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Halo Jones
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Posted - 2003.12.08 19:21:00 -
[1]
This sounds like a great idea, until you attempt to travel somewhere without a MWD. There is full disruption within the fields radius.
I did a little test in deepsapce, on chaos, with a battleship equipped to mine, geddon, 4 cargo expanders, good flight skills, and a converted 1 MN MWD. I chose the 1MN, as that is what had been assigned. Basically under current system, all of us with MWD equipped battleships in deepspace will have to limp around using systems not designed for the vessel, until we get to empire space ~45 jumps away.
5 jumps, jumped and travelled manually, as autopilot cant cope at all with the dampning fields. Going from gate to warp range, warping, and then into jump range and jumping, rinse and repeat 5 times.
This took 48 MINUTES.
Say I was slow, and could have done it more efficiently, 40 minutes, thats 6 hours to limp back to empire to equip systems that a deepspace battleship that has survived for months didn't require previously.
This system needs better ideas, and thoughts to improve it, the pride of the empires fleet shouldn't require additional drives simply to travel outside their own system, in fact, no ship should need additional engines if it wish to leave the system, thats what the gate are there for in the first place.
Helpful suggestions please, as I know the new system will be great for combat, but tbh I don't see space invaders spending 6 hours to go up to venal to have great fights where your ship isn't brutally handicapped by equipping a massive cap killer MWD.
Oberon Incorporated. |
Jael
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Posted - 2003.12.08 22:08:00 -
[2]
Quote: ... with a battleship ... and a converted 1 MN MWD.
BS are 2 orders of magnitude more massive... get a 100MN MWD, and you might go a bit quicker, I believe. ------------=o0O+O0o=------------ Peg Wench
Hazara Khan's Haphazard Bazaar The Finest Camels in all EVE!
Come into my tent... O0o=------------+------------=o0O |
Nightfang
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Posted - 2003.12.08 22:27:00 -
[3]
Or consider limping yourself back to empire space just prior to the patching so you can fit an appropriate MWD when the conversion is done...
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Halo Jones
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Posted - 2003.12.08 22:39:00 -
[4]
Yes the limping back has been suggetsed by others, which is fine, but why should entire alliances who have been reasonably self sufficient in deep sapce for a number of months be forced to 'limp' back to empire space, not for new content, but becuase a game patch will be so badly implemented that they are forced to do so.
Oberon Incorporated. |
Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2003.12.08 23:55:00 -
[5]
Quote: Yes the limping back has been suggetsed by others, which is fine, but why should entire alliances who have been reasonably self sufficient in deep sapce for a number of months be forced to 'limp' back to empire space, not for new content, but becuase a game patch will be so badly implemented that they are forced to do so.
erm arent you assuming that NPC cruisers wont drop any of the new types of abs/mwd?
Or has that been stated somewhere?
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Zyrla Bladestorm
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Posted - 2003.12.09 02:07:00 -
[6]
surely a single frigate with an updated oh say quad lif will be able to zip back to empire space and pick up a bp or a stack of items to bring back for the fleet ? . ----- Apologys for any rambling that may have just occurred.
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Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2003.12.09 02:14:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Morkt Drak on 09/12/2003 02:14:55
Quote: surely a single frigate with an updated oh say quad lif will be able to zip back to empire space and pick up a bp or a stack of items to bring back for the fleet ?
I think Halo's point is that as the overwhelming majority of travel is actually taken up by mundane travel (accelerating from the dead stop that you end every warp with - then motoring to your next gate, bearing in mind that you alwyas exit in the warp-ihibition spehere of a different gate { thus jump - accelerate out of inhibition area - warp - stop - accelerate to gate - jump})
That raising the warp-speed to 3au/s is actually trivial in comparison to overal travel time.
In that regard she is right. The only time the 3au will play into the equation inforce will be over long warps (and that in itself may be offset by the new JIP being at the exit back to last gate)
Thus ...There are reasons for concern over extended travel times due to this new system.
Obviously needs more testing once AP is fixed and so forth.
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Wren
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Posted - 2003.12.09 09:40:00 -
[8]
I guess I need to test all of this, but I never could quite understand why these massive battleships would or should be able to fly eveywhere just as fast as smaller ships. The battleship and when the titan come out are tactial pieces of a puzzle. If you want a presense in a system, you bring your battleships. This should be a chore, since they are massive weapons platforms, not your dad's corvette.
Now fleet movements would actually mean something.
But again, I should test it before I defend it. I may have to eat my words here. --------------------------------------------------
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Ana Khouri
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Posted - 2003.12.09 11:08:00 -
[9]
They key issue are actually not the BS, but the immensly increased travel times due to the inhibitor field change. We are talking about 50-100% more time here.
free speech not allowed here |
Hakera
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Posted - 2003.12.09 12:53:00 -
[10]
I have to admit after having a go on the new chaos build that these new warp field dirupters will increase travel times dramitaclly, even if you increase the warp speed to 3AU, this new feature places the advantage squarly with the campers. Incoming ships now have little to no chance without an mwd or booster to get out of the warp disruption field and escape before they would be locked down by the campers.
Travel times for ships without speed boosters will increase dramitcally making travel times back to before the highways and no one wants to spend their evenings doing a slow jump where there is no chance of escaping any pirates at the gates on the other side.
If sentries are removed then that will be the last straw, pirates will have free reign to camp gates (with a greater chance of success) like in the beginning and we will be back to square one. At least we wont be killed before our screen loads this time, but we will still be locked, webbed and jammed before we could turn the ships and get out of warp disruption range to warp away.
Just my thoughts - the new system seemed reasonable and fair until the warp disruption field was brought in.
Dumbledore - Eve-I.com |
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Mitchman
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Posted - 2003.12.09 13:25:00 -
[11]
Quote:
Just my thoughts - the new system seemed reasonable and fair until the warp disruption field was brought in.
TouchÚ.
No worries, it will be removed after a few weeks when enough subscribers have cancelled their subscription or lost their ships due to this.
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Dukath
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Posted - 2003.12.09 14:24:00 -
[12]
I thought they would add 3 different spheres around the gates and such 1 = jumping , if you are within then you can jump 2 = warp in, can't warp in to sphere 3 = warp out , can't warp out while inside the sphere
So they could easily tweak it so that if you warp in to a camped spot you are still outside the warp out sphere and can still flee. (provided you have a warp core stabiliser wich you SHOULD have in dangerous territory)
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Hakera
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Posted - 2003.12.09 18:24:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Hakera on 09/12/2003 18:36:41 Edited by: Hakera on 09/12/2003 18:25:36 I will try out a few test journies on tranq and on chaos to see the change in travel times. But seeing the number of posts against the removal of bookmark jumping, I would also concur that this nerf will not stay in long at all.
A lot of people have gone to a lot of effort to precisly bookmark their routes, to which CCP said originally they would not prevent people from using bm's to travel as they have put the effort in to plot them.
To remove all that just because of a load of campers want to be able to catch anyone who warps in is stupid. If you dont have an mwd or a load of ab's you will be dead before you travel beyond the WDZ and be able to align for warp and get up to speed again to go to warp.
I would urge CCP not to add this warp disruption fields, or alter the rings to enable as before that you can align for warp and warp out. It was enough that people are now able to target you while you align for warp, to now give them an extra 10secs-5mins to pod you is too far (not even mentioning the increase in travel times on top!). Removing the bm instajumping feature will have widespread repucussions that cannot be countered by a 50% increase in warp speed.
Dumbledore - Eve-I.com |
Dagny
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Posted - 2003.12.09 18:41:00 -
[14]
Jumping around in empire space on chaos in a frigate is about 60-90 seconds per system. (10 jumps in 12 minutes). (That is with broken ap).
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Bobby Wilson
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Posted - 2003.12.09 18:52:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Bobby Wilson on 09/12/2003 19:05:34
Quote: [No worries, it will be removed after a few weeks when enough subscribers have cancelled their subscription or lost their ships due to this.
Too bad there's a lot of truth to this. Travel has been the most sodding tiresome part of the game since inception, since it is basically unavoidable. The nerf to ABs/MWDs the first time (had to activate after you dropped out of warp, plus the reduction in their speed boost) was bad. This one, if it goes ahead as planned, nerfs speed modules AND gates at the same time.
Granted piracy is broken in EVE ATM. PvP generally is. But this sounds as if it will break gameplay generally. Hope I'm wrong, but judging from the "big" log-in, this game can't afford to alienate any more subscribers with a big, dumb nerf that makes ANYTHING more boring.
BW
P.S. Don't worry Halo dahling, I'll camp a ship out in Nonni to get us some for Venal if CCP goes ahead with this sillyness.
Originally by: Selim
Cool, congrats.
Oh, stupid idea by the way.
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Halo Jones
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Posted - 2003.12.09 19:06:00 -
[16]
Second test today, same area of deepspace, same ship, a battleship equipped for mining and not carrying one of the new MWDs, 4 18% cargo expander 1's.
5 jumps took 41 minutes.
With fixed autopilot, (not yet achieved) the overall time will depend on if it moves u diretcly away form the gate at a tangent to minise time to warp capable point then warps you, or if it moves you directly towards your destination, the difference in this can double time in space, actually it can almost triple it.
General travelling in a big ship is exceptionally slower than before. perhaps this is what they want, but large battlegroups and fleets will take months to send to a destination, not a sparkling plan for large scale PvP.
Oberon Incorporated. |
Ralimenua
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Posted - 2003.12.09 20:07:00 -
[17]
(Apologies for minor threadjack)
Bobby: read your email!
Cheers, Ralimenua |
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