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Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.23 11:10:00 -
[1]
I don't like to moan but I'm sorry, this ship makes no sense!
Same slot layout as a thanatos except...
Less Powergrid. Less CPU. Less Cap. Less Armour. Less Hull. Less Drone bay. Less Cargo Hold. Less Lock Range. Less Resists. Less Senor Strength. Less DPS. Slower Lock time. Slow Cap Recharge.
More Top Speed. (**** that ****) More Shield. (**** that **** too)
The only real difference is that the Nidhoggurs bonus requires, CAP, Powergrid and CPU to be able to use it, while the thanatos' bonus requires none of these, yet it still has more!!
Stop trying to please the mases with your bull**** roleplay and and fix the one ship that is TRULY unbalanced. OK?
- Nova
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Methicone
Amarr Ever Flow
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Posted - 2008.12.23 11:13:00 -
[2]
/signed
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Warrio
Southern Cross Incorporated
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Posted - 2008.12.23 11:14:00 -
[3]
Is fitting really a problem on your carrier?
Aside from that, the Minmatar have their lot, it may not be outstanding but it does the job. Don't like it, don't fly it. Also, GBTWoW as they say. sXe |
Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.23 11:17:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Nova Satar on 23/12/2008 11:20:23
Originally by: Warrio
Minmattar have their lot.
What would that be? Since QR their t2 is the same as everyone else just without a tank.
Maybe you mean the minmattar battleships.. lol
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keepiru
Supernova Security Systems
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Posted - 2008.12.23 11:19:00 -
[5]
Minnie capitals are a kind of ongoing gag by CCP. ... and I really think they should boost T2 plate HP.
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Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.23 11:21:00 -
[6]
Originally by: keepiru Minnie capitals are a kind of ongoing gag by CCP.
yeah
It's getting old. It's almsot as funny as that joke they call CSM.
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Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.12.23 11:45:00 -
[7]
1) I agree 2) I think you should train another race 3) I fly the Nid on one of my characters for RP reasons. . . 4) Just make the Thanatos and Niddhogger bonus' 10% instead of 5% - that would actually make the logistical advantage a serious consideration in choising the ship over. . .say. . .an Archon or a Chimera. 5) Give us the old slot layout please. . .it would make a perfectly fine shield tanker. . . 6) The Niddy is bad. . .the Nag is worse. . .
/cry ----
ECCM is a Counter-measure not a defense. |
Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.23 12:31:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
4) Just make the Thanatos and Niddhogger bonus' 10% instead of 5% - that would actually make the logistical advantage a serious consideration in choising the ship over. . .say. . .an Archon or a Chimera.
/cry
w0rd
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Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.12.23 12:36:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Nova Satar
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
4) Just make the Thanatos and Niddhogger bonus' 10% instead of 5% - that would actually make the logistical advantage a serious consideration in choising the ship over. . .say. . .an Archon or a Chimera.
/cry
w0rd
what. . .too much? ----
ECCM is a Counter-measure not a defense. |
Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.23 13:17:00 -
[10]
nah i agree with you felix.
It's not the fact the nid is the worse carrier that i have a problem with, it's the fact it has exactly the same slot layout as the thanatos but everything at a lower level, it was intentionally made to be worse....
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Eaiaden
Minmatar Baptism oF Fire B.L.A.C.K.
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Posted - 2008.12.23 16:59:00 -
[11]
/signed
5 months ago i started training for carriers, i figured "its so bad, by the time i have it, im sure CCP have fixed it" man was i wrong...
Now i started to train for dreads, in 22 days will i have a fully fitted Naglafar, so basically, i just spent 6 months of training for the 2 "joke" ships in the game, im still hoping for the day CCP "fix" minmatar capitals".
I mean, it dosent have to be the BEST ones, but gees, several options to work with here.
More armor HP More cap Faster cap regen
Just 1 of theese 3 options will make it a viable carrier.
I dont care about the lesser CPU / PG, my fitting are
High 1 X True sansha EMP smartbomb 1 X domination explosion smartbomb 1 X true sansha neut 2 X remote armor reps
Mid: 1 x Shadow serpensis sensorbooster 1 X ECCM - Ladar II 3 X Cap recharger II
Low: 2 X Armor reps 1 X True sansha EANM 1 X Expl hardner II 1 X Kinetic hardner II 1 X Thermic hardner II
3 x CCC rigs
-----------
And i have never had any problems with fittings, so theese points are of no consequence really.
BUT, the sheer lack of cap / regen, while having the intended role as a great logistic ship is beyond me, and a low amount of armor HP, well.... it can survive without it, ONE of the carriers have to be the one with weakest local tank, so i guess its ok, but give us some cap to work with CCP!!!
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BiggestT
Caldari Resurrection Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2008.12.23 17:13:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Eaiaden /signed
5 months ago i started training for carriers, i figured "its so bad, by the time i have it, im sure CCP have fixed it" man was i wrong...
Now i started to train for dreads, in 22 days will i have a fully fitted Naglafar, so basically, i just spent 6 months of training for the 2 "joke" ships in the game, im still hoping for the day CCP "fix" minmatar capitals".
I mean, it dosent have to be the BEST ones, but gees, several options to work with here.
More armor HP More cap Faster cap regen
Just 1 of theese 3 options will make it a viable carrier.
I dont care about the lesser CPU / PG, my fitting are
High 1 X True sansha EMP smartbomb 1 X domination explosion smartbomb 1 X true sansha neut 2 X remote armor reps
Mid: 1 x Shadow serpensis sensorbooster 1 X ECCM - Ladar II 3 X Cap recharger II
Low: 2 X Armor reps 1 X True sansha EANM 1 X Expl hardner II 1 X Kinetic hardner II 1 X Thermic hardner II
3 x CCC rigs
-----------
And i have never had any problems with fittings, so theese points are of no consequence really.
BUT, the sheer lack of cap / regen, while having the intended role as a great logistic ship is beyond me, and a low amount of armor HP, well.... it can survive without it, ONE of the carriers have to be the one with weakest local tank, so i guess its ok, but give us some cap to work with CCP!!!
But your gunzzz! Zey are CAPLESS!!11!
Oh wait..carrier..no guns..hmm
Capital F
(hehe get it, I said capital to imply "to a great degree" when the threads about capital ships, hehe im so smartzor) EVE history
t2 precisions |
Jared D'Uroth
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Posted - 2008.12.23 17:26:00 -
[13]
I T ' S
F R E A K I N G
V E R . .
Oh.
Nevermind, /signed.
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.12.23 17:48:00 -
[14]
They should reverse the slot layout change, give it 150 more CPU and make the rr bonus 7.5%/lvl, that'll fix it juuust fine.
Wyvern & Chimera fitting flowchart |
arbiter reformed
Minmatar Systematic Chaos.
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Posted - 2008.12.23 18:49:00 -
[15]
yeh but it looks cool, better than no carrier?
lolship but im still training for it
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Superfailsauce
Neo Spartans
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Posted - 2008.12.23 19:00:00 -
[16]
I'm training for the Nid on the basis that: Everything I train for gets nerfed soon after I have it. The Nid is shocking anyway (but still no worse than the other carriers), so is due a boost. I could have gone for thanny or Chimera, but Nid looks best, and is the better one for supporting small gangs. ------- Larkonis' Alt, main got banned. |
Drake Draconis
Minmatar Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2008.12.23 19:07:00 -
[17]
I concur...minmatar due for boost...all else likely to get nerfed...
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Dark Soldat
Caldari Dirty Deeds Corp.
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Posted - 2008.12.23 20:56:00 -
[18]
THE DUCT TAPE !!!!!! THEY HAVE NON !!!!
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Cyrus Brown
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Posted - 2008.12.23 22:11:00 -
[19]
Boost the Nid!
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Hamatitio
Caldari Veto. Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.12.23 22:30:00 -
[20]
Well the nid looks awesome and i have thought about getting it purely for the aesthetic views. I mean, if i'm gonna be spinning a ship in the station i'd rather have it look nice.
It does have less cap but at the same time a quicker recharge rate which actually makes it have the exact same base cap/sec charge as a thanatos. I'm not sure how cap charger 2's play into this if they stack differently because of proportions or whatnot but i'm too lazy to check.
That being said, it is generally thought of as the worst carrier, having the worst tank etc. That in and of itself warrants it primary in a fleet of carriers, which is why I won't be buying one.
They are the cheapest tho! haha.
Hijack this |
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Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.12.24 03:53:00 -
[21]
if you are going to fit 2x RR armor reps - then fly an archon. . .srsly. Fit one RR shield and RR armor rep.
3x AN EANM 1x DCU 2x Cap. armor rep
is the best lowslot config unless you give up tank for cap.
the problem with the Nid is easily solved, the Nag is a totally messed up. ----
ECCM is a Counter-measure not a defense. |
Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.12.24 03:59:00 -
[22]
if you are going to fit 2x RR armor reps - then fly an archon. . .srsly. Fit one RR shield and RR armor rep.
3x AN EANM 1x DCU 2x Cap. armor rep
is the best lowslot config unless you give up tank for cap.
the problem with the Nid is easily solved, the Nag is a totally messed up and there is no easy fix. ----
ECCM is a Counter-measure not a defense. |
EFT Warrior
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Posted - 2008.12.24 04:05:00 -
[23]
Why waste a perfectly good bonus, fit 2 RRs and a shield transporter like any sensible person.
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Ahz
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Posted - 2008.12.24 04:07:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Nova Satar fix the one ship that is TRULY unbalanced...
I always liked the idea of giving drone tracking bonuses to the Nid. 7.5% per level would give the ship a really interesting role.
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.12.24 10:35:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
3x AN EANM 1x DCU 2x Cap. armor rep
is the best lowslot config unless you give up tank for cap.
And your own tank isn't worth much, so screw one rep and one eanm for 2x cpr and fit three rr mods :)
Wyvern & Chimera fitting flowchart |
techzer0
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2008.12.24 10:40:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Nova Satar
Originally by: Warrio
Minmattar have their lot.
What would that be? Since QR their t2 is the same as everyone else just without a tank.
Agreed. I do love my vaga and huginn to death still ------------
Originally by: Nexus Kinnon I could outgay you even without my pink tutu. >.>
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Shadow Raven
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Posted - 2008.12.24 11:28:00 -
[27]
theres alot of ships unbalanced in this game when you look closely at it. I myself am a thanatos pilot however i have flow the minmatar carrier and can see you point. But at the same time i do like seeing them close to me when engaged in cap fights purely because they keep me and most others alive long enough to make a differance. However that is if they are not called primary themselfs ofcourse.
Give CCP time to straighten other issues they may have in-game then they might just get around to giving you your christmas wish :)
I will however sign off on this.
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Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.24 11:41:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Shadow Raven
Give CCP time to straighten other issues they may have in-game then they might just get around to giving you your christmas wish :)
this is the only issue!
maybe give it an extra mid and call it a shield tanker.......
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Shadow Raven
BlackWater Mercenaries The Firm.
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Posted - 2008.12.24 11:44:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Shadow Raven on 24/12/2008 11:44:30
Originally by: Nova Satar
Originally by: Shadow Raven
Give CCP time to straighten other issues they may have in-game then they might just get around to giving you your christmas wish :)
this is the only issue!
maybe give it an extra mid and call it a shield tanker.......
Well it would be a simple fix for the problem and seem as the shields are higher than that of the thanatos, not a bad idea in general. However i think the carrier as a hole needs a full revamp to put it inline with the others
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Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.24 13:28:00 -
[30]
it would also balance out the capital remote repping situation..
the CHimera is an amazing carrier, but not so popular becuase its a shield tanker and everyone else has remote armour reps fitted
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Awesome Marie
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Posted - 2008.12.24 13:31:00 -
[31]
/signed
And I like to tell ppl to adapt or die. But man do I want the hoggur to be as good as it looks!
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RedSplat
Suddenly Ninjas
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Posted - 2008.12.24 13:43:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Awesome Marie /signed
And I like to tell ppl to adapt or die. But man do I want the hoggur to be as good as it looks!
Oh please no There was even talk of French toast
But there was none to be had |
Neyro7830
Gallente Stormfront A.W. Stormfront J.U.N.T.A.
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Posted - 2008.12.24 13:48:00 -
[33]
Originally by: RedSplat
Originally by: Awesome Marie /signed
And I like to tell ppl to adapt or die. But man do I want the hoggur to be as good as it looks!
Oh please no
None to be had... Oh god how did this get here I am not good with computer |
Eaiaden
Minmatar Baptism oF Fire B.L.A.C.K.
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Posted - 2008.12.24 15:15:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Sokratesz
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
3x AN EANM 1x DCU 2x Cap. armor rep
is the best lowslot config unless you give up tank for cap.
And your own tank isn't worth much, so screw one rep and one eanm for 2x cpr and fit three rr mods :)
For the 10th time sokratez NO NO NO NEVER, despite what you keep saying about capitals, not everything is about fitting 3 X RR's, you do get into situations where you own local tank plays a critical role, even your own mighty mothership died recently didnt it, so your setup is far from perfect.
Sure its good with massive cap support, but not all alliances are able to field 100+ capitals.
I once got caught by -A- while i was repping a pos, i was just 100 hundred meters from the shield edge, all the sudden they had covert ops scout me, and i had 50+ angry russians all over, wepped to death (before wep nerf) i was moving 0.4 M/S - i had 60% cap when they caught me, by the time i got back under shields, i had 7% cap, and 10% armor, with dual rep tank (setup above) - had i used your setup, id be dead long before - props to AAA btw, i got 7 kills, was great fun
Im sure your setup works, im not saying it dont, if your in tri, with your massive cap blobs.
But its not the ONLY way to fit a carrier, witch you seem to claim.
But back on track, i have a happit of derailing.
The Nidhog absolutely needs a boost, dont make it all mighty, but give it a boost, 10% cap and 10% more armor
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.12.24 16:01:00 -
[35]
Edited by: Sokratesz on 24/12/2008 16:02:09
Originally by: Eaiaden
For the 10th time sokratez NO NO NO NEVER, despite what you keep saying about capitals, not everything is about fitting 3 X RR's, you do get into situations where you own local tank plays a critical role, even your own mighty mothership died recently didnt it, so your setup is far from perfect.
It's the only carrier that gets bonuses for RR, so better capitalise on it. Two is fine on others but the nid has only one strength and not making use of it is quite wasteful.
Originally by: Eaiaden
Sure its good with massive cap support, but not all alliances are able to field 100+ capitals.
Neither does TRI, what's your point?
Originally by: Eaiaden
I once got caught by -A- while i was repping a pos, i was just 100 hundred meters from the shield edge, all the sudden they had covert ops scout me, and i had 50+ angry russians all over, wepped to death (before wep nerf) i was moving 0.4 M/S - i had 60% cap when they caught me, by the time i got back under shields, i had 7% cap, and 10% armor, with dual rep tank (setup above) - had i used your setup, id be dead long before - props to AAA btw, i got 7 kills, was great fun
Fit for the situation? I've never claimed that my fittings were good for all situations.
Originally by: Eaiaden
Im sure your setup works, im not saying it dont, if your in tri, with your massive cap blobs.
Your point?
Originally by: Eaiaden
But its not the ONLY way to fit a carrier, witch you seem to claim.
Nope. But whenever there is 5 or more other carriers around, remote tank >> local tank.
Originally by: Eaiaden
But back on track, I have a habit of derailing.
You sure do.
Wyvern & Chimera fitting flowchart |
Jack Dubrow
The Drekla Consortium
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Posted - 2008.12.24 16:57:00 -
[36]
Logistic range + resist (2 caps) Logistic range + damage (1) Logistic range + logistic repair (1)
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...what if it had a larger repair amount? Like 10% or 15% per level? Or maybe a LARGER rep range with the 5% rep bonus? ---
Let all of it fall to the ground and burn with what we can not smell! |
Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.12.24 18:10:00 -
[37]
A logistics range bonus would be more useful than amount - if it were something substantial so that it could reach out to 100km at least.
If anything, they should reverse the shield/armour HP because they forgot to do that after the slot change.
Wyvern & Chimera fitting flowchart |
Solid Prefekt
Minmatar Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2008.12.24 18:18:00 -
[38]
I give up on on thinking CCP will ever do anything to balance the Minnie caps with the other races.
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SharpMango
14th Legion
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Posted - 2008.12.24 18:54:00 -
[39]
i will train for this carrier one day. i hope by the time i do, there will be a thread complaining about how overpowered it is. instead of several dozen threads lamenting its... crapness.
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Solid Prefekt
Minmatar Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2008.12.24 19:33:00 -
[40]
Originally by: SharpMango i will train for this carrier one day. i hope by the time i do, there will be a thread complaining about how overpowered it is. instead of several dozen threads lamenting its... crapness.
That is what I did when I trained Matar caps . . . a year ago.
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Debrace
Minmatar Universal Assembler Sylph Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.24 21:57:00 -
[41]
Agreed and signed (does signing this stuff every actually work?)
Something needs to be brought about to make the Nidhoggur more inline with other ships. This ship, by no means should be a solomobile, but at the same time it shouldn't be the butt of all carrier jokes.
Just curious to what CCP thinks of this, because it does feel like we've been in the dark for a while.
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Cyrus Brown
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Posted - 2008.12.24 22:26:00 -
[42]
Something has to be done to many of the Minmatar ships to bring them inline with thier counterparts.
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Ahz
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Posted - 2008.12.24 22:29:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Debrace Something needs to be brought about to make the Nidhoggur more inline with other ships...
Just make it cheaper. It should be around 650 mil.
Problem solved.
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Reatu Krentor
Minmatar Duragon Pioneer Group GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.12.25 00:48:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Sokratesz They should reverse the slot layout change, give it 150 more CPU and make the rr bonus 7.5%/lvl, that'll fix it juuust fine.
CAPITAL THIS. Well except the rr bonus, i'd say just make it apply to rr and personal reps but keep it 5%. -- stuff -- |
Typhado3
Minmatar Ashen Lion Mining and Production Consortium Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2008.12.25 01:01:00 -
[45]
/signed
been playing eve for over 3 years and never bothered with capitals cause I'd want to go minmatar. Recently decided to create a capital alt and chose minmatar purely for rp reasons (nomad, freinrir, nid, nag we really need to have some balancing done).
ccp fix mining agent missions % pls |
Ahz
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Posted - 2008.12.25 05:47:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Typhado3 /signed
been playing eve for over 3 years and never bothered with capitals cause I'd want to go minmatar. Recently decided to create a capital alt and chose minmatar purely for rp reasons (nomad, freinrir, nid, nag we really need to have some balancing done).
I was willing to put up with the lame caps because the cruisers were so good. But now with the relative nerfing of the vagabond there isn't much that the Minmatar have to brag about.
Each race should be able to count on dominance with at least one ship class.
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masternerdguy
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Posted - 2008.12.25 06:03:00 -
[47]
dude...................................................minmattar are not meant to be tough like that, !!!!!!
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Crackpipe2000
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Posted - 2008.12.25 09:13:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Nova Satar
Less Powergrid. Less CPU. Less Cap. Less Armour. Less Hull. Less Drone bay. Less Cargo Hold. Less Lock Range. Less Resists. Less Senor Strength. Less DPS. Slower Lock time. Slow Cap Recharge.
More Top Speed. (**** that ****) More Shield. (**** that **** too) - Nova
Excluding lock time, its true to general minmatar ship design. But hey, it got smaller signature radius, too! Just change the fighter bonus to split weapon system bonus and it'll do fine. |
Shionoya Risa
The Xenodus Initiative. Overclockers Podpilot Services
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Posted - 2008.12.25 09:47:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Crackpipe2000 Just change the fighter bonus to split weapon system bonus and it'll do fine.
Don't give them anymore ideas dammit! -----
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Unreal5
Malicious Intentions
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Posted - 2008.12.25 11:49:00 -
[50]
In the spirit on xmas, im feeling nostalgic so i feel obliged posting the following:
VAGABOND ROFL OVAPOWA also, ROFL WTF NO CAP FOR WAPONS, WTF
Otherwise, /signed ASD |
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arbiter reformed
Minmatar Systematic Chaos.
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Posted - 2008.12.25 13:35:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Ahz
Originally by: Typhado3 /signed
been playing eve for over 3 years and never bothered with capitals cause I'd want to go minmatar. Recently decided to create a capital alt and chose minmatar purely for rp reasons (nomad, freinrir, nid, nag we really need to have some balancing done).
I was willing to put up with the lame caps because the cruisers were so good. But now with the relative nerfing of the vagabond there isn't much that the Minmatar have to brag about.
Each race should be able to count on dominance with at least one ship class.
dude we still have the saber thats by far the best light dictor. stopwhining :P
in all serious tho tempest is a really really mean battleship, good for everything love it
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Dion Rivers
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Posted - 2008.12.25 13:44:00 -
[52]
Altough I respect the possible RP purposes of EVE, this is one of the issues that doesn't make sense. okay, minmatar ships above cruiser class except typhoon suck. this maybe explained as minmatar beign a slave race ergo not technologically devolopped as other races, I accept that. But if you give a race weak ships, as suggested by someone else, just make them way cheaper. hell just use the statistics and see how many people uses which capital.
in a nutshell, strong ships are not the only winning point of eve. cheap ships are. not everyone in eve used the pos bug so I don't have billions to distrubute at jita. so what I expect is, if I'm flying a weak ship(I use it to define the slot layouts, unmodded stats) I want its darn price to be in relevance with its effectiveness. or as others said, improve it and keep the price as it is.
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Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.25 15:27:00 -
[53]
this thread has shown...
if it wasn't for laziness or RP, NOBODY would fly Matar Caps!
How do we get the CSM to do whatever they do (nothing) concerning this?
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Cyrus Brown
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Posted - 2008.12.25 16:05:00 -
[54]
Pattern will save Minmatar!
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Gunner Chick
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Posted - 2008.12.25 18:22:00 -
[55]
minmatar is just stinky. train galle..wait. train calda..wait. yea train my race so you can get me nerfed.
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UD549
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Posted - 2008.12.25 18:29:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Nova Satar
Originally by: keepiru Minnie capitals are a kind of ongoing gag by CCP.
yeah
It's getting old. It's almsot as funny as that joke they call CSM.
Minnie caps are a novelty ship so u lose, also try speed tanking your cap ship.
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Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.26 11:31:00 -
[57]
Originally by: UD549
Originally by: Nova Satar
Originally by: keepiru Minnie capitals are a kind of ongoing gag by CCP.
yeah
It's getting old. It's almsot as funny as that joke they call CSM.
Minnie caps are a novelty ship so u lose, also try speed tanking your cap ship.
tried..
failed.
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Jalif
Black Sinisters
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Posted - 2008.12.26 12:42:00 -
[58]
I would fly a nidhogger & hell before I would fly any of the 3 other races. You are not thinking outside the box.
CEO of Black Sinisters |
Vherr Arkhar
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Posted - 2008.12.26 13:03:00 -
[59]
I am currently speccing minmatar up further. I love the style and there is only so much time until some weird change will make minmatar the new amarr. *g*
Honestly, I remember the "lol lasers are broken" threads and all the "amarr underdog" ones. *sigh* Remember? The time when the alpha of the tempest was still something vastly not-liked by anyone not-in-a-tempest?
Honestly, Minmatarr ships are just that tiny bit less good than others, but maybe thats a good thing... otherwise the "rusty wheelchair with belt-fed-uzis" would be all that is played! xD
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Argilac Blackthorne
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Posted - 2008.12.26 18:37:00 -
[60]
I'd really love to see a dev response to all of the "Boost Minmatar" threads lately. Is anything even being considered?
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Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Wreckless Abandon G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.12.26 22:18:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Argilac Blackthorne I'd really love to see a dev response to all of the "Boost Minmatar" threads lately. Is anything even being considered?
Problem is: while requests and the suggestions for the changes to the Niddy are reasonable (just boost the Logistics bonus from 5 to 7.5 or 10% - which should be the same increace for the fighter damage bonus to the Thanny), all the complaints about the sub-caps are off the wall (like giving more turret slots to tempests and increacing the optimal of artillery) and the Nag is so broken it would mean a complete ship redesign - which means anyone who trained it did so knowing it was the weakest dread by a long shot (Rev does 70+% more dps and tanks more and can be used to haul stuff in a pinch).
Also, capitals don't get a lot of attention because most people don't fly them. ----
ECCM is a Counter-measure not a defense. |
Eaiaden
Minmatar Baptism oF Fire B.L.A.C.K.
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Posted - 2008.12.27 02:34:00 -
[62]
*BUMP*
Aint letting a perfectly good thread die, CCP you should pay some attention to this issue, seems its a general feeling, both minmatar and other races, how come you dont just fix it?!
Your game designers can do it in a few hours work, give it to a dev who apply it during DT, dont even need to do an extended patch, its that simple, cammoan.
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EFT Warrior
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Posted - 2008.12.27 02:46:00 -
[63]
I will only say this: Minmatar aren't balanced, but the imbalance isn't as bad as you think, and I will be more than happy to take advantage of your ignorance in space.
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Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.27 11:33:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Eaiaden *BUMP*
Aint letting a perfectly good thread die, CCP you should pay some attention to this issue, seems its a general feeling, both minmatar and other races, how come you dont just fix it?!
Your game designers can do it in a few hours work, give it to a dev who apply it during DT, dont even need to do an extended patch, its that simple, cammoan.
Exactly, and this isn't the first thread, there are Matar Carrier threads popping upo every week but nothing ever happens. It would be nice for CCP to atleast acknowledge the issue (or the non-issue as the case may be).
That';s what sets them apart from the other Game Developers out there!
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Orakkus
Minmatar m3 Corp BlackWater.
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Posted - 2008.12.27 15:54:00 -
[65]
I think they are just hoping that this thread (as well as similar ones like it) will go the way of the "Boost Tempest" and "Boost Arty" threads that have passed into antiquity with no resolution from CCP, following a great mmo axiom: If you ignore it long enough.. it will go away.
I only do diplomancy because I haven't found you.. yet. |
Megan Maynard
Minmatar Out of Order
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Posted - 2008.12.27 16:31:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Sokratesz
If anything, they should reverse the shield/armour HP because they forgot to do that after the slot change.
SEE: Typhoon, a battleship used by the minmatar.
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314159265
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Posted - 2008.12.27 17:56:00 -
[67]
Recent happenings made me thinking again of training to get into the nidhuggor.. I'm only 1 month away of getting into it. They say it's one of the worst carriers and probably it is.. But I know, as a Minmatar specced character that I will find a way to use it.
Recently I learned that the Typhoon isn't the only minmatar BS that's good, it's just the easiest battleship (though you got to train 'a lot' before you can use it effectively). Tempest en Maelstrom are really good at what they can, and that's more then just station decoration. Also, Muninn isn't bad either, it's just a medium range sniper, that's all.
Minmatar caps, I wont say more about them until I fly one, that's the only way to get a good view of what they're capable of.
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ebonyivory
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Posted - 2008.12.27 18:46:00 -
[68]
if you like the idea of a minnie buff post in my thread in gd (even if only in support of a carrier buff)
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Mioelnir
Minmatar Meltd0wn The Black Isle
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Posted - 2008.12.27 18:56:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Sokratesz A logistics range bonus would be more useful than amount - if it were something substantial so that it could reach out to 100km at least.
If anything, they should reverse the shield/armour HP because they forgot to do that after the slot change.
Erm...
A Nidhoggur has, without skills, the following stats:
Shield-HP: 112'500 Armor-HP: 112'500
What do you hope to accomplish by switching them?
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Kagura Nikon
Minmatar Infinity Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.12.27 19:49:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Mioelnir
Originally by: Sokratesz A logistics range bonus would be more useful than amount - if it were something substantial so that it could reach out to 100km at least.
If anything, they should reverse the shield/armour HP because they forgot to do that after the slot change.
Erm...
A Nidhoggur has, without skills, the following stats:
Shield-HP: 112'500 Armor-HP: 112'500
What do you hope to accomplish by switching them?
I match his reversal and say we should re-reverse it 7 times in a row!!! ------------------------------------------------- If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
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Nova Satar
Shadow Company
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Posted - 2008.12.27 22:12:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Mioelnir
Originally by: Sokratesz A logistics range bonus would be more useful than amount - if it were something substantial so that it could reach out to 100km at least.
If anything, they should reverse the shield/armour HP because they forgot to do that after the slot change.
Erm...
A Nidhoggur has, without skills, the following stats:
Shield-HP: 112'500 Armor-HP: 112'500
What do you hope to accomplish by switching them?
lol...
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Eaiaden
Minmatar Baptism oF Fire B.L.A.C.K.
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Posted - 2008.12.29 01:20:00 -
[72]
Necroed to life again... CCP you still havent fixed thiz!
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ry ry
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Posted - 2008.12.30 11:45:00 -
[73]
one carrier has to be worse than the others, and to be honest how often do you 1v1 another carrier?
yeah they're a bit cack compared to the other caps but if you're part of a massive capblob rr circle-jerk there isn't so much difference. besides, given how many people play undock point silly-buggers, i'd imagine the higher top speed is benefiting somebody, somewhere.
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Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.12.30 11:57:00 -
[74]
Edited by: Felix Dzerzhinsky on 30/12/2008 11:59:24
Originally by: ry ry one carrier has to be worse than the others, and to be honest how often do you 1v1 another carrier?
yeah they're a bit cack compared to the other caps but if you're part of a massive capblob rr circle-jerk there isn't so much difference. besides, given how many people play undock point silly-buggers, i'd imagine the higher top speed is benefiting somebody, somewhere.
Actually. . .no.
The resist bonus' that Amarr and Caldari carriers have makes them far better in RR gangs because 25% more rep is far less valuable then 25% un-peanalied resists - both in terms of the lag that capitals, especially mass capitals generate, as well as the actual EHP (calculations are best when DCU is removed).
Thats why the 5% bonus' for Gallente and Minmatar being increaced from 5% per level to 7.5% per level (or even 10% - but that may be too much) and allow the Thanatos to have its bonus spread to all drones while the Minmatar can do all logistics (energy and drones)would be enough to make those ships - but especially the Niddy - more attractive. ----
ECCM is a Counter-measure not a defense. |
Bart Starr
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Posted - 2008.12.31 18:42:00 -
[75]
/signed
5 months ago i started training for carriers, i figured "its so bad, by the time i have it, im sure CCP have fixed it" man was i wrong...
Now i started to train for dreads, in 22 days will i have a fully fitted Naglafar, so basically, i just spent 6 months of training for the 2 "joke" ships in the game, im still hoping for the day CCP "fix" minmatar capitals".
I mean, it dosent have to be the BEST ones, but gees, several options to work with here.
More armor HP More cap Faster cap regen
Just 1 of theese 3 options will make it a viable carrier.
I dont care about the lesser CPU / PG, my fitting are
High 1 X True sansha EMP smartbomb 1 X domination explosion smartbomb 1 X true sansha neut 2 X remote armor reps
Mid: 1 x Shadow serpensis sensorbooster 1 X ECCM - Ladar II 3 X Cap recharger II
Low: 2 X Armor reps 1 X True sansha EANM 1 X Expl hardner II 1 X Kinetic hardner II 1 X Thermic hardner II
3 x CCC rigs
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And i have never had any problems with fittings, so theese points are of no consequence really.
BUT, the sheer lack of cap / regen, while having the intended role as a great logistic ship is beyond me, and a low amount of armor HP, well.... it can survive without it, ONE of the carriers have to be the one with weakest local tank, so i guess its ok, but give us some cap to work with CCP!!!
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VoiceInTheDesert
Gallente Diplomatic Disruption
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Posted - 2008.12.31 19:25:00 -
[76]
Edited by: VoiceInTheDesert on 31/12/2008 19:25:32 I like the niddy. It's a little weak on cap, but it has a number of advantages.
+Good tank (If you do it right. Hint: Armor is doing it wrong) +Logistics bonus +ECM resistant (how many minny jammers does an average falcon have fitted? Maybe one?)
-Cap isn't stable (or at least I can't get it stable) -CPU is weak when shield tanking (difficult to fit the shield transfer array without an implant)
It's not the best carrier (that's the archon imo), but it's not terrible. TBH, I'm choosing to fly one of those instead of a thanny cause the thanny tank is so weak and gallente jammers abound on your typical falcon.
You're absolutely right on the Naglfar though. It's bad. Fly a moros/revelation.
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Rhaegor Stormborn
R.U.S.T. Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.31 19:26:00 -
[77]
CCP, something really should be done.
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Ramson
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Posted - 2008.12.31 21:24:00 -
[78]
Edited by: Ramson on 31/12/2008 21:24:04 Finaly took a bite out of the AC round and started training for caps,about almost 2 months ago ,now I finaly have the skills for my deadly nidhogg... but wait,what is this ... matari capitals still fail after all this time.
Seriously if you are going to make ships crap CCP,make them look like it,nid and hel looks extremly deadly and badass ... maibe that was your intention,to make them intimidating and hope people wont attack them.
Not to mention the speed nerf hit matari ships like a sun about to super nova hit a kestrel.
SOOO A SUMARY:
FIX MATARI SHIPS - BRING THEM IN LINE WITH THE OTHERS,SINCE SPEED IS WHAT THEY WERE ABOUT,MATARI SHIPS LOOK BUILT FOR WAR AND DEADLY ... well mostly
AND IF YOU DONT WANT TO FIX MATARI SHIPS THEN BUFF THE FREAKING NIDHOGGUR AND HEL.
Oh .. I dream the days when this line didnt just sound cool but reflected the cold hard truth of it's efficency öImagine a dozen deadly hornets pouring from the devilÆs mouth. Now imagine they have autocannons.ö
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ry ry
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Posted - 2008.12.31 21:50:00 -
[79]
Edited by: ry ry on 31/12/2008 21:50:08
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky Edited by: Felix Dzerzhinsky on 30/12/2008 11:59:24 Actually. . .no.
The resist bonus' that Amarr and Caldari carriers have makes them far better in RR gangs because 25% more rep is far less valuable then 25% un-peanalied resists - both in terms of the lag that capitals, especially mass capitals generate, as well as the actual EHP (calculations are best when DCU is removed).
Thats why the 5% bonus' for Gallente and Minmatar being increaced from 5% per level to 7.5% per level (or even 10% - but that may be too much) and allow the Thanatos to have its bonus spread to all drones while the Minmatar can do all logistics (energy and drones)would be enough to make those ships - but especially the Niddy - more attractive.
i see your point, but it comes down to lag and the way capfleet battles are fought.
if there isn't enough time to finish a cycle, or the server chokes, the rep bonus is worthless. clearly lag is inevitable, but from a pure game-design POV balancing ships shouldn't necessarily compensate for it.
if the concentration of fire is enough to melt a carrier that rep bonus is just as worthless as the thannie's, and no ship should be better than another on the off-chance lag interrupts play.
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