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Pbatt
Gravit Negotii
0
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Posted - 2011.12.27 04:24:00 -
[1] - Quote
What would get a new player started in the game so that they would be able to enjoy a bit of everything right off the bat?
Sure there are differing opinions but what sort of things seem to be beneficial and what sort of things seem to be insignificant? |
Roscojameson
The Riot Formation
7
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Posted - 2011.12.27 04:30:00 -
[2] - Quote
Tell them to finish the tutorial missions, then give them 10 rifter/tristan/merllin/punisher and a handful of T1 modules and tell them to go to low-sec and kill some s***. |
Roh Voleto
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
79
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Posted - 2011.12.27 04:40:00 -
[3] - Quote
A PLEX, so they won't have to deal with trail restrictions. |
Pbatt
Gravit Negotii
0
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Posted - 2011.12.27 04:47:00 -
[4] - Quote
Roscojameson wrote:Tell them to finish the tutorial missions, then give them 10 rifter/tristan/merllin/punisher and a handful of T1 modules and tell them to go to low-sec and kill some s***.
This seems plausable but what other skills not provided in the tutorials?
Perhaps also a destroyer for missions? |
Endeavour Starfleet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
59
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Posted - 2011.12.27 04:49:00 -
[5] - Quote
The best thing for newer players to have fun and make isk is to get into a corp. Yet the barrier of entry into good corps is pretty big.
The priority needs to be more ways to isolate and prevent spies acting as newer players to deal damage. The modular POS system and new corporation controls would go a HUGE way towards that.
Then you need to completely scrap the current wardec system. 90 percent of the time it is used to grief those who don't know how to use dec shields and that prevents smaller groups from using the corp system correctly. It needs to be scrapped asap and a new better system involving benefits for actually fighting outside of keeping your ship but that is for another discussion.
My idea for massively boosting mining barge hull HP needs to be implemented. Losing your first expensive ship to a catalyst isn't going to be fun for newer members. |
Pbatt
Gravit Negotii
0
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Posted - 2011.12.27 04:56:00 -
[6] - Quote
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:The best thing for newer players to have fun and make isk is to get into a corp. Yet the barrier of entry into good corps is pretty big.
I completely agree with this.
The thing im missing right now is what is fun to newer players right off the bat?
Someone earlier posted the idea to first finish the tutorials which in themselves are boring and then give 10 frigs and assorted modules and head to low sec.
I wonder if that would frustrate more than it would benefit though. |
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
165
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:01:00 -
[7] - Quote
Pbatt wrote:Endeavour Starfleet wrote:The best thing for newer players to have fun and make isk is to get into a corp. Yet the barrier of entry into good corps is pretty big.
I completely agree with this. The thing im missing right now is what is fun to newer players right off the bat? Someone earlier posted the idea to first finish the tutorials which in themselves are boring and then give 10 frigs and assorted modules and head to low sec. I wonder if that would frustrate more than it would benefit though.
Well they will get shot every time and they will not kill anything. . Depend if they have fun being punished. |
Evei Shard
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
32
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:06:00 -
[8] - Quote
A T3 cruiser based on their race, strip fit except modules and weapons that help them kill miners. Profit favors the prepared |
Revman Zim
Babylon Holdings United Interstellar Federation
1
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:07:00 -
[9] - Quote
You can also try the Career Agents. These are available under Agent Finder .
This will give you a taste of some of the careers available in EVE. Not all of them of course, but some of the major ones. The thing to do is find something that interests you, find a corp that supports that interest, skill for that interest and go for it.
You will get a lot of advice on what to do or not to do. Some good, some bad and some in the middle. Just remember, it is your dime you are spending for the game, get the most out of it. As long as you are having fun then it is worth the dime.
EVE has a steep learning curve, once you get past that or at least understand that, you will have a much more enjoyable experience. |
Endeavour Starfleet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
59
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:08:00 -
[10] - Quote
Pbatt wrote:Endeavour Starfleet wrote:The best thing for newer players to have fun and make isk is to get into a corp. Yet the barrier of entry into good corps is pretty big.
I completely agree with this. The thing im missing right now is what is fun to newer players right off the bat? Someone earlier posted the idea to first finish the tutorials which in themselves are boring and then give 10 frigs and assorted modules and head to low sec. I wonder if that would frustrate more than it would benefit though.
frustrate... Those 10 frigs will do nothing to benefit and the griefers would quickly use it to learn when to expect flocks of noobs to pad their killboards.
You've got to get em into groups. EVE uni does a good job with this but not everyone wants to go there. Forming anything less than a 10-20 char corp in hisec is asking for a wardec so current systems encourages you to stay in a noob corp.
If you are a noob you look at the big boys and want to join them. They take one look at your char b-day and suspect you are a spy. Because of current POS mechanics giving you a chance means putting other peoples stuff at risk. Especially ships.
It is a no win scn for those who are truly new to the game and not invited by a friend. |
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Pbatt
Gravit Negotii
0
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:18:00 -
[11] - Quote
@ Endeavour
Getting younger players into groups. I like that idea. Have them sit next to an orca in their mining frigate and fill it or have an FC do a corp frigate roam through null sec that seems like the right way to get people.
Also getting them into groups just so they can experience their start in the game together also your saying?
Get 20 young players into the game at the start of their careers so they can hurdle their early problems together and then feel a sense of comraderie. Is that what your getting at? |
Varve
Oredustries
1
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:19:00 -
[12] - Quote
Pbatt wrote:Roscojameson wrote:Tell them to finish the tutorial missions, then give them 10 rifter/tristan/merllin/punisher and a handful of T1 modules and tell them to go to low-sec and kill some s***. This seems plausable but what other skills not provided in the tutorials? Perhaps also a destroyer for missions?
You get a destroyer from the career agents
You also (all but pointlessly) get some skillbooks like prop jamming twice. |
MadMuppet
Kerguelen Station
19
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:30:00 -
[13] - Quote
Short of pointing people to the tutorials and telling them to read like mad and hope it all makes sense, you would need to point them away from the forums (too toxic). What the game REALLY needs is two part:
1. Live people, preferably on live voice, that can teach people. The problem herein lies that wrong advice is bad and that the questions often degrade in to 'What is the best.. blah blah blah. It would drive a preacher to drink or WC Fields to sobriety.
2. And this is the harder part, players need to understand that the game requires patients and a direct grasp that this game moves at about half the speed of other MMOs in its overall pacing.
Other things I would consider:
No killmails for the first seven days awarded to anybody killing a fresh account's life if they do not start the fight (or no killmails at all on a fight against any 7-day toon or less (unless it is a paid account)
Rookie chat be modified in to two windows, the window we have now and a second window where responding players can right click- on the questioner's name and then answer. Everybody sees the reply in the first window, but the second window only shows directed replies to the user. Too much is lost in the chaos we call rookie help (same should be done with regular help). Yes, I only have a Vigil, I've had a bad bit of luck Ok? |
Amitious Turkey
The Scope Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:38:00 -
[14] - Quote
Wasn't there a corp called Eve University that helped out noobs in this way? If they're still around, I'd direct more newbies in their direction. No doubt they need volunteer teachers as well. I like to lick things.
Haunting the forums since 03. |
Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
211
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:41:00 -
[15] - Quote
Amitious Turkey wrote:Wasn't there a corp called Eve University that helped out noobs in this way? If they're still around, I'd direct more newbies in their direction. No doubt they need volunteer teachers as well.
They are very much still around and the best starting place to learn the ropes of the game.
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Hainnz
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
21
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:43:00 -
[16] - Quote
A new player needs at least one of these two things: a friend, or pure bloody-minded stubbornness.
I honestly have no idea how I survived my first 6-9 months of this game, running endless L1 and L2 missions. Heck, I freaking mined veldspar in a bantam for at least a month! :)
Even now I'd love to have one person I could actually trust to do things with in this game. Alts don't cut it. IMO, a 4m skill point newb is more valuable flying with you than a 40m skill point alt. Unfortunately the few people I know who play these kinds of games won't touch EVE with a 10' pole. I keep getting dragged off to play WoW or CoH/CoV or LoTRO or SWTOR or whatever, with them. No one wants to play EVE (scamming, grief-play, bots, game dev scandals, alts, slow real time based character advancement, character selling, etc.). EVE has much in it that many people find unappealing, unfortunately. |
Morganta
Peripheral Madness The Midget Mafia
621
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Posted - 2011.12.27 05:55:00 -
[17] - Quote
Pbatt wrote:Roscojameson wrote:Tell them to finish the tutorial missions, then give them 10 rifter/tristan/merllin/punisher and a handful of T1 modules and tell them to go to low-sec and kill some s***. This seems plausable but what other skills not provided in the tutorials? Perhaps also a destroyer for missions?
you can pick up a destroyer in the tutorial missions as a reward people already get all this stuff if they play the game.
need something more special to make bittervets cry... I mean to entice new players to take that big step into a new universe
The American public's reaction to the change was poor and the new cola was a major marketing failure. The subsequent reintroduction of Coke's original formula, re-branded as "Coca-Cola Classic", resulted in a significant gain in sales, leading to speculation that the introduction of the New Coke formula was just a marketing ploy |
Endeavour Starfleet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
59
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Posted - 2011.12.27 06:48:00 -
[18] - Quote
Not just groups of noobs. Something to help noobs get to experience the game early is experienced corps. But again it takes too much trust.
Yes a noob isn't going to be able to do much inside of nullsec but mine and clean up after people clear anoms. Yet there can be opportunities to do things. Learn from experience. Watch with wonder as massive groups form.
Compared to doing l1s and 2s for months the choice is clear. But because of current mechanics the big corps cant risk that noob turning out to be a spy. |
Dbars Grinding
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
84
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Posted - 2011.12.27 06:58:00 -
[19] - Quote
When i was a new player i finished the tutorials. Then i got my frigate rewards went to lowsec and yelled at everyone in local andcalled them many choice names. It was actually really fun because a lot of people took the bait. |
rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
84
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Posted - 2011.12.27 07:17:00 -
[20] - Quote
Implants are very helpful early on. |
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Endeavour Starfleet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
61
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Posted - 2011.12.27 08:00:00 -
[21] - Quote
rodyas wrote:Implants are very helpful early on.
And so is a good use of a remap. But they would never know just how important tanking skills are until they are specced for damage training and keep losing your drake.
Yes if they get into EVE uni they would help them make good long term choices. However it is not enough. |
Avensys
United Highsec Front The 99 Percent
5
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Posted - 2011.12.27 08:25:00 -
[22] - Quote
when some fhc guys checked out Serenity this summer you'd get 1 destroyer, 4 frigates and 80m ISK as a welcome package over there |
Vyl Vit
Cambio Enterprises
139
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Posted - 2011.12.27 09:37:00 -
[23] - Quote
Roscojameson wrote:Tell them to finish the tutorial missions, then give them 10 rifter/tristan/merllin/punisher and a handful of T1 modules and tell them to go to low-sec and kill some s***. Ahar! Tell them to go to the low sec area where you are? FRESH MEAT? Too funny. Send a noob to low sec to "kill" something. In this kill or be killed world, somebody has to die...might as well be a noob...(is that redundant - or patently obvious?)
To her it doesn't matter much.-á It's chasms have been leapt, and she leans upon the skepticism of her chosen fate. |
Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1383
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Posted - 2011.12.27 09:42:00 -
[24] - Quote
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:Not just groups of noobs. Something to help noobs get to experience the game early is experienced corps. But again it takes too much trust.
Yes a noob isn't going to be able to do much inside of nullsec but mine and clean up after people clear anoms. Yet there can be opportunities to do things. Learn from experience. Watch with wonder as massive groups form.
Compared to doing l1s and 2s for months the choice is clear. But because of current mechanics the big corps cant risk that noob turning out to be a spy.
Goonswarm takes newbies (from SA) and hands them no end of Rifters, salvaging destroyers and skillbooks. We nurture them, from the point where they are newbies barely training Propulsion Jamming I, showering them with ISK, ships and scamming advice, until they are jaded bittervets with nothing but contempt for the game.
Newbie to bittervet in 6 months guaranteed~ |
Endeavour Starfleet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
61
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Posted - 2011.12.27 09:48:00 -
[25] - Quote
Andski wrote:Endeavour Starfleet wrote:Not just groups of noobs. Something to help noobs get to experience the game early is experienced corps. But again it takes too much trust.
Yes a noob isn't going to be able to do much inside of nullsec but mine and clean up after people clear anoms. Yet there can be opportunities to do things. Learn from experience. Watch with wonder as massive groups form.
Compared to doing l1s and 2s for months the choice is clear. But because of current mechanics the big corps cant risk that noob turning out to be a spy. Goonswarm takes newbies (from SA) and hands them no end of Rifters, salvaging destroyers and skillbooks. We nurture them, from the point where they are newbies barely training Propulsion Jamming I, showering them with ISK, ships and scamming advice, until they are jaded bittervets with nothing but contempt for the game. Newbie to bittervet in 6 months guaranteed~
And I come from the planet mars.
Goon scams aside. Again what is needed for the majority out there is more ways to isolate newbies so that they cant make off with stuff that isn't theirs if they are a spy.
This won't end the outright mistrust of noobs into the big corps but it will help significantly. Thus the modular pos really ought to be up there on the priority list.
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Andski
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1383
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Posted - 2011.12.27 09:53:00 -
[26] - Quote
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:And I come from the planet mars. Goon scams aside. Again what is needed for the majority out there is more ways to isolate newbies so that they cant make off with stuff that isn't theirs if they are a spy. This won't end the outright mistrust of noobs into the big corps but it will help significantly. Thus the modular pos really ought to be up there on the priority list.
It isn't a scam, it's just that you can't join ;p
It's easy as hell to prevent people from running off with your corp's assets - don't give everyone corp hangar and POS roles when not needed. |
Sisohiv
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
3
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Posted - 2011.12.27 09:56:00 -
[27] - Quote
CCP tried to SP jumpstart new players. You started with around 900K and based on race and career lines, you got what would benefit you best.
You started up with a few 5's trained and several 4's that turned in to throw away alts for players who knew what it all meant. (out of the box Nav 5 winmatar nano scouts) Noobs just saw it as confusing and monorail character development. |
Endeavour Starfleet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
61
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Posted - 2011.12.27 10:03:00 -
[28] - Quote
Andski wrote:Endeavour Starfleet wrote:And I come from the planet mars. Goon scams aside. Again what is needed for the majority out there is more ways to isolate newbies so that they cant make off with stuff that isn't theirs if they are a spy. This won't end the outright mistrust of noobs into the big corps but it will help significantly. Thus the modular pos really ought to be up there on the priority list. It isn't a scam, it's just that you can't join ;p It's easy as hell to prevent people from running off with your corp's assets - don't give everyone corp hangar and POS roles when not needed.
That is just it. Because there is not a modular system for isolation and POS control for corps. It becomes a risk to let people in. That leads to BS like alliances demanding your Full API for the duration (Read my EVEmail wtf?)
Modular means you can give that new player his isolated spot in the ship array so he cant make off with them all when he gets mad that they didn't save him from the neut that showed up.
There was a big description of the system during the vote some time back.
And PS it is a scam. |
Avensys
United Highsec Front The 99 Percent
5
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Posted - 2011.12.27 10:08:00 -
[29] - Quote
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:And I come from the planet mars. Andski is not lying to you.
Here's a GSF newbie guide written for a recruitment drive in 2010:
http://cdn.goonfleet.com/newbies/newbieguide.pdf
As for "newbies are useless in 0.0" take a look at goonswarm's 30 day training plan (page 22 in the guide linked above):
Quote: Day 1: Tackling Afterburner frigate: Rifter Day 1: Basic learning skills Day 2: Tackling MicroWarpdrive frigate: Rifter Day 3: Salvaging destroyer: Thrasher Day 9: Basic support skills and advanced learning skills Day 11: DPS cruiser: Caracal Day 11: Level 2 mission running cruiser: Caracal Day 12: Logistics cruiser: Osprey Day 13: ECM cruiser: Blackbird Day 20: Ratting battlecruiser: Drake Day 28: Reimbursement PvP battlecruiser: Drake
For the full plan and fittings see the goon wiki or any mirror (e.g. http://crackerjax.org/gwiki/GoonWIki/wiki.goonfleet.com/30_Day_Plan.html).
GSF offers a great environment for newbies (from the SA forums). |
Endeavour Starfleet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
61
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Posted - 2011.12.27 10:20:00 -
[30] - Quote
Yes for SA forum users not the random people that get suckered in and ganked when they intend to join and not know about the SA involvement to join now can we get back on topic?
One thing I have thought that does not help is some peoples outright hostile attitude towards newer players. If you tell a newer player to "Adapt or GTFO" he/she will likely do the latter. I have actually been laughed at when I described EVE in that you lose your stuff when you die. Losing a frig may be child's play to us. But to a newer player it is a disaster. Especially when that player is alone and confused.
What I want to do is during the times I rather not salvage my missions I may ask if newer players (there is usually a starter system some jumps over) If they would like to join the group for some phat loot if they salvage them.
Stupid? Yes as with low salvage skills they will take forever to salvage a good lvl4 site. Yet for them that is a goldmine. And for the community my opinion is that it is for the best. The tiny limited effect it can have on the market from noobs following us in salvage destroyers is tiny tiny compared to the benefit of someone not quitting after their trial is up. More players = more active accounts and that means more funds to aid development for all of us. |
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