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Mr Manufacture
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Posted - 2007.03.08 20:52:00 -
[1]
O Thief > hi
crazy bear > hi
crazy bear > how much for a buyout on the bpo?
O Thief > 10bn
O Thief > an identical BPO went on the auction forum for 12bn about 6 weeks ago
crazy bear > i am aware of this
crazy bear > give me 2 minutes to discuss with corp banker please
O Thief > rgr
crazy bear > ok we will take it
O Thief > I will put a contract up in Jita
O Thief > can you claim it quickly?
crazy bear > yes thte corp banker can claim the contract immediatly
crazy bear > do you know how to set it up so he can claim it from 0.0?
O Thief > he can claim a contract from anywhere, what is his name?
O Thief > i need to put the contract in his name so he can access it remotely
O Thief > i can explain how to do that
crazy bear > no it must be made to my corp
crazy bear > we dont give out his name
O Thief > erm
O Thief > how do i make it for your corp?
O Thief > not done a corp one before
crazy bear > ok
crazy bear > create new - auction - private
crazy bear > name = what ya got on my 40
crazy bear > select item - next
O Thief > rgr, i'm doing it as an item exchange
crazy bear > im pretty sure it doesnt work out of region
O Thief > No owner can be found with 'what ya got on me 40' in the beginning its name.
crazy bear > what ya got on MY 40
O Thief > rgr
O Thief > it will work out of region
crazy bear > ok
O Thief > okay its up
O Thief > <url=contract:30000142//1041263>Heavy Neutron Blaster II Blueprint</url>
O Thief > there is the link to the contract
crazy bear > kk 2 seconds i link to banker
O Thief > or if he goes into contracts, selects 'my corporation' from the view bar, and leaves everything else blank, it should pop up
crazy bear > he says he cannot claim
crazy bear > <br>This contract is in The Forge. You can only access outstanding contracts in the region you are currently in.
crazy bear > this is eror he gets
O Thief > oooh maybe they have changed that since i last did a contract
O Thief > you used to be able to claim item exchange contracts from anywhere
O Thief > has he tried
O Thief > O Thief > or if he goes into contracts, selects 'my corporation' from the view bar, and leaves everything else blank, it should pop up
crazy bear > ya
crazy bear > he sees it he cannot claim it though
crazy bear > can we do auction method that i know works please
O Thief > rgr, will re-do
O Thief > give me a sec
crazy bear > kk
crazy bear > hve you used it before?
O Thief > no lol
O Thief > i'll work it out
crazy bear > you must set the buyout to 10b and leave starting bid as default so it does not register as an auction and can be claimed on buyout out of region
O Thief > done!
O Thief > <url=contract:30000142//1041347>Heavy Neutron Blaster II Blueprint</url>
crazy bear > kk cool
crazy bear > i linked to banker but he is afk, justmaking dinner for his kids
crazy bear > he will claim as soon as he is back
O Thief > okay i will wait
crazy bear > btw, do you have ny other things for sale?
O Thief > nope, just that
crazy bear > roger, thanks
crazy bear > cya later then :)
O Thief > one sec
O Thief > can you hang around until its claimed
O Thief > then its all done
crazy bear > why?
O Thief > because if its not claimed within the hour I'll cancel it
crazy bear > ok no problem
O Thief > thanks
O Thief > so is this chap back yet?
crazy bear > no
O Thief > kk, why have you made a 1,000 isk bid against it?
crazy bear > for fun
O Thief > hmmmm
O Thief > either this gets claimed within 30 minutes or I'm filing an exploit petition
crazy bear > why?
O Thief > because putting a bid up means I cannot cancel it
O Thief > I'm not worried, it will be cancelled for me by a GM, I'm just telling you how long you have
crazy bear > yes
crazy bear > no, no it wont
O Thief > watch and learn
crazy bear > because it is a valid scam :)
crazy bear > hmmm
crazy bear > you are only the 20th person to say that
O Thief > its quite clearly using an in-game system in a manner it was not designed, but lets let the GM's decide that, the petition has been filed :)
O Thief > good bye
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Templer Relleg
x13
Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.03.08 20:54:00 -
[2]
This is a valid thing. Live with it.
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Jarjar
Celestial Apocalypse
Insurgency
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Posted - 2007.03.08 20:54:00 -
[3]
Yeah, it's valid...
Sorry.
"In Communist China ISK buys YOU!!" - random bio |
Dark Shikari
Caldari
Imperium Technologies
Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.03.08 20:56:00 -
[4]
You set up an auction allowing only your buyer to bid on it.
Auctions unless they say so have no reserve.
This means that the buyer can bid whatever he wants and still win the auction.
How is that an exploit of the system? It seems like an exploit of someone who doesn't understand how auctions work, yes.
--23 Member--
EVE-Trance Radio--The EVE Textboard |
Mr Manufacture
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Posted - 2007.03.08 20:57:00 -
[5]
So you take a complex system, understand a particular quirk which most lay people will clearly be unaware, and exploit it for personal gain?
I would say its the very definition of exploit. It's using a game mechanic in a manner which is clearly NOT intended.
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Brutor Shaun
Minmatar
Freelancers UK Alliance
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Posted - 2007.03.08 20:57:00 -
[6]
You have just made a VERY expensive mistake.
This scam has been reported on the forums many times, and every time it's been passed as being valid. Not an exploit.
Sorry for your loss 
My skills
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Jinx Barker
GFB Scientific
Interstellar Corporate Alliance
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:00:00 -
[7]
People still fall for this? Sorry to hear you got screwd mate, but this is a valid scam, and people been screaming and moaning about it for months. My guess is you dont read the forums much.
As GM's say, when they tell us to jump into a lake, I hope you will be able to recover from this loss.
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Joshua Foiritain
Gallente
Coreli Corporation
Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:02:00 -
[8]
Its not an exploit because CCP doesn't care too much about customers. Seems you unfortunately lost a lot of money.
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$Forum + $Bob + $Devs == $ForumPostCount+++++; |
Raivi
Explosion Matrix
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:03:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Raivi on 08/03/2007 20:59:33
It's a scam, scams are perfectly legit.
Mean, but legit.
-----------------------------------------
Explosion Matrix: Our Name Makes No Sense |
maGz
Chaos Reborn
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:03:00 -
[10]
  
Butter Noob got scammed
____________
Coming soon... |
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Gone'Postal
Minmatar
LuthorCorp Combat Division
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:04:00 -
[11]
That has the CCP seal of non-exploit.
--------------------------------------------
Welcome to the best slideshow on Earth! |
Mr Manufacture
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:07:00 -
[12]
I accept the dog-eat-dog nature of EVE, I've had expensive haulers suicided etc, and thats fine - but this isn't gameplay, its a technicality.
The auction system doesnt appear to warn people they cannot cancel. All it would have taken was a pop-up box and I would not have made the auction.
The end result is that those who play eve a lot and learn the quirks can quickly profit by exploiting the lack of knowledge of the user interface and control systems, rather than any element of gameplay etc.
I mean, I accept just about everything thrown my way, but drawn the line at losing out on a technicality of which I was unaware and not warned by the auction system.
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Rudy Metallo
Minmatar
G.H.O.S.T
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:07:00 -
[13]
Valid.
Its a *****, but it's also your own fault for falling for it I'm afraid. 
Sorry man.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:08:00 -
[14]
/me clears throats
/me excercises vocal cords a bit in preparation
MOTHER******* PWNED!!!!
ahem. Thank you.
(No, this is not an exploit, an auction is a competition to get something for the lowest price possible played against other bidders, with only one competetor (bidder), it will go for the starting price)
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If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
Mr Manufacture
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:08:00 -
[15]
 Originally by: maGz
Butter Noob got scammed
yeah I'm not playing eve anymore, this money was for other people!
but still, I know what eve is like, but this is pretty odd...
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Wizzkidy
Demonic Retribution
Pure.
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:09:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
Originally by: maGz
Butter Noob got scammed
yeah I'm not playing eve anymore, this money was for other people!
but still, I know what eve is like, but this is pretty odd...
It's true its been reported on the forum for ages, all though I do feel for you because well if u didn't know then u didnt know!
I dont think your get anything from your petition 
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:11:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
I accept the dog-eat-dog nature of EVE, I've had expensive haulers suicided etc, and thats fine - but this isn't gameplay, its a technicality.
The auction system doesnt appear to warn people they cannot cancel. All it would have taken was a pop-up box and I would not have made the auction.
The end result is that those who play eve a lot and learn the quirks can quickly profit by exploiting the lack of knowledge of the user interface and control systems, rather than any element of gameplay etc.
I mean, I accept just about everything thrown my way, but drawn the line at losing out on a technicality of which I was unaware and not warned by the auction system.
Of course you can't cancel it - part of the risk of any auction is not getting good bids on it - from Eve to Ebay. Eve is not going to remove that risk, or pander to your ignorance of how auctions work.
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If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
Mr Manufacture
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:12:00 -
[18]
what interests me about this, is that by all accounts its the very definition of an exploit - using game mechanics in a way they were clearly not intended
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Wizzkidy
Demonic Retribution
Pure.
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:14:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
what interests me about this, is that by all accounts its the very definition of an exploit - using game mechanics in a way they were clearly not intended
Read DS post, I agree that its a bit lame but people will do these things and if you setup an action for only 1 bidder (or 1 corp) then of course they can bid what they want. When I was reading your convo with that guy I was hoping you wasn't going to fall for it but it seems you didnt think before you made the decision to put it up for only a buy out price.
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Kareltje
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:15:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
what interests me about this, is that by all accounts its the very definition of an exploit - using game mechanics in a way they were clearly not intended
You don't get to define what is or is not an exploit. The GM's do. And they don't define this as an exploit. Good to see this scam still works, congrats to the current owner of the bpo for finding the dumbest player in EvE.
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Joshua Foiritain
Gallente
Coreli Corporation
Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:15:00 -
[21]
Technically speaking this scam falls within the designed auction system. However, the auction system and the documentation is ****y, unless you're a forum ***** you're unlikely to know about this tactic and people fall for it all the time.
-----
$Forum + $Bob + $Devs == $ForumPostCount+++++; |
Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:20:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
what interests me about this, is that by all accounts its the very definition of an exploit - using game mechanics in a way they were clearly not intended
It's an auction. You created on with one person. The result of this is inevitable, whether in Eve or eBay.
Consider this:
An auction is a real-life concept, if you go to someone who never played Eve and tell them what you did, they will likely predict the result.
A gatecamp in a 0.0 chokepoint system is a purely Eve concept, a person who has not played Eve before will not know what it is or how to avoid it. This are more serious, more common and less known to newer players than the minor intricacies of auctions. They are also not really intended gameplay (did CCP really intend gatecamps? Doubt it.).
Thus a 0.0 gatecamp is more of an exploit than this scam.
-
If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
Mr Manufacture
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:21:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Kareltje
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
what interests me about this, is that by all accounts its the very definition of an exploit - using game mechanics in a way they were clearly not intended
You don't get to define what is or is not an exploit. The GM's do. And they don't define this as an exploit. Good to see this scam still works, congrats to the current owner of the bpo for finding someone with a life outside EVE.
fixed it for you
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Wiggy69
In Soviet Russia Ships Build You
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:23:00 -
[24]
Good one Butter Dog, gave me a good giggle
Better luck next time
-----
Wiggy's Bad Spelling and Grammar Complaints Department |
Raivi
Explosion Matrix
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:24:00 -
[25]
When people use a game system for something outside it's designed intent, this can be considered either innovation or an exploit. The company in charge of the game decides. In this case he wasn't using a bug, he was lying about how a game system worked so that he could trick someone. Call it PVP.
-----------------------------------------
Explosion Matrix: Our Name Makes No Sense |
Mr Manufacture
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:25:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
what interests me about this, is that by all accounts its the very definition of an exploit - using game mechanics in a way they were clearly not intended
It's an auction. You created on with one person. The result of this is inevitable, whether in Eve or eBay.
Consider this:
An auction is a real-life concept, if you go to someone who never played Eve and tell them what you did, they will likely predict the result.
A gatecamp in a 0.0 chokepoint system is a purely Eve concept, a person who has not played Eve before will not know what it is or how to avoid it. This are more serious, more common and less known to newer players than the minor intricacies of auctions. They are also not really intended gameplay (did CCP really intend gatecamps? Doubt it.).
Thus a 0.0 gatecamp is more of an exploit than this scam.
er, no
this isn't gameplay - its getting someone on a simple technicality, its a user interface issue
losing a BPO to a gatecamp - fine
having a BPO stolen from me by a friend - fine
losing a BPO due to a technicality in the user interface of which I was not personally aware - just, bizarre
Quite simply, its a user interface issue and I freely admit I've not used the auction system before... clearly the other person knew it very well, and used knowledge of a technical aspect of the user interface to exploit it for personal gain
my problem is that this falls outside the remit of any 'dog-eat-dog' gameplay - its something else. It leaves a nasty taste in my mouth.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:25:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
Originally by: Kareltje
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
what interests me about this, is that by all accounts its the very definition of an exploit - using game mechanics in a way they were clearly not intended
You don't get to define what is or is not an exploit. The GM's do. And they don't define this as an exploit. Good to see this scam still works, congrats to the current owner of the bpo for finding someone with a life outside EVE.
fixed it for you
This is so childish it actually conjures the sound of a baby crying in my mind.
Makes me want to be a scammer.
-
If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
|
Posted - 2007.03.08 21:28:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
what interests me about this, is that by all accounts its the very definition of an exploit - using game mechanics in a way they were clearly not intended
It's an auction. You created on with one person. The result of this is inevitable, whether in Eve or eBay.
Consider this:
An auction is a real-life concept, if you go to someone who never played Eve and tell them what you did, they will likely predict the result.
A gatecamp in a 0.0 chokepoint system is a purely Eve concept, a person who has not played Eve before will not know what it is or how to avoid it. This are more serious, more common and less known to newer players than the minor intricacies of auctions. They are also not really intended gameplay (did CCP really intend gatecamps? Doubt it.).
Thus a 0.0 gatecamp is more of an exploit than this scam.
er, no
this isn't gameplay - its getting someone on a simple technicality, its a user interface issue
losing a BPO to a gatecamp - fine
having a BPO stolen from me by a friend - fine
losing a BPO due to a technicality in the user interface of which I was not personally aware - just, bizarre
Quite simply, its a user interface issue and I freely admit I've not used the auction system before... clearly the other person knew it very well, and used knowledge of a technical aspect of the user interface to exploit it for personal gain
my problem is that this falls outside the remit of any 'dog-eat-dog' gameplay - its something else. It leaves a nasty taste in my mouth.
This is not a user interface issue. You created an auction with a minimum bid X and buyout Y. This auction was open to one person only. Thus the first, last and only bid was X.
-
If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
Mr Manufacture
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:34:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
what interests me about this, is that by all accounts its the very definition of an exploit - using game mechanics in a way they were clearly not intended
It's an auction. You created on with one person. The result of this is inevitable, whether in Eve or eBay.
Consider this:
An auction is a real-life concept, if you go to someone who never played Eve and tell them what you did, they will likely predict the result.
A gatecamp in a 0.0 chokepoint system is a purely Eve concept, a person who has not played Eve before will not know what it is or how to avoid it. This are more serious, more common and less known to newer players than the minor intricacies of auctions. They are also not really intended gameplay (did CCP really intend gatecamps? Doubt it.).
Thus a 0.0 gatecamp is more of an exploit than this scam.
er, no
this isn't gameplay - its getting someone on a simple technicality, its a user interface issue
losing a BPO to a gatecamp - fine
having a BPO stolen from me by a friend - fine
losing a BPO due to a technicality in the user interface of which I was not personally aware - just, bizarre
Quite simply, its a user interface issue and I freely admit I've not used the auction system before... clearly the other person knew it very well, and used knowledge of a technical aspect of the user interface to exploit it for personal gain
my problem is that this falls outside the remit of any 'dog-eat-dog' gameplay - its something else. It leaves a nasty taste in my mouth.
This is not a user interface issue. You created an auction with a minimum bid X and buyout Y. This auction was open to one person only. Thus the first, last and only bid was X.
And where on that screen does it state that I cannot cancel an auction once started?
this is my issue. I would have NEVER set it up had I known I could not cancel it.
It IS a technicality. It is NOT gameplay.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente
Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2007.03.08 21:38:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Mr Manufacture
what interests me about this, is that by all accounts its the very definition of an exploit - using game mechanics in a way they were clearly not intended
It's an auction. You created on with one person. The result of this is inevitable, whether in Eve or eBay.
Consider this:
An auction is a real-life concept, if you go to someone who never played Eve and tell them what you did, they will likely predict the result.
A gatecamp in a 0.0 chokepoint system is a purely Eve concept, a person who has not played Eve before will not know what it is or how to avoid it. This are more serious, more common and less known to newer players than the minor intricacies of auctions. They are also not really intended gameplay (did CCP really intend gatecamps? Doubt it.).
Thus a 0.0 gatecamp is more of an exploit than this scam.
er, no
this isn't gameplay - its getting someone on a simple technicality, its a user interface issue
losing a BPO to a gatecamp - fine
having a BPO stolen from me by a friend - fine
losing a BPO due to a technicality in the user interface of which I was not personally aware - just, bizarre
Quite simply, its a user interface issue and I freely admit I've not used the auction system before... clearly the other person knew it very well, and used knowledge of a technical aspect of the user interface to exploit it for personal gain
my problem is that this falls outside the remit of any 'dog-eat-dog' gameplay - its something else. It leaves a nasty taste in my mouth.
This is not a user interface issue. You created an auction with a minimum bid X and buyout Y. This auction was open to one person only. Thus the first, last and only bid was X.
And where on that screen does it state that I cannot cancel an auction once started?
this is my issue. I would have NEVER set it up had I known I could not cancel it.
It IS a technicality. It is NOT gameplay.
First of all, where does it state that you can cancel it?
It doesn't. You made an assumption, and bet a huge amount of money on that assumption.
But, on top of this, if you give it a microsecond of thought it's obvious that you aren't going to be able to cancel it because it is a contract, the point of which is to accept the risk of your item selling for near your minimum price, with the possible reward of it selling for a much higer price. Being able to cancel it would remove the risk, and thus is always going to be impossible.
-
If you go into your options menu, there's a difficulty slider. Put that all the way over to the easiest setting and you'll be fine. |
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