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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
malcotch
Gallente MicroFunks
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:37:00 -
[1]
CCP are considering changing how the local chat window is going to operate:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=905941
Quote: Local as an info tool: We want to put local in 0.0 as a delayed mode channel so only people who talk in the channel are shown. We are also looking at other alternatives but if we find nothing better this will be put in testing at least.
I know this is still in development, but please CCP do not get this wrong...
Now I cannot think of anything worse than logging on, and not knowing if you have war targets in your system. Why should we be forced to use alts just to see if a system is safe, before undocking!
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Clinical Experiment
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:40:00 -
[2]
'cause that's how things should work really.
A: You cna now safely go rat in 0.0. B: You can haul stuff more easily through 0.0. C: If you want to be "safe", you use a shuttle first. D: It's more "brown pants" |
The Dealmaker
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:40:00 -
[3]
Its 0.0, who cares if its war targets or not. |
baltec1
Antares Shipyards Vanguard.
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:40:00 -
[4]
Why should you know my bomber is in system when cloaked?
Suck it up, I am finaly getting something I want and many farmers and carebears shall die because of it! |
DrAtomic
Atomic Heroes Arcane Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:40:00 -
[5]
Great another blob promotion tool. |
Craleo
Caldari Brotherhood Cartel
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:42:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Sheriff Jones 'cause that's how things should work really.
A: You cna now safely go rat in 0.0. B: You can haul stuff more easily through 0.0. C: If you want to be "safe", you use a shuttle first. D: It's more "brown pants"
It's bloody lame. How is one to find targets? Especially with complexes. People just sit there, ratting like there is no tomorrow, and just keep their scanner open. Meanwhile, a gang passing though has to deploy several probes just to find out if someone is there. If anything, this will make live easier for carebears. |
DrAtomic
Atomic Heroes Arcane Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:46:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Craleo It's bloody lame. How is one to find targets? Especially with complexes. People just sit there, ratting like there is no tomorrow, and just keep their scanner open. Meanwhile, a gang passing though has to deploy several probes just to find out if someone is there. If anything, this will make live easier for carebears.
Errr quite the opposite to be precise, scouts will find you with their scanner easily, not so much in exploration content but certainly in belts. If this goes through then ratting = suicide unless you click your scanner every 5 seconds. |
TZeer
Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:47:00 -
[8]
Originally by: malcotch CCP are considering changing how the local chat window is going to operate:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=905941
Quote: Local as an info tool: We want to put local in 0.0 as a delayed mode channel so only people who talk in the channel are shown. We are also looking at other alternatives but if we find nothing better this will be put in testing at least.
I know this is still in development, but please CCP do not get this wrong...
Now I cannot think of anything worse than logging on, and not knowing if you have war targets in your system. Why should we be forced to use alts just to see if a system is safe, before undocking!
Cause local wont be totally gone....
I guess you will still be able to tell how many people are in system...
Only problem, you wont be able to see if they are hostile or friendly with a quick peek at local...
The way it is now, is ******ed. Jump in, go through local list, 20 freindly, 2 hostile, 3 neutrals...
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Clinical Experiment
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:47:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Craleo It's bloody lame. How is one to find targets? Especially with complexes. People just sit there, ratting like there is no tomorrow, and just keep their scanner open. Meanwhile, a gang passing though has to deploy several probes just to find out if someone is there. If anything, this will make live easier for carebears.
Same way then before, except that you have to WORK for the info. As. It. Should. Be.
No magical "i sense a disturbance in the force, D4rth\/ad3r is here"..
You sit at gates, you chase belts, you scan down missioners. Nothing changes except...no insta-info. |
Tiirae
The New Era HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:49:00 -
[10]
Originally by: DrAtomic
Originally by: Craleo It's bloody lame. How is one to find targets? Especially with complexes. People just sit there, ratting like there is no tomorrow, and just keep their scanner open. Meanwhile, a gang passing though has to deploy several probes just to find out if someone is there. If anything, this will make live easier for carebears.
Errr quite the opposite to be precise, scouts will find you with their scanner easily, not so much in exploration content but certainly in belts. If this goes through then ratting = suicide unless you click your scanner every 5 seconds.
For god's sake man, there have been dozens and dozens of threads about this, with thousands of posts; CCP and pretty much everyone from here to mars is well acquainted with the issues, why do you think it's taken so long for them to decide to implement something?
It's generally assumed that they will give us some other tools to make this less horrific and ultimately it will lead to much more interesting gameplay. Personally I can't wait.
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TZeer
Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:50:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Craleo
Originally by: Sheriff Jones 'cause that's how things should work really.
A: You cna now safely go rat in 0.0. B: You can haul stuff more easily through 0.0. C: If you want to be "safe", you use a shuttle first. D: It's more "brown pants"
It's bloody lame. How is one to find targets? Especially with complexes. People just sit there, ratting like there is no tomorrow, and just keep their scanner open. Meanwhile, a gang passing though has to deploy several probes just to find out if someone is there. If anything, this will make live easier for carebears.
Cause you will still be able to see if there are people in local, difference is that you dont know if they are friendly or hostile with a quick glimpse on local list... |
Dirk Magnum
Royal Hiigaran Navy
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:51:00 -
[12]
Good. Local chat in nullsec needed a change, especially in areas where actual players claim sovereignty.
To address the OP: don't use alts, use corp-mates. If you don't have corp-mates why are you at war? You want to reap the rewards of nullsec then accept the risks, one of which might be and should be a delayed local channel. |
ApaKaka
Lone Starr Corporation
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Posted - 2008.10.27 14:57:00 -
[13]
Either this change will:
1. Make 0.0 interesting and make surprise tactics and sneaky maneuvers a viable tactic by going around scouts.
2. Make 0.0 the new lowsec, completely desolated and filled with roaming pirates just trying to get a gank out of newbs.
All depending on how CCP decides to implement it. Simply remove local and not replace it with other intel tools will make no 2. a lot more probably. |
malcotch
Gallente MicroFunks
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:08:00 -
[14]
Edited by: malcotch on 27/10/2008 15:12:15
Originally by: Dirk Magnum Good. Local chat in nullsec needed a change, especially in areas where actual players claim sovereignty.
To address the OP: don't use alts, use corp-mates. If you don't have corp-mates why are you at war? You want to reap the rewards of nullsec then accept the risks, one of which might be and should be a delayed local channel.
I agree with what you're saying to a point. We all have corp-mates, but they may not be in the same system as you, they may not be on-line.
The local window is a valuable tool when you're docked. Perhaps some scanner could be available in station, but I somehow doubt that will be provided. You could undock in a shuttle! as stated above, but what's the point. When you re-dock to change ship, you still do not know if a WT is in system and arrived outside your station. It's only stations that will be restricted by this change.
If you're at a SS or in a POS, you have your ships scanner and escape mechanisms in place and do not need to totally rely on the local window.
p.s I had missed the crucial 0.0 in the original text, at least they're not planning on introducing this to empire space
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Malcanis
RuffRyders Eradication Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:13:00 -
[15]
Originally by: The Dealmaker Its 0.0, who cares if its war targets or not.
This. |
Malcanis
RuffRyders Eradication Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:15:00 -
[16]
Originally by: ApaKaka Either this change will:
1. Make 0.0 interesting and make surprise tactics and sneaky maneuvers a viable tactic by going around scouts.
2. Make 0.0 the new lowsec, completely desolated and filled with roaming pirates just trying to get a gank out of newbs.
Quote:
1. sounds a lot like 2. to me |
Ervol Libra
Amarr Invenio Inceptum
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:19:00 -
[17]
Well if they change it they better change it the same way in low- and highsec as well. At least then wardecs become a lot more fun and suicide ganking ofc. |
DrAtomic
Atomic Heroes Arcane Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:22:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Tiirae
For god's sake man, there have been dozens and dozens of threads about this, with thousands of posts; CCP and pretty much everyone from here to mars is well acquainted with the issues, why do you think it's taken so long for them to decide to implement something?
It's generally assumed that they will give us some other tools to make this less horrific and ultimately it will lead to much more interesting gameplay. Personally I can't wait.
Ground control to cloud 9, ground control to cloud 9: It's Zulupark we're talking about, he says he wants to put local in delayed mode. Nowhere does he say we'll replace local with an intell tool.
Results: 1. You cant trust the number in channel of a delayed chat channel as that doesnt update in real time (no accurate data). 2. If you rat or mine you'll have to press scanner every 5 seconds or get ganked a couple of times a day (impossible). 3. 24/7 borderpatrol duty where entry points into your space will need to be bubble camped 24/7 (booooooooooooooring). 4. The results from a warfar point of view could be positive. 5. The results from a living in 0.0 point of view are disastrous. |
Clair Bear
Coalition of Nations Free Trade Zone.
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:22:00 -
[19]
We'll have to wait and see. If you think this is going to serve you carebear ass on a silver platter you've got a rude shock coming -- after losing a couple of PvE fitted ships the intelligent ones will move back to empire to run L4s, and the rest will either quit or follow. Alliances get less ISK from renters and simply raise moon mineral prices and a new equilibrium is quickly reached.
Could be interesting if combined with changes to remove static belts -- recons would need to probe out their gank target before engaging. With a bit of scanner improvements to easily show probes might be enough to give attentive ratters time to escape.
If not, screw spamming the scanner every second, I'd be headed back to Motsu. |
Dmian
Gallente Gallenterrorisme
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:26:00 -
[20]
Read:
Local changes
Originally by: CCP Zulupark
Local as an info tool: We want to put local in 0.0 as a delayed mode channel so only people who talk in the channel are shown. We are also looking at other alternatives but if we find nothing better this will be put in testing at least.
Local: I'm hoping we'll have something done to local in 0.0 in q1 next year.
Timeframe for local changes: I'd like to see it q1 next year but I can't really promise it. I'll do everything I can to make it happen though :)
Local changes: Yeah, I actually thought that was so obvious that I didn't need to mention it. But yes, any changes to local will of course have to be hand-in-hand with changes to scanning mechanics. You must be able to somehow get quick-ish intel on the basic status of the system you're in.
Local: *IF* we remove local from 0.0 we would replace it with some other kind of intel gathering tool. What that tool is we don't know but we have a few ideas.
Changing local: Yeah, I said that changing it to delayed was one of the options and I also said that we would then probably replace it with some other way to gather the required info. I've already talked about level 4's and highsec risk-reward stuff.
Local: Yes, as stated above somewhere this would most likely go hand-in-hand with some changes that would allow you to quickly gather basic intel on the system you're in.
Local vs constellation chat: Yeah, we've discussed replacing local with constellation chat but we're not really fond of it.
Local: Yes, I think that's exactly what I've said before in this thread, I'd like to decouple the intel gathering from chat channels and into an existing or new dedicated mechanic.
0.0 local change: I don't know how we'd change it but yeah, we'd implement another way of getting local info as stated above.
Local chat in high-sec: Do you mean that you would want to just close the channel to not see the text (just minimize it?) or that you want to be able to close it so you don't show up in the channel list? Either way I don't see us removing local from high-sec, no.
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The BringerofOrder
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:27:00 -
[21]
I seriously hope that they implement this in Low Sec as well! I'd be overjoyed if they did it in Low and Null infact |
Faife
Noctiscion
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:27:00 -
[22]
what an exciting and original thread that brings so many new ideas
go read the eve book to see how it's going to be done. |
Malcanis
RuffRyders Eradication Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:28:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Clair Bear We'll have to wait and see. If you think this is going to serve you carebear ass on a silver platter you've got a rude shock coming -- after losing a couple of PvE fitted ships the intelligent ones will move back to empire to run L4s, and the rest will either quit or follow. Alliances get less ISK from renters and simply raise moon mineral prices and a new equilibrium is quickly reached.
Could be interesting if combined with changes to remove static belts -- recons would need to probe out their gank target before engaging. With a bit of scanner improvements to easily show probes might be enough to give attentive ratters time to escape.
If not, screw spamming the scanner every second, I'd be headed back to Motsu.
I'm not reading anything I don't like here. |
Ghoest
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:28:00 -
[24]
The only thing I would change from the devs comments is that once you attack another player you would show up on chat just as if you had spoken. |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:30:00 -
[25]
Oh, hey, what a shocker, you might actually be FORCED TO ENGAGE enemies for a change, and have PATROOLS IN YOUR HOME to keep them safe. This change is 100% pure gold. Each and everybody against it is a brown-pants, wants-only-easy-mode moron.
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Le Skunk
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:31:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Le Skunk on 27/10/2008 15:31:30 Edited by: Le Skunk on 27/10/2008 15:31:12
Originally by: Clair Bear We'll have to wait and see. If you think this is going to serve you carebear ass on a silver platter you've got a rude shock coming -- after losing a couple of PvE fitted ships the intelligent ones will move back to empire to run L4s, and the rest will either quit or follow. Alliances get less ISK from renters and simply raise moon mineral prices and a new equilibrium is quickly reached.
Could be interesting if combined with changes to remove static belts -- recons would need to probe out their gank target before engaging. With a bit of scanner improvements to easily show probes might be enough to give attentive ratters time to escape.
If not, screw spamming the scanner every second, I'd be headed back to Motsu.
So the argument is:
PRESENTLY:
It is nigh impossible to kill you in low sec/0.0 because local gives advance notice of incoming reds and you can dock/spam scan until you see a probe and have plenty of time to dock
ASSUMING LOCAL NERF HAPPENS:
It is nigh impossible to kill you as you are in motsu and dimwitted elements of CCP nerfed suicide ganking.
END RESULT:
You are nigh on impossible to kill in either case. Sum loss to pvp players... none. Sum gain to pvp players... one less whiney bear in low sec/0.0. Sum gain for carebear.... none. Sum loss for carebear... less isk, horrible lag.
SKUNK |
Sebea
Bottomfeeders Science and Research
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:32:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Clair Bear \ With a bit of scanner improvements to easily show probes might be enough to give attentive ratters time to escape.
yea, cause we're totally lacking the ability to do this now
Open overview settings
Add probes to overview
Close overview settings....
Man, that was tough |
Haskear
Minmatar Valklear Guard
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:32:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Tiirae
For god's sake man, there have been dozens and dozens of threads about this, with thousands of posts; CCP and pretty much everyone from here to mars is well acquainted with the issues, why do you think it's taken so long for them to decide to implement something?
It's generally assumed that they will give us some other tools to make this less horrific and ultimately it will lead to much more interesting gameplay. Personally I can't wait.
And that is really all that needs be said about it forever more. |
DrAtomic
Atomic Heroes Arcane Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:36:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Dmian Read:
Local changes
Originally by: CCP Zulupark
Local: Yes, I think that's exactly what I've said before in this thread, I'd like to decouple the intel gathering from chat channels and into an existing or new dedicated mechanic.
If thats the case let's have it; as long as the intel tool is automatic (ie radar like) and doesnt require mashing buttons like a maniac. |
Dizeezer Velar
Caldari League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees
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Posted - 2008.10.27 15:37:00 -
[30]
Originally by: baltec1 Why should you know my bomber is in system when cloaked?
Suck it up, I am finaly getting something I want and many farmers and carebears shall die because of it!
Hahaha @ your bomber. |
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