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Hanilein
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Posted - 2004.04.30 09:28:00 -
[1]
So, CCP, make up your mind:
Nowadays more and more gatecampers are killing indies in empire space. Either you give the attacked the opportunity to strike back or you stop that killing.
ATM there is _no_ way to stop the pirates - they're using cheap alts and cheap ships.
I want to build a convoy with my mates to protect them and send those pirates to hell - but as in RL - the polices protects (nearly always) the bad guys.
CCP, give us gangs in which the player can protect each other!
________________________________________________ Balancing doesn't mean to equal every fitting, it means giving everybody the chance to encounter a fitting.
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Bsport
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:09:00 -
[2]
yer if your ganged and in close range of each other. if a pirate tagets any gang members, each ship in the gang auto targets that ship. that would scare them --------
|~~~| I run out of money, so bunny has been | OIL | grounded down to make grease for my |____| rifter- poor bunny
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ClarCE
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:22:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Hanilein So, CCP, make up your mind:
Nowadays more and more gatecampers are killing indies in empire space. Either you give the attacked the opportunity to strike back or you stop that killing.
ATM there is _no_ way to stop the pirates - they're using cheap alts and cheap ships.
I want to build a convoy with my mates to protect them and send those pirates to hell - but as in RL - the polices protects (nearly always) the bad guys.
CCP, give us gangs in which the player can protect each other!
Some options for gangs and convoys would be nice, especially as it is not an exploit to sensor dampen the sentry guns, or so I heard. It does seem a little one sided, and I saw a good comment by someone the other day, saying that Pirates camping gate in empire = strip mining veld in 1.0.
--'The Way is Shut'--
----------------------- Jenny...Get to the Chopper---Stick Around -----------------------
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Bonnie Parker
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:29:00 -
[4]
Anyone who fires upon you in any sec space should be fair game for yourself, fellow corp mates, and gang members, for a set period of time (say 10 minutes).
That way corps can actually escort their haulers through empire space safe in the knowledge that they can actually DEFEND them without insta-gank NPC's ruining that aspect of the game.
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Aelius
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:34:00 -
[5]
Ending all alts or applying huge deletion times will fix the problem. Selling Raven BPC ME20 3M at Yulai 1st Station |
Bonnie Parker
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:36:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Aelius Ending all alts or applying huge deletion times will fix the problem.
And create bigger problems as a consequence.
Try again.
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Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.04.30 10:38:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Lao Tzu on 30/04/2004 10:39:39
Quote: Ending all alts or applying huge deletion times will fix the problem
A couple of weeks to delete an alt might do it, there's no good reason I can think of to need to delete alts often. Noob who screws up all his starting characters could always petion to have one removed.
edit: maybe a month, two weeks still leaves one alt a week and a main.
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Alexander Rahl
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Posted - 2004.04.30 11:23:00 -
[8]
This is a major nuisance and until ccp allow corp mates to assist in battles like this then it will remain a nuisance, but, the way around it is to have a BS escort when hauling valuables with sh transferers fitted so even a missile spam would have no chance of hurting the haulers ship.
Or just make insta jumps for common journeys.
----/ / /-----<[]>-----\ \ \---- Head of House Rahl Warleader of the Rahl Clans
"Death and Glory, Honour with Courage, Fury and Vengeance" - Chronicles of Rahl. |
Adriana
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Posted - 2004.04.30 11:30:00 -
[9]
Battles? Um, it's not a battle, it's one kestral x 4 cruise missiles = dead indi.
The problem is that a tiny little frigate can use great big battleship missiles.
NERF THEM!!!
or give industrials more hps to be able to withstand a single barrage from these ass clowns.
I know criminal flagging is supposed to occur...implement it already. make it so people can blow up the guy standing by in the hauler to loot your stuff after concord blows up the kestral atl in his disposable ship.
Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake. -Napoleon Bonaparte |
lash
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Posted - 2004.04.30 11:34:00 -
[10]
i think just giving indys more base hp would solve this problem and make everyone happy. People will get to keep their cruise missiles on their frigates, and indy pilots will get a very nice upgrade to a ship with paper thin armor as it is.
-------------- "You ever hear of the Seattle Seven? That was me. And, um, six other guys." |
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McWatt
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Posted - 2004.04.30 11:40:00 -
[11]
Edited by: McWatt on 30/04/2004 11:42:07 excuse me guys, but are you nuts?
i ve seldom read so much bull**** from so many ppl in so few posts!
high sec still not safe enough for you?
you can t be bothered to transport expensive stuff with another ship but your indy?
too complicated to stay at the computer and strap some equipment on your ship?
sorry, but loosers deserve to die!
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Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.04.30 11:56:00 -
[12]
btw: my post was aout me not liking alts, most idustrials can be equiped to resist a cruise volley from a kestrel.
You know the kessies are out there, you should know that it's not considered an exploit by CCP, so fit so goddamm sheild modules, armour get some ECM bursts, anything, other than bigcargo and go faster gear.
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Archemedes
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:31:00 -
[13]
Considering my interceptor can (depending on the type of missile) potentially survive 4 cruises (it's an armor tanked Taranis blaster boat), I'm quite certain an Iteron 5 or Badger 2 could easily be rigged to survive a cruise missile attack. A couple 200mm armor plates and an armor explosive hardener would make you a VERY tough nut to c r a c k...
Still, there does need to be something done about throw-away alt pirates. Hopefully the criminal flagging that's being added will do the job, since at least then the character scooping the loot is also at risk (and the cops are RIGHT THERE since they just swatted the Kestrel )
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Amox
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:39:00 -
[14]
Originally by: McWatt Edited by: McWatt on 30/04/2004 11:42:07 excuse me guys, but are you nuts?
i ve seldom read so much bull**** from so many ppl in so few posts!
high sec still not safe enough for you?
you can t be bothered to transport expensive stuff with another ship but your indy?
too complicated to stay at the computer and strap some equipment on your ship?
sorry, but loosers deserve to die!
Its not about being safe. Its about being able to defend yourself as well as your corpmates without concord killing you. The use of kestrel's to kill cargo ships is a risk free way to make isk. How can you defend that?
Your Tachyon Beam Laser I perfectly strikes Blood Oracle, wrecking for 722.3 damage. |
Javren Dei
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:41:00 -
[15]
I hope the DEVS enable criminal flagging to solve this particular problem instead of some uber-nerf. The game does need risk - even in "safe" areas but it also need consequences. Criminal flagging will allow the victim (and corp mates) of such attacks to fight back and defend themselves for a short period of time instead of Concord teleporting in and blasting everyone, good or bad.
I think this is how the 'problem' of ore theives is going to be solved, so why not extend it to high-sec aggressors?
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Bad Harlequin
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:45:00 -
[16]
Keep it civil please! -Zhuge Liang
You are in a maze of twisty little asteroids, all alike. |
Bad Harlequin
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:52:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Amox
Originally by: McWatt Edited by: McWatt on 30/04/2004 11:42:07 excuse me guys, but are you nuts?
i ve seldom read so much bull**** from so many ppl in so few posts!
high sec still not safe enough for you?
you can t be bothered to transport expensive stuff with another ship but your indy?
too complicated to stay at the computer and strap some equipment on your ship?
sorry, but loosers deserve to die!
Its not about being safe. Its about being able to defend yourself as well as your corpmates without concord killing you. The use of kestrel's to kill cargo ships is a risk free way to make isk. How can you defend that?
it IS about being safe, tho. The kessie pilot's assets are perfectly safe, as is the indy friend of his coming to loot you, or say the 3-5 support ships shield transferring to the sentry-tanking BS. All these carebear "pirate" gankers are perfectly safe - the pilot essentially pays few hundred k isk fee to be able to gank indy pilots under CONCORD's nose.
And all the ganker cheerleaders talking about shield transfer units and armor plating and... are you nuts? New players start with 15,000 skillpoints, or thereabouts. Every mod you name requires SKILLS, and oft as not the weird ones require skills to even TRAIN the right skills... what you are describing is everyone must follow the same combat-oriented skill path, whether they're in 0.0 or 1.0, miner or fighter, to say nothing about how enthusasitc ANY paying player should have to be to devoting a few weeks to months of their paid time to training skills for the sole purpose of allowing these griefers to continue their lazy, 100% safe carebear ganking existance.
Shyeah okay sure. And from now on in order to fight effectively in 0.0 you must train Deep Core Mining to 5 and have ALL the research skills at max and do 5 agent missions a day.
You are in a maze of twisty little asteroids, all alike. |
Xavier Arron
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Posted - 2004.04.30 12:56:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Javren Dei I hope the DEVS enable criminal flagging to solve this particular problem instead of some uber-nerf. The game does need risk - even in "safe" areas but it also need consequences. Criminal flagging will allow the victim (and corp mates) of such attacks to fight back and defend themselves for a short period of time instead of Concord teleporting in and blasting everyone, good or bad.
I think this is how the 'problem' of ore thieves is going to be solved, so why not extend it to high-sec aggressors?
I agree, its crap atm that u cant fight back, even in 0.4>, due to peeps warping away to gates as soon as u turn up. If u attack a corp / gang member the corp /gang should be able to chase u down for at least the next hour (should be 24 imo).
Could even make it so criminal flagging will let any aggressor be ganked by locals for 15 mins, so heroic local peeps could come and help if they wanted to. Basically peeps should be able to police themselves.
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Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:11:00 -
[19]
I can't see how crimainal flagging is going to change the suicide kessie 'rats, as they die to concord instantly, maybe you can hit the pod which will cost them a little more.
Sheild tanking at low sec. gates may change as people might get a chance to take out the support ships.
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cashman
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:20:00 -
[20]
Edited by: cashman on 30/04/2004 14:00:19
No flaming please -Zhuge Liang
You call that flaming? Why don't you go "work" the Crime and Punishement-room then.
McWatt: You're nothing but a carebear-pirate. Your oppinion is nothing but a pro-pirate view. All these alt-exploits (alt-war, alt-scouting, alt-pirating, ect) are only growing at the time, and its getting dumber and dumber.
____________________________________
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Ezra Vouland
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:20:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Ezra Vouland on 30/04/2004 13:23:22 "PVP is not ruining EVE. Piracy is. Ganking the helpless is. Pointless violence and vandalism is." vanBuskirk"
WTF.....
If this game is ever going to be a real immersion into a false reality then this crap has to stop...
If I kicked yer butt and stole yer lunch money there would be nothing you could do in real life. You could get the cops its a possibility. Just as its possible for concord to come gank the people who do combat in empire.
LIFE IS NOT FAIR... That is what makes all of us humans thrive so well and what defines this game.If everything was fair who the heck would wann play? You wouldn't be able to make money, be more powerful, and have fun.
If some d00d kills you in empire, suck it up, get enough skill points to do something about it, use an agent to find them in 0.0, and then proceed to seek revenge.
Stop EVE Communism
They call me trash... TrashGUY |
Bad Harlequin
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:23:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Ezra Vouland "PVP is not ruining EVE. Piracy is. Ganking the helpless is. Pointless violence and vandalism is." vanBuskirk"
WTF.....
If this game is ever going to be a real immersion into a false reality then this crap has to stop...
If I kicked yer butt and stole yer lunch money there would be nothing you could do in real life. You could get the cops its a possibility. Just as its possible for concord to come gank the people who do combat in empire.
LIFE IS NOT FAIR... That is what makes all of us humans thrive so well and what defines this game.If everything was fair who the heck would wann play? You wouldn't be able to make money, be more powerful, and have fun.
If some d00d kills you in empire, suck it up, get enough skill points to do something about it, use an agent to find them in 0.0, and then proceed to seek revenge.
Stop EVE Communism
i was wondering where bill o'reilly went
You are in a maze of twisty little asteroids, all alike. |
Ezra Vouland
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:26:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Bad Harlequin I was wondering where bill o'reilly went
Who is that
They call me trash... TrashGUY |
Maidel
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:31:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Ezra Vouland Edited by: Ezra Vouland on 30/04/2004 13:23:22 If some d00d kills you in empire, suck it up, get enough skill points to do something about it, use an agent to find them in 0.0, and then proceed to seek revenge.
Stop EVE Communism
No i think u are missing the point entirely - these ppl never go to 0.0 they are alts - when there sec rating gets too low they are simply recycled and replaced by a new one. the persons main character never gets affected, they are never even implicated they just collect a nice amount of money every time this happens. pirating in 0.0-0.4 is GOOD for the game, makes it fun, more risky and makes me think twice about how to go there and in what ship and is it really nessessary etc. Pritating in 1.0-0.5 is wrong because the pirate looses nothing but a 200k ship and he gains LOTS. PS if u can pirate in 1.0-0.5 WITHOUT using missile spaming alts - then more power to u and i think that is great (unless ur exploiting)
'Your Tachyon Beam Laser I perfectly strikes Sansha's Ravager, wrecking for 554.6 damage. - they do work occationally' |
Daald
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:53:00 -
[25]
Quote:
If I kicked yer butt and stole yer lunch money there would be nothing you could do in real life. You could get the cops its a possibility. Just as its possible for concord to come gank the people who do combat in empire.
If you killed somebody in front of the police, will the police allow your buddies to rob me? No they will not. They will declare it a crime scene and consfiscate everything. This game should allow for something to that effect in order to make it more realistic as you say. |
Zeltan Shadowhawk
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Posted - 2004.04.30 13:53:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Zeltan Shadowhawk on 30/04/2004 14:02:35 I agree Amox.
Unfortunately there are ass clowns in game that exploit this bad design to their advantage, then call you a loser for complaining about it. Yes, McWatt, the word is loser, not looser.
Loose: Not fastened, restrained, or contained Lose: To be unsuccessful in retaining possession of; mislay
Try a little less flaming and a little more time proofreading.
It's completely lame to design a game this way. How realistic is it that someone would be carrying valuable cargo with a good armed escort, just to have someone attack the hauler and expect the escort to just watch?
People didn't say remove the risk. Oh no. They asked that the risk be UPPED. The huge reward the pirates in 0.5 to 1.0 space get is not matched with a risk factor to the pirate. You lamers that use this alt tactic want no risk and all the reward. The folks you're griefing are the ones taking the risk.
Nice try though. Come back and try again when you have thought things through fully... or when all the folks with at least half a brain and a sense of what's "reasonable" have left the game so no one is around to point out your mental deficiencies.
Originally by: Amox
Originally by: McWatt Edited by: McWatt on 30/04/2004 11:42:07 excuse me guys, but are you nuts?
i ve seldom read so much bull**** from so many ppl in so few posts!
high sec still not safe enough for you?
you can t be bothered to transport expensive stuff with another ship but your indy?
too complicated to stay at the computer and strap some equipment on your ship?
sorry, but loosers deserve to die!
Its not about being safe. Its about being able to defend yourself as well as your corpmates without concord killing you. The use of kestrel's to kill cargo ships is a risk free way to make isk. How can you defend that?
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Darmed Khan
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Posted - 2004.04.30 14:25:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Daald If you killed somebody in front of the police, will the police allow your buddies to rob me? No they will not. They will declare it a crime scene and consfiscate everything. This game should allow for something to that effect in order to make it more realistic as you say.
Sounds like a good idea to me!
Either that or modify the sentry guns so that they shoot down the missiles of the agressor.
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Mitchello
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Posted - 2004.04.30 14:41:00 -
[28]
Originally by: ClarCE
Originally by: Hanilein So, CCP, make up your mind:
Nowadays more and more gatecampers are killing indies in empire space. Either you give the attacked the opportunity to strike back or you stop that killing.
ATM there is _no_ way to stop the pirates - they're using cheap alts and cheap ships.
I want to build a convoy with my mates to protect them and send those pirates to hell - but as in RL - the polices protects (nearly always) the bad guys.
CCP, give us gangs in which the player can protect each other!
Some options for gangs and convoys would be nice, especially as it is not an exploit to sensor dampen the sentry guns, or so I heard. It does seem a little one sided, and I saw a good comment by someone the other day, saying that Pirates camping gate in empire = strip mining veld in 1.0.
actually so Far I've had the GMs tell me it isn't possible, so there is no exploit beucase no one can sensor dampen the sentry guns...accept I've seen it done...but then the GMs are always right...but then I've actaully seen it done...
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Raeff
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Posted - 2004.04.30 14:41:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Raeff on 30/04/2004 14:45:42
Originally by: Ezra Vouland Edited by: Ezra Vouland on 30/04/2004 13:23:22 "PVP is not ruining EVE. Piracy is. Ganking the helpless is. Pointless violence and vandalism is." vanBuskirk"
WTF.....
If this game is ever going to be a real immersion into a false reality then this crap has to stop...
If I kicked yer butt and stole yer lunch money there would be nothing you could do in real life. You could get the cops its a possibility. Just as its possible for concord to come gank the people who do combat in empire.
LIFE IS NOT FAIR... That is what makes all of us humans thrive so well and what defines this game.If everything was fair who the heck would wann play? You wouldn't be able to make money, be more powerful, and have fun.
If some d00d kills you in empire, suck it up, get enough skill points to do something about it, use an agent to find them in 0.0, and then proceed to seek revenge.
Stop EVE Communism
kinda makes ya wonder if some people dont think before they post .. nothing personal but your not making any sense .. all these posts about this topic are about all we want to do is be able to defend ourselves from an obvious game mechanics bug .. can it not be any clearer? i dont know how many times we have tried to explain it but people still seem to get "we wanna fly afk without any trouble from point A to B" when we are trying to say "we want to be able to defend ourselves from a game bug" .. do i have to type it in 14 other languages as well? maybe backwards and upside down? I pvp quite a bit, but i also mine to pay for ships and insure them and i haul that ore around to sell it(NEVER AFK) i dont want my minerals ripped out of my hand because of a game bug, i wanna be able to put up a fight or have escort ships that can actually defend me, but guess what, I CAN NOT
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Armin Chamberlain
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Posted - 2004.04.30 14:49:00 -
[30]
Give it up, some people are just too simple minded to understand the problem. Some of them, like McWatt just want to continue using this exploit, yeah I said it McWatt. |
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