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FlinchingNinja Kishunuba
Bellum Esca
79
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Posted - 2012.01.15 12:22:00 -
[1] - Quote
It's been 3 days! Get out of my region! What is the deal with this? Locusts or something.... |
Akrasjel Lanate
Naquatech Conglomerate
506
|
Posted - 2012.01.15 13:04:00 -
[2] - Quote
FlinchingNinja Kishunuba wrote:It's been 3 days! Get out of my region! What is the deal with this? Locusts or something.... You need a final solution. |
FlinchingNinja Kishunuba
Bellum Esca
79
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Posted - 2012.01.15 13:10:00 -
[3] - Quote
Goons! If they wanna do something really useful teach them that the incursions and fleet warfare are meant to get them in to PvP not perpetual incursions..... |
Arazel Chainfire
Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension
71
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Posted - 2012.01.15 14:49:00 -
[4] - Quote
... you could instead go farm the incursion with everyone else. Or if it makes you that angry, you can get together a team to run the mothership and make it go away. But despite those feeble thoughts your mind is having, incursions aren't meant to teach PvP, they are meant to provide a PvE experience that forces you to work with a team.
-Arazel |
King Rothgar
Autocannons Anonymous
141
|
Posted - 2012.01.15 14:51:00 -
[5] - Quote
I have been toying with the idea of suicide ganking incursion runners. Haven't figured out a viable way yet sadly. I have found some interesting aggression mechanic exploits but I don't think that would work more than a couple times before people caught on. We need something sustainable like catalyst pairs knocking hulks out. It need not be profitable, but must atleast allow us to break even. It also needs to be doable with just 2-3 people. More than that gets tricky to setup and causes too many potential timing problems. If anyone has any ideas I'd love to hear them. |
FlinchingNinja Kishunuba
Bellum Esca
79
|
Posted - 2012.01.15 14:52:00 -
[6] - Quote
Let's ask CCP for the minutes of the meetings they had regarding incursions? |
FlinchingNinja Kishunuba
Bellum Esca
79
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Posted - 2012.01.15 14:54:00 -
[7] - Quote
So I assume the Incursion is gone when the Mom is destroyed? How do you find it and what sort of EHP on it? |
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
2702
|
Posted - 2012.01.15 16:48:00 -
[8] - Quote
*sight
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ GÇö Karath Piki |
Gaitrie
MagmaTech Industries
8
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Posted - 2012.01.15 16:51:00 -
[9] - Quote
yes - when the mom carrier is popped the incursion is ended. How you find it ? - go to an HQ site in the incursion site and look for The Kundalini manifest (Highh Sec) or Uroborus (low/null Sec) and there in ou will find teh mom carrier.
As for EHP I have no idea but with 80 ships it will take maybe 10 min to take it down >>> Mine is Bigger than Yours ! <<< |
Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
136
|
Posted - 2012.01.15 19:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=57522&find=unread
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Tarsus Zateki
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3
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Posted - 2012.01.15 21:23:00 -
[11] - Quote
King Rothgar wrote:I have been toying with the idea of suicide ganking incursion runners. Haven't figured out a viable way yet sadly. I have found some interesting aggression mechanic exploits but I don't think that would work more than a couple times before people caught on. We need something sustainable like catalyst pairs knocking hulks out. It need not be profitable, but must atleast allow us to break even. It also needs to be doable with just 2-3 people. More than that gets tricky to setup and causes too many potential timing problems. If anyone has any ideas I'd love to hear them.
Assuming you have sufficient bank a handful of Alpha Tornadoes will be able to kill Logistics without too much trouble. Then the rest of the fleet folds like a deck of cards. |
drdxie
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
19
|
Posted - 2012.01.15 23:01:00 -
[12] - Quote
Tarsus Zateki wrote:King Rothgar wrote:I have been toying with the idea of suicide ganking incursion runners. Haven't figured out a viable way yet sadly. I have found some interesting aggression mechanic exploits but I don't think that would work more than a couple times before people caught on. We need something sustainable like catalyst pairs knocking hulks out. It need not be profitable, but must atleast allow us to break even. It also needs to be doable with just 2-3 people. More than that gets tricky to setup and causes too many potential timing problems. If anyone has any ideas I'd love to hear them. Assuming you have sufficient bank a handful of Alpha Tornadoes will be able to kill Logistics without too much trouble. Then the rest of the fleet folds like a deck of cards.
Yea... cause incursion fleets are carebears and would never carry rep drones and remote reps in their spare high slots.
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Clementina
The Scope
49
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Posted - 2012.01.15 23:43:00 -
[13] - Quote
I'll bite.
The setup that I've seen be fashionable recently is three Basilisks transferring cap to each other while repairing each other and the rest of the fleet. Basilisks are not cap stable hence the necessity of the cap transfers. Scimitars are also used, and they are cap stable. Typically ships will be omni-tanked with 80%+ resists all around and then hitpoints after that to provide buffer.
To disrupt a vanguard fleet it is necessary to nuke 2 out of 3 Basilisks. It is possible to complete Vanguard sites with two Basilisks, but nuking a logistics can make the rest of the fleet panic and therefore cause its destruction. Nuking 2 of their logistics will surely cause the rest of the fleet to fail, no matter how calm they are. Alpha makes repairing not matter very much. If you can get past their EHP then they are done. A more finessefull way of disrupting an incursion fleet is to neut down one of the logistics. But now you do have to worry about the opposition having repair drones or remote reps on their DPS ships.
When I say that repairing doesn't matter, I'm assuming that you can do the 25k-ish damage that you will need to destroy a logistics in the same instant. Assuming that (Against advise) you content yourself to only destroy one logistic ship, and the logistic pilot broadcasts as soon as he is yellow boxed like is fashionable in incursion fleets. Then the logistic ship will be able to gain 4983 shields per second as the two other logistics ships feed him shields. If you don't destroy them on the first shot then they will not die.
If I'm wrong, I'm sure you'll say something in the rest of the thread. |
Lebens
Black Vice Industries Externus Hostis
7
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Posted - 2012.01.16 00:46:00 -
[14] - Quote
Everyone has to find something to complain about. Of course incursions are going to be farmed, that was the intent when they were made. Fit up a ship, and go run some incursions, lean about them before you complain. |
RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1216
|
Posted - 2012.01.16 04:06:00 -
[15] - Quote
Akrasjel Lanate wrote:FlinchingNinja Kishunuba wrote:It's been 3 days! Get out of my region! What is the deal with this? Locusts or something.... You need a final solution.
This is one of those days where you roll an alt. Gobbler, or Hit the Lurs. That's who you say these things with for maximum effect.
Edit: Poastin Drunk agin. dAWwww, here he goes. -áPoastin' Drunk agin. |
Cambarus
Baros Reloaded
117
|
Posted - 2012.01.16 04:24:00 -
[16] - Quote
drdxie wrote:Tarsus Zateki wrote:King Rothgar wrote:I have been toying with the idea of suicide ganking incursion runners. Haven't figured out a viable way yet sadly. I have found some interesting aggression mechanic exploits but I don't think that would work more than a couple times before people caught on. We need something sustainable like catalyst pairs knocking hulks out. It need not be profitable, but must atleast allow us to break even. It also needs to be doable with just 2-3 people. More than that gets tricky to setup and causes too many potential timing problems. If anyone has any ideas I'd love to hear them. Assuming you have sufficient bank a handful of Alpha Tornadoes will be able to kill Logistics without too much trouble. Then the rest of the fleet folds like a deck of cards. Yea... cause incursion fleets are carebears and would never carry rep drones and remote reps in their spare high slots. the thing with incursions is that they tend to put out a lot of DPS on their own, about 1500 for the easiest one, and 4k+ near the end of the hardest ones (vanguards that is).
TBH though I'd take neuts over trying to alpha the logis. 2-3 heavy neuts on each basi and they should be rendered useless. Hell you could even get together a group of 10 guys, get 3-4b worth of kills and they wouldn't even know what was happening until you started shooting ("hey look guys competition, lol they're in t1 BSs") |
RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1216
|
Posted - 2012.01.16 04:25:00 -
[17] - Quote
Cambarus wrote:drdxie wrote:Tarsus Zateki wrote:King Rothgar wrote:I have been toying with the idea of suicide ganking incursion runners. Haven't figured out a viable way yet sadly. I have found some interesting aggression mechanic exploits but I don't think that would work more than a couple times before people caught on. We need something sustainable like catalyst pairs knocking hulks out. It need not be profitable, but must atleast allow us to break even. It also needs to be doable with just 2-3 people. More than that gets tricky to setup and causes too many potential timing problems. If anyone has any ideas I'd love to hear them. Assuming you have sufficient bank a handful of Alpha Tornadoes will be able to kill Logistics without too much trouble. Then the rest of the fleet folds like a deck of cards. Yea... cause incursion fleets are carebears and would never carry rep drones and remote reps in their spare high slots. the thing with incursions is that they tend to put out a lot of DPS on their own, about 1500 for the easiest one, and 4k+ near the end of the hardest ones (vanguards that is). TBH though I'd take neuts over trying to alpha the logis. 2-3 heavy neuts on each basi and they should be rendered useless. Hell you could even get together a group of 10 guys, get 3-4b worth of kills and they wouldn't even know what was happening until you started shooting ("hey look guys competition, lol they're in t1 BSs")
Go-go-Gadget-Blackbird fleet. dAWwww, here he goes. -áPoastin' Drunk agin. |
King Rothgar
Autocannons Anonymous
143
|
Posted - 2012.01.16 04:29:00 -
[18] - Quote
Clementina wrote:I'll bite.
The setup that I've seen be fashionable recently is three Basilisks transferring cap to each other while repairing each other and the rest of the fleet. Basilisks are not cap stable hence the necessity of the cap transfers. Scimitars are also used, and they are cap stable. Typically ships will be omni-tanked with 80%+ resists all around and then hitpoints after that to provide buffer.
To disrupt a vanguard fleet it is necessary to nuke 2 out of 3 Basilisks. It is possible to complete Vanguard sites with two Basilisks, but nuking a logistics can make the rest of the fleet panic and therefore cause its destruction. Nuking 2 of their logistics will surely cause the rest of the fleet to fail, no matter how calm they are. Alpha makes repairing not matter very much. If you can get past their EHP then they are done. A more finessefull way of disrupting an incursion fleet is to neut down one of the logistics. But now you do have to worry about the opposition having repair drones or remote reps on their DPS ships.
When I say that repairing doesn't matter, I'm assuming that you can do the 25k-ish damage that you will need to destroy a logistics in the same instant. Assuming that (Against advise) you content yourself to only destroy one logistic ship, and the logistic pilot broadcasts as soon as he is yellow boxed like is fashionable in incursion fleets. Then the logistic ship will be able to gain 4983 shields per second as the two other logistics ships feed him shields. If you don't destroy them on the first shot then they will not die.
If I'm wrong, I'm sure you'll say something in the rest of the thread.
I thought of that but as said, you must be able to atleast break even and we are talking suicide ganking here. War decing does not work since they just won't undock or will change corps. Additionally, basi's have around 40k EHP without ganglinks or implants, not 25k. It would take no less than 4x alpha tornado's to kill one basi and 8x to break the chain. Realistically you're going to have to assume they have links, in that case it's about 58k EHP. Thus you'll need 12x alpha tornado's to break their logi chain.
The basi's themselves are not terribly profitable in loot. You can expect perhaps 5-10M isk off each of them in potential loot. Other ships that die will be left to random chance and there is a good chance none will die since most incursion NPC's do not point you. Thus all the shiny **** is very likely to escape. Even if it does go down, you still need a way to loot the field. That in turn means that in addition to those 12x GCC tornado pilots, you're also going to need 2-3 logi and probably a dps ship (kill any scramblers) that are not outlaw or GCC to go grab all the loot. That's 16 guys, far too many for this to be practical. It's also terribly expensive for suicide ganking. With this many guys you are far better off alpha'ing a pimped ship directly on a gate/station and I'm pretty sure you'd lose isk unless they are covered in x-type stuff.
This is not the way to do it, it is not practical. We need a way to nuke 200M isk worth of ships for the low price of 4M isk (ignoring loot and insurance) as is the case with catalysts ganking hulks. We also need something to shout in local upon attack. Allah akbar doesn't seem suitable, we need something decidedly sansha RP-ish. First things first though, we need a way to gank them. |
Cambarus
Baros Reloaded
117
|
Posted - 2012.01.16 04:30:00 -
[19] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Cambarus wrote:drdxie wrote:Tarsus Zateki wrote:King Rothgar wrote:I have been toying with the idea of suicide ganking incursion runners. Haven't figured out a viable way yet sadly. I have found some interesting aggression mechanic exploits but I don't think that would work more than a couple times before people caught on. We need something sustainable like catalyst pairs knocking hulks out. It need not be profitable, but must atleast allow us to break even. It also needs to be doable with just 2-3 people. More than that gets tricky to setup and causes too many potential timing problems. If anyone has any ideas I'd love to hear them. Assuming you have sufficient bank a handful of Alpha Tornadoes will be able to kill Logistics without too much trouble. Then the rest of the fleet folds like a deck of cards. Yea... cause incursion fleets are carebears and would never carry rep drones and remote reps in their spare high slots. the thing with incursions is that they tend to put out a lot of DPS on their own, about 1500 for the easiest one, and 4k+ near the end of the hardest ones (vanguards that is). TBH though I'd take neuts over trying to alpha the logis. 2-3 heavy neuts on each basi and they should be rendered useless. Hell you could even get together a group of 10 guys, get 3-4b worth of kills and they wouldn't even know what was happening until you started shooting ("hey look guys competition, lol they're in t1 BSs") Go-go-Gadget-Blackbird fleet. You'd get more kills with a group of megas I think
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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex Cosmic Consortium
905
|
Posted - 2012.01.16 07:12:00 -
[20] - Quote
You could simply pose as logistics and warp out mid-fight. Or if you don't wish to risk losing a ship due to warp scramming NPCs (Tama Cerebellum, Schmael Medulla, Delltole Tegmentum), just keep repping yourselves while the rest of the fleet dies. Then your friendly fleet warps in and finishes the site, leaving you all the shiny loot to recover in perfect safety.
This should work a couple of times until your character's name appears on blacklists. Of course you will not get any kill mails, but that's not what PVP is about, right?
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Patri Andari
Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer
50
|
Posted - 2012.01.16 16:09:00 -
[21] - Quote
Not that I have ever been involved in ganks and such, why not think out side the box? ECM on logis means dead damage dealers. Scorpion is the only ship that gets a boost when using ECM burst. (most powerful ECM in game iirc)
So would this work?
[Scorpion, logi hunter] Power Diagnostic System I Power Diagnostic System I Power Diagnostic System I Damage Control I
100MN MicroWarpdrive I ECM Burst II Stasis Webifier I Stasis Webifier I Photon Scattering Field I Invulnerability Field I Large Shield Extender I Large Shield Extender I
Large EMP Smartbomb I Large EMP Smartbomb I Large EMP Smartbomb I Large EMP Smartbomb I Large EMP Smartbomb I Large EMP Smartbomb I
[empty rig slot] [empty rig slot] [empty rig slot]
Ogre SD-900 x2 Hammerhead SD-600 x2 Hobgoblin SD-300 x1
Very cheap and can add rigs or T2 to taste or wallet. Also can adjust smartbomb damage and resists. Had thoughts on switching a mid for a cap charge booster but whatever.
Approach 1st logi and when in web range lock it and the nearest 2nd logi. Sic drones on logi #2, pulse burst. Web Logi #1 and activate smarties. Re-activate burst as often as it cycles or until Concord shows up.
If you are lucky at least 2 of the 3 logis loose lock. Logi #2 can try to regain lock but the drones should slow that down. Logi # 1 is proper f*cked.
Report back.
HTH
Patri
Miners! Make Moar Isks Nao! |
XXSketchxx
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
93
|
Posted - 2012.01.16 16:35:00 -
[22] - Quote
King Rothgar wrote:I have been toying with the idea of suicide ganking incursion runners. Haven't figured out a viable way yet sadly. I have found some interesting aggression mechanic exploits but I don't think that would work more than a couple times before people caught on. We need something sustainable like catalyst pairs knocking hulks out. It need not be profitable, but must atleast allow us to break even. It also needs to be doable with just 2-3 people. More than that gets tricky to setup and causes too many potential timing problems. If anyone has any ideas I'd love to hear them.
Remove Concord from Incursion areas.
Problem solved. |
drdxie
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
19
|
Posted - 2012.01.16 19:15:00 -
[23] - Quote
XXSketchxx wrote:King Rothgar wrote:I have been toying with the idea of suicide ganking incursion runners. Haven't figured out a viable way yet sadly. I have found some interesting aggression mechanic exploits but I don't think that would work more than a couple times before people caught on. We need something sustainable like catalyst pairs knocking hulks out. It need not be profitable, but must atleast allow us to break even. It also needs to be doable with just 2-3 people. More than that gets tricky to setup and causes too many potential timing problems. If anyone has any ideas I'd love to hear them. Remove Concord from Incursion areas. Problem solved.
They did, its called LS and Null sec, go check it out some time.... Oh wait.. you might get shot at and you certainly don't want to be a target... just a bully
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Tasko Pal
Spallated Garniferous Schist
184
|
Posted - 2012.01.16 23:15:00 -
[24] - Quote
King Rothgar wrote:
This is not the way to do it, it is not practical. We need a way to nuke 200M isk worth of ships for the low price of 4M isk (ignoring loot and insurance) as is the case with catalysts ganking hulks. We also need something to shout in local upon attack. Allah akbar doesn't seem suitable, we need something decidedly sansha RP-ish. First things first though, we need a way to gank them.
Maybe this isn't your speed. Ever thought about ambushing roids? They never see it coming. |
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