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Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:29:00 -
[151] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote: The original point still stands, Subcaps can volley a logi that is moving, how is that in some way different from a Titan doing it?
this might be the dumbest supercap post ever we have reached peak grath it's all downhill from here |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
425
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:29:00 -
[152] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Grath Telkin wrote:That might be true, but that was a long time ago, the only thing that toppled most of those empires was age, the driving forces behind those alliances got bored and went AFK, that is not a viable counter to the blob, time should not be the answer to beating an empire, the act of watching it crumble from within.
A new alliance shouldn't be forced to wait in Deklien for Goons to go AFK enough to be beaten, there should be weapons at their disposal to deal with a group that thinks spamming 1000 drakes is the answer to a fight.
Currently, those weapons exist, and they exist with the a counter that is cheaply available to just about any person in the game with the skills to fly one.
2 days in an incursion fleet and you have bought, paid for, and insured a dreadnaught. Gather up 70 of these, and suddenly you have something that will literally insta gib a titan, gather 150, and not only will you kill one titan, you'll kill most on field that aren't smart enough to get the hell out of dodge, any more than that and suddenly you're looking at a **** the likes of which the game has never seen.
All that from 2 days worth of effort, 3 if you wanted to pay for 2 months of game time plexes after you buy a dread.
It doesn't take a rich alliance to make this happen, it just takes an alliance wanting it to happen, and then doing it At least 15 of them will vanish in the first doomsday volly. Then the titans will bring about their turret firepower and tear them apart. The dreads will score one, maby two titan kills before they are obliterated themselves. Two titan losses is nothing for the likes of PL or the CFC. And I am not talking about when those alliances of old folded, I mean all of the fights they lost in their history.
I think you should look at the numbers, the real actual numbers again. 70 dreads has a hell of a volley, easily killing a tracking fit titan in nearly one volley, 2 finishes it off.
Also exactly 2 tank mods shields a dread from dying to a DD, so to lose 15, you'd need to get hit by 30 DD's fired in the exact right order, you're more likely to lose either A) None since the SOP is to fire DD's randomly at caps or B) 5-10 at most if they were smart enough to double up on targets.
I'm not making any of this up, its actually all in the math, if you wanted to look its there.
Titan balls haven't been countered yet because nobody has actively tried.
EVE has a hard coded habbit of crying nerf first and then later its discovered that people don't need a nerf, just a little forethought.
Examples are, when we first put Ahacs on the map, people were crying that the logis were too strong, that they needed nerfing, later it turned out that Ahacs are actually terrible and easily countered by themselves.
When we rolled out the tengu fleet, the same thing, tengus were fairly strong. Now that everybody and their brother has a Tengu fleet up the counters are beyond obvious.
The same will be said about the titan ball. Right now their only showing up from 3-4 alliances, the other that could field them (AAA) won't, for obvious reasons (they have a lot, but we have more, and ours are probably better at flying the ship in combat than theirs are). Goons and the CFC are making a massive push to get people into titans right now, their industry is literally churning them out and an amazing speed, as well as dreads. As the number of alliances with titan fleets increases, the counters will become more obvious as they are used by other people in the game that already thought of them, and planned for their use.
Our dread fleets, let me show them to you.
|
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:30:00 -
[153] - Quote
an interceptor can mwd out of a bubble why can't a titan do it
a carrier can launch warrior iis why can't a titan do it
a stealth bomber can launch aoe bombs why can't a titan do it
band of brothers 2012: "a titan should be able to do anything any other ship can" |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:31:00 -
[154] - Quote
i also enjoy grath's counter to a titan blob supported by heavy capital-sized reps from a SC fleet is a ship that can't receive remote reps |
Tore Vest
265
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:33:00 -
[155] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:
Because blobs of subcaps have never been unbeatable. If you knew your history you would know this.
No ships are unbeatable bro.... you should know this
A real highsec carebear. |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
425
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:34:00 -
[156] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:Grath Telkin wrote: I think you may be mentally ********, and are thinking of the patch that nerfed the portal doomsday, meaning titans had to leave the force field to fire their dd's, and couldn't do it through cyno's anymore.
Titans have literally always been tacklable.
The thing that made Molle tacklable was having to leave the force field, and nothing more.
what a suprise grath telkin, one of the least knowledgable people about supercaps on eve-o, does not know what he is talking about: Quote:Warp bubbles and interdiction spheres now prevent all ships from jumping, including Titans and Motherships. http://community.eveonline.com/updates/patchnotes.asp?newpatchlogID=2802i would say "boom headshot" but really it's like shooting a toddler
If you said 'boom headshot', you'd look more ********, that patch was well after Molle's first titan had died, in bubbles.
Unless you're insinuating that Titans and Motherships couldn't be tackled until Heat was released in EVE, and jump bridges were introduced.
Comon Weaselior, tell me thats what you're saying, and you're not just reading your own stupidity into that post that had a note added for clarity. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:36:00 -
[157] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote:Weaselior wrote:Grath Telkin wrote: I think you may be mentally ********, and are thinking of the patch that nerfed the portal doomsday, meaning titans had to leave the force field to fire their dd's, and couldn't do it through cyno's anymore.
Titans have literally always been tacklable.
The thing that made Molle tacklable was having to leave the force field, and nothing more.
what a suprise grath telkin, one of the least knowledgable people about supercaps on eve-o, does not know what he is talking about: Quote:Warp bubbles and interdiction spheres now prevent all ships from jumping, including Titans and Motherships. http://community.eveonline.com/updates/patchnotes.asp?newpatchlogID=2802i would say "boom headshot" but really it's like shooting a toddler If you said 'boom headshot', you'd look more ********, that patch was well after Molle's first titan had died, in bubbles. Unless you're insinuating that Titans and Motherships couldn't be tackled until Heat was released in EVE, and jump bridges were introduced. Comon Weaselior, tell me thats what you're saying, and you're not just reading your own stupidity into that post that had a note added for clarity.
ahahahahahaha quoting this for posterity
|
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
425
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:38:00 -
[158] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:
ahahahahahaha quoting this for posterity
I'll take that as a yes, you heard it here first folks, Weaselior says titans couldn't be tackled at all until Heat and Jumpbridges were released in EVE.
|
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:39:00 -
[159] - Quote
grath given that i have already dragged you to the 0wnzone and sodomized you there rather than bait you into more stupid statements i will merely point out that patch is revalations II, a patch that you may have heard came out days before shrike was tackled and killed, and you may want to read those patch notes again before discussing those |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:40:00 -
[160] - Quote
because you've now declared that remote doomsday removal happened, then shrike happened, then later on that patch i linked happened
guess why that timeline is...highly unlikely
i'll give you a hint it can be found in those patch notes |
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Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:41:00 -
[161] - Quote
FLAWLESS POSTING VICTORY |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
425
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:41:00 -
[162] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:because you've now declared that remote doomsday removal happened, then shrike happened, then later on that patch i linked happened
guess why that timeline is...highly unlikely
i'll give you a hint it can be found in those patch notes
You mean these patch notes?
Quote:Adding a new dimension to space combat in EVE, Revelations II brings you Heat: the ability to overload starship modules for a temporary boost in performance, but at the risk of damaging the module. |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
425
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:43:00 -
[163] - Quote
So I put the question to you again, are you standing by your statement that Titans couldn't be tackled at all until Heat was released? |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:43:00 -
[164] - Quote
grath, hit "ctrl-f" in those patch notes, enter "doom", read what you see there, then contemplate how your lifetime of bad posting has lead you to this...doom |
baltec1
736
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:48:00 -
[165] - Quote
Tore Vest wrote:baltec1 wrote:
Because blobs of subcaps have never been unbeatable. If you knew your history you would know this.
No ships are unbeatable bro.... you should know this
Aside from titan blobs you are right. |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
425
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:49:00 -
[166] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:because you've now declared that remote doomsday removal happened, then shrike happened, then later on that patch i linked happened
So once upon a time, an alliance called Band Of Brothers was the premiere supercap force in EVE, utilizing something like 3 titans (Shrike, Orange Speicies, Chow Down) to utilize whats called a portal dooms day.
In this, a frigate would fly up, light a cyno, and a titan, safely stored in a POS would lite a DD, and it would come through the cyno and kill everything on the frigates grid.
This was deemed unacceptable (And lets be honest, that was nutty), and so it was nerfed. 1 Week later, the hero frigate uncloaked Shrike as he was trying to hide after DDing a Goon fleet on the gate (I was in that fleet). There is video of him dying, including the hooting of many a wild Goon and a very young me, who had died in the initial assault to the marauding titans.
Later, I would leave KOS and move on to other non crap alliances like Imperial Order and Fatal Alliance, eventually falling in with STK when the patch finally came through that you are linking now.
But please Weaselior, tell me more, about how titans couldn't be tackled before heat?
|
Reilly Duvolle
Hydra Squadron
414
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:50:00 -
[167] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Reilly Duvolle wrote:
Again, how will my solution put "the VAST bulk of people having no say what-so-ever"?
Capital pilots are a minority and simply adding more caps means the huge bulk that cant fly them are reduced to nothing more than a meat sheild. It also means that the big 4 will simply blob them up so that not only do they have the titans to wipe out anything a small alliance could bring but would also mean they wouldnt attack eachother. Result? The same stagnation we saw with the supercarriers for a year and a half before the NC folded only this time, nobody will be stupid enough to sell capitals to the enemy. If we go with EAF however every alliance can take part, newer players are made important for a fleet which is good for them and we avoid our virsion of the coldwar stockpiling of nukes that will never get used for fear of getting nuked themselves. The other upside being that currently useless ships become wanted.
How small do you think that minority is Baltac, with almost 11.000 active characters in game with more than 100 million skillpoints?
And again you refuse to answer my question. Probably because even in your retared mind you see that you have no ******* argument. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:51:00 -
[168] - Quote
grath i'm actually feeling bad for you at this point so I'm just going to put this out there rather than giving you the most unsubtle hints possible: if you read those patch notes you will find that was the same patch that nerfed the remote doomsday, making your timeline impossible |
Tore Vest
265
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:51:00 -
[169] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Tore Vest wrote:baltec1 wrote:
Because blobs of subcaps have never been unbeatable. If you knew your history you would know this.
No ships are unbeatable bro.... you should know this Aside from titan blobs you are right. You can allso say that 200 maels are unbeatable for 50 drakes .. rigth ? A real highsec carebear. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:54:00 -
[170] - Quote
really i gave you every chance possible to slink away
but in the end times, when the book of good posting is opened we will not find the name "grath telkin" written in it, and he shall be cast into the pit of bad posting, where one may hear naught but ordo posts and one may see naught but penif posts |
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Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
426
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:56:00 -
[171] - Quote
I edited my post after you made your first post, you're still wrong.
EDIT: Don't be a bitter goon weasel, you know some penif posts are pretty damn funny, especially the bites. |
Grey Azorria
Federation Industries
90
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:57:00 -
[172] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote:So, ignoring the first part since people have been posting in 3 threads for days about how to 'cheaply' counter supers, I'll address the second part:
You said that battleships shouldn't be able to (and probably cant') [its in your quote] volley a logi thats moving.
I say it can, and provide you with at least 3 ship classes that can.
You then respond by relating all of those in some way to a titan.
The original point still stands, Subcaps can volley a logi that is moving, how is that in some way different from a Titan doing it?
The original quote (which you wrote )
Grey Azorria wrote:Grath Telkin wrote: The original point still stands, Subcaps can volley a logi that is moving, how is that in some way different from a Titan doing it?
They should not be able to (and tbh probably can't) volley a logi that is moving. If it is stationary however, then blap away. So no, I was not talking about subcaps, I was talking about titans.
And I am way to tired right now to explain why your welp-nought fleet won't work. But suffice to say, given the amount of times it has been tried, if it did work, then everyone would use it. Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 00:59:00 -
[173] - Quote
grath those are the revalations II patch notes and literally every source you will find states clearly shrike died right after that patch
come now this is just undignified, have some self-respect and go hide like a little girl |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
426
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 01:00:00 -
[174] - Quote
Grey Azorria wrote: But suffice to say, given the amount of times it has been tried, if it did work, then everyone would use it.
Goons tried it once, it worked perfectly, I don't understand what you're talking about. |
baltec1
736
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 01:00:00 -
[175] - Quote
Grath Telkin wrote: I think you should look at the numbers, the real actual numbers again. 70 dreads has a hell of a volley, easily killing a tracking fit titan in nearly one volley, 2 finishes it off.
Also exactly 2 tank mods shields a dread from dying to a DD, so to lose 15, you'd need to get hit by 30 DD's fired in the exact right order, you're more likely to lose either A) None since the SOP is to fire DD's randomly at caps or B) 5-10 at most if they were smart enough to double up on targets.
I'm not making any of this up, its actually all in the math, if you wanted to look its there.
Titan balls haven't been countered yet because nobody has actively tried.
EVE has a hard coded habbit of crying nerf first and then later its discovered that people don't need a nerf, just a little forethought.
Examples are, when we first put Ahacs on the map, people were crying that the logis were too strong, that they needed nerfing, later it turned out that Ahacs are actually terrible and easily countered by themselves.
When we rolled out the tengu fleet, the same thing, tengus were fairly strong. Now that everybody and their brother has a Tengu fleet up the counters are beyond obvious.
The same will be said about the titan ball. Right now their only showing up from 3-4 alliances, the other that could field them (AAA) won't, for obvious reasons (they have a lot, but we have more, and ours are probably better at flying the ship in combat than theirs are). Goons and the CFC are making a massive push to get people into titans right now, their industry is literally churning them out and an amazing speed, as well as dreads. As the number of alliances with titan fleets increases, the counters will become more obvious as they are used by other people in the game that already thought of them, and planned for their use.
Our dread fleets, let me show them to you.
See this is where your liitle theory falls apart, we have dropped suicide dreads. We scored one kill for a decimated fleet. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 01:01:00 -
[176] - Quote
but if you insist on managing to have less dignity than a little girl who ran off and hid then please do link anything whatsoever to support your crazy timewarp theory |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
426
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 01:03:00 -
[177] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:grath those are the revalations II patch notes and literally every source you will find states clearly shrike died right after that patch
Look bro, ask anybody in your alliance, Mynas eve, if titans were ever NOT able to be tackled. Lets try starting there.
Then we can move on to how off the Rev II patch notes are.
Then we can move on to your unhealthy obsession with me.
|
baltec1
736
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 01:03:00 -
[178] - Quote
Reilly Duvolle wrote:baltec1 wrote:Reilly Duvolle wrote:
Again, how will my solution put "the VAST bulk of people having no say what-so-ever"?
Capital pilots are a minority and simply adding more caps means the huge bulk that cant fly them are reduced to nothing more than a meat sheild. It also means that the big 4 will simply blob them up so that not only do they have the titans to wipe out anything a small alliance could bring but would also mean they wouldnt attack eachother. Result? The same stagnation we saw with the supercarriers for a year and a half before the NC folded only this time, nobody will be stupid enough to sell capitals to the enemy. If we go with EAF however every alliance can take part, newer players are made important for a fleet which is good for them and we avoid our virsion of the coldwar stockpiling of nukes that will never get used for fear of getting nuked themselves. The other upside being that currently useless ships become wanted. How small do you think that minority is Baltec, with almost 11.000 active characters in game with more than 100 million skillpoints? And again you refuse to answer my question. Probably because even in your simple mind you see that you have no ******* argument.
Perhaps if you read what I type you might see it. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2532
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 01:05:00 -
[179] - Quote
grath im gonna do you a solid and suggest you go ask around your alliance because you're going to find you've massively embarrassed yourself
i've even stopped quoting you so you can go edit out most of these posts when reality sets in and the shame comes crashing down |
Grath Telkin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
426
|
Posted - 2012.02.29 01:07:00 -
[180] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:
See this is where your liitle theory falls apart, we have dropped suicide dreads. We scored one kill for a decimated fleet.
Actually goons have admitted that but for a really bad bounce on jump in, they'd have killed more. |
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