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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 13 post(s) |
Destoya
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
426
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Posted - 2015.06.20 07:04:05 -
[31] - Quote
All of these mods suck and as such will never be used. I think you guys missed an opportunity here; passive shield tanking isnt exactly the most riveting gameplay design but it would be at least nice if shield rechargers and flux coils could shake their current status as unfittable modules.
Modules this bad just doesn't need to exist, either change the module or just get rid of it altogether. Could do something interesting like give flux coils a shield HP bonus at the cost of fitting/heat damage/cap/etc to give a module that provides more raw HP than a power diag at the cost of other stats. |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates Get Off My Lawn
1122
|
Posted - 2015.06.20 07:24:37 -
[32] - Quote
Shield flux coils and shield rechargers are basically useless. Something should be done about that.
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. So, why do I post here?
I'm stubborn.
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Dino Zavr
Shadow Owls
31
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Posted - 2015.06.20 11:04:23 -
[33] - Quote
CCP Terminus wrote:Aeon Veritas wrote:CCP Terminus wrote:Consolidate 'Named' modules from meta levels 1-4 into two variants within meta level 1 - a 'compact' variant and a 'restrained' variant And again I want to ask why they are all changed to meta level 1? Do you have any plans for the meta levels 2-4? If not, please consider to distribute the variants across them, like "Compact" = Meta 1, "Restrained" = Meta 2 and so on... This would make it easier to filter the inventory for the different mods. Once the module tiericide project is complete, it is very likely we will rework meta levels to remove the gaps. Until then we feel leaving the gaps is a better option than having two systems working simultaneously.
In this scenario all stocks of Meta4 deposited modules shall automatically be converted into Meta1 Afterward they will NOT be promoted to higher meta. Not that I am complaining but this gimmick looks like a tiny robbery :) |
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery Prolapse.
2453
|
Posted - 2015.06.20 13:00:27 -
[34] - Quote
I passive tank PVP fits a lot. My three current favorite fits for passive tanking in PVP are; Passive Svipul
[Svipul, Passive]
Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II
Medium Shield Extender II Warp Disruptor II [Empty Med slot] 5MN Y-T8 Compact Microwarpdrive
200mm AutoCannon II 200mm AutoCannon II 200mm AutoCannon II 200mm AutoCannon II Small Diminishing Power System Drain I Small Diminishing Power System Drain I
Small Core Defense Field Extender II Small Core Defense Field Extender II Small Core Defense Field Extender II
[Jackdaw, Passdaw]
Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Tracking Speed Disruption Script 5MN Y-T8 Compact Microwarpdrive EM Ward Amplifier II Republic Fleet Medium Shield Extender Warp Disruptor II
Light Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Light Missile Light Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Light Missile Light Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Light Missile Light Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Light Missile Light Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Light Missile [Empty High slot]
Small Core Defense Field Purger II Small Core Defense Field Purger II Small Core Defense Field Purger II
[Nereus, Shortcat]
Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Damage Control II Shield Power Relay II
Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Stasis Webifier II Warp Scrambler II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Small Diminishing Power System Drain I 200mm AutoCannon II
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Medium Core Defense Field Purger I
Warrior II x3 Hornet EC-300 x3
The tanking numbers, from the top; Svipul - 140 DPS tank Jackdaw - 252 DPS tank Nereus 'Shortcat' - 458 DPS tank
In none of those fits does either a shield recharger do anything to improve tank. Nominally the passive Jackdaw benefits by 50 HP per second in passive tank, but it loses so much raw EHP you end up unable to tank much anyway. This is because even a weak hit will dip you below your passive recharge peak and you don't recover, so passive tanking requires actual buffer.
This is why shield flux coils are unused; yes you gain % recharge but by losing your shield hitpoints you end up basically back in the same position in reality. I mean, the results of PYFA and EFT theorycraft are sustained by real world testing of fits in the game - you suffer if you use SFC's and not SPR's.
Flux coils are only distinguished from SPR's by the lack of cap penalty. For example, if you replace the SPRs in the Shortcat with SFC's your tank goes from 458 DPS to 332 DPS. Yes, you have better cap stability, but that's irrelevant mostly. You can claw some of that back by going full purger rigs but it's still not useful. Yes, you are cap stable, but you can still run a point using a small Nosferatu - after all very low capacitor levels caused by SPR's recharge quite fast, and the Nos cycles faster than a web, point, invul, so you can sustain tank and point long enough to be efficient bait.
That's what passive fits are used for - bait, in PVp, or just for low-DPS ratting fits.
What is needed in a rebalance of shield buff modules is dispensing with the current three option which are; rechargers - % buff to shield recharge rate power relays = capacitor penalty and recharge rate buff flux coils = hitpoint penalty and recharge bonus
also, the Power Diagnostic is also of note; shield capacity and shield recharge and capacitor amount and recharge bonus (4 positives)
thereafter, the rig options for passive tanking are; purger rigs = recharge bonus and sig penalty extender rigs = hitpoint bonus and sig penalty
What is needed is a rationalisation of these three modules into two. They are all focused around recharge rate. For passive tanking, you need a large pool of shield hitpoints and a short time to recharge them. eg; 10,000 raw hitpoints recharging over 600 seconds = 16 raw HP/sec 10,000 raw hitpoints recharging over 300 seconds = 32hp/s
if you put on an SFC and the rate goes up 20% but the hitpoints go down 15%, you aren't much better off. 10,000 @ 600s = 16hp/s 8,500 @ 480s = 17.7 hp/s = 10% net benefit but lower EHP.
Iterate that two times more, for 4 SFC's you get to 6141 hp @ 300s = 20hp/s
Or you go SPR's, and the rate goes up but the hitpoints remain stable, so you get to 10,000 @ 300s = 33.3 hp/s. So you can see why SFC's suck and SPR's are the way to go. I mean, why tiercide SFC's at all?
Therefore the modules to help passive tanking should be; midslots: shield rechargers which reduce shield recharge time (ie; recharge the shield hitpoint pool faster) lowslot flux coil which buffs recharge time shield power relays which could be an active module, which swaps capacitor recharge into shield recharge when active.
ie; if you recharge 20 capacitor per second the power relay takes some of this capacitor and converts it into shield hitpoints in a constant fashion.
For example, a SPR Tech 1 would convert 50% of capacitor regen into shield hitpoints. A T2 converts 75%. This could be stacking penalised such that four SPR's would result in 90% or 95% or 99% efficiency at converting cap into shield.
This would create an interesting mechanic in tradeoffs - you could use a capacitor battery and CCC's to up your cap regen rate to provide power to your SPR's. You could active cap inject to provide juice for your SPR's. Your passive energy -> shield conversion could be disrupted by neuting. You aare sacrificing DPS for this, of course, since it's a lowslot module.
Has CCP considered this kind of module? it would be an interesting mechanism for a fairly predictable set of fits - drake, Shortcat, Svipul, jackdaw and Rattler.
Doctor Prince Field Marshall of Prolapse. Alliance and Grand Sasquatch of Bob
We take Batphones. Contact us at Hola Batmanuel - Free call 1800-UR-MOMMA
~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
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Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
2907
|
Posted - 2015.06.20 13:30:32 -
[35] - Quote
TBH I would rather see Shield Flux Coils work opposite to how they work currently.
They would nerf your recharge rate but increase your buffer amount.
Roleplaying Trinkets for Explorers and Collectors
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Victor Emmanuel
Bearded BattleBears Brave Collective
5
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Posted - 2015.06.20 15:44:07 -
[36] - Quote
Altrue wrote:Shield rechargers
Suggestion: What about a module that modifies the curve of shield regeneration to have the optimal regeneration start earlier and last longer? That would definitely be a nice addition to Shield Flux Coils or Shield Rechargers.
This ^^
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HeXxploiT
Big Diggers Get Off My Lawn
158
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Posted - 2015.06.20 17:46:35 -
[37] - Quote
CCP Terminus wrote:
The general principles behind module tiericide are as follows:
Provide meaningful options within the module set
I have often thought that it would be nice if passive shield recharge were buffed slightly. I think the only passive recharge tanked ship in the game that pilots fly frequently is the rattlesnake thanks to it's hansom bonus to shield recharge rate. Would be nice to see it brought up to spec to where it could compete with shield boosting and thereby gave more options to consider for shield fits. |
Jenn aSide
Smokin Aces.
11458
|
Posted - 2015.06.20 17:59:27 -
[38] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:TBH I would rather see Shield Flux Coils work opposite to how they work currently.
They would nerf your recharge rate but increase your buffer amount.
this |
Deacon Abox
Justified Chaos Spaceship Bebop
509
|
Posted - 2015.06.20 18:06:50 -
[39] - Quote
Ab'del Abu wrote:Shield power relays are already quite strong, don't think they need a buff. This. Why are you increasing the strength of SPRs? Passive shield regen is already a bit ridiculous on certain ships, and always has been.
CCP, there are off buttons for ship explosions, missile effects, turret effects, etc. "Immersion" does not seem to be harmed by those. So, [u]please[/u] give us a persisting-áoff button for the jump gate and autoscan visuals.
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Yazzinra
Scorpion Ventures
74
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Posted - 2015.06.20 19:31:06 -
[40] - Quote
How about y'all finish ship teiricide. Just another incomplete feature from CCP. |
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Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
785
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Posted - 2015.06.20 19:38:47 -
[41] - Quote
Shield flux coils. The best use for them is to still melt them down, and use the minerals to build something useful.
EDIT: SPRs out recharge SFCs WITHOUT 15% taken from your primary tank.
"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves."
The Trial - Franz Kafka-á
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HeXxploiT
Big Diggers Get Off My Lawn
159
|
Posted - 2015.06.20 23:42:51 -
[42] - Quote
Yazzinra wrote:How about y'all finish ship teiricide. Just another incomplete feature from CCP.
Logic would dictate having a level base module set before modifying ships. Anyway the module tiericide has been going splendidly and once completed it will be easier for the devs to balance ships having their module formula in place and not so chaotic. |
James Baboli
Novablasters
898
|
Posted - 2015.06.21 02:02:58 -
[43] - Quote
HeXxploiT wrote:Yazzinra wrote:How about y'all finish ship teiricide. Just another incomplete feature from CCP. Logic would dictate having a level base module set before modifying ships. Anyway the module tiericide has been going splendidly and once completed it will be easier for the devs to balance ships having their module formula in place and not so chaotic.
Especially with the ships left to rebalance having either very dedicated communities built around them (BLOPS) or built around building them (T3s) or are niche by design (many of the remaining t2 classes, like EAFs). All of these are very subject to major changes in how the modules they use are balance as they are usually razor edge on one or more resource of the fit (PG, CPU, Cap) to make them work properly. As such, I am not gonna get my jimmies rustled about various ships languishing so long as CCP acknowledges they are being watched, makes changes at a reasonable rate (every other or every third release is enough for me on the things which are getting filed down, rather than a mallet or spackle) etc.
As for these modules, I can't say I'm much impressed with the scale of buffs. they are still all extremely niche at best, and SFCs are probably just a tiny bit better than an empty slot now.
Talking more,
Flying crazier,
And drinking more
Making battleships worth the warp
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Orca Platypus
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
3
|
Posted - 2015.06.21 05:33:27 -
[44] - Quote
If those stats are final, chance to make those mods useful is completely wasted. Shield power relays remain pretty much the only shield tanking low slots, thus they at least have their niche. Flux coils suck. Rechargers suck. |
Arthur Aihaken
Jormungand Corporation
4458
|
Posted - 2015.06.21 07:58:56 -
[45] - Quote
Instead of a shield HP reduction for shield flux coils, why not reduce either armor or hull by the same corresponding amount?
I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
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afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1429
|
Posted - 2015.06.21 08:20:16 -
[46] - Quote
I don't think I've ever found a fit where an extender wasn't better than a recharger.
And flux coils....lolwut? It's like they were made as if regen value wasn't tied to total capacity but a flat value per hull. |
Haatakan Reppola
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
40
|
Posted - 2015.06.21 10:18:00 -
[47] - Quote
Some stacking "penalty" on the negative aspects of these modules would go a long way. As far as i can tell there is no stacking penalty on any of these modules. |
Alexis Nightwish
250
|
Posted - 2015.06.21 15:06:38 -
[48] - Quote
Current stats:
[Rattlesnake, SPRII] Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II Shield Power Relay II
Large Core Defense Field Purger II Large Core Defense Field Purger II Large Core Defense Field Purger II
56k EHP 451 DPS tank (this will go up slightly in Aegis)
[Rattlesnake, SFCII] Shield Flux Coil II Shield Flux Coil II Shield Flux Coil II Shield Flux Coil II Shield Flux Coil II Shield Flux Coil II
Large Core Defense Field Purger II Large Core Defense Field Purger II Large Core Defense Field Purger II
39k EHP 278 DPS tank
So who in their right mind would ever use flux coils? No one does now, and no one will after. The shield HP penalty of the flux coils is too damn high to ever justify their use.
Just delete flux coils from the game. That would fit in with the stated goals:
"Reduce unnecessary complexity" by removing modules that ironically cripple your ship rather than help it. I remember as a newbie trying to understand the point of flux coils. It wasn't until years later that I realized there is none.
"Provide meaningful options within the module set" by removing a meaningless set of modules from the game.
Oh and before you tell me that the advantage of flux coils is that they don't penalize the capacitor like SPRs do, let me tell you that the only ships that ever go full passive shield regen are PvE ships that don't need cap like the Rattle, Gila, Scorp Navy, etc.
CCP approaches problems in one of two ways: nudge or cludge
EVE Online's "I win!" Button
Fixing bombs, not the bombers
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James Baboli
Novablasters
900
|
Posted - 2015.06.21 15:16:30 -
[49] - Quote
Orca Platypus wrote:If those stats are final, chance to make those mods useful is completely wasted. Shield power relays remain pretty much the only shield tanking low slots, thus they at least have their niche. Flux coils suck. Rechargers suck.
Power diagnositic system. Shield amount and recharge.
Talking more,
Flying crazier,
And drinking more
Making battleships worth the warp
|
James Baboli
Novablasters
900
|
Posted - 2015.06.21 15:17:44 -
[50] - Quote
afkalt wrote:I don't think I've ever found a fit where an extender wasn't better than a recharger.
And flux coils....lolwut? It's like they were made as if regen value wasn't tied to total capacity but a flat value per hull.
Where you can't fit an extender?
Talking more,
Flying crazier,
And drinking more
Making battleships worth the warp
|
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McChicken Combo HalfMayo
The Happy Meal
804
|
Posted - 2015.06.21 16:38:46 -
[51] - Quote
I thought tiericide was meant to add meaningful choices. It's mostly stripped away choices so far.
All modules have various stats associated with them. Stats such as PG, CPU, cycle time, capacitor use, etc. The concept for adding meaningful choices should be based around the understanding that different scenarios optimize the usefulness of certain stats over others.
- Meta 0 modules get base (b) for all stats. - Meta 1-4 modules get one or two stats at b+x, the rest of their stats at b-y. - T2 modules get b+z for all stats, where z is less than x, but cost more, require more training to fit, and in some cases use more fitting. - Faction and deadspace module balance so far has been good, not much to change there.
It won't work perfect for every module group but as a general theme this is the way to go. The theme right now of removing all the choices, putting one version with less fitting and another with less cap, and calling that tiericide is underwhelming.
There are all our dominion
Gate camps: "Its like the lowsec watercooler, just with explosions and boose" - Ralph King-Griffin
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afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1429
|
Posted - 2015.06.21 16:40:45 -
[52] - Quote
James Baboli wrote:afkalt wrote:I don't think I've ever found a fit where an extender wasn't better than a recharger.
And flux coils....lolwut? It's like they were made as if regen value wasn't tied to total capacity but a flat value per hull. Where you can't fit an extender?
Perhaps should have said extender/hardener.
They're a waste of a slot. |
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CCP Terminus
C C P C C P Alliance
262
|
Posted - 2015.06.22 02:10:19 -
[53] - Quote
Regarding Shield Flux Coils and Shield Rechargers, I'll make sure to bring up some of the points and ideas made in this thread the next time we have a module tiericide meeting. There's always potential for changes at this stage.
@CCP_Terminus // Game Designer // Team Size Matters
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Ranamar
Valkyries of Night Of Sound Mind
89
|
Posted - 2015.06.22 04:04:13 -
[54] - Quote
CCP Terminus wrote:Regarding Shield Flux Coils and Shield Rechargers, I'll make sure to bring up some of the points and ideas made in this thread the next time we have a module tiericide meeting. There's always potential for changes at this stage.
I think you're already thinking of this, but I basically have two questions, one essentially a follow-on from the other.
1) Are you looking to change the desirability of using shield recharge modules during this tiericide pass?
2) What do you think of the current state of shield recharge modules? (Relatedly, when do you think they should be a strong consideration? We can give feedback on what's missing then.)
I'm not really sure what I think of them, but I basically never use them, either. |
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery Prolapse.
2455
|
Posted - 2015.06.22 04:23:48 -
[55] - Quote
Thanks, CCP Terminus.
As Alexis nightwish said above, these modules have limited (rechargers) to no practicable use (flux coils).
It is clear CCP has the will and ability to put module types in the game and try things out, c.f. Target Spectrum Breaker, the new missile guidance computers. Likewise, you should be capable and willing to admit that the idea of flux coils is good, but the practical use is next to nil because it is one of the few modules which basically works against itself.
I mean, there's no armour module which increases resistance but reduces hitpoints. Granted it's not a direct comparison, due to shield recharge being what it is, and there's no passive recharge of armour, but regardless there's almost no modules in the game which have self-defeating negatives.
So, if you're willing to at least discuss changing the module's mechanism, if you remove the hitpoint penalty it becomes a better version of the SPR due to having no cap penalty.
if you reduce the hitpoint penalty it would need to be balanced against the SPR and Recharger.
The Flux Coil has to have a clear benefit versus either of these modules and versus other options for tanking.
eg, a recharger competes with the SPR (which is more efficient at % recharge but has an unrelated drawback) and with resist modules, which are more effective for tanking because they increase EHP not just recharge. It also competes with extenders if you have the spare PG. its only real use is in PG constrained battleship fits, because every other ship either needs buffer (eg, frigates) or has the spare CPU to fit resists.
Assume you have 10,000 raw hitpoints and 600s recharge, with 0% across the board resists, and are deciding on an invul field (eg; 30% resist bonus for simplicity's sakes) or a recharger with 15% resist bonus. The passive tank raw is 16 hp/s. With 30% resists the effective hitpoint tank goes to 20.8. 15% recharge bonus goes to 19.6.
Therefore you will choose better resists to give a better EHP tank with a lower raw tank, and not choose shield rechargers. Ergo, to passive tank, you fill your lows with SPR's and deal with the capacitor problems (unneeded with Drakes, Rattlers, etc, and as we know no one ever passive shield tanks any laser boats).
So, comparing the T2 modules; Recharger II = 15% Shield Power Relay = 25% Flux Coil II = 30%
If you remove the shield hitpoint penalty for the flux coil, it invalidates the SPR. If you remove the cap penalty of the SPR, likewise, it becomes even moreso the module of choice.
So the only real option with the flux coil is to either reduce the shield hitpoint penalty so that the nett effect is equal with the SPR so that thereby the tradeoff is, i guess, do you lose capacitor with the SPR or buffer with the flux coil?
But if you consider the effect of midslots, you'd never, ever choose the flux coil anyway because as shown above, you can add resists to make any given pool of hitpoints more effective. In other words, why trade off capacitor for buffer when you can keep the buffer and use midslots to add even MORE buffer and MORE resists?
So, yeah, to my mind the choices with the flux coil are to redesign the mechanism of its operation entirely, or remove it entirely because it is demonstrated that it cannot be modified to become useful and not a redundant variation of the SPR anyway. The whole idea of passive shield tanking is to add buffer, then resists, then recharge, capacitor be damned i'm using capless weapons or drones.
Doctor Prince Field Marshall of Prolapse. Alliance and Grand Sasquatch of Bob
We take Batphones. Contact us at Hola Batmanuel - Free call 1800-UR-MOMMA
~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
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Kasia en Tilavine
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2015.06.22 05:01:37 -
[56] - Quote
CCP Terminus wrote:Regarding Shield Flux Coils and Shield Rechargers, I'll make sure to bring up some of the points and ideas made in this thread the next time we have a module tiericide meeting. There's always potential for changes at this stage.
Might I suggest flipping the two stats so that flux coils are a buffer extender with a reduction to recharge rate? ASB tankers would like a low slot buffer extension module and don't particularly care to much about their recharge when they're feeding their tank with charges.
As for Mid slot rechargers, Just take into consideration the modules they're competing against....
I am considering fitting a mid slot recharger... oh wait, i'd rather fit...
Shield extenders ASB's Cap boosters second prop Invulns damage hole plugs scrams/disruptors E-war Tracking computers/MGE's/Omni-directionals PWNAGE webs Sensor boosters
I'm not sure what can be changed about rechargers to make them considerable for fitting against the massive list of better alternatives without making them OP. Perhaps an active module with a 50% recharge reduction but the cap use of an Invuln? Neutable, and burnable with overheat to raise it to 65% recharge reduction... That may be op on rattlesnakes with 2/3 extenders... IDK, they don't seem like they can be balanced... just remove them then? |
Rawketsled
Generic Corp Name
203
|
Posted - 2015.06.22 05:36:25 -
[57] - Quote
At what point does the stacking penalty on Invuln's make a Recharger more effective?
I'm taking a guess that 2x Inv + 1x Recharger gives you a marginally higher DPS than 2x Inv. |
Barrogh Habalu
Forever Winter Absolute Zero.
869
|
Posted - 2015.06.22 06:29:31 -
[58] - Quote
As a concept, coils were supposed to give some more sustained HPpS than relays at the expense of alpha resistance. Sounds like something you'd fit on traditional PvE boat. IMO it can work, but they need to be buffed considerably.
Shield rechargers and relays are pretty much blood raiders grinding mods as well, I really doubt there's a good use of them outside of traditional PvE against heavy neuting. |
Janeway84
Def Squadron Pride Before Fall
171
|
Posted - 2015.06.22 08:25:11 -
[59] - Quote
Its great that you keep the module tiericide train going! Im sure you guys can handle both ship and module tiericide work at the same time.
Flux coils are very bad compared to other options, they need some serious tweaks or like someone suggested deleted from the game. Maybe you can trade off armor hp for recharge? Since they are a low slot mod. Shield rechargers are also less useful but not as bad as flux coils from my own experience. Thing is shield rechargers are using a mid slot wich most players w most ships find other modules that are more needed to fit there, I liked the idea someone had of making it a active module like invul field and giving it a higher recharge.
SPR's seem like they are in a good place imo, would perhaps be fun to see a few navy / faction variants for each of the module types so they are in line with other modules in the game. |
afkalt
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1429
|
Posted - 2015.06.22 09:35:57 -
[60] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote:Thanks, CCP Terminus.
As Alexis nightwish said above, these modules have limited (rechargers) to no practicable use (flux coils).
It is clear CCP has the will and ability to put module types in the game and try things out, c.f. Target Spectrum Breaker, the new missile guidance computers. Likewise, you should be capable and willing to admit that the idea of flux coils is good, but the practical use is next to nil because it is one of the few modules which basically works against itself.
I mean, there's no armour module which increases resistance but reduces hitpoints. Granted it's not a direct comparison, due to shield recharge being what it is, and there's no passive recharge of armour, but regardless there's almost no modules in the game which have self-defeating negatives.
So, if you're willing to at least discuss changing the module's mechanism, if you remove the hitpoint penalty it becomes a better version of the SPR due to having no cap penalty.
if you reduce the hitpoint penalty it would need to be balanced against the SPR and Recharger.
The Flux Coil has to have a clear benefit versus either of these modules and versus other options for tanking.
eg, a recharger competes with the SPR (which is more efficient at % recharge but has an unrelated drawback) and with resist modules, which are more effective for tanking because they increase EHP not just recharge. It also competes with extenders if you have the spare PG. its only real use is in PG constrained battleship fits, because every other ship either needs buffer (eg, frigates) or has the spare CPU to fit resists.
Assume you have 10,000 raw hitpoints and 600s recharge, with 0% across the board resists, and are deciding on an invul field (eg; 30% resist bonus for simplicity's sakes) or a recharger with 15% resist bonus. The passive tank raw is 16 hp/s. With 30% resists the effective hitpoint tank goes to 20.8. 15% recharge bonus goes to 19.6.
Therefore you will choose better resists to give a better EHP tank with a lower raw tank, and not choose shield rechargers. Ergo, to passive tank, you fill your lows with SPR's and deal with the capacitor problems (unneeded with Drakes, Rattlers, etc, and as we know no one ever passive shield tanks any laser boats).
So, comparing the T2 modules; Recharger II = 15% Shield Power Relay = 25% Flux Coil II = 30%
If you remove the shield hitpoint penalty for the flux coil, it invalidates the SPR. If you remove the cap penalty of the SPR, likewise, it becomes even moreso the module of choice.
So the only real option with the flux coil is to either reduce the shield hitpoint penalty so that the nett effect is equal with the SPR so that thereby the tradeoff is, i guess, do you lose capacitor with the SPR or buffer with the flux coil?
But if you consider the effect of midslots, you'd never, ever choose the flux coil anyway because as shown above, you can add resists to make any given pool of hitpoints more effective. In other words, why trade off capacitor for buffer when you can keep the buffer and use midslots to add even MORE buffer and MORE resists?
So, yeah, to my mind the choices with the flux coil are to redesign the mechanism of its operation entirely, or remove it entirely because it is demonstrated that it cannot be modified to become useful and not a redundant variation of the SPR anyway. The whole idea of passive shield tanking is to add buffer, then resists, then recharge, capacitor be damned i'm using capless weapons or drones.
This. Unfortunately.
That said, its name lends itself perfectly to being the shield version of reactive armor hardener tbh. |
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