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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 15 post(s) |
Gui Montog
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Posted - 2008.07.30 23:42:00 -
[3361]
I think Nohz or what ever should be banned from EVE and have his GM status revoked. He seriously just broke EVE and i think he stinks to.
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Aenis Veros
Caldari Perkone
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Posted - 2008.07.30 23:42:00 -
[3362]
Originally by: Andnowthenews Edited by: Andnowthenews on 30/07/2008 22:28:33 We have tested:
1. NANO VS snipers....snipers owned.
2. NANO VS battle cruisers/hacs and recons(general mix tbh)..mixed fleet owned.
3. NANO VS RR bs....rr bs fleet owned.
4. NANO VS Other nano (although im not sure why)...lol.
Conventionally Tanked hacs/recons/BS vs a mixed gang of BC....mixed gang of BC owned.
5. Conventionally Tanked hacs vs a mixed gang of BC....mixed gang of BC owned.
All nano ships had HG snakes and were T2 fitted and had a claymore in gang.
In all of the serious tests the hacs lost all if not 90% of there fleet while the other ships lost nothing in also virtually all casses.
And in all cases we made it so the gangs were of similar size (10-20 SHIPS ON EACH SIDE) a consideration that i doubt many defending alliances will follow.
The guys assigned as the "hacs/roaming gang" eventually got p*ssed off and hot dropped the assigned "defender team" with a large fleet of RR bs and carriers.
Your post is really unclear, do you mean to say that NANOships owned the RR BS gangs etc.? How in the hell did you have a mixed gang without a huginn/rapier/curse/neut-ship and lost to a nano-gang? Dear Sir if that is the case you simply suck at tactics.
If your post means to imply the opposite, then you just need to learn how to write more clearly.
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Aenis Veros
Caldari Alphaflight
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Posted - 2008.07.30 23:44:00 -
[3363]
Originally by: Wizzkidy LOL just LOL - I bet EVERY SINGLE pilot that has moaned about these changes either has a set of snakes in there head or fly nano's on a regular basis - dont deny it :D
LOL I bet you are a clueless carebear who have no idea how to counter nanoships and cry nerf when your inability to perform reaches critical. Don't deny it.
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Aenis Veros
Caldari Perkone
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Posted - 2008.07.30 23:44:00 -
[3364]
Originally by: Wizzkidy LOL just LOL - I bet EVERY SINGLE pilot that has moaned about these changes either has a set of snakes in there head or fly nano's on a regular basis - dont deny it :D
LOL I bet you are a clueless carebear who have no idea how to counter nanoships and cry nerf when your inability to perform reaches critical. Don't deny it.
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Gui Montog
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Posted - 2008.07.30 23:46:00 -
[3365]
Garmon should be EXEMPT from this ENTIRE NERF and should become GOD of EVE. He is the true internet cyber hero and should be rewarded for his heroic actions.
1. He should NEVER be banned from the forums or EVE AGAIN 2. GM's shall bow to him 3. CCP shall give him free officer mods and also bow to him 4. CCP Wrangler should resign as part of the Dev Team and give it to Garmon
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Gui Montog
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Posted - 2008.07.30 23:46:00 -
[3366]
Garmon should be EXEMPT from this ENTIRE NERF and should become GOD of EVE. He is the true internet cyber hero and should be rewarded for his heroic actions.
1. He should NEVER be banned from the forums or EVE AGAIN 2. GM's shall bow to him 3. CCP shall give him free officer mods and also bow to him 4. CCP Wrangler should resign as part of the Dev Team and give it to Garmon
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TimGascoigne
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Posted - 2008.07.30 23:57:00 -
[3367]
this has suddenly removed one third of the effectiveness of the huginn, Rapier and hyena.
thanks CCP
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TimGascoigne
The Graduates Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.07.30 23:57:00 -
[3368]
this has suddenly removed one third of the effectiveness of the huginn, Rapier and hyena.
thanks CCP
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Psyflame
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Posted - 2008.07.31 00:12:00 -
[3369]
Ok question.
The "discovery" of this speed problem was when this Nozh guy couldn't hit a vaga with his missiles, yes? Well I must inquire, if that "ludicrously speedy" vaga wasn't taking damage, how well were his turrets tracking, and just how much damage was the vaga putting onto target? (I have never flown a vagabond so I don't know)
Also, my torp raven is now decimating nano-hacs on sisi. Much thanks ccp, now my battleship class weapons can destroy those cruisers who try to avoid damage... but that brings up another question. Does ccp plan to fix defender missiles? Defenders are a JOKE (tested them with max skills on armageddon day) and I honestly see no viable counter to missiles on the test server. I use tracking disrupters on turret ships, but missiles strike with impunity.
Does this seem broken to anyone else? Missiles are getting a huge buff and there are no counters to them, unlike other weapons. At least I can enjoy my insanely overpowered torpedo raven for a few months while the devs realize they made a game-breaking superweapon.
My suggestion would be to tone down polycarbs (make them in line with the other rigs,) tone down heat (overheated mwd gets 50% boost while everything else only gets ~15% boost, if you don't want insane speeds, why the lack of uniformity in poly's and heat?) and maybe add an umbrella stacking penalty for speed mods.
Nerfs are NEVER popular, how about a buff instead? You want afterburners to be viable, me too. How about boosting afterburners instead of these mwd-shutoff shenannigans? You want to change webs, how about scripted webs? 10km 90% vs 20km 40%, limit rapiers, huginns, and hyenas to the "original" script as to not make them overpowered.
I don't know, just some ideas that everyone will probably ignore.
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Nzpure
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Posted - 2008.07.31 00:12:00 -
[3370]
The nerf is BS and thats coming from someone who hates nano ships casue they outrun my missiles but you still shouldn't kill nano bollucks i say absolute bollucks
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Psyflame
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Posted - 2008.07.31 00:12:00 -
[3371]
Ok question.
The "discovery" of this speed problem was when this Nozh guy couldn't hit a vaga with his missiles, yes? Well I must inquire, if that "ludicrously speedy" vaga wasn't taking damage, how well were his turrets tracking, and just how much damage was the vaga putting onto target? (I have never flown a vagabond so I don't know)
Also, my torp raven is now decimating nano-hacs on sisi. Much thanks ccp, now my battleship class weapons can destroy those cruisers who try to avoid damage... but that brings up another question. Does ccp plan to fix defender missiles? Defenders are a JOKE (tested them with max skills on armageddon day) and I honestly see no viable counter to missiles on the test server. I use tracking disrupters on turret ships, but missiles strike with impunity.
Does this seem broken to anyone else? Missiles are getting a huge buff and there are no counters to them, unlike other weapons. At least I can enjoy my insanely overpowered torpedo raven for a few months while the devs realize they made a game-breaking superweapon.
My suggestion would be to tone down polycarbs (make them in line with the other rigs,) tone down heat (overheated mwd gets 50% boost while everything else only gets ~15% boost, if you don't want insane speeds, why the lack of uniformity in poly's and heat?) and maybe add an umbrella stacking penalty for speed mods.
Nerfs are NEVER popular, how about a buff instead? You want afterburners to be viable, me too. How about boosting afterburners instead of these mwd-shutoff shenannigans? You want to change webs, how about scripted webs? 10km 90% vs 20km 40%, limit rapiers, huginns, and hyenas to the "original" script as to not make them overpowered.
I don't know, just some ideas that everyone will probably ignore.
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Nzpure
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Posted - 2008.07.31 00:12:00 -
[3372]
The nerf is BS and thats coming from someone who hates nano ships casue they outrun my missiles but you still shouldn't kill nano bollucks i say absolute bollucks
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GateScout
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Posted - 2008.07.31 00:36:00 -
[3373]
What a bunch of whiny *****es. Have you ever seen a more pathetic conglomerate of complaining ****s?
There are valid reasons for altering the method CCP uses to nerf nano ships... So please stop the "I trained my whole career to fly nano ship..." NO ONES CARES.
Form valid arguments and maybe (MAYBE!) ccp will listen to you. However, with the insane amount of pure bullshit in this thread, no wonder CCP ignores your whines.
Format a semi-decent argument and stop whining...you pathetic shits.
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GateScout
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Posted - 2008.07.31 00:36:00 -
[3374]
What a bunch of whiny *****es. Have you ever seen a more pathetic conglomerate of complaining ****s?
There are valid reasons for altering the method CCP uses to nerf nano ships... So please stop the "I trained my whole career to fly nano ship..." NO ONES CARES.
Form valid arguments and maybe (MAYBE!) ccp will listen to you. However, with the insane amount of pure bullshit in this thread, no wonder CCP ignores your whines.
Format a semi-decent argument and stop whining...you pathetic shits.
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Amarr Holymight
Bat Country Aegis Militia
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Posted - 2008.07.31 00:51:00 -
[3375]
Originally by: GateScout What a bunch of whiny *****es. Have you ever seen a more pathetic conglomerate of complaining ****s?
There are valid reasons for altering the method CCP uses to nerf nano ships... So please stop the "I trained my whole career to fly nano ship..." NO ONES CARES.
Form valid arguments and maybe (MAYBE!) ccp will listen to you. However, with the insane amount of pure bullshit in this thread, no wonder CCP ignores your whines.
Format a semi-decent argument and stop whining...you pathetic shits.
Practice what you preach oh and use your main to flame it's unbecoming to do it with an alt.
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Amarr Holymight
Ultrapolite Socialites GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.07.31 00:51:00 -
[3376]
Originally by: GateScout What a bunch of whiny *****es. Have you ever seen a more pathetic conglomerate of complaining ****s?
There are valid reasons for altering the method CCP uses to nerf nano ships... So please stop the "I trained my whole career to fly nano ship..." NO ONES CARES.
Form valid arguments and maybe (MAYBE!) ccp will listen to you. However, with the insane amount of pure bullshit in this thread, no wonder CCP ignores your whines.
Format a semi-decent argument and stop whining...you pathetic shits.
Practice what you preach oh and use your main to flame it's unbecoming to do it with an alt.
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DeadDuck
Amarr Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.31 01:43:00 -
[3377]
Originally by: Andnowthenews Edited by: Andnowthenews on 30/07/2008 22:28:33 We have tested:
1. NANO VS snipers....snipers owned.
2. NANO VS battle cruisers/hacs and recons(general mix tbh)..mixed fleet owned.
3. NANO VS RR bs....rr bs fleet owned.
4. NANO VS Other nano (although im not sure why)...lol.
Conventionally Tanked hacs/recons/BS vs a mixed gang of BC....mixed gang of BC owned.
5. Conventionally Tanked hacs vs a mixed gang of BC....mixed gang of BC owned.
All nano ships had HG snakes and were T2 fitted and had a claymore in gang.
In all of the serious tests the hacs lost all if not 90% of there fleet while the other ships lost nothing in also virtually all casses.
And in all cases we made it so the gangs were of similar size (10-20 SHIPS ON EACH SIDE) a consideration that i doubt many defending alliances will follow.
The guys assigned as the "hacs/roaming gang" eventually got p*ssed off and hot dropped the assigned "defender team" with a large fleet of RR bs and carriers.
Errr... even before this patch, nanos would die if the defending group would know what to do... The issue is not that one, the question is that due to flaws in game modules design it is possible to reach stupid speeds completly distorting the roles of each ship class.
________________ God is my Wingman |
DeadDuck
Amarr Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.31 01:43:00 -
[3378]
Originally by: Andnowthenews Edited by: Andnowthenews on 30/07/2008 22:28:33 We have tested:
1. NANO VS snipers....snipers owned.
2. NANO VS battle cruisers/hacs and recons(general mix tbh)..mixed fleet owned.
3. NANO VS RR bs....rr bs fleet owned.
4. NANO VS Other nano (although im not sure why)...lol.
Conventionally Tanked hacs/recons/BS vs a mixed gang of BC....mixed gang of BC owned.
5. Conventionally Tanked hacs vs a mixed gang of BC....mixed gang of BC owned.
All nano ships had HG snakes and were T2 fitted and had a claymore in gang.
In all of the serious tests the hacs lost all if not 90% of there fleet while the other ships lost nothing in also virtually all casses.
And in all cases we made it so the gangs were of similar size (10-20 SHIPS ON EACH SIDE) a consideration that i doubt many defending alliances will follow.
The guys assigned as the "hacs/roaming gang" eventually got p*ssed off and hot dropped the assigned "defender team" with a large fleet of RR bs and carriers.
Errr... even before this patch, nanos would die if the defending group would know what to do... The issue is not that one, the question is that due to flaws in game modules design it is possible to reach stupid speeds completly distorting the roles of each ship class.
________________ God is my Wingman |
Synapse Archae
Amarr Demonic Retribution Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.07.31 01:44:00 -
[3379]
Originally by: Space Flyer THANKS CCP for killing the only way that we all had to fight blobs outnumbered in this game... really THANKS!
I didn't have to go far to find someone had already posted my thoughts.
Terrible change. ALl your most highly skilled PVPers are nano pilots. We love it, we think it's balanced fine. We think you should do something about why we have to fly nano ships to do something fun with less than 400 people.
Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
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Synapse Archae
Amarr Demonic Retribution G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.07.31 01:44:00 -
[3380]
Originally by: Space Flyer THANKS CCP for killing the only way that we all had to fight blobs outnumbered in this game... really THANKS!
I didn't have to go far to find someone had already posted my thoughts.
Terrible change. ALl your most highly skilled PVPers are nano pilots. We love it, we think it's balanced fine. We think you should do something about why we have to fly nano ships to do something fun with less than 400 people.
Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
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Synapse Archae
Amarr Demonic Retribution Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.07.31 01:51:00 -
[3381]
Originally by: Mitsuni Abashadoni While I won't scream at the top of my lungs that all these changes are bad, it would be nice if Nozh could explain how they think these changes will achieve all the speed goals. Particularly I'd like to see how you think you'll achieve the last;
Originally by: "Nozh" Guerrilla warfare must remain a viable combat tactic.
In the current game state, this is mainly achieved with nano setups, which enable you to travel fast, move into enemy territory, hit targets of opportunity, and when the inevitable blob arrives, you run like hell. This is pretty much the only way small corps and gangs have to hurt larger enemies, and it's more or less the only viable solo tactic. Gatecamping also works to a certain point, but you're hardly mobile, so it's not exactly Guerilla Warfare.
There are currently quite a few effective counters to speed tanking ships, chiefly Minmatar Recons and neutralizing ships. The problem is that the people don't want to sacrifice an alt or a corpmate in a recon with webs, or fitting that heavy neut that will save their battleships, because it makes them less effective at ratting or whatever they do. Well, welcome to our world. I'd love to have more DPS on my Vagabond, but it's a trade-off. I have virtually no tank but my speed, and if you use tactics that have been debated to death, you can at least make me run.
As to risk vs. reward; I run around in a ship worth 3-400 mill, with a billion worth of implants in my head, I'm willing to take the risk, while the "zoot zoot, omg speed tanking is lame"-crowd is unwilling to sacrifice a highslot that can save their ass.
Please CCP; at least explain how you want to achieve viable guerilla warfare with these changes, because as I see it, you're about to kill the last small gang warfare tactic there is.
I'd like to quote this in the hope against hope that even one more person sees it. I have never been so worried that the game will die as I am now. Where is the guerilla warfare?
Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
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Synapse Archae
Amarr Demonic Retribution G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.07.31 01:51:00 -
[3382]
Originally by: Mitsuni Abashadoni While I won't scream at the top of my lungs that all these changes are bad, it would be nice if Nozh could explain how they think these changes will achieve all the speed goals. Particularly I'd like to see how you think you'll achieve the last;
Originally by: "Nozh" Guerrilla warfare must remain a viable combat tactic.
In the current game state, this is mainly achieved with nano setups, which enable you to travel fast, move into enemy territory, hit targets of opportunity, and when the inevitable blob arrives, you run like hell. This is pretty much the only way small corps and gangs have to hurt larger enemies, and it's more or less the only viable solo tactic. Gatecamping also works to a certain point, but you're hardly mobile, so it's not exactly Guerilla Warfare.
There are currently quite a few effective counters to speed tanking ships, chiefly Minmatar Recons and neutralizing ships. The problem is that the people don't want to sacrifice an alt or a corpmate in a recon with webs, or fitting that heavy neut that will save their battleships, because it makes them less effective at ratting or whatever they do. Well, welcome to our world. I'd love to have more DPS on my Vagabond, but it's a trade-off. I have virtually no tank but my speed, and if you use tactics that have been debated to death, you can at least make me run.
As to risk vs. reward; I run around in a ship worth 3-400 mill, with a billion worth of implants in my head, I'm willing to take the risk, while the "zoot zoot, omg speed tanking is lame"-crowd is unwilling to sacrifice a highslot that can save their ass.
Please CCP; at least explain how you want to achieve viable guerilla warfare with these changes, because as I see it, you're about to kill the last small gang warfare tactic there is.
I'd like to quote this in the hope against hope that even one more person sees it. I have never been so worried that the game will die as I am now. Where is the guerilla warfare?
Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
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Atlanticpyro
The Space BorderLine United For 0rder
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Posted - 2008.07.31 03:20:00 -
[3383]
Edited by: Atlanticpyro on 31/07/2008 03:22:02 Thanks for continuing the silent holocaust of the minmitar. I really just invested years of training Minmatar to become the fastest race to become obsolete ever.
EDIT: If they have a leg to stand on, cut it off. |
Atlanticpyro
The Space BorderLine United For 0rder
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Posted - 2008.07.31 03:20:00 -
[3384]
Edited by: Atlanticpyro on 31/07/2008 03:22:02 Thanks for continuing the silent holocaust of the minmitar. I really just invested years of training Minmatar to become the fastest race to become obsolete ever.
EDIT: If they have a leg to stand on, cut it off. |
Synapse Archae
Amarr Demonic Retribution Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.07.31 04:24:00 -
[3385]
Originally by: Spindeln Being able to kill anything with numbers while being untouchable by speed is just stupid.
If I sacrifice all my slots to armourtanking I dont become invincible, I last a little longer. If I go full gank I still can't instapop everything, I do a bit more damage. If I go full speed, I can outrun everything. Drones, missiles, tracking of guns, tacklers...
Ships with MWD only (blasterboats, sniping ships) will be mostly unaffected if I read the devs correctly.
Blasters might suffer from the web nerf, but time on SiSi will tell and give ample opportunity to fix that.
Speedships will still be fast, just not untouchably fast.
Now Harden the **** up.
Go Nozh! Don't let the weak sway you from the true path!
You have no clue what youre talking about. Every point you list here is flat wrong. Full speed cant outrun everything. Full gank doesnt cost billions, blasters will be VERY affected. Speed is not just a strategy its a TANK you dont fit reppers, and you count on being able to GTFO before you run out of shield. Its a tank.
Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
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Synapse Archae
Amarr Demonic Retribution G00DFELLAS
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Posted - 2008.07.31 04:24:00 -
[3386]
Originally by: Spindeln Being able to kill anything with numbers while being untouchable by speed is just stupid.
If I sacrifice all my slots to armourtanking I dont become invincible, I last a little longer. If I go full gank I still can't instapop everything, I do a bit more damage. If I go full speed, I can outrun everything. Drones, missiles, tracking of guns, tacklers...
Ships with MWD only (blasterboats, sniping ships) will be mostly unaffected if I read the devs correctly.
Blasters might suffer from the web nerf, but time on SiSi will tell and give ample opportunity to fix that.
Speedships will still be fast, just not untouchably fast.
Now Harden the **** up.
Go Nozh! Don't let the weak sway you from the true path!
You have no clue what youre talking about. Every point you list here is flat wrong. Full speed cant outrun everything. Full gank doesnt cost billions, blasters will be VERY affected. Speed is not just a strategy its a TANK you dont fit reppers, and you count on being able to GTFO before you run out of shield. Its a tank.
Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
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Sylthi
Minmatar Coreward Pan-Galactic
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Posted - 2008.07.31 04:37:00 -
[3387]
Edited by: Sylthi on 31/07/2008 04:44:13
Originally by: Atlanticpyro Edited by: Atlanticpyro on 31/07/2008 03:22:02 Thanks for continuing the silent holocaust of the minmitar. I really just invested years of training Minmatar to become the fastest race to become obsolete ever.
I have to agree with this. Absoultely. I mean, let me count the ways:
Minmatar have some of the worst shield and armor (numbered) tanks in the game. This is greatly offset by a skilled pilot that knows how to use speed as part of their tank.
Despite what everyone claims, I find artillery can be an effective weapon, in PvP and PvE. BUT, for it to be effective you MUST have a speed advantage so you can manage transverse and angular.
Autocannons are a wonderful weapon system. BUT, for them to be effective you have to perform the merge as QUICKLY as possible. To do this, you need, you guessed it, SPEED.
So, if you take speed away from the minmatar, what do they have left? Exactly?
Oh, and on a final note, the base speeds on entire classes of ships haven't been modified in over 4 years. Doing so now is pure insanity. AND: You slow down EVERYONE and EVEYTHING so that by default missiles get a huge boost. So, in turn, you are slowing down missiles. When the F*CK did "nano-nerf" turn into "eve-nerf"?!!? Come on devs!! WAKE UP!! You are changing the entire game to take care of a few (perceived) problem ships and players. Talk about using a broadsword to do the work of a scalpel.....
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Sylthi
Minmatar Coreward Pan-Galactic
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Posted - 2008.07.31 04:37:00 -
[3388]
Edited by: Sylthi on 31/07/2008 04:45:43
Originally by: Atlanticpyro Edited by: Atlanticpyro on 31/07/2008 03:22:02 Thanks for continuing the silent holocaust of the minmitar. I really just invested years of training Minmatar to become the fastest race to become obsolete ever.
I have to agree with this. Absoultely. I mean, let me count the ways:
Minmatar have some of the worst shield and armor (numbered) tanks in the game. This is greatly offset by a skilled pilot that knows how to use speed as part of their tank.
Despite what everyone claims, I find artillery can be an effective weapon, in PvP and PvE. BUT, for it to be effective you MUST have a speed advantage so you can manage transverse and angular.
Autocannons are a wonderful weapon system. BUT, for them to be effective you have to perform the merge as QUICKLY as possible. To do this, you need, you guessed it, SPEED.
So, if you take speed away from the minmatar, what do they have left? Exactly? The need to train another race I suppose....
Oh, and on a final note, the base speeds on entire classes of ships haven't been modified in over 4 years. Doing so now is pure insanity. AND: You slow down EVERYONE and EVEYTHING so that by default missiles get a huge boost. So, in turn, you are slowing down missiles. When the F*CK did "nano-nerf" turn into "eve-nerf"?!!? Come on devs!! WAKE UP!! You are changing the entire game to take care of a few (perceived) problem ships and players. Talk about using a broadsword to do the work of a scalpel.....
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Shagrath Neptune
Series of Tubes
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Posted - 2008.07.31 04:47:00 -
[3389]
Originally by: Atlanticpyro Edited by: Atlanticpyro on 31/07/2008 03:22:02 Thanks for continuing the silent holocaust of the minmitar. I really just invested years of training Minmatar to become the fastest race to become obsolete ever.
EDIT: If they have a leg to stand on, cut it off.
I too have years of Minmater training and never nanoed a single ship except a Vagabond. I have killed people just fine without extreme speed setups with these ships.
Maybe learn how to fly your ships instead of using a broken game mechanic to get by?
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Shagrath Neptune
Series of Tubes
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Posted - 2008.07.31 04:47:00 -
[3390]
Originally by: Atlanticpyro Edited by: Atlanticpyro on 31/07/2008 03:22:02 Thanks for continuing the silent holocaust of the minmitar. I really just invested years of training Minmatar to become the fastest race to become obsolete ever.
EDIT: If they have a leg to stand on, cut it off.
I too have years of Minmater training and never nanoed a single ship except a Vagabond. I have killed people just fine without extreme speed setups with these ships.
Maybe learn how to fly your ships instead of using a broken game mechanic to get by?
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