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GiggityGiggityGooo
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Posted - 2008.03.03 23:40:00 -
[1]
So i recently got layed off because the place i worked at is closing down. They had a meeting on 2/20 and told everyone we would be open for 3 more weeks afterwards, and told everyone if they didn't get talked to 2/23 would be their last day. Well i obviously was one of them who didn't get talked to.
I talked to my buddy thats still working there and he told me they hired a new person for my position (weird, the stores closing) And he also told me they now plan on staying open until 1st or 2nd week of April.
Now maybe theres a pro out there or someone with experience in this but are they allowed to lay a person off and replace there position within a week? Also somewhere i heard that they need to give all employees 60 day notice of a mass lay off/Store closing.
I gave the company 4 hard years of sweat and blood without screwing them over at all, and whenever they needed me to do something i was there even on my days off, and to see this happen angers me. Is there anything i can do?
Thanks!
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Isiskhan
Gnostic Misanthropy
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Posted - 2008.03.03 23:44:00 -
[2]
Dr. Gonzo: Sounds like big trouble. You're going to need plenty of legal advice before this thing is over. As your attorney, I advise you to rent a very fast car with no top. And you'll need the c*caine. Tape recorder for special music. Acapulco shirts. Get the hell out of L.A. for at least 48 hours. Blows my weekend.
Raoul Duke: Why?
Dr. Gonzo: Because naturally I'm going to have to go with you. And we're going to have to arm ourselves... to the teeth!
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Shalia Ripper
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.03.03 23:47:00 -
[3]
Originally by: GiggityGiggityGooo So i recently got layed off because the place i worked at is closing down. They had a meeting on 2/20 and told everyone we would be open for 3 more weeks afterwards, and told everyone if they didn't get talked to 2/23 would be their last day. Well i obviously was one of them who didn't get talked to.
I talked to my buddy thats still working there and he told me they hired a new person for my position (weird, the stores closing) And he also told me they now plan on staying open until 1st or 2nd week of April.
Now maybe theres a pro out there or someone with experience in this but are they allowed to lay a person off and replace there position within a week? Also somewhere i heard that they need to give all employees 60 day notice of a mass lay off/Store closing.
I gave the company 4 hard years of sweat and blood without screwing them over at all, and whenever they needed me to do something i was there even on my days off, and to see this happen angers me. Is there anything i can do?
Thanks!
Depends on the state.
Oh, and companies don't give a whit about employees.
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Mtthias Clemi
Gallente The Space Bastards
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Posted - 2008.03.03 23:54:00 -
[4]
*watches some Boston legal*
ill give you a response in 2 to 5 hours.
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GiggityGiggityGooo
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Posted - 2008.03.04 00:24:00 -
[5]
i live in wisconsin
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Cmdr Sy
Appetite 4 Destruction INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2008.03.04 00:47:00 -
[6]
I am not a legal guy or even a US resident or anything, but speaking from common sense...
Assuming management made the announcement without delay, it does not sound like a planned closure, it sounds like sudden insolvency. You might be contractually entitled to some sort of notice period before redundancy in normal circumstances, but if the cash flow got screwed up, the company imploded and the money to pay you is simply not there, then hard luck. Although the business might have already been in trouble, you cannot expect to receive advance notice of an event, the timing of which is intrinsically unpredictable. You do not get notice if a bank calls in the company's credit lines.
Again assuming the management were fundamentally honest in their disclosure, it sounds like they worked out how long it would take to wind down the business, how much money they had remaining, and budgeted accordingly. I assume the majority of people got told to leave. As for why they might have hired a replacement, perhaps it made sense to hire someone for a brief period. Maybe it was a relevant skillset they were after, maybe for security reasons they need some people unconnected to the company to carry out certain final duties.
From the way you tell it, assuming there is nothing more to it, it sounds like a case of KABOOM, company bank accounts getting frozen, and you would be saving yourself time just walking away.
This is going to be happening a lot, by the way.
EVE CCG Trinity Booster
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2008.03.04 01:08:00 -
[7]
I'm pretty sure Wisconsin is a "work at will" state which basically means you can quit or they can let you go for any reason (well, almost any reason...some groups have protected status so you cannot be fired for race, gender, religion, supposedly whistle blowers and so on).
Beyond that your employer can show you the door anytime they want with no explanation and pretty much not a damn thing to be done about it unless you feel you fall into a discrimination category.
That said if the company had a termination policy they should have followed it. A termination policy may specify severance pay, extension of benefits, help finding new work and so on. Companies are not forced to do those things but if they make a habit of doing them and then deny you those benefits by pretending to close shop in three days then you may have a course of action against them. Talk to an attorney if you think this is the case.
You also should be eligible for unemployment benefits and frankly them hiring someone else to do your job is stupid on several levels. If they hired you back they would no longer be forced to pay some of your unemployment benefit not to mention you know the job better and would likely be far more efficient than someone new. Of course maybe they are paying the new person a whole lot less.
Anyway, sucks. I know. Best of luck.
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Erotic Irony
0bsession
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Posted - 2008.03.04 01:08:00 -
[8]
Labor is weak in America, a strange fact given how much American ideals lend themselves to labor empowerment and class solidarity. Then again maybe its not surprising at all given the transformation of the republican party during industrialization and urbanization.
You may want to consult a labor lawyer if you're unionized or not, I doubt anything illegal happened, just a matter of comparativeness. Alternatively I'd tell you to vote but you and I both know voting isn't going to change American hostility to collective bargaining or concern for labor welfare. ___ Eve Players are not very smart. Support Killmail Overhaul
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Shameless Avenger
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Posted - 2008.03.04 02:03:00 -
[9]
The best advice: hit monster.com
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PhantomMenace
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2008.03.04 03:07:00 -
[10]
think im right im saying (in the uk at least) that they cant replace you after telling you the jobs finished , i guess they may have given the guy your job under a different title which i believe is a way round it . wonder if you can claim constructive dismissal , or just say your *** and claim thats why they dismissed you that allways seems to work for people
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Ademaro Imre
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.03.04 03:19:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Ademaro Imre on 04/03/2008 03:22:03
Originally by: GiggityGiggityGooo Is there anything i can do?
Thanks!
No there is not. You may not be discriminated for race, sex, nationality, age or sexual preference. If you dyed your hair pink one day, you can be fired if the business operators do not like pink hair. But they will have to pay you unemployment compensation, or rather, it will be deducted from their "account" with the state and will adversely effect their unemployment compensation tax rates on payroll.
In this situation, it doesn't matter why the company is discharging you, unless its discrimination. Before getting angry about the company hiring for the position for you, that person might have had more seniority. In the end, the business is still shutting down.
What you can do is apply for unemployment compensation. Whenever you are discharged from employment that is no fault of your own, you are eligible for unemployment compensation. I don't know about your state, but most states have a state system for unemployment compensation, and you will be eligible for the compensation for about 6 months. Every state has a different method for calculating your benefits. The higher the business taxes, the higher the benefits (allegedly - but it is true in the case of comparing Maryland to Pennsylvania). If your state does not have such a program, then you will be covered by Federal unemployment compensation (employers either pay to the state program, and if the states does not have one, they are forced into the federal government's program). You will be required to at least try to find a job for those 6 months by filling out forms of who you contacted for a job.
Find the unemployment compensation office and get the paperwork started. Once you get notice, you can fill out the forms.
As for special notices, that is not true, unless is is a special state law, or you might have seen it in large union contracts.
The aim of politics is to keep the populace alarmed and clamorous to be saved by menacing it with imaginary hobgoblins. The urge to save humanity is a false front for the urge to rule it. |
Mimiru
Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.03.04 03:47:00 -
[12]
check this
site should help a bit
If you are unionized, your best bet is to talk to your union rep, they should be able to handle most things for you.
If not, you should contact a lawyer. Your state/local BAR association should have a directory of attorneys in your area, and if they're any good, have them broken down into catagories like labor, criminal, family law, etc.
Im not sure, but if Wisconsin is a right to hire/fire state, then they can pretty much fire you for whatever reason they want, as long as it isnt discriminatory. ---------
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GiggityGiggityGooo
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Posted - 2008.03.04 05:16:00 -
[13]
Thanks everyone for your replies, glad to see they were all mature etc :) Ill def look into what everybody said. I have already filed for unemployment, but i have a month of vacation there paying me (thru-out the next month like regular checks) Its funny i always thought how nice it would be to have off a week or two, and i'm already bored 1 week later
Originally by: Shameless Avenger The best advice: hit monster.com
Aye i have done that already, and am thinking maybe it was best this happened, having looked at jobs on monster i noticed i was really underpaid for what i do. (Most jobs starting (entry level) is 8-10 dollars an hour more then i was getting paid, plus i have the years of experience. Funny i didn't notice that before. Actually really sucks that i didn't
Everything happens for a reason hey?
Thanks again
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F'nog
Amarr Celestial Horizon Corp. Valainaloce
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Posted - 2008.03.04 06:54:00 -
[14]
Since you were there for 4 years, I'm guessing you weren't making the starting wage. So they probably got rid of most of the highest paid employees and hired new ones to make costs cheaper for them until the store closes.
Circuit City fired all their highest paid employees about a year ago to cut down on costs. Of course, they then gave the executives a holiday bonus worth more than all the fired employees' pay together for years. But that's the corporate lifestyle nowadays. Sucks when you're not already one of the super-wealthy.
Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari
F'nog for Amarr Emperor. Nuff said
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Ademaro Imre
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.03.04 07:16:00 -
[15]
I would check with the unemployment office about that weeks vacation pay. If you were severed before the pay started, the pay might be considered severance pay and count towards your unemployment compensation. That sort of thing is complicated. Just make sure all of your bases are covered.
The aim of politics is to keep the populace alarmed and clamorous to be saved by menacing it with imaginary hobgoblins. The urge to save humanity is a false front for the urge to rule it. |
SniperWo1f
Omega Enterprises Mostly Harmless
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Posted - 2008.03.04 18:44:00 -
[16]
laws can vary quite alot it's best to contact a lawyer who has labour specializon to at least level 4
in some parts of the states i believe if you are laid off then replaced ( which is a common scam ) then if you can prove it you will be entitled to all the wages you would have earned so long as they kept him employed .
what generally happens in many company with labour and no union is once a worker has been there for a few years and are earning higher pay ( raises + so-on) compnay will remove that employee and replace him/her for a new employee who will cost them less
it's all about dollars . your best bet for succeeding as an employee is to always keep your options open constantly shop for a better job take all the promotions and bonuses you can possibly earn but the second a better opportunity comes along leave . offer your current employer the opportunity to match-or-better if they cant leave . employers are like shoes when you have had them for a while they get comfortable but after a while they stink . ditch them - before they ditch you .
oh and been there too , hang in there buddy !
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Gunner Dark
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Posted - 2008.03.04 20:12:00 -
[17]
Got to laugh at the employment laws in the US, if this had happened in the UK, you would 100% get your job back and/or compensation.
Guess we should tthink ourselves luck employees are so well protected in the UK
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Corstaad
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Posted - 2008.03.04 22:09:00 -
[18]
Actually if there really closing thats pretty standard to bring in temp workers for the last few months. Wisconsin is very close to Minnesota Unemployment laws so get your six to nine months of paided eve-time. If they haven't documented anything or make you sign anything your golden. I'm a seasonal construction worker so I deal with this stuff all the time.
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Cmdr Sy
Appetite 4 Destruction INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2008.03.04 22:45:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Cmdr Sy on 04/03/2008 22:46:25
Originally by: Gunner Dark Got to laugh at the employment laws in the US, if this had happened in the UK, you would 100% get your job back and/or compensation.
Guess we should tthink ourselves luck employees are so well protected in the UK
Uh... no.
Have you forgotten those stories of people showing up for work and finding the building locked? There was a legal firm that made a few column inches a couple of years ago just like that. Then there is a bakery I used to go, where the staff worked out the remainder of their week after the administration notice got posted.
A simple fact of life is you have rights only as long as your employer has a line of credit. Once that's gone, you might as well be entitled to blood squeezed out of a stone.
It might not have happened this way in this case, but it CAN and DOES happen and the law offers no protection in many such cases. When the money is gone, it is gone.
EVE CCG Trinity Booster
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Silence Duegood
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Posted - 2008.03.04 22:50:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Gunner Dark Got to laugh at the employment laws in the US, if this had happened in the UK, you would 100% get your job back and/or compensation.
Guess we should tthink ourselves luck employees are so well protected in the UK
Wrong. I have a several friends with whom you can chat that are standing in queues that have similar stories to the OP.
Originally by: Chencherra I dont think the Nighthawk needs help, I just think about how to get it on par with the other cs.
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Corstaad
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Posted - 2008.03.04 22:50:00 -
[21]
They have a Unemployment account from the state thats paided a year in advance. Doesn't matter if they get nuked to ground its going to have unemployment insurance.
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Wash MySocks
Hiram's Call
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Posted - 2008.03.05 03:53:00 -
[22]
Good luck with your job search. Wisconsin can be a funny place to find work this time of year though. It all comes down to where you are in our fine state.
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KingsGambit
Caldari Knights
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Posted - 2008.03.05 13:44:00 -
[23]
Edited by: KingsGambit on 05/03/2008 13:46:19 Don't know the specifics of US law, but in the UK it is against the law to employ someone for a job after the person doing it was made redundant/laid off. The reason being that redundancy means that the job is no longer required within the company, and is thus being gotten rid of. generally a company will offer the employee doing that job a redundancy payment (there are laws on how it is calculated, but it can be higher than the legal minimum) or anothe rpost within the company if one is available. It is unlawful to employ someone in the same capacity. If however the job description was changed slightly, it could be legally said to be a different job, and thus a replacement can be employed.
If your company employed someone to do your old job when they just laid you off, under UK law that's illegal, so it may be worth checking the laws where you are. It seems odd to do something like that considering the company is closing down. Under the circumstances, they should have really kept you on as long as they existed and the job needed doing within the company. Companies are entitled to lay staff off, particularly if they are closing, but you may be entitled to some compensation for earnings you should have had between when you actually stopped working and when your job ceases to exist (eg. the guy they've employed to do it stops doing it and/or the company closes). This may also depend of course, on any severance pay they gave you and the terms under which it was given. Best advice is to seek legal advice. I'm sorry to hear about your job, and wish you all the best in the future. -------------
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Patch86
Di-Tron Heavy Industries Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.05 19:09:00 -
[24]
Were you in a union? And if not, is there a reason why not (local law or some such)?
If that happened to me, my union would be the first to know. They're like a big collection of very expensive lawyers who will work for free, less my membership fee. Next stop would be an employment tribunal, backed by my nice free lawyers. I do live in the UK, though.
UK labour laws are generally pretty favourable over most American state laws. Our labour force is protected by contract law, official legally binding tribunals and legal unions. Whiles its true, as the above posters said, that when a company goes bust theres not much that can be done (if theres no money to have, you can't get any money; employees are at the bottom of the priority list, after debts, rent, and legal cost), generally you can't be let go without proper redundancy laws being adhered to. ------
Originally by: Dark Shikari The problem with killing Jesus is he always just respawns 3 days later anyways. |
DubanFP
Caldari Four Rings Phalanx Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.07 04:01:00 -
[25]
Eh, it's a private buisiness which means they can pretty much do any damn thing they please. Although it's usually extremely impolite to drop someone on their ass without notice assuming no fault of such person. ___________
Desolacer> Who the heck gives YOU the right to ruin it for others buy blowing them up.
Zaqar> CCP |
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