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Ulysses Odysseus
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Posted - 2009.06.21 02:41:00 -
[1]
Which race has the best sniping ships? I've been fooling around with several playstyles and am really liking sniping so I wanted to train for ships that are built for that.
I'm thinking amarr maybe?
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El Smol
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Posted - 2009.06.21 02:44:00 -
[2]
I'd say Amarr->Galente->Minmatar->Caldari. Laz0rz r good.
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SuiJuris
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Posted - 2009.06.21 02:55:00 -
[3]
I'd Say Amarr > Caldari > Gallente > Minmatar --- It's like my mom always said... "I knew I should of drowned that one." |
Lt Angus
Caldari End Game. Dead End.
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Posted - 2009.06.21 03:07:00 -
[4]
Originally by: SuiJuris I'd Say Amarr > Caldari > Gallente > Minmatar
this please resize your signature to the maximum allowed file size of 24000 bytes. Navigator Shhhh, Im hunting Badgers |
Ulysses Odysseus
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Posted - 2009.06.21 03:08:00 -
[5]
Originally by: SuiJuris I'd Say Amarr > Caldari > Gallente > Minmatar
Damn, too bad I'm trained for minmatar right now. They didn't seem like they had good sniping ships. Time to crosstrain to amarr then. :(
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Gneeznow
Minmatar North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2009.06.21 03:13:00 -
[6]
Muninn is pretty good at murdering ceptors at >80km
(in before astrophopic comes along to whine about minmatar as is seemingly his life's work)
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FT Diomedes
Gallente Factio Paucorum
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Posted - 2009.06.21 03:32:00 -
[7]
Each of the races can field a decent sniper ship, but the Amarr are currently the kings of the sniping world. Personally, I've always used a Tempest and had good success, except when it came time to shoot a POS or station (then the tiny clip size sucks monkey balls). The Minmatar are currently getting the short end of the stick. Probably time for all the would-be FOTMers to start training for Minmatar (the nerf pendulum will have to swing back at some point).
...this doesn't even seem to be a regular case of rats fleeing the sinking ship. Seems more like the rats are on fire, the ship is on fire, and the sea is full of drunk Russians. - Jacob Etienne |
Ulysses Odysseus
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Posted - 2009.06.21 03:55:00 -
[8]
Originally by: FT Diomedes Each of the races can field a decent sniper ship, but the Amarr are currently the kings of the sniping world. Personally, I've always used a Tempest and had good success, except when it came time to shoot a POS or station (then the tiny clip size sucks monkey balls). The Minmatar are currently getting the short end of the stick. Probably time for all the would-be FOTMers to start training for Minmatar (the nerf pendulum will have to swing back at some point).
I'm wondering about this now since it does seem that things are constantly changing so who knows if Amarr will get nerfed heavily? Plus I'm further along with Minmatar anyway so perhaps I should just stick with them.
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2009.06.21 04:09:00 -
[9]
1) Caldari. Best fleet battleship, and the only race that really supports sniping below the battleship level.
2) Amarr. Second-best fleet battleship, Zealot is a decent sniper, but usually used with pulses.
3) Gallente. Battleships are outclassed by the Rokh in every way, no support at all below battleship level.
4) Minmatar. Laughably bad fleet battleships, and the smaller ships aren't much better. Only the Muninn is even remotely non-comedy, but it's still pretty poor. -----------
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SuiJuris
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Posted - 2009.06.21 17:30:00 -
[10]
Any range you can get lasers to shoot out to they will outdamage Railguns, the 7 Tach apoc outdamages the 8 Railgun Rokh at 200+ km So the Apoc is the king of sniping battleships. The Zealot is head and shoulders above the other HAC's for a sniping HAC. I think the Harpy makes a better frigate sniper then the retribution though so you got me there. --- It's like my mom always said... "I knew I should of drowned that one." |
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achoura
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Posted - 2009.06.21 17:50:00 -
[11]
He asked for race not an individual ship discussion and remember that in fleet individual dps means squat and caldari are the sniper race, the only race in fact to support sniping in all ship classes.
Just for the record, the rokh can drastically both out range and out damage and out tank an apoc and actually cost less. It all comes down to how you fit which is amarrs weak point, their ships are very inflexible leaving the apoc with very little manoeuvring room while rokhs can be used in a range of different sniper fits. |
Gram Hellfire
International House of PWNCakes Aggression.
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Posted - 2009.06.21 18:06:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Gram Hellfire on 21/06/2009 18:07:51 versatility? all you need is 1: lock and hit past 150 km (with T2 guns) 2: tank a DDD 3: fit a MWD
the Apoc does this very well
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Transmaniacon
Minmatar HOMELESS. Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2009.06.21 18:09:00 -
[13]
Alright, bring a shield tanking sniper to an armor tanking world and tell me how things pan out. Everyone who mentions 200+km shooting, is not familiar with fleet combat. Most engagements take place between 150 and 180 km.
Amarr are by far the best sniper race, unlike Caldari, they can easily reach that range and still maintain great DPS. The Tach Apoc is a very effective sniping ship for amarr.
Gallente are another great race because their primary sniper, the mega, has a tracking bonus which when using T2 long range ammo is a blessing.
Look at fleet engagements, you will see these ships primarily; Megathron, Apocalypse, Tempest. In a strictly sniper gang, there will be a bit more Caldari, but many long range fleets utilize remote rep, ie. you need an armor tank.
I would suggest to train for Amarr or Gallente for a sniper race.
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.06.21 18:16:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Transmaniacon Alright, bring a shield tanking sniper to an armor tanking world and tell me how things pan out. Everyone who mentions 200+km shooting, is not familiar with fleet combat. Most engagements take place between 150 and 180 km.
Because sniper fleets always have loads of rr support?
A sniper usually dies or it doesnt, not much in between. And more range is always better because, for example, it allows you to move away while aligned and still hit for full damage.
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UMEE
Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.06.21 18:42:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
1) Caldari... the only race that really supports sniping below the battleship level.
what are you talking about man...zealot and the ishtar being a very close second are the best t2 snipe cruisers at 100km range. i guess if you`re further away in large fleets then yes, the eagle is ideal.
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Neuronai
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Posted - 2009.06.21 18:57:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
3) Gallente. Battleships are outclassed by the Rokh in every way, no support at all below battleship level.
no
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Duke Starbuckington
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Posted - 2009.06.21 19:01:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Neuronai
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
3) Gallente. Battleships are outclassed by the Rokh in every way, no support at all below battleship level.
no
CONTRUCTIVE POSTAN!
How about you actually discuss why, instead of just mindlessly disagreeing with someone.
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Morikai Acler
Caldari Demon Theory Wildly Inappropriate.
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Posted - 2009.06.21 19:12:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Transmaniacon Alright, bring a shield tanking sniper to an armor tanking world and tell me how things pan out. Everyone who mentions 200+km shooting, is not familiar with fleet combat. Most engagements take place between 150 and 180 km.
Amarr are by far the best sniper race, unlike Caldari, they can easily reach that range and still maintain great DPS. The Tach Apoc is a very effective sniping ship for amarr.
Gallente are another great race because their primary sniper, the mega, has a tracking bonus which when using T2 long range ammo is a blessing.
Look at fleet engagements, you will see these ships primarily; Megathron, Apocalypse, Tempest. In a strictly sniper gang, there will be a bit more Caldari, but many long range fleets utilize remote rep, ie. you need an armor tank.
I would suggest to train for Amarr or Gallente for a sniper race.
*looks at my fleet fit rokh* Hmmm my rokh does around 400dps at 200km or more with only 2 dmg mods, apoc is sitting just barely above 300, while still having any relevant buffer tank to make it worth while with t2 tachs. Rokh doesn't even really need scripts in its sensor boosters to target up to around 200km.
Do you actually fly the ships and have proper skills before you talk them down? The rokh is the best fleet ship in game, and I've been in a lot of fleets and can tell you, outside of short range RR, Rokh are usually close to 1/4 or 1/3 of a fleet. |
Neuronai
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Posted - 2009.06.21 19:23:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Neuronai on 21/06/2009 19:24:51
Originally by: Duke Starbuckington
Originally by: Neuronai
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
3) Gallente. Battleships are outclassed by the Rokh in every way, no support at all below battleship level.
no
CONTRUCTIVE POSTAN!
How about you actually discuss why, instead of just mindlessly disagreeing with someone.
It wasn't mindless disagreement, I just didn't think it would be necessary to back up why I said no considering what he said - that Gallente battleships are outclassed by the Rokh in every way.
But okay, if you insist:
[Megathron, Sniping Megathron] Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Tracking Computer II F-90 Positional Sensor Subroutines, Targeting Range F-90 Positional Sensor Subroutines, Targeting Range 100MN MicroWarpdrive II
425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L [empty high slot]
[empty rig slot] [empty rig slot] [empty rig slot]
DPS: 350 Optimal: 192km
[Rokh, Sniping Rokh] Reactor Control Unit II Tracking Enhancer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Sensor Booster II Sensor Booster II Sensor Booster II Tracking Computer II Tracking Computer II Tracking Computer II
425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L 425mm Railgun II, Spike L
[empty rig slot] [empty rig slot] [empty rig slot]
DPS: 321 Optimal: 254km
As you can see, although this Rokh fit gets more optimal, the Megathron fit gets more DPS. Therefore, with consideration to these fits, the Rokh does not outclass a Gallente battleship in every way.
In fact, if you wanted to do damage at a closer sniping range, say, 100km, the Megathron would out DPS the Rokh even more so.
Oh, and as for "no support at all below battleship level", you can set up a Thorax with rails, or a Vexor with drone links.
As for the best sniping race, i'd call Amarr for sure.
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Duke Starbuckington
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Posted - 2009.06.21 19:23:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Transmaniacon Alright, bring a shield tanking sniper to an armor tanking world and tell me how things pan out. Everyone who mentions 200+km shooting, is not familiar with fleet combat. Most engagements take place between 150 and 180 km.
Amarr are by far the best sniper race, unlike Caldari, they can easily reach that range and still maintain great DPS. The Tach Apoc is a very effective sniping ship for amarr.
Gallente are another great race because their primary sniper, the mega, has a tracking bonus which when using T2 long range ammo is a blessing.
Look at fleet engagements, you will see these ships primarily; Megathron, Apocalypse, Tempest. In a strictly sniper gang, there will be a bit more Caldari, but many long range fleets utilize remote rep, ie. you need an armor tank.
I would suggest to train for Amarr or Gallente for a sniper race.
Greater range also means its harder for targets to move out of range. Greater range doesn't just mean, "LOL IM 200km AWAY AND SAFE AND SOUND!" Also the sniper rokh still has enough buffer to survive a DD, while the other sniper BS's have tanks made of paper.
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Neuronai
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Posted - 2009.06.21 19:32:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Duke Starbuckington
Also the sniper rokh still has enough buffer to survive a DD, while the other sniper BS's have tanks made of paper.
And the other sniper BS's will do more damage...Whether the fight will favour a tanked sniper or a DPS sniper is obviously circumstancial.
Also, "the other sniper BS's" don't have to be set up like paper. You can sacrifice tracking enhancers/mag stabs on a Mega just like a Rokh pilot has to sacrifice tracking computers/sensor boosters. |
FT Diomedes
Gallente Factio Paucorum
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Posted - 2009.06.21 20:10:00 -
[22]
I haven't seen very many of the setups posted here on killboards, which tells me there is more theory-crafting going on than relating actual experience (with a couple of exceptions). |
Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.21 20:25:00 -
[23]
Neuronai, a rokh can pretty much do everything a mega does but better. Only if you are sniping at 100km distance (against hacs for example), the mega will have better tracking due to its bonus.
And w00t the mega gets a 35% bonus to tracking which is usefull when sniping at 150km. Meanwhile a rokh can use faction ammo, so compared to spike gets effectively a 300% bonus to tracking.
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WELLTIMEDECMJAM
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Posted - 2009.06.21 21:35:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Neuronai As you can see, although this Rokh fit gets more optimal, the Megathron fit gets more DPS. Therefore, with consideration to these fits, the Rokh does not outclass a Gallente battleship in every way.
In fact, if you wanted to do damage at a closer sniping range, say, 100km, the Megathron would out DPS the Rokh even more so.
The problem with your Megathron fit being that the first time a stiff wind gets near you it'll pop.
Compare which ship can do more DPS @ sniper-acceptable ranges while being able to survive a DD. HINT: Rokh is better. |
Neuronai
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Posted - 2009.06.21 21:40:00 -
[25]
I'm not trying to discuss which ship is better, I was just refuting what that guy said about the Rokh outclassing Gallente BS at sniping in every way. You can go on about DDs and optimal ranges, but my point is that the Mega does have its own advantages, e.g., DPS and tracking. |
Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.21 21:45:00 -
[26]
And the point is, it only has tracking advantage when it doesnt need to use spike, and it only has dps advantage when it can use antimatter (which isnt sniping). |
Neuronai
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Posted - 2009.06.21 21:48:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Furb Killer Neuronai, a rokh can pretty much do everything a mega does but better.
Gank? Nah. Mega does 300+ more DPS than a Rokh with the same damage mods.
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achoura
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Posted - 2009.06.21 21:56:00 -
[28]
The noob error most people make with rokhs is a lack of ti ammo, ppl who rush to spike loose not only tracking but damage. If you fit a paper rokh like that mega there it can spit antimatter at 150km. The eve community has evolved around the concept of "the best" i.e. something must be better than everything else therefore something must be fotm, currently amarr. Problems is amarr are very much mid ranged, in all ship classes caldari have the superior long range ships.
Amarr frigs cant snipe at 80km, amarr ti cruisers cant snipe at 120km, amarr tii cruisers cant snipe at 180-230km nor can their command ships and their bs max at about 190km when fitted comparatively* to a 425 rokh which is hitting at 250km. Calradi were created as the sniping race and they still are which is why they make up the bulk of fleets. Even mega pilots can get a rokh and snipe effectively with t1 guns with equal/greater damage and tank than an apoc with all skills at lvl 5. Thing is, any reasonably competent pilot already understands this which is why they're out in 0.0 rather than shepherding noobs on the forums
Something most people like to, conveniently, forget is that mega beams are the amarr equivalent to the 425 rail gun. Tachs are above the 425s and 1400s, they have no equal which is why their fitting is so horrid. Furthermost a rokh does not need to sacrifice a gun slot to fit them and deal with the horrid tracking of aurora. ***The EVE servers and their patches*** |
Red Spring
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Posted - 2009.06.21 22:04:00 -
[29]
the error (mostly Caldari) is to say Amarr/Caldari then Gallente/minimater
this kind of vote only reflects on the Eve population distribution - the vast majority of players are Caldari. So votes are not unbiased.
Minimater and Gallente require intensive hands on management, the need players to use their brain, to do some maths, to use their speed to dictate range, Caldari ships for example are click and snooze technology. If Mater ships are properly set up they equal Amarr lazers.
(I'm a raven flying ratter )
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.06.21 22:05:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Neuronai
Originally by: Furb Killer Neuronai, a rokh can pretty much do everything a mega does but better.
Gank? Nah. Mega does 300+ more DPS than a Rokh with the same damage mods.
proof or stfu?
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