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Dr Clay
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:11:00 -
[1]
Just wondering if tech II trumps all the faction ships.
The Ishtar seems better than the navy vexor etc...
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Wet Ferret
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:12:00 -
[2]
Well the T2 got the resists and that's hard to beat.
But, yeah. These forums seriously need some indicator that the post has ended and the sig has started. |
TimMc
Gallente The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:12:00 -
[3]
Nope, faction ships are just for epeen or for people who don't have the cruiser 5 skill.
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Roemy Schneider
BINFORD
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:20:00 -
[4]
navy omen with its drones fleet stabber with tracking bonus (if you should ever decide to profit from an unextended signature and get real close)
not saying these ships are better "all the way" but if you can make full use of these lil' extras, they can be - putting the gist back into logistics |
Tsaya
Azn Empire
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:22:00 -
[5]
Stabber Fleet Issue is better than Vagabond
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Lux Exterior
The Scope
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:27:00 -
[6]
Nightmare > All T2 BS
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"
Friedrich Nietzsche |
The Djego
Minmatar merovinger inc
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:31:00 -
[7]
Sansha Ships, Navy Omen(newest) and Fleet Stabber(adjusted) have some points that make them not worse than her T2 Counterparts, but a bit diffrent. This all happend in ther big Faction Ship overhaul in Emperian Age(that wasnŠt this big in the end and made the Navy Apoc even worse than the normal one for multiple months).
Navy Vexor is able to serious Outgank a Ishtar at close Range, but the higher flexibility and surviability of the Ishtar is still better most of the times. ---- Nerf Tank - Boost Gank!
Originally by: Amantus Real men don't need to get into blaster range.
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Warrio
Southern Cross Incorporated Dara Cothrom
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:36:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Lux Exterior Nightmare > All T2 BS
^^
Add the Bhaalgorn for PvP since, neither the Marauders nor the Bops are up to the task. sXe |
Ig Neus
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:42:00 -
[9]
Generally yes. There are a few exceptions however, first to come in mind is Phantasm.
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fkingfurious
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:44:00 -
[10]
For FW faction ships are awesome as they fit into the plex's that only allow tech 1 ships. In that scenario your faction ship (should) be head and shoulders above the tech 1 competition.
Other than that (with the possible exception of the Phantasm) the cruiser and below faction ships are a bit meh.
The BS on the other hand have quite a lot of potential. Cost a lot though.
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Muad' Dib
Gallente Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2009.03.17 11:47:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Roemy Schneider navy omen with its drones fleet stabber with tracking bonus (if you should ever decide to profit from an unextended signature and get real close)
not saying these ships are better "all the way" but if you can make full use of these lil' extras, they can be
Navy Vexor, Fleet Stabber, Navy Omen are alternatives to their t2 counterparts. They have abilities that are not so great in the t2 version. --- I smack just for myself.
* Your signature file is to large. Please note: we do not allow signature files larger than 24000 bytes - Fallout |
Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2009.03.17 18:09:00 -
[12]
Some are, some are not:
Better than T2:
Phantasm: Zealot DPS, Drake HP buffer, 2x neuts + drones to remove frigates = win. Best HAC in the game, IMO. Navy Omen: it's a Zealot with a drone bay instead of the range bonus. Navy Caracal: + drones, - missile damage, net result is essentially the same. BUT: huge speed/agility increase over the Cerberus. Fleet Stabber: a bit more of a gray area, but 50% tracking is huge, and some people like to fly it as a faster, tougher Rupture with ewar mids instead of a T1 Vagabond.
Nightmare: absurd tank, awesome dps, 2x heavy neuts, and it's OMG VERTICAL. Machariel: it's faster than some HACs. Enough said. Navy Raven: sadly the Golem lacks dps over the Raven. The CNR does not.
As for the rest... some are decent, but not really anything special (Vigilant, Navy Apocalypse, etc), some are just terrible (all of the frigates, Ashimmu, etc). -----------
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fuxinos
Caldari Guys 0f Sarcasm
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Posted - 2009.03.17 19:36:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Lux Exterior Paladin > Nightmare > Golem/Vargur/Kronos
Fixed.
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Xavier Sunder
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Posted - 2009.03.17 22:15:00 -
[14]
Take a look at the Rattlesnake.
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Lindsay Logan
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Posted - 2009.03.17 22:17:00 -
[15]
Originally by: fuxinos
Originally by: Lux Exterior Paladin > Nightmare > Golem/Vargur/Kronos
Fixed.
I disagree. Shields over armor.
NM > Paladin.
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Caldari Citizen4714
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Posted - 2009.03.17 22:21:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Tsaya Stabber Fleet Issue is better than Vagabond
Only if you can ignore the falloff & EHP superiority the vagabond has.
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.03.17 23:51:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin Some are, some are not:
Better than T2: Navy Caracal: + drones, - missile damage, net result is essentially the same. BUT: huge speed/agility increase over the Cerberus.
Navy caracal gets the damage bonus but not the RoF, and instead gets 6 launchers. 6 assault launchers makes it quite a bit better than the Cerberus as a frigate slaughtering machine.
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2009.03.18 00:00:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 18/03/2009 00:00:22
Originally by: James Lyrus Navy caracal gets the damage bonus but not the RoF, and instead gets 6 launchers. 6 assault launchers makes it quite a bit better than the Cerberus as a frigate slaughtering machine.
Err, isn't that what I just said? A bit less missile damage, +3 drones, net result is essentially the same. 222 launcher damage, 270 with drones included for the Navy Caracal, 246 for the Cerberus. Cerberus tanks more and has better range, Navy Caracal has a third rig slot for missile precision rigs and more speed. I guess the Navy Caracal can do the job alright, but I don't see it being all that much better. -----------
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Joshua Foiritain
Gallente Coreli Corporation
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Posted - 2009.03.18 00:04:00 -
[19]
Originally by: fuxinos
Originally by: Lux Exterior Vargur > Paladin > Nightmare > Golem//Kronos
Fixed.
Fixed
Though only because minmatar are awesome, not so much because its good ---------------------------
[Coreli Corporation] |
Ephemeron
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2009.03.18 00:19:00 -
[20]
Vargur is pretty bad, tho I came to expect total blindness to small issues from the CCP
They only fix things that need nerf bat and nerf sledgehammer
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Cambarus
The Baros Syndicate
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Posted - 2009.03.18 00:57:00 -
[21]
Navy vexor: easily gets 8, maybe even 900 dps. Try doing that in an ishtar
Navy auguror: One of the best bait ships in the game. People can't help but go for a faction ship kill, and with over 130k EHP when plated (tech II mods, tech I rigs) odds are you'll last long enough for support to show up.
Navy Stabber: Roughly the same DPS and speed as a vaga, but with no falloff bonus and a sick tracking bonus.
Navy Omen: Zealot with drones instead of a range bonus, not better per se, but definitely on par.
Phantasm: Awesome buffer, can fit neuts, and has zealot dps. Just awesome. |
Dallenovic
Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.03.18 04:13:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Cambarus Navy Omen: Zealot with drones instead of a range bonus, not better per se, but definitely on par.
Never seen the new stabs haha so glad i stumbled across this post, the omen navy issue has the same gun dps as the zealot, less range but it has more efective hitpoints than a zealot if they both fit 2x EAN II, and has a lower signature radius with mwd on by 12% so u get hit less, speed drops by a bit though not majorly
[Omen Navy Issue, Zealot Down !] Overdrive Injector System II Overdrive Injector System II Medium Armor Repairer II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
10MN MicroWarpdrive II Warp Disruptor II Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 800
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Dark Blood Small Energy Neutralizer
Energy Metastasis Adjuster I Energy Locus Coordinator I Auxiliary Thrusters I
Hobgoblin II x5
All it lacks on is range, even thought resists are down ehp is up due to lots more hitpoints. Same as my Zealot fitting + the tracking rig, and one nanofiber changed to overdrive
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EvilSpork
Invicta.
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Posted - 2009.03.18 05:18:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Phantasm: Zealot DPS, Drake HP buffer, 2x neuts + drones to remove frigates = win. Best HAC in the game, IMO.
how do you cram such a huge buffer on there and stiff have it function?
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Dallenovic
Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.03.18 05:38:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Dallenovic on 18/03/2009 05:41:22 Posibly something like this.. requires 5% powergrid..
[Phantasm, RAWR!] Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Damage Control II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Disruptor II Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 400 Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Invulnerability Field II
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Amarr Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Amarr Navy Multifrequency M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Amarr Navy Multifrequency M Small Energy Neutralizer II Small Energy Neutralizer II
Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Core Defence Field Extender I Core Defence Field Extender I
Warrior II x3
EDIT: 500 dps on my char with cheap implants of 5% med energy turret and 3% all turret dmg with 47k EHP, 14k shields EM55% Ex69% Kin63% Th51%
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xxxak
Caldari O.W.N. Corp OWN Alliance
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Posted - 2009.03.18 05:39:00 -
[25]
Well, this thread just made me by a Caracal Navy for ratting tests and a Phantasm for fun tests.. lol
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Dreadpilot Roberts
Friends of Honor Minor Threat.
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Posted - 2009.03.18 05:46:00 -
[26]
This thread is so full of fail First of all, it doesnt say what they need to be better at. Second of all so many people talking out of their ***es.
No faction ships are not better than t2 for pvp, "some" very few, mostly the pirate faction ones are "on par" in some respects, much weaker in others, and better in some, so you could say they're as good as them or even better if you want to fly them for the specific role that the ship gives bonuses for (like tracking vs range to kill frigs, though this is debate-able).
Mostly faction t1 ships are just for people that dont have the skills to fly a t2 ship. T2 usually get better fitting capability to fit tech2 mods. More grid/cpu makes a big difference. Usually t1 cruisers are fail for pvp, some are better than t2 in other roles, oh and no resists and ship-name means many FCs will call you primary. The faction t1 cruisers that got introduced with QR are better than the ones that were ingame before, and you could say are even on par with t2, just depends what you wanna fly, but lack of resists and grid/cpu is still a crappy drawback. For BS'es imho Marauders rule pve, t1 non-faction BS'es rule pvp, sure .. if u're filthy rich you could say faction BS are better than marauders for pvp due to sensor strength, but again ... it all depends on what your gang needs to do and what you wanna do in your gang.
So imho rule of thumb is t2>t1, with a few exceptions that might be called on par.
Just my 2 cents. Train your skills fly t2 fit t2 if you wanna pvp. Pve is another story i guess, but then again, dunno dont care I'm sorry, did I say u could speak ? |
Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2009.03.18 05:48:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 18/03/2009 05:53:36 Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 18/03/2009 05:48:48
Originally by: EvilSpork
Originally by: Merin Ryskin
Phantasm: Zealot DPS, Drake HP buffer, 2x neuts + drones to remove frigates = win. Best HAC in the game, IMO.
how do you cram such a huge buffer on there and stiff have it function?
Dallenovic almost guessed it. 43k EHP with gang bonuses (I <3 siege mindlink) and 5% shield HP implant, 430 gun dps @ 24km.
[Phantasm, Zealot Sansha Issue] Heat Sink II Heat Sink II Heat Sink II
10MN MicroWarpdrive II Large Shield Extender II True Sansha Medium Capacitor Booster, Cap Booster 800 Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Republic Fleet Warp Disruptor
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Small Energy Neutralizer II Small Energy Neutralizer II
Core Defence Field Extender I Core Defence Field Extender I Core Defence Field Extender I
Warrior II x3
Originally by: Dreadpilot Roberts Mostly faction t1 ships are just for people that dont have the skills to fly a t2 ship.
Actually, this is not true at all. By the time you have the skills to use a faction ship effectively and not just produce an expensive lossmail, you've got the skills for T2. You fly the faction ship because it does something the T2 ship can't.
Quote: Usually t1 cruisers are fail for pvp, some are better than t2 in other roles, oh and no resists and ship-name means many FCs will call you primary.
Less resists, but more base HP. Net result is faction cruisers tend to have better EHP than T2. -----------
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Dallenovic
Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.03.18 05:49:00 -
[28]
Isnt the Kronos the ultimate 1v1 ship with its extra large cargo for cap boosters and ammo. To be honest ive been saving up for a nightmare for some time and cant wait to use it, active officer shield tanking, t2 shield rigs and crystal implants.. unbelivable. I think NM >> ALL tbh just cos its sexeh
But i am loving the new faction ships, i never knew they were that good until now, some are better than the hacs in their own way to be honest, am looking forward to flying fleet stabber, vexor navy and omen navy... cos over time especially in nano i was whoring zealot ishtar and vaga
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Dallenovic
Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.03.18 06:02:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Dallenovic on 18/03/2009 06:02:45 Merin Ryskin thanks for the fitting i knew there was something i could do to fit 3x heat sink and 3x extender rigs but I couldnt see it. Yeah its all bout the EHP on the faction crusiers, resists arent much when u have 30% (or w/e) more hitpoints lol
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Carniflex
Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project
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Posted - 2009.03.18 06:13:00 -
[30]
Depends what you use it for.
There is faction ships out there that do some roles better than their T2 counterparts. And ofc the other way around also. For example CNR has 16% more dps than Golem on paper - in reality it ofc depends how you are actually using it, but there is situations where your CNR will still outperform Golem.
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