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Author	Reply to Topic \| Show CCP posts - 5 post(s)
Ashail	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:47:00 - [181] - Quote Originally by: Eelifea Originally by: Casper Ozymandias Quote this if you hate censorship.
Raphael Scoria	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:47:00 - [182] - Quote It's a shame: I was really enjoying Eve. But now that I see that the bias allegations were founded in truth, and that nothing is to be done, I'll make the only, small gesture I can in order to display my opinion: this and my other account are cancelled, and I'm giong to find a less fun but less corrupted game to play. Oh, and I have never been in BoB nor in a corp that has ever been in conflict with BoB: I don't care about the corp involved in this cheating and cover-up. I just care that it has happened.
Ilidanis	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:48:00 - [183] - Quote Originally by: Ab Initio If you actually knew what you were talking about, and weren't just running around with a pitchfork, you would realise why that doesn't make any sense. I think what they were trying to say might have been obfuscated by eagerness and inexperience. Allow me to make me a humble effort to salvage her post. I believe what she was trying to 'one-up' SirMolle and claim that the removal of the dev characters that were outed as being members of BoB was a sure-sign of mischief, etc. Of course, you and I both know that's not true. The characters in question were removed because as we all know, while it is not illegal for a dev to play with the rest of us, he should keep his affiliation with CCP a secret. I guess she probably wasn't aware of that, go figure. However, what I'd like to know is, since the information Kugutsumen provided claiming that certain characters in BoB were actually CCP employees (devs or not, it's not relevant) proved to be spot-on, how do you feel about his other claims and inferences, Ab? Allow me to re-state them for you, in case you forgot them or were not aware of them: 1) Certain BoB members in high-ranking positions were actively promoting the sharing of dread-capable pilot accounts, and the person in charge of this group was reportedly a CCP employee, which was eventually forced out prior to this particular incident. Note that account sharing is a violation of the EULA, yet nothing reportedly happened to these players. 2) The same character that was in charge of the cynonet left 8 or 10 T2 BPOs with BoB upon his departure. While some dispute that these BPOs are not very valuable, any T2 BPO has an intrinsic value due to its rarity (it's a veritable isk printer). What are the chances of a single character played by a CCP staff member obtaining 8 or 10 T2 BPOs legitimaly, uhm? 3) And lastly (but possibly not least), the allegations that DB Preacher purchased at least one player account for cold, hard, real-life cash, which is a bannable offense. Last I checked, nothing happened to him, though. So, do you have any comments or wagers on how much of the above statements are partially or entirely true? Do you understand that as of right now, regardless of the valiant efforts by the BoB Forum Interceptor Squadron, you guys are looking pretty weak when it comes to honesty, and CCP is definitely trying to bring this embarrassing situation to a swift and silent demise?
Lyticus Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:48:00 - [184] - Quote Edited by: Lyticus on 07/02/2007 09:44:59 I dont frequent the EVE-O message boards very often, usually because the standard of intelligent conversation is generally quite low. However, this situation calls for my comment and input since it affects me directly. Kugutsumen was a friend of mine, and he's now had all his accounts banned. I understand that CCP reserves the right to do this under their TOS agreements. However, if EVE is truly the open-ended sandbox the developers claim it is, where you can scam, lie and cheat your way to the top, and as many do, then why has Kugutsumen been singled out in this case? Did CCP need a scapegoat to blame this event on? Why not blame this fellow? He has ties to all the right corporations, he's been known for causing a bit of a forum uproar in the past, the perfect one to take the fall. Lets ignore the fact that it was in fact the developers fault for distributing sensitive information to their corpmates in the first place. If one of the BOB members who was in the know had leaked the information, would this situation have been treated differently? Subversion and corp theft are commonplace in EVE, it makes sense that someone would create an intelligence based website where those who pay can obtain this kind of information from those who specialise in its retrieval. So, I ask CCP, is this the beginning of a new wave? Should I remove my alts from corporations which are there only to benefit myself? Should my IPO scam be cancelled lest I risk a ban? The other day, my alt was scammed by a new player for 5 million isk. I knew he was scamming me at the time, but it was an interesting experience and I taught him a few things on how to improve his tactics. In hindsight, should I have petitioned him? Will you give me my isk back, and give him a warning? My viewpoint may of course be skewed since I know the person involved here, and all my facts may not be correct as I am not the forum warrior I once was, however, I hope that my points will be considered in the discussion. In conclusion, is this turning into another World of Warcraft, CCP? Make sure you let us know, so I can hang up my space boots in advance, I won't be coming along for that ride, thanks. - Lyticus
Luna Liandri PPN United Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:49:00 - [185] - Quote kieron: on a sidenote i'm curious why the names of said characters need to stay top-secret ?
Kcel Chim Caldari Arcane Technologies The Five	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:50:00 - [186] - Quote Originally by: Captain Thunk You've been caught red-handed with information that has been verified regardless of how "highlevel gaming" it was obtained. You accept the profits of macro operations with full knowledge. You're well aware that characters are traded by your directors for cash. You know that your members engage in the same activities as kugutsumen but lack the balls to go public. This is hardly baseless accusations. What you've done with your highlevel gaming is forced everyone to use the same methods in order to compete on a level playing field, which means there's a lot of EULA's that are going to be torn up and ignored on the proviso that all such activities and transactions are conducted out of game and don't leave an ingame trail - you've afterall proven that it's easy to get away with it. Nice one mate. CAPTAIN THUNK Maybe you should question the information you got since all the "proof" you name here is either a) collected via illegal means b) presented by a banned (hence himself eula/TOS violating) character and c) simply wrong. It was shown that dbps char was NOT transfered for cash, even if you wish to believe that. It was shown that a guy in bob macromined and WAS banned for it by ccp. However the ban was only temporary and after it exspiered he came to terms and was let back in. It is widely known that BoB members will use ingame mechanics and social engineering to their advantage in a game. Mr.K however used illegal out-of-game methods. One is playing a spy character the other is brute forcing his way into ppls webservers. In short all of the above might have at one point or the other a grain of truth in it however you twist the situations accordingly to suit your anti bob bull. Im glad the hacker got banned and to the snigg guy, i would be very carefull about threatening ppl with illegal means such as dos attacks or your inet kungfu. Im not a fan of this stuff in any way or form, whoever does it but ure clearly not helping the situation by a new wave of baseless accusations. If you got solid proof of some BoB member commiting illegal stuff on the net contact his ceo instead of doing another twist of hatemongering.
Sinlare Gallente Sinlare Auditorium	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:51:00 - [187] - Quote Originally by: Lyticus Edited by: Lyticus on 07/02/2007 09:44:59 I dont frequent the EVE-O message boards very often, usually because the standard of intelligent conversation is generally quite low. However, this situation calls for my comment and input since it affects me directly. Kugutsumen was a friend of mine, and he's now had all his accounts banned. I understand that CCP reserves the right to do this under their TOS agreements. However, if EVE is truly the open-ended sandbox the developers claim it is, where you can scam, lie and cheat your way to the top, and as many do, then why has Kugutsumen been singled out in this case? Did CCP need a scapegoat to blame this event on? Why not blame this fellow? He has ties to all the right corporations, he's been known for causing a bit of a forum uproar in the past, the perfect one to take the fall. Lets ignore the fact that it was in fact the developers fault for distributing sensitive information to their corpmates in the first place. If one of the BOB members who was in the know had leaked the information, would this situation have been treated differently? Subversion and corp theft are commonplace in EVE, it makes sense that someone would create an intelligence based website where those who pay can obtain this kind of information from those who specialise in its retrieval. So, I ask CCP, is this the beginning of a new wave? Should I remove my alts from corporations which are there only to benefit myself? Should my IPO scam be cancelled lest I risk a ban? The other day, my alt was scammed by a new player for 5 million isk. I knew he was scamming me at the time, but it was an interesting experience and I taught him a few things on how to improve his tactics. In hindsight, should I have petitioned him? Will you give me my isk back, and give him a warning? My viewpoint may of course be skewed since I know the person involved here, and all my facts may not be correct as I am not the forum warrior I once was, however, I hope that my points will be considered in the discussion. In conclusion, is this turning into another World of Warcraft, CCP? Make sure you let us know, so I can hang up my space boots in advance, I won't be coming along for that ride, thanks. - Lyticus What about no, he's a known hacker, and you're defending him? Go you! Why are you even trying to compare real life illegal actions with legit in-game mechanics?
Niaski Zalani Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:52:00 - [188] - Quote Originally by: Sinlare Edited by: Sinlare on 07/02/2007 09:09:40 Edited by: Sinlare on 07/02/2007 09:07:09 Originally by: Niaski Zalani Originally by: SirMolle We play the game on a high level, we have a high profile, this isnt the first accusations of cheat, hax, and god knows what else that has been flung at us. Does that "high level" also include some of your membership threatening to DDoS the kugutsumen.com site? Because someone did threaten with it, and there have been a few attempts at it so far. Could've been anyone really, so consider this one public notice; a) it won't work, b) if it works, it won't work for long, c) it'll have to involve law enforcement at some point, although that's not something I'd like to do, or d) I'll just handle it myself in which case the results won't be pretty. (No, I'm not Kugutsumen, I'm just the guy that hosts his site. Guess I'll get ready for the thwack upside the head with the banstick now...) So, sni.ggerdly hosts a hacker huh? good to know It does explain why shamis responds the way he does. interesting. Actually I host a paying customer. My work is quite separate from my in-game associations, but think what you will :D yarr.
Sinlare Gallente Sinlare Auditorium	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:54:00 - [189] - Quote Originally by: Niaski Zalani Actually I host a paying customer. My work is quite separate from my in-game associations, but think what you will :D Good to know that even in real life you support criminals.
Niaski Zalani Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:54:00 - [190] - Quote Originally by: Sun Ra Originally by: Niaski Zalani Originally by: SirMolle We play the game on a high level, we have a high profile, this isnt the first accusations of cheat, hax, and god knows what else that has been flung at us. Does that "high level" also include some of your membership threatening to DDoS the kugutsumen.com site? Because someone did threaten with it, and there have been a few attempts at it so far. Could've been anyone really, so consider this one public notice; a) it won't work, b) if it works, it won't work for long, c) it'll have to involve law enforcement at some point, although that's not something I'd like to do, or d) I'll just handle it myself in which case the results won't be pretty. (No, I'm not Kugutsumen, I'm just the guy that hosts his site. Guess I'll get ready for the thwack upside the head with the banstick now...) Erm so its bad for peopel to DDoS your site but its ok for your mate to go aroudn hacking peoples forums? Yes. A DDoS against Kugutsumen's site will not only take out that site, but another 300 along with it. As well as e-mail, and streaming media services. Kugutsumen's alledged hacking seems to only target a single site, and seems to never disable any sites. shrug yarr.

Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:55:00 - [191] - Quote This thread is a fine example of what is wrong with mob mentality. It doesn't matter what the facts are, or how they are phrased, people will believe what they want to believe. CCP: "CCP have players in many alliances" Witch Hunters: Yeah, but we are only interested in BoB withches. Clearly a Dev in BoB must be corrupt. It is obvious. Hacker: A character who I think is a dev have BoB some T2 BPO's. Witch Hunters: Yeah, well, obviously the Dev cheated to create the BPO's, or coded the lottery in shuch a way that he would win. Stands to reason. I mean, we all know that the lottery is unfair because I have never had a BPO, so it is obvious the Devs cheat. Hypothetical CCP announcement: "We looked in to the BPO thingy, and nothing unfair happened. The Dev in question legitimately aquired the BPO's on his player account." Witch Hunters: Yeah, well, you would say that. It is a cover-up. We know that it was all cheating and h4x. Ban BoB, fire the Devs, turn the servers off!! Hypothetical CCP announcement: "We looked in to the BPO thingy, and a Dev was a naughty boy." Witch Hunters: Ah-ha! We knew it. BoB can't be trusted. The CCP can't be trusted. Ban BoB, fire the Devs, turn the servers off! Meanwhile, back in the real world: Devs are losing player characters because they got IP matched on a third party website. CCP are losing reputation because people want to believe a conspiracy. The playerbase becomes increasingly paranoid. The whole community is going to hell, and for what? If you believe all this stuff, fine. I know nothing I say will change that. Just leave. This whole thing has saddened me to be honest. Not the accusations, they are nothing unusual; but the community reaction to them. This whole episode tarnishes the image of CCP, of BoB (not that we didn't have a bad image anyway), but mostly of the community. Sad times. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Anonymous Coward Gallente Panopticon Citadel	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:55:00 - [192] - Quote Originally by: Sinlare Good to know that even in real life you support criminals. Ever heard of xs4all.nl? Same philosophy. Originally by: Dianabolic I was sworn to secrecy by CCP.
Kerdrak Amarr 3B Legio IX Freelancer Alliance	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:56:00 - [193] - Quote Sorry to say but I don't like to see CCP plays in tranquility... ________________________________________ First atheist amarr on EVE
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:56:00 - [194] - Quote Originally by: Avon This thread is a fine example of what is wrong with mob mentality. It doesn't matter what the facts are, or how they are phrased, people will believe what they want to believe. CCP: "CCP have players in many alliances" Witch Hunters: Yeah, but we are only interested in BoB witches. Clearly a Dev in BoB must be corrupt. It is obvious. Hacker: A character who I think is a dev gave BoB some T2 BPO's. Witch Hunters: Yeah, well, obviously the Dev cheated to create the BPO's, or coded the lottery in shuch a way that he would win. Stands to reason. I mean, we all know that the lottery is unfair because I have never had a BPO, so it is obvious the Devs cheat. Hypothetical CCP announcement: "We looked in to the BPO thingy, and nothing unfair happened. The Dev in question legitimately aquired the BPO's on his player account." Witch Hunters: Yeah, well, you would say that. It is a cover-up. We know that it was all cheating and h4x. Ban BoB, fire the Devs, turn the servers off!! Hypothetical CCP announcement: "We looked in to the BPO thingy, and a Dev was a naughty boy." Witch Hunters: Ah-ha! We knew it. BoB can't be trusted. The CCP can't be trusted. Ban BoB, fire the Devs, turn the servers off! Meanwhile, back in the real world: Devs are losing player characters because they got IP matched on a third party website. CCP are losing reputation because people want to believe a conspiracy. The playerbase becomes increasingly paranoid. The whole community is going to hell, and for what? If you believe all this stuff, fine. I know nothing I say will change that. Just leave. This whole thing has saddened me to be honest. Not the accusations, they are nothing unusual; but the community reaction to them. This whole episode tarnishes the image of CCP, of BoB (not that we didn't have a bad image anyway), but mostly of the community. Sad times. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:57:00 - [195] - Quote . The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
Logan Feynman Constructive Influence	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:57:00 - [196] - Quote Originally by: Lyticus Edited by: Lyticus on 07/02/2007 09:44:59 Kugutsumen was a friend of mine, and he's now had all his accounts banned. Good riddance. There is solid evidence he broke the law, and that no legal enforcement agencies would pursue him as he did not do enough financial damage by his actions. He did not provide any solid evidence for anything, but instead raised the paranoid side of the community to their feet by providing them with dressed-up tidbits. If any developer lost his 3-year old account over his posts and blogs only because they were outed as developers, he was banned too late. . "Life is no way to treat an animal." ~Tombstone of Kilgore Trout
Casper Ozymandias	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:57:00 - [197] - Quote So how many pages do you think this thread would be up to without the hard work of those diligent mods? Keep up the good work guys, I'm sure if you delete enough posts you're going to eventually make sure an unbiased view is provided. Sup Cortes ^_____________________^
Kcel Chim Caldari Arcane Technologies The Five	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:57:00 - [198] - Quote Originally by: Lyticus Edited by: Lyticus on 07/02/2007 09:44:59 I dont frequent the EVE-O message boards very often, usually because the standard of intelligent conversation is generally quite low. However, this situation calls for my comment and input since it affects me directly. Kugutsumen was a friend of mine, and he's now had all his accounts banned. I understand that CCP reserves the right to do this under their TOS agreements. However, if EVE is truly the open-ended sandbox the developers claim it is, where you can scam, lie and cheat your way to the top, and as many do, then why has Kugutsumen been singled out in this case? Did CCP need a scapegoat to blame this event on? Why not blame this fellow? He has ties to all the right corporations, he's been known for causing a bit of a forum uproar in the past, the perfect one to take the fall. Lets ignore the fact that it was in fact the developers fault for distributing sensitive information to their corpmates in the first place. If one of the BOB members who was in the know had leaked the information, would this situation have been treated differently? Subversion and corp theft are commonplace in EVE, it makes sense that someone would create an intelligence based website where those who pay can obtain this kind of information from those who specialise in its retrieval. So, I ask CCP, is this the beginning of a new wave? Should I remove my alts from corporations which are there only to benefit myself? Should my IPO scam be cancelled lest I risk a ban? The other day, my alt was scammed by a new player for 5 million isk. I knew he was scamming me at the time, but it was an interesting experience and I taught him a few things on how to improve his tactics. In hindsight, should I have petitioned him? Will you give me my isk back, and give him a warning? My viewpoint may of course be skewed since I know the person involved here, and all my facts may not be correct as I am not the forum warrior I once was, however, I hope that my points will be considered in the discussion. In conclusion, is this turning into another World of Warcraft, CCP? Make sure you let us know, so I can hang up my space boots in advance, I won't be coming along for that ride, thanks. - Lyticus Dont forget that ccp only condones "illegal behaviour" within the gamerules. Ccp, similar to any other mmporg gaming company, wasnt too happy about someone going around hacking their client / customer / fansites. They might have not been their possession, however they belong to the community. Imagine a group of bullies showing up at the next fanfest beating up all invited evegamers. Now imagine further them escaping legal punishment for similar reasons as in this case. Bullying / beating up ppl ingame is very much encouraged by the devs. Irl it is a crime. Im sure in such a case ccp also would terminate the service because they dont want THEIR community (since its their game and without a game no community) to get the negative image and to suffer from ppl who apparently cant be grabbed by the balls through legal means.
Anonymous Coward Gallente Panopticon Citadel	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:57:00 - [199] - Quote Originally by: Avon Originally by: Avon This thread is a fine example of what is wrong with mob mentality. It doesn't matter what the facts are, or how they are phrased, people will believe what they want to believe. CCP: "CCP have players in many alliances" Witch Hunters: Yeah, but we are only interested in BoB witches. Clearly a Dev in BoB must be corrupt. It is obvious. Hacker: A character who I think is a dev gave BoB some T2 BPO's. Witch Hunters: Yeah, well, obviously the Dev cheated to create the BPO's, or coded the lottery in shuch a way that he would win. Stands to reason. I mean, we all know that the lottery is unfair because I have never had a BPO, so it is obvious the Devs cheat. Hypothetical CCP announcement: "We looked in to the BPO thingy, and nothing unfair happened. The Dev in question legitimately aquired the BPO's on his player account." Witch Hunters: Yeah, well, you would say that. It is a cover-up. We know that it was all cheating and h4x. Ban BoB, fire the Devs, turn the servers off!! Hypothetical CCP announcement: "We looked in to the BPO thingy, and a Dev was a naughty boy." Witch Hunters: Ah-ha! We knew it. BoB can't be trusted. The CCP can't be trusted. Ban BoB, fire the Devs, turn the servers off! Meanwhile, back in the real world: Devs are losing player characters because they got IP matched on a third party website. CCP are losing reputation because people want to believe a conspiracy. The playerbase becomes increasingly paranoid. The whole community is going to hell, and for what? If you believe all this stuff, fine. I know nothing I say will change that. Just leave. This whole thing has saddened me to be honest. Not the accusations, they are nothing unusual; but the community reaction to them. This whole episode tarnishes the image of CCP, of BoB (not that we didn't have a bad image anyway), but mostly of the community. Sad times. Did you mean to quote and reply to this post with your Sinlare alt, but selected the wrong dropdown option? Originally by: Dianabolic I was sworn to secrecy by CCP.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.02.07 09:58:00 - [200] - Quote Originally by: Anonymous Coward Did you mean to quote and reply to this post with your Sinlare alt, but selected the wrong dropdown option? No, I meant to fix the spelling, but it all went very strange. The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur

Dragutinovic Caldari Bladerunners Mordus Angels	Posted - 2007.02.07 10:00:00 - [201] - Quote Originally by: Xendie i wonder why they had bob investigating bob/dev stuff? think about it for a sec, 5 devs in RKK alone, how many more in the rest of bob? wouldnt it be kinda hard for 2-3 devs to fire the rest of the office? one thing though, when will molle be banned for putting a persons RL name/adress/workplace on these forums? when will digitalcommunist be banned for trying to get peoples ip adresses ingame? when will db preacher be banned for ebaying101 when will bob alliance be disbanded for using information they knew werent allowed?(the leadership were effectively exploiting when they knew that these persons were devs and still accepted advance information) will CCP ever do anything against bob? answer is, never as they would ban themselves then. Indeed , as in the past as now they seem to get away with everything , whiel some others get insta banned from forums by just posting a bit to much of [insert stuff]. The griefing of a player out of the game wasnt even punished , teh abuse of RL intel wasnt punished ... GG hypocrites & CCP . _____________ Im back !
Captain Thunk Explode. Now. Please.	Posted - 2007.02.07 10:02:00 - [202] - Quote Originally by: Kcel Chim Originally by: Captain Thunk You've been caught red-handed with information that has been verified regardless of how "highlevel gaming" it was obtained. You accept the profits of macro operations with full knowledge. You're well aware that characters are traded by your directors for cash. You know that your members engage in the same activities as kugutsumen but lack the balls to go public. This is hardly baseless accusations. What you've done with your highlevel gaming is forced everyone to use the same methods in order to compete on a level playing field, which means there's a lot of EULA's that are going to be torn up and ignored on the proviso that all such activities and transactions are conducted out of game and don't leave an ingame trail - you've afterall proven that it's easy to get away with it. Nice one mate. CAPTAIN THUNK Maybe you should question the information you got since all the "proof" you name here is either a) collected via illegal means b) presented by a banned (hence himself eula/TOS violating) character and c) simply wrong. It was shown that dbps char was NOT transfered for cash, even if you wish to believe that. It was shown that a guy in bob macromined and WAS banned for it by ccp. However the ban was only temporary and after it exspiered he came to terms and was let back in. It is widely known that BoB members will use ingame mechanics and social engineering to their advantage in a game. Mr.K however used illegal out-of-game methods. One is playing a spy character the other is brute forcing his way into ppls webservers. In short all of the above might have at one point or the other a grain of truth in it however you twist the situations accordingly to suit your anti bob bull. Im glad the hacker got banned and to the snigg guy, i would be very carefull about threatening ppl with illegal means such as dos attacks or your inet kungfu. Im not a fan of this stuff in any way or form, whoever does it but ure clearly not helping the situation by a new wave of baseless accusations. If you got solid proof of some BoB member commiting illegal stuff on the net contact his ceo instead of doing another twist of hatemongering. Cheers for the BoB spin bud, but I don't think it'll be working this time. I wasn't referring to the BoB guy who got banned for the 0isk macro (which I believe requires python injection code, if CCP think that's only worth 2 weeks thats up to them) - he was never kicked from the corp though, he just waited out the ban - no need to "let him back in" as he never actually left. I was actually referring to the 10/10 complex BoB rent to macroers for a large slice of ISK. As I said, in order to compete on the same level with BoB those that continue to pay their subscription will certainly consider ignoring their EULA as so long as nothing written ingame leaves a trail you will get off scot free, plead ignorance or claim it's a massive conspiracy because people are jealous. Like it or not, BoBs killing Eve - apathy won't save it. CAPTAIN THUNK If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them, maybe you can hire...The ENP-Team.
Sinlare Gallente Sinlare Auditorium	Posted - 2007.02.07 10:02:00 - [203] - Quote Originally by: Anonymous Coward Originally by: Sinlare Good to know that even in real life you support criminals. Ever heard of xs4all.nl? Same philosophy. The philosophy of both entities doesn't even come close.
Lyticus Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2007.02.07 10:03:00 - [204] - Quote Originally by: Sinlare Originally by: Lyticus my post What about no, he's a known hacker, and you're defending him? Go you! Why are you even trying to compare real life illegal actions with legit in-game mechanics? I ask you and other EVE players, since when does CCP have the right to enforce real-life laws? If I contact the CEO of a corporation over MSN and convince him to give me a billion isk, is that not a real-life action? If you have a problem with someone breaking into your forums, you need to either improve your security or involve the law. CCP should not be dealing with out of game matters via the game. Kugutsumen having his accounts banned does not un-hack your forums, nor does it solve the problem. While I do not condone the method in which he obtains his information, the fact is that CCP dont have any TOS based upon out of game actions. This means they have no right to ban a character because of what he does out of game. What if next they start banning players from rival games companies? Or perhaps racial judgement? Bans should be administered based upon in-game action and that alone, out of game information which CCP have no way of verifying via logs etc that cannot be substantiated should be voided as evidence. - Lyticus
qrac Caldari Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.02.07 10:05:00 - [205] - Quote Originally by: Kcel Chim It was shown that dbps char was NOT transfered for cash, even if you wish to believe that. You can't prove that but dbp can't be banned either because the so called proof could've been tampered with. To CCP: I hope you create a new policy where browsing non-CCP sites connected to the game using CCP's connection is NOT allowed. -------------------------------------------
Niaski Zalani Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.02.07 10:05:00 - [206] - Quote Originally by: Sinlare Originally by: Niaski Zalani Actually I host a paying customer. My work is quite separate from my in-game associations, but think what you will :D Good to know that even in real life you support criminals. Alledged hacker != criminal. yarr.
Ashail	Posted - 2007.02.07 10:06:00 - [207] - Quote Hey cortes, delete this.
Luna Liandri PPN United Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.02.07 10:06:00 - [208] - Quote Originally by: Lyticus Bans should be administered based upon in-game action and that alone, out of game information which CCP have no way of verifying via logs etc that cannot be substantiated should be voided as evidence Amen.
Rod Blaine Evolution Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.02.07 10:06:00 - [209] - Quote Originally by: Alakazam - How many devs were in BoB? Who knows, it doesn't matter much. I believe it was like 3 or 5 or something that were named. Quote: - Did BoB know they were devs? Not relevant. A good ethical player that finds out about the player identity of a dev shuts the ** up and lets the dev get one with his gameplay. Yes it creates an awkward situation because you don't want a dev to be put in a position where his interests collide. It's when the retards get hold of dev identities and use it to further their omgh4x crusades that things start stinking and characters get deleted. Serves noone. Quote: - Why did they chose BoB, why not any other alliance? Silly question, we are the most advanced of the bunch. If they want to see what the BoB formula is that gets half the game in seizures for all kinds of reasons then you go and check it out. On the other hand, who says this was the only alliance ? Quote: To me it seems like there were more devs in BoB than in any other alliance? Is this a wrong assumption? Yes. CCP has over 200 employees now, 5 wre in BoB and 195 are still in d2. Noone knows, people just yell stupid stuff because they feel something unfair must be happening if they're not winning. Quote: - Did BoB gain anything from this except good friends? No, and I doubt the friendships extend to improper use of authority if that's what epople would read into that. Quote: - Does BoB understand that their sarcasm works against them when they state that they do have buttons for node crashing, cheating and have devs in their alliance? I doubt we care. People that cannot see the obvious sarcasm in those statements are rather dimwitted. If they believe them and as a consequence stop playing eve then you won;t see us cry about it. Quote:** Everything would've been so much easier if devs was not allowed to play against paying customers. You can't play Eve with someone yet notagainst someone else. Yes it would be easier, it would mimo also be disastrous and rather unfair on the devs who you have to thank for being here in the first place. Easy is not always good, in this case, being smart and not signing into witchhunts is good, and smart as well since it saves you from killing your own braincells in frustration. Eve sees alot of devsploitha4xfavouritsm idiocy yes. That's what comes with a competitive ffa pvp game with serious loss built in and one big server with umpteen thousand players. That's because people get emotional about their gameplay, and because some of them aren't able to keep that in check. It's quite normal for games like this to see this, and it's equally normal for there being no truth to any of it bar some very rare cases mostly involving gm's or voluneers, but hardly ever developers. And yes I'm in BoB. But this post would have looked exactly the same if I'd been in D2 or whatever. Old blog Originally by: Vriezuh Naz: John is a realist
Anonymous Coward Gallente Panopticon Citadel	Posted - 2007.02.07 10:07:00 - [210] - Quote Originally by: Sinlare The philosophy of both entities doesn't even come close. I know what you are--an idiot. I also know what you aren't--Niaski Zalani's spokesman. You're putting out some really, really weak trolling here. Originally by: Dianabolic I was sworn to secrecy by CCP.

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