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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Galavet
Minmatar
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 14:57:00 -
[61]
I know you have seen the question, and I am still waiting on your answer.
Originally by: Galavet
Originally by: Kugutsumen
One of my agent has a full SQL backup of one of BoB member corp's forum. I don't know how he got it nor do I want to know. From my understanding he might have hacked them or infiltrated them and help them with programming stuff and they handed him admin access. Again I don't really want to know.
There is only three ways you could have a copy of private mail between me and DBP.
1) DBP or I gave you a screen shot
2) You Fabricated the mail
3) You hacked the forum using a phpbb exploit.
Now tell the Eve public, which is it? Your credibility is on the line.
Current RKK Ranking: (MIN100) CEO |
Acwron
Minmatar
Cataclysm Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.01.02 14:58:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Galavet
Originally by: Acwron
I don't parade him at all Galavet. I didn't say BoB exploit or hack either. Don't make stuff up.
But just like hacking is breaking the immersion is paying extra accounts to gain access to other parties in order to gain an edge.
That's the problem I as a player have. I r have multiple accounts but the characters don't interact if they are in different factions.
You and I as a player very well know that his intel is true and so does everybody with some idea what is going on.
Acwron, What I see here is an attempt to blur the line between Out of game phpbb forum hacks and getting an spy alt into a enemy corp using ingame manipulation.
Just so we can all be crystal clear on this one... Are you trying to say that you see no difference in the two means of information extraction and view them both in the same light?
If this is indeed the case, then our little running debate here is done. Your view of reality would be to warped to warrent any further comment.
Of course not. Hacking would be even wrong in a legal way (rightly so). But the both break the point of playing a game in the same way.
And it's not ingame manipultion as long as you use extra accounts for it. It is out of game aswell.
e.g. you are be playing a standard roleplaying game: What would be to point if you could just create an "Orc character" to infiltrate the monsters who is loyal to the player characters? You break the game in the same way as if you would just read the game masters notes.
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Phrixus Zephyr
Yesodic Nomads Corp
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:00:00 -
[63]
Lol, whether its true or not this thread delivers just because of the amount of BoB forum warriors whining about how they're hard done by.
Pot, meet kettle.
Originally by: Victor Ramirez
using it to get the layout of a new system and a quick belt-check is about as practical as using Google Earth to see if your car is still in front of your house.
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Laythun
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:04:00 -
[64]
Would it not be plausible that in fact this guy is a BOB guy, and this has all been orchestrated sow discontent?
I see a lot of threads by this dude, and they are pretty much focused on BOB plans to invade D2 space and bring them down with all these facny plans. Aside from a bit of forum drama, this really only serves to force D2 to 'show there not weak' upping the ante so to speak. Making them believe that BOB are immenently about to attack, and thus heightening tension within D2?
or am i just as crazy as the next dude with a spliff?
Where are all the detailed plans of other ideas of domination BOB have? surely there not completely focused on one target in the north cos that would be pretty short sighted, and honestly i would think they would be that stupid.
So why the focus on BOB vs D2? aside from some history its not exactly a huge pressing concern..
CEI's own Undercover Brother
It's great being Amarr, aint it?V
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ponieus
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:06:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Galavet
I know you have seen the question, and I am still waiting on your answer.
Originally by: Galavet
Originally by: Kugutsumen
One of my agent has a full SQL backup of one of BoB member corp's forum. I don't know how he got it nor do I want to know. From my understanding he might have hacked them or infiltrated them and help them with programming stuff and they handed him admin access. Again I don't really want to know.
There is only three ways you could have a copy of private mail between me and DBP.
1) DBP or I gave you a screen shot
2) You Fabricated the mail
3) You hacked the forum using a phpbb exploit.
Now tell the Eve public, which is it? Your credibility is on the line.
Come on now answer the question.
Or are you hiding something?
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ok ok
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FrioBebe
S.A.S
Cruel Intentions
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:06:00 -
[66]
Edited by: FrioBebe on 02/01/2007 15:09:48
A full db dump can only be obtained by having access to the server, no?
So 3 should be your lucky number.
<3
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Tarsha Listur
Glamour Bunnies
Glamour Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:15:00 -
[67]
its sad that someone is gettin lil jollies off behaving like an elite hacker lol, its pretty amusing. It drgusting your behavior.
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CDS Leader
Caldari
Eve Forum Warriors
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:16:00 -
[68]
If crap happens in eve - its is called "Game Mechanic" and anyone saying OmGMhaxoploit is laughed at.
So what has happened here is a "phbb Mechanic" OmServerAdminHaxploit that bob are complaining about?
Join Eve Forum Warriors
Free Wardecs on Alliances! A Pirates Dream! |
Tarsha Listur
Glamour Bunnies
Glamour Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:18:00 -
[69]
af for proof of getting people banned, your "evidence " would not be proof in any businesses eyes as it was ileglly obtained.
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BlackRain
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:27:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Laythun
Would it not be plausible that in fact this guy is a BOB guy, and this has all been orchestrated sow discontent?
\o/
Our rather strong industry system has completed their upgrades to our new tinfoil helmet construction lines. The models are straight from Paris, the materials the best EVE can offer and the prices ridiculously low. We will setup shops to distribute these new age wonders of tinfoil as soon as the first product batches roll out from our factories.
In Stores Near You! GET YOURS NOW!
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Galavet
Minmatar
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:30:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Acwron
Of course not. Hacking would be even wrong in a legal way (rightly so). But the both break the point of playing a game in the same way.
And it's not ingame manipultion as long as you use extra accounts for it. It is out of game aswell.
e.g. you are be playing a standard roleplaying game: What would be to point if you could just create an "Orc character" to infiltrate the monsters who is loyal to the player characters? You break the game in the same way as if you would just read the game masters notes.
Ah I did not know I was talking to the White Knight of EvE. Somebody so right and pure to the heart of the game, that they would see using an alt for any purpose as lofty as spying or as lowly as picking up skills for your main, an out of game manipulation, or as evil as treading the game masters notesv.
I bow before your holy glow.
Current RKK Ranking: (MIN100) CEO |
Sinlare
Gallente
Sinlare Auditorium
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:32:00 -
[72]
Originally by: CDS Leader
If crap happens in eve - its is called "Game Mechanic" and anyone saying OmGMhaxoploit is laughed at.
So what has happened here is a "phbb Mechanic" OmServerAdminHaxploit that bob are complaining about?
Don't stoop so low as to condone illegal actions, if you can't see the difference you have a problem. |
searchi
tiberian suns
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:36:00 -
[73]
so infiltrating private ts by impersonating is not illegal? thats the faforite bob tactic no?
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CDS Leader
Caldari
Eve Forum Warriors
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:38:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Sinlare
Originally by: CDS Leader
If crap happens in eve - its is called "Game Mechanic" and anyone saying OmGMhaxoploit is laughed at.
So what has happened here is a "phbb Mechanic" OmServerAdminHaxploit that bob are complaining about?
Don't stoop so low as to condone illegal actions, if you can't see the difference you have a problem.
Nobody knows if an illegal action took place.
This just in - Tin Foil Hat sales at an all time high!
Join Eve Forum Warriors
Free Wardecs on Alliances! A Pirates Dream! |
Acwron
Minmatar
Cataclysm Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:40:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Galavet
Originally by: Acwron
Of course not. Hacking would be even wrong in a legal way (rightly so). But the both break the point of playing a game in the same way.
And it's not ingame manipultion as long as you use extra accounts for it. It is out of game aswell.
e.g. you are be playing a standard roleplaying game: What would be to point if you could just create an "Orc character" to infiltrate the monsters who is loyal to the player characters? You break the game in the same way as if you would just read the game masters notes.
Ah I did not know I was talking to the White Knight of EvE. Somebody so right and pure to the heart of the game, that they would see using an alt for any purpose as lofty as spying or as lowly as picking up skills for your main, an out of game manipulation, or as evil as treading the game masters notesv.
I bow before your holy glow.
Yeah why argue when one can be sarcastic?
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Dracorimus
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:45:00 -
[76]
....and the saga continues.........
Some of you people clearly must be under the age of 16 to not know what is legal or illegal.
-
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Nel'Kar
Impulse.
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:50:00 -
[77]
Originally by: searchi
so infiltrating private ts by impersonating is not illegal? thats the faforite bob tactic no?
I am a fairly passive observer in these ongoings but I feel it necessary to point out the fatal flaw in your argument here:
Using social manipulation (an accepted part of the game), and using a vulnerability in some forum software to gain access to private data are vastly different things. The latter of these two things is not so easily prevented as it isn't the fault of the person using the forum software as they likely do not know of this vulnerability.
I for one find it amusing that someone who clearly is so vastly unskilled at infiltration (they resort to what all indications point at as exploiting a forum vulnerability - and yes I have used phpBB many times before and it definitely isn't the strongest of forum softwares) is trying to run an intelligence service (and begging for isk at every step of the way).
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Galavet
Minmatar
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:53:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Acwron
Yeah why argue when one can be sarcastic?
The argument was over once you chose to hide behind an un-debatable position that is impossible to prove either way. You took the stance and opted out of this debate, not I.
It all comes back to Credibility; do we think that you really donFt use alts to assist your main? Dunno to be honest, I have my opinion on the matter but its not your Credibility I am concerned about.
The only matter of credibility I am concerned about is in the question I posed before, and will again:
Originally by: Galavet
Originally by: Kugutsumen
One of my agent has a full SQL backup of one of BoB member corp's forum. I don't know how he got it nor do I want to know. From my understanding he might have hacked them or infiltrated them and help them with programming stuff and they handed him admin access. Again I don't really want to know.
There is only three ways you could have a copy of private mail between me and DBP.
1) DBP or I gave you a screen shot
2) You Fabricated the mail
3) You hacked the forum using a phpbb exploit.
Now tell the Eve public, which is it? Your credibility is on the line.
Current RKK Ranking: (MIN100) CEO |
Laythun
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:54:00 -
[79]
Originally by: BlackRain
Originally by: Laythun
Would it not be plausible that in fact this guy is a BOB guy, and this has all been orchestrated sow discontent?
\o/
Our rather strong industry system has completed their upgrades to our new tinfoil helmet construction lines. The models are straight from Paris, the materials the best EVE can offer and the prices ridiculously low. We will setup shops to distribute these new age wonders of tinfoil as soon as the first product batches roll out from our factories.
In Stores Near You! GET YOURS NOW!
I already have my work clothes coated in tinfoiliumV
I like to join in with the conspiracy theories, but u bobits are pretty quick in 'trying' to shoot people down.
Hmm but isnt it strange that you quote my thread...your name is blackrain...my sig has a picture of an obvious undercover brother with the panther salute...hmm are u an undercover brother too blackrain....
omg...BOB...must all be brothers...Black Nova Corp...hmmm all the pieces are falling into place...the BOB leadership and memberbase are all former cast members and crew of the seminal film Undercover Brother
Hmm i even managed to find a pic of Blacklight and Kryztal
CEI's own Undercover Brother
It's great being Amarr, aint it?V
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SirMolle
Evolution
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 15:57:00 -
[80]
Oh i totally forgot, my bad.
Merry Xmas Anthony, do you get much snow in Indonesia?
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Lunas Feelgood
Euphoria Released
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Posted - 2007.01.02 16:00:00 -
[81]
Edited by: Lunas Feelgood on 02/01/2007 16:01:15
If this guy actually did a force hack on the BOB forum server it is indeed sad..
However I see no difference to what BOB has done in the past.. Only difference is that BOB use social hacking on forums, TS etc..
Its the same just another Approach.. So I cant stop laughing when the bob guys came on here telling how disgusted they are if the OP did a force hack becuase you doing the same and its quite frankly game destroying..
An alliance as ASCN would prop never be created again in the world of EVE becuase whats the point trying to build an empire when some kids just get access to you forum, ts and use offgame knowledge to destroy an ingame community, while covering it up in an illusion that they are just better "pvp&ers then every1 els..
So many times I have come to these forum and sayd my opinion on how dssgusted i am on all these social enginering tricks that gives you access and the ability to completly shut down another entity forum, TS plans etc.. I have called it game destroying and it is.. And ill tell you why..
1. New EVE players got almost zero chance to get into a corp in 0.0 space becuase people are affraid of alts/spyes.. The only recent alliance that has manage todo that is the goons, however they camed from a hole other forum community.. New players only got empire or low sec until they get a social network and can join some 0.0 corp and that can take quite a while.. Maybe thats why we still see all the old timers still controlling allmost every corner of 0.0 space?..
2. Forum, TS etc is not ingame mechanics, it has nothing todo with the game, however today it has become a neccessery tool to allmost every1 who plays EVE.. And thats the hole problem, Becuase the game was designed for spies however spies in a corp with the abiltiy to only read corp/alliance chat and mails is not that game destroying.. But when the playerbase then introduced TS, Forum and alot of other tools then it do get alot more severe.. Forum, TS is not ingame mechanics and any attempt to access it, what ever you do social enginering or a direct force hack s the same thing, But aperently over the years it has somewhat become legal and accepted in the EVE community..
And why has it that then?? Well BOB you only got youself to blame. For many new players you guys are idols on how to be "succesfull" in the world of EVE.. And when you public stats thats its ok todo social enginering on others private forum ts etc.. What do you guys think the new players gonna do??
If the OP did indeed did a force hack Im affraid this is only the beginning.. Atm the hole playerbase is rotten and im quite sure this hole "spying" gonna get more severe in the future..
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Dianabolic
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 16:00:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Phrixus Zephyr
Lol, whether its true or not this thread delivers just because of the amount of BoB forum warriors whining about how they're hard done by.
Pot, meet kettle.
Let's make one thing very clear here, Phrixus, and for you aswell Acrwon:
When we infiltrate an alliance we do using what any intelligence bod will tell you is "human intel". There is a person behind any infiltration or or grooming of a possible turncoat - in both cases the details and passwords are passed from one person to another for an agreed fee or other trade.
NONE of that EVER entails, denial of service hacking, or brute force attempts on our communications and out-of-game systems. If someone gains access to ANY of this, with humint, then more power to them - we've done it ourselves.
But if any of you here think we would stoop so low as to brute force, physically (and illegal in some states) disable and break our servers, the people for whom are responsible having their xmas breaks effected by it because on some of these servers the sites that pay their wages reside, then you all need to take a LONG step backwards, take a few deep breaths and re-assess your whole world view.
We know who you are now, Gaius, let's see how successful you will be in the future.
Quote:
2006.12.18 23:46:04 Notify Phoenix belonging to nOrAb self-destructs.
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searchi
tiberian suns
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Posted - 2007.01.02 16:01:00 -
[83]
Edited by: searchi on 02/01/2007 16:03:35
so somebody getting employment in a company with faked credentials and then doing industrial espionage would not be illegal?
the employer can not identify the spy b using legitimate means. in the same manner corporations in eve have no way of identifying faked identities.. what is less illegal in getting acces to privatecomunication (ts) by faked identities than forum hacking?
its all detestable and disgusting but bob will do anthing that they think necessary to win. if they get caught theyll try to ridicule the enemy with their forum brigade.
without those means the wouldnt be as succesfull b half.
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j0sephine
Caldari
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 16:04:00 -
[84]
"Yeah why argue when one can be sarcastic?"
Perhaps because the argument of 'breaking immersion by using alternate characters' is entirely pointless in the "roleplaying universe" which allows you to create 3 different characters as part of its rules... and which is commonly used to perform multitude of in-game tasks without having to use one's main character for them? By the same token, you're breaking immersion whenever you use covert ops scouting alt, or hauler alt, or anything along these lines.
So if that's somehow "destroying credibility", then probably no corporation in EVE has any. And it's just pot yelling at kettle how black it the latter is.
... on sidenote, Omega Man already said it but the OP is doing awesome work sowing the paranoia under the guise of public service. Clearly, they must be alt of whoever owns large amount of stocks of tinfoil hat factory ;s
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Dianabolic
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 16:05:00 -
[85]
Originally by: searchi
so somebody getting employment in a company with faked credentials and then doing industrial espionage would not be illegal?
the employer can not identify the spy b using legitimate means. in the same manner corporations in eve have no wa of identifying faked identities.. where is less illegal in getting acces to faked identities than forum hacking?
its all detestable and disgusting but bob will do anthing that they think necessar to win if the get caught theyll try to ridicuke the enemy with their forum brigade.
without those means the wouldnt be as succesfull b half.
What utter rubbish. Again, if you think we would sacrifice or risk our own liberty to just "get ahead" in some game then, yes, you should be first in line to step back and take a deep breath.
Quote:
2006.12.18 23:46:04 Notify Phoenix belonging to nOrAb self-destructs.
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j0sephine
Caldari
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 16:11:00 -
[86]
"If this guy actually did a force hack on the BOB forum server it is indeed sad..
However I see no difference to what BOB has done in the past.. Only difference is that BOB use social hacking on forums, TS etc.."
Hacking other people's computers is generally persecuted by law, joining their forum as member of their in-game corporation generally isn't.
There's the difference in nutshell for you. I don't think it's actually something worth complaining about, but it's definitely not "the same thing" as people desperate to point and laugh would like to pretend to themselves.
... and omg Lunas, post with your alt? :s
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Turkantho
Asgard Schiffswerften
Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2007.01.02 16:14:00 -
[87]
keep it rolling guys, I'm having a blast reading this
________
been there, done that, got the t-shirt |
Molotov Akkad
Caldari
Privateers
Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.02 16:17:00 -
[88]
Lol BoB!
Not much fun when the shoe is on the other foot, is it?
And btw the posts from all the senior Bobbits give him all the credibility he needs...
But maybe thats the plan
Quote:
Well I suppose if I'm gonna pvp I better plug my mouse in :P
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Acwron
Minmatar
Cataclysm Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.01.02 16:18:00 -
[89]
Originally by: j0sephine
"Yeah why argue when one can be sarcastic?"
Perhaps because the argument of 'breaking immersion by using alternate characters' is entirely pointless in the "roleplaying universe" which allows you to create 3 different characters as part of its rules... and which is commonly used to perform multitude of in-game tasks without having to use one's main character for them? By the same token, you're breaking immersion whenever you use covert ops scouting alt, or hauler alt, or anything along these lines.
So if that's somehow "destroying credibility", then probably no corporation in EVE has any. And it's just pot yelling at kettle how black it the latter is.
[...]
And here am I thinking that the 3 slots were there to have the possiblity to play 3 different characters and roles and not to have 2 alts helping one main.
And tbh I don't care if you break the immersion for yourself. Thats your own problem. But when you start using a totally unrelated account or buy a character in order to sabotage a different faction you break the immersion for them. When you do that you not only destroy the point of playing for yourself but also for the others.
@Diana: never did I say BoB used anything illegal by law. Seems like you missed that just like Galavet but write another paragraph about how BoB don't exploit or hacked even though nobody said so.
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Dianabolic
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.02 16:21:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Acwron
@Diana: never did I say BoB used anything illegal by law. Seems like you missed that just like Galavet but write another paragraph about how BoB don't exploit or hacked even though nobody said so.
Acwron, if you said that then yes, I did miss it, my apologies, my main focus was those that say "haha how do you like it when it's on the other foot" when "it" isn't even teh same. This whole saga has ruined a fair few peoples' xmas because it had an RL effect. Not, mine, thankfully, but people I care about.
When we don't want to play eve we can simply turn off the PC and it will never bother us - but you know, the SECOND what we do in EvE has an effect on the lives and careers of people outside of the game then that's just too ******* far man, ya know?
Quote:
2006.12.18 23:46:04 Notify Phoenix belonging to nOrAb self-destructs.
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