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Outlaw
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Posted - 2003.11.11 13:39:00 -
[91]
Heres a quote from TomB
"railguns won't be fully useable in long range combat until warping into a scene gets another look at, ETA for this is uncertain at the moment"
Until this is fixed why even use Rails in PVP? Blaster are getting so much lovin because of this and as Tomb has stated they are rocking at close range.
TomB instead of given everything else some lovin maybe you should really look at the core problem that you mentioned above. People have been complaining about this since the start of retail 6 months ago and nothing really concret has been done about it and from your post nothing will be done in the near future. Maybe just maybe when this is fixed a better balance towards weapons can be done.
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von Steinroehder
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Posted - 2003.11.11 13:40:00 -
[92]
Now, just image what batting the other types would get you in terms of response from the player base. I think it's really hard to 'nerf' something these days, because players work to use a certain loadout (at least I do), and if you log after patch time and see your beloved ship suddenly doing less DoT or whatever, you're going to become frustrated for sure.
I thought about that for some time when I asked myself whether ship combat could be prolonged in some way, but all I came up with was nerfing weapon damage, because upping shields or armor would effectively downsize frigates again... it's a thin line CCP has to walk on there.
Speaking of hybrid luvage that means you cannot 'nerf' lasers and projectiles without hitting a good lot of people over the head, when you intended to make more people happy.
It's all about making a weapon class a viable choice.
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TomB
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Posted - 2003.11.11 13:41:00 -
[93]
Quote: DEFINE EFFECTIVE! THIS IS IMPORTANT!
10km is good. 15km is stretching it but still reasonable ... 20km no way TomB, don't do this. I have been using blasters since the day i got into my first Atron, i've chained and pvped with blasters pre and post "MegaWeaponChange Patch TM" don't take away the challenge they present for the pilots that select them as their favored weapons. It'll be like tachyons once again.
Unless by effective you mean they get hit's but not damage ammounts that would justify loading out to fight with blasters at 20km minimum.
Was talking about large blasters being able to hit at longer ranges, sorry about not defining this well enough
"Where is my hat?" |
von Steinroehder
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Posted - 2003.11.11 13:49:00 -
[94]
Edited by: von Steinroehder on 11/11/2003 13:50:37 To adress the distance problem in PvP:
Insert a control to drop out of warp early.
I know you are limited to the warp 'points' where ships drop out when warping to an object, but you know the distance to them at any point of the warp... so just add a few options like 'exit warp approx. 25/50/75 kms early'.
That would give pilots several more options:
spying a place by warping in at a distance warping in on their weapon's range evading lockdown by webbies and scramblers actually using railguns
The only problem you are having then IMHO is that people can avoid combat too easily... that would have to be adressed otherwise.
If this were implemented, long range weapons would actually be DAMNED NICE TO HAVE.
425mm railguns, anyone?
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Raven DeBlade
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Posted - 2003.11.11 14:16:00 -
[95]
(off topic) i have to agree that MWDs gives an unfair disadvantage to ships wich depends on shields i.e Caldari, Gallente etc and alot less disadvantages to Amarr ships who relies on Armour. And since Amarr also have more cap this is even more unbalanced. But as he said its fixable with skills etc.
"To hunt pirates you need time and patience, because even monkeys fall from the trees"
"Any statements made above this line are my persona" |
Raven DeBlade
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Posted - 2003.11.11 14:21:00 -
[96]
Quote:
Quote: Suggestion; Either decrease the cap penelty to -10% or -15% and reduce the cap/use to 40 or even 30 OR make the actuall skill for using the MWD count. Increase -% cap/use per level and add a -2%/-3%/-4%/-5% per level lesser capacitor penelty. This could actually make players train the skill to more than just level 1, since they can¦t see why e
Good suggestion, I do not want to lessen the penality on the shield but I promise I'll have a look on cap penality and usage with the skill.
This should go for alot more skills/Modules as it is now anyone can be an "ECM expert" in 1h training since people dont need more than level 1 of most skills to be able to use modules etc. There is no reason to actually train above level 1 for most skills. Also make skills to have more bonuses for the last 2 levels i.e level 4 and especially at level 5 where and adidditional "bonus" should be added for example add an "extra" 2-3% at level 4 and maybe an extra 5% at level 5 on Large turret skills etc. As it is now its not worth training combat skills to level 5, the only skills that is worth the time is industrial/science skills.
"To hunt pirates you need time and patience, because even monkeys fall from the trees"
"Any statements made above this line are my persona" |
TomB
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Posted - 2003.11.11 14:35:00 -
[97]
Quote: Insert a control to drop out of warp early.
I know you are limited to the warp 'points' where ships drop out when warping to an object, but you know the distance to them at any point of the warp... so just add a few options like 'exit warp approx. 25/50/75 kms early'.
This is the plan but ETA on this is uncertain at the moment as I said.
"Where is my hat?" |
Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2003.11.11 14:49:00 -
[98]
Quote: (off topic) i have to agree that MWDs gives an unfair disadvantage to ships wich depends on shields i.e Caldari, Gallente etc and alot less disadvantages to Amarr ships who relies on Armour. And since Amarr also have more cap this is even more unbalanced. But as he said its fixable with skills etc.
Caldari: do indeed suffer the most from the 50% shield penalty of the MWD.
However they have range bonuses on hybrids, missiles and EW all of which allow them to engage from further away. A MWD is not a critical item for such loadouts, unless you require it for specific engagements.
Minmatar: second best in shields suffer as well.
However they don't have cap issues due to the fact that their primary weaponry are projectiles and missiles. Med Slots also allow for some EW.
Gallente: Have less shields than Min and Cal. Thus suffer less from shield penatly of MWD. Strongest structure and 2nd strongest Armor compensates for the loss (with a couple of tweaks). Cap isn't also such a major issue when using Blasters (primary weapon) which require a MWD to be trully effective (unless you are on the defensive against smaller vessels trying to approach you).
Amarr: Lowest shields... suffer the least from MWD penalty. Cap however is important for the Amarr and the 25% penalty which decreases Max Cap and indirectly cap regen as well is a problem. Armor and Structure valious compensate somwhat. The important factor though is that their lasers are ableto deal a lot of damage at good ranges therefore negating the need for a MWD.
The biggest problem MWD presents is BS Vs Cruiser Vs Frigate balancing. Even with targeting time changing to make it harder for larger to lock smaller the inability of the Frigate to overtake the speed of cruisers and BSs nullifies the benefit.
Sorry for dragging this OT btw.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
Babar
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Posted - 2003.11.11 15:01:00 -
[99]
Edited by: Babar on 11/11/2003 17:16:55 Edited by: Babar on 11/11/2003 15:10:52 Edited by: Babar on 11/11/2003 15:03:54 Please factor in ship bonuses in this balancing mess as well..
While gallente ships gain up to 25% damage and tempest pilots gain as much as 66% on a 1400mm, amarr pilots with lvl5 bs AND controlled bursts 5 have their cap usage reduced so a mega beam takes (only? ;p) 50% more cap than a 425mm(also with CB5). 93% (per sec, not/shot) for the tachyon...
Also, this leaves the base damage (damage / rof) of these weapons on par with eachother. (0.353 for tempest, 0.3472 for the 425mm (old stats), and 0.34 for the tachyon).
If you're flying an apoc, you do get another 25% cap recharge as well, but you're far from even. And as you start pushing the limits, every shred of energy used will cripple you more..
I don't have experience with 1400mm/425mm, but assume they both miss a lot if things are even slightly balanced with current stats..
And lasers DO use more energy, per damage dealt, than hybrids over the whole spectrum, even with maxed energy skills. - Unless you manage to squeeze a large crystal into a medium laser and outdamage a tachyon, that is. ;D
Best of luck trying to come up with something that's genuinely fair, and which people realize is. ___ And I'd really like to see the lvl3 cruisers (as they're the most distinct/defining ships for each race) reasonably equal when this is over. Is the Thorax supposed to own a Maller even using only rails? ..it has 2k drone bay as well. |
ga'ia
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Posted - 2003.11.11 15:52:00 -
[100]
Edited by: ga'ia on 11/11/2003 16:00:58 Any boosting of the mwd in ways you have suggested will completely destroy any chance frigates have of becoming usefull again.
What does a MWD have to do with that?
Show me a BS that can effectivelly orbit at blaster distance ~2.5km with mwd on. Even if nanos start working (agility) and you do somehow manage to sustain a proper orbit at mwd speed... how often do you think you ll be hitting?
Think you missunderstood me there some. The changes I wanted to the MWD was what comes after the BOLD text that said "Suggestion;"... Ofcourse a Megathron or any other bship for that matter shouldn¦t be able to orbit any other bship at full MWD speed at around 1300-1500m/s...thats just stupid. But you see there is this little wounderfull thing down in the UI which lets you limit your maxspeed if you click on it, that way it would be very possible for a Megathron to orbit at lets say 500m/s?
Cap isn't the problem with mwds in pvp. You ll only gonna use it to cover the distance... after that there is always the webifier. The ships meant for close range have low slots that can be used to boost cap regen.
Cap isnt a problem? It doesnt really matter if you just use the MWD to get to the enemy because you will still have the -25%... But if one wants to do as me and try to orbit at 500m/s or so, then the MWD takes a hell lot of cap. Lets do some maths shall we. MWD = 60cap/3 sec. Compare to a tachyon which takes 125cap/12 sec. so getting the MWD up to over 12 sec the cap usage is 240...now thats 2 tachyons with basic skill or almost 4 with really good skills in a Amarr bship, cap isn¦t a issue? And ofcourse you always have some cap rechargers and a statis if you go blasters pvp, but do you reallt think thats enought when running all candy? No, far from... Simply, MWD need less cap penelty.
Shield and cap loss isn't the problem that close range gunboats face... armor/structure damage is. None can justifiably expect such ships to be durable in large battles. Once their in the fray it's do or die for them... unless they get a lucky break and manage to mwd out and jump. But the leakage damage to hull needs to be looked at.
Armor hardeners are pointless. The Armor will still be up but the Hull will be destroyed in more or less the same time it would have been destroyed if it didn't have any hardeners on. Armor extenders which seem to work better are not the close range ship's best friend cause they slow you down.
Imho, it should leak to hull, but maybe not as early and I know Reinforced armors are somewhat bugged to, so you have a hard time compensate with the shield loss with armor upgrades yes...
MWD skill is pointless to train as you said. The bonuses you offered though are a bit over the top.
Lets just see what TomB comes up with then lets comment furter. Got faith in TomB =). __________________________________________________________ |
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ClawHammer III
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Posted - 2003.11.11 15:59:00 -
[101]
Quote: How do laser users counter the mwd+blaster combo, for instance? - Equip mwd's themselves..? ;P Quote:
That's possible one way. Since blasters only work well at very close range you could counter them by staying out of range and picking off their very weak shield with your lasers.
I can also think of several other ways off the top of my head but I wouldnÆt want to spoil the fun for you in discovering them. ;)
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Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2003.11.11 16:11:00 -
[102]
Gaia,
The 500m/s is still too much for the agility of a BS to handle. There are non cap draining ways to get default speed of 250-300 for a blaster loadout, so far i have seen no reason to keep the MWD on while i am within firing distance. Maybe a burst or two. If agility is fixed single bursts will be able to speed up the ship faster thus requiring even less use of the MWD.
Blasters especially ions don't drain much. They will kill way faster than they will drain cap.
A stasis web, ECCM, warp jammer etc don't drain much either.
MWD+Blasters loadouts 90% of the time don't use shield boosters, which are great cap eaters.
As for how frigates come in to this. Frigs can't fit MWD and have a viable loadout. Making it easier for cruisers and battleships to fit and carry one will devastate any chance the frigate has of coming back into the game.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2003.11.11 16:17:00 -
[103]
Quote:
Quote: How do laser users counter the mwd+blaster combo, for instance? - Equip mwd's themselves..? ;P Quote:
That's possible one way. Since blasters only work well at very close range you could counter them by staying out of range and picking off their very weak shield with your lasers.
I can also think of several other ways off the top of my head but I wouldn’t want to spoil the fun for you in discovering them. ;)
Not that simple... try firing a tachyon at 1000+m/s and hitting. Try stopping and Blaster user will catch up with you.
There are plenty of ways though.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
ProphetGuru
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Posted - 2003.11.11 16:26:00 -
[104]
Edited by: ProphetGuru on 11/11/2003 16:27:25 Hate to say this, as I love my raven, but uh, I really doubt a megathron with blasters and a mwd could get within range to do that uber damage, as cruise push is a really really powerful thing, when u getting hit every 1.7sec. Have to test that on chaos i guess.
To clarify for those not aware of what i speak, the "push" u get from a detonating cruise missile is what i am referring to. Evolution..... Just when you thought you were winning.
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Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2003.11.11 16:38:00 -
[105]
Quote: Edited by: ProphetGuru on 11/11/2003 16:27:25 Hate to say this, as I love my raven, but uh, I really doubt a megathron with blasters and a mwd could get within range to do that uber damage, as cruise push is a really really powerful thing, when u getting hit every 1.7sec. Have to test that on chaos i guess.
To clarify for those not aware of what i speak, the "push" u get from a detonating cruise missile is what i am referring to.
True, but:
1) The missile doesn't always hit you dead on if you are travelling at the correct angle. 2) Mega has 2 mls which can take defenders.
Nway... this can go on forever. Especially when it comes to 1 v 1 there are so many loadouts that can counter each other.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
Ana Khouri
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Posted - 2003.11.11 16:50:00 -
[106]
Edited by: Ana Khouri on 11/11/2003 16:57:26 A MWD boost is not needed IMO. And I'm ALWAYS using a MWD for PVP. It's a bad idea in fleet battles, but in ambushes or 1v1 it's essential.
In order to kill a tach-uberdamage ship you need this: - blaster cannons/repeating artillery (add 2 cap power relays if you use blasters) - 2 tracking inhibitors - 1 MWD - 2-3 Hull speedmods (ATM overdrives, since the agi bonus of nanos is not working)
It doesn't really matter where that battle starts, be it 20 or 100 km. If you don't simply approach the target, but fly to a point 20-30% away from it you'll fly at such a relativ speed to hi movement & guns that they cannot hit you, especially with their lowered tracking. And once you're at 4-5 km, orbit.
The shield malus doesn't really hurts when you cannot get hit
And the same with missles, btw. A bb on chaos once fired a volley of 6 torps from ~50km towards me - and this was when torps were 2000ms on chaos! Now since I wasn't flying exactly toards him, but to a point a little left of him my flight vector and that of the torps wasn't the same. By the time I and the torps got close, around halfway to the BB I had a speed of around 2000ms, still accellerating to my max of 2500ms. The torps were not able to change their cource enough to get into detonation range during my flyby with them - none of them hit me. They turned and followed me again. And hit me some time later. The funny thing is, though, that at this time I was already 10-15 sec head-to-head with the BB, we were around 100 m apart. Result - I lost my shields and took some armor damage and the BB was reduced to space junk by his own torps.
free speech not allowed here |
ga'ia
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Posted - 2003.11.11 16:55:00 -
[107]
Edited by: ga'ia on 11/11/2003 17:06:27 The 500m/s is still too much for the agility of a BS to handle.
If 500m/s is to fast, try a lesser speed and maybe greater distans. And I do think you forget about the built in "agility bonus" you get when using a MWD.
There are non cap draining ways to get default speed of 250-300 for a blaster loadout
I have no clue what you mean with that...
so far i have seen no reason to keep the MWD on while i am within firing distance. Maybe a burst or two. If agility is fixed single bursts will be able to speed up the ship faster thus requiring even less use of the MWD.
Yea that is true, one could use repeating small bursts of MWD to keep the speed at 300m/s or so, but it is still to much cap usage...
Blasters especially ions don't drain much. They will kill way faster than they will drain cap.
A stasis web, ECCM, warp jammer etc don't drain much either.
Yea blasters are rather energy effecient for thier damage output so should they be. And its not that one statis, or one ECCM takes considerable cap, it¦s when you have all the items runing that counts don¦t you think?
MWD+Blasters loadouts 90% of the time don't use shield boosters, which are great cap eaters.
So are armor repairers, only that they are more effecient than shield boosters (1.4 i think).
As for how frigates come in to this. Frigs can't fit MWD and have a viable loadout. Making it easier for cruisers and battleships to fit and carry one will devastate any chance the frigate has of coming back into the game.
So...frigates are usless because some people use MWD? Or frigate is useless because some people would actually go with a closerange bship/cruiser setup? Players starting to fit MWD wouldn¦t really matter if frigates have a chance to come back into the game or not, why? Beacuse most active players already have bships...which is absurd btw. Sure it might be harder for a pack of frigates to get a bship with a MWD, since they would need to dual statis and jammit, but do you think it would be much more easier to bring down a Apoc sitting 50km away with tachyons where most frigates aren¦t even able to target it on that distans? Or a raven having some fun with cruise FoF while being jammed...if the frigates even got that far that is...no you don¦t do you? __________________________________________________________ |
ga'ia
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Posted - 2003.11.11 17:03:00 -
[108]
Edited by: ga'ia on 12/11/2003 02:49:45
Quote: Edited by: Ana Khouri on 11/11/2003 16:57:26 A MWD boost is not needed IMO. And I'm ALWAYS using a MWD for PVP. It's a bad idea in fleet battles, but in ambushes or 1v1 it's essential.
In order to kill a tach-uberdamage ship you need this: - blaster cannons/repeating artillery (add 2 cap power relays if you use blasters) - 2 tracking inhibitors - 1 MWD - 2-3 Hull speedmods (ATM overdrives, since the agi bonus of nanos is not working)
It doesn't really matter where that battle starts, be it 20 or 100 km. If you don't simply approach the target, but fly to a point 20-30% away from it you'll fly at such a relativ speed to hi movement & guns that they cannot hit you, especially with their lowered tracking. And once you're at 4-5 km, orbit.
The shield malus doesn't really hurts when you cannot get hit
And the same with missles, btw. A bb on chaos once fired a volley of 6 torps from ~50km towards me - and this was when torps were 2000ms on chaos! Now since I wasn't flying exactly toards him, but to a point a little left of him my flight vector and that of the torps wasn't the same. By the time I and the torps got close, around halfway to the BB I had a speed of around 2000ms, still accellerating to my max of 2500ms. The torps were not able to change their cource enough to get into detonation range during my flyby with them - none of them hit me. They turned and followed me again. And hit me some time later. The funny thing is, though, that at this time I was already 10-15 sec head-to-head with the BB, we were around 100 m apart. Result - I lost my shields and took some armor damage and the BB was reduced to space junk by his own torps.
hehe, did simular thing with a friend on chaos, however in fleet battles there will be more than one scource of missiles...(most likely today anyway...) __________________________________________________________ |
Ana Khouri
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Posted - 2003.11.11 17:16:00 -
[109]
Yes, as said, wouldn't use a MWD in fleet battles - you can only outmaneuver SO many attackers.
free speech not allowed here |
ga'ia
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Posted - 2003.11.11 17:37:00 -
[110]
Quote: Yes, as said, wouldn't use a MWD in fleet battles - you can only outmaneuver SO many attackers.
If only Reinforced plates worked as supposed...i would have no problem here, except ranning out of cap pretty damn fast... __________________________________________________________ |
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Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2003.11.11 19:08:00 -
[111]
Quote: There are non cap draining ways to get default speed of 250-300 for a blaster loadout
I have no clue what you mean with that...
I mean you fit some overdrives/nanos. Train the skills for speed and one can maintain high speeds without the use of modules once near his target.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
Leitari
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Posted - 2003.11.11 19:45:00 -
[112]
Frßbµrar Breytingar, vel unni starf TomB. Ìa a nota "Tachyon" geislavopn ß Spordreka bardagaskipi er fßsinna. Ì· verur samt sem ßur a passa ¦a a auka ekki drµgnina ß Blendingsbyssunum ¦vÝ ¦a myndi bara enda me vitleysu. Ì· hefur n·na gefi sj¾rµningjunum (¦ar ß meal mÚr) n²tt tµkifµri ¦vÝ allar okkar orrustur gerast ß innann vi tuttugu kÝl¾metra fµri. Auk ¦ess ¦ß er ein af ßstµum ¦ess a vi notum geislavopn svona miki er a skotfµrin taka of miki plßss og er miki vandamßl fyrir okkur a flytja me okkur nokkur ¦·sund st¾r blendingsvopnsskot. Haltu g¾a starfinu ßfram og ekki lßta bugast af einhverjum sem skj¾ta Ý sÝfellu ß ¦ig, frßbµrt starf.
Here, Only the silent survive.
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Znaei
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Posted - 2003.11.11 20:36:00 -
[113]
Quote: Frßbµrar Breytingar, vel unni starf TomB. Ìa a nota "Tachyon" geislavopn ß Spordreka bardagaskipi er fßsinna. Ì· verur samt sem ßur a passa ¦a a auka ekki drµgnina ß Blendingsbyssunum ¦vÝ ¦a myndi bara enda me vitleysu. Ì· hefur n·na gefi sj¾rµningjunum (¦ar ß meal mÚr) n²tt tµkifµri ¦vÝ allar okkar orrustur gerast ß innann vi tuttugu kÝl¾metra fµri. Auk ¦ess ¦ß er ein af ßstµum ¦ess a vi notum geislavopn svona miki er a skotfµrin taka of miki plßss og er miki vandamßl fyrir okkur a flytja me okkur nokkur ¦·sund st¾r blendingsvopnsskot. Haltu g¾a starfinu ßfram og ekki lßta bugast af einhverjum sem skj¾ta Ý sÝfellu ß ¦ig, frßbµrt starf.
ROFL... Einmitt :)
clagnuts> im drunk just come back from pirates night in spain , wtf i thought it was some eve guys getting together for a drink , turned out to be a feken real pirates show , doh |
TomB
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Posted - 2003.11.11 21:21:00 -
[114]
Quote: Frßbµrar Breytingar, vel unni starf TomB. Ìa a nota "Tachyon" geislavopn ß Spordreka bardagaskipi er fßsinna. Ì· verur samt sem ßur a passa ¦a a auka ekki drµgnina ß Blendingsbyssunum ¦vÝ ¦a myndi bara enda me vitleysu. Ì· hefur n·na gefi sj¾rµningjunum (¦ar ß meal mÚr) n²tt tµkifµri ¦vÝ allar okkar orrustur gerast ß innann vi tuttugu kÝl¾metra fµri. Auk ¦ess ¦ß er ein af ßstµum ¦ess a vi notum geislavopn svona miki er a skotfµrin taka of miki plßss og er miki vandamßl fyrir okkur a flytja me okkur nokkur ¦·sund st¾r blendingsvopnsskot. Haltu g¾a starfinu ßfram og ekki lßta bugast af einhverjum sem skj¾ta Ý sÝfellu ß ¦ig, frßbµrt starf.
Blendingsvopnskotin og vopnskotin vera smµkku Ý r·mmßli, hafu ekki ßhyggjur fÚlagi Leitari.
"Where is my hat?" |
CrazzlY
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Posted - 2003.11.11 21:34:00 -
[115]
Quote: Blendingsvopnskotin og vopnskotin vera smµkku Ý r·mmßli, hafu ekki ßhyggjur fÚlagi Leitari.
Hey TomB, can you translate that msg for us, please?
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Reiisha
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Posted - 2003.11.11 23:03:00 -
[116]
Indeed, some of us cant read Icelandic :/
Gamersland.nl, DE site voor PC gaming! |
Mitchman
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Posted - 2003.11.11 23:22:00 -
[117]
As it has been stated in this thread, MWDs are heavily tilted against Caldari in particular due to their reliance on shields over armor. Could it be an idea to introduce a split in penalty or other types of MWDs that would reduce armor instead of shield? Ofcourse, it would not be very realistic that a MWD would reduce armor, but it would atleast even the playfield a bit.
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Serak Tur
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Posted - 2003.11.12 00:20:00 -
[118]
Edited by: Serak Tur on 12/11/2003 00:32:04 I'd just like to touch on what ProphetGuru said and as it seem to have been largely ignored throughout this thread. The issue of missle "blowback" is very important to blaster use and all close range combat.
I've tinkered with the idea of loading out my Mega for close range combat many times but I've always its always come back to that issue. Not only do I have to equip an MWD to get within effective range (and all the loadout problems that go along with it), BUT I also have to maintain that range.
Anyone who has been in a large scale battle will know that missles are widely used and their explosive effect throws your ship off at great speed in the opposite direction. If you're trying to maintain a range (without regard to the speed of your opponent, which is altogether another thing) this can be a huge problem.
The effect is in itself unrealistic and probably not intented (?). I hope some thought is given to the "blowback" effect missles have.
Edit: And for anyone who says, "just use defenders or smartbombs." The only consideration for loading those should be to defend against their damage not the speed penalty they inadvertantly dish out.
-They can also severely disrupt a ship aligning to warp.
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ga'ia
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Posted - 2003.11.12 02:59:00 -
[119]
Quote:
Quote: There are non cap draining ways to get default speed of 250-300 for a blaster loadout
I have no clue what you mean with that...
I mean you fit some overdrives/nanos. Train the skills for speed and one can maintain high speeds without the use of modules once near his target.
Yea at the cost at cap/armor/weapon upgrades, but its not very efficent anyway, would take 4+ lowslots for that and thats crucial for a blaster pvp player, and it would still be hard to get to enemys far away. Yea its good for orbiting I agree, good for ambushes where you can start at close range, but fleetbattle?...would you dare to put 5 overdrives on? __________________________________________________________ |
Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2003.11.12 08:09:00 -
[120]
Serak Tur,
As i said missiles with singificant "push" i.e. cruise and torps are relatively easy to avoid temporarilly so that they hit you from the rear, or sideways.
Ga'ia,
Depends on the fleet battle ... what ships are going to be there... what is my support going to be using etc etc. Personally i don't orbit, especially with a BS, so i never use more than 2 overdrives.
Questions like that can't be answered with a simple yes or no. What i can say is that i have never had cap problems because of the MWD.
As for the person who said that there should be a different kind of MWD so Caldari can use them without huge penalties... he should realise that maybe Caldari suffer the most from MWD because they don't need to use them as badly as other races.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
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