Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 15 post(s) |
|
CCP Wrangler
|
Posted - 2008.06.19 17:59:00 -
[1]
There's more to Customer Support than answering petitions, even if that's the core of what they do. Find out how it all works and what else they're doing in the new blog, conveninetly named Customer Support.
Wrangler Community Manager CCP Hf, EVE Online Email
"It's not worth doing something unless you are doing something that someone, somewhere, would much rather you weren't doing." |
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2008.06.19 18:20:00 -
[2]
Do GMs only work for one group or do they switch between groups?
Estel Arador corp services (high-sec POS/JCs) just 120M isk! |
Kalissa
D00M.
|
Posted - 2008.06.19 18:31:00 -
[3]
I read the blog with great interest and as I read it these words came to mind "we have examined the logs and can find nothing wrong, we hope you recover from your loss quickly"
I have played Eve now since December 03, when I started to play if something went wrong I petitioned, after 6 months I learnt a bitter lesson and that is 90% of the time you'll hear the above statement. I've seen people lose ships in the same battle yet some get replaced, some dont, just because they were dealt with by a different GM.
You could train monkeys to do a better job. Sorry it's how I feel after 4.5 years of seeing GM's at work.
|
Ranges
Against all Rules Atrum Tempestas Foedus
|
Posted - 2008.06.19 18:44:00 -
[4]
Well, i guess this is a good time to repeat what i say in every petition i write;
Thank you for your time!
(and i mean that) -Ranges
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2008.06.19 18:47:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Kalissa You could train monkeys to do a better job. Sorry it's how I feel after 4.5 years of seeing GM's at work.
Quite insulting; unnecessarily so I think. Especially when everyone and their grandmother is spamming the GMs with reimbursement petitions even if they have no case since this is a bet with no cost and everything to gain. GMs are humans and will make mistakes just like you - that is assuming they made a mistake. You don't have access to all the information they based their decision on (even if that information was lacking, it's still more information than you have).
I think GMs do a great job, I've always been treated fair in my petitions, even though I didn't always get what I wanted.
Estel Arador corp services (high-sec POS/JCs) just 120M isk! |
Paddlefoot Aeon
Neogen Industries Daisho Syndicate
|
Posted - 2008.06.19 20:40:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Paddlefoot Aeon on 19/06/2008 20:41:05 I've been playing for 2.5 years, and on several occasions I've had the chance to deal with GMs for reasons ranging from reimbursement to "stuck" petitions.
The GMs have never been anything but polite and professional, and though not every one of my petitions has been resolved the way I would like, I understand that GMs have to be consistant and fair across thousands of petitions.
I have, on occasion, had issues with the GM petition queue, but that speaks more to player volume or GM staffing than an actual GM.
GMs take holidays and vacations too... they're human after all. If I file a petition and it takes 3 days instead of 1 to get a response, my "beef" isn't with the GM who replies... its with the playerbase for filing so many petitions, or (in rare cases) with the person who is responsible for insuring that there are sufficient numbers of GM staff working that day.
I've worked email customer support before (don't anymore), and it was a ****ty job. Anyone who does this for the long term deserves respect, even if you don't like their decisions.
We may only have to "put up with" 50-100 GMs... but they have to deal with 200k + of us! Now Recruiting. Join "Neogen" channel for details
|
Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.06.19 21:28:00 -
[7]
You don't happen to have a need for some new Gms in Dnsseldorf? (with an "n", dammit!)
Just asking. :)
|
|
GM Zhainius
Game Masters
|
Posted - 2008.06.19 21:31:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Estel Arador Do GMs only work for one group or do they switch between groups?
We are assigned to one group, however this does not mean we can not assist the other groups in their responsibilities. Our main responsibilities will still remain the ones of our own group.
--- GM Zhainius EVE Online Customer Support CCP Games |
|
|
GM Zhainius
Game Masters
|
Posted - 2008.06.19 21:33:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Batolemaeus You don't happen to have a need for some new Gms in Dnsseldorf? (with an "n", dammit!)
Just asking. :)
Keep an eye on the jobs listings here, you never know. --- GM Zhainius EVE Online Customer Support CCP Games |
|
MuffinsRevenger
EmpiresMod Arcane Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.06.19 23:36:00 -
[10]
Completly out of curiosity, is there any statistics on how frequently you use the automated messeges to reply to pettitions compared to writing a answer related to the actually question?
Not to be rude, but it seems as if recently those are the most common ones to get :p
|
|
Mack Dorgeans
Camelot Innovations
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 01:20:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Mack Dorgeans on 20/06/2008 01:23:17
"LED" NOT "LEAD"
This is not meant to be a flame toward the writer of this particular blog, but rather an attempt to point out an extremely common error in CCP news items, blogs, and text in general. In fact, it is so common, I suspect the folks who use the right word are in a somewhat microscopic minority.
No, "led" is not a type of display screen. It is the past tense form of the verb "to lead" and is pronounced the same as the metal "lead."
As a writer and editor by trade, it is sickening to me to see how often this mistake is made on the Internet. I've even started to see it slip into print. EVE and CCP, however, get it wrong more often than any other source I've come across. Granted, the gaming industry in general is notoriously bad at catching grammar and spelling errors, often appearing to leave the task to beta testers and QA, who are NOT editors by trade. Still, it's nothing to brag about when your company is among the worst in a group of sloppy publishers.
Quote: LeadGroup
As each of the aforementioned groups is lead by a Lead GM, we also have a LeadGroup which consists of all the Lead GMs and the director of CCPÆs global customer support. The LeadGroup works closely together on steering the Support Department. They discuss the hiring of new GMs, take care of administrative duties and make cool plans for the future.
Let's try a little exercise, shall we? If the above passage was written with as much disregard for the proper spelling and use of the verb "to lead" as is often shown toward "led," then it would look like the paragraph below.
Quote: LedGroup
As each of the aforementioned groups is led by a Led GM, we also have a LedGroup which consists of all the Led GMs and the director of CCPÆs global customer support. The LedGroup works closely together on steering the Support Department. They discuss the hiring of new GMs, take care of administrative duties and make cool plans for the future.
This, quite clearly, is gibberish.
In all seriousness, does CCP have professional editors (or even just one) who review the text that gets published to the game or to the web-based news and information pages? This one very annoying oversight is far from the only instance of poor spelling or grammar in official EVE-related communications and in-game text. If you don't have a qualified professional or group of professionals capable of fulfilling this role currently on staff, I would strongly advise you to consider hiring someone who IS capable.
I understand that English is not the first language of everyone working at CCP, but that's no excuse if it is the game's official language. Would your Chinese customers be as forgiving if you constantly garbled Chinese grammar? I suspect the Shanghai GM team would tell you otherwise.
Poor grammar and spelling have a way of making the people and organization publishing the text look like idiots. That is especially true of consistently poor grammar and spelling. For your own sake, CCP employees, please stop making yourselves and your company look foolish and stupid.
Next lecture: the proper use of plural and possessive forms, also known as "let me show you where to stick that apostrophe."
|
Typhado3
Ashen Lion Mining and Production Consortium
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 01:32:00 -
[12]
Quote: I read the blog with great interest and as I read it these words came to mind "we have examined the logs and can find nothing wrong, we hope you recover from your loss quickly"
I have played Eve now since December 03, when I started to play if something went wrong I petitioned, after 6 months I learnt a bitter lesson and that is 90% of the time you'll hear the above statement. I've seen people lose ships in the same battle yet some get replaced, some dont, just because they were dealt with by a different GM.
You could train monkeys to do a better job. Sorry it's how I feel after 4.5 years of seeing GM's at work.
I've been playing for 3 years and I have petitioned 5 times in all that time.
maybe you do have a lot of legitamate losses due to bugs but for the most part of what I see in game people just use the petition whenever they lose a ship or if there was any lag at all.
|
Ho HsienKo
Ammatar Free Corps
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 01:42:00 -
[13]
I have a question for the GM Team ; ]
I have made hardly any petitions during my time playing EVE but when I do I always seem to get fast fair and friendly service from whatever GM ends up helping me.
Can you as GM's see how many petitions a player has made during their time in EVE?
Do we each carry a Petition file that can be looked at when a call from us comes in?
|
|
GM Zhainius
Game Masters
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 02:05:00 -
[14]
Originally by: MuffinsRevenger Completly out of curiosity, is there any statistics on how frequently you use the automated messeges to reply to pettitions compared to writing a answer related to the actually question?
There is no such thing as an automated reply, other then the one that is sent by the system acknowledging that we have received an email petition.
While we may sometimes use a standardized reply if we run in to the same issue many times in a row, this in no way implies we have not fully read and investigated the case.
In short, your petition is always looked in to, and then responded to by a GM.
Originally by: Ho HsienKo
Can you as GM's see how many petitions a player has made during their time in EVE?
Do we each carry a Petition file that can be looked at when a call from us comes in?
It is not possible for a petition to be deleted, the only thing that can happen to it, is that it is closed.
As such all petitions remain on record, and are linked to the person that created them.
This also assists us in being able to better respond to issues someone may have already filed a petition about in the past.
--- GM Zhainius EVE Online Customer Support CCP Games |
|
Victor Valka
Kissaki Corporation
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 05:45:00 -
[15]
Demmit. I can't find my "Logs. They show nothing." motivation poster when I need it.
(Sorry. Couldn't deny myself the opportunity. For the record, as someone who does a good bit of customer support myself, I have a great deal of personal and professional respect for the GM team. Users are Hell. Hang in there, guys and gals.)
Originally by: Roxanna Kell You are insane.
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 08:48:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Mack Dorgeans "LED" NOT "LEAD" (...)
I was spelled wrong exactly once. In all other cases 'lead' was used as a noun / part of a noun phrase.
Estel Arador corp services (high-sec POS/JCs) just 120M isk! |
Betagem
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 09:07:00 -
[17]
Mack, please tell me your post is some kind of joke?
|
Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 09:24:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Victor Valka Users are Hell.
That is indeed true. I think, without those damn users, all of this would be much easier!
|
Ethidium Bromide
ZEALOT WARRIORS AGAINST TERRORISTS Curatores Veritatis Alliance
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 10:12:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Mack Dorgeans Edited by: Mack Dorgeans on 20/06/2008 01:23:17
Did you misspell something?
Jesus, if you would have been my English teacher (I'm not a natural speaker) I guess I would have failed.... P.S. you even made me use that 'Shift' key to capitalize! ARGH!
Back to topic: my personal experience with GMs has been a very good one for almost 5 years now. Keep up the good job!
Originally by: George Petsch Nochricht: Dei schwarer StroinlSser trifftn Karli[Baatzis] und ruiniert erm so richtig de Dosn, 1343.7 schhodn, oida.
|
Altaree
Red Frog Investments Blue Sky Consortium
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 10:55:00 -
[20]
Cool. Does the Info Team's responsibilities also include publishing all of the rules that the GMs enforce but aren't current public? Things like "spamming cans at gates is bad." Players only know about that through word of mouth....
Blue Sky |
|
|
GM Zhainius
Game Masters
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 11:03:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Altaree Cool. Does the Info Team's responsibilities also include publishing all of the rules that the GMs enforce but aren't current public? Things like "spamming cans at gates is bad." Players only know about that through word of mouth....
We will try to be as transparent as possible, however we can not divulge all internal policies off course.
With regards to the containers, please refer to article 16 of the terms of service:
"You may not do anything that interferes with the ability of other EVE Online subscribers to enjoy the game or web site in accordance with its rules. This includes, but is not limited to, making inappropriate use of any public channels within the game and/or intentionally creating excessive latency (lag) by dumping cargo containers, corpses or other items in the game world." --- GM Zhainius EVE Online Customer Support CCP Games |
|
Banni Vinda
Kinda'Shujaa
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 11:58:00 -
[22]
Interesting post, and long overdue IMHO :). I think some more transparency like this is especially important in maintaining healthy customer relations (particularly your point about the misconception of volunteers vs professionals).
I'd guess 99% of the petitions I've made have been reporting ISK sellers. So many in fact that I reckon I know the GM names of most of the guys n the 'Law & Order' cell. I know you can't give out details, but do you track how many RMT petitions you get? If so, how has this number changed as the population has increased?
Also, could you give some rough numbers on how many GMs you actually have, compared to the number of players? |
Batolemaeus
Free-Space-Ranger Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 12:09:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Banni Vinda
I'd guess 99% of the petitions I've made have been reporting ISK sellers.
Same here, but i report macroravens in 0.0. Some statistics would be very, very interesting to me.
|
Tarminic
Black Flame Industries
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 14:25:00 -
[24]
Are the GMs also responsible for the ongoing efforts to hunt down and remove macrominers/ISK selling rackets, is this a joint operation between GM's and the developers, or is this handled exclusively by non-GM employees?
In addition, a lot of people are very jaded toward GMs due to the seemingly cut-and-paste responses regarding ship loss. The line "Our logs show that nothing unusual occured" can be very frustrating to a player who lost a ship to (on his end) obvious lag spike. I believe that it would be in the best interests of the GM team to explain exactly what they mean a bit more thoroughly. For example, this response might help calm someone's nerves:
"Hi (playername), I'm sorry to say that we cannot reimburse your ship loss, regardless of the lag you experienced. It is against GM policy to reimburse lag-related losses except in extreme cases such as a confirmed crash of the server node you were on at the time."
I think that a little more clarity in your initial responses would help soothe the tempers of angry players a little and also lighten the workload on GMs as you have fewer cases of escalated petitions and GMs having to return to petitions to explain themselves. ---------------- Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.81 (Updated 4/8) |
Mack Dorgeans
Camelot Innovations
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 14:40:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Estel Arador
Originally by: Mack Dorgeans "LED" NOT "LEAD" (...)
I was spelled wrong exactly once. In all other cases 'lead' was used as a noun / part of a noun phrase.
Yes, it was wrong once in this particular blog. As I pointed out, this is a very common mistake, and I think CCP should do a better job of editing what they publish. I was trying to make a point that I feel is much more important than many posts that players make on this forum.
Originally by: Ethidium Bromide
Originally by: Mack Dorgeans Edited by: Mack Dorgeans on 20/06/2008 01:23:17
Did you misspell something?
Jesus, if you would have been my English teacher (I'm not a natural speaker) I guess I would have failed.... P.S. you even made me use that 'Shift' key to capitalize! ARGH!
Back to topic: my personal experience with GMs has been a very good one for almost 5 years now. Keep up the good job!
In fact, I made a couple of edits immediately after posting. First, I had to remove some tags that the forum did not recognize as valid (text size), and then I had to alter a sentence where I had left out a word. I never claim to be perfect, but at least I can edit my own writing. CCP apparently does not have professional editors, or they don't use them in all situations, because clearly they don't catch even the simplest mistakes. I suspect most "editing" that happens before they publish something is limited to running spell check.
It may not seem important to anyone else, but personally I think CCP should strive for higher standards than your average semi-literate forum poster.
|
kahless stovokor
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 14:53:00 -
[26]
What is with ALL of the server disconnects ?? I had 6 in one day, the same day I downloaded your latest volanteer patch, is the patch the problem? If so please fix it. I have never seen this many problems in 3 years of playing. Is it because of the Emp download? Please address the issue, I am not the only one, people all over were complaining in various channels yesterday.It makes playing totally impossible, if you try to run a lev 4 mission and have rats and your drones out and lose connection, you prob will have lost your T2 drones by the time you can get back in, if not also your ship with all your T2 and faction mods.
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 15:09:00 -
[27]
Originally by: kahless stovokor What is with ALL of the server disconnects ??
There was a network problem with a couple of U.S. ISPs.
Originally by: kahless stovokor I had 6 in one day, the same day I downloaded your latest volanteer patch, is the patch the problem? If so please fix it.
It's not the problem, it has nothing to do with it. Correlation is not equal to causation.
Originally by: kahless stovokor I have never seen this many problems in 3 years of playing. Is it because of the Emp download?
It's not the problem, it has nothing to do with it. Correlation is not equal to causation.
Originally by: kahless stovokor Please address the issue
The ISPs are aware of the issues and they have been working on it.
Estel Arador corp services (high-sec POS/JCs) just 120M isk! |
|
GM Guard
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 15:40:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Banni Vinda Interesting post, and long overdue IMHO :). I think some more transparency like this is especially important in maintaining healthy customer relations (particularly your point about the misconception of volunteers vs professionals).
I'd guess 99% of the petitions I've made have been reporting ISK sellers. So many in fact that I reckon I know the GM names of most of the guys n the 'Law & Order' cell. I know you can't give out details, but do you track how many RMT petitions you get? If so, how has this number changed as the population has increased?
Also, could you give some rough numbers on how many GMs you actually have, compared to the number of players?
I couldn't tell your for sure how many RMT reports we get exactly. ISK farmers are often reported alongside other matters that players need to discuss with us and so forth. The number of ISK farmer reports we get from time to time is however fairly steady. The largest number of RMT reports have to do with ISK spammers but people also report farmers and it is common for a few players to report the same farmer.
Regarding the GM/Player ratio, we have approximately 1 gm per 4300 accounts.
|
|
|
GM Guard
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 16:10:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Tarminic Are the GMs also responsible for the ongoing efforts to hunt down and remove macrominers/ISK selling rackets, is this a joint operation between GM's and the developers, or is this handled exclusively by non-GM employees?
In addition, a lot of people are very jaded toward GMs due to the seemingly cut-and-paste responses regarding ship loss. The line "Our logs show that nothing unusual occured" can be very frustrating to a player who lost a ship to (on his end) obvious lag spike. I believe that it would be in the best interests of the GM team to explain exactly what they mean a bit more thoroughly. For example, this response might help calm someone's nerves:
"Hi (playername), I'm sorry to say that we cannot reimburse your ship loss, regardless of the lag you experienced. It is against GM policy to reimburse lag-related losses except in extreme cases such as a confirmed crash of the server node you were on at the time."
I think that a little more clarity in your initial responses would help soothe the tempers of angry players a little and also lighten the workload on GMs as you have fewer cases of escalated petitions and GMs having to return to petitions to explain themselves.
Our anti RMT actions are a joint effort between GMs, Game designers, Database staff, and Programmers. The Law&Order group manages our part of the work and obtains help from other GM groups if needed. The GM Team handles most of the ground work and as a result, a lot of the ideas for new tools and designs to counter RMT have come from us although we have left the programming to others (fortunately).
Regarding standard replies, you are correct that they are used quite often to respond to reimbursement petitions. That is simply due to the fact that a large number of them are similar in nature and it therefore makes sense to spend more time on investigating the issues at hand than typing somewhat similar replies repeatedly. Standard replies save us a lot of valuable time which is why we use them. We do however have strong objections to excessive or inappropriate use of standard replies as we know full well that they are only applicable in certain scenarios. If a player wants more details, we are happy to explain our decision in as much detail as possible. We will however never be able to reveal much of the details about how exactly our logs work for security reasons.
Keep in mind that even if you receive a standard reply to your reimbursement petition, the GM in question will have spent some amount of time going through a checklist of various log items and server reports with the intent of verifying your claimand trying to find a reason to reimburse you. All within the boundaries of our reimbursement policy of course.
|
|
|
GM Guard
|
Posted - 2008.06.20 16:12:00 -
[30]
Originally by: kahless stovokor What is with ALL of the server disconnects ?? I had 6 in one day, the same day I downloaded your latest volanteer patch, is the patch the problem? If so please fix it. I have never seen this many problems in 3 years of playing. Is it because of the Emp download? Please address the issue, I am not the only one, people all over were complaining in various channels yesterday.It makes playing totally impossible, if you try to run a lev 4 mission and have rats and your drones out and lose connection, you prob will have lost your T2 drones by the time you can get back in, if not also your ship with all your T2 and faction mods.
Estel Arador explained the likely cause of this issue before I got around to it (thanks Estel) but if you are still having problems I urge you to file a petition so our technical experts can go through the matter with you.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |