a corphangar have now a limit of space? Can't deliver my ships now.
Oh, the finale product don't interesting me much, productiontime and cost are more interesting. |
Azarion Sinak
Apollo Technologies Inc
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.22 22:00:00 -
[16] - Quote
I love the UI changes. I love the slot availability.
What I miss and cant stand was changed was the tables moving from the MSSQL dump to a flat file.
This to me is really a bad move. I despise PHP, Linux, MySQL and all the rest of the toys. Yes, I am a .NET developer and a MSSQL DBA. Yes, those skills are my bread and butter and pay my bills. Having said that, I have tons of queries to mine Eve data and make my production as efficient as possible. Doing so from a flat file that is incredibly difficult to parse without delving into skillsets I don't have nor want to learn. Its ludicrious that we have to jump through hoops when it could be provided easily.
This change makes me want to drop Eve. It shouldn't be this frustrating to get back up to speed after a patch. |
Jason Chase
Starcorp Heavy Industries Notorious Organization of Brothers
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 02:06:00 -
[17] - Quote
I rarely post in the forums, but so far I am very pleased with the overall redesign of the UI for S&I. With that said, the fact that we are now having to pay to research blueprints at POS's that we own is a major let down. We have to pay to fuel the tower, buy the labs and arrays, and now spend up to millions of isk to research a BPO that we had to pay millions for in many cases? In my opinion this change alone is going to seriously damage the industry which it was supposedly trying to help.
I am mainly an industrialist, and with the new changes it makes me want to quit altogether, which I might do, and then "hey, it's not my problem any more." |
Ixidor Zorander
Coffee Club of Cautelous Chaps
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 09:03:00 -
[18] - Quote
In the past a perfect me freighter bpo was roughly 4b isk on contracts and it was reasonable considering the investment and time spent. A size able investment to someone new who wanted to be competitive. Today, I seen a quote of 140b to up a chimera bpo from 7-10. I literally did a double triple check walked off and got coffee, returned and stared at my monitor.. counting numbers,,, one hundreds, thousands, millions, billions.... hmm....... once concluding ccp clearly has 3 decimal places represented. I put all my isk save for 2b into corp wallet and clicked to proceed with the research and a red "you do not have the isk to complete this" message came up. ........ -_-......... no .... stinking...... way
ludicrous is a word I reserve for special occasions.... this being one of the few |
Vartan Sarkisian
Reasonable People Of Sound Mind
157
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 10:23:00 -
[19] - Quote
- I like the new interface (even though it takes a while to get used to it) - I like that I can see at a glance my ME and TE numbers. - I like that it is easy to see my BPOs/BPCs no matter where they are.
- I've not worked out how I can determine how much a research or manufacturing job would cost in other systems. - I donGÇÖ t know how to check the system index thingy to show me the cheapest place to uproot my entire manufacturing effort to.
- I am not sure the system index of the system I am in but the costs to put a T1 Destroyer TE from 0 to 20% was 28m and would take 66days is abysmal and from what i read on the forums about other people and the costs they are getting it would seem that currently industry is dead in the water. IF prices increase to cover such new costs then the costs to replace even basic ships and fittings will be astronomical. -I have not seen any CCP responses to any of the fears/questions on these costs so not sure if these are working as intended or if they have dropped the ball and totally screwed industry (not that that would be admitted anyway). I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate. All those moments will be lost in time... like tears in rain... Time to die. |
corv jacksons
Mortis Angelus The Kadeshi
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 12:51:00 -
[20] - Quote
there are a lot of thing wrong with the industry patch i think ccp needs to look at it again |
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Kesker
The Sagan Clan Mordus Angels
35
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 12:53:00 -
[21] - Quote
Well the rest of these fine folks are hitting the nail on the head.
I've already dropped my tower. The cost of fuel, plus paying for jobs is a slap in the face.
It's liquidation time, and auction a much less valuable toon now.
ONE LESS PAID SUBSCRIPTION FROM ME CCP |
DooDoo Gum
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
50
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 13:45:00 -
[22] - Quote
Do you still need us to do the survey, or does the rate of dropped subs answer your question sufficiently? |
telxkiskisrowr
The Greater Goon Clockwork Pineapple
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 18:46:00 -
[23] - Quote
most serious refiners in null sec already had the skills at near max because we only had 35% yield stations available. The refining issue doesn't much affect the people who already had to have max skills to get close to 100%. Am I sad that loot reprocessing got hurt? Of course, but it isn't comparatively any worse than the nerfs many of my friends have had in pvp ships over the years. From what i am seeing I think the price for jobs at a POS should have some mitigation as well as by sec status. Maybe low sec stations start at 51% refine or charge somewhat less taxes. Null sec refine at 52% or fewer station taxes again. The only reason is because it is so much harder to keep a pos alive in low-sec and null sec. I think null and especially WH space should have a much lower maximum cap on the system index. I don't care if 50 producers are in a 0.0 system if they are 20 jumps from the nearest other facility there would still be lenty of workers. Might be easier to implement a regional or at least constellation mitigation factor.
disclaimer All in all I'm kind of excited by the new patch but i have been out of action for a few years. I only resubbed recently. |
HighlanderUK
Interstellar Business Machines Corp.
2
|
Posted - 2014.07.28 23:00:00 -
[24] - Quote
just the stuff you missed in your big Indy rebuild......
you removed the slot issue @ stations, but not the near decade old limit of 11 jobs per factory/lab, come on this is supposed to be the future -- not gimped to an Earthly 11 jobs maximum.
while i'm on topic, how about boosting the trade slot limit from 305 to allow trading in other regions at the same time, i cant sell everything i make with just 305 selling slots. again its a skill restriction dating back many years (since trade skills were added).
your going in the right direction updating S&I, but it needs a little more polish. then i will be a happy Scotsman (rare I know). |
Eldan Sangofil
Angry Growlers
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.31 11:09:00 -
[25] - Quote
Hello,
I agree with Jason Chase and Kesker,
Isn't it a little bit strange that we have to pay for jobs in our own laboratories?
A POS is almost unrentable now... |
Jubei Hangoon
Kenshin. Northern Coalition.
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.04 12:31:00 -
[26] - Quote
As a small scale industrialist in 0.0, I'd really like a way to get my hands on moon goo without having to travel to Jita.
When is the last time you saw a serious PvP ship that used T1 modules? I want to support my team, but don't want to be tethered to Jita so tightly. Currently I'm having to make Jita runs weekly to do minimal T2 industry and invention. Maybe a scannable site with enough goo for a few dozen PvP ships worth of manufacturing?
Also, please add a little bit of each racial isotope into each ice. So Caldari ice also produces a few % of Gallente, Minmatar, and Amarr fuel. That way in the event of a blockade a small industrialist could support limited action for his team. That way when the corp decides to go to Gallente space I can still support the team.
Finally PI: Please add a way to save planetary layouts. The way the game happens people have to move, each time they reinvent the wheel (in a manner of speaking). Setting up a fully upgraded manufacturing planet takes WAY too much time even if I've done it dozens of times.
As a personal wish: Some kind of skill that extends the range of extractors? |
Yasuo Zhao
Perkone Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 11:02:00 -
[27] - Quote
that there are 3 types of a ores is in my opinion nonsense.
I saw how Pyroxeres was more worth then the 10% more yield type because Pyrox is needed for Missions...
Pls CCP dont make this complex game even more complex with such content |
Decarthado Aurgnet
Imperial Combat Engineers Empire of Arcadia
19
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Posted - 2014.08.07 19:06:00 -
[28] - Quote
The implications of which things are worth more and which markets are doing how well aside ... whichever of you helped to add the option to pay for industry jobs with either the corp or personal wallet (and made it work in POS towers) needs a box of cookies. That's a box of cookies each, not one box to share. That small change cut the amount of time I need to spend installing jobs by no less than 2/3. Remove T2 BPO's or make them inventable at extreme cost. |
Endo Saissore
Asteroid Bluez S I L E N T.
67
|
Posted - 2014.08.14 15:34:00 -
[29] - Quote
I tried industry out a year ago. It didn't stick with me. Too much hassle and uncertainty. I dabbled in exploration and whenever I came across a bpc I would just sell it because I couldn't be bothered.
Since the industry update I have gotten into manufacturing. The interface is incredibly easy to figure out. I didn't need a third party wiki to find out what the hell it all meant.
So from an accessibility standpoint you guys did a great job. One more player is building things in eve now. |
Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
4
|
Posted - 2014.08.20 17:47:00 -
[30] - Quote
Endo Saissore wrote:I tried industry out a year ago. It didn't stick with me. Too much hassle and uncertainty. I dabbled in exploration and whenever I came across a bpc I would just sell it because I couldn't be bothered.
Since the industry update I have gotten into manufacturing. The interface is incredibly easy to figure out. I didn't need a third party wiki to find out what the hell it all meant.
So from an accessibility standpoint you guys did a great job. One more player is building things in eve now.
Except that now you have to have a 3rd party tool to honestly and directly tell you if what you are manufacturing is profitable, since many things in Eve right now are unprofitable due to input resource hikes and overstocking before said change took effect.
To me it seems they did manage to do what they wanted, get more people into industry but make it more ambiguous as to if they are actually making money with the increased materials costs, the new job cost, and the system index multipliers that aren't clearly listed anywhere in game for you to be able to tell if you can build something cheaper somewhere else.
Granted the game does need more ISK sinks to even begin to catch up with the ISK faucets, but they should be clearer with how wide the drains are.
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Pah Cova
Made in Portugal S.A.
8
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Posted - 2014.08.27 18:48:00 -
[31] - Quote
Hi there.
As far as I see, miners are selling all their mining chars, i-¦ve seen guys selling 15 and 20 mining chars, why they would do that? Lets see... Now the ore are traded as compressed ore and not on mineral, miners are loosing isks. The new regfinning system makes them raise their skill to maximum if they want to get more mineral, however when they want to sell it, no one wants the mineral, they prefer to by compressed ore, at least in null sec. Then comes the industry... tons of the same structures just to get the b+¦nus and in the end CCP took away that b+¦nus because of the teams costs. So, now produces on POS worth nothing, I believe soon CCP have to put their hamsters and slaves to work on NPC stations just to supply the players.
Changes are needed of course, I like changes and I guess everybody like changes, however change should not be made at our time expenses because we know that when we get on goal (max skills) you will find a way to make them useless again as always. That have happened several times in the last 4 years and will continue until people say enough is enough and leave the game once and for all.
Why didnt you put T2 BPO-¦s on market provided by NPC-¦s? And instead of using decryptors for ME/PE level, use them for decrease manufacturing time, use the datacores for T2 manufacturing as required item. You want teams, that is ok, but let the people do their munufacturing jobs as allways without those guys and without paying in their own structures, you can make the teams on the same way, however who wants them have to pay for them. You want to give bonus to manufacting in POS, use ihub upgrades instead of 50 ammunition arrays in the same POS,, you can even make ihubs usefull for wormholes, give those guys an assist and give them at least some sites to run, some of them as none for days and weeks. Give some ice to wormholers too, in exchange give null sec some gas sites I never see any in all systems I passed. The reprocess system I agree with the changes. Move the data sites away or make them worthy, they worth nothing at all, put relics sites in drone space too, drone space still the uggly duck of eve.
Hope you guys read these words, i-¦ve experienced some eve professions but you guys always have to break my game. I-¦m tired to make skills that later became useless, or at least let us redistribut our skillpoints for something usefull. |
Asshin Riraille
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.03 02:05:00 -
[32] - Quote
Vapuk Kripit wrote:I believe a major priority should be to address POCO taxes.
The emergence of griefer-like taxation levels in HISEC is starting to make PI unviable for noobs like me starting out in EVE.
This is an ISK hungry game - and it is a very attractive option to sink a lot of time and effort in to getting a PI operation underway so that new players can enjoy the broad range of gaming experiences EVE offers.
But if that investment can be quixotically put at risk when a griefer corporation takes over the POCO and whacks taxes right up to >30% - it means there is no real return on investment.
I've already had to write off one PI base for this thing. And the same corporation has started taking over POCOs (and upping the tax rates) where I relocated to.
I thought PI was introduced partially as a way of engaging newbie players by offering the lower level returns in hisec to allow them to get a toe-hold in the game - griefer taxes effectively close off this avenue - is this the desired effect?
I do not know enough about the mechanics of the game to suggest how this should be addressed, but there is no sanction on a griefer corp doing this. One option would be for POCO owner to receive a penalty for liquidated bases - to be reimbursed to the PI owner.
Alternatively, some provisional taxation burdens on POCO owners - again - so that if a base is liquidated due to griefer taxation, the POCO owners have to pay future taxes based on prior revenue records. Again incentivising retaining PI bases.
I know to those that just want to harvest tears - these may be small penalties - but in hisec, there has to be some kind of expecation of some consequences of griefing? There is for ganking! And taxation griefing can easily have the same ISK impact on PI base owners! So true.
I just founded PI and it looked interesting, so I started planing, but after I saw that I need to play a loot just to move things from my buildings to my ship...
Please make POCOs in High sec NPC controlled only, with a fixed tax like 10%, or allow multiple POCOs in a same Planet. |
smokeydapot
MSE-corp Northern Associates.
8
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 13:36:00 -
[33] - Quote
Now I have found where something of industrial relevance is itGÇÖs time to destroy it in true eve fashion.
First the R.Db items.
Well they are useless unless you are some age old lucky or multi trillion isk person that has had the luck of having a T2 BPO.
I am yet to find a single use for these items and IGÇÖm forced to agree that T2 BPOGÇÖs need to make a comeback and in my honest and experienced opinion these need to be reintroduced in data or relic sites ( the how, why and balance of I am leaving to you although this is probably a bad idea ).
Second useless build requirements.
This solely refers to titans build requirements I have recently focused on industry and something really bugs me with the titans BPGÇÖs and this is the fact that to build them the BP requires that two certain components are needed to construct these marauding monsters of new Eden let me elaborate.
The components to build these monsters are: Capital Propulsion Engine Capital Turret Hardpoint Capital Sensor Cluster Capital Armor Plates Capital Capacitor Battery Capital Power Generator Capital Shield Emitter Capital Jump Drive Capital Computer System Capital Construction Parts Capital Doomsday Weapon Mount Capital Ship Maintenance Bay Capital Corporate Hangar Bay Capital Jump Bridge Array Capital Clone Vat Bay
Now I donGÇÖt know to the readers overall experience within eve ( itGÇÖs probably little with the actual functionality of these ships ) but these last two items in the above list draw grate concern with myself, Why have parts such as Capital Jump Bridge Array and Capital Clone Vat Bay when the base hull does not have the functionality of putting up a bridge or installing a clone without additional modules ?
This is just building for the sake of building no wonder industrial focused people are leaving the game and or selling their characters who knows what else requires such pointless and useless parts.
Third Player Owned Structures ( POSGÇÖs ).
This part of the game needs the most attention these should be the end game for industrial focused corporations / alliances as it is only at these structures that super capital ships can be constructed at ( at least to myself the fact of super capital construction suggests end game industrial ) and yet the fitting requirements are poor to say the least, POS defences are a joke ( you cant counter capital ships successfully with anything more than a POS and loads of guns ) and even then the POS canGÇÖt decide on a target if itGÇÖs unmanned for more than a minute or two.
Refining should be better at POSGÇÖs than it is. The fuel use should be less for regular space users ( i know it gets a modifier in SOV space and I believe it gets one in FW systems as well ). The recovery of low end moon materials should be altered to make it more financially viable to deploy and defend structures on such moons, and not to mention the fitting requirements should be lower for structures such as defences ( Missile batteryGÇÖs are scarcely used for the fact they require CPU and when the POS is reinforced these structures go offline compared to turret batteryGÇÖs that donGÇÖt ).
All in all i find the changes you have done to industry to be nothing more than cosmetic with little thought to industry in its entirety, Refining base yield needs to be grater if not in stations then at POSGÇÖs you could even alter the skills to give a better modifier to gain better yields from the ore that corporations and alliances spend not just hours or days mining but weeks and months.
In the words of Philip j Fry GÇ£fix itGÇ¥ before industry dies a slow and painful death with POSGÇÖs being the first to go.
P.S. The only POS array I have found any use for within industry is the compression array all the rest just gather dust in my items bay waiting for the possible day where they become useful once again. |
Gabriel Rova
Distant Light Syndicate
1
|
Posted - 2014.09.15 20:57:00 -
[34] - Quote
Short and to the point:
I think the moons in high sec should be harvestable. Reactors should be able to be setup in high sec. I also think that keeping a POS online should not cost so much.
|
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
174
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 15:10:00 -
[35] - Quote
Everything you guys try to "fix" you break. My inventory UI is still broken from when you tried to "fix" that like 2 or 3 years ago and now you break something as basic as the info tab.
So I was just talking to a corp mate who is new to invention and trying to walk him through some stuff so I go to the market to find a BP to link to him so I can explain to him about the skills and data cores and how it all works and guess what the invention tab on the BPO is greyed out so I can't find that info.
Luckily since I was talking basic theory and did not need a specific item I could just go to contracts and be confident that I could find a BPC there so I do and right click on show info and once again the invention tab is greyed out.
So then I go into "view contract" and then click on the info button in there and bingo now I can see the info that I am looking for. So I drag that into corp chat to show my corpie and guess what happened. Yep you guessed it, it went back to the generic BP info UI where the invention tab is greyed again.
So if you are looking for invention info like if you want to train skills to work towards inventing something or start researching data cores to invent something and no one is selling BPCs in contracts the only way you have to find that info is to buy the BPO make a copy and then look that the info UI on that copy. Am I the only one that see's that as being a huge **** up?
This game used to have a lot of ways to look up various kinds of info and link it to people and more and more you are eliminating those ways and claiming it's to make things simpler and more intuitive. This game is very complex and heavily reliant upon vets taking newbies by the hand and teaching them stuff. So your answer to making the game simpler and more new player friendly is to make finding basic info very difficult and make linking that info impossible?
By the way if I sound a bit pissed it's only because seriously every time that I dock and my station hangar becomes my ship's cargo hold and I have to re-setup my inventory window and I want to just throw a bricks with the CCP logo on them through random windows in Reykjavik so the locals show up at your door with pitch forks and torches.
Of course I'm joking about the bricks but I'm not about my frustration with you guys braking everything that you touch and then moving on to the next thing to break.
You guys are thinking to narrowly about doing certain tasks if you already have everything you need in place and forgetting that sometimes people just explore info tabs looking for their next project. Think more general and less specific.
|
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
174
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 15:32:00 -
[36] - Quote
just as a side note to what I posted above:
In my discussions with the corpie in question he mentioned that it makes sense that the invention tab on the BPO be greyed out since you can't invent from a BPO. I would like to point out that only makes sense if you have the very limited perspective of having that BPO in your possession and are trying to do something very specific with it. If you step back to a more general perspective that makes very little sense.
I would like to point out that in the past the info used to be available in the info UI of BPOs and BPCs alike. I would also like to point out that BPOs can be found in the market and also typed in chat then highlighted and right clicked then linked to also can be found indirectly through the info tab on both the base tech 1 item as well as the tech 2 version. That is a lot of ways to get to the information that one might be looking for. The current set up gives you only one very specific way of finding science skill and data core information for inventing that is contingent upon you either having a BPC in your possesion or a BPC being for sale in contracts. I could find no other way to locate this information.
This is a game about knowledge and information. Making basic research and investigation difficult or impossible is not good for the fun factor of the game. There are times when I spend hours in station just looking **** up or at least there used to be. |
Croc Evil
Croc's Family Business
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 18:19:00 -
[37] - Quote
ergherhdfgh wrote:
I would like to point out that in the past the info used to be available in the info UI of BPOs and BPCs alike. I would also like to point out that BPOs can be found in the market and also typed in chat then highlighted and right clicked then linked to also can be found indirectly through the info tab on both the base tech 1 item as well as the tech 2 version. That is a lot of ways to get to the information that one might be looking for. The current set up gives you only one very specific way of finding science skill and data core information for inventing that is contingent upon you either having a BPC in your possesion or a BPC being for sale in contracts. I could find no other way to locate this information.
This is a game about knowledge and information. Making basic research and investigation difficult or impossible is not good for the fun factor of the game. There are times when I spend hours in station just looking **** up or at least there used to be.
This information is easy to find. Open info for BPO, select copying tab, there you have BPC as outcome. Double click it or right click for popup menu ... you there |
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
175
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 18:59:00 -
[38] - Quote
Croc Evil wrote:
This information is easy to find. Open info for BPO, select copying tab, there you have BPC as outcome. Double click it or right click for popup menu ... you there
Thank you very much. While that does work as you stated that is not in the least bit intuitive nor is it congruent with how things have been done in the past. I spent probably 45 mintues trying to figure this out in game and had to come to the forums to find this route also this is no better than the copy I found in contracts as when I try to link it in corp chat it links the BPO which again has a greyed out invention tab.
What you proposed here isn't really any less complicated than what I did by finding a BPC in contracts and does not solve the link problem but it does help clarify. I can see now that there are two separate issues. One is that the took something simple and intuitive and made it complex and hard to figure out. The second issues seems to be that they broke BP linking so regardless of what type of BP you link it shows up as a fresh BPO with no research. At least for T1 BPs. I've not tried to link T2 BPs yet.
This seems to be a trend with CCP. The old website used to be very functional. It was beautiful as far as function is concerned. I could always easily find what I was looking. They changed the eveonline website and now it is very pretty but insanely difficult to find basic things that you are looking for. I have no issue with CCP prettying things up a bit as long as they maintain functionality but when they destroy functionality to pretty things up that's just seem amateurish to me.
They prettied up the eve website and fuxored it's functionality. They prettied up the inventory and fuxored it's functionality. Now they prettied up the industry and information UIs and again fuxored functionality.
|
Goin Off
Manson Family Advent of Fate
10
|
Posted - 2014.09.27 15:59:00 -
[39] - Quote
This team concept and the new changes especially to industry have IMHO totally messed up industry.
Firstly, I have 5 pos's in hisec, managed by other toons and a couple of corps, two of the pos's have been online for years, the other 3 I use as necessary. Apparently no advantage to owning and maintaining pos's in hisec any more! As if the cost to keep them up and running wasn't enough of an isk sink, now I'm paying exorbitant costs to NPC corps to install jobs in pos's with NO benefit for my corp.
Secondly, this team concept CCP has created, beyond being another isk sink targeting smaller corps while handing industry to the large corps/alliances has caused me to rethink my position when it comes to EVE industry in general.
None of the recent changes CCP has made in the last year has done anything to make EVE more fun! All CCP has done is added layers of complexity, confusion, and change meant to turn EVE into a game for large corporations/alliances and if you don't join one you basically whelping ships and getting very little fun for your subscription.
I used to really love to do the indy stuff and was able to generate a significant isk revenue stream with 132 build slots available across 12 of 21 toons. Plenty of cyno alts and two highly skilled pvp toons.
I currently have 7 accounts with 21 toons most of which are/were industrialists and those characters are all about making isk for this character to be able to afford ships and stuff for pvp along with a few other pvp toons. Maintaining that many accounts in case you at CCP don't know it is an expensive and tedious. In recent months and more specifically with the summer expansion targeting industry I haven't been able to grasp/digest the changes in this expansion and be able to justify continuing along the industrialist profession. That being said I'll probably begin to consolidate my accounts, sell off my indy assets and play EVE for free until the isk runs out.
This toon was my first and will likely be my last in EVE. EVE is morphing into a game where it's hard to find something to do that's fun, lucrative, offers any kind of ability to relax without being constantly "on guard". Don't get me wrong, I play the game primarily to PVP and If you look at my KB stats I'm actually pretty good at it. However, the changes over the years have done everything to move assets and advantages towards the large alliances. Making it impossible for the small alliance to compete at virtually any level. My current alliance keeps plugging away, but IMHO will continue to struggle because we DON't desire to join a large alliance for the safety and security in numbers.
I used to mine ice and minerals in hisec, however, it's just not fun anymore!! Hisec gankers have ruined that career, along with the constant war decs that basically just create work for industrialists, loss of revenue and in my case parking 12 toons for a week or more.
Sorry about the wall of text but just consider this an observation of how CCP is going wrong. Indy toons basically parked, hisec mining toons parked (Don't care to hassle with gankers) .
For those of you that wish to troll me have at it, I could care less!! CCP you need to really wake up and analyse what's really happening with EVE, and, maybe EVE is really on it's way out. Analyse this though, when I first started playing EVE there were about average to see 45 to 55 thousand characters online at any given time, now barely over 30 thousand during prime time. Large alliances getting larger, small alliances/corporations getting smaller or evaporating into the ether of space. Rampant uncontrolled inflation in the markets for virtually anything in the game and all of the isk controlled by a small number of players/alliances. Your catering to the large alliances/power blocks serves only to keep the smaller corps from having fun competing all across the EVE universe and IMHO is contributing heavily to your loss in subscriptions.
If CCP cares to discuss don't hesitate to contact me in game, if ya don't care that's ok as well!! EVE for me is on the verge of no longer being fun and when it's not fun I won't do it anymore! Have fun, fight outnumbered, kill ****, and by all means take care of you family BEFORE EVE. |
smokeydapot
MSE-corp Northern Associates.
8
|
Posted - 2014.09.29 23:15:00 -
[40] - Quote
Gabriel Rova wrote:Short and to the point:
I think the moons in high sec should be harvestable. Reactors should be able to be setup in high sec. I also think that keeping a POS online should not cost so much.
Really not a fan of this stuff. High sec moon mining and reactions should be kept to low / null sec allowing corps and alliances to attack with capital support.
While I would like the old POS fuel system POS's need their own overall pass with fitting requirements being the front of the list.
The fuel requirement for a POS is static the only variation in the price is the material cost to produce the blocks this can be negated by providing your own BP and required materials to produce said blocks.
Goin Off wrote: Secondly, this team concept CCP has created, beyond being another isk sink targeting smaller corps while handing industry to the large corps/alliances has caused me to rethink my position when it comes to EVE industry in general.
Being new to the teams concept within eve it looks to be a good idea teams are bid upon depending on how they modify the job installed.
These teams are an optional part of industry and the only one that makes them an isk sink and a necessity is you with the desire to get the modified job done with less materials and less time while footing the bill for the use of the team.
Goin Off wrote: I'm paying exorbitant costs to NPC corps to install jobs in pos's with NO benefit for my corp.
I would need to investigate this myself and can think of a circumstance where you would pay an NPC entity to install a job and that would be if you install it from their station to your facility.
If you are still paying to install the job physically at your facility then this could be an oversight or unintended game play or even the cost of running a POS in high sec because you still need them starbase charters another cost of running a POS in high sec.
Installing jobs at the POS ( not remotely from station ) should cost you nothing you maintain the facility the job is running at by the fuel for the POS and buying and deploying the relevant structures / mods.
Overall your better moving your POSGÇÖs to low sec but from what iGÇÖve read here so far there is an aversion to risk. Risking that POS in low / null to get the reward of moon materials, reacting them materials or even making drugs to make something useful or just for profit.
ergherhdfgh wrote: Thank you very much. While that does work as you stated that is not in the least bit intuitive nor is it congruent with how things have been done in the past. I spent probably 45 mintues trying to figure this out in game and had to come to the forums to find this route also this is no better than the copy I found in contracts as when I try to link it in corp chat it links the BPO which again has a greyed out invention tab.
So you would be a fan of providing false information to them making industry a new start.
I donGÇÖt see how providing new players with information on an item that is false will help. This will just bread a new eve player assuming that you can invent on an original BP. This part of the game functions correctly and as I would expect.
I donGÇÖt want information pertaining to a BPC being on a BPO information screen this would just lead to more questions from them wanting to get involved in the invention process.
Before you all go off at me let me leave you with this.
CCP is susceptible to the way it recruits people ( two involved in the ship balancing particularly ) provided ships with more slots but failed to consider that fitting requirements would be affected. These now devs and I use that term lightly are from some of the major alliances within eve.
The game has been focused around thousand man fights and mega sized alliances or even a coalition in the game the days of solo PVP or small scale industry are things of the past and this is the problem.
They have the T2 BPOGÇÖs they have all the valuable moons and large numbers of players that more than likely just sit and spin their titans or supers and the regular Joe well he struggles to make ends meat, every time he tries PVP he gets killed by 10 or more guys and canGÇÖt get a foothold anywhere without being beaten back to high sec with a 20 man dread blob or a few super capital ships for good measure.
IGÇÖve seen the future and itGÇÖs alliance A and alliance B with if they are still around rooks and kings in the middle smart bombing whatever they can find.
I will resist the collective even if I have to change game to do it or maybe I can get a job at CCP and start bashing the guys that are constantly thinking of the bigger and bigger stuff and refocus them to include the 20 man corps, Maybe I should join some major alliance then submit my application.
|
|
Luziano Luxiferous
Human Information Virus
5
|
Posted - 2014.10.01 20:13:50 -
[41] - Quote
Why did you remove some of the PI materials info?
One used to be able to see what materials was needed to make a material - but now ya only see what they can be made into...
Please change this back to how it used to be.
This information is VERY valuable to those of us with many PI projects. |
Agnes Stix
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2014.10.15 11:32:00 -
[42] - Quote
First off "Your opinion matters!"pfft yeah, please don't insult us any further.
Secondly I have heard some people say "if you're not having the same or more profit margin you are doing it wrong" okey then please tell me what I am doing wrong.
I do tech 2 manufacturing in highsec and my profit is about 40% what is was before.
I'll give my opinion even if I know it's a complete waste of time and the trolls will be here rolling in their own ***** in a heartbeat.
After indy changes buyers generally pay more, manufacturers make significantly less and the market is ridiculously oversupplied.
tl;dr It's ****... |
Agnes Stix
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2014.10.15 11:32:59 -
[43] - Quote
First off "Your opinion matters!"pfft yeah, please don't insult us any further.
Secondly I have heard some people say "if you're not having the same or more profit margin you are doing it wrong" okey then please tell me what I am doing wrong.
I do tech 2 manufacturing in highsec and my profit is about 50-60% less then what it was before.
I'll give my opinion even if I know it's a complete waste of time and the trolls will be here rolling in their own ***** in a heartbeat.
After indy changes buyers generally pay more, manufacturers make significantly less and the market is ridiculously oversupplied.
tl;dr It's ****...
Edit: Actually after looking at the market for the last few weeks I would say it is closer to 65-75% less. |
Eris Lassa
Intersideralis
0
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 16:08:36 -
[44] - Quote
PI in empire, aka PI for new players:
- If you don't 'excel' the whole PI concept you have no idea what you're doing. New players usualy don't 'excel'.
- Player owned customs offices are unfair, they take away the cherry and the cream of the profit.
- Only processed materials are profitable and mostly (30%) toxic metals and (60%) water
- At least half of the planet types are a total loss of time
- Only way to make good money on PI is by extracting on good hotspots available on 3% of the planets.
- The extraction on hotspots requires !!!extremely!!! repetitive reconfiguration of extractor heads and processors.
- These repetitive tasks consume at least 30 hours per month, I'd rather do something more entertaining.
- Hospot's life is too short. Halved after one day, gone after two days.
- You can start PI after two weeks skill training but you will train 3 months to increase the profits = 3 plex = 2 bil isk
- Did you forget to take into account that on top of the effort done on PI you need to transport and sell the materials in a trade hub, also when your corp is at war? Skill up an hauler alt, second character training ... pause my main? ... hmm no with plex? Sure 20Gé¼ or 750 mil ISK?
- Player owned custom office tax calculations are based on data from one year ago, the real calculated tax is on average 5% higher. E.g. : A total of 12% CCP tax is in reality 17% tax on your sales value in a trade hub. I'm not talking about the sales tax and broker fees, that's on top of it.
- New players don't have the standings and skills for selling at low tax rates, takes another 2% of the benefit
- By the time they become aware how boring and unprofitable PI is I guess they can't be called newbees anymore
- OK, I got a wrong idea about the whole PI concept, you can't concentrate on extracting hotspots => profit goes down to 50-100 mil per month for half the effort, even more waste of time, better do something else like grinding missions.
|
Eris Lassa
Intersideralis
0
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 16:13:00 -
[45] - Quote
Production and invention:
- Most T1 items are sold from loot drops below the production price.
- The complexity of T2 invention and production process is staggering. To calculate the profitability of each module I had to create 7 excel files with each 10-20 sheets. I won't describe how it works and what is taken into account in the calculations since it would take pages and I would loose 95% of the readers before the end.
My GF studied economics at university and is supposed to be an excel pro, when she saw my excel sheets she told me the following after one or two minute jaw dropping: You are inhumanely crazy, you're multiplying vlookups with vlookups from webdata data from different sheets and files and multiplying this with data from something that looks more like a 3D table and ... OMG!
A short list of what you need to calculate the benefit/ hour of a T2 item: BPO cost, BPC copy time, BPC copy taxes, invention taxes, decryptor cost, named T1 items, invention time, decryptor ME modifier, decryptor PE, decryptor max run modifier, system indexes, base item prices, production time, material/component/item costs, sales taxes, broker fees, etc.
And you still have to check the market for sudden price drops
- The few market API developpers are struggeling with both complexity and the monthly static data updates (static lolz). EVE IPH Industry Calculator is the only good one I know and is currently not working because of the static data updates. I quote Zifrian "The hits keep on coming huh? "
- The production costs and sell prices showed in the industrial window are on average 10% off the real prices in the trade hubs. The average benefit is around 5%. The production/sell prices don't take into account the BPC copy costs/taxes, data core costs, invention taxes, invention chance, decryptor costs, sales taxes, broker fees, etc. Result: Very few people in this game know the real production costs. Second result : Half the T2 items are sold at loss.
- Two third of the production items (T1 and T2) have no value in game and are barely or not sold.
- Production times on 'profitable' T2 items are often too long (e.g. medium T2 rigs 10 copy = 2.5 days)
- Since the EVE market is fairly small compared to the real world market the prices fluctuate so fast that by the time you sell the item it's sometimes worth less that the components you bought.
- The good thing about production/invention is that it's one of the few non repetitive activities of this game, well ... you have to sell the items.
- If you want to sell your items you need to actively modify the sell prices, which is 'again' a super repetitive activity. Why do I have to pay broker fees if I need to take care of the sales myself?
- As a result of the complexity of production especially invention only a minority of players realy know what they are doing.
- Half of the T2 item production is an isk sink and it's very well hidden. Nice job CCP!
The EVE-online community likes this game more than the average monster bashing RPG because they're looking for something more complex which makes it more interesting, but this is overkill.
If you want to involve more players into invention you're going to have to simplify the whole concept quite a bit. The competitivity will increase and you'll spread the isks over a larger amount of players.
I'm convinced that many will loose interrest in production and invention again after a few months when they will notice that you can't just build and sell with profit easily.
In the end the easiest way to make isk in this game is to join a nulsec corp and grind NPC's in belts or plexes, or even better sell plex you bought with real money.
The inventments in skill time (monthly fee or isk cost) and investments in items such as BPO's and skills are much higher than the cost of plex you can buy of the website and sell ingame. ISK for plex will always be the best investment.
Well I guess our creator did the calculations better than any EVE citizen.
Eris Lassa, CEO of Intersideralis |
Eris Lassa
Intersideralis
0
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 16:13:45 -
[46] - Quote
Production and invention:
- Most T1 items are sold from loot drops below the production price.
- The complexity of T2 invention and production process is staggering. To calculate the profitability of each module I had to create 7 excel files with each 10-20 sheets. I won't describe how it works and what is taken into account in the calculations since it would take pages and I would loose 95% of the readers before the end.
My GF studied economics at university and is supposed to be an excel pro, when she saw my excel sheets she told me the following after one or two minute jaw dropping: You are inhumanely crazy, you're multiplying vlookups with vlookups from webdata data from different sheets and files and multiplying this with data from something that looks more like a 3D table and ... OMG!
A short list of what you need to calculate the benefit/ hour of a T2 item: BPO cost, BPC copy time, BPC copy taxes, invention taxes, decryptor cost, named T1 items, invention time, decryptor ME modifier, decryptor PE, decryptor max run modifier, system indexes, base item prices, production time, material/component/item costs, sales taxes, broker fees, etc.
And you still have to check the market for sudden price drops
- The few market API developpers are struggeling with both complexity and the monthly static data updates (static lolz). EVE IPH Industry Calculator is the only good one I know and is currently not working because of the static data updates. I quote Zifrian "The hits keep on coming huh? "
- The production costs and sell prices showed in the industrial window are on average 10% off the real prices in the trade hubs. The average benefit is around 5%. The production/sell prices don't take into account the BPC copy costs/taxes, data core costs, invention taxes, invention chance, decryptor costs, sales taxes, broker fees, etc. Result: Very few people in this game know the real production costs. Second result : Half the T2 items are sold at loss.
- Two third of the production items (T1 and T2) have no value in game and are barely or not sold.
- Production times on 'profitable' T2 items are often too long (e.g. medium T2 rigs 10 copy = 2.5 days)
- Since the EVE market is fairly small compared to the real world market the prices fluctuate so fast that by the time you sell the item it's sometimes worth less that the components you bought.
- The good thing about production/invention is that it's one of the few non repetitive activities of this game, well ... you have to sell the items.
- If you want to sell your items you need to actively modify the sell prices, which is 'again' a super repetitive activity. Why do I have to pay broker fees if I need to take care of the sales myself?
- As a result of the complexity of production especially invention only a minority of players realy know what they are doing.
- Half of the T2 item production is an isk sink and it's very well hidden. Nice job CCP!
The EVE-online community likes this game more than the average monster bashing RPG because they're looking for something more complex which makes it more interesting, but this is overkill.
If you want to involve more players into invention you're going to have to simplify the whole concept quite a bit. The competitivity will increase and you'll spread the isks over a larger amount of players.
I'm convinced that many will loose interrest in production and invention again after a few months when they will notice that you can't just build and sell with profit easily.
In the end the easiest way to make isk in this game is to join a nulsec corp and grind NPC's in belts or plexes, or even better sell plex you bought with real money.
The inventments in skill time (monthly fee or isk cost) and investments in items such as BPO's and skills are much higher than the cost of plex you can buy of the website and sell ingame. ISK for plex will always be the best investment.
Well I guess our creator did the calculations better than any EVE citizen.
The root of all evil The primary reason for all the problems in production and invention is the introduction of PLEX in the game. CCP's (actually the investors of CCP) biggest nightmare is that players would be able to replace the monthly subscription with PLEX, which they buy in-game payed with isk they earn in-game. Therefore production/invention can and will never be profitable with this system. Furthermore the less profitable any acivity is in game the more PLEX they can sell out of game. Everything in the real world, even deep into your preferred game is messed up by people with lots of money who have an insatiable need for more money. Grind on this one for a moment.
Eris Lassa, CEO of Intersideralis |
Eris Lassa
Intersideralis
0
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 18:31:07 -
[47] - Quote
I would like to add one note to all of this.
I'm not targeting any of the employees of CCP who have done an incredible job over the last decade. You just can't blame any of the CCP xxxxx for any of this. |
Marabelle Tuson
Justin's Beavers
0
|
Posted - 2014.10.27 08:40:18 -
[48] - Quote
Why are there increasing production costs if you run your jobs at a POS?
Why are there any isk/hour costs at all. You'd imagine it is covered by the fact that your POS fuel covers the PG/CPU needed to run whatever you have anchored and online at your tower.
Remove that cost entirely from POS jobs. Give incentive to have production POS'es and make them worthwhile.
I was paying factory fees in my wormhole of all places..... |
13kr1d1
Hedion University Amarr Empire
21
|
Posted - 2014.10.30 19:03:21 -
[49] - Quote
Agnes Stix wrote:First off "Your opinion matters!"pfft yeah, please don't insult us any further.
Secondly I have heard some people say "if you're not having the same or more profit margin you are doing it wrong" okey then please tell me what I am doing wrong.
I do tech 2 manufacturing in highsec and my profit is about 50-60% less then what it was before.
I'll give my opinion even if I know it's a complete waste of time and the trolls will be here rolling in their own ***** in a heartbeat.
After indy changes buyers generally pay more, manufacturers make significantly less and the market is ridiculously oversupplied.
tl;dr It's ****...
Edit: Actually after looking at the market for the last few weeks I would say it is closer to 65-75% less.
If the market is oversupplied, why not hike up your prices and stop making as much stuff? What about finding stuff in short supply? Don't build it if it won't make you the most profit.
I agree with other poster that PLEX has become the root of all problems. It used to be that people payed for game time cards with ISK, but this was subject to conning and CCP had to put in a "no con or ban" rule regarding it, instead of squashing ISK for RL cash, they endorsed it when they went for PLEX. It's a good business decision for them, but bad for the game environment, and represented a fundamental shift in game economics. |
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