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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Nathan Rees
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:01:00 -
[1]
kk i love eve and everything about it but the battleships only being able to carry 3 heavy drones is BS guys..
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Galactina Evol
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:02:00 -
[2]
Thats nice, my 'phoon fits 7
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Maya Rkell
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:04:00 -
[3]
That's Heavies.
Consider the alternatives.
Warning: above post may contain traces of sarcasm.
"Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
MellaRinn
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:04:00 -
[4]
yyes, might sound/look scary, but then again look at the drone skilltree after RMR and you will knoiw that 3 heavies can pwn quite well, tbh:) I am a Domi pilot and i thought i would be hit a lot by the patch, while drones are so good now I can't believe Gallente wasn't nerfed, but beefud up, as it should be ;-)
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dantes inferno
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:09:00 -
[5]
3 drones post rmr = roughly 6 drones pre rmr...even more depending on skills. _____
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Kharakan
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:11:00 -
[6]
Use medium drones ;) They're much better than they used to be.
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Miracle Max
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:15:00 -
[7]
I love my 3 little Mini-me's in my APOC. Work just as good as my 6 before. Much easier to keep track of also and manage.
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Kaaii
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:17:00 -
[8]
Skills > equipment
"..Id rather fall beside 10 lions, then stand with One thousand sheep.."
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Soulita
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:28:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Kaaii
Skills > equipment
o_O Muha muhahah muhahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa 0_o
I have a years+ worth of skills in drones and drone carrier piloting related stuff. The skills are now worth crap.
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Phant Zon
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:31:00 -
[10]
Heck, in my phoon I can carry 5 lights, 5 meds and 4 heavies. Perfect for any situation. For once the 'phoon shines at something :)
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Shirei
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:36:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Soulita
Originally by: Kaaii
Skills > equipment
o_O Muha muhahah muhahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa 0_o
I have a years+ worth of skills in drones and drone carrier piloting related stuff. The skills are now worth crap.
Considering that the Domi has with this patch become probably the strongest close-range BS for 1v1, I call BS.
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Soulita
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:38:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Soulita on 18/12/2005 00:39:44
Originally by: Shirei
Originally by: Soulita
Originally by: Kaaii
Skills > equipment
o_O Muha muhahah muhahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa 0_o
I have a years+ worth of skills in drones and drone carrier piloting related stuff. The skills are now worth crap.
Considering that the Domi has with this patch become probably the strongest close-range BS for 1v1, I call BS.
ROFL
Edit: I am through with arguing this topic, only thing left I can do is laugh my *** off at comments like this.
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Chester McFester
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:39:00 -
[13]
Yep only 3. Can count em on 1 hand. 1, 2, 3.
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Nathan Rees
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Posted - 2005.12.18 00:59:00 -
[14]
ok now that i am home from work and have more time to explain... this is crap because:
1. not only have i spent the time to get my drones ability to be able to use 5 and can no longer use them in a Raven ... what a waste.. a battleship that can only carry 3 drones..
2. now that i can only CARRY 3 heavy drones if i am engaged and lose one then how many more do i have to replace it with? thats right 0 so now you take out my 3 drones and i am short range = screwed...
not a very good deal all the way around if you ask me .. thanks alot for wasting all my precious skill time on trainging drones to five CCP .. preciate that one..
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Gunstar Zero
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Posted - 2005.12.18 01:21:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Nathan Rees ok now that i am home from work and have more time to explain... this is crap because:
1. not only have i spent the time to get my drones ability to be able to use 5 and can no longer use them in a Raven ... what a waste.. a battleship that can only carry 3 drones..
2. now that i can only CARRY 3 heavy drones if i am engaged and lose one then how many more do i have to replace it with? thats right 0 so now you take out my 3 drones and i am short range = screwed...
not a very good deal all the way around if you ask me .. thanks alot for wasting all my precious skill time on trainging drones to five CCP .. preciate that one..
hush, it's Caldari - it's meant to suck
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Joshua Foiritain
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Posted - 2005.12.18 01:47:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 18/12/2005 01:47:37
Originally by: Soulita
Originally by: Kaaii
Skills > equipment
o_O Muha muhahah muhahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa 0_o
I have a years+ worth of skills in drones and drone carrier piloting related stuff. The skills are now worth crap.
Then you wherent training drones skills. My maxed out drones skills made drones UBAR on drone ships ------------------
[Coreli Corporation Mainframe] |
Luther Kincaid
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Posted - 2005.12.18 01:47:00 -
[17]
err.. heavy drones on a raven? use missiles on anything large, light/medium drones on everything else duh!
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Galk
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Posted - 2005.12.18 01:55:00 -
[18]
Dang you sunk my battle ship.
Umm drones on bs, ok not drunk speak, what they did is make what was once an an ancillary (god bless you google) a primary.
Running out of ideas or something new, you decide -----------
She says It's only in my head She says Shhh I know it's only in my head
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Nostradamu5
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Posted - 2005.12.18 01:56:00 -
[19]
I must be just wierd or something, allthough I usually fly my Domi I allways used the drones for close in support, only when things couldn't get close enough did I send them out in an offensive manner.
So now I can't carry 30 heavies I can still carry 15, and yes I'm training the skills up now.
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Veronique Lamonte
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Posted - 2005.12.18 01:57:00 -
[20]
it doesnt matter what you say,3 heavy drones circling a battleship is pathetic. it looks stupid,and by some of the replies to this guys valid grief,most of you probably didnt bother to train heavy drones anyway,or you would have used them.
what cpp have done to the drone options is great,but cutting the drone bays in all ships is by far the worst thing they've done with the new patch.worse than the font which i dont have a problem with btw,go on,admit it,the dronebay nerf sucks NIKKI |
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Galk
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Posted - 2005.12.18 01:58:00 -
[21]
by the way that that my point, expand on everything.
Not a bad point. -----------
She says It's only in my head She says Shhh I know it's only in my head
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Luther Kincaid
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Posted - 2005.12.18 01:58:00 -
[22]
would you like some cheese with that?
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Galk
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:01:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Veronique Lamonte it doesnt matter what you say,3 heavy drones circling a battleship is pathetic. it looks stupid,
Dood.. i have a dreadnaught, you think 3 surounding a bs is fine, try a DREADANUGHT with 4 -----------
She says It's only in my head She says Shhh I know it's only in my head
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Noriath
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:02:00 -
[24]
To me it seems like Gallente got buffed purely by numbers, but in terms of coolness factor - even 15 drones didn't strike me as paticularly spectacular, 5 just seems like too much bang for what you see...
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JamesTalon
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:11:00 -
[25]
At first I wasn't at all happy with the drone bay reduction, but seeing my Hammerhead I's in action, they did as much damage with just 2 of them as 4 did on my Retriever. So you don't get to use more than 3 Heavies, they do the alot more damage than before the patch.
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Soulita
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:21:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Soulita on 18/12/2005 02:23:50
Originally by: Joshua Foiritain Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 18/12/2005 01:47:37
Originally by: Soulita
Originally by: Kaaii
Skills > equipment
o_O Muha muhahah muhahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa 0_o
I have a years+ worth of skills in drones and drone carrier piloting related stuff. The skills are now worth crap.
Then you wherent training drones skills. My maxed out drones skills made drones UBAR on drone ships
Oh yea? Please explain to me in complete detail (Skills & exact dom setup - plz no shield tank setup since this would take me a lot of extra training, and tank must be able to sustain lvl4 mission damage) how you achieve this Uberness (going solo against BSs, cruisers and frigs). If ya cant i wont believe ya.
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Monty Burns
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:27:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Monty Burns on 18/12/2005 02:28:38
Originally by: JamesTalon At first I wasn't at all happy with the drone bay reduction, but seeing my Hammerhead I's in action, they did as much damage with just 2 of them as 4 did on my Retriever. So you don't get to use more than 3 Heavies, they do the alot more damage than before the patch.
Exactly.
I was a bit shocked to find i had to dump some of my drones in space. I still have a kestrel armed with Cruise that I was not *forced* to deal with but ......
I have been very pleased with the new strength of three medium drones - so much so that I sent them to "deal" with a Gurista BS and they kept it entertained and even did it some damage. I have no extra uber drone skills and yet they did the job sufficiently whilst i delt with the other BS.
So, if you are not happy with your new reduced BS (and i'm trained up to DI4 - and thats it!) then maybe you need to change tactics?
Eve is always about adapting to the changes we get introduced to.... try it, its fun! Darwin 4tw
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Parallax Error
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:27:00 -
[28]
Use your braincells (if you actually have more enough to use a plural amount).
The people who are whining about a "drone nerf" obviously haven't used their braincells and haven't noticed that light drones have had a near doubling of their *base* damage, and that medium drones have had a 33% *base* damage increase. Why have I emphasised the base part? Simple really, that means thay have had that damage increase before any skills or modules have been taken into account.
If your dumb enough to use 3 heavies over 5 mediums and 5 lights then you deserve to ride a pod.
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Veronique Lamonte
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:29:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Veronique Lamonte on 18/12/2005 02:31:04 people are happy with what they are used to. its just not the same game anymore,if cpp want to cut down on the lag the first thing they could have done is get rid of the dustclouds in deadspace for one. alot of people are not happy,the miners are furious,i for one cannot say to cpp "here im only paying you 7 euros this month" like i said it doesnt matter who flames us drone bay nerf whiners,it sucks period. i am having trouble with it,the raven is now significally weaker psycologically. its not the same ship anymore,the nerf is unfair
a hull module to accomodate extra drones or a 15m3 per level skill needs to be implemented NIKKI |
Parallax Error
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:43:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Veronique Lamonte Edited by: Veronique Lamonte on 18/12/2005 02:31:04 people are happy with what they are used to. its just not the same game anymore,if cpp want to cut down on the lag the first thing they could have done is get rid of the dustclouds in deadspace for one. alot of people are not happy,the miners are furious,i for one cannot say to cpp "here im only paying you 7 euros this month" like i said it doesnt matter who flames us drone bay nerf whiners,it sucks period. i am having trouble with it,the raven is now significally weaker psycologically. its not the same ship anymore,the nerf is unfair
a hull module to accomodate extra drones or a 15m3 per level skill needs to be implemented
Dust clouds would only create client side lag which has little to no bearing on server side lag.
And secondly using drones on a Raven implies that they are there as an anti frigate measure. You obviously have tried this out before coming to the forums (I mean anything else would be utterly illogical right?) fitting 5 lights and 5 mediums gives you far more flexibility (you dont have to fit a webber to kill drones) and you can carry a flight of either light or medium EW/Nos/Repair drones.
I mean, surely you'd have actually taken the effort to look at the situation and thought about it before coming straight to the forums and spouting horsemuck just because all the cool kids are doing it?
Or maybe thats too much like hard work?
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Rich Head
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:44:00 -
[31]
Loving the drones...yayaya
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Soulita
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:44:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Azuriel Talloth So is this like missile nerf whines version 2.0?
Yea it is, only worse cause drones werent overpowered so didnt deserve a nerf.
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Veronique Lamonte
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Posted - 2005.12.18 02:57:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Parallax Error
Originally by: Veronique Lamonte Edited by: Veronique Lamonte on 18/12/2005 02:31:04 people are happy with what they are used to. its just not the same game anymore,if cpp want to cut down on the lag the first thing they could have done is get rid of the dustclouds in deadspace for one. alot of people are not happy,the miners are furious,i for one cannot say to cpp "here im only paying you 7 euros this month" like i said it doesnt matter who flames us drone bay nerf whiners,it sucks period. i am having trouble with it,the raven is now significally weaker psycologically. its not the same ship anymore,the nerf is unfair
a hull module to accomodate extra drones or a 15m3 per level skill needs to be implemented
Dust clouds would only create client side lag which has little to no bearing on server side lag.
And secondly using drones on a Raven implies that they are there as an anti frigate measure. You obviously have tried this out before coming to the forums (I mean anything else would be utterly illogical right?) fitting 5 lights and 5 mediums gives you far more flexibility (you dont have to fit a webber to kill drones) and you can carry a flight of either light or medium EW/Nos/Repair drones.
I mean, surely you'd have actually taken the effort to look at the situation and thought about it before coming straight to the forums and spouting horsemuck just because all the cool kids are doing it?
Or maybe thats too much like hard work?
the only horsemuck being spouted is from your mouth,i was expressing my opinion,which others share,which of course you would know about if you bothered to look at other posts. incidentally,why should i have to downgrade to mediums,i trained for them drones and bought a BS for 100.000.000 isk and with it 150m3 drone bay.
NIKKI |
Maestro Ulv
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Posted - 2005.12.18 03:02:00 -
[34]
As a gallente flying gallente battleships and having held the droner title on both my main chars I figured as most that the "nerf" on drones would annoy the crap out of me. So i tested the same setup on both test and main server before rmr was officialy ported (is that the word!) over.
I can honestly say that this so called nerf is a load of hogwash. Hammerheads now so out perform the old models that comparisons are pointless. Ogres the same but imo at least not by as far. Not that im bothered, Ogres were never the drone of preference for taking down NPC BS and for the small fry they were quite pathetic.
Due to the dumbed down tracking this is even more evident but again but again the damage and strength of the drones more than makes up for it, even when comparing 5 to 9 drones.
I should add that at the moment and when on test I did not have all the new drone skills trained to the full extent. When they are completed it will just add to the satisfaction of throwing five small cruiser or fast frigate type wingmen out on my side.
Anyone with a grudge against combat drones in RMR seriously needs to look at how they used them in combat and re-think there tactics. Drop down to meds, if you were a droner you probably used them more than heavies anyway. Then consider changing BS race.
Galls are the droner race, always have been. The storyline has since day one (despite the changes in history) always shown the superioty of drones in gall hands over any other race. To say that your Raven no longer perfoms well with drones is pointless, it was never meant to perfom well with them, they were a mere back up. When ever I have flew a raven I didn't even look at the drone bay.
People seem to want all things completely even, this is pathetic and not EVE, why do you think we have four races with different bloodlines and such a vast amount of ships?
As one poster has already said, drones are now back where they belong, as a prime weapon for the race they were intended for.
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Zytrel
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Posted - 2005.12.18 03:06:00 -
[35]
Either you didn't read the patch notes or you reading/comprehension abilities suck. Anyway. We don't care...
regards, zytrel.
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Sobeseki Pawi
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Posted - 2005.12.18 03:08:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Soulita
Originally by: Azuriel Talloth So is this like missile nerf whines version 2.0?
Yea it is, only worse cause drones werent overpowered so didnt deserve a nerf.
Well, missiles wouldnt crash entire nodes.
~Sobe
Originally by: TomB
Originally by: Darpz
Originally by: Sobeseki Pawi CCP will nerf this probably, but hey, worth a try
so your saying I should of kept my mouth shut?
Yup.
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nahtoh
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Posted - 2005.12.18 03:32:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Veronique Lamonte
Originally by: Parallax Error
Originally by: Veronique Lamonte Edited by: Veronique Lamonte on 18/12/2005 02:31:04 You obviously have tried this out before coming to the forums (I mean anything else would be utterly illogical right?)
Or maybe thats too much like hard work?
the only horsemuck being spouted is from your mouth,i was expressing my opinion,which others share,which of course you would know about if you bothered to look at other posts. incidentally,why should i have to downgrade to mediums,i trained for them drones and bought a BS for 100.000.000 isk and with it 150m3 drone bay.
So in other words...
Answer to question 1 was no?
And
Answer to question 2 was also no?
"I am not saying there should be capital punishment for stupidity, but why can`t we just take the safety labels off everything and let the problem solve itself" (credits to mcallister TCS)
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Leandro Salazar
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Posted - 2005.12.18 03:43:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 18/12/2005 03:45:38 In my Tempest, I use 1 light 2 med 2 hvy now instead of the 6 hvys I had before RMR. And hell, they do a lot better then my 6 heavies did. And they react a lot better to my commands. I am very pleased with the drone changes. Then again I can barely read the new font while some others seem to love it so I guess there are two sides to every story. Guess Dom drivers do have a valid complaint. But if you run 3 hvs drones out of a Raven you didn't do your homework.
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Maestro Ulv
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Posted - 2005.12.18 03:54:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Leandro Salazar Guess Dom drivers do have a valid complaint.
I am a Dom pilot and its the complete opposite to a complaint, the extra bonus just adds to the fun mate :)
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Veronique Lamonte
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Posted - 2005.12.18 03:56:00 -
[40]
maybe i didnt,thats not the issue.of course i will have to adapt, and of course i know the three drones give out exellent damage and can tear up a cruiser easily,i already tried it and yes,better than 6 pre-rmr my point is the bays should have stayed,across the board.again i find myself reiterating,"sale to veronique lamonte of 100 mil isk for raven INCLUDING 150m3 dronebay" we should have kept the m3,even if we could have only 4-5 in space in any one time. NIKKI |
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Maestro Ulv
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Posted - 2005.12.18 04:04:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Veronique Lamonte we should have kept the m3,even if we could have only 4-5 in space in any one time.
Because we can only fly 5 drones at a time now, no you should not keep your m3. For the simple reason that ravens are not meant to chuck out the same amount of drones as a gall BS. Whats the point of a backstory and ships if everything is equal?
Do you then intend to give all gall ships the same missile bonus as caldari ones? No, didn't think so. Its just balance.
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Veronique Lamonte
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Posted - 2005.12.18 04:54:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Maestro Ulv
Originally by: Veronique Lamonte we should have kept the m3,even if we could have only 4-5 in space in any one time.
Because we can only fly 5 drones at a time now, no you should not keep your m3. For the simple reason that ravens are not meant to chuck out the same amount of drones as a gall BS. Whats the point of a backstory and ships if everything is equal?
Do you then intend to give all gall ships the same missile bonus as caldari ones? No, didn't think so. Its just balance.
ok thanks for pointing that out Maestro,i was consumed with dissapointment without the slightest thought or sympathy to what gallente ships have to endure as well. ill go manufacture some hammerheads,adapt and move on. i'll have some of that cheese now i think. NIKKI |
Varsath
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Posted - 2005.12.18 05:20:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Luther Kincaid would you like some cheese with that?
omg..thats so cliche..heard it a billion times and never want to hear it again.
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Phoenix Lord
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Posted - 2005.12.18 05:33:00 -
[44]
It seems to me that most of the people that complained just like the sight of tons of drones orbiting them without really noticing the damage :\
Also, if youre not in a gallente BS, then dont complain about low drone capacity, because youre not even meant to be a drone based BS...
Im a gallente and i fly a thorax that used to have 200m3 of drone space and now its 50, you dont see me complaining do you? I used to love being able to just send out a new drone once one died, but now they hardly ever die. They do so much damage now i can just use them as a main weapon source for most of the stuff cruisers are meant for and fit things like a remote armor repairer to assist them.
Finally.. dont complain about drones until you have actually trained up those new skills. If you havent, then drones should only be used as support for things like anti frigate. Not as your main damage dealer. __________________________________________________
Originally by: CYVOK ASCN SPACE is now a NOW FLY Zone.
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Gonada
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Posted - 2005.12.18 05:45:00 -
[45]
cry me a river void, your full of crap
i can do lvl 3 extravaganzas just as easily now with 5 drones as i could pre-patch with 15
they are indead tougher hit harder, and if you bothered to learn the 4 new combat skills for em you'd see they even make a bigger differance.
and as for crying bout 3 drones for the bs's, im assuming your talkin bout the raven and the apoc, well OMG batman , you wanted drones then you should have gone with gallent.
so heres a violin song for ya,......
cheese?
-I don't necessarily agree with everything I say.-
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Ranger 1
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Posted - 2005.12.18 05:57:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 18/12/2005 00:39:44
Originally by: Shirei
Originally by: Soulita
Originally by: Kaaii
Skills > equipment
o_O Muha muhahah muhahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa 0_o
I have a years+ worth of skills in drones and drone carrier piloting related stuff. The skills are now worth crap.
Considering that the Domi has with this patch become probably the strongest close-range BS for 1v1, I call BS.
ROFL
Edit: I am through with arguing this topic, only thing left I can do is laugh my *** off at comments like this.
Fair enough, as the only thing the rest of us can do is laugh at what an ass you've just made of yourself. I would suggest using eve-search to find the 50 or so page thread that spells it all out for you in minute detail... then come back here and someone will explain it to you.
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dantes inferno
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Posted - 2005.12.18 07:55:00 -
[47]
have you people actualy tried the drones yet or did you just log on see the bay cut in half and have an anerism??? my 5 heavys now kill frigs/cruisers quicker than the 8 i used to use..they eat through Battle cruisers and destroyers.
in case you have not noticed the hp of drones have been increased (i belive doubled), you have a drone durability skill which increased it futher, the drone interfacing skill now will more or less give you double the dot of what the drones had before (specialy those with DI5) light drones have doubled in damage before skills, medium drones have had a increase in damage before skills, you have the new repair, ew and sentry drones, skills to increase drone optimal range and speed (ive not chekced the drone mods..they may be carriers only..if not you now got them to)..so please try engaging your brain and relise that 1 drone in RMR is at least as good if not better than 2 droned in cold war...so those complaining about 3 heavy drones..well those 3 heavy drones are roughly the equivilent of 6 heavy drones in cold war if not better this is stupidest thing ive seen in eve...drones have had a boost if you got the brains to notice it..and people are crying nerf WTF???? _____
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Soulita
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Posted - 2005.12.18 08:43:00 -
[48]
Edited by: Soulita on 18/12/2005 08:44:13
Originally by: Ranger 1
Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 18/12/2005 00:39:44
Originally by: Shirei
Originally by: Soulita
Originally by: Kaaii
Skills > equipment
o_O Muha muhahah muhahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa 0_o
I have a years+ worth of skills in drones and drone carrier piloting related stuff. The skills are now worth crap.
Considering that the Domi has with this patch become probably the strongest close-range BS for 1v1, I call BS.
ROFL
Edit: I am through with arguing this topic, only thing left I can do is laugh my *** off at comments like this.
Fair enough, as the only thing the rest of us can do is laugh at what an ass you've just made of yourself. I would suggest using eve-search to find the 50 or so page thread that spells it all out for you in minute detail... then come back here and someone will explain it to you.
You are very funny. Is that you in the picture of your sig?
If you, my friend, would have read the very thread you are referring too, you would also have read my posts there. Basically you are telling me to read a thread which I not only read but also posted in, obviously without having read it yourself. Now how does that make you look??
I guess some people like the new drones, for me they in effect are a nerf.
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dantes inferno
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Posted - 2005.12.18 08:50:00 -
[49]
Quote: for me asa drone carrier pilot they in effect are a nerf.
how exactly are they a nerf? list your reasons for stating that the changed are a nerf? or is this just a whine without you actuyalyu testing or trainng any new skills _____
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Brastagi
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Posted - 2005.12.18 09:06:00 -
[50]
Interesting...
How many drones a carrier and motherships can hold? (the fighter drones of course) --------- Watch me gravitate Ha ha ha ha ha....
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Dak Hakin
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Posted - 2005.12.18 09:11:00 -
[51]
Hmm ok. I dont use drones, so this is just a sideline view of things.
So some people will turn off graphic effects, sounds, etc to get better performance from the game. Some, dont know if they are the same ones or not, are unhappy because it "doesnt look as cool" to not have a huge swarm of bugs flying around their ship. It does not matter that less drones with more power is better, it just does not look cool.
Hmm ok. I guess we all have our priorities. _______________________________________________
If you fear the thorn, do not crave the rose
Mr. Grumpy-sour-pus |
Right Eyeighty
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Posted - 2005.12.18 09:16:00 -
[52]
Edited by: Right Eyeighty on 18/12/2005 09:16:35
Originally by: Dak Hakin unhappy because it "doesnt look as cool" to not have a huge swarm of bugs flying around their ship. It does not matter that less drones with more power is better, it just does not look cool.
Heh, I have the same though about people whining dronebay nerf. ----------------------------- And now a word from my sponsor
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sonofollo
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Posted - 2005.12.18 09:22:00 -
[53]
drones appear to be ok - sure theres a few less but im still able to fight just as effective as before in a co op setting wth corp mates CCP please restore the recruitment channel - add divisional wallets and also add a days since last login details available to CEOs so we can better manage inactive players - also concord interbus and |
Sergio Ling
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Posted - 2005.12.18 09:43:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Nathan Rees ok now that i am home from work and have more time to explain... this is crap because:
1. not only have i spent the time to get my drones ability to be able to use 5 and can no longer use them in a Raven ... what a waste.. a battleship that can only carry 3 drones..
2. now that i can only CARRY 3 heavy drones if i am engaged and lose one then how many more do i have to replace it with? thats right 0 so now you take out my 3 drones and i am short range = screwed...
not a very good deal all the way around if you ask me .. thanks alot for wasting all my precious skill time on trainging drones to five CCP .. preciate that one..
dude, shush...use meds, you get more, and you're in a rave ffs. the one battleship that's guaranteed not to have a problem with range.
Originally by: Lluthiunne Atalaron He's too busy adjusting his leather pants and mullet to worry about petty things such as physics.
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Sessho Seki
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Posted - 2005.12.18 09:44:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Soulita Oh yea? Please explain to me in complete detail (Skills & exact dom setup - plz no shield tank setup since this would take me a lot of extra training, and tank must be able to sustain lvl4 mission damage) how you achieve this Uberness (going solo against BSs, cruisers and frigs). If ya cant i wont believe ya.
Edit: Oh and plz no theoretical stuff, try it out in a lvl 4 like angel extra or silince the informant or such.
Ok, you are complaining about your dominix not being able to wade through a lv4 mission, but you will hear nothing of shield tank setup since that would take ôextra trainingö?
For the love of God, the bulk of this game is training (shock, horror, surprise!)
Training is what separates a rank one newbie from a battle hardened veteran. If you are reluctant to train up perfectly logical skills related to and indeed necessary to make your ship do what you are intending on doing, then the only weakness in the fitting is the pilot.
The dominix can tank EXTREMELY well, especially with a couple NOS to let your enemy fuel the fire, but if you donÆt have the skills nor the desire to acquire them, then nothing can be said to convince you since youÆve already made up your mind to not want to bother with it.
So long as you are unwilling to meet the game in the middle on your plans, the game isnÆt going to conform to your plans. You have to make the sacrifices of time and effort to get out of the game what you want.
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sonofollo
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Posted - 2005.12.18 09:51:00 -
[56]
co op are level 4 missions now enough said (except for manufacturing agents) well yet anyway CCP please restore the recruitment channel |
Kusotarre
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Posted - 2005.12.18 09:53:00 -
[57]
If you have Drone Interfacing lvl4, your 3 post-RMR drones are equal to 5.4 pre-RMR drones.
You barely got nerfed.
Now, if you were using mediums or lights, instead of heavies, you just got an enormous bonus.
And since you're talking about the raven, here, you should take that other fellow's advice and go with the meds or lights anyways, and let your missiles handle the other guys.
And Soulita, as for the Dominix being a bad 1v1 close combat ship, you really do know nothing. With jamming, the dominix is the only ship that can beat a shield tanked raven in a 1v1, and, of course, all other ships.
You call people asses and laughable, but you clearly have no idea what you are talking about.
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Soulita
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Posted - 2005.12.18 09:53:00 -
[58]
Edited by: Soulita on 18/12/2005 09:54:51
Originally by: dantes inferno
Quote: for me asa drone carrier pilot they in effect are a nerf.
how exactly are they a nerf? list your reasons for stating that the changed are a nerf? or is this just a whine without you actuyalyu testing or trainng any new skills
Since you asked:
a) tracking of heavy drones has been nerfed - they cant kill frigs anymore (taken the frigs are neither painted nor webbed). Now in order to kill frigs lites have to be used. The new lites not only kill frigs slower then the old heavies used to, but if drones are used as primary weapons this also means the type of drones has to be changed in fight when fighting various sizes of ships. This is very problematic since it often takes ages to scoop drones (depending on behaviour of drones can be minutes), meaning during this time a drone carrier pilot cant use his/her primary weapon.
b) using a lower number of drones means each drone destroyed causes a sharper drop in drone damage output. (In case of dom it was 1/15th before and now is 1/5th (durability increase doesnt help because once targeted by tons of npcs the drones die very fast, even with increased durability))
c) drone carrier users cant use the new types of drones since they depend on all 5 combat drones as primary weapon. (this part of the drone changes only effects drone carrier users negatively)
d) the amount of spare drones is reduced in absolute numbers(especially if you have to carry various sizes of drones to be able to counter frigs/cruisers and BSs).
And you can read my opinion on some of the new skills here.
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Plexreticle
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Posted - 2005.12.18 10:10:00 -
[59]
My opinion on the drone nerf:
It's not about the new drones being stronger or better, it's about advantage. People train skills for advantage. When advantage is removed then it is a nerf.
Hypothetically a person trains to control 9 or 10 drones. Someone else trains less than half the time to control 5 or 6. Most ships won't hold more that 5 mediums anymore. The advantage of the additional training to 9-10 is gone because of the size constraint.
This pulls the rug out on people that chose to train addition drone control.
Maybe some folks trained up the Thorax because it was uber. Perhaps someone decided to train up missiles before the last patch because missiles pwned with little training.
I don't see how this was unfair. Everybody here has/had access to the same information and the same market and same original training skills.
CCP adding additional skills to even out the playing field is a nerf. Having to train additional skills to achieve an advantage that one HAD is a nerf. ItÆs changing the rules during the middle of a game.
For some people itÆs great. Rail Boy has 5 better drones and has less drone training than the Drone Master. The whole time the Drone Master was training drone skills Rail Boy was training large hybrids. Rail Boy pwns Drone Master now.
Is there a player in Eve that doesnÆt have some kind of plan or direction for their training?
How can additional unexpected or unavailable training not be a nerf if it does not follow your training career path?
I really have no suggestions to make this a better system. Maybe CCP could release the skills a month or so before the patch to let people adjust to the changes.
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Tatsue Nuko
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Posted - 2005.12.18 10:21:00 -
[60]
Quick note about this:
Originally by: Soulita d) the amount of spare drones is reduced in absolute numbers(especially if you have to carry various sizes of drones to be able to counter frigs/cruisers and BSs).
So in other words, your drones were "nerfed" in the same way my missiles were: you are no longer able to carry weapons suitable to kill every possible type of target at the same time? I'd use the word "balanced" for that particular part of it, actually.
Kit to suit your targets, and bring friends for those targets you can't accomodate in your setup. Sounds good to me.
Feel the ♥, director, diplomat, recruitment officer |
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Kusotarre's Alt
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Posted - 2005.12.18 10:33:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Soulita
Since you asked:
a) tracking of heavy drones has been nerfed - they cant kill frigs anymore (taken the frigs are neither painted nor webbed). Now in order to kill frigs lites have to be used. The new lites not only kill frigs slower then the old heavies used to, but if drones are used as primary weapons this also means the type of drones has to be changed in fight when fighting various sizes of ships. This is very problematic since it often takes ages to scoop drones (depending on behaviour of drones can be minutes), meaning during this time a drone carrier pilot cant use his/her primary weapon.
I agree, it can take longer, due to the switching. However, it was a necessary nerf.
Since we're talking about using Domis and Ishtars here, as they primarily use drones, I'll stick with them.
15 heavy drones killed a close orbiting interceptor before the ship had time to get out, 90% of the time. If it was webbed or nossed, 100%.
Even a long range orbiting inty had trouble staying away from 15 heavy drones. Possible, yes, but once drone humping and random separation tarted spreading the heavies around the BS in a uniform fashion, it was nearly impossible.
And again, with a nos, it was always impossible.
The biggest problem pre-RMR was that there was no thought about which drones to use. You carried as many heavies as possible, and that was it. No thought at all.
Now, there's flexibility. Look at your raven. Do you take 3 heavies, for killing BS and cruisers? Do you take 7 mediums for killing everything with a cruiser-sized sweetspot, and have a couple spares? Do you take 5 meds and 5 lights?
In short: which situations will you prepare for? Before, there was simply no question.
Originally by: Soulita b) using a lower number of drones (with higher damage each) means each drone destroyed causes a sharper drop in drone damage output. (In case of dom it was 1/15th before and now is 1/5th (durability increase doesnt help because once targeted by tons of npcs the drones die very fast, even with increased durability))
Multiple things wrong here, so point form.
1) You completely ignore that pre-RMR, domi had 2 waves of drones. Now, it has 3 waves. Ishtar went from 1.33 to 2 with max skills.
2) Drone durability does help, obviously.
3) If the NPCs hit your drones, you are doing something wrong. Aggro them first. If your drones are aggroing things themselves, form an empty gang to keep them under control. Sure, it sucks to have to do that, but it's been that way since very early Exodus and hence not an RMR problem.
4) Lag. It actually is an issue, and a valid one in large PvP situation.
Originally by: Soulita c) drone carrier users cant use the new types of drones since they depend on all 5 combat drones as primary weapon when going solo. (this part of the drone changes only effects drone carrier users negatively)
If you go solo in a carrier, your a ******* moron. This response doesn't need to be any more in depth than that.
Originally by: Soulita d) the amount of spare drones is reduced in absolute numbers(especially if you have to carry various sizes of drones to be able to counter frigs/cruisers and BSs).
Completely irrelevant!
You had just as many drones or waves of drones before as you do now. 'Absolute numbers' don't matter in the slightest.
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Soulita
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:04:00 -
[62]
Edited by: Soulita on 18/12/2005 11:07:07
Thanks to the above posters for confirming the drone changes are in fact a nerf.
Maybe I should mention CCP didnt intend to nerf drones, and Tuxford actually stated they were in balance before the changes.
Enough said.
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Cantari
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:14:00 -
[63]
Errrm, the drones werent really nerfed/ They have increased hit points, increased damage and there are also new types of drones, not to mention skills to make them hit harder, fly faster and shoot further.
The reason they have reduced the numbers of drones able to be used is because of lag.
Any one who has fought in fleet battles know how much lag launchig drones can cause if done enmasse.
Now the server will only have to track (very roughly) 50% of the drones it did before, meaning less server side lag and a smoother playing experience for all, once the post patch shakes have passed.
Im quite happy with this fact, plus i have been training the new skills since the patch and have already noticed huge improvements in my three heavies on my apoc.
Cantari
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Murwaz
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Posted - 2005.12.18 11:33:00 -
[64]
****! If it wasnt for some "atleast" positivie and intelligent reply's here I would probably rather have killed my self then reading any more of these posts. SO much bull****. The drones works great, they do alot more damage, the mega is lovelynow, I get to have 5 heavys, I rock! They take a bs easily alone. Not player ship perhaps but npc's.
I cant even bare to write any more.. I feel its pointless... most of you dont even seem to care to take it in. Or cant read? O_o
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Crypt
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Posted - 2005.12.18 12:01:00 -
[65]
The nice thing about the new drones is the variety. The damage they do is very nice, but the variety is what makes em so nice. I can do more with drones now then I could by swiching modules before. I no longer have to worry about what I'm going to take off my ship to fit a webber or a sensor dampener or ecm/ew...now I have drones that do that job quite nicely.
Two heavy webber drones will web NPC cruisers about 70% of the time and npc battleships about 20% to 30% of the time...frigates get smoked by the heavy wasps now so fast you barely have time to see what it was before it pops. Two heavy webbers web frigates almost every time without fail and the three wasps pop em right now.
Drone interfacing adds 20% damage per level, Drone sharpshooting adds 5% per level...with both skills trained to 5 thats a 125% boost to your drone damage. With the new range skills your drones will now go out and attack farther...currently mine are attacking targets 40k away, thats with the new skill only at level 2. will my drones reach out to 50k or 60k when all the skills are trained? I sure hope so. This is christmas come early to us Dom/Mega pilots.
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Maestro Ulv
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Posted - 2005.12.18 12:16:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Maestro Ulv on 18/12/2005 12:17:11
Originally by: Plexreticle My opinion on the drone nerf:
Gah! Your opinion could use some information before you post.
It isn't a sodding nerf, like the missiles wasn't a nerf. you just have to train up some extra skills to get even more out of them than before.. Yes thats right, missiles with full skills now perform better too, as do drones. Although why I am repeating myself is beyond me, you like most on here have no clue whatsoever in practical and tactical usage of drones.
As a base fact against your post and one you should have checked before posting. If you can handle 10 drones then with only five released at the same time you already far overpower someone that could only release 5 drones before the patch. Thats is regardless of extra drone skills or BS bonus.
The droner (where the hell does drone master come from??) is still a droner my freind.
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Devric
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Posted - 2005.12.18 12:43:00 -
[67]
Have run a few missions now to see how the drones work now. Well...damage-wise it's just fine and dandy, but...have they gotten even more stupid than before? As soon as their target is killed, they choose another target within a second or so, and it's ALWAYS a target in a non-aggroed group of ships. They NEVER pick a target in the group you already aggroed. You have to be very quick at telling them what target to attack next, but very often it's still not enough.
Their behaivour has changed, no doubt about it. Together with the fact that you control less drones I am of the opinion that they are nerfed in a bad way. I loose drones in a rate that is probably 5-10 times higher than before, even though their hitpoints are increased, and even though I trained a few new drone skills to improve them further.
I loose my drone firepower much faster now than before the patch, and it's not because I control less drones, it's because their behaivour is different. Reeling in the drones makes the ships attack my ship instead, so warping out is a much more common thing too.
If the behaivour was like before the patch, I don't think I would have noticed any difference using them really.
This goes for the heavy drones. Someone had went back to use medium drones instead and claimed it was better. I think I will try that. At least I can bring a few spares.
Anyway, this is not whining, just observations made first hand from a drone user. __________________________________________________________ Knowledge is when you don't know what you don't know. (Old Chinese saying) |
Judekka
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Posted - 2005.12.18 12:45:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Crypt ...frigates get smoked by the heavy wasps now so fast you barely have time to see what it was before it pops.
Check the Tracking speed on the info page of a Wasp I or II next time you're in game. Then look at the Tracking speed of the other heavy drones. Prepare to be amazed! *cough* bug *cough*
(Note to CCP: Please correct this.) |
Angelic Resolution
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Posted - 2005.12.18 13:07:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Judekka
Originally by: Crypt ...frigates get smoked by the heavy wasps now so fast you barely have time to see what it was before it pops.
Check the Tracking speed on the info page of a Wasp I or II next time you're in game. Then look at the Tracking speed of the other heavy drones. Prepare to be amazed! *cough* bug *cough*
(Note to CCP: Please correct this.)
*cough* thanks for wrecking it *cough* ******** *cough*
:)
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Sarmaul
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Posted - 2005.12.18 13:07:00 -
[70]
Edited by: Sarmaul on 18/12/2005 13:08:15 1) You can only control 5 drones at a time, as opposed to 10 (15 on some gal ships)
2) As the Drone Interfacing skill would be redundant with this new system, it has now been changed to to give +20% damage and +20% mining yeild per level. Trained to level 5, this now means that your 5 drones now do the damage of 10, as opposed to 10 drones doing the damage of 10 before. As you can see, no loss of damage output.
3) The gallente ships that were able to control an extra drone per ship level have had their bonus changed to 10% damage per level. Doing the maths, with maxed skills this means 5 drones now do the damage of 15 before. Again, no loss in damage.
4) All drone hitpoints have been doubled, giving 5 drones now the same change of surviving as 10 before.
5) As a result of this increase, it now takes longer to smartbomb drones (8 volleys now, as opposed to 4 before), meaning your drones will last longer and do more damage for longer.
6) Light and medium drones have had a damage boost, making them very effective against smaller targets (before they were a joke).
7) The dronebays on all ships have been halved as 1/2 the drones now do the same damage as full drones before, i.e. my tempest with 3 drones in RMR does the same damage as my tempest with 6 drones before.
8) Drone damage modules are being introduced (like heatsinks and gyrostabs), further increasing the damage of drones
9) New drone types are being introduced, which will make ships with a big drone bay able to carry a full assortment of combat drones, webbing drones, tracking disrupting drones, nosferatu drones, and sentry drones.
10) sentry drones hurt. A LOT.
I think that's it. It is most definatly a boost, not a nerf.
Originally by: Testy McTest Artillery Extreme Ammo - fires typhoons that launch claws with autocannons that launch guys in space suits that have machine guns that fire ninjas
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Nyphur
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Posted - 2005.12.18 13:22:00 -
[71]
It's not a drone ship. Why should it be able to hold a full complement of the best drones? Use mediums or stick with the three heavy ones.
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dantes inferno
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Posted - 2005.12.18 13:58:00 -
[72]
Quote: tracking of heavy drones has been nerfed - they cant kill frigs anymore (taken the frigs are neither painted nor webbed). Now in order to kill frigs lites have to be used. The new lites not only kill frigs slower then the old heavies used to, but if drones are used as primary weapons this also means the type of drones has to be changed in fight when fighting various sizes of ships. This is very problematic since it often takes ages to scoop drones (depending on behaviour of drones can be minutes), meaning during this time a drone carrier pilot cant use his/her primary weapon.
um wrong heavys kill frigs perfectly fine (actualy better that pre rmr)...how do i know this? from 2 days of chaining in 0.0 where i, my corp mates, and my alliance mates have used heavy drones without webbing/painting or anything else to great effect..either you have not tested this properly or ur doing something wrong.
Quote: b) using a lower number of drones (with higher damage each) means each drone destroyed causes a sharper drop in drone damage output. (In case of dom it was 1/15th before and now is 1/5th (durability increase doesnt help because once targeted by tons of npcs the drones die very fast, even with increased durability))
and? here a hint..wait for the npc to target you..then drop your drones..i can go weeks of chainign/missions and not loose a single drone..why cant you?
Quote: c) drone carrier users cant use the new types of drones since they depend on all 5 combat drones as primary weapon when going solo. (this part of the drone changes only effects drone carrier users negatively)
the new types of drones are an addition..you hve lasted this long without them..so why complain that ur drone ship cant use them now? the choice is urs..use dmg drones or the new ones..u cant have everything you know..its similar to the tank/dmg choices that every ship has to make.
Quote: d) the amount of spare drones is reduced in absolute numbers(especially if you have to carry various sizes of drones to be able to counter frigs/cruisers and BSs)
.
now lets take my mega into acount i used to carry 10 heavys and use 8..i now carry 5 heavys and use 5..so assuming if i had DI5 i wouldnt realy of lost anything. some ships probaly have lost a bit of extra drones but this is an unaovidable side affect which really considering how bad a lot of other people have been hit by nerfs you should count your blessings.
reading this list its all petty things or things you obviously havent tested out properly..so im forced to conclude ur just whinning that things arnt 100% in your favor and you have to make compromises like the rest of eve does. _____
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Soulita
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Posted - 2005.12.18 16:26:00 -
[73]
Originally by: dantes inferno reading this list its all petty things or things you obviously havent tested out properly..
ROFL - things are starting to get funny again.
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Plexreticle
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Posted - 2005.12.19 18:46:00 -
[74]
Thanks for the condescending reply there maestro luv.
The term Drone Master is a hypothetical character name, youÆre thinking of it as descriptive slang like uber fanboy or megalomaniac.
ôDronerö (noun) or ôdroningö (verb) is a definition of a person that replies to post without reading it or to post in a persistently dull or monotonous tone
Example: MegalomaniacÆs reply to my post is droning that additional skills training to return to status quo ante is not a nerf.
Originally by: Maestro Ulv Edited by: Maestro Ulv on 18/12/2005 12:17:11
Originally by: Plexreticle My opinion on the drone nerf:
Gah! Your opinion could use some information before you post.
It isn't a sodding nerf, like the missiles wasn't a nerf. you just have to train up some extra skills to get even more out of them than before.. Yes thats right, missiles with full skills now perform better too, as do drones. Although why I am repeating myself is beyond me, you like most on here have no clue whatsoever in practical and tactical usage of drones.
As a base fact against your post and one you should have checked before posting. If you can handle 10 drones then with only five released at the same time you already far overpower someone that could only release 5 drones before the patch. Thats is regardless of extra drone skills or BS bonus.
The droner (where the hell does drone master come from??) is still a droner my freind.
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Mercade
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Posted - 2005.12.19 19:17:00 -
[75]
WTB a world where needing to pay for 15 OGRE II's which can be popped by a single smart bomb is > getting the same results from 5 OGRE II's which can't be as easily popped.
Or are you not a carrier pilot? You say you are Soulita but all you've confirmed so far is.
1. You refuse to adapt tactics/skills to situation with your beligerance regarding shield skills.
2. You are entrenched like all premissile nerf ravens were that if your ship previously could achieve all it was supposed to remain that way. That somehow you are entitled a degree of reward vs effort because it is what you are familiar with.
3. That your perspective on solo lvl 4 PVE represents more then 50% of drone application making your opinionated perspective have greater value then the combined opinions of the pilots that use drones otherwise. In fact I would guess that between PVP, and other types of PVE you are in fact as a solo drone carrier level 4 mission player a major minority.
4. That you like to argue a point like me alot "kudos" hehe.
5. Something else.
And anyone who can point out 5 parts wrong to someone else's post is more correct then them.
So in light of fun and sarcasm and a little seriousness the truth of the matter is.
Before nerf adding in new features like EW drones would have been impossible because certain ships would have completely become overpowered.
By reducing the number this became possible, boostable and the cost of using tech 2 drones more feasible. And key ships made better.
All that is necessary now is some fitting/tactical imagination or wingmen.
good luck
Originally by: kieron ...possible causes for an extended downtime, I think playing WoW would be close to the bottom of the list, probably between shaving cats and having dental work done w/o anethesia. |
Wyldkat
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Posted - 2005.12.19 19:33:00 -
[76]
Edited by: Wyldkat on 19/12/2005 19:35:55 OK seriously have you ppl saying drones were nerfed even glanced at what all is available now?
There's now a new skill called Advanced Drone interfacing to replace Drone interfacing that will allow us to control 5 more drones.
We didn't loose anything by having drone interfacing changed as it now gives a +20% bonus to damage or mining yeild per level. There are now skills that crank up most of the stats on drone even higher than what they are now.
Fighters just frankly scare the heck out of me. dunno if any of you have looked at the stats on these things, but they have the HP of a Tech one Cruiser and the fire power of about 2 Heavy drones. And that's BEFORE you take into account Skill and ship bonuses.
Seriously Drones haven't been nerfed, they've been majorly boosted. what's been nerfed is the way we used to use them.
I've already said it in my Corp channel, and I'm gonna say it here. RMR wasn't just an expansion, it was a total reinvention of combat in EVE. If you try to continue to fight the way you did, you are gonna get your butts handed to you.
(edit:Fixed my horrid typing)
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The Major
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Posted - 2005.12.19 20:16:00 -
[77]
There is an excellent reasonto fear Fighters more than that: A Mothership pilot under optimal conditions (all relavent drone skills to level 5 and the max of 3 Drone Control Units fitted) will field 28 Fighters at once that do the damage of 56.
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Nybbas
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Posted - 2005.12.19 20:17:00 -
[78]
i agree with soulita, my ishtar doing 600dps with drones alone is not nearly enough, let alone its ability to also fit a full set of sentry drones which can hit at over 75km. Boost drones, this nerf was terrible!
*note* heavy drones hitting frigs was a necessary FIX. It is the only way drones were nerfed at all in the patch, but even with that medium drones beat the crap out of them still, and i hear light drones do even moreso. use that extra drone bay you got in your ishtar and dominix from the patch to fit a few mediums or lights. Still better than what missile users got hit with, if they got torps they CANT hit frigs and kill them, you just gotta recall drones and launch a new set. cry more please.
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Trev Kachanov
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Posted - 2005.12.19 21:00:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Veronique Lamonte Edited by: Veronique Lamonte on 18/12/2005 02:39:19 Edited by: Veronique Lamonte on 18/12/2005 02:31:04 i am having trouble with it,the raven is now significally weaker psycologically. its not the same ship anymore,the nerf is unfair
This is hilarious, psychological nerfs.... AHHHH MY BRAINS!!!
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Maestro Ulv
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Posted - 2005.12.19 21:08:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Plexreticle ôDronerö (noun) or ôdroningö (verb) is a definition of a person that replies to post without reading it or to post in a persistently dull or monotonous tone
"Whiner"
#1 To utter a plaintive, high-pitched, protracted sound, as in pain, fear, supplication, or complaint. #2 To complain or protest in a childish fashion. #3 To produce a sustained noise of relatively high pitch: jet engines whining
Droner however in context with your original post, these forums and the game of EVE is a term used to describe someone with full drone skills.
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dantes inferno
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Posted - 2005.12.19 21:16:00 -
[81]
Quote: ROFL - things are starting to get funny again.
how so? this is a irrelevent statment with no clarification and no reference to anything and just verify's my point that you are whinning without any real tests been done. most of your points of a so called nerf are either nitpicking or incorret...heavys i know work fine against frigs..as ive used them and seen other do so. you cant seriously expect to use a full set of DMG drones as well as the reppers and ew at the same time can you?
so up to the point you actualy bring some valid points and comments and not idiotic remarks...you will just show urself to be one of the legion of brainless whiners who have infested the forums for past 4 days. _____
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Gariuys
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Posted - 2005.12.19 21:27:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Plexreticle My opinion on the drone nerf:
It's not about the new drones being stronger or better, it's about advantage. People train skills for advantage. When advantage is removed then it is a nerf.
Hypothetically a person trains to control 9 or 10 drones. Someone else trains less than half the time to control 5 or 6. Most ships won't hold more that 5 mediums anymore. The advantage of the additional training to 9-10 is gone because of the size constraint.
This pulls the rug out on people that chose to train addition drone control.
Maybe some folks trained up the Thorax because it was uber. Perhaps someone decided to train up missiles before the last patch because missiles pwned with little training.
I don't see how this was unfair. Everybody here has/had access to the same information and the same market and same original training skills.
CCP adding additional skills to even out the playing field is a nerf. Having to train additional skills to achieve an advantage that one HAD is a nerf. ItÆs changing the rules during the middle of a game.
For some people itÆs great. Rail Boy has 5 better drones and has less drone training than the Drone Master. The whole time the Drone Master was training drone skills Rail Boy was training large hybrids. Rail Boy pwns Drone Master now.
Is there a player in Eve that doesnÆt have some kind of plan or direction for their training?
How can additional unexpected or unavailable training not be a nerf if it does not follow your training career path?
I really have no suggestions to make this a better system. Maybe CCP could release the skills a month or so before the patch to let people adjust to the changes.
What are you on about? People that trained drone interfacing 5, now have a 100% damage increase over people taht just trained to use 5. And the bay was cut so you don't need a aditional artificial limit to stop ravens from having 5 heavy drones out just like a megathron for instance. ~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~ A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool |
Tabernash
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Posted - 2005.12.19 21:37:00 -
[83]
I'm a drone specialist..domi's and ishtar's and I gotta say i was a bit scuuurred about the patch but after it came I couldn't be happier...lights, heavies, mediums oh my, my drone are feckin killin machines (DI-5, HD-5 4tw!)...just train up the skills and stop the whining the new skills just make them that much more ridiculous.
if after all these people have said something you still think you have a valid pt then remember your flying a raven which is enough reason for this thread to be over about a million posts ago in reference to your drone bay.....yarrrr
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Plexreticle
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Posted - 2005.12.20 01:41:00 -
[84]
Your definition #2 fits your posting style quite well. Whining about everybody that has an opinion different than yours. I think you should dump you current banner and use that, it fits your personality.
My definition of droner only has to do with you and your post and not Eve. IÆm sorry you didnÆt understand. ôDroning onö also fits, thank you. IÆll use that term if it helps you understand what I think of your incessant and condescending posting style. BTW, I didnÆt use that term in my original post, perhaps you should make an attempt to read and understand before you try insulting people and accuse them of the same.
Instead of focusing on one line of my original post could you answer this question? How can additional unexpected or unavailable training not be a nerf if it does not follow your training career path?
Is English not your primary language? I know you having a hard time grasping this because of your multiple edits. If you like you can Evemail me and IÆll explain it off line so you donÆt have to look like such a whining droner.
Cya "freind"
Originally by: Maestro Ulv Edited by: Maestro Ulv on 19/12/2005 21:28:02 Edited by: Maestro Ulv on 19/12/2005 21:26:25
Originally by: Plexreticle ôDronerö (noun) or ôdroningö (verb) is a definition of a person that replies to post without reading it or to post in a persistently dull or monotonous tone
"Whiner"
#1 To utter a plaintive, high-pitched, protracted sound, as in pain, fear, supplication, or complaint. #2 To complain or protest in a childish fashion. #3 To produce a sustained noise of relatively high pitch: jet engines whining
Droner however in context with your original post, these forums and the game of EVE is a term used to describe someone with full drone skills.
Originally by: Plexreticle Example: MegalomaniacÆs reply to my post is droning that additional skills training to return to status quo ante is not a nerf.
Again an incorrect assumption that even manages to argue its point with your own original post.
In your original post you stated incorrectly that a char with 10 drones available pre RMR is now on an even keel with a char using 5 drones pre RMR. There wasn't a status quo before and due to the fact that the higher char also has extra bonus taken into account due to his lvl5 interfacing there is no status quo post RMR.
Oh and btw, its "droning on".
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Maximus Krysdam
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Posted - 2005.12.20 02:24:00 -
[85]
Edited by: Maximus Krysdam on 20/12/2005 02:29:01
Quote: So is this like missile nerf whines version 2.0?
ppl always find somthing to cry about..
big deal.. you cant use 10 drones in your ship anymore... you can use 3 or 4 that and overall you do the same dmg.. what's the big deal..
"...It is that in war the victorious strategist only seeks battle after the victory has been won, whereas he who is destined to defeat first fights and afterwards looks for victory..." |
Ranger 1
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Posted - 2005.12.20 02:46:00 -
[86]
Edited by: Ranger 1 on 20/12/2005 02:53:24 Edited by: Ranger 1 on 20/12/2005 02:49:26 Edited by: Ranger 1 on 20/12/2005 02:48:15
Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 18/12/2005 08:47:24
Originally by: Ranger 1
Originally by: Soulita Edited by: Soulita on 18/12/2005 00:39:44
Originally by: Shirei
Originally by: Soulita
Originally by: Kaaii
Skills > equipment
o_O Muha muhahah muhahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa 0_o
I have a years+ worth of skills in drones and drone carrier piloting related stuff. The skills are now worth crap.
Considering that the Domi has with this patch become probably the strongest close-range BS for 1v1, I call BS.
ROFL
Edit: I am through with arguing this topic, only thing left I can do is laugh my *** off at comments like this.
Fair enough, as the only thing the rest of us can do is laugh at what an ass you've just made of yourself. I would suggest using eve-search to find the 50 or so page thread that spells it all out for you in minute detail... then come back here and someone will explain it to you.
You are very funny. Is that you in the picture of your sig?
If you, my friend, would have read the very thread you are referring too, you would also have read my posts there. Basically you are telling me to read a thread which I not only read but also posted in, obviously without having read it yourself. Now how does that make you look??
I guess some people (probably missile users) like the new drones, for me asa drone carrier pilot they in effect are a nerf.
Doh!!! You've got me there. I totally did'nt realize that numerous people had already tried to explain how things work now... and you still can't get it.
I use drones heavily, most of my main combat pilots fly Domi's in a variety of combat rigs.
You... are.... clueless.
Edit: Oh yes, lets not forget my Raven flying buddies out in Fountain space, who are cluckling gleefully as they shred everything coming too close with their Medium drones. They'd feel insulted if I left them out.
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Hllaxiu
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Posted - 2005.12.20 03:07:00 -
[87]
If this is a drone nerf, I'd love to see what a drone boost would be.
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Ka Dargo
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Posted - 2005.12.20 03:25:00 -
[88]
Im a drone specialised character... Dom and Ishtar are two of my favourite ships.. I prefer the way drones are now.
Skill wise, I have all of the old skills at V, except for racial specialised skills which are all currently at IV. Im working through the new skills as we speak, and find the drones getting better on a daily basis as I work through them.
I also fly Caldari ships, and quite often use a Raven for NPCing. I have tried using 3 heavies, as well as a mixture of mediums and lights, I found both of them still to be very effective, and again, nothing to complain about.
I have yet to come across any issues with killing frigs with heavy drones however. I use 5 heavies to kill frigs atm, and it kills them as fast if not faster than pre patch. I dont use a web / target painter or anything else, so no third party modules are effecting the drones ability to kill.
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EvilDoomer
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Posted - 2005.12.20 03:45:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Nathan Rees kk i love eve and everything about it but the battleships only being able to carry 3 heavy drones is BS guys..
they said the drone changes were for the better.
3 heavy drones in my apoc WTF. so, I trained all that time were I could fly 9 now 5 but can only put 3 in. :{
Thanks
EvilDoomer
Chicago Mobsters In-Game Channel:DAMOB
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Soulita
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Posted - 2005.12.20 04:00:00 -
[90]
Edited by: Soulita on 20/12/2005 04:27:48 Edited by: Soulita on 20/12/2005 04:16:14
Originally by: dantes inferno
Quote: ROFL - things are starting to get funny again.
how so?...clarification...
Well Dantes Inferno, since you realy want me to answer: Originally by: dantes inferno
Quote: tracking of heavy drones has been nerfed - they cant kill frigs anymore (taken the frigs are neither painted nor webbed). Now in order to kill frigs lites have to be used. The new lites not only kill frigs slower then the old heavies used to, but if drones are used as primary weapons this also means the type of drones has to be changed in fight when fighting various sizes of ships. This is very problematic since it often takes ages to scoop drones (depending on behaviour of drones can be minutes), meaning during this time a drone carrier pilot cant use his/her primary weapon.
...um wrong heavys kill frigs perfectly fine (actualy better that pre rmr)...
This is simply untrue. (I am not talking about clumsy 6k frigs, but fast 30k ones) Please check other posts on that matter.
Originally by: dantes inferno
Quote: b) using a lower number of drones (with higher damage each) means each drone destroyed causes a sharper drop in drone damage output. (In case of dom it was 1/15th before and now is 1/5th (durability increase doesnt help because once targeted by tons of npcs the drones die very fast, even with increased durability))
and? here a hint..wait for the npc to target you..then drop your drones..i can go weeks of chainign/missions and not loose a single drone..why cant you?
I ll let a dev explain that to you:
Originally by: Zrakor
Originally by: Martinus Crimson Serpentis Extravaganza... The whole spawn agrro'd without any apparent reason ...
...were you using a ton of drones who might have flown through the aggro radius of other npc groups than you were fighting?
No further explanation needed I think.
Originally by: dantes inferno
Quote: c) drone carrier users cant use the new types of drones since they depend on all 5 combat drones as primary weapon when going solo. (this part of the drone changes only effects drone carrier users negatively)
the new types of drones are an addition..you hve lasted this long without them..so why complain that ur drone ship cant use them now? the choice is urs..use dmg drones or the new ones..u cant have everything you know..its similar to the tank/dmg choices that every ship has to make.
With the difference that any other ships have main weapons in the high slots and not in the drone bay. So any non Drone carrier ship with a drone bay can use the new drones without sacrificing their main weapons.
Originally by: dantes inferno
Quote: d) the amount of spare drones is reduced in absolute numbers(especially if you have to carry various sizes of drones to be able to counter frigs/cruisers and BSs)
.
now lets take my mega into acount i used to carry 10 heavys and use 8..i now carry 5 heavys and use 5..so assuming if i had DI5 i wouldnt realy of lost anything. some ships probaly have lost a bit of extra drones but this is an unaovidable side affect which really considering how bad a lot of other people have been hit by nerfs you should count your blessings.
Interesting. I thought you said it was not a nerf ? Now you say it is in that point (I find this point to be the weakest of the 4 btw).
Oh and you said you have the impression I am not testing anything? What do you think I do in the dom? Could it be I use drones all the time??
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dantes inferno
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Posted - 2005.12.20 07:11:00 -
[91]
Quote: This is simply untrue. (I am not talking about clumsy 6k frigs, but fast 30k ones) Please check other posts on that matter.
what in hell makes u think im talking about crappy 6k frigs...i live work and hunt in 0.0 and use my heavy drones against measly 8 k frigs to the highest bounty frigs available..and guess what they work fine.
Quote: I ll let a dev explain that to you:
no need for them to explain anything to me..if i can go weeks without loosing any droned nor having them take damage..how come you cant? is it you dont know what your doing or am i a super drone user without relisign?
Quote: With the difference that any other ships have main weapons in the high slots and not in the drone bay. So any non Drone carrier ship with a drone bay can use the new drones without sacrificing their main weapons.
while the drone carrier who does not rely on having good wepons on their high slots (which is very PG and cpu intensive) can fit an excelent tank and have EW on their ship without loosing any DPS...other ships cant rely do this if they want good DPS they must sacrifise their tank/ew capabilities..its half a dozen of one and 6 of the other im afraid. its the same with new drones you want that abilites you must sacrifise some DPS im sorry they are not a win button for you..but you have to deal with the same scenario as every one else.
Quote: Interesting. I thought you said it was not a nerf ? Now you say it is in that point (I find this point to be the weakest of the 4 btw).
putting words in my mouth 4tw...its a boost i was speaking on the terms u idioticly see it as a nerf..your gripes are insicnificant to the problems real nerfs get which is the point im making. and it is not the weakest..now you can only use 5 (whihc if u have DI to 5 is the equivilent to 10 cold war drones)drones..leaving the droen bays the same size would give you way to much "waves" of drones and would unbalance drone users making them to powerful..as the drone expert im sure you could of figured this out yourself
Quote: Oh and you said you have the impression I am not testing anything? What do you think I do in the dom? Could it be I use drones all the time??
then your not doing a very good job either you dont test them...your after a i win button or your head is so far up ur ass you cant see this as the boost it is. all you can see is OMG I CAN ONLY USE 5 DRONES (which are just as powerful if not more than 10 pre rmr drones..15 in a domi) AND MY DRONE BAY IS ONLY HALF THE SIZE (but now that i can only use 5 double the power of pre rmr drones..i dont need a drone bay as big as i did..cause i cant use as much drones as i did)
_____
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Earthan
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Posted - 2005.12.20 07:17:00 -
[92]
No its perfectly ok
Only some bs are designed to use hvy drones.
For rest drones are against smaller ships.
*****************************
Out here on the perimeter there are no stars Out here we is stoned-immaculate.
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Ralitge boyter
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Posted - 2005.12.20 07:44:00 -
[93]
Medium drones with a few months of training will own almost all ships. They now do roughly +150% more damage then before, they last longer, the fly faster and are more acurate in their damage dealing. They can even do EW now.
All in all I would say leave the heavies for the dreadnaughts and use your (max of 5 in space now) mediums as they really do own all (including interceptors).
------------------------------------------- Should you disagree with me, well I guess that is because I disagree with you. If you have a problem with that please feel free not to tell me. |
Gray Carmicheal
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Posted - 2005.12.20 08:28:00 -
[94]
I'm all for the "nerf" MUCH prefer the drones being like snubfighters as compared to gnats.
Also, I viewed the old drones as crutches for the skilless, by skillless I mean those without the brass to take a pounding and dish one out as well. Drones are a supplement, not a primary weapon system (except on the new carriers, afaik). The fact that people were hauling about a ton of drones so they could swarm and spam was, pathetic, to say the least.
Old Drones reminded me of Plasma Spam in PlanetSide: It makes Baby Jesus cry.
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Gariuys
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Posted - 2005.12.20 08:29:00 -
[95]
Originally by: Ralitge boyter Medium drones with a few months of training will own almost all ships. They now do roughly +150% more damage then before, they last longer, the fly faster and are more acurate in their damage dealing. They can even do EW now.
All in all I would say leave the heavies for the dreadnaughts and use your (max of 5 in space now) mediums as they really do own all (including interceptors).
NEt result with maxed out skills is that 5 do some 25% more damage then 10 did before. ~{When evil and strange get together anything is possible}~ A tool is only useless when you don't know how to use it. - ActiveX The grass is always greener on the other side. - JoCool |
Maestro Ulv
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Posted - 2005.12.20 11:26:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Plexreticle How can additional unexpected or unavailable training not be a nerf if it does not follow your training career path?[/i]
Glad you managed to get at least on line back on topic...
If someone has Interfacing lvl5 pre RMR and someone does not then the person with the skill has vastly more firepower. If they are at the same level then neither are at a disadvantage, pretty easy to grasp really.
As for how can additional training not be a nerf... Stupidest question I have ever heard. How can additional training to make the HP, speed, damage, resistance etc be a nerf? It makes your drones harder, faster and a damn site more capable than ever before.
I won't get into the rest of the childish flame bait. Its been covered by nearly everyone else in this thread and you seem completely incapable of actualy understanding anything you disagree with.
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Maestro Ulv
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Posted - 2005.12.20 11:36:00 -
[97]
Originally by: Gray Carmicheal Drones are a supplement, not a primary weapon system (except on the new carriers, afaik). The fact that people were hauling about a ton of drones so they could swarm and spam was, pathetic, to say the least.
In PvP yes, they are not so much a supplement but a very handy and powerful diversion. In PvE then In the Dom I can now release 5 meds or on odd occasion 5 heavies and literaly just sit there and armour tank while they do the work. This is in high end lvl3 and low to mid lvl4. Admittedly and thankfully in lvl4's I do have to turn the rails on a few times. So for NPC missions the drones are now back to primary weapons.
Now its back to using the tried and trusted method of making sure your targetted before sending in a wave. Have to admit that this makes for boring missions, but hey its only for the sec rating on 3's so...
Have to disagree with you on the swarm and spam thing though. Personaly I released all my drones because I could and only used them in combat not for showing off.
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