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Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:13:00 -
[1] - Quote
Alright guys I've got this one.
At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run, which is what CCP want the game to be a - a game lasting decades, not years. With biggies like Star Citizen coming round with one-time fees and no-subs, there's gonna be some serious questions asked by the players. Questions like this:
"Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?"
This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet. But when it is, who knows what'll happen to the CCP.
The big business model transFORMATION
Okay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it.
1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons.
2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay.
3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun.
4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy.
This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. I'd recommend that they do this IPO on the stockmarket they were talking about, as that will get the big businesses interested and posting articles about this awesome sci-fi sim. All of the hardcore eve fans, like the mitani, will probably buy shares - so they'll have even more money to improve the game.
As they improve the game more people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer.
Thoughts please. |
Solstice Project
I'm So Meta Even This Acronym
4231
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:14:00 -
[2] - Quote
Die in a ******* gunfire. (ingame) |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:16:00 -
[3] - Quote
Solstice Project wrote:Die in a ******* gunfire. (ingame)
That's actually a good idea. For the dusties, maybe CCP could have firework guns that shoot fireworks and we can see from up in our EVE ships? Building links and funding the F2P.
It works with dust, why not EVE? why pay? |
Leigh Akiga
State War Academy Caldari State
299
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:17:00 -
[4] - Quote
People dont mind paying for a 'non-cash shop' experience. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
9322
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:18:00 -
[5] - Quote
Free to play is a move made by developers of failing pay to play titles to avoid losing what they invested in development. Free to play doesn't really work unless you actually gain a substantial advantage from paying. Twitter: @EVEAndski
TheMittani.com: The premier source for news, commentary and discussion of EVE Online and other games of interest.-á |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:19:00 -
[6] - Quote
Leigh Akiga wrote:People dont mind paying for a 'non-cash shop' experience.
Yeah we know that, but MORE people would prefer not paying but getting a cash shop experience. Heck, sometimes the cash shop adds a bit of variety to the game even if I still pay. why pay? |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:20:00 -
[7] - Quote
Andski wrote:Free to play is a move made by developers of failing pay to play titles to avoid losing what they invested in development. Free to play doesn't really work unless you actually gain a substantial advantage from paying.
Then here's an alternative mr Andski sir --
1) EVE goes BUY TO PLAY. All current subscribers receive free copy of game. New people must pay -ú39.99 to play EVE, but there will be no SUBS!
2) Add the cash shop with cosmetics, clothes, paints character slots ect...
3) Rake in the dough, make eve better and profit.
There would be some people to kill, gank and scam - surely you can see the benefit andski?
why pay? |
Lazy Eagle
FUITA
8
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:22:00 -
[8] - Quote
Better yet, put it on steam F2P, the steam community is just what we need. Hordes of idiots joining Eve, getting confused, and sperging out on forums...... GOOD IDEA BRO! |
Mpat120 M256
Latter Day Saints SPACE CONTINUUM
9
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:23:00 -
[9] - Quote
NO! Now please give your stuff to someone deserving and click "Biomass". |
Skeln Thargensen
Alpha Sperglords
258
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:24:00 -
[10] - Quote
tidi everywhere, never dock up in jita 4-4 again.
no. freelance space bum |
|
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:25:00 -
[11] - Quote
Lazy Eagle wrote:Better yet, put it on steam F2P, the steam community is just what we need . Hordes of idiots joining Eve, getting confused, and sperging out on forums...... GOOD IDEA BRO!
Actually, I didn't think of this.
The EVE store page gets MILLIONS of hits every single day. When a game first launches on steam, it gets featured - so think about all of the people that would play? We're talking hundreds of thousands, if not millions over a 30 day period.
Does the community get ruined? Not at all. There is no EVE community, it's divided up into corps, alliances and coalitions. The CFC would remain as culturally pure as it is, while the hordes of new players would form their own groups.
Would the forums become more active? Yes sir they would, but can CCP deal with this? Yes they can. With the extra revenue from all of the attention, CCP would be able to employ more community managers to improve and manage the forums.
The CFC has 10k members at the moment. With these changes, a new coalition could have 100k members?
Think about the scale of the warfare we're seeing here. Imagine the biggest fight in eve history happening every single week. It would be crazy. why pay? |
Lazy Eagle
FUITA
8
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:29:00 -
[12] - Quote
:checks pocket: i have no more food for you troll. |
Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
454
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:31:00 -
[13] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:With biggies like Star Citizen coming round .. But I like spaceships and not airplains |
Jove Death
Jovian Vengeance
153
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:31:00 -
[14] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Solstice Project wrote:Die in a ******* gunfire. (ingame) That's actually a good idea. For the dusties, maybe CCP could have firework guns that shoot fireworks and we can see from up in our EVE ships? Building links and funding the F2P. It works with dust, why not EVE?
Or we could blap the crap out of them from space and there bodies would shoot about like pretty sparklers
Plus the OP sounds like he works for EA BOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! Quoting "you will die" in EvE is fail Chars dont die in EvE. Unless you have a heart attack eek
|
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
1028
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:31:00 -
[15] - Quote
F2P requires substantial compromises in game design because everything needs to be evaluated in terms of how it will affect subscribers vs how it will affect free players. There are some games which are designed from the ground up to work with the F2P model, and they work well. There are other games which are not designed for it, and F2P is nothing but a desperation move.
the additional players that EVE would get as a result of going F2P wouldn't be anywhere close to worth the design sacrifices. |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:32:00 -
[16] - Quote
Lazy Eagle wrote::checks pocket: i have no more food for you troll.
No this isn't a troll. I genuinely believe with all my heart that EVE would be much more exciting if it was more popular and also free to play.
At the moment, I can go many systems in null only seeing 1-2 people. With these changes, I might encounter 10-20 in each system and 100 man fleets just roaming! The idea is there is more people, more action and more fun.
Aside from calling it a troll, I'd like to hear your specific feedback about why this wouldn't work?
Lots of EVE players just dismiss f2p immediately, but you have got to think about the benefits. why pay? |
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
1028
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:35:00 -
[17] - Quote
Quote:At the moment, I can go many systems in null only seeing 1-2 people. With these changes, I might encounter 10-20 in each system and 100 man fleets just roaming! The idea is there is more people, more action and more fun.
CCP could create the same effect by making the universe smaller. However, I don't think any person would seriously argue (other than you, apparently) that having everyone packed together would actually be good for the game. In fact, there are regularly people asking for space to be expanded to decrease population density. |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3207
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:35:00 -
[18] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Alright guys I've got this one.
At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run, which is what CCP want the game to be a - a game lasting decades, not years. With biggies like Star Citizen coming round with one-time fees and no-subs, there's gonna be some serious questions asked by the players. Questions like this:
"Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?"
This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet. But when it is, who knows what'll happen to the CCP.
The big business model transFORMATION
Okay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it.
1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons.
2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay.
3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun.
4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy.
This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. I'd recommend that they do this IPO on the stockmarket they were talking about, as that will get the big businesses interested and posting articles about this awesome sci-fi sim. All of the hardcore eve fans, like the mitani, will probably buy shares - so they'll have even more money to improve the game.
As they improve the game more people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer.
Thoughts please.
Is this where I type 'posting in a stealth Star Citizen will Kill EVE' thread? I sometimes get the stealth call out post rules wrong?
The part I highlighted is the "smoking gun", you know, the part where the poster mistakenly reveals his true motivation. This poster doesn't like EVE and is trying to appeal to CCP's wallet to get them to change the game to suit his personal need rather that just screwing off and playing the wonderful SC hanger walk around game.
Free to play games become Ghettos of non-interested/non-hardcore ADHD on crack/meth casual gamers who eventually muck up the entire game. No thanks. |
Xylem Viliana
Protomonolithic
97
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:36:00 -
[19] - Quote
"EVE should go F2P"
I have no words for this but I do have this to say about EVE going F2P
..!.. o.o |
general beanflicker
Merchants Trade Consortium The Last Chancers.
10
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:37:00 -
[20] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Alright guys I've got this one.
At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run, which is what CCP want the game to be a - a game lasting decades, not years. With biggies like Star Citizen coming round with one-time fees and no-subs, there's gonna be some serious questions asked by the players. Questions like this:
"Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?"
This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet. But when it is, who knows what'll happen to the CCP.
The big business model transFORMATION
Okay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it.
1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons.
2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay.
3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun.
4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy.
This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. I'd recommend that they do this IPO on the stockmarket they were talking about, as that will get the big businesses interested and posting articles about this awesome sci-fi sim. All of the hardcore eve fans, like the mitani, will probably buy shares - so they'll have even more money to improve the game.
As they improve the game more people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer.
Thoughts please.
10/10 TROLL
if not a trol go biomass your chars because we dont want your kind here |
|
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:39:00 -
[21] - Quote
Maybe not necessarily free to play, but BUY TO PLAY.
I'd like you to take a look at GW2. It's constantly growing, not declining, an unusual trend that only MMOs like EVE have pulled of. The community there is good, as there is still a paywall to prevent the hacking/children community - but still has wide access and people like it. Eventually, the people who don't like it that much stop playing, but come back later because they know its B2P and there are no subs. And you end up with the people who're interested in playing, liking the game.
Sure, you could take a look at complete free-to-play games like clash of clans on the ipad, but that is not what I'm suggesting. I'm suggesting a very strict cosmetic-only store that fits in with CCPs values, and allows them to give greater access to lots more people. I'd say that this could be done through either F2P or B2P.
why pay? |
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
671
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:42:00 -
[22] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Leigh Akiga wrote:People dont mind paying for a 'non-cash shop' experience. Yeah we know that, but MORE people would prefer not paying but getting a cash shop experience. Heck, sometimes the cash shop adds a bit of variety to the game even if I still pay.
No way, I'd raather prefer to pay higher subscription than having the game ruined by cash shop system.
Beside F2P model is free to play is not really viable for a game with off-line levelling. You should rewrite all, replace skilling with some kind of SP pills packs in the cash shop and all the consequent ****
What about having CCP invresting and ezpanding EVE instead? |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:44:00 -
[23] - Quote
Sura Sadiva wrote:Jim McMorris wrote:Leigh Akiga wrote:People dont mind paying for a 'non-cash shop' experience. Yeah we know that, but MORE people would prefer not paying but getting a cash shop experience. Heck, sometimes the cash shop adds a bit of variety to the game even if I still pay. No way, I'd raather prefer to pay higher subscription than having the game ruined by cash shop system. Beside F2P model is free to play is not really viable for a game with off-line levelling. You should rewrite all, replace skilling with some kind of SP pills packs in the cash shop and all the consequent **** What about having CCP invresting and ezpanding EVE instead?
No XP boosters or skill packs or whatever. When I say free to play or buy to play, I mean a shop with COMPLETELY cosmetic items. I'm talking about getting rid of the sub and just expanding the current aura shop. It's being done by hundreds of companies across the globe and has a proven track record.
why pay? |
Lazy Eagle
FUITA
8
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:48:00 -
[24] - Quote
Xylem Viliana wrote:"EVE should go F2P"
I have no words for this but I do have this to say about EVE going F2P
..!.. o.o Best thing to come out of this thread. |
Hammer Crendraven
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
70
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:48:00 -
[25] - Quote
I say no. Eve is doing just fine as is for 10 years now while other games have come and gone.
Second we do not need more players in eve, TiDi is already kicking in in more than a few systems. Eve is full enough as is.
If and that is a big if, eve loses a lot of subs after Star Citizen comes out then they can do something about it. But as Star Citizen is a different kind of game flight sim vs RTS I think eve will be ok. |
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
1029
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:48:00 -
[26] - Quote
Quote:No XP boosters or skill packs or whatever. When I say free to play or buy to play, I mean a shop with COMPLETELY cosmetic items. I'm talking about getting rid of the sub and just expanding the current aura shop. It's being done by hundreds of companies across the globe and has a proven track record.
You never answered my question. If EVE players were so eager to buy cosmetic items, then why was the Aurum store a complete failure?
Furthermore, "Other companies have done it" is not a valid argument, especially if they do not make games that are like EVE. The only F2P games that I can think of that are halfway acceptable were designed to be F2P. |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:49:00 -
[27] - Quote
Hammer Crendraven wrote:I say no. Eve is doing just fine as is for 10 years now while other games have come and gone.
Second we do not need more players in eve, TiDi is already kicking in in more than a few systems. Eve is full enough as is.
If and that is a big if, eve loses a lot of subs after Star Citizen comes out then they can do something about it. But as Star Citizen is a different kind of game flight sim vs RTS I think eve will be ok.
Then expand. Imagine the universe 10x bigger, that isn't something CCP can support with its current playerbase. why pay? |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:50:00 -
[28] - Quote
Kahega Amielden wrote:Quote:No XP boosters or skill packs or whatever. When I say free to play or buy to play, I mean a shop with COMPLETELY cosmetic items. I'm talking about getting rid of the sub and just expanding the current aura shop. It's being done by hundreds of companies across the globe and has a proven track record.
You never answered my question. If EVE players were so eager to buy cosmetic items, then why was the Aurum store a complete failure? Furthermore, "Other companies have done it" is not a valid argument, especially if they do not make games that are like EVE. The only F2P games that I can think of that are halfway acceptable were designed to be F2P.
We have no data on CCP's aura store earnings, so it's hard to say. But I bet if they added stuff like character slots and ship paints, things people actually want, then it would do MUCH better. why pay? |
Hammer Crendraven
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
70
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:55:00 -
[29] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Hammer Crendraven wrote:I say no. Eve is doing just fine as is for 10 years now while other games have come and gone.
Second we do not need more players in eve, TiDi is already kicking in in more than a few systems. Eve is full enough as is.
If and that is a big if, eve loses a lot of subs after Star Citizen comes out then they can do something about it. But as Star Citizen is a different kind of game flight sim vs RTS I think eve will be ok. Then expand. Imagine the universe 10x bigger, that isn't something CCP can support with its current playerbase.
Expand is lame, Everyone wants to play at Jita already. It does not matter how big you make it the majority will stay in Jita and cause TiDi. |
Winter Archipelago
Innocuous Infection
135
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:56:00 -
[30] - Quote
F2P EvE == Dead EvE.
StarCitizen isn't even out yet. Hell, the alpha isn't even out yet. You can hype anything. I could hype the **** I'm going to take after work as the most explosive thing to happen yet this millennium, but that doesn't make it any more than a load of ****. Ransoms are accepted in Isk, Ships, Mods, and Dolls. |
|
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:58:00 -
[31] - Quote
Hammer Crendraven wrote:Jim McMorris wrote:Hammer Crendraven wrote:I say no. Eve is doing just fine as is for 10 years now while other games have come and gone.
Second we do not need more players in eve, TiDi is already kicking in in more than a few systems. Eve is full enough as is.
If and that is a big if, eve loses a lot of subs after Star Citizen comes out then they can do something about it. But as Star Citizen is a different kind of game flight sim vs RTS I think eve will be ok. Then expand. Imagine the universe 10x bigger, that isn't something CCP can support with its current playerbase. Expand is lame, Everyone wants to play at Jita already. It does not matter how big you make it the majority will stay in Jita and cause TiDi.
There are solutions. What CCP could do is put trading-tax bonuses in certain systems, this would create the need to spread out and diversify.
Also, if you've got a universe spreading out thousands of jumps - regional markets will have more importance. With increased wars as well, importing goods would be on the rise. General higher demand and supply would encourage more frequent trading as well, which I think would make the game much more dynamic. Think of real life markets, where millions are sold every second. That's the type of complexity eve needs. why pay? |
Tollen Gallen
Xionworld
1822
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 18:59:00 -
[32] - Quote
general beanflicker wrote:Jim McMorris wrote:Alright guys I've got this one.
At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run, which is what CCP want the game to be a - a game lasting decades, not years. With biggies like Star Citizen coming round with one-time fees and no-subs, there's gonna be some serious questions asked by the players. Questions like this:
"Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?"
This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet. But when it is, who knows what'll happen to the CCP.
The big business model transFORMATION
Okay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it.
1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons.
2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay.
3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun.
4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy.
This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. I'd recommend that they do this IPO on the stockmarket they were talking about, as that will get the big businesses interested and posting articles about this awesome sci-fi sim. All of the hardcore eve fans, like the mitani, will probably buy shares - so they'll have even more money to improve the game.
As they improve the game more people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer.
Thoughts please. 10/10 TROLL
If not then op is a tool Zimmy Zeta -I f*cking love martinis.the original ones, with gin, not that vodka martini crap. |
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
1029
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:03:00 -
[33] - Quote
Quote:We have no data on CCP's aura store earnings, so it's hard to say. But I bet if they added stuff like character slots and ship paints, things people actually want, then it would do MUCH better.
The aurum store (+ associated cosmetic features, like CQ) was such a colossal failure that the playerbase revolted and the CEO of CCP provided an apology for wasting time on it.
Furthermore, who the hell needs more character slots? Second accounts are far more common. |
Arduemont
The State of War.
2303
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:04:00 -
[34] - Quote
There is a way CCP could make Eve free to play, but I am afraid they are incapable of implementing it.
Also, your are a terrible human being. "In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:04:00 -
[35] - Quote
Kahega Amielden wrote:Quote:We have no data on CCP's aura store earnings, so it's hard to say. But I bet if they added stuff like character slots and ship paints, things people actually want, then it would do MUCH better.
The aurum store (+ associated cosmetic features, like CQ) was such a colossal failure that the playerbase revolted and the CEO of CCP provided an apology for wasting time on it. Furthermore, who the hell needs more character slots? Second accounts are far more common.
Take a look at the successful offering of dual-trading plexes. Think about all of the extra revenue this has brought CCP. Now think about similar things which could be done to facilitate getting rid of the sub and/or making the game buy to play. why pay? |
Damon Blood
Back Alley Abortion Clinic Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere
1
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:05:00 -
[36] - Quote
I am not going to bash you for your ideas, but I do want to share with you what my specific situation would be if EVE went F2P.
1. EVE goes F2P and only does cash transactions for cosmetics. a. CCP loses 3 account subscriptions and I continue to play as I do today just $45 bucks a month richer.
2. EVE goes F2P and Performance is improved by those who have the cast to spend special ships/Implants/Items that CCP now places ingame to make isk. a. CCP loses 3 account subscriptions and I quit EVE.
Either Way CCP loses. I think there are many people what would end up in the exact same boat I am.
DB
|
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
1029
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:06:00 -
[37] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Kahega Amielden wrote:Quote:We have no data on CCP's aura store earnings, so it's hard to say. But I bet if they added stuff like character slots and ship paints, things people actually want, then it would do MUCH better.
The aurum store (+ associated cosmetic features, like CQ) was such a colossal failure that the playerbase revolted and the CEO of CCP provided an apology for wasting time on it. Furthermore, who the hell needs more character slots? Second accounts are far more common. Take a look at the successful offering of dual-trading plexes. Think about all of the extra revenue this has brought CCP. Now think about similar things which could be done to facilitate getting rid of the sub and/or making the game buy to play.
Dual-training PLEX is functionally very similar to simply buying a separate account. I'm not sure what your point is. |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:08:00 -
[38] - Quote
Damon Blood wrote:I am not going to bash you for your ideas, but I do want to share with you what my specific situation would be if EVE went F2P.
1. EVE goes F2P and only does cash transactions for cosmetics. a. CCP loses 3 account subscriptions and I continue to play as I do today just $45 bucks a month richer.
2. EVE goes F2P and Performance is improved by those who have the cast to spend special ships/Implants/Items that CCP now places ingame to make isk. a. CCP loses 3 account subscriptions and I quit EVE.
Either Way CCP loses. I think there are many people what would end up in the exact same boat I am.
DB
Number one is the ideal scenario though. Even though they lose your $45, they actually make $50 from the three other players who decided to start playing and found they really liked the game so they bought some dual-plexes or cool new ship decals.
These three players also create content for the game, they make an alliance and defeat the mittani. You see this game is about the players, and the more we have - the more content we have. why pay? |
Solstice Project
I'm So Meta Even This Acronym
4234
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:09:00 -
[39] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Questions like this: "Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?" A person asking this question isn't happy with the game he's playing and would have let go of EvE as soon as ANY game out there was more appealing to him.
Besides that, it's not a myth that people always come back, no matter what. That's because EvE is real and you know it too.
Quote:
This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet. But when it is, who knows what'll happen to the CCP.[/quote]This is completely irrelevant.
(too many quotes in post -.-)
That other businesses go this route, does not mean CCP is forced to go it too. Especially considering that CCP has a unique product, they can literally afford to do it differently. Besides that, it's a luxury worth using for marketing.
I felt free to your remove manipulation attempts from the quotes and restricted them to the actual message you where carrying over.
Jim McMorris wrote:1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start playing. 2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay. Character slots can't fall into this, because they have impact onto the gameplay.
Jim McMorris wrote:3) Population of EVE rises. Yes, but this is actually dramatic. Not only does CCP have to buy way more processing power than now, having more opinions around doesn't necessarily mean it's a good thing, especially considering that most of these opinions aren't made by persons above IQ100.
"4)" can be disregarded completely.
Jim McMorris wrote:This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. I'd recommend that they do this IPO on the stockmarket they were talking about, as that will get the big businesses interested and posting articles about this awesome sci-fi sim. All of the hardcore eve fans, like the mitani, will probably buy shares - so they'll have even more money to improve the game. And this outs you as the troll that you are. ^_^
Besides the stupid "This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well." ... dude, seriously ? You just couldn't resist, hu ? xD And even the "probably" ! PROBABLY ! *LOL*
I'll translate this ...
"I have no idea if this wouldn't just be a huge trainwreck and CCP would go bankrupt in six months, but it's my idea so i want it to happen!"
Jim McMorris wrote:More people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer. Based on your above paragraph, i would be forced to conclude that "CCP get richer" means that you have no idea what you're saying.
I give you a 7/10, but you made too obvious mistakes. All in one paragraph, plus the one i translated. The "This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well." was way too much. If you think about it, it clearly displays complete disregard of what'll happen to CCP.
Let's see how many respond until this gets locked. ^_^ |
Fassin-Taak
Boris Johnson's Love Children
5
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:09:00 -
[40] - Quote
**** off |
|
Leigh Akiga
State War Academy Caldari State
299
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:13:00 -
[41] - Quote
Yo Prencleeve, all because you maxed out grandmas CC buying SA accounts trying to get into goons doesnt mean the rest of us are broke. You already get free expansions. |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
866
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:13:00 -
[42] - Quote
Get out deadbeat. In this game grown-ups want to spend their money on space ships mmmmkay?
"Also, your boobs " -á CCP Eterne, 2012
|
Jessica Danikov
Clan Shadow Wolf Fatal Ascension
131
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:14:00 -
[43] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run
Right, so... EVE celebrates it's 10 year anniversary with subscriber numbers enjoying a steady but gentle increase (February this year: http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/02/28/eve-online-hits-500-000-subscribers-heads-into-second-decade/) and you think EVE is doomed?
Don't fix what isn't broken. Greed is as good as far as you don't kill your golden goose... |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:16:00 -
[44] - Quote
I never said I think EVE is done. I reckon the population will do fine in the coming months/years, but it's stale. Let's be honest, we need big change to spice things up - reenergise the game if you know what I mean.
You can rebalance null sec, which will only cause short-term wars and power shifts, or you can introduce new forces into the game. Completely change the playing field with thousands of new player. It might be costly, but if CCP do it right - the rewards will be big. why pay? |
Himnos Altar
An Errant Venture
284
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:20:00 -
[45] - Quote
Winter Archipelago wrote:F2P EvE == Dead EvE.
StarCitizen isn't even out yet. Hell, the alpha isn't even out yet. You can hype anything. I could hype the **** I'm going to take after work as the most explosive thing to happen yet this millennium, but that doesn't make it any more than a load of ****.
Oh boy, remember Spore! Spore was awesome! Spore was the biggest bad-ass thing Will Wright had ever done! Spore has a space game! Spore was oing to be the ULTIMATE GAME EVER!
Oh, wait....... |
Za'afiel
Federation Militia Bandits
11
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:21:00 -
[46] - Quote
Star Citizen is dying. Shoot them all! Be polite. |
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
672
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:22:00 -
[47] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote: No XP boosters or skill packs or whatever. When I say free to play or buy to play, I mean a shop with COMPLETELY cosmetic items. I'm talking about getting rid of the sub and just expanding the current aura shop. It's being done by hundreds of companies across the globe and has a proven track record.
So? I could skill offline an unlimited number of characters for free? Seriously does it sound like a good idea?
|
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
5023
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:22:00 -
[48] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:I never said I think EVE is done. I reckon the population will do fine in the coming months/years, but it's stale. Let's be honest, we need big change to spice things up - reenergise the game if you know what I mean. You can rebalance null sec, which will only cause short-term wars and power shifts, or you can introduce new forces into the game. Completely change the playing field with thousands of new player. It might be costly, but if CCP do it right - the rewards will be big. that goose is all but roasted There are no goons. The goons' 0.0 dream is over.
"Progodlegend said the goal of N3 is to destroy Goonswarm Federation, but in reality NCdot is in Fountain due to the fact it is virtually the last place there is action." ~NC., Fountain 2013 |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:24:00 -
[49] - Quote
Sura Sadiva wrote:Jim McMorris wrote: No XP boosters or skill packs or whatever. When I say free to play or buy to play, I mean a shop with COMPLETELY cosmetic items. I'm talking about getting rid of the sub and just expanding the current aura shop. It's being done by hundreds of companies across the globe and has a proven track record.
So? I could skill offline an unlimited number of characters for free? Seriously does it sound like a good idea?
This is one problem with the plan I think. How do you stop people just making new accounts to bypass character limits? They could do some techno IP/hardware bans or whatever, but that might not be practical.
There is a practical limit to how much you can manage as well. You can't be updating thousands of skill queues each day. why pay? |
Pennywise le'Fluffer
University of Caille Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:25:00 -
[50] - Quote
It seems obvious to me why EVE hasn't gone F2P. They make all their money on Skill Trainer Online via PLEX and sub money. I would bet Aurum doesn't even account for 10% of total sales. If the game is F2P every idiots has 10,000 alts and they lose all that money.
The only way they'd make more would be if they made it even more Pay 2 Win and just sold skilled characters created out of thin air and dramatic training boots far beyond the current implant system but a LOT of people would quit and EVE would be just another mediocre F2P title.
I've spent money on World of Tanks and War Thunder and was a (regretful Legendary Founder) Mechwarrior Online, but nowhere near as much as on EVE and I'm a newbie who started playing during the last alliance tournament. I've also played several games that were B2P or subscription based that switched to F2P models and I no longer play ANY of them because it ruined the games AND the community (LOTRO, Rift, and Global Agenda, to name a few off the top of my head).
IMO, F2P would only work for EVE if the game had been built around that from the beginning but a lot of fundamental mechanics would have be completely redone and that would make it into something else; not EVE. |
|
Himnos Altar
An Errant Venture
285
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:26:00 -
[51] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Damon Blood wrote:I am not going to bash you for your ideas, but I do want to share with you what my specific situation would be if EVE went F2P.
1. EVE goes F2P and only does cash transactions for cosmetics. a. CCP loses 3 account subscriptions and I continue to play as I do today just $45 bucks a month richer.
2. EVE goes F2P and Performance is improved by those who have the cast to spend special ships/Implants/Items that CCP now places ingame to make isk. a. CCP loses 3 account subscriptions and I quit EVE.
Either Way CCP loses. I think there are many people what would end up in the exact same boat I am.
DB
Number one is the ideal scenario though. Even though they lose your $45, they actually make $50 from the three other players who decided to start playing and found they really liked the game so they bought some dual-plexes or cool new ship decals. These three players also create content for the game, they make an alliance and defeat the mittani. You see this game is about the players, and the more we have - the more content we have.
*facepalm*
REALLY?
You suck at math, dude.
Okay, let's look at it this way. He's paying $45 a month. He quits.
3 more people buy EVE for $150 total.
4 months in, these people have brought CCP $150 in revenue.
Or, we keep this business model, and he keeps paying $45 per month.
4 months in, He's brought CCP $180 in revenue.
Gee, I wonder which one CCP would prefer.
If it were me in the Buy once, play foreer EVE model, I doubt I'd buy the dual training (like I very likely never will today) or ship skins. Because I am a money grubbing son of a ***** |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:28:00 -
[52] - Quote
Himnos Altar wrote:Jim McMorris wrote:Damon Blood wrote:I am not going to bash you for your ideas, but I do want to share with you what my specific situation would be if EVE went F2P.
1. EVE goes F2P and only does cash transactions for cosmetics. a. CCP loses 3 account subscriptions and I continue to play as I do today just $45 bucks a month richer.
2. EVE goes F2P and Performance is improved by those who have the cast to spend special ships/Implants/Items that CCP now places ingame to make isk. a. CCP loses 3 account subscriptions and I quit EVE.
Either Way CCP loses. I think there are many people what would end up in the exact same boat I am.
DB
Number one is the ideal scenario though. Even though they lose your $45, they actually make $50 from the three other players who decided to start playing and found they really liked the game so they bought some dual-plexes or cool new ship decals. These three players also create content for the game, they make an alliance and defeat the mittani. You see this game is about the players, and the more we have - the more content we have. *facepalm* REALLY? You suck at math, dude. Okay, let's look at it this way. He's paying $45 a month. He quits. 3 more people buy EVE for $150 total. 4 months in, these people have brought CCP $150 in revenue. Or, we keep this business model, and he keeps paying $45 per month. 4 months in, He's brought CCP $180 in revenue. Gee, I wonder which one CCP would prefer.
Yes but by those four months, even more people start playing and even more maybe even use the cosmetic cash shop.
why pay? |
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
672
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:28:00 -
[53] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote: This is one problem with the plan I think. How do you stop people just making new accounts to bypass character limits? They could do some techno IP/hardware bans or whatever, but that might not be practical.
There is a practical limit to how much you can manage as well. You can't be updating thousands of skill queues each day.
Oh, please...
|
Bagrat Skalski
Poseidaon
454
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:29:00 -
[54] - Quote
We don't need f2p right now in eve. Look at dust, it is free to play and what?
Free to play is not some kind of magic wand that will make your game better. Protect yourself from CONCORD today! Tinfoil hats, quality product. Styled after pirate hats. |
Himnos Altar
An Errant Venture
285
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:31:00 -
[55] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Himnos Altar wrote:Jim McMorris wrote:Damon Blood wrote:I am not going to bash you for your ideas, but I do want to share with you what my specific situation would be if EVE went F2P.
1. EVE goes F2P and only does cash transactions for cosmetics. a. CCP loses 3 account subscriptions and I continue to play as I do today just $45 bucks a month richer.
2. EVE goes F2P and Performance is improved by those who have the cast to spend special ships/Implants/Items that CCP now places ingame to make isk. a. CCP loses 3 account subscriptions and I quit EVE.
Either Way CCP loses. I think there are many people what would end up in the exact same boat I am.
DB
Number one is the ideal scenario though. Even though they lose your $45, they actually make $50 from the three other players who decided to start playing and found they really liked the game so they bought some dual-plexes or cool new ship decals. These three players also create content for the game, they make an alliance and defeat the mittani. You see this game is about the players, and the more we have - the more content we have. *facepalm* REALLY? You suck at math, dude. Okay, let's look at it this way. He's paying $45 a month. He quits. 3 more people buy EVE for $150 total. 4 months in, these people have brought CCP $150 in revenue. Or, we keep this business model, and he keeps paying $45 per month. 4 months in, He's brought CCP $180 in revenue. Gee, I wonder which one CCP would prefer. Yes but by those four months, even more people start playing and even more maybe even use the cosmetic cash shop.
Oh, just like in the last few months all kinds of new people have started playing EVE as it is today? |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
565
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:32:00 -
[56] - Quote
I don't know. I've been thinking about quitting once I get my Occulus Rift and it turns out that its great as everyone says it is.
Sadly, I plexed all my accounts til January 30th. I'll most likely play enough to put one plex in each so I can renew without paying money.
I would have to agree that EVE is getting stale, but I could just be burnt out from making billions of isk in a short period of time.
Maybe I just need a break. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
3375
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:33:00 -
[57] - Quote
I've stopped believing in transformations ever since I saw the marauders on SiSi. |
Orakkus
Wraithguard. Dirt Nap Squad.
225
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:34:00 -
[58] - Quote
-1 to OP.
Just.. No. He's not just famous, he's "IN" famous. - Ned Nederlander
|
Anomaly One
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:40:00 -
[59] - Quote
As a fellow mouth breather I agree with the OP |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3208
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:41:00 -
[60] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:I don't know. I've been thinking about quitting once I get my Occulus Rift and it turns out that its great as everyone says it is.
Sadly, I plexed all my accounts til January 30th. I'll most likely play enough to put one plex in each so I can renew without paying money.
I would have to agree that EVE is getting stale, but I could just be burnt out from making billions of isk in a short period of time.
Maybe I just need a break.
Yea, it's you. I've been playing since 2007, not one intentional break (only time ive been away from the game was for work trips, internet outages and the like) and I'm still not burned out or finding the game the least bit stale. My favorite saying on the matter is "if you aren't having fun in a sandbox, it's not the sands fault".
I'll play SC too, I'll also laugh at the legions of disappointed and angry folks who bought into the hype realize that no matter how cool it ends up being, it won't wipe your backside or walk your dog for you because it's just a game. |
|
Batelle
Komm susser Tod
255
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:42:00 -
[61] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet.
That's because those MMO's want to be WoW-killers and then discover they can't hack it. No one's moving away from subs voluntarily. Fighting is Magic |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
566
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:48:00 -
[62] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:"if you aren't having fun in a sandbox, it's not the sands fault".
The sandbox could be full of cat poop.
"Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Desivo Delta Visseroff
Cedar Knolls Research STEEL BROTHERHOOD
43
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:48:00 -
[63] - Quote
The OP is obviously and EA alt.
I really hate feeding trolls but:
1. http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/10/29/command-conquer-and-the-curse-of-the-free-to-play-rts
2. http://www.dorkadia.com/2012/11/29/the-failings-of-the-swtor-free-to-play-conversion/
Also, If you're going to post troll threads and terrible ideas, POST WITH YOUR MAIN! don't hide behind an alt. I need to rebuild my watch list the next time I log on |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:50:00 -
[64] - Quote
Desivo Delta Visseroff wrote:
This is actually my main and please get involved in the debate - I don't really like personal insults.
I genuinely think the game'll be more dynamic with a new business model. why pay? |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3208
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:52:00 -
[65] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:"if you aren't having fun in a sandbox, it's not the sands fault". The sandbox could be full of cat poop.
Yea but if you're the cat, why complain, just stop pooping lol.
|
Baali Tekitsu
B0SSAURA xXPlease Pandemic Citizens Reloaded Alliance.Xx
191
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:54:00 -
[66] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Desivo Delta Visseroff wrote: This is actually my main and please get involved in the debate - I don't really like personal insults. I genuinely think the game'll be more dynamic with a new business model.
I would even go as far as to say that we need additional to the f2p model the diablo 3 auction house. |
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:55:00 -
[67] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:"if you aren't having fun in a sandbox, it's not the sands fault". The sandbox could be full of cat poop. Yea but if you're the cat, why complain, just stop pooping lol.
It's not fair if only the cat gets to have fun. why pay? |
Desivo Delta Visseroff
Cedar Knolls Research STEEL BROTHERHOOD
43
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:56:00 -
[68] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:
This is actually my main and please get involved in the debate - I don't really like personal insults.
I genuinely think the game'll be more dynamic with a new business model.
Fantastic! Also, simply no. There were other threads made on this topc:
1. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3294036#post3294036
2. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3680780#post3680780
3. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3245451#post3245451
4. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3148050#post3148050
As you can tell, There is resounding opposition to even the idea of introducing a free to play model.
My final contribution to this subject has been voiced by others and I will reiterate the same here: DEATH 2 MICROTRANSACTIONS |
Hammer Crendraven
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
70
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:56:00 -
[69] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:I never said I think EVE is done. I reckon the population will do fine in the coming months/years, but it's stale. Let's be honest, we need big change to spice things up - reenergise the game if you know what I mean. You can rebalance null sec, which will only cause short-term wars and power shifts, or you can introduce new forces into the game. Completely change the playing field with thousands of new player. It might be costly, but if CCP do it right - the rewards will be big.
You have said it yourself a few times in this thread. It is the players that make the content of the game not CCP.
If the game is stale it is not up to CCP to fix it. That would be the players job. |
Montami
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
11
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 19:58:00 -
[70] - Quote
0/10. Lots of effort, very little result except people who exclaim in horror.
Could have used a different theme and made it less obvious than P2W. |
|
Jim McMorris
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
24
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:01:00 -
[71] - Quote
Montami wrote:0/10. Lots of effort, very little result except people who exclaim in horror.
Could have used a different theme and made it less obvious than P2W.
I'm starting to think it's you who's trolling.
This is a genuine debate and I'm not proposing PW2. I'm proposing a system like Guild War 2's, where only cosmetic items are offered. Is this practical? I think so, but that's the point of this thread, to discuss and debate. why pay? |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
566
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:01:00 -
[72] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:"if you aren't having fun in a sandbox, it's not the sands fault". The sandbox could be full of cat poop. Yea but if you're the cat, why complain, just stop pooping lol.
I'm pretty sure this is someone else's poop. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
I Love Boobies
All Hail Boobies
656
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:01:00 -
[73] - Quote
Dude... I haven't paid real money to play this game in like... years. Even before PLEX, when GTCs were the preferred form of payment with ISK. *removed inappropriate signature* - CCP Eterne |
Prince Kobol
1069
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:08:00 -
[74] - Quote
Andski wrote:Free to play is a move made by developers of failing pay to play titles to avoid losing what they invested in development. Free to play doesn't really work unless you actually gain a substantial advantage from paying.
Yes, I am sure Riot agree with your assessment that is if they can hear you over their estimated $200 million earnings in 2013. |
Winter Archipelago
Innocuous Infection
135
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:13:00 -
[75] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:There is a practical limit to how much you can manage as well. You can't be updating thousands of skill queues each day. My skill queue generally lasts me about 30+ days at a time, and that's for just a single skill. I get excited when I have to change a skill in fewer than two weeks.
It may be a decent amount of clicking in the very beginning, but as you get towards the higher end of the skills you need, you're looking at multi-week training for a single skill. Ransoms are accepted in Isk, Ships, Mods, and Dolls. |
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings Point Blank Alliance
1902
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:18:00 -
[76] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote: How do you stop people just making new accounts to bypass character limits? They could do some techno IP/hardware bans or whatever, but that might not be practical.
You can't. People will circumvent it, no matter what.
Quote:There is a practical limit to how much you can manage as well. You can't be updating thousands of skill queues each day.
Thousands? No. Dozens? Most assuredly. Farmers gonna farm, grinders gonna grind. And make no mistake, a true F2P model requires that you up the grind substantially. Rifterlings pirate corporation is now recruiting pilots for lowsec solo & small gang operations. Visit our website at www.rifterlings.com or join our in game channel weflyrifters to speak to a recruiter. |
Baali Tekitsu
B0SSAURA xXPlease Pandemic Citizens Reloaded Alliance.Xx
191
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:24:00 -
[77] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote:Andski wrote:Free to play is a move made by developers of failing pay to play titles to avoid losing what they invested in development. Free to play doesn't really work unless you actually gain a substantial advantage from paying. Yes, I am sure Riot agree with your assessment that is if they can hear you over their estimated $200 million earnings in 2013.
I think CCPs $66 million in 2012 are far better considering how EvE has only a tiny fraction of the LoL player base. |
Prince Kobol
1069
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:25:00 -
[78] - Quote
Winter Archipelago wrote:Jim McMorris wrote:There is a practical limit to how much you can manage as well. You can't be updating thousands of skill queues each day. My skill queue generally lasts me about 30+ days at a time, and that's for just a single skill. I get excited when I have to change a skill in fewer than two weeks. It may be a decent amount of clicking in the very beginning, but as you get towards the higher end of the skills you need, you're looking at multi-week training for a single skill. Prince Kobol wrote: Yes, I am sure Riot agree with your assessment that is if they can hear you over their estimated $200 million earnings in 2013.
The LoL community are some of the most horrific wretches of humanity that exist. I quit playing LoL because of said community, despite enjoying the game. That is one of the things I'd rather see NOT happen to EvE.
No arguments from me although I still do play LoL.
Games which are designed from Day 1 to be F2P do well.
Games which start of as subscription based and then convert to F2P is usually a sign that they are not doing to well. |
Prince Kobol
1069
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:26:00 -
[79] - Quote
Baali Tekitsu wrote:Prince Kobol wrote:Andski wrote:Free to play is a move made by developers of failing pay to play titles to avoid losing what they invested in development. Free to play doesn't really work unless you actually gain a substantial advantage from paying. Yes, I am sure Riot agree with your assessment that is if they can hear you over their estimated $200 million earnings in 2013. I think CCPs $66 million in 2012 are far better considering how EvE has only a tiny fraction of the LoL player base.
Very true.. again no arguments from me.
If CCP ever announced they were going to a F2P model I would sell all my toons + assets on ebay and leave |
Maurice deSaxe
1st Steps Academy Fidelas Constans
8
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:31:00 -
[80] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:
scammed by goons.
/
Show me on the usb rifter where the goons touched you. |
|
Maurice deSaxe
1st Steps Academy Fidelas Constans
8
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:32:00 -
[81] - Quote
I Love Boobies wrote:Dude... I haven't paid real money to play this game in like... years. Even before PLEX, when GTCs were the preferred form of payment with ISK. And this . You can pay for 3 accounts in less then 12 hours of game play a month.
|
ConranAntoni
Empyrean Warriors Insidious Empire
105
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:38:00 -
[82] - Quote
Hey look.
Another shitpost thread. |
Baali Tekitsu
B0SSAURA xXPlease Pandemic Citizens Reloaded Alliance.Xx
191
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:41:00 -
[83] - Quote
ConranAntoni wrote:Hey look.
Another shitpost thread. Hey look
another meta post |
Lucy Journey
Between a Rock and a Hard Place
1
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:42:00 -
[84] - Quote
This thread again!?!
"Oh, let's alienate all of our existing paying customers, and hope that new players join the game instead to make up for the loss of revenue" |
Anomaly One
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
3
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 20:59:00 -
[85] - Quote
Quote: The LoL community are some of the most horrific wretches of humanity that exist. I quit playing LoL because of said community, despite enjoying the game. That is one of the things I'd rather see NOT happen to EvE.
So ******* true I played that game since the very first day of S1, diamond 1 and don't give a ****, LoL has real psychos, the bad ones, Eve has the good fun loving ones also some forms of boosting have gotten out of hand iiirk.. still play it but so much less now, gets boring after 4 years, anyway..
This thread is now about teemo. |
Amhra Rho
Accujac Elimination
158
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 21:05:00 -
[86] - Quote
Star Citizen is not even in the same game class as Eve Online. The only similarity between them is spaceships.
Tell you a story. Since I started Eve, a dozen other MMOs (which all really WERE in the same game class) came and went for me. The only one left standing is Eve. There's real reasons why your Eve character doesn't do /dance. |
Jarod Garamonde
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
529
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 21:35:00 -
[87] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Alright guys I've got this one. At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run, which is what CCP want the game to be a - a game lasting decades, not years. With biggies like Star Citizen coming round with one-time fees and no-subs, there's gonna be some serious questions asked by the players. Questions like this: "Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?" This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet. But when it is, who knows what'll happen to the CCP. The big business model transFORMATIONOkay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it. 1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons. 2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay. 3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun. 4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy. This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. I'd recommend that they do this IPO on the stockmarket they were talking about, as that will get the big businesses interested and posting articles about this awesome sci-fi sim. All of the hardcore eve fans, like the mitani, will probably buy shares - so they'll have even more money to improve the game. As they improve the game more people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer. Thoughts please. Thread update:Thanks for feedback guys, I think there are a few more points worth adding here. 1) CCP should also consider the option of buy to play. Perhaps a -ú39.99 to get access to the game client, but fees after that - this would ensure there is a paywall to supplement CCP profits and keep out the hacking community. With the increased profits, CCP would have greater confidence in following a strictly cosmetic cash4items scheme. Buy to play has been an extremely successful model and I think it is particularly relevant to EVE ONLINE. Why? The model in GW2 has triggered slow but steady growth, this is the type of growth CCP has always been experiencing with EVE. http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/08/23/lead-designer-says-guild-wars-2-is-growing-its-playerbase/2) Secondly, a steam launch as free to play would be a great bolster to current numbers. 0.9 of the world's population has a steam account. http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/10/30/0-9-of-the-global-population-have-steam-accounts/
Please biomass.
CCP, please raise sub fees to $20, so guys like this will desub and stop stupiding up your game world.... That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right... |
TharOkha
0asis Group
636
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 21:46:00 -
[88] - Quote
Hey OP. Did you know that: -Free to play is just renamed "DEMO VERSION" ? (like "Cloud" is just renamed "the internet") -EVE is already "true free to play" (PLEX)? -Star citizen is no.5454866322 game in a row which is going to "kill EVE definitely"? -You are using textbooks fallacies? -EVE is here for more than 10 years now only because people like you and your stupid ideas are not in the CCP management? -you would do a favor for many of us here if you biomass yourself right now ? GÇ£If reality can destroy the dream, why shouldn't the dream destroy reality?GÇ¥ |
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
439
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 21:52:00 -
[89] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:lots of stuff... Thoughts please.
Thank you for your ideas, but no.
Of course it's CCP's privilege to go down that road. But not with my money and not with my time.
Remove insurance. |
Gogela
Freeport Exploration Loosely Affiliated Pirates Alliance
2778
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 21:54:00 -
[90] - Quote
shipGÇáosGÇá^2
No.
|
|
Jarod Garamonde
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
529
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:19:00 -
[91] - Quote
TharOkha wrote:Hey OP. Did you know that: -Free to play is just renamed "DEMO VERSION" ? (like "Cloud" is just renamed "the internet") -EVE is already "true free to play" (PLEX)? -Star citizen is no.5454866322 game in a row which is going to "kill EVE definitely"? -You are using textbooks fallacies? -EVE is here for more than 10 years now only because people like you and your stupid ideas are not in the CCP management? -you would do a favor for many of us here if you biomass yourself right now ?
That's two votes for "biomass" That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right... |
Minmatar Citizen160812
The LGBT Last Supper
572
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:22:00 -
[92] - Quote
Why hello there Mr. Decker it's nice to meet your in-game character. |
PotatoOverdose
SONS of LEGION RISE of LEGION
464
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:22:00 -
[93] - Quote
Vote #3 for biomass. Also, eve has already lasted over a decade. Their business model is fine. |
Garandras
Black Aces Against ALL Authorities
25
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:24:00 -
[94] - Quote
I do love people that say EvE cant survive the long run..
EvE has been going strong for 10years... very few games are considered worth playing after a single year.. |
Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
454
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:42:00 -
[95] - Quote
Amhra Rho wrote:Star Citizen is not even in the same game class as Eve Online. The only similarity between them is spaceships. But they don't even look like spaceships, more like jet fighters. Jet fighters with toilets. I pledged for this game long ago, but the more stuff they show off the less appealing I find sc as a whole. |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
569
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:45:00 -
[96] - Quote
Karak Terrel wrote:Amhra Rho wrote:Star Citizen is not even in the same game class as Eve Online. The only similarity between them is spaceships. But they don't even look like spaceships, more like jet fighters. Jet fighters with toilets. I pledged for this game long ago, but the more stuff they show off the less appealing I find sc as a whole.
Did you never play Wing Commander? I mean, if you didn't like that then you won't like SC. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Amhra Rho
Accujac Elimination
160
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:48:00 -
[97] - Quote
Karak Terrel wrote:Amhra Rho wrote:Star Citizen is not even in the same game class as Eve Online. The only similarity between them is spaceships. But they don't even look like spaceships, more like jet fighters. Jet fighters with toilets. I pledged for this game long ago, but the more stuff they show off the less appealing I find sc as a whole. I plan to take a look at it, but I'm predicting that in the final analysis, StarCit will be yet another also-ran to Eve for me. There's real reasons why your Eve character doesn't do /dance. |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
570
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:50:00 -
[98] - Quote
Well the largest player flown ships on SC is the Idris:
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/13097-Idris-Corvette-Revealed
Can handle two fighters and lots of manned guns so you need a group of people to effectively run the ship. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Amhra Rho
Accujac Elimination
160
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:52:00 -
[99] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Karak Terrel wrote:Amhra Rho wrote:Star Citizen is not even in the same game class as Eve Online. The only similarity between them is spaceships. But they don't even look like spaceships, more like jet fighters. Jet fighters with toilets. I pledged for this game long ago, but the more stuff they show off the less appealing I find sc as a whole. Did you never play Wing Commander? I mean, if you didn't like that then you won't like SC. Never did, although I heard good things about it. Wing Commander never was in the "running", however - quite simply, I only do MMOs. There's real reasons why your Eve character doesn't do /dance. |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
570
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:54:00 -
[100] - Quote
Amhra Rho wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Karak Terrel wrote:Amhra Rho wrote:Star Citizen is not even in the same game class as Eve Online. The only similarity between them is spaceships. But they don't even look like spaceships, more like jet fighters. Jet fighters with toilets. I pledged for this game long ago, but the more stuff they show off the less appealing I find sc as a whole. Did you never play Wing Commander? I mean, if you didn't like that then you won't like SC. Never did, although I heard good things about it. Wing Commander never was in the "running", however - quite simply, I only do MMOs.
You must be young. Wing Commander was before MMO's in the early 1990's. I had a copy on the SNES. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
|
Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
455
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 22:54:00 -
[101] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Karak Terrel wrote:Amhra Rho wrote:Star Citizen is not even in the same game class as Eve Online. The only similarity between them is spaceships. But they don't even look like spaceships, more like jet fighters. Jet fighters with toilets. I pledged for this game long ago, but the more stuff they show off the less appealing I find sc as a whole. Did you never play Wing Commander? I mean, if you didn't like that then you won't like SC. Wing Commander Privateer is basically the reason I play EVE. I did not care much about the other Wing Commander titles. |
Karen Avioras
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
3
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 23:04:00 -
[102] - Quote
You're a terrible person. |
Amhra Rho
Accujac Elimination
160
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 23:27:00 -
[103] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Amhra Rho wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Karak Terrel wrote:Amhra Rho wrote:Star Citizen is not even in the same game class as Eve Online. The only similarity between them is spaceships. But they don't even look like spaceships, more like jet fighters. Jet fighters with toilets. I pledged for this game long ago, but the more stuff they show off the less appealing I find sc as a whole. Did you never play Wing Commander? I mean, if you didn't like that then you won't like SC. Never did, although I heard good things about it. Wing Commander never was in the "running", however - quite simply, I only do MMOs. You must be young. Wing Commander was before MMO's in the early 1990's. I had a copy on the SNES. Make no mistake. I may be young, but that doesn't mean I'm not treacherous
The "theme" doesn't matter - it's the game type. There's space MMOs, fantasy MMOs, urban ghetto MMOs, science fiction MMOs, and even Korean mythology MMOs. It's not the spaceships - or "space jets" - it's the game type that counts. There's real reasons why your Eve character doesn't do /dance. |
Sir Spottington
Merchants Trade Consortium The Last Chancers.
35
|
Posted - 2013.10.30 23:31:00 -
[104] - Quote
no
please leave
|
Xavier Higdon
Wolfbane Hauler Inc RECURSIVE ASCENSION
42
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 00:43:00 -
[105] - Quote
I was seriously excited about Star Citizen until they called a corvette size vessel a capital ship. What kind of wimpy space empire can't build anything bigger than that? Dogfights don't interest me one bit, I want grand strategy. A proud member of Wolfbane Hauler Inc. We are currently recruiting pilots of all skill levels. We need both industrial combat specialists. For more information see our ad:-áhttps://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3764273&#post3764273 |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3209
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 00:50:00 -
[106] - Quote
Xavier Higdon wrote:I was seriously excited about Star Citizen until they called a corvette size vessel a capital ship. What kind of wimpy space empire can't build anything bigger than that? Dogfights don't interest me one bit, I want grand strategy.
I lvoed Wing Commander (even read the crappy novels lol), but I'm like you, I'm not interested in dogfighting anymore either. I'll play SC because it's about space and such, but if I fall in love with it it will be becuase of other aspects.
|
destiny2
Perkone Caldari State
215
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 01:51:00 -
[107] - Quote
EVE has been around for what 10 years now. and still going strong, while half these scrubs who make pointless threads where still playing Pokemon,
If eve was free to play, it be like playing, minecraft with worst graphics,
*and ina sense eve is already free to play, if your one of those players who can generate enough isk for a plex each month,* |
Baaldor
In Igne Morim Easily Excited
156
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 02:17:00 -
[108] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Star Citizen is better,,,no really...Guys?/
Posting in another stealth "Star Citizen is better because I paid money for something that does not exist, that will fail and need more dumbasses to share in the misery" |
Sheldor Amouh
6
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 02:29:00 -
[109] - Quote
If you look at other "free to play" models two things happen. First it actually becomes much more expensive to play. You get x gate jumps in y amount of time, more are $.10 each. You can post z number of orders, then they are $.50 each. Training time is quadroupled but you can buy speed ups. Same with build times. You can run b number of missions a day then they are$1 a piece, more for higher lvl missions. Second, for the reasons above, it becomes pay to win.
Sub prices are not what keep subs low for this game. Seeing one movie by youself cost more than a one month sub. A fifth of cheap liquor costs more than a one month sub. Depending on were you live three gallons of gad costs etc, etc, etc. People waste exponentially more money on useless junk. But its because they want to.
What makes Eve the game it is is also what keeps many people away. Believe it or not most people dont enjoy having to be suspicious of every person they meet because its a scam or an outright threat to their possesions or existance. Thats what real life is for. Most people play games to escape reality, not re-experience it.
If you want millions of subs, make Eve an instant satisfaction, low effort, no risk World of Poke Kitty game. If you want Eve to be the game it is, live with it being niche.
And the primary reason Star Citizen wont dent eve are its the millions of subs version of Eve in single player format.
IMHO. Buzzards gotta eat, same as worms. |
Xen Solarus
Inner 5phere
588
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 02:30:00 -
[110] - Quote
Another EvE is dying thread? Who would have thought? Post with your main, like a BOSS! |
|
To Be Me
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
21
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 02:45:00 -
[111] - Quote
ur things belong to me |
AnUnskilled Pilot
State War Academy Caldari State
7
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 02:47:00 -
[112] - Quote
What I do know is that the majority of my friends have spent 100s of dollars on dota2 for enhancements that do not effect gameplay, so it's possible for a mainstream game to succeed with this model |
Matokin Lemant
5
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 03:10:00 -
[113] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Alright guys I've got this one. At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run, which is what CCP want the game to be a - a game lasting decades, not years. With biggies like Star Citizen coming round with one-time fees and no-subs, there's gonna be some serious questions asked by the players. Questions like this: "Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?" This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet. But when it is, who knows what'll happen to the CCP. The big business model transFORMATIONOkay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it. 1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons. 2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay. 3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun. 4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy. This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. I'd recommend that they do this IPO on the stockmarket they were talking about, as that will get the big businesses interested and posting articles about this awesome sci-fi sim. All of the hardcore eve fans, like the mitani, will probably buy shares - so they'll have even more money to improve the game. As they improve the game more people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer. Thoughts please. Thread update:Thanks for feedback guys, I think there are a few more points worth adding here. 1) CCP should also consider the option of buy to play. Perhaps a -ú39.99 to get access to the game client, but fees after that - this would ensure there is a paywall to supplement CCP profits and keep out the hacking community. With the increased profits, CCP would have greater confidence in following a strictly cosmetic cash4items scheme. Buy to play has been an extremely successful model and I think it is particularly relevant to EVE ONLINE. Why? The model in GW2 has triggered slow but steady growth, this is the type of growth CCP has always been experiencing with EVE. http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/08/23/lead-designer-says-guild-wars-2-is-growing-its-playerbase/2) Secondly, a steam launch as free to play would be a great bolster to current numbers. 0.9 of the world's population has a steam account. http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/10/30/0-9-of-the-global-population-have-steam-accounts/
I think your on to something with this.
You know I would not mind eve being free to play or a one time payment as long as CCP dont follow some games by adding superior ships, mods and ammo (basically anything would effect game pay ) that you could buy. And I think that is mostly what the community is most afraid of eve turning in to a "pay to win" type of game.
If CCP stays away from the "pay to win" model and sells merely vanity related items this could work.
I would like to throw out an other idea (multi boxers my hate me but) have your first account/toon free and have to pay -ú25.99 to grant the ability to make more then one toon or accont this combined with the "Pay for vanity" model would net even more income for CCP |
Caviar Liberta
Moira. Villore Accords
195
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 03:30:00 -
[114] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Kahega Amielden wrote:Quote:No XP boosters or skill packs or whatever. When I say free to play or buy to play, I mean a shop with COMPLETELY cosmetic items. I'm talking about getting rid of the sub and just expanding the current aura shop. It's being done by hundreds of companies across the globe and has a proven track record.
You never answered my question. If EVE players were so eager to buy cosmetic items, then why was the Aurum store a complete failure? Furthermore, "Other companies have done it" is not a valid argument, especially if they do not make games that are like EVE. The only F2P games that I can think of that are halfway acceptable were designed to be F2P. We have no data on CCP's aura store earnings, so it's hard to say. But I bet if they added stuff like character slots and ship paints, things people actually want, then it would do MUCH better.
No data perhaps but usually if a company notices something producing earnings they will make said earner bigger and more diverse. By making it bigger it makes it more appealing for people to spend more.
The store pretty much died on the vine as most people play eve for spaceships and not avatar dress up. |
Yummy Chocolate
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1902
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 08:08:00 -
[115] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:EVE cannot survive in the long-run
I want to punch you so bad... Frostys Virpio > CCP: Continously Crying Playerbase Felicity Love >... was thinking "moar popcorn"... but now, seeing the truly awesome contribution this thread is going to make to the Greater Glory Of EVE.... imagonnamakkadapizza.... |
Baali Tekitsu
B0SSAURA xXPlease Pandemic Citizens Reloaded Alliance.Xx
192
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 08:08:00 -
[116] - Quote
Yummy Chocolate wrote:Jim McMorris wrote:EVE cannot survive in the long-run I want to punch you so bad... EvE is ded #yolo |
Marexlovox
The Scope Gallente Federation
9
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 08:09:00 -
[117] - Quote
I have seen good games die because of the free-to-play / pay-to-win model. Monthy sub is fine where its at. No, that it all. |
Prince Kobol
1070
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 08:29:00 -
[118] - Quote
The only thing can kill Eve is CCP.
Eve is a very niche game and as such it will most likely never have a direct competitor.
As much as I am looking forward to SC and will be playing it, I will still play Eve (if I am still here) as they are 2 different games.
The problem with EVE is not any other game but the direction, or lack of it from CCP.
Yeah you can say they have a 5 year plan blah blah blah, I'm sorry but I have long stop believing anything CCP say. You can say I have zero faith in CCP these days.
Personally for me, Eve has stagnated.
I don't know if it was Incarna which has killed any ambition CCP had or if its because they are spreading themselves to thin with everything they are trying to do.
Either way, again its just for me, I only really find myself logging in when pings go out. |
Radamant Nemess
Caribbean Coke Enterprises
21
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 08:45:00 -
[119] - Quote
No. I don`t want the hordes of third world zombies swarming my favourite game. Now go away and take f2p with you. i can fail at any speed you like |
Kialopreyst
Hole Exploitation Inc. Goonswarm Federation
38
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 08:47:00 -
[120] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:All current subscribers receive free copy of game.
You know that the software is already free right?
|
|
Maekchu
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
12
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 08:54:00 -
[121] - Quote
Farm that ISK to get yourself a PLEX, and you got yourself a F2P.
Your "initial" investment is only the first month of subs.
But no, the F2P model does not work in EVE, because of how the skill system works.
|
Yummy Chocolate
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
1909
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 09:23:00 -
[122] - Quote
Kialopreyst wrote:Jim McMorris wrote:All current subscribers receive free copy of game. You know that the software is already free right? he said "free copy of game". that means we lost. Frostys Virpio > CCP: Continously Crying Playerbase Felicity Love >... was thinking "moar popcorn"... but now, seeing the truly awesome contribution this thread is going to make to the Greater Glory Of EVE.... imagonnamakkadapizza.... |
Lugalbandak
Anunnaku Industrial Corp. Northern Associates.
221
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 09:30:00 -
[123] - Quote
uuh dunno , already plexing my accounts , it is kinda free , jeah okey i need to grind 600mil but thats okey The police horse is the only animal in the world that haz his male genitals on his back |
GreenSeed
720
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 09:31:00 -
[124] - Quote
the f2p model is not compatible with eve. and looking at the new generation of MMOs, none of the big ones is f2p, they are all paid. nwo, everquestnext, titan, etc, etc.
also, titan is a space mmo from blizzard, once it gets the official announcement this general forum will get unbearable. |
Skeln Thargensen
Alpha Sperglords
258
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 09:37:00 -
[125] - Quote
Xavier Higdon wrote:I was seriously excited about Star Citizen until they called a corvette size vessel a capital ship. What kind of wimpy space empire can't build anything bigger than that? Dogfights don't interest me one bit, I want grand strategy.
yes this is what makes the comparisons void, it's all on a different scale. eve won't scale down and SC won't scale up.
I'm excited for it but i won't be dropping my eve subs. what makes me drop my eve subs is when i've done everything and there's no new big things in a couple of year's time.
(don't worry, i'll contract my stuffs in this event) freelance space bum |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
623
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 09:41:00 -
[126] - Quote
Why can't eve survive? Eve has been even on recent years one of the mostly reliable income MMO in the western market.
Stop making idiotic presumptions.
Someday what wil die again are these stupid free to ply games.
Free to play games are not games, they are MADE to you SUFFER.. and that is needed, because if you do not suffer while playignyou will not spend money to reduce this suffering "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
12249
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 09:42:00 -
[127] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Alright guys I've got this one.
At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run,
Says who apart from you?
1 Kings 12:11
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17174
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 09:44:00 -
[128] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:"Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?" Because I want this excellent game, not something completely different, no matter how cheap it is (especially since I don't know whether I'll get what I pay for in that other case). You're also setting up a pretty silly false dichotomy. Ignoring the ridiculous presumption that the game is bad, your question is about as meaningful as:
GÇ£Why am I still playing this game when I could paint the ceiling in this wonderful fuchsia hue?GÇ¥ or GÇ£Why am I still playing this game when apples are so tasty?GÇ¥ or GÇ£Why am I still playing this game when cold fusion would solve the energy crisis?GÇ¥
Quote:This question will mean people will unsubscribe. You're making a huge and unfounded presumption that the question is asked at all, without any consideration of who's asking it. Anyone who asks this does so already because they are not happy with the game GÇö the business model behind it is not a factor. CCP could change into a PMC and they would still leave because they are fundamentally disinterested in the product. They're not lost customers GÇö they're just people who would never have stuck around anyway.
So here's a counter-question: what is there to gain to make these people keep playing a game they have no interest in?
Quote:Okay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it.
1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons. 2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay. 3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun. 4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy.
This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. No, it would not, and points 3 and 4 do not follow from the premise of points 1 and 2.
What you're asking for is for them to shut down EVE and create a new game with the same IP. This means taking their entire customer base behind the shed and hoping that after that treatment, some of them will come back afterwards. There is little to nothing to suggest that they will. A game needs to be designed for F2P GÇö it can't be transformed into one. Doubly so if the game is competitive since you must design your money-making schemes in such a way that they gel with the competition itself. All the ideas you have require a complete redesign of the game to take the new customer behaviours into account, because without such a redesign, the game will be insanely imbalanced and simply topple over.
You'll notice that all the money-making schemes they have right now are completely reliant on it being a subscription-based game. You are trying to use them as examples of what they can expand on if the game was made F2P, without considering that doing so means those examples will immediately be rendered invalid.
Oh, andGǪQuote:At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run, GǪbased on what, exactly? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Kagura Nikon
Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness
623
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 09:45:00 -
[129] - Quote
GreenSeed wrote:the f2p model is not compatible with eve. and looking at the new generation of MMOs, none of the big ones is f2p, they are all paid. nwo, everquestnext, titan, etc, etc.
also, titan is a space mmo from blizzard, once it gets the official announcement this general forum will get unbearable.
You mean the one that was scrapped in may this year and wil start all over again? "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!" |
Santo Trafficante
Black Caste
10
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 09:46:00 -
[130] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Alright guys I've got this one. At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run, which is what CCP want the game to be a - a game lasting decades, not years. With biggies like Star Citizen coming round with one-time fees and no-subs, there's gonna be some serious questions asked by the players. Questions like this: "Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?" This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet. But when it is, who knows what'll happen to the CCP. The big business model transFORMATIONOkay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it. 1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons. 2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay. 3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun. 4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy. This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. I'd recommend that they do this IPO on the stockmarket they were talking about, as that will get the big businesses interested and posting articles about this awesome sci-fi sim. All of the hardcore eve fans, like the mitani, will probably buy shares - so they'll have even more money to improve the game. As they improve the game more people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer. Thoughts please. Thread update:Thanks for feedback guys, I think there are a few more points worth adding here. 1) CCP should also consider the option of buy to play. Perhaps a -ú39.99 to get access to the game client, but fees after that - this would ensure there is a paywall to supplement CCP profits and keep out the hacking community. With the increased profits, CCP would have greater confidence in following a strictly cosmetic cash4items scheme. Buy to play has been an extremely successful model and I think it is particularly relevant to EVE ONLINE. Why? The model in GW2 has triggered slow but steady growth, this is the type of growth CCP has always been experiencing with EVE. http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/08/23/lead-designer-says-guild-wars-2-is-growing-its-playerbase/2) Secondly, a steam launch as free to play would be a great bolster to current numbers. 0.9 of the world's population has a steam account. http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/10/30/0-9-of-the-global-population-have-steam-accounts/
Get the F*** out Lamington and learn to eve cuz from what u wrote i see u got no effin clue how the things goin'
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Temuken Radzu
Bendebeukers Northern Associates.
50
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Posted - 2013.10.31 10:23:00 -
[131] - Quote
It might be possible to introduce a free to play model in eve together with a paid model. The idea is this: when you have a subscription or plex, you will play the game normally like it is now. But when playing without a subscription, the time it takes to train your skills will be doubled and you can't fly capital ships. How does this sound?
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Solstice Project
I'm So Meta Even This Acronym
4268
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 10:28:00 -
[132] - Quote
Santo Trafficante wrote:Get the F*** out Lamington and learn to eve cuz from what u wrote i see u got no effin clue how the things goin' Santo ! \o/ :D
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Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
586
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 10:36:00 -
[133] - Quote
Temuken Radzu wrote:It might be possible to introduce a free to play model in eve together with a paid model. The idea is this: when you have a subscription or plex, you will play the game normally like it is now. But when playing without a subscription, the time it takes to train your skills will be doubled and you can't fly capital ships. How does this sound?
Still bad.
EVE and f2p equals bad. No matter how you put it. Stupidity should be a bannable offense.
Also This --> https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=216699 Please stop making "afk cloak" threads, thanks in advance. |
Xavier Higdon
Wolfbane Hauler Inc RECURSIVE ASCENSION
45
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 12:46:00 -
[134] - Quote
If EVE was to go F2P we would lose all of the intelligent people such as Tippia. The man or woman(sorry but this is EVE and you never know), is a reasonable person, with fully formed thoughts and ideas the likes of which you won't find in WOW or LOL. It is players like her that are the backbone of EVE. The goons might have numbers, but without an intelligent person leading the masses they would have nothing. And Tippia isn't alone, there are thousands of people like that, capable of seeing beyond the killmails and wallet size to the big picture that makes EVE so amazing. A proud member of Wolfbane Hauler Inc. We are currently recruiting pilots of all skill levels. We need both industrial combat specialists. For more information see our ad:-áhttps://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3764273&#post3764273 |
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
31
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 14:18:00 -
[135] - Quote
There is no fun in losing free stuff..... cos its.... worth nothing.
The game would become pretty meaningless.... Go away with your silly ideas.
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Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3209
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 14:25:00 -
[136] - Quote
Temuken Radzu wrote:It might be possible to introduce a free to play model in eve together with a paid model. The idea is this: when you have a subscription or plex, you will play the game normally like it is now. But when playing without a subscription, the time it takes to train your skills will be doubled and you can't fly capital ships. How does this sound?
*Might* have worked when the game was new. But doing that now just means that a bunch of 100 mil SP toons that don't fly capitals anyways won't be paying subs. Bad idea.
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Temuken Radzu
Bendebeukers Northern Associates.
50
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 15:17:00 -
[137] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Temuken Radzu wrote:It might be possible to introduce a free to play model in eve together with a paid model. The idea is this: when you have a subscription or plex, you will play the game normally like it is now. But when playing without a subscription, the time it takes to train your skills will be doubled and you can't fly capital ships. How does this sound?
*Might* have worked when the game was new. But doing that now just means that a bunch of 100 mil SP toons that don't fly capitals anyways won't be paying subs. Bad idea.
Most of those people already dont pay trough plex. This idea is meant that you can play the game as usual, but it will take a looooooong time before you can fly certain ships or use modules this way. I believe if you want to train a long skill as new player it will be very attractive to take a sub for a month or two to spare yourself a 70 days of training Cruiser 5 or something like that.
At least this idea is better than OP's themepark type of F2P |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17176
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 15:21:00 -
[138] - Quote
Temuken Radzu wrote:Most of those people already dont pay trough plex. That means they still generate income for CCP. With your idea, they no longer will since they have no reason to get those PLEXes any more.
That's really a general problem with all the kinds of GÇ£paid/free hybridsGÇ¥ that are suggested every now and then: they never really provide any solid reason for people to keep paying, little to nothing to compensate for all that lost income. Of course, since F2P and subscription are to business models, rather than just two payment schemes, the (near?) impossibility of combining in any sensible them is hardly surprising. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
embrel
BamBam Inc.
66
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 15:27:00 -
[139] - Quote
No. I assume it will take only a short time until F2P becomes P2W. Only with clothing, paintjobs and so on EVE will not generate the necessary cashflows. So the next step will need to be P2W. And at the time I will not even be able to threaten to unsub. |
Icarus Able
Traverse Holdings Setting The Universe on Fire
142
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 15:44:00 -
[140] - Quote
Temuken Radzu wrote:Jenn aSide wrote:Temuken Radzu wrote:It might be possible to introduce a free to play model in eve together with a paid model. The idea is this: when you have a subscription or plex, you will play the game normally like it is now. But when playing without a subscription, the time it takes to train your skills will be doubled and you can't fly capital ships. How does this sound?
*Might* have worked when the game was new. But doing that now just means that a bunch of 100 mil SP toons that don't fly capitals anyways won't be paying subs. Bad idea. Most of those people already dont pay trough plex. This idea is meant that you can play the game as usual, but it will take a looooooong time before you can fly certain ships or use modules this way. I believe if you want to train a long skill as new player it will be very attractive to take a sub for a month or two to spare yourself a 70 days of training Cruiser 5 or something like that. At least this idea is better than OP's themepark type of F2P
Someone paying through PLEX is giving CCP almost twice the money. As a plex costs -ú15 and a sub costs -ú8. Someone else has to buy the PLEX for -ú15.
No to F2P all o.f the ideas in this thread for it all awful and riddled with problems. Theres no need to go F2P. |
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Phoenix Jones
Shockwave Innovations Surely You're Joking
203
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 15:49:00 -
[141] - Quote
The way star citizen is going, I believe CCP doesn't have to worry very much.
Don't fix what ain't broken. You have a very easy ingame way of paying for the game. You just have to work at it.
Will people jump ship. You betcha. Heck logins dropped for CCP the night the batman movie came out, when a wow expansion dropped, when ffxiv relaunched.
People go play the new thing, cry when it isn't perfect, then return.
Eve is like a warm used blanket. You paid for it, stitched it up, and won't throw it out. Stabbers are totally broken
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=15116553
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
12251
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 16:01:00 -
[142] - Quote
EVE already has the best free to play model in the business.
1 Kings 12:11
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Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
573
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 16:53:00 -
[143] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:EVE already has the best free to play model in the business.
The only problem it requires grind for the majority of people. If you are space rich off the backs of others, then you don't need to log in only so often, but there are only a handful of people who fall under that category.
I think I would enjoy EVE more if I didn't have to log on as much is what I am trying to say.
But CCP will have none of that. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
12253
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 16:57:00 -
[144] - Quote
Phoenix Jones wrote:The way star citizen is going, I believe CCP doesn't have to worry very much.
People are talking about SC is if it's out now, and it's awesome.
The whole thing might not be a scam
It might produce a good game.
It might not have a cripplingly greedy cash shop
It might even be the first game ever to appear on schedule. The year after next.
Two things are certain though:
Firstly it will have to compete against EVE, not as it is now, but with 4 more expansions under its belt. I understand Mr Roberts is ambitious to produce an outstanding game; I don't think CCP Seagull is any less passionate. Star Citizen has the advantage of a "clean slate" and learning from the mistakes of other games. EVE will have the advantage of a 12 year development headstart, and experience in dealing with one of the most demanding customer bases imaginable.
Secondly, and much more importantly, there's simply no way SC can possibly live up to the weight of the expections that the hypenauts are placing in it.
Have a dose of reality. It tastes a little bitter but it's ultimately more refreshing.
1 Kings 12:11
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Baggo Hammers
191
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:00:00 -
[145] - Quote
Oh joy another prole with a business plan... If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there. |
Karrl Tian
Riehl Un-Lucky United 4 Nations
227
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:03:00 -
[146] - Quote
Phoenix Jones wrote:
Don't fix what ain't broken. .
Is that a challenge, good sir?
----CCP |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3212
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:04:00 -
[147] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Malcanis wrote:EVE already has the best free to play model in the business. The only problem it requires grind for the majority of people. If you are space rich off the backs of others, then you don't need to log in only so often, but there are only a handful of people who fall under that category. I think I would enjoy EVE more if I didn't have to log on as much is what I am trying to say. But CCP will have none of that.
At current prices, a single plex costs 20.5 mil isk per DAY. That's 20-25 minutes per day in a null sec anomaly like forsaken hub if you are flying a crappy t1 BS or attack battlecruiser.
Hell, a doing ONE site in non-shiny HQ incursion fleet flying a tech 1 BS pays 31 mil + lp. You could literally join a high sec incursion fleet, run ONE HQ site with them per day and at the end of the month you could buy a plex and have STILL have a quarter bil+ isk left to spend on space-hookers and space-blow.
And you would enjoy a game more if you didn't have to play that game as much? At what point do you realize that the game in question is not your cup of tea?
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Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3212
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:12:00 -
[148] - Quote
Karrl Tian wrote:Phoenix Jones wrote:
Don't fix what ain't broken. .
Is that a challenge, good sir? ----CCP Also, I went to a SC panel recently and the developers themselves said they weren't going to try to be EVE.Seriously, when you try to steal the existing playerbase of an established game, it doesn't go too well.
Someone needs to forward this link to the Mechwarrior Online devs. |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
573
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:18:00 -
[149] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:Firstly it will have to compete against EVE, not as it is now, but with 4 more expansions under its belt. I understand Mr Roberts is ambitious to produce an outstanding game; I don't think CCP Seagull is any less passionate. Star Citizen has the advantage of a "clean slate" and learning from the mistakes of other games. EVE will have the advantage of a 12 year development headstart, and experience in dealing with one of the most demanding customer bases imaginable.
Will EVE support walking in stations and Occulus Rift support in 4 expansion?
Well there is Valkyrie, but that's not EVE really and will most likely be F2P.
Yeah there is too much hype and people are spending $1000 on ships in a game that doesn't have anything other than a hanger which you can walk around and gawk at space pixels.
The thing is though, some of us have low expectations... Hell... War Thunder and World of Tanks has better gameplay than EVE but it lacks strategic depth.
You only need slightly better gameplay and somewhat of a strategic depth to achieve success.
War Thunder and World of Tanks and League of Legends have more players than EVE, but they aren't really competing. Sure I might play one of those games for a few hours, but it lacks the depth of EVE to warrant spending most of the time on it.
The issue is that if you have a game that has superior game play AND strategic depth then you'll stop playing the other game.
But the truth is we don't know other than the development promises, but I suppose they aren't going to fail because lack of money. People are just throwing hundreds of dollars at that game.
Anyways, I think that Star Citizens success or failure also rides in the success of the Occulus Rift.
I have a suspicion due to the reviews of people on youtube that I saw is that when people get a rift, they will stop playing games that don't support it because it seems more realistic and immersive with the Rift.
CCP has noticed this so that is why they started Valkyrie and demo the hell out it with the Occulus Rift everywhere they have an event. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Snakebyte Jack
Grand Theft Astr0
7
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:21:00 -
[150] - Quote
No! |
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Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
573
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:27:00 -
[151] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Malcanis wrote:EVE already has the best free to play model in the business. The only problem it requires grind for the majority of people. If you are space rich off the backs of others, then you don't need to log in only so often, but there are only a handful of people who fall under that category. I think I would enjoy EVE more if I didn't have to log on as much is what I am trying to say. But CCP will have none of that. At current prices, a single plex costs 20.5 mil isk per DAY. That's 20-25 minutes per day in a null sec anomaly like forsaken hub if you are flying a crappy t1 BS or attack battlecruiser. Hell, doing ONE site in non-shiny HQ incursion fleet flying a tech 1 BS pays 31 mil + lp. You could literally join a high sec incursion fleet, run ONE HQ site with them per day and at the end of the month you could buy a plex and have STILL have a quarter bil+ isk left to spend on space-hookers and space-blow. And you would enjoy a game more if you didn't have to play that game as much? At what point do you realize that the game in question is not your cup of tea?
I don't like null politics and I don't trust WH corporations. Also I hate mission running and ratting much less incursions.
Also, if people are buying plex to sell for isk it means there is a good portion of the player base who don't earn enough isk to warrant actually buying the plex.
Also personally, I can earn 2-3 plex's every weekend so its not like I have to log in every day.
I mentioned before I actually plex'd 3 accounts til January 30 so I might as well be playing.
Actually... I should check my market orders now.
And truth be told I sort of do enjoy the process of making the isk. Its just that I believe the majority of players who buy their plex do so through grinding of certain actives like missioning which seem like a chore.
It just feels like I have a 200lb on my back to make sure I earn enough isk all the damn time even though I don't.
I just don't like the idea of having to play all the time even if its only 2-3 days a week. I sometimes like to take breaks for a month and do other things for a bit. I want to be free to not play the game when I choose not to. "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
3212
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:44:00 -
[152] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:
I don't like null politics and I don't trust WH corporations.
Who said anything about poltics? Do you have to join a WH corp to solo a class 3 or below wormhole in a drake? Do you have to join a corp to jump into a cheap ship, go to null sec and find ONE forsaken hub/Rally point and spend 20-3- minutes a day (less if you know what you are doing) earning enough to play the game for free?
Quote:Also I hate mission running and ratting much less incursions.
Industry? You can afk mine in a tanked mining ship with eve in the back ground and while it takes much longer, its effortless and cheap.
You're making excuses. You're saying you can't trade 20-30 minutes of your time for EVE. That's ok, but that's no reason for true "free to play" in EVE.
Quote: Also, if people are buying plex to sell for isk it means there is a good portion of the player base who don't earn enough isk to warrant actually buying the plex.
No, it means some people want a short cut, or see plex as a business oppurtunity. You're assumption here is wrong.
Quote: Also personally, I can earn 2-3 plex's every weekend so its not like I have to log in every day.
I mentioned before I actually plex'd 3 accounts til January 30 so I might as well be playing.
Actually... I should check my market orders now.
And truth be told I sort of do enjoy the process of making the isk. Its just that I believe the majority of players who buy their plex do so through grinding of certain actives like missioning which seem like a chore.
It just feels like I have a 200lb on my back to make sure I earn enough isk all the damn time even though I don't.
I just don't like the idea of having to play all the time even if its only 2-3 days a week. I sometimes like to take breaks for a month and do other things for a bit. I want to be free to not play the game when I choose not to.
You are free to do that. Sub with money, OR let your sub lapse and come back when you want to. What you seem to want is all the advantages and none of the trade offs/ The trade offs are what make EVE compelling.
The "feelings" you have most likely are the result of you trying to fit a square peg (your enjoyment) into a round hole (EVE). When you think a game is a "chore" it's not time for the game to change, it's time for you to make new and better choices.
If you think the tank game or a game where people shoot fairy dust and arrows at each other via scantilly clad avatars (LoL) has "better gameplay" then EvE probably just doesn't suit you. And yes, I play World of Tanks and LoL, they are nice quick changes of pace from EvE, but only for a few minutes. |
cynthia greythorne
Twilight Labs Unsung Voices
31
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:44:00 -
[153] - Quote
'2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay.
As they improve the game more people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer.'
I can see that quickly degenerating into 'Evetropia'. What fun that would be. |
Atlantis Fuanan
Uncharted Skies Cerberus Unleashed
49
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:45:00 -
[154] - Quote
EA is trying to slowly get Players used to upcomming free2play model? Things that would make EVE better: NRDS - Remove Local - Balance Cloak - Sov-Mechanic Changes - Less QQ |
Leigh Akiga
State War Academy Caldari State
307
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:47:00 -
[155] - Quote
Captain Tardbar wrote:Malcanis wrote:EVE already has the best free to play model in the business. The only problem it requires grind for the majority of people. If you are space rich off the backs of others, then you don't need to log in only so often, but there are only a handful of people who fall under that category
You could be spacerich off the backs of others too but you chose not to. |
Captain Tardbar
Sons of Sam
573
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:50:00 -
[156] - Quote
Well truth be told I hate LoL.
And what I am trying to say even though I don't have a problem making enough isk to plex 3 accounts, I don't like the idea that I have to play all the time even for 30 minutes a day.
Like I said, some weeks I don't feel like playing EVE.
I don't expect them to change the game because I don't like it.
It just means if I find a F2P game with enough long term strategic depth, I'll stop playing EVE.
And I suppose I won't be alone... "Entitlement" is a euphemism for "I hate the way you play and it makes me cry like a baby". If you fantasize about being immoral it means you enjoy being immoral deep down. |
baltec1
Bat Country
8394
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 17:56:00 -
[157] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:
At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run
Its the only MMO to have a decade of growth. |
Solstice Project
I'm So Meta Even This Acronym
4272
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 18:12:00 -
[158] - Quote
Solstice Project wrote:Die in a ******* gunfire. (ingame) The quoted post, ladies and gentlemen, is based on the concept of "cheap pops" from World Wrestling Entertainment.
24 Likes and counting. ^_^
There's so much meta, my eyes sparkle! :D
How does this post influence the behaviour of the observer in context of liking the quoted post ?
Will he "dislike" it, in case he has read through the whole thread ? Will he like it, if he has only jumped to the middle/end of the thread ? Will others, former Likers-of-the-quoted-post, read this post and now unlike it ?
Do you share the opinion displayed in the quoted post ?
Will you respond at all ?
"hm ...", "hm.. interesting", "wtf?", "i want his drugs", "not that guy AGAIN", "**** you, sol",
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:It's the stream-of-consciousness philosophy, combined with the Surrealists' Automatic Writing paradigm. (i have no idea. nobody ever said *that* to me ^_^) something totally unrelated, like an opinion about Likes (there's always that one guy, but he is - in fact - many ... :/ ) "like-whoring", "troll", the own POV on what one believes is the point of the post, or ...
... just a Like ? |
Solomunio Kzenig
Incursions Missions and Mining
12
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Posted - 2013.10.31 18:35:00 -
[159] - Quote
To the OP, aren't you that doucheag CCP hired from EA? |
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
935
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 18:59:00 -
[160] - Quote
Eve online has the best payment structure of any game I have Ever played. It's been free to play since I started in '08. I have chosen to pay $34.95 (each) for my first 3 accounts to get a head start.
Making it follow the standard model of free to play would wreck it utterly and completely. Comparing it to STO is a joke. Comparing it to SC is apples to oranges. STO aint bad for an F2P MMO but the graphics suck and it only has an edge on eve in one or 2 small facets. And either game can release any numbers they want, Eve has WAY more players.
Anyway its a terrible idea. CCP would loose millions a month. That's not cool.
Accounts may not be used for business purposes. Access to the System and playing EVE is intended for your personal entertainment, enjoyment and recreation, and not for corporate, business, commercial or income-seeking activities.-á |
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Jarod Garamonde
Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance
544
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 20:30:00 -
[161] - Quote
Star Citizen is going to blow goats. /thread That moment when you realize the crazy lady with all the cats was right... |
Matokin Lemant
5
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 21:52:00 -
[162] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Captain Tardbar wrote:Malcanis wrote:EVE already has the best free to play model in the business. The only problem it requires grind for the majority of people. If you are space rich off the backs of others, then you don't need to log in only so often, but there are only a handful of people who fall under that category. I think I would enjoy EVE more if I didn't have to log on as much is what I am trying to say. But CCP will have none of that. At current prices, a single plex costs 20.5 mil isk per DAY. That's 20-25 minutes per day in a null sec anomaly like forsaken hub if you are flying a crappy t1 BS or attack battlecruiser. Hell, doing ONE site in non-shiny HQ incursion fleet flying a tech 1 BS pays 31 mil + lp. You could literally join a high sec incursion fleet, run ONE HQ site with them per day and at the end of the month you could buy a plex and have STILL have a quarter bil+ isk left to spend on space-hookers and space-blow. And you would enjoy a game more if you didn't have to play that game as much? At what point do you realize that the game in question is not your cup of tea?
Yes that is all well and good for people who are in one of the large null power blocks and have access to high quality null sec anomaly allot of the player base dont.
As for HQ incursions its not that easy to get into an HQ fleet. People all have blues and the like who fleet up to run incursions together. You have to be one of the people who do them frequently to even get a look in on an HQ fleet.
And honestly who likes just grinding isk 24/7 just to keep there account(s) open...one of the reasons I only have one out of my 3X running currently. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor Cosmic Consortium
4213
|
Posted - 2013.10.31 22:37:00 -
[163] - Quote
Matokin Lemant wrote:Yes that is all well and good for people who are in one of the large null power blocks and have access to high quality null sec anomaly allot of the player base don't.
Hisec pilots have access to Incursions too, y'know. Get a fleet together, make 60M ISK/hr while barely trying.
The only thing stopping you is your will to fail.
Day 0 advice for new players: Day 0 Advice for New Players |
Celestra Doxaila
MinTek Heavy Industries
58
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:29:00 -
[164] - Quote
Seriously, every thread in GD that propose s a feature is "nope". |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
17183
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 00:32:00 -
[165] - Quote
Celestra Doxaila wrote:Seriously, every thread in GD that propose s a feature is "nope". Not everyone. Just the ones that are bad. And the ones that belong in F&IGǪ
GǪoh wait. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan 2.0. |
Remiel Pollard
Shockwave Innovations Surely You're Joking
1875
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:11:00 -
[166] - Quote
This thread again?
Star Citizen isn't a threat to EVE. Both games offer completely different features. Just by virtue of both being in space does not make them similar. Comparing them is like comparing a pair of cross trainers to high heels just because they are both a type of shoe. There is a comparison, sure, but it's in the differences, not the similarities. There are more differences than similarities, and that makes them completely different game types.
As for your entire F2P argument, it's based on the premises that EVE is a 'bad bad game' and it's losing subs. Both of these are false premises which you have failed to articulate. It is also based off the speculative premise that EVE is going to lose more subs to SC. As stated, this is speculative at best, and highly unlikely, due to the fact that even if people do 'switch', they will discover the differences between both games and most likely be back on EVE, if not playing both games. In any case, it's pure speculation at this point, and despite the amount of money Mr Roberts has made for his 'little' project, most of it has come from a very dedicated Wing Commander fan base, which at this stage is much smaller in population than the existing EVE fan base.
In other words, if you were to take everyone that donated money to the SC Kickstarter and line them up with the people paying for EVE subs, the EVE line would be longer, and that's taking alt accounts into consideration as well.
EVE's subscription system is the most successful subscription system of any game ever. That's why EVE's player base is always in steady growth, whereas every other MMO on the market, including WOW, has hit a peak and started to decline. WOW won't decline quickly, or quietly, but it is in decline. The other reason for EVE's success here is its uniqueness. There is no other game quite like it currently on the market.
If you really must have a CCP game to compare Star Citizen to, however, I would suggest taking a look at their up and coming Valkyrie title. You don't scare me. I've been to Jita. |
Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
456
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:22:00 -
[167] - Quote
Remiel Pollard wrote:I fall for every troll and write massive posts to refute them Well done |
Remiel Pollard
Shockwave Innovations Surely You're Joking
1875
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 01:42:00 -
[168] - Quote
Karak Terrel wrote:Remiel Pollard wrote:I fall for every troll and write massive posts to refute them Well done
Trolling is against forum rules. I just naturally assume people are generally capable of following the rules. If this thread is a troll, then it needs to be locked. How you came by that conclusion, what with you not being the OP of course, is interesting, but no doubt merely speculative in and of itself. You trolling me just now, however, in such a disrespectful fashion, is nothing short of flaming, which is also against the rules. At least I had the courtesy and maturity to address the OP with reasoned and carefully assessed and articulated discussion points. Was it a bit too long for you?
All you've really done here is make an assumption about the OP, then based on that assumption, try to put me down. So far, though, I've managed to escape the cynicism and bitterness and subsequent speculations of the real trolls on the forums, like yourself of course, who are really only here to seek out weakness and exploit it for the sake of their own ego growth. I hope it was worth it, but that's probably why trolling is against the rules. At least, if the OP was trolling, he was doing it with civility instead of spite.
I stand by my choice to take the OP seriously, because I prefer to seek the best in people. Some, like you, might call that naive. But that's why the world is going to ****, and unfortunately, it's hard to see the best in people that put their worst so openly on display like yourself.
I recommend you go find yourself a good Disney movie and try to remember what it was like, long ago, when you could at least address people as if they had the right to respect. Because if you can't show respect to begin with, you most certainly don't deserve to have it returned. And yet, here I am, and I still have shown you no spite or disrespect myself, even though after that crap, you wholly deserve it.
I do believe that makes me the better man.
Cheers for that. You don't scare me. I've been to Jita. |
Johnny Marzetti
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
938
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 02:00:00 -
[169] - Quote
Remiel Pollard wrote:Karak Terrel wrote:Remiel Pollard wrote:I fall for every troll and write massive posts to refute them Well done Trolling is against forum rules. I just naturally assume people are generally capable of following the rules. If this thread is a troll, then it needs to be locked. How you came by that conclusion, what with you not being the OP of course, is interesting, but no doubt merely speculative in and of itself. You trolling me just now, however, in such a disrespectful fashion, is nothing short of flaming, which is also against the rules. At least I had the courtesy and maturity to address the OP with reasoned and carefully assessed and articulated discussion points. Was it a bit too long for you? All you've really done here is make an assumption about the OP, then based on that assumption, try to put me down. So far, though, I've managed to escape the cynicism and bitterness and subsequent speculations of the real trolls on the forums, like yourself of course, who are really only here to seek out weakness and exploit it for the sake of their own ego growth. I hope it was worth it, but that's probably why trolling is against the rules. At least, if the OP was trolling, he was doing it with civility instead of spite. I stand by my choice to take the OP seriously, because I prefer to seek the best in people. Some, like you, might call that naive. But that's why the world is going to ****, and unfortunately, it's hard to see the best in people that put their worst so openly on display like yourself. I recommend you go find yourself a good Disney movie and try to remember what it was like, long ago, when you could at least address people as if they had the right to respect. Because if you can't show respect to begin with, you most certainly don't deserve to have it returned. And yet, here I am, and I still have shown you no spite or disrespect myself, even though after that crap, you wholly deserve it. I do believe that makes me the better man. Cheers for that.
Someone make an mp3 of this. I'd do it myself but my wife already thinks I'm crazy. |
Karak Terrel
As Far As The eYe can see Chained Reactions
456
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 02:10:00 -
[170] - Quote
Remiel Pollard wrote:Karak Terrel wrote:Remiel Pollard wrote:I fall for every troll and write massive posts to refute them Well done I fall for every troll and write massive posts to refute them Well d.. oh wait..
leaving well fed |
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Liam Inkuras
Chaotic Tranquility Casoff
543
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 03:52:00 -
[171] - Quote
Are you that EA guy? I wear my goggles at night.
Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone |
Knights Armament
Operator Chan
85
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 23:42:00 -
[172] - Quote
star citizen is not going to have meaningful pvp.
Respawning in the ship you just saw blown to bits isn't hardcore enough for me. https://secure.eveonline.com/trial/?invc=29554516-05f9-4eca-a942-32e1701a6569&action=buddy |
Allison A'vani
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
53
|
Posted - 2013.11.01 23:57:00 -
[173] - Quote
Lol ya'll nubs be posting in a troll thread.
http://i1.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/004/866/YallN1ggazPostinInATrollThread.jpg |
Shrike Arghast
Aliastra Gallente Federation
4
|
Posted - 2013.11.02 01:19:00 -
[174] - Quote
If you can't afford to play MMORPGs, then you clearly shouldn't be playing MMORPGs.
You should be working. |
Jim McMorris
Co-operative Group
26
|
Posted - 2013.11.02 09:37:00 -
[175] - Quote
Shrike Arghast wrote:If you can't afford to play MMORPGs, then you clearly shouldn't be playing MMORPGs.
You should be working.
I can afford to buy a campervan, but I won't buy it. If they were offering me the campervan for free, I'd take it.
It's really simple. why pay? |
Solstice Project
I'm So Meta Even This Acronym
4288
|
Posted - 2013.11.02 09:49:00 -
[176] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Shrike Arghast wrote:If you can't afford to play MMORPGs, then you clearly shouldn't be playing MMORPGs.
You should be working. I can afford to buy a campervan, but I won't buy it. If they were offering me the campervan for free, I'd take it. It's really simple. Which doesn't connect to her post at all. "can not afford" != "not willing to spend money on" |
samualvimes
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
119
|
Posted - 2013.11.02 10:35:00 -
[177] - Quote
Karak Terrel wrote:Remiel Pollard wrote:I fall for every troll and write massive posts to refute them Well done
The biggest problem with troll posts is that you occasionally get other innocents on the forums believing the Bul*****
Thus a proper refutal must always be made lest some poor newb actually believes all the scare stories of the week
Including but by no means restricted to such fallacies as:
The Blue Doughnut I'm a good PvPer Mittens The CSM are Shills AFK cloakers kill people minerbumping is a breach of human rights the thorax was designed by someone who didn't put it in as a joke EvE is dying Goons are evil (and CCP) null seccers hate hi-seccers Drake minerals mined are free
and other such brilliant tin foil hattery.and generally badly thought out ideas
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Arresy Barres
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.11.02 11:21:00 -
[178] - Quote
Thanks to OP, half of the sandwich I was eating as scrolling over GD is now stuck in my throat and the other half on the table and keyboard.
Now, as I collect the pieces back and wash down with a cup of water what I was coughing intensely upon, man, this thread is just too good. I don't even know if OP was serious, if he isn't, this thread is golden. If he is, though, this thread is even more golden.
While we're at it, why don't we implement flaming skins for interceptors, make yellow skins for all Amarr banana ships, and graffiti skins for titans, yeah buddy, because surely enough EVE Online is a dieing game, oh how sad this is, let's all hold our hands and cry, because EVE might not be around next year. ;_; |
Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
856
|
Posted - 2013.11.02 11:43:00 -
[179] - Quote
Jim McMorris wrote:Alright guys I've got this one. At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run, which is what CCP want the game to be a - a game lasting decades, not years. With biggies like Star Citizen coming round with one-time fees and no-subs, there's gonna be some serious questions asked by the players. Questions like this: "Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?" This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet. But when it is, who knows what'll happen to the CCP. The big business model transFORMATIONOkay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it. 1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons. 2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay. 3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun. 4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy. This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. I'd recommend that they do this IPO on the stockmarket they were talking about, as that will get the big businesses interested and posting articles about this awesome sci-fi sim. All of the hardcore eve fans, like the mitani, will probably buy shares - so they'll have even more money to improve the game. As they improve the game more people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer. Thoughts please. Thread update:Thanks for feedback guys, I think there are a few more points worth adding here. 1) CCP should also consider the option of buy to play. Perhaps a -ú39.99 to get access to the game client, but fees after that - this would ensure there is a paywall to supplement CCP profits and keep out the hacking community. With the increased profits, CCP would have greater confidence in following a strictly cosmetic cash4items scheme. Buy to play has been an extremely successful model and I think it is particularly relevant to EVE ONLINE. Why? The model in GW2 has triggered slow but steady growth, this is the type of growth CCP has always been experiencing with EVE. http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/08/23/lead-designer-says-guild-wars-2-is-growing-its-playerbase/2) Secondly, a steam launch as free to play would be a great bolster to current numbers. 0.9 of the world's population has a steam account. http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/10/30/0-9-of-the-global-population-have-steam-accounts/
they already have the best free to play model with PLEX, nothing else needed
... |
Solstice Project
I'm So Meta Even This Acronym
4292
|
Posted - 2013.11.02 14:26:00 -
[180] - Quote
30 Likes and counting. ^_^
Did you, person 30, ever reach this post ? |
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