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Zurrar
Epiphyte Mining and Exploration
Combined Planetary Union
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Posted - 2008.05.22 14:35:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Christari Zuborov
Edited by: Christari Zuborov on 22/05/2008 05:06:04
Nano Ishtars don't do 5.5k.
Nano Ishtars with max skills might do close to 3.5-3.7k.
Nano Ishtars with max skills and some implants can do upwards of 4.5k
Nano Ishtars with max skills, implants, gang bonuses might do 5.2k
Nano Ishtars with max skills, implants, gang bonuses, and command ship bonuses can go 6.5k and beyond depending on the ammount of ISK spent, and of course let's not forget there's three players vs. you (Inty, Command Ship, and Ishtar). So you really have to ask yourself, just how many experienced players determined to kill you should you be able to take on, defeat, or retreat from? Would it be fair to them?
There's a lot involved there. A single Ishtar is not going to kill a BS, unless you're not carrying a Neut, because you can simply warp away. An Ishtar and an Inty, is a deadly combination to a single BS. When two people gang up on one, there's a very good chance you're going to die, unless you're at a gate, you just jump out.
If you're in a belt ratting, well... you're in deep crap at this point. You have a gang, using ships designed for skirmish warfare, vs. a ship that's designed for sieging or fleet warfare. You've missed your opportunity to leave when they entered local, and you have no backup. It's your achilles heel, you have no reinforcements, and you should know that you're going to die at this point.
You learn your lesson, you plan more carefully in your fittings, pay more attention to who's around, and make sure you have friends around to save each others arses.
Of course you can continue to be a nub if you choose not to follow the advice above.
[Edit:]
As for whether or not nano ships should be capped in speed, or should be nerfed, or any of that type of talk; fly one first, do combat with one, and learn your enemy instead of being ingorant to it.
A nano anything is a pretty weak opponent, especially in a drone boat. Once you've understood the game mechanics through experience, you'll realize there's a counter to everything, so long as you have the right tools. The right tools would include ships, mods, drones, missile types, anything in the long list of skills and equipment available - including a good smartbomb fitted.
A good skilled Raven pilot can single salvo drones, and each drone is 1/5th the total damage done. Two drones killed and you've reduced damage taken by 2/5th's, or nearly 50% and it takes a while for a fresh drone to enter combat if the Ishtar is 40k out.
i seen 2 in wildlands that were doing 5.5km/s day before yesterday...
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Nyphur
Pillowsoft
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Posted - 2008.05.22 14:56:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Nyphur on 22/05/2008 14:56:48
Originally by: Zurrar
i seen 2 in wildlands that were doing 5.5km/s day before yesterday...
Using a full set of implants, tech 2 rigs and a deadspace MWD, the ishtar tops out at over 10km/sec BEFORE gang bonuses and before overloading the MWD. A real setup will be much slower but their maximum speed can definitely exceed 10km/sec.
Zurrar, I support your suggestion to alter webs but not how you've altered them. You may not know this but when you web someone, it actually decreases their agility so they turn slower. A side-effect is that their decelleration rate is cut dramatically with multiple webs applied, so in extreme cases like HACs going over 10-15km/sec, the large number of webs required to cut their top speed down actually helps them escape out the other side of web range by nuking their agility. A competant pilot won't enter someone's web range without building up some momentum first, making webs essentially useless regardless of the percentage decrease in maximum speed.
What I believe we need are scripts that allow us to add the effect of say +75% agility to the web at the cost of 25% of its range. Then we could get long range webs (20km) which have only 50% speed reduction. This means that two agility-scripted long range webs (15km range) will reduce the enemy's top speed to 25% of what it was but also increase his agility by 206% (100*1.75*1.75 = 306 - 100 = 206) rather than dropping it. He will only be dropped to 25% of his top speed but will decellerate much faster toward it. The actual numbers should be played with and tested but I think the theory is sound. You'd still need 2-3 webs to stop a nano vagabond with a fast tackler and 4-5 to stop him with anything bigger, which sets the upper bound on the size of enemy gang that he will be safe from.
This solution re-positions ships like the vagabond and nano-ishtar into the hit-and-run role where they attack small targets of opportunity without making them able to engage and retreat from larger gangs whenever they want. It doesn't remove the effectiveness of nano-ships in their intended roles but introduces a viable countermaneuver that can be executed by a force of equal or greater size.
Eve-Tanking.com - We're sorry, something happened. |
Jalmari Huitsikko
Karjala Inc.
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Posted - 2008.05.22 15:32:00 -
[33]
Nerf polycarbons. Because their bonuses are not in line with other rigs... Increase mass for drone ships. (Makes sense uh?)
remove/fix implants stacking with each other and ship modules so you cant have cruiser going much faster than i.e. assault frigate.
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Matrixcvd
Rionnag Alba
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Posted - 2008.05.22 16:51:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Zurrar
The generic answer, not everyone flys those ships or has plans to fly them. I will not skill a 30 day skill to fly a rapier, then how ever long for nav skills, then gunnery skills. Why not try to contribute instead of troll, instead of reading the title and not the post. Here ill fix the title to a broader one.
why not fix this
why not fix webs
why not fix low slot mods
why not make it so 1 mil sp guys can do what 40 mil sp guys can do
why not give me a tissue
there is a reason why nothing has really happened even tho the whining has continued. because there is nothing wrong with nano
if you can't read the forums and listen to the advice of players who PVP its clear you will fail, regardless of whether its nano or not.
Just cause you don't feel like skilling, training or learning how to play the game the way it is in the current iteration, then you will just die alot. Game takes effort, not RL RP and your vision of how EVE should be
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Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers
Black Hand.
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Posted - 2008.05.23 01:01:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Jalmari Huitsikko
Nerf polycarbons. Because their bonuses are not in line with other rigs... Increase mass for drone ships. (Makes sense uh?)
remove/fix implants stacking with each other and ship modules so you cant have cruiser going much faster than i.e. assault frigate.
They are also 60 mil each.
Black Hand.
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Wannabehero
Absolutely No Retreat
Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.05.23 01:40:00 -
[36]
I believe the solution is simple.
Range vs. strength scripts for webs
90% slowdown at 10km
70% at 20km
50% at 30km
Something like that.
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Don't harsh my mellow |
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