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UD549
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Posted - 2008.11.15 14:21:00 -
[1]
Edited by: UD549 on 15/11/2008 14:23:23 Ok, I know that the tactical shield manipulation skill is for the use of shield harderners but can someone explain to me what it actually means? Also what is uniformity bonus? Tactical Shield Manipulation: Skill at preventing damage from penetrating the shield, including the use of shield hardeners and other advanced shield modules. Reduces the chance of damage penetrating the shield when it falls below 25% by 5% per skill level, with 0% chance at level 5. So at level 5 no damage will penetrate the shield, that doesn't sound right? Edit: Also i heard at lvl 5 this skill is bugged and its like having the skill at level 1, has this been fixed?
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322egnaro
Caldari Under Heavy Fire
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Posted - 2008.11.15 15:16:00 -
[2]
When your shields get low (<25%) you can get damage to your armour (which is apparently extra damage to your shields, not instead of). Each level will reduce the 25% by 5%, so it will start at 20% at level 1, 15% at level 2 etc, and so when you get to level 5 only when you get 0% shields can you get damage to armour. It has been fixed.
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Dark Soldat
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.11.15 15:40:00 -
[3]
at level V no damage will penetrate the shields..in this case no armor damage before you lost your shields
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Demonic Sentiment
Caldari Dissonance Corp Libertas Fidelitas
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Posted - 2008.11.15 21:20:00 -
[4]
lvl 5 in this skill is a must have for capitals : )
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Johann Callasan
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Posted - 2008.11.16 00:45:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Johann Callasan on 16/11/2008 00:45:03
Originally by: UD549 Edited by: UD549 on 15/11/2008 14:23:23 Ok, I know that the tactical shield manipulation skill is for the use of shield harderners but can someone explain to me what it actually means? Also what is uniformity bonus? Tactical Shield Manipulation: Skill at preventing damage from penetrating the shield, including the use of shield hardeners and other advanced shield modules. Reduces the chance of damage penetrating the shield when it falls below 25% by 5% per skill level, with 0% chance at level 5. So at level 5 no damage will penetrate the shield, that doesn't sound right? Edit: Also i heard at lvl 5 this skill is bugged and its like having the skill at level 1, has this been fixed?
Are you familiar witht he concept of "bleedthrough"?
Normal shields will start "bleeding through" damage at 25% capacity. If you're running missions/ratting, you notice how on the rats that the armor bar starts showing damage before the shields are fully down? That's bleedthrough on the rats, and it applies to players too.
Tactical Shield Manipulation lowers the point at which that bleedthrough can occur. Each rank lowers that percentage of remaining shields by 5% absolute. So, at level 5 Tactical Shield manipulation means that NO damage gets through the shield until it's fully down, increasing the total damage you can tank if you're a shield-tanker. if you're a armor-tanker it gives you a little extra buffer before it's time to turn the tank on.
It's also a requirement if you get into capships, for things like cap ship shield boosters. So, it has it's uses - much more than the shield compensation skills (which are mostly of use to passive shield-tankers.)
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Marine HK4861
Caldari Radical Technologies
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Posted - 2008.11.16 13:15:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Johann Callasan
So, at level 5 Tactical Shield manipulation means that NO damage gets through the shield until it's fully down, increasing the total damage you can tank if you're a shield-tanker.
It all depends on whether the bleedthrough is additional damage or a proportion of the incoming damage.
If it's additional damage, then your statement is correct.
If it's a proportion of the damage that's re-directed to armour instead, then a high level of TSM hurts shield tankers as you actually tank less, due to the way passive shield regeneration works (which even active shield tanks have). |
Ralara
Caldari D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.11.17 07:27:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Demonic Sentiment lvl 5 in this skill is a must have for capitals : )
Shield-using capitals, yes. |
Karanth
Gallente Independent Fleet Space Exploration and Logistic Services
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Posted - 2008.11.18 00:11:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Ralara
Originally by: Demonic Sentiment lvl 5 in this skill is a must have for capitals : )
Shield-using capitals, yes.
Caldari capitals and Rorqual. And maybe the Minmatar ones.
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Wheel of Whineage |
Johann Callasan
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Posted - 2008.11.18 06:27:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Marine HK4861
Originally by: Johann Callasan
So, at level 5 Tactical Shield manipulation means that NO damage gets through the shield until it's fully down, increasing the total damage you can tank if you're a shield-tanker.
It all depends on whether the bleedthrough is additional damage or a proportion of the incoming damage.
If it's additional damage, then your statement is correct.
If it's a proportion of the damage that's re-directed to armour instead, then a high level of TSM hurts shield tankers as you actually tank less, due to the way passive shield regeneration works (which even active shield tanks have).
AFAIK it's additional, not a roportion of incoming.
Even if it was a proportion, I'd still want it as by the time TSM kicks in, the tank is failing and I'd want to keep my repair bills as low as possible during warpout :)
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Witcher
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Posted - 2008.11.18 10:51:00 -
[10]
CCP make stupid skill perform something meaningful already, not that useless crap, right now nobody wants to train excep for cap mode. Its useless to both armor tankers and shield tankers. add some attribute on it, like reach or some minor resist bonus - anything , but make it fukin useful |
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Grarr Dexx
Amarr The Cosa Nostra La Cosa Nostra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.11.18 11:37:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Witcher CCP make stupid skill perform something meaningful already, not that useless crap, right now nobody wants to train excep for cap mode. Its useless to both armor tankers and shield tankers. add some attribute on it, like reach or some minor resist bonus - anything , but make it fukin useful
Then I want CCP to actually upgrade Hull Upgrades, too
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Ghoest
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Posted - 2008.11.18 12:03:00 -
[12]
The skill itself is a total waste for everyone except capitol pilots.
Train it as high as you need to open T2 modules then ignore it.
If you think corp is different than a guild or clan you have some insecurity issues.
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Witcher
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Posted - 2008.11.18 12:26:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Witcher on 18/11/2008 12:26:36 and again speaking about some logical skill progression , and certs system etc. So skills in theory should lead to other skills, which are tougher to train but give some ebenefit, then once you've achieved all moderatelly tough and all moderately usefull skills, then you should proceed to caps, which in theory are most useful ships.
Useful as in for pos warfare and sov claims for that matter, if we deem territory control as the key objective of this game. But thats not the point, the point is that we have mdoeratelly tough skill (rank 3), which leads to cap modules and which is absolutelly and totall pointless skill to train . Comon CCP do something about it, that just fukin stupid to have skills like this on the skill sheet page. |
Durzel
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.11.18 14:21:00 -
[14]
Pointless above level 4 imo (outside of it being a pre-requisite), if you're a shield-tanker and your shield is at 25% or below it's already failed and you should be warping out of there.
Sure it can mean the difference between life and death in some contrived scenario but 99 times out of 100 you will either die regardless, or warp out.
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322egnaro
Caldari Under Heavy Fire
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Posted - 2008.11.18 16:30:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Durzel Pointless above level 4 imo (outside of it being a pre-requisite), if you're a shield-tanker and your shield is at 25% or below it's already failed and you should be warping out of there.
Sure it can mean the difference between life and death in some contrived scenario but 99 times out of 100 you will either die regardless, or warp out.
What about for armour tankers, surely it can have a small use here? If you have TSM to 5 then the shields will be completely down before your armour starts to take any damage, meaning you can potentially have more hit points. Admittedly it's not going to be a lot, but every point counts, right?
Or a meringue?
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Barbicane
TGUN Industries
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Posted - 2008.11.18 19:51:00 -
[16]
Originally by: UD549
Ok, I know that the tactical shield manipulation skill is for the use of shield harderners but can someone explain to me what it actually means?
I suggest checking one of the other numerous threads on the subject: here. |
Ralara
Caldari D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.11.19 07:48:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Karanth
Originally by: Ralara
Originally by: Demonic Sentiment lvl 5 in this skill is a must have for capitals : )
Shield-using capitals, yes.
Caldari capitals and Rorqual. And maybe the Minmatar ones.
Minmitar mothership, Rorqual and Caldari capitals.
And also the Thanatos, if you want; the Thanatos can sport a shield tank although you'd be giving up any warp disruptors/web... if you don't use those normally on a carrier, then ... yes the Thanatos. In fact, the Thanatos' shield tank is marginally superiour to it's armour tank. --
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