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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
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CCP Ytterbium
C C P C C P Alliance
1355
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Posted - 2012.12.07 17:24:00 -
[61] - Quote
Oink! |
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Liandri Jenquai
State War Academy Caldari State
5
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Posted - 2012.12.07 17:27:00 -
[62] - Quote
JitaPriceChecker2 wrote:Turelus wrote:Any more updates on this?
I find it hard to believe no one else is suffering the issues that have been had, Stop whining - adopt, brainless computer program is beating you , what does it say about you ?
Stop whining about whiners. Do you have nothing better to do? |
Nicolai Xperte
No Fracks Givin Inc
6
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Posted - 2012.12.07 18:48:00 -
[63] - Quote
we got DEV'd our voices have been heard now for the live results show next week I don't always bring out my Absolution.
But when I do it makes the Blue's rage, lol. |
vice vortex
Kiith Paktu Curatores Veritatis Alliance
6
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Posted - 2012.12.07 22:45:00 -
[64] - Quote
Nicolai Xperte wrote:we got DEV'd our voices have been heard now for the live results show next week
this is good news! lets hope they fix it and test it for themselves this time :( |
Schroeder Karloff
State War Academy Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.12.08 07:32:00 -
[65] - Quote
Will be interesting to see what (if any) changes are made - completely happy with them buffing TD's since for projectiles they were a bit of a non-entity before in l4's imho (although I appreciate lasers are a different kettle of fish!), but was kinda surprised how hefty they were post patch - am fortunate enough to be running ac mach w. snakes and can just about deal with em ok, but not sure how many mission runners run boats with 2.6km/s for rapid closure and 3 TE's!
TD's plus whole room aggro in first pocket of Vengeance made me clench a bit :) Glad to see some changes though to toughen up l4's, relieves the mission running monotony a bit but I guess that's personal preference :)
BTW I loved:
Quote:Turelus wrote:Any more updates on this?
I find it hard to believe no one else is suffering the issues that have been had, Stop whining - adopt, brainless computer program is beating you , what does it say about you ?
I fail to see how pulling off a Madonna is going to resolve the issue. |
hmskrecik
TransMine Group German Information Network Alliance
36
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Posted - 2012.12.08 18:32:00 -
[66] - Quote
While you are at it, please evaluate sensor damps too. |
Turelus
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve The Fourth District
78
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Posted - 2012.12.08 18:46:00 -
[67] - Quote
hmskrecik wrote:While you are at it, please evaluate sensor damps too.
TBH a complete look at NPCs in general and the way they work, the power of their EWAR, range of their weapons (80km torps) would be nice.
I would love to see the day when NPCs are smart and challenging though not hard to kill still, there needs to be a nice balance in the challenge of PVE and the ease of ISK. Most scrubs in EVE don't have nice moons to buy them everything and have to grind for hours for their ISK. "Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves." |
hmskrecik
TransMine Group German Information Network Alliance
37
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Posted - 2012.12.08 18:54:00 -
[68] - Quote
Turelus wrote: TBH a complete look at NPCs in general and the way they work, the power of their EWAR, range of their weapons (80km torps) would be nice.
I would love to see the day when NPCs are smart and challenging though not hard to kill still, there needs to be a nice balance in the challenge of PVE and the ease of ISK. Most scrubs in EVE don't have nice moons to buy them everything and have to grind for hours for their ISK.
I agree. That's why I don't complain about this new AI, even though it costed me dozen T2 drones so far. But this pimped up EWAR is prohibitive. In fun killing sense prohibitive. |
Xavier Linx
Omni Research The Methodical Alliance
5
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Posted - 2012.12.08 18:59:00 -
[69] - Quote
Turelus wrote:There is little one can do to adapt to this change other than move over to missile ships.
Nice summary but just one thing: All missile ships worth running lv 4s with need light and/or medium drones to function properly. |
Josefine Etrange
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
4
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Posted - 2012.12.09 04:07:00 -
[70] - Quote
Turelus wrote:JitaPriceChecker2 wrote:Turelus wrote:Any more updates on this?
I find it hard to believe no one else is suffering the issues that have been had, Stop whining - adopt, brainless computer program is beating you , what does it say about you ? There is little one can do to adapt to this change other than move over to missile ships. The screenshot shows three NPC ships Disrupting an optimal range of 50km down to 9km, with 11km falloff. There have been situations where this has happened and the NPCs will orbit you at 40km meaning you CAN'T hit them with lasers using the longest range ammo. There have been worse cases reported. Currently the only way to "adapt" is to never use gun ships when flying solo against Sansha NPCs
Really? You are playing a a space station? Cool story bro, but maybe you should try a laser space ship with an engine and close that distance to kill the pest of ecm ships. |
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Akuma Tsukai
24th Imperial Crusade Amarr Empire
19
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Posted - 2012.12.09 06:03:00 -
[71] - Quote
Xavier Linx wrote:
Nice summary but just one thing: All missile ships worth running lv 4s with need light and/or medium drones to function properly.
Actually raven have 2 free slots for small turrets and heavies are still good enough vs frigs. Raven with 3 sentries, god what the **** am i flying now |
Jose Montalvo
TSOE Po1ice TSOE Consortium
0
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Posted - 2012.12.09 07:33:00 -
[72] - Quote
Any new developments on this matter Dev's....?? From what i been reading on the forums the problem is not only with TD but all different types of ECM aswell. Drones is another matter too, the aggro is insane in some cases, for example missions that involve killing scram/web frigs in some cases more than 12 frigs and as soon you deploy the drones they start dying in less that 10secs. I'm sure new players nor vets are happy with this, missioning has become almost imposible regardless of the level. Please keep us posted on this, many players are awaiting a good balanced result. Thx |
Tetsuko Yorimasa
Kiith Paktu Curatores Veritatis Alliance
0
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Posted - 2012.12.09 12:50:00 -
[73] - Quote
When you connect to the game occasionaly like me, that TD increase become a real problem, . I can't relax myself alone for a few minutes in a mission or in anomalies, the game became totally useless for me. CCP is pushing me outside the game, and I don't have only one account.
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Turelus
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve The Fourth District
84
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Posted - 2012.12.09 21:39:00 -
[74] - Quote
Tetsuko Yorimasa wrote:When you connect to the game occasionaly like me, that TD increase become a real problem, . I can't relax myself alone for a few minutes in a mission or in anomalies, the game became totally useless for me. CCP is pushing me outside the game, and I don't have only one account.
I have hardly been playing and PVE since the patch, I think I spent two days just sitting on the Jita undock shooting flashy people because Providence became so worthless. I'm normally playing and doing PVE when everyone else works or sleeps so I don't have much choice but to play alone.
It's being looked into all we can hope for is a fix this week, otherwise I am pretty sure any one living in Sansha/Angel space will be spending a lot less time playing. "Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves." |
Byron Squared
FCI Solvents
2
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Posted - 2012.12.10 03:09:00 -
[75] - Quote
There used to be four ways to deal with TD heavy senarios.
1) Use drones - the AI makes this MUCH harder since the elite cruisers take mediums to kill and they move too slow
2) Fight in Falloff - The change that is killing people is not the number or ewar ships or the change in the frequency of their TDs hitting. The change is that the TD now effect falloff which is where most of us used to fight Sansha whether we meant to or not. The long falloff on projectiles and tachyons with long range ammo were key. This doesn't work any more....
3) Missiles - but they require drones for the smaller ships which are much harder to manage now.....
4) Bring friends. That is really what is left. Was this intended to make level IVs/anomalies a 2-3 man fleet activity? Would have been nice to just say this up front....... |
BearonKeila
Fat boy hauler service SQUEE.
0
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Posted - 2012.12.10 06:14:00 -
[76] - Quote
Well, OP, you're not alone obviously. I haven't been able to finish an anomoly since patchday. I've tried fitting my abaddon numerous ways to help. furthermore, I sacrificed a perfectly good legion in an effort to make it happen.
Tl;dr it needs fixed bad. |
Rip Minner
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
72
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Posted - 2012.12.10 11:51:00 -
[77] - Quote
Well I found my self disrupted none stop.
So I stoped using 100% Gunnery ships. I know use Drone boats like Dominix/Rattlesnake. Or missile ships.
Works wonders. |
Gerard Hareka
State Protectorate Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.12.10 14:40:00 -
[78] - Quote
Yes keep holding players by hand instead of letting them adapt - for example as fitting long range guns and use new module that you introduced tha gets you 100k away , and i dont know outsmarting stupid ai instead of whining.
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dexington
Push button receive bacon
260
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Posted - 2012.12.10 14:54:00 -
[79] - Quote
Gerard Hareka wrote:Yes keep holding players by hand instead of letting them adapt - for example as fitting long range guns and use new module that you introduced tha gets you 100k away , and i dont know outsmarting stupid ai instead of whining.
I was thinking about trying the micro jump drive myself, but i'm not sure if they work with anything else then battleships. GÇ£The best way to keep something bad from happening is to see it ahead of time, and you can't see it if you refuse to face the possibility.GÇ¥ |
vice vortex
Kiith Paktu Curatores Veritatis Alliance
7
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Posted - 2012.12.10 18:31:00 -
[80] - Quote
still no new news on this i dont want to adapt i want to fly the ship ive been training for....I like how yalll say this **** until an update comes out which affects you |
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Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
2
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Posted - 2012.12.10 19:18:00 -
[81] - Quote
I live in Providence as well and I agree that it is now totally impossible to rat in a turret based ship. Even with perfect gunnery skills you just can't. You don't have the tracking to hit them up close and you don't the range to hit them far off, permanently. It's not that the TDs are any stronger than before, the NPCs just leave the on 100% of the time now. This is what the patch notes meant by "The effect is now correctly applied to your ship." You used to be able to wait 45-60 seconds for the TDs to turn off and then go to town with your guns. This is no longer the case. The Sansha TDs were always stupidly overpowered, but since they were bugged so that the NPCs forgot to turn them on about 80% of the time it worked out to be pretty balanced.
You know what I did? I got out of my laser BS and hopped into a (newly buffed) non-pimp-fit HAM legion. Problem solved. I imagine that a Tengu would work just as well.
It does about the same DPS as my non-pimp-fit T1 BS once you account for the fact that the HAMs are pure EM damage and not an EM/Therm split against the Sansha resist profile and even more tank once you account for being able to speed tank the BSs. Even webbed by NPC frigs it still tanks the BS's more than long enough to kill the frigs and start speed tanking. The small amount of time I spend chasing down the few BSs that like to orbit far out is made up for by the fact that I no longer have to wait for the TDs to "wear off" like I did in my turret ship. Is it as good as the old turret BS? No, it uses ammo and it just won't ever kill quite as fast as 8 BS sized guns. But you know what? It works.
However not everyone has the ISK and SP to just hop into a fully skilled and properly fitted T3 cruiser at the drop of a hat. So yeah this is certainty a big problem for most of the people who live out here. |
Snoodaard Thrasy
Yulai Guard Fleet Yards Yulai Federation
11
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Posted - 2012.12.10 22:46:00 -
[82] - Quote
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:This is what the patch notes meant by "The effect is now correctly applied to your ship." You used to be able to wait 45-60 seconds for the TDs to turn off and then go to town with your guns. This is no longer the case. The Sansha TDs were always stupidly overpowered, but since they were bugged so that the NPCs forgot to turn them on about 80% of the time it worked out to be pretty balanced.
Actually I understood that the "fix" applied to the fact that the tracking disruptors from rats would reduce optimal but not falloff. This has indeed been fixed with the Retribution patch. Now your gun optimal gets reduced as well as falloff. It seems to me what wasn't the intention was the permadisruption which makes turret based ratting (the weapon type of 3 out of 4 ships) impossible. |
Rip Minner
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
72
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Posted - 2012.12.10 23:21:00 -
[83] - Quote
Gerard Hareka wrote:Yes keep holding players by hand instead of letting them adapt - for example as fitting long range guns and use new module that you introduced tha gets you 100k away , and i dont know outsmarting stupid ai instead of whining. I dont realy know how long range guns is going to hellp you with TD? |
R0cky Marciano
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
11
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Posted - 2012.12.11 12:54:00 -
[84] - Quote
why only Sansha have so strong e-war, that against turret and apply dps generally.
for example, Angel's at all not have e-war against turret, target painter.... hahaha :/ |
Schmell
Russian Thunder Squad Against ALL Authorities
20
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Posted - 2012.12.11 13:13:00 -
[85] - Quote
Im really interested if other races ewar was changed in the same fashion. I mean the fact, that tracking disruption is constant even from battleships. Do the dampeners from serpentis and ecm from guristas work the same way now?
Angel painters seem to be still chance based from my expirience. |
Morrigan LeSante
The Lost and Forgotten Troopers
101
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Posted - 2012.12.11 13:41:00 -
[86] - Quote
Schmell wrote:Im really interested if other races ewar was changed in the same fashion. I mean the fact, that tracking disruption is constant even from battleships. Do the dampeners from serpentis and ecm from guristas work the same way now?
Angel painters seem to be still chance based from my expirience.
Confirming damps are madness.
Not ran into ECM users yet (they didnt use it in WC) |
Jessica Danikov
Ubuntu Inc. Varangon Tagma
11
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Posted - 2012.12.11 16:04:00 -
[87] - Quote
There are a few popular theories in my corp.
The best one is that the insta-locking and extra strong EWAR was introduced to counter-act the poor AI. Now that it's been fixed, the fudge is now breaking things- dumb NPC with big guns is manageable. Clever(er) AI with big guns is now a nightmare.
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Terazul
The Scope Gallente Federation
68
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Posted - 2012.12.11 20:34:00 -
[88] - Quote
Should just take out the E-War entirely.
It's hard enough to deal with scramming frigates that target your drones while tanking 2k+ DPS simultaneously. Don't need to be unable to target a damn thing in addition to that. |
Lugalzagezi666
77
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Posted - 2012.12.11 21:18:00 -
[89] - Quote
Terazul wrote:Should just take out the E-War entirely.
It's hard enough to deal with scramming frigates that target your drones while tanking 2k+ DPS simultaneously. Don't need to be unable to target a damn thing in addition to that.
Go do some minmatar missions, angel ewar is utter joke compared to tds, damps and ecm. Not to mention unlike these it actually isnt even broken so angel rats dont permaspam you with tps like seprpentis do with damps, guristas with ecm and sanshas with tds. |
Snoodaard Thrasy
Yulai Guard Fleet Yards Yulai Federation
11
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Posted - 2012.12.12 13:42:00 -
[90] - Quote
Patch notes: "Corrected the chance percentage that an enemy NPC will use tracking disruption on a player's ship."
So I assumed things would be back to "normal".
The only thing that has changed is that the tracking disrupting rats stop for 3-4 seconds and then start a new disruption cycle. So now you get disrupted by 90% of the rats permanently in stead of 100%.
Useless!
Turret based ratting is still impossible. |
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