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Benilopax
Gallente
Pulsar Combat Supplies
Alternative Realities
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Posted - 2008.09.26 13:57:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Benilopax on 26/09/2008 13:57:29
In my opinion, one of the hardest working and indeed best behaved CSM members is Lavista Vista.
Now CCP plan to introduce a 21 year age limit for the next CSM. This would put Lavista out of the running. Lavista Vista has the right to run two full terms in office. Support our campaign to have Lavista given special dispensation to complete his time as a delegate.
In order for CSM to succeed, CCP shouldn't be ruling out the admittance of one of its better members for a second term! All the technical jargen that CCP have come up with were dealt with in the last election.
Plese go here and add your support.
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Benilopax
Gallente
Pulsar Combat Supplies
Alternative Realities
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Posted - 2008.09.26 13:57:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Benilopax on 26/09/2008 13:57:29
In my opinion, one of the hardest working and indeed best behaved CSM members is Lavista Vista.
Now CCP plan to introduce a 21 year age limit for the next CSM. This would put Lavista out of the running. Lavista Vista has the right to run two full terms in office. Support our campaign to have Lavista given special dispensation to complete his time as a delegate.
In order for CSM to succeed, CCP shouldn't be ruling out the admittance of one of its better members for a second term! All the technical jargen that CCP have come up with were dealt with in the last election.
Plese go here and add your support.
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CrayC
Gallente
CrayC Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.26 14:02:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Benilopax
Lavista Vista has the right to run two full terms in office support our campaign to have Lavista given special dispensation to complete his time as a delegate.
Having the right to run again and completing a term, is two very different things. Yes, all delegates have the right to two terms, but each one is seperate from the other, in the sense that they are not counted as one period. As such, rules may change and they have. LV has the right to run for CSM when he is old enough, acording to the rules put forth by CCP. Until then, he must wait...
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CrayC
Gallente
CrayC Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.26 14:02:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Benilopax
Lavista Vista has the right to run two full terms in office support our campaign to have Lavista given special dispensation to complete his time as a delegate.
Having the right to run again and completing a term, is two very different things. Yes, all delegates have the right to two terms, but each one is seperate from the other, in the sense that they are not counted as one period. As such, rules may change and they have. LV has the right to run for CSM when he is old enough, acording to the rules put forth by CCP. Until then, he must wait...
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Bish Ounen
Gallente
Omni-Core Freedom Fighters
Ethereal Dawn
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Posted - 2008.09.26 14:04:00 -
[5]
Look, our various Operating system disagreements aside, I like LaVista Vista. He's a nice guy, and I've enjoyed alternately sparring and agreeing with him here on the forums.
Unfortunately, some of the under 21 CSM's have shown an inability to handle the responsibility. Thus CCP is raising the age bar to ensure a more mature CSM group that will take it's job seriously. Regrettably, this puts LaVista Vista out of the running for the time being. However, if he is still around in 3 years, he will be eligible to run again, and I will look forward to voting for him at that time.
In the mean time, I would hope some of our more seasoned player base will step up and respectfully fill the chair that LaVista Vista will be vacating. THAT is the best thing we can do for him. To select an honorable replacement that will make him proud.
Tactical Logistics using the last T1 Frigate hull!
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Bish Ounen
Gallente
Omni-Core Freedom Fighters
Ethereal Dawn
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Posted - 2008.09.26 14:04:00 -
[6]
Look, our various Operating system disagreements aside, I like LaVista Vista. He's a nice guy, and I've enjoyed alternately sparring and agreeing with him here on the forums.
Unfortunately, some of the under 21 CSM's have shown an inability to handle the responsibility. Thus CCP is raising the age bar to ensure a more mature CSM group that will take it's job seriously. Regrettably, this puts LaVista Vista out of the running for the time being. However, if he is still around in 3 years, he will be eligible to run again, and I will look forward to voting for him at that time.
In the mean time, I would hope some of our more seasoned player base will step up and respectfully fill the chair that LaVista Vista will be vacating. THAT is the best thing we can do for him. To select an honorable replacement that will make him proud.
Tactical Logistics using the last T1 Frigate hull!
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Daria Hahn
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Posted - 2008.09.26 14:08:00 -
[7]
Voted for Vista and if CCP doesn't let me vote for that guy again, then I'm voting for goons.
Besides, smoking people out of CSM via these means is utterly ridiculous.
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Daria Hahn
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Posted - 2008.09.26 14:08:00 -
[8]
Voted for Vista and if CCP doesn't let me vote for that guy again, then I'm voting for goons.
Besides, smoking people out of CSM via these means is utterly ridiculous.
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Rodj Blake
Amarr
PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.26 14:10:00 -
[9]
In England, at the age of eighteeen you can:
* Purchase and drink alcoholic beverages
* Join the army and go off to die for your country
* Get married without parental consent
* Vote in elections
* Stand as a candidate in local elections
Now, if an eighteen year old is considered mature enough to do all of those things, why doesn't CCP consider them mature enough to sit on the CSM?
In my view, if an eighteen year old is sufficiently eloquent and passionate to garner enough votes, why shouldn't he be on the CSM?
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
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Gonada
Priory Of The Lemon
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Posted - 2008.09.26 14:27:00 -
[10]
the CSM thing is a waste of time.
Please, jump into traffic
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CrayC
Gallente
CrayC Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.26 14:32:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Rodj Blake
In England, at the age of eighteeen you can:
Same thing in Denmark. But, CCP isn't in England or Denmark, they're in Iceland. And even if the CSM age-change has nothing to do with Icelandic laws, there's nothing stopping CCP from making their own requirements. If they feel that you have to have played EVE for a minimum of 3 years, be at least 25 years old and have a college education, then that's their call. Granted, the CSM will not be more popular with those requirements, but it's up to CCP to decide. They have changed the age-requirement. That's all there is to it...
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Khlitouris RegusII
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Posted - 2008.09.26 15:38:00 -
[12]
who honestly cares the csm is justa farce anyway and nothing to do with ccp's original idea of people having access to ccp's data to ensure fair dev play.
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SoftRevolution
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Posted - 2008.09.26 15:39:00 -
[13]
Maturity isn't a digital thing.
If Lavista Vista is doing a good job they should grant him dispensation.
Generally I do agree with that policy mind you.
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Naga Elohim
Amarr
Forsaken Death Squad
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Posted - 2008.09.26 16:04:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Naga Elohim on 26/09/2008 16:06:45
Originally by: Rodj Blake
In England, at the age of eighteeen you can:
* Purchase and drink alcoholic beverages
* Join the army and go off to die for your country
* Get married without parental consent
* Vote in elections
* Stand as a candidate in local elections
Now, if an eighteen year old is considered mature enough to do all of those things, why doesn't CCP consider them mature enough to sit on the CSM?
In my view, if an eighteen year old is sufficiently eloquent and passionate to garner enough votes, why shouldn't he be on the CSM?
Maybe we should do it based purely off of experience and intelligence. Those things you just named an 18 year old can do, require little to no intelligence whatsoever to do.
A 21 year old can be just as immature. Especially in MMOs.
and an 18 year old can be experienced and at the same time mature. All depends on the person.
Instead of having an age limit, the voting process should be more rigorous and based off of the persons
Reputation
Character
Experience
Overall Intelligence and Knowlegde of Eve
....and especially the knowledge of Eve. I saw a CSM post an incorrect statement about smartbombs that offended me.
How can someone representing the playerbase have no clue as to the mechanics of smartbombs?
The standards should be changed, i agree, but age shouldnt even be a main reason for doing so.
There should be some sort of exam. We have to hold these people to higher standards....
Oh and of course have more voter participation.
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Feilamya
Minmatar
24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2008.09.26 17:03:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Feilamya on 26/09/2008 17:03:25
Originally by: Daria Hahn
Voted for Vista and if CCP doesn't let me vote for that guy again, then I'm voting for goons.
Besides, smoking people out of CSM via these means is utterly ridiculous.
Right so! Let's all vote for goons. That'll show them.
Uhm wait ... is this part of another goonspiracy to take over the CSM?
EDIT: Amazing ... seems like avatars got rolled back by several months. What happened on the servers?
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Kalahari Wayrest
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
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Posted - 2008.09.26 18:52:00 -
[16]
I don't think he should be given special dispensation, but I don't think the rule should be there either. If you have people under 21 playing the game and owning accounts, then you should have the chance for under 21 people to be on the CSM.
Afterall, as CCP are so fond of telling us, it's a teen rated game with a teen rated forum 
I can understand the concern about maturity, but I'd disagree that's neccesarily dictated by physical age...
that said maybe 13 year olds wouldn't be a good idea  but I can't for a minute imagine a 13 year old either having an interest, getting voted for, or being prepared to do all of the work required. 21 seems extreme. If an age cap is neccesary, I'd put it at 16 or 18 personally.
__________________________
Indulge Me
Consider Yourself Indulged - Immy ♥
Wow immy scored  - Xorus
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CrayC
Gallente
CrayC Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.26 19:05:00 -
[17]
I can see one obvious reason for a minimum age of 18, one "funny" reason for 20, but I have no clue why CCP set it at 21. Not that I disagree, but still...
18: You have to be of legal age for the Non-Disclosure Agreement, which all CSM members must sign. For those that do not know what a NDA is, in short, it's a legal document where you agree to STFU about everything you learn about CCP and if you tell anyone, you can be sued. there's way more to it, but that's the rough outline.
20: Legal drinking age in Iceland is 20. So to go out and get some bree after the meetings, you gotta be legal 
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Lia Gaeren
Caldari
Pole Dancing Vixens
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Posted - 2008.09.26 19:11:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Bish Ounen
Unfortunately, some of the under 21 CSM's have shown an inability to handle the responsibility.
Some of the over 21s have shown the same thing.
LV's focus of industry is not where my interest in EVE lies, but if it did, I would want him representing it on the CSM. I think he has acquitted himself better than any other member of the delegates so far. His term 'in office' has proven better than any argument that age is not a determinant of maturity.
I think this is a nonsense rule if it goes through - if the player is over the age limit to play the game, they should have the right to stand and represent the player base (if voted in, and I have little doubt that if LV were to stand again he would win a second term).
I noted in another thread though that he seems to have lost his 'CSM delegate' tag in the forums... I've not checked any of the other CSMs to see if it is affecting them too, but I sure hope it's not related to this...
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LaVista Vista
Conservative Shenanigans Party
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Posted - 2008.09.26 19:49:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Lia Gaeren
I noted in another thread though that he seems to have lost his 'CSM delegate' tag in the forums... I've not checked any of the other CSMs to see if it is affecting them too, but I sure hope it's not related to this...
Nope. It's a bug which is being looked into! 
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Caan Buhaao
Gallente
72nd Squadron
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Posted - 2008.09.26 22:21:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Khlitouris RegusII
who honestly cares the csm is justa farce anyway and nothing to do with ccp's original idea of people having access to ccp's data to ensure fair dev play.
Thread over.
--
sig temporarily busted. kinda like the game. |
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Uuve Savisaalo
Rage and Terror
Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2008.09.29 20:58:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Caan Buhaao
Thread over.
this poster lacks in substance.
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Avel Kereka
Amarr
The Aegis Militia
Aegis Militia
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Posted - 2008.09.29 23:26:00 -
[22]
Isn't the age of consent 14 in Iceland? I thought they passed down responsibility earlier rather than later over there. Maybe they're just more liberal with sex than they are with internet spaceships... |
Ghost 3374923
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Posted - 2008.10.01 12:33:00 -
[23]
Irrespective of who, I or anyone else is going to vote for, this is an outrage. No age limits can be made, any citizen of EVE who gets enough votes has the right to be elected and anything else would be a scandal!
/signed
Makes you wonder...if there are elements in CCP, who want to acheive something that has nothing to do with this age limit...
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Xindi Kraid
Cerulean Sky Fire Industries
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Posted - 2008.10.02 11:58:00 -
[24]
If maturity is what they are worried about then they should do interviews or something. I have seen many people over 21 that are immature and people under 21 who act mature.
The 21 rule is bullshit
-So says Xindi Kraid
Dear devs: Sign here
initial here
here
and here |
Miz Cenuij
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Posted - 2008.10.04 01:00:00 -
[25]
Good, its 1 less of last years corrupt council members who can retain his position. |
steejans nix
Amarr
0beron Construct
Shadow Empire.
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Posted - 2008.10.04 13:06:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Miz Cenuij
Good, its 1 less of last years corrupt council members who can retain his position.
Would imagine that he is one of the few that have got their brains in most of the time tbh.
Most others not let their lack of knoweldge in certain areas stop them from spouting crap about it and only one or two can be seen to have a proper discussion and thinks about the matter in hand instead of just saying the same things over and over in the belief that the more words you write the more people will think you great.
One of the others i think people have respect for is the goon dude, he has on the whole represented his side of the game well and has rational thoughts and tries to see each side of debate.
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Ix Forres
Caldari
Vanguard Frontiers
Violent-Tendencies
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Posted - 2008.10.05 13:12:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Ix Forres on 05/10/2008 13:12:40
Originally by: Xindi Kraid
If maturity is what they are worried about then they should do interviews or something. I have seen many people over 21 that are immature and people under 21 who act mature.
The 21 rule is bullshit
Absolutely. I certainly know that Reakktor Media GmbH (developers of Neocron and Neocron 2: Beyond the Dome of York) allowed under-18s to be part of their community teams (equivalent to ISD/AURORA), allowing their legal parents/guardians to sign the NDA on their behalf. Of course, the people were chosen and interviewed to make sure they were mature enough, but knowing that one of the better members of that team was 14- well, let's just say that age is not a direct correlation to maturity. CCP really need to think that one over. I was considering applying for the CSM this time round but this has left a sour taste in my mouth that has lead me to seriously reconsider an application.
--
Ix Forres
EVE Application Developer
ISKsense | RLS-EVE | Blog |
Semkhet
The Priory
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Posted - 2008.10.06 17:09:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Rodj Blake
In England, at the age of eighteeen you can:
* Purchase and drink alcoholic beverages
* Join the army and go off to die for your country
* Get married without parental consent
* Vote in elections
* Stand as a candidate in local elections
Now, if an eighteen year old is considered mature enough to do all of those things, why doesn't CCP consider them mature enough to sit on the CSM?
In my view, if an eighteen year old is sufficiently eloquent and passionate to garner enough votes, why shouldn't he be on the CSM?
All these activities look pretty foolish to me, but at least with the first one you can have some good time
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Athre
Minmatar
The Higher Standard
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Posted - 2008.10.08 23:16:00 -
[29]
The age limit is being held for CSM II and will be implemented in CSM III.
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