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Weiland Taur
Ceptic Innovations Rebel Alliance of New Eden
19
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 14:33:00 -
[91] - Quote
I have recently dipped my toe (on an alt) into the wild waters of null sec pvp and it has been a mixture of exciting rushes and mind numbing boredom that made ice mining look like a day at the amusement park. When it's happening the group effort and pretty explosions of PVP are awesome but alot of the time the wandering, the chasing, the gate games, (thank the gods we have a fun FC), the inevitable hot drop, etc... add up to several hours of ISK free guard duty that taxes the system. I don't blame them but in my limited experience it seems that many pvp oriented pilots are only in it if they are sure they can win. Sooner or later the bait and mug tactics get really old.
It reminds me that Eve is greater in it's sum than in it's parts.
That said I'm not docking up anytime soon. |
Sara XIII
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
52
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 15:35:00 -
[92] - Quote
2bhammered wrote:Nicolo da'Vicenza wrote:eve is only as exciting as your initiative and imagination lets it be Which is why D&D and my wetdreams are more fun than eve is?!
I mean, c'mon! That's always gonna be the case
|
Large Collidable Object
morons.
1038
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 18:49:00 -
[93] - Quote
The problem with eve pvp is that for anyone smarter than a boiled egg, blobfights are boring. Unfortunately, they're the only means to achieve anything in Eve - want to take over a moon or hold some sov? POS-grinding, timers, another bazillion HP to grind here, wait for the timer to finish and the enemy to assemble his blob, or not showing up at all if you have the bigger blob - rinse and repeat...
Small gang pvp is fun, but serves absolutely no purpose in Eve and hence it's an end in itself and there's nothing to gain except killmails and k/d ratios that are considered good. Since there's nothing else to gain but KMs and stats, people are usually extremely risk averse and only engage when they are sure to win.
If there was a purpose for small gang pvp, people would probably risk more (as in "look - my small pvp alliance may have lost more ships than 'Red Clusterswarmlegiondot.' achieving our goal, but we managed to hack their moon-mining arrays and haul of 4 billion worth of tech in doing so..."). morons- sting like a butterfly and-ápost like a bee. |
2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
20
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 19:22:00 -
[94] - Quote
Sicex wrote:The fact that other game communities talk about the brutality of EVE PVP means your point is empty.
... I could even insert the meme: "You're not doing it right," and most EVE players would know what I mean.
Those people never played eve longer than the trial, give me a break. "Brutal" lol best joke of today. |
2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
20
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 19:35:00 -
[95] - Quote
Halcyon Ingenium wrote:What is boring is subjective.
State what you mean exactly by boring. Then follow up with an explanation of how EvE pvp meats the necessary and sufficient conditions of what is boring for you.
If you want to hear thoughtful replies, make thoughtful comments.
Boring is to not do anything, check
boring is to wait around for hours in order to do something, check,
boring is to always have an unfair fight, check,
boring is to never have real risk, check,
boring is watching trans speeds and click f1, f2, f3, check,
boring is to have boring gameplay mechanics for actual ship fighting, check,
boring is to explore and fight in a big galaxy that all looks and acts the same way, check,
boring is to do always do the same thing in a fight, check,
as for 0.0, enter it, take it,fight and fight, mine, pvp, haul and do economics,politics,alliances and deceptions, "win", get bored, rinse repeat.
Both normal game and metagame is boring, metagame more so since it gets old and it is the same game as it was 5 years ago. Except now I can walk around in a studio apartement on any station in 3d and take screenshots... |
2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
20
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 19:49:00 -
[96] - Quote
Weiland Taur wrote: I have recently dipped my toe (on an alt) into the wild waters of null sec pvp and it has been a mixture of exciting rushes and mind numbing boredom that made ice mining look like a day at the amusement park. When it's happening the group effort and pretty explosions of PVP are awesome but alot of the time the wandering, the chasing, the gate games, (thank the gods we have a fun FC), the inevitable hot drop, etc... add up to several hours of ISK free guard duty that taxes the system. I don't blame them but in my limited experience it seems that many pvp oriented pilots are only in it if they are sure they can win. Sooner or later the bait and mug tactics get really old.
It reminds me that Eve is greater in it's sum than in it's parts.
That said I'm not docking up anytime soon.
You hit the nail, I entered PVP as a pirate almost a decade ago and it was very fun, then one day after a very long time of lowsec and ransoming I started as a merc (no more targets got boring also,) had fun for awhile (wait to get hired=worse+politcs) then tried out 0.0 and big fleet fights (mute mic, listen to FC, click f1, f2, or lead and play "car games" to stay awake.) Now all of that is either, boring,old or meanignless, also those moments that were fun was only 5% of playtime, rest was spent on afk, wait, camp, be camped, warp in, warp out, travel time, eft, evemon, forums which all was boring and nothing close to what we fell in love with and got us to buy the game and play it in the first place.
It is like, going to a club, you wanna get laid and you know that once in awhile you do by going there but in reality you spend most of your time bored, waisting money, talk to idiots and get in fights and dance to ****** music. But once in awhile you do it, because you think, maybe tonight I get a one nighter, but in reality you spend less and get more entertainment by just going to the brothel...
In this case eve=nightclub brothel=wow? whatever.
PS: Istill got another 6months ofplaytime thanks to plex so I wont leave, just wont play, changing skill from time to time will have to be it.
Also, cloaking devices=Boooring and just makes eve more boring, might as well reinstate mine fields |
2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
20
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 19:55:00 -
[97] - Quote
Large Collidable Object wrote:The problem with eve pvp is that for anyone smarter than a boiled egg, blobfights are boring. Unfortunately, they're the only means to achieve anything in Eve - want to take over a moon or hold some sov? POS-grinding, timers, another bazillion HP to grind here, wait for the timer to finish and the enemy to assemble his blob, or not showing up at all if you have the bigger blob - rinse and repeat...
Small gang pvp is fun, but serves absolutely no purpose in Eve and hence it's an end in itself and there's nothing to gain except killmails and k/d ratios that are considered good. Since there's nothing else to gain but KMs and stats, people are usually extremely risk averse and only engage when they are sure to win.
If there was a purpose for small gang pvp, people would probably risk more (as in "look - my small pvp alliance may have lost more ships than 'Red Clusterswarmlegiondot.' achieving our goal, but we managed to hack their moon-mining arrays and haul of 4 billion worth of tech in doing so...").
Very insightful and good thought, wow, nice,one of the best posts here
I agree and you could be on to a big reason as to why a big part of eve online PVP is boring. In many ways you just hit the nail, dead on. I figured arena might be nice because KM's and KB's are meaningless and stupid and a ranked ladder systemwould be way more good than that. I have been in so many fights where a fleet will jump 10+ jumps in order to get on a Killmail even though they were not part of the fight, because the KM=results which in turn=gratification even though nothing was achieved and what was gained sucked, a dude killed another dude but you wanna get there to be a part of that guys KM... |
2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
20
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 20:00:00 -
[98] - Quote
Of course such a system would get me to play and enjoy only one part of eve, arena, rest would still be boring and broken in my eyes and arena most likely too unless better balance is implemented etc. Real issues needs to be adressed as a whole on a big scale covering all mechanics of eve. But an arena would be something to do while waiting for CCP to make eve fun, but waiting for CCP takes longer than the wait for a kill so it might be another decade... |
Large Collidable Object
morons.
1040
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 21:08:00 -
[99] - Quote
2bhammered wrote:
I agree and you could be on to a big reason as to why a big part of eve online PVP is boring. In many ways you just hit the nail, dead on. I figured arena might be nice because KM's and KB's are meaningless and stupid and a ranked ladder systemwould be way more good than that. I have been in so many fights where a fleet will jump 10+ jumps in order to get on a Killmail even though they were not part of the fight, because the KM=results which in turn=gratification even though nothing was achieved and what was gained sucked, a dude killed another dude but you wanna get there to be a part of that guys KM...
I strongly oppose an Arena system and don't think killmails as such are a problem.
The problem is there is nothing else to gain but a killmail in small scale warfare.
I made a thread a few months ago where I asked people if they could come up with a single reason to go on a small scale roam other than fun and killmails - the thread ended up with 2 pages of replies and each one consisted of people who didn't even read the topics header and said 'because it's fun'.
Nobody could come up with a single ingame objective for small gangs. In a game that describes its setting as a dark, harsh universe filled with competing corporations it's kind of ridiculous that people shoot red crosses in highsec to mindlessly blow each other up in lowsec for no reason.
People always bring up some kind of payout for pvp kills, but that's a terrible idea as well. So we mindlessly shoot each other for no reason and magically, isk spawns in our wallets?
There need to be Objectives such as raidable moon-mining arrays which would also end the giant AFK-Empires that batphone each other once in a year to form a blob should their sov be threatened. morons- sting like a butterfly and-ápost like a bee. |
baltec1
503
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 21:23:00 -
[100] - Quote
PvP is only Boring if you make it boring. |
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2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
21
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 21:30:00 -
[101] - Quote
Large Collidable Object wrote:2bhammered wrote:
I agree and you could be on to a big reason as to why a big part of eve online PVP is boring. In many ways you just hit the nail, dead on. I figured arena might be nice because KM's and KB's are meaningless and stupid and a ranked ladder systemwould be way more good than that. I have been in so many fights where a fleet will jump 10+ jumps in order to get on a Killmail even though they were not part of the fight, because the KM=results which in turn=gratification even though nothing was achieved and what was gained sucked, a dude killed another dude but you wanna get there to be a part of that guys KM...
I strongly oppose an Arena system and don't think killmails as such are a problem. The problem is there is nothing else to gain but a killmail in small scale warfare. I made a thread a few months ago where I asked people if they could come up with a single reason to go on a small scale roam other than fun and killmails - the thread ended up with 2 pages of replies and each one consisted of people who didn't even read the topics header and said 'because it's fun'. Nobody could come up with a single ingame objective for small gangs. In a game that describes its setting as a dark, harsh universe filled with competing corporations it's kind of ridiculous that people shoot red crosses in highsec to mindlessly blow each other up in lowsec for no reason. People always bring up some kind of payout for pvp kills, but that's a terrible idea as well. So we mindlessly shoot each other for no reason and magically, isk spawns in our wallets? There need to be Objectives such as raidable moon-mining arrays which would also end the giant AFK-Empires that batphone each other once in a year to form a blob should their sov be threatened.
Maybe also why eve was fun more fun in the begining when few in small ships mattered.
I also think CCP has failed on gamedesign, perhaps arena moba style is not a solution but it would add a lot to the gamein my opinion. EvE is always about the wait it seems to me, wait for that magicalawesome payoff in entertainment, but it never delivers. Only time it delivered for me was when eve launched and people were clueless and I flew around in my rifter attacking someone or getting attacked in lowsec, at a BELT lol and we... good old m0o days etc.
Then we waited for that skill to finish or that ship that would change our experience or that war that in the end was more boring than a round of CS:S.
Wait for alliance tournament to watch? wait for ability to vote for your alliances candidate in the "great" election. WTF am I waiting for? a killboard that says we inflicted more ISK loss than we lost and write an RP essay on the forums claiming victory?? Is that what I got to look forward to in 2012? I had more exciting things to dream of while waiting for that skill to train or expansion/patch back in '04 or something. How does one win a war? you don't get bored and give up=can beat ANYONE in eve online if you just have patience and don't succumb to boredom.
And the way to get there is boring gameplay mechanics. With an arena I would at least be able to log on and fight with friends for a greater reward than a killmail, but you point out the fact it does not fix anything and I agree also the gameplay is STILL boring, so, what does one come upwith to make it more fun?
Hard thing to answer, indeed not easy at all. Perhaps one should first focus on the fact that waiting and less action=less fun and try and combat that and all the other things making PVP boring that islisted in this thread other than the reward of ISK.
So solving it would be to find a reason as to why fight in small gangs? we also need a reason as to why not always avoid a fight we know we wont win before it begins, we also need to make the actual mechanics of space ship combat more fun and action filled, even if one needs strategy,but CS:S has TONS of strategy so does sc2 etc and moba games yet gameplay mechanics are more fun and action filled than this so... thinking wait and trans speeds=strategy is stupid while pressing f1, f2 and f3, hmm use to be more buttons but now passive tanking rule so meh.
Ihave to come and fess up and say, capital ships suck and makes it more boring than fun in EVERY single way. Game was better when a battleship was "the ****" and balancing is just out of wack and gets worse by every ship they add to the game. Especially new ship classes. Cloaking also made things more boring. A game with frigate,cruiser and BS is 10 times easier to balance to and design for than 1million different things.
Still your question remains and I can only answer by saying that the answer is mostlikely made up of several different solutions and not by adding another 1 thing to fight over in the economic battle that is EVE which thanks to PLEX has infinite resources, aka, money does grow on trees.
Also because fights are so ****** and balance outof wack and everything else, KM/KB has less meaning and incentive than a CS:S clan match ever will. When I and many bought the game years ago we were under theimpression that it was the opposite, we wanted more meaning and emotional investment into a game than FPS games offered and for several reasons I have come to the conclusion that BoB's or mine (ascn) or goons or RA or whatever alliances accomplishments mattered less than my CS:S team and it costed more both in money and time investment than that I put into CS:S.
So what would think change by your gameplay mechanic on the scale of all of eve and how do you change the other stuff or deal with the implications? I would start by removing capital ships perhaps. |
2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
21
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 21:44:00 -
[102] - Quote
I think I could even argue that all accomplishments in WoW have more meaning and gratification and rewards than anything eve offers even when it comes to PVP. Leveling in this game is something a monkey can do, earning lots of ISK is easier than lots of gold timewise etc. Gear is better with again, more rewarding than any gear in eve offers, arena ranking takes more skill and gives more gratification + less invested time than any form of eve PVP has to offer (with possibleexception of once a year event of alliance tournament but I argue that even here WoW arena beats EVE.) Eve beats WOW in world pvp I guess, and ehm, more business savy people in eve than in wow and mining in eve can be done while being AFK...
Also in EVE one can become a master thief/scammer/scumbag and be hated more than anyone in WoW. |
Skywalker
MAFIA Pirate Coalition
11
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 21:55:00 -
[103] - Quote
It's not boring...
The catch is better then the prey |
Ptraci
StoneWall Metals Productions Bloodbound.
315
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 22:04:00 -
[104] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:Remove local. Embrace the unknown.
Yup. Have fun scanning... every ...f-cking ...system ...all the time. You won't be playing EVE anymore, you'll be playing Scan Probe online. Miners will have an advantage because all they need is to post cloaky scouts on the gates - so they will see you coming long before you even know they're there. PVP will be restricted to station and gate camping only. That what you want? |
2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
21
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 22:06:00 -
[105] - Quote
Ptraci wrote:Marlona Sky wrote:Remove local. Embrace the unknown. Yup. Have fun scanning... every ...f-cking ...system ...all the time. You won't be playing EVE anymore, you'll be playing Scan Probe online. Miners will have an advantage because all they need is to post cloaky scouts on the gates - so they will see you coming long before you even know they there. PVP will be restricted to station and gate camping only. That what you want?
remove cloaks solves both those problems. |
Ptraci
StoneWall Metals Productions Bloodbound.
316
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 22:12:00 -
[106] - Quote
2bhammered wrote:
remove cloaks solves both those problems.
Dream on. There are entire ship classes designed around the ability to cloak. While the cloak might be modified somewhat according to the CSM notes to deal with the ever-present AFK cloakers, cloaks are here to stay.
Edit: Also even if cloaks were gotten rid of, there's nothing stopping me from posting a trial account alt in a rookie ship on the gate. When the alt gets pwned, the miners log off. So removing local is still a silly idea that won't help increase PVP at all. Quite the opposite since now instead of running away from each other, people just won't be able to find each other. |
Large Collidable Object
morons.
1042
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 22:19:00 -
[107] - Quote
2bhammered wrote: So solving it would be to find a reason as to why fight in small gangs? we also need a reason as to why not always avoid a fight we know we wont win before it begins, we also need to make the actual mechanics of space ship combat more fun and action filled, even if one needs strategy,but CS:S has TONS of strategy so does sc2 etc and moba games yet gameplay mechanics are more fun and action filled than this so... thinking wait and trans speeds=strategy is stupid while pressing f1, f2 and f3, hmm use to be more buttons but now passive tanking rule so meh.
I think small scale pvp has great mechanics and involves quite some strategy - admittedly, when being the FC even blobs have. I've always viewed Eve as a space RTS like Homeworld, yet everyone only plays as many units as his multiboxing abilities allow. Maybe that's why I wonder why people are aimlessly sending expensive 'units' around without any objective.
Quote:Also because fights are so ****** and balance outof wack and everything else, KM/KB has less meaning and incentive than a CS:S clan match ever will. When I and many bought the game years ago we were under theimpression that it was the opposite, we wanted more meaning and emotional investment into a game than FPS games offered and for several reasons I have come to the conclusion that BoB's or mine (ascn) or goons or RA or whatever alliances accomplishments mattered less than my CS:S team and it costed more both in money and time investment than that I put into CS:S.
It depends on how much things matter to you - back in the days, I used to play Quakeworld and I would get totally pumped for clan matches. Then I became to old and slow, didn't enjoy the slower FPS, graduated, got a job ending up with less spare-time and started playing eve for the afk training and 'meaningful deaths' . To this day, I must admit that no single game got my adrenaline pumping as Eve has. I also must admit that when I was in CH until about 3-4 years ago, there were times I was totally addicted to killmails and I would go to work completely deprived of sleep because I just had to get kills the night before. Eventually I took a break and then I came back and started to ask 'why?' I keep joining alliances from time to time, but always end up with the fact that pvp either involves a blob (which I hate) or serves no purpose but PvP itself. You're obviously a tad more of a bittervet than I am in regards to the fact that I would still enjoy small gang pvp mechanics - I only have issues with the fact that there's no single strategic goal for it.
Quote: So what would think change by your gameplay mechanic on the scale of all of eve and how do you change the other stuff or deal with the implications? I would start by removing capital ships perhaps.
As I said - all Eve needs is goals for small gangs - stealing stuff from others is so much fun and whilst eve promotes that on a metagaming level, the ingame mechanics to steal anything of value without infiltrating an alliance are rather limited (meh - canflipping). Think of something akin to viking raids into enemy territory. I don't think eve needs much more as a first step. Alliances would depend on keeping their space populated or they would get robbed blind and vanish.
The only other problem is the fact that whilst Eve doesn't promote bigger=better (which is good), it heavily promotes bigger numbers=better. There should be a few advantages of fielding less people, like e.g. better mobility.
Of course a bigger number of comparable ships should beat fewer when it comes to an actual fight, but there should be a tactical advantage of bringing fewer ships too. However, that's hard to accomplish in a manner that doesn't get exploited - longer lock time with increasing number of hostile locks, stacking penalities on RR and DPS, spool timers on gates, speed penalties for bigger fleets etc... - I've read them all, but pretty much all of them are easily evaded or exploited. morons- sting like a butterfly and-ápost like a bee. |
Weiland Taur
Ceptic Innovations Rebel Alliance of New Eden
21
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 22:23:00 -
[108] - Quote
Ptraci wrote:[quote=2bhammered]
remove cloaks solves both those problems.
Outside of WH's cloaks aren't that big of a deal. In Sov space as soon a cloaky comes in everyone is aware of it and acts accordingly. I can't remember a time we stopped doing what we were doing because we had a peeping tom. The effect of the AFK cloaker is greatly exaggerated. I imagine it's more fun for the closet roleplayers who sit giggling thinking they have pos'd up everyone and now only need to stare intently to make us log off and wander over to World of Tanks.
Per pvp, I think it would be great if you could target specific modules/areas of a ship and if their was more of a chance of returning from a fight crippled but still in the same hull. Many times the undock, shoot, blow up, reship cycle makes the entire thing seem to lack a certain, purpose other than keeping the waters of that specific ISK sink flowing. That might be a bit romantic however and not practicable in a game play sense. |
met worst
The Drongo Club
115
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 22:29:00 -
[109] - Quote
Ptraci wrote:Marlona Sky wrote:Remove local. Embrace the unknown. Yup. Have fun scanning... every ...f-cking ...system ...all the time. You won't be playing EVE anymore, you'll be playing Scan Probe online. Miners will have an advantage because all they need is to post cloaky scouts on the gates - so they will see you coming long before you even know they're there. PVP will be restricted to station and gate camping only. That what you want? Remove local but give me a specialised ship with sweep radar that gives me range, bearing and azimuth to n au. Maybe even throw in a nice audible ping (only heard with an installed mod on a specialised ship) for the residents and they can hunt each other down.
Options: Anoms/Sigs/Belts distort the ping so you can't hear it. (kills off bots - even if they heard it, can a botscript detect sound?) Station mod detects ping and broadcasts audible sig to all blue. Range needs to improve to affect a stronger signal to get a lock. On lock, throw in a bubble probe that hones in on target and deploys on contact.
I could go on. I'm getting excited just thinkin' about it.
Gotta be better than docking/logging/safeing as soon as local wobbles a bit. |
2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
22
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 22:35:00 -
[110] - Quote
Weiland Taur wrote:Ptraci wrote:[quote=2bhammered]
remove cloaks solves both those problems. Outside of WH's cloaks aren't that big of a deal. In Sov space as soon a cloaky comes in everyone is aware of it and acts accordingly. I can't remember a time we stopped doing what we were doing because we had a peeping tom. The effect of the AFK cloaker is greatly exaggerated. I imagine it's more fun for the closet roleplayers who sit giggling thinking they have pos'd up everyone and now only need to stare intently to make us log off and wander over to World of Tanks. Per pvp, I think it would be great if you could target specific modules/areas of a ship and if their was more of a chance of returning from a fight crippled but still in the same hull. Many times the undock, shoot, blow up, reship cycle makes the entire thing seem to lack a certain, purpose other than keeping the waters of that specific ISK sink flowing. That might be a bit romantic however and not practicable in a game play sense.
I answered to cloaked scouts, as in defending/scouting gates not offensive or afk stealthers.
I do agree that specific targeting might be nice, but I rather go more simplistic for finding fun than go more complicated that CCP has over the last 5-6 years making the game less fun to me. What is needed to be found is a goodsimple core element that makes this game fun to begin with, then perhaps add depth?! |
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Lyrrashae
Crushed Ambitions Reckless Ambition
182
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 22:44:00 -
[111] - Quote
2bhammered wrote:Ptraci wrote:Marlona Sky wrote:Remove local. Embrace the unknown. Yup. Have fun scanning... every ...f-cking ...system ...all the time. You won't be playing EVE anymore, you'll be playing Scan Probe online. Miners will have an advantage because all they need is to post cloaky scouts on the gates - so they will see you coming long before you even know they there. PVP will be restricted to station and gate camping only. That what you want? remove fixed system-entry/exit-points solves both those problems.
Fixed.
Think of me as the Jester to your King Lear: Because annoying you is more fun than politicking with you. Because your predictable outrage makes you even more fun to play with. Because forum PvP = best PvP. Come to me, little puppet! |
2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
23
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 23:01:00 -
[112] - Quote
Lyrrashae wrote:2bhammered wrote:Ptraci wrote:Marlona Sky wrote:Remove local. Embrace the unknown. Yup. Have fun scanning... every ...f-cking ...system ...all the time. You won't be playing EVE anymore, you'll be playing Scan Probe online. Miners will have an advantage because all they need is to post cloaky scouts on the gates - so they will see you coming long before you even know they there. PVP will be restricted to station and gate camping only. That what you want? remove fixed system-entry/exit-points solves both those problems. Fixed.
I like it |
Marlona Sky
EntroPrelatial Vanguard EntroPraetorian Aegis
407
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 23:44:00 -
[113] - Quote
Ptraci wrote:Marlona Sky wrote:Remove local. Embrace the unknown. Yup. Have fun scanning... every ...f-cking ...system ...all the time. You won't be playing EVE anymore, you'll be playing Scan Probe online. Miners will have an advantage because all they need is to post cloaky scouts on the gates - so they will see you coming long before you even know they're there. PVP will be restricted to station and gate camping only. That what you want?
Which is why the scanner needs a total and complete overhaul at the same time. I have mentioned this what feels like, one thousand ******* times.
Something still tells me you will ***** anyways without having your instant intel so you can be safe 100% of the time regardless. It is pathetic scum like you that keeps this game stagnant and boring.
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Ptraci
StoneWall Metals Productions Bloodbound.
316
|
Posted - 2012.01.28 23:57:00 -
[114] - Quote
Marlona Sky wrote:
Something still tells me you will ***** anyways without having your instant intel so you can be safe 100% of the time regardless.
Er, I invite you to look me up on killboards if you think I like being safe all the time.
|
RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1314
|
Posted - 2012.01.29 01:03:00 -
[115] - Quote
met worst wrote:Ptraci wrote:Marlona Sky wrote:Remove local. Embrace the unknown. Yup. Have fun scanning... every ...f-cking ...system ...all the time. You won't be playing EVE anymore, you'll be playing Scan Probe online. Miners will have an advantage because all they need is to post cloaky scouts on the gates - so they will see you coming long before you even know they're there. PVP will be restricted to station and gate camping only. That what you want? Remove local but give me a specialised ship with sweep radar that gives me range, bearing and azimuth to n au. Maybe even throw in a nice audible ping (only heard with an installed mod on a specialised ship) for the residents and they can hunt each other down. Options: Anoms/Sigs/Belts distort the ping so you can't hear it. (kills off bots - even if they heard it, can a botscript detect sound?) Station mod detects ping and broadcasts audible sig to all blue. Range needs to improve to affect a stronger signal to get a lock. On lock, throw in a bubble probe that hones in on target and deploys on contact. I could go on. I'm getting excited just thinkin' about it. Gotta be better than docking/logging/safeing as soon as local wobbles a bit.
So local-level intel, but only for the invaders? Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
Teowulff Odinson
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
31
|
Posted - 2012.01.29 01:07:00 -
[116] - Quote
Large Collidable Object wrote: The problem is there is nothing else to gain but a killmail in small scale warfare.
I made a thread a few months ago where I asked people if they could come up with a single reason to go on a small scale roam other than fun and killmails - the thread ended up with 2 pages of replies and each one consisted of people who didn't even read the topics header and said 'because it's fun'.
There need to be Objectives such as raidable moon-mining arrays which would also end the giant AFK-Empires that batphone each other once in a year to form a blob should their sov be threatened.
I completely agree. I also proposed things like stealing from moon goo harvesters, attacking empty stations, the option to make hidden bases in nulsec. Perhaps even small areas of pirate faction controlled lowsec with neutral stations in between where you can have small trade hubs where people can sell stolen goods from raids and buy new ships and ammo if necessary. So you don't have to travel all the way back to highsec without cyno alts and jump drives.
That would make it a lot more exciting and give small gangs and even solo pilots and incentive a reason to go to nulsec. A little more space for real pirates among the suburban gang like nullbear alliances. |
2bhammered
Perkone Caldari State
27
|
Posted - 2012.01.29 21:58:00 -
[117] - Quote
Teowulff Odinson wrote:Large Collidable Object wrote: The problem is there is nothing else to gain but a killmail in small scale warfare.
I made a thread a few months ago where I asked people if they could come up with a single reason to go on a small scale roam other than fun and killmails - the thread ended up with 2 pages of replies and each one consisted of people who didn't even read the topics header and said 'because it's fun'.
There need to be Objectives such as raidable moon-mining arrays which would also end the giant AFK-Empires that batphone each other once in a year to form a blob should their sov be threatened.
I completely agree. I also proposed things like stealing from moon goo harvesters, attacking empty stations, the option to make hidden bases in nulsec. Perhaps even small areas of pirate faction controlled lowsec with neutral stations in between where you can have small trade hubs where people can sell stolen goods from raids and buy new ships and ammo if necessary. So you don't have to travel all the way back to highsec without cyno alts and jump drives. That would make it a lot more exciting and give small gangs and even solo pilots and incentive/ reason to go to nulsec. A little more space for real pirates among the suburban gang like nullbear alliances.
Those are good ideas.
So true about the batphone |
Pavel Bidermann
Aliastra Gallente Federation
84
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 04:01:00 -
[118] - Quote
Actually PvP is really boring in EVE. Sure, theres a brief moment where it seems okay, but its boring overall. the mechanics are okay, when they're actually working. Null is just crap because of how the players use it tbh.
I had more fun running gate camps in high and low sec than I did in null. Not much really going on in null. I don't know what happened.
I think the community broke during the summer of rage. Several people brought that up at the time and there was concern that it wouldn't heal. it doesn't seem to be getting better. Not at all. Sad really since it was a very active community at the time. Its all divided and entrenched now.
Maybe the PvP is still the same but the game itself isn't fun anymore. It was debatably fun before so there wasn't a lot of wiggle room to begin with. |
NaturalBeast
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
18
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 04:05:00 -
[119] - Quote
Because hitting F1 sucks? |
Astrid Stjerna
Teraa Matar
450
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 07:47:00 -
[120] - Quote
I don't find PvP boring at all, or at least I don't find fleet PvP boring.
It has a large part to do with who I'm flying with -- my corp and I tend to exchange jokes and stories when we're not actively flying from place-to-place. Also, waiting for someone to fly in and shoot at us can be tedious, but it's always balanced by the adrenaline rush I get as I see my shield meter creep upward when I finally engage.
I find solo PvP boring, simply because I have nobody to talk to and it's entirely likely that I'll get my head handed to me. At least in a fleet, my friends sympathize with the loss most of the time. ((Please note:-áAt times, my characters-ámay be a-holes, but-áI am most certainly not.-áWhat they say IC has no bearing on my OOC opinions or behaviors, and I apologize in advance if you are offended OOC by anything I might say or do-áIC.)) |
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