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Faceless Pokemon
THe X Spies
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Posted - 2007.12.14 17:06:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Faceless Pokemon on 14/12/2007 17:11:15 Corporation Espionage
Part 1. Infiltration
While writing my series in general discussion on the corporation theft I felt it might be useful if I wrote a series of posts focussing on how corporation infiltration is done and how corps can help prevent thefts/spying from happening. Some of this I have detailed before, some not. But this will provide a overall explanation rather than me explaining a particular instance of doing it.
Please excuse the formatting/poor English. It is not my primary language and a friend has converted this from a wall of text into something more readable.
Ill split the post into 2 parts. First being how to infiltrate. The second on how to prevent it.
The Infiltrator
Infiltrating an alliance directly is not always the most discreet method of entering. This is due to questions being raised about why you want to join.
There are 2 methods we employ for getting into an alliance.
1. Using a sleeper network
This involves a bit of luck.
Most members of our organisation have around 3-4 accounts, usually most are suspended to reduce cost, activating when needed. All the slots on each account are filled with characters at all times. These characters normally have 900k SP and spend their time not in use, building up an Employment history in any corporation discovered on the recruitment channel.
This way each member always has characters moving around the alliances of EVE, laying dorment.
Another method of creating a good spread of characters is by infiltrating failing alliance with multiple characters across many corps. Few questions are raised as to why you want to join, and within a short time the alliance disbands and the corps go to empire for a while before joining another alliance. In our organisation's early days with Xelas we each inserted many characters so that we could do multiple tasks at once, later when Xelas disbanded and the corps went their separate ways we ended up with characters spread across lots of alliances throughout the game. Giving us a good source of intel and a starting point should we ever have a contract against the alliance.
Once you have this character in the alliance you begin by talking to corps within your alliance about a "friend" you know who is interested in joining and or by asking if your alt can join...
2. The direct approach
This involves quite a bit of social engineering.
You need to first research your target. Learn the structure of the organisation and who the key players are. Which corps are in the alliance and how much of a role they play in the alliance and also which has the worst recruitment policies. Check out the forums, see if any of them are recruiting and leave the recruitment channel open checking for spam from them. If they are recruiting this way the hard part is done as it does not look like you are coming from nowhere.
If there is nothing you need to be slightly sneakier. One way is to make contact with a member of the corp/alliance befriend him over time and then start talking about his corp and get a reference in . This however can take quite a while.
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Faceless Pokemon
THe X Spies
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Posted - 2007.12.14 17:07:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Faceless Pokemon on 14/12/2007 17:08:11 Another is to contact the CEO directly with a good enough reason why you want to join the alliance. Maybe you once lived in the area and want to come back because you have lots of assets still there and like the place. Maybe you strongly dislike their current enemies and want to fight them.
Talk to them for a while before you do come out with your reasoning and as much as possible gauge what kind of a person they are and what they are likely to believe. A good way is to say you have read about them on the forums and like what they are doing and it sounds like fun. Mentioning anything to do with their current enemies can raise suspicion so use that as a last resort.
Through this method you are most likely going to be asked to provide a screen shot of your login screen. If you are operating with many characters on the same account this will obviously be a problem. To do this you need to be very quick... first you need to throttle your bandwidth in some way. One method is to set many downloads running to consume it or use bandwidth throttling software. Once this is done. Log off eve. Open any image editing software. Relaunch eve. Enter your credentials and connect. As your bandwidth is throttled you should see the character selection screen appear with empty slots. While in the stage you need to do as many screen captures as possible. The Background behind the slots slowly changes while waiting for the characters to load in so you need to get your empty screen shot as close to the to the one where it is populated as possible.
Once this is done you should have two images. Copy as exactly as possible the 2 empty slots on the empty image onto your populated image. Save, and email to wherever you were instructed to send it.
If they are very suspicious they will ask for more than one image. Such as images of your wallet, skill sheet and so on. So the better image editing skills you have, the more likely you are to succeed. Failing that claim you are having email problems and try to be believable :)
At this point you have your starting point with which to begin..
Part 2 will explain where to go from here.
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Faceless Pokemon
THe X Spies
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Posted - 2007.12.14 17:08:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Faceless Pokemon on 14/12/2007 17:11:32 The Alliance and Corporation
There is no 100% method of preventing people infiltrating your corporation . However following the advice here you can decrease the chances of being infiltrated.
Corporation recruitment
The first method of infiltration I mentioned is quite difficult to prevent against as recruiting corporations is sometimes necessary for an alliance.
Corporations can have extremely tight recruitment standards and be 99% sure about their members but the moment you accept another corporation you are adding an unknown element. To help against potential "sleeper units" in the corp wishing to join you can do the following
First look at the corporations alliance history. If they are from a notoriously spy ridden alliance there is going to be sleepers. From this you can figure out how much of a problem its going to be.
Ask for a member list from the corp, screen them. Look at each user, check for anything suspicious and make a note.
Also request that the corporation do a purge of inactive members (Many times our members have reactivated an alt after 3-4 months to discover they are in a different alliance and gone on to use that character)
Be strict with these policies and if you have doubts donĘt let them in!
Member recruitment
If you are going recruit by advertising. Make a forum post. Do not use the recruitment channel.
On being contacted ask where they heard of you. Look at the corporation history. Use a search engine to look them up. See what alliances their previous corps have been in. What ships they have flown.
Before you ask them anything ask if they have any alts and if so what are their names. Then ask them if they have had or do have any characters other than the one they are talking to you on. Make a note of this. Look up the character on the forums, has it ever been for sale?
From here ask them about what they fly, what they have done in the game. Ask them questions about the game in general and about what they want to achieve.
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Faceless Pokemon
THe X Spies
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Posted - 2007.12.14 17:09:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Faceless Pokemon on 14/12/2007 17:10:56 Begin to look for discrepancies with what you have found and with what they are saying. And always always always be weary of the "know everything noob", the 30 days old character who knows all the details of fleet combat and the workings of POS's!. If you notice this have a look to see whether they mentioned if they had alts or had played before. If they answered no then you have someone who is being deceptive!
Another common mistake spies make is of acting like a noob and asking stupid questions that even a noob would not ask while using terms and acronyms a noob would not use!
If you are satisfied that they are legitimate tell them you would like some screen shots. The first being of their character selection screen. Ask it to be emailed to a particular address.
Once they have done this and you have checked it. Ask for 2 more screen shots, the first being the conversation window with you open next to their open skill sheet with all the tabs minimized so you can see the breakdown of skill points. The second being your conversation next to their wallet with "player donations" filter selected.
If they take longer than 10minutes to send this from the point of asking then reject them.
Once again, be strict and do not allow exceptions or excuses.
Check the skill point sheet to see if it matches with what they have said and look for any attempts at faking. Check who has been sending them money. Be suspicious if they are a supposed 10 million sp character and have never had any player donations ( This is because the quick solution a spy will normally use is to take a screen shot of one of the other filter options selected that returns "no records" and then paste over the top of the filter "player donations")
At this point if they pass all these tests you can accept them.
When recruiting by reference such as a player already in your corporation asking if his friend can join, apply similar rules as above. Do not allow exceptions. Also do not allow the previous corporations a player has been in effect you carrying out the rules above or make you think they are safe. The Band of Brothers alliance is good example how an alliance with good recruitment policies that maintains a high quality of pilots can over time be penetrated through lapses due to people allow poor referrals in. Never make exceptions and if you have doubts donĘt accept them!
All this aside you can sometimes be over paranoid. Do not stress over it. Strictly follow your recruitment policies, make a note of things you see that seem odd and act on your instincts.
In part 2 I will go into how to actually discover them once they are in!
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Ramlir
0.0 Corp
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Posted - 2007.12.14 17:25:00 -
[5]
Oh hey, it's the self-proclaimed group of spies who spend more time on the forums informing us of their actions and methods than they do in-game. They also have done nothing even remotely worth noting as yet but let's forget that for a second and read your crappy thread.
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Bin Matar
Fallen Angel's Blade.
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Posted - 2007.12.14 17:31:00 -
[6]
I think somebody was a little bit bullied at school wasnt he.
Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -HornFrog ([email protected]) |
Domania
Convergent Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.12.14 17:41:00 -
[7]
Corporation Espionage
Mr. Anderson your time is up. 3rd in a alt thread I think.
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Factor Benz
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.12.14 17:48:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Domania Corporation Espionage
Mr. Anderson your time is up. 3rd in a alt thread I think.
What is FIX's official stance on corporate espionage?
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ISD Valorem
Amarr ISD STAR
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Posted - 2007.12.14 18:06:00 -
[9]
Can I remind everyone that spam (2nd page snypa, fifth in this thread etc), trolling and flaming will be moderated heavily.
Someone has gone to the effort of making a lucid and comprehensive post on a subject that effects almost every Corporation and Alliance in game. Please try and do something outlandish like, oh I don't know, discuss the subject matter?
Stay on topic or get a warning.
forum rules | CAOD Rules | [email protected] | Our Website |
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WickedMan1337
Caldari Obsidian Inc. KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2007.12.14 19:02:00 -
[10]
Really good post man. Allot of good points.
But then again, if you have an account that is been played "normal" Standings to agents and not o.o security. It will be very hard to spot. (And if your wallet is "clean") Also voices, if you are a spy, and are on different coms, people can recognize your voice.
So stopping spies is pretty much impossible. Just go with your gut feeling.
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Vasili Z
Beasts of Burden YouWhat
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Posted - 2007.12.14 19:23:00 -
[11]
Part 6. Area 52: Infiltration
Step 1. Slide down metal beam directly behind 3 gaurds.
Step 2. Use grenades to destroy turrets
Step 3. Navigate mine field to gain rocket launcher. -------
Everything I say represents my corporation and their views. |
Dr Paithos
Minmatar Republic Deep Space Institute
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Posted - 2007.12.14 19:33:00 -
[12]
getting spies into xelas that must have been quite tricky please tell me more
Quote: Thank you for kittens, glitter, for warm nights in fuzzy blankets... Thank you for dolphins, whales... Thank you for cartoons, for birthdays, for candy and cookies.
Thank you CCP!
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The Mittani
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.12.14 19:43:00 -
[13]
hey thanks for this guide, ive been interested in espionage from time to time between mining, this will really help me get started!
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The Mittani
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.12.14 19:44:00 -
[14]
Originally by: ISD Valorem Can I remind everyone that spam (2nd page snypa, fifth in this thread etc), trolling and flaming will be moderated heavily.
Someone has gone to the effort of making a lucid and comprehensive post on a subject that effects almost every Corporation and Alliance in game. Please try and do something outlandish like, oh I don't know, discuss the subject matter?
Stay on topic or get a warning.
no one with any actual knowledge of the subject matter and a lick of sense is going to contribute to this thread
thats how the metagame rolls~
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Faceless Pokemon
THe X Spies
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Posted - 2007.12.14 20:05:00 -
[15]
Originally by: The Mittani
Originally by: ISD Valorem Can I remind everyone that spam (2nd page snypa, fifth in this thread etc), trolling and flaming will be moderated heavily.
Someone has gone to the effort of making a lucid and comprehensive post on a subject that effects almost every Corporation and Alliance in game. Please try and do something outlandish like, oh I don't know, discuss the subject matter?
Stay on topic or get a warning.
no one with any actual knowledge of the subject matter and a lick of sense is going to contribute to this thread
thats how the metagame rolls~
Hello Mittani
My view point is that improving the education of corporations in regards to recruitment will increase the challenge and provide more fun. Although I can understand how in the game for some organisations the objective achieved is the primary goal and not the fun of the espionage.
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Petter Sandstad
Taggart Transdimensional Kinetic Maelstrom Alliance
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Posted - 2007.12.14 21:12:00 -
[16]
May I ask what your price is for infiltrating an alliance or corporation?
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Pokchu
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.12.14 21:37:00 -
[17]
i'll sponsor you into goonfleet for 100m |
Fraps
Setenta Corp
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Posted - 2007.12.14 22:12:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Fraps on 14/12/2007 22:12:20 getting into Xelas was easy, just go up to a doomsday corp member and and say
您保护我为金钱, 我支付您周刊权利对鼠您的空间, 给您损坏
and that was basicaly it
Originally by: Rohann /emote pokes woody and moons him
I R NEKID SEE!?!?!?!?! |
Janu Hull
Caldari Terra Incognita Dark Matter Coalition
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Posted - 2007.12.14 22:27:00 -
[19]
Originally by: ISD Valorem Can I remind everyone that spam (2nd page snypa, fifth in this thread etc), trolling and flaming will be moderated heavily.
Someone has gone to the effort of making a lucid and comprehensive post on a subject that effects almost every Corporation and Alliance in game. Please try and do something outlandish like, oh I don't know, discuss the subject matter?
Stay on topic or get a warning.
Somewhere in the past, there was a infiltration takedown of an alliance in EVE that epitomizes the requisite nature of spying to such an amazing degree that this "Spying for Dummies" handbook being posted here is ************ compared to a 48 hour horizontal marathon with all three of Hugh Hefner's girlfriends.
Spying isn't something you learn in a handbook. Its like stage magic sleight of hand merged with a method actor's ability to immerse themselves in a role so completely that the actor isn't there anymore.(SEE: Jim Carrey playing Andy Kaufman)
This Matahari wannabe stuff doesn't cut it when the results really matter.
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Faceless Pokemon
THe X Spies
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Posted - 2007.12.14 22:39:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Faceless Pokemon on 14/12/2007 22:40:33
Originally by: Janu Hull
Spying isn't something you learn in a handbook. Its like stage magic sleight of hand merged with a method actor's ability to immerse themselves in a role so completely that the actor isn't there anymore.(SEE: Jim Carrey playing Andy Kaufman)
This being a computer game, We don't feel the need to go quite that deeply into it. We play for fun.
The purpose of the post is to educate about corp infiltration. How it is carried out and the signs to watch for when recruiting. It isn't "Become a spy in 24 hours".
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zilllii
Midas Tycho
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Posted - 2007.12.14 23:02:00 -
[21]
another good pointer to wether the character is someones alt is to check if it was made during one of the 2 "power of 2" periods wich greatly increases the chance of it being someones second account trying to sneak in.
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Kiarah
Gallente Janus Pilot Corps
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Posted - 2007.12.15 00:14:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Faceless Pokemon
Originally by: The Mittani
Originally by: ISD Valorem Can I remind everyone that spam (2nd page snypa, fifth in this thread etc), trolling and flaming will be moderated heavily.
Someone has gone to the effort of making a lucid and comprehensive post on a subject that effects almost every Corporation and Alliance in game. Please try and do something outlandish like, oh I don't know, discuss the subject matter?
Stay on topic or get a warning.
no one with any actual knowledge of the subject matter and a lick of sense is going to contribute to this thread
thats how the metagame rolls~
Hello Mittani
My view point is that improving the education of corporations in regards to recruitment will increase the challenge and provide more fun. Although I can understand how in the game for some organisations the objective achieved is the primary goal and not the fun of the espionage.
Let me see if I have this straight. Your idea of "fun" in eve is hanging out in the recruitment channel trying to get into corporations with difficult recruitment policies?
Blech, I'd quit in a week if that was my day.
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Faceless Pokemon
THe X Spies
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Posted - 2007.12.15 00:29:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Kiarah
Let me see if I have this straight. Your idea of "fun" in eve is hanging out in the recruitment channel trying to get into corporations with difficult recruitment policies?
Blech, I'd quit in a week if that was my day.
I'm not sure where you created that picture from. It's very unlikely you are going to find a target corporation using the recruitment channel. Although it does sometimes happen. We use the recruitment channel normally for creating sleeper characters.
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Pseudo Ucksth
Collegium Mechanicae
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Posted - 2007.12.15 08:30:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Pseudo Ucksth on 15/12/2007 08:31:07
Originally by: The Mittani
no one with any actual knowledge of the subject matter and a lick of sense is going to contribute to this thread
thats how the metagame rolls~
Wrong!
Ultimate Guide to Corp Infiltration
- Make sexy yet independant looking Matari female
- Find CEO/Director of your choice in empire using locator agent
- Build rapport with target CEO/Director
- Cyber with aforementioned CEO/Director
- Get into target corp as their "secretary"
- ????
- Profit
Edit: I think I gave this a little bit too much thought lol
______
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killerco
Gallente The Graduates Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2007.12.15 09:10:00 -
[25]
Edited by: killerco on 15/12/2007 09:10:47
Originally by: Faceless Pokemon Through this method you are most likely going to be asked to provide a screen shot of your login screen. If you are operating with many characters on the same account this will obviously be a problem.
There is a flaud in your reasoning here. a smart corp ceo/recruiter will ask for a api(limited acces) so they can check who your chars are and what your skills and skillpoints are(http://myeve.eve-online.com/api/doc/default.asp).
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Faceless Pokemon
THe X Spies
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Posted - 2007.12.15 11:21:00 -
[26]
Originally by: killerco Edited by: killerco on 15/12/2007 09:10:47
Originally by: Faceless Pokemon Through this method you are most likely going to be asked to provide a screen shot of your login screen. If you are operating with many characters on the same account this will obviously be a problem.
There is a flaud in your reasoning here. a smart corp ceo/recruiter will ask for a api(limited acces) so they can check who your chars are and what your skills and skillpoints are(http://myeve.eve-online.com/api/doc/default.asp).
That is a good point although very few recruiters carry this out. There are also ways around it.
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JINX HSC
le MASKEN
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Posted - 2007.12.15 11:34:00 -
[27]
lol - KLADDKAKA -
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umop 3pisdn
Minmatar Fnck the blob.
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Posted - 2007.12.15 11:44:00 -
[28]
Heres some attention.
Now shutup and go back to pretending you matter.
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BoB sucks
Burning Bush Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.12.15 16:11:00 -
[29]
Originally by: ISD Valorem Can I remind everyone that spam (2nd page snypa, fifth in this thread etc), trolling and flaming will be moderated heavily.
Someone has gone to the effort of making a lucid and comprehensive post on a subject that effects almost every Corporation and Alliance in game. Please try and do something outlandish like, oh I don't know, discuss the subject matter?
Stay on topic or get a warning.
Faceless pokemon's alt is ISD Valorum! c/d? seriously, while this is a great read, nobody is going to have serious a discussion on this subject on a public forum. It's the nature of the business.
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ISD Valorem
Amarr ISD STAR
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Posted - 2007.12.15 16:15:00 -
[30]
Originally by: BoB sucks
Originally by: ISD Valorem Can I remind everyone that spam (2nd page snypa, fifth in this thread etc), trolling and flaming will be moderated heavily.
Someone has gone to the effort of making a lucid and comprehensive post on a subject that effects almost every Corporation and Alliance in game. Please try and do something outlandish like, oh I don't know, discuss the subject matter?
Stay on topic or get a warning.
Faceless pokemon's alt is ISD Valorum! c/d? seriously, while this is a great read, nobody is going to have serious a discussion on this subject on a public forum. It's the nature of the business.
People need to remember that many other small Corporations and Alliances also read this forum. While this information may not be of you use to many of the major Corps/Alliances it may still be an invaluable source of information for others.
Please do not jump to the conclusion that, just because it is of no use to you, does not mean it is of no use to anyone.
forum rules | CAOD Rules | [email protected] | Our Website |
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