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Kenrailae
Fallen Reich
369
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Posted - 2015.06.17 18:02:53 -
[421] - Quote
@OP: I would disagree. Battleships are as important a platform as any other. Their specific engagement window is just smaller. The ability to escalate to battleships and caps is often more important than doing so. That being said, the mentality behind bs, the 'NY battleship should wreck everything' idea, must be changed. But people need to fly them to learn this. We also need people to fly them so we can continue to push on their legitimate problems that do need fixed.
The Law is a point of View
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Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
170
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Posted - 2015.06.19 06:47:16 -
[422] - Quote
Kenrailae wrote:@OP: I would disagree. Battleships are as important a platform as any other. Their specific engagement window is just smaller. The ability to escalate to battleships and caps is often more important than doing so. That being said, the mentality behind bs, the 'NY battleship should wreck everything' idea, must be changed. But people need to fly them to learn this. We also need people to fly them so we can continue to push on their legitimate problems that do need fixed.
Please elaborate how battleships are preferred for these activities. |
Traejun DiSanctis
Astro Technologies SpaceMonkey's Alliance
150
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Posted - 2015.06.19 06:54:04 -
[423] - Quote
Aza Ebanu wrote:Kenrailae wrote:@OP: I would disagree. Battleships are as important a platform as any other. Their specific engagement window is just smaller. The ability to escalate to battleships and caps is often more important than doing so. That being said, the mentality behind bs, the 'NY battleship should wreck everything' idea, must be changed. But people need to fly them to learn this. We also need people to fly them so we can continue to push on their legitimate problems that do need fixed.
Please elaborate how battleships are preferred for these activities.
I don't think he was actually advocating battleships as preferred over other ships. They do, however, have their place. Structure bashing and Cap killing, to name only a couple. Certain battleships are also preferred for ratting over anything else. Sure, the Ishtar can rat well... but I'll do better in my Rattlesnake, Vindicator, Machariel and/or any Marauder.
That's not even mentioning certain Battleship fleet doctrines that absolutely annihilate opposing fleets. RHML Ravens and Arty Typhoons, just to name a couple. |
Icarius
The Wings of Maak
29
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Posted - 2015.06.19 08:46:01 -
[424] - Quote
Aza Ebanu
I still waiting your answer |
Lan Wang
Stillwater Corporation That Escalated Quickly.
814
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Posted - 2015.06.19 08:47:39 -
[425] - Quote
this thread became redundant a long time ago
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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Kenrailae
Fallen Reich
370
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Posted - 2015.06.19 10:05:44 -
[426] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:this thread became redundant a long time ago Apparently it did not. It seems there is still a strong mentality that bs are useless. They are not, they are just more difficult to use effectively. They do need a more clearly defined role in the former of t3's not invading on their role as much as they do
The Law is a point of View
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Valkin Mordirc
1129
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Posted - 2015.06.19 10:21:32 -
[427] - Quote
Kenrailae wrote:Lan Wang wrote:this thread became redundant a long time ago Apparently it did not. It seems there is still a strong mentality that bs are useless. They are not, they are just more difficult to use effectively. They do need a more clearly defined role in the former of t3's not invading on their role as much as they do
That "Strong Mentality" is coming from the OP who is belligerently ignoring everyone else who is telling him is wrong.
IE: Redundant
#DeleteTheWeak
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Kenrailae
Fallen Reich
370
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Posted - 2015.06.19 12:42:50 -
[428] - Quote
Which is why I was just reading something over in F and I the other day about bs and them needing to be better, and see threads like that crop up fairly regularly.
The Law is a point of View
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Lan Wang
Stillwater Corporation That Escalated Quickly.
814
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Posted - 2015.06.19 12:52:19 -
[429] - Quote
Kenrailae wrote:Which is why I was just reading something over in F and I the other day about bs and them needing to be better, and see threads like that crop up fairly regularly.
they can be better yes, but the op is specifically telling people to NOT train into battleships because they are useless which is bullsh!t, maybe they are for the OP who throws random mission loot on battleships then dies while solo.
EVEALON Creative - Logo Design & Branding | Digital Design
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16246
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Posted - 2015.06.20 00:45:31 -
[430] - Quote
Kenrailae wrote:Which is why I was just reading something over in F and I the other day about bs and them needing to be better, and see threads like that crop up fairly regularly.
All started by people who don't fly them and think they are broken because they work differently to the cruisers and frigates they are used to.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
170
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Posted - 2015.06.20 02:34:50 -
[431] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Kenrailae wrote:Which is why I was just reading something over in F and I the other day about bs and them needing to be better, and see threads like that crop up fairly regularly. they can be better yes, but the op is specifically telling people to NOT train into battleships because they are useless which is bullsh!t, maybe they are for the OP who throws random mission loot on battleships then dies while solo. Nope! I never said anything like that. See, you forgot to read the OP or you have no reading comprehension. I said for most thingsother ships can usually do it just as well or better. If a player uses the SP required to adequately fly battleships, too fly smaller hulls, they will find EVE more satisfying. No one has proved it false. I have seen a lot of snark though. |
Omar Alharazaad
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
2035
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Posted - 2015.06.20 04:04:14 -
[432] - Quote
Honestly I think the Warhammer is pretty much the iconic representation of the Inner Sphere's mechs, just as the MadCat pretty much is the poster child for the Clan.
I do favor the lighter, faster mechs personally. I don't mind sacrificing the durability and firepower for the extra speed and maneuverability. Especially if jump jets are involved. LOVE those things. So for me it's a Jenner for the inner sphere, but if I'm driving a clan mech I really REALLY like the Puma. If you go with the jump jet and ER Large laser variation of it you have a super fast lil bastich that can work the terrain really well while packing a pretty impressive punch for a light mech. Despite the high heat output I do like the lasers, as they can strike targets that are underwater.
Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
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Webvan
All Kill No Skill
9986
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Posted - 2015.06.20 04:54:03 -
[433] - Quote
Aza Ebanu wrote:" The truth is that, any smaller combat ship can destroy a battleship, and they are designed to be destroyed by larger capital ships too. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4XT-l-_3y0
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Perihelion Olenard
208
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Posted - 2015.06.20 06:11:52 -
[434] - Quote
In spite of what has been said about battleships being bad, I think I'll use my Kronos in PvP one day after getting Marauders V. I may even consider buying the new Kronos police skin. |
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
1249
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Posted - 2015.06.20 18:58:03 -
[435] - Quote
Kenrailae wrote:Lan Wang wrote:this thread became redundant a long time ago Apparently it did not. It seems there is still a strong mentality that bs are useless. They are not, they are just more difficult to use effectively. They do need a more clearly defined role in the former of t3's not invading on their role as much as they do
The only way its not redundant is if you consider it hyper-redundant, which IMHO is warranted. OP claims BS's arent the best for any role, people repeatedly post otherwise, OP denies it.
Accounts may not be used for business purposes. Access to the System and playing EVE is intended for your personal entertainment, enjoyment and recreation, and not for corporate, business, commercial or income-seeking activities.-á
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Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
170
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Posted - 2015.06.20 19:54:14 -
[436] - Quote
Cipher Jones wrote:Kenrailae wrote:Lan Wang wrote:this thread became redundant a long time ago Apparently it did not. It seems there is still a strong mentality that bs are useless. They are not, they are just more difficult to use effectively. They do need a more clearly defined role in the former of t3's not invading on their role as much as they do The only way its not redundant is if you consider it hyper-redundant, which IMHO is warranted. OP claims BS's arent the best for any role, people repeatedly post otherwise, OP denies it. Truth should be redundant. I never said battleships aren't best at any role. You sir are full of malarkey. |
Haatakan Reppola
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
40
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Posted - 2015.06.20 22:30:06 -
[437] - Quote
Aza Ebanu wrote:If a player uses the SP required to adequately fly battleships, to fly smaller hulls, they will find EVE more satisfying. No one has proved it false. I have seen a lot of snark though.
With the SP needed to fly a HAC instead of a BS you have enough to get most of the core/fitting/tank/weapon skills to 4. Not to mention that most of the skills you need in order to fly a BS good are skill you also need to fly a T2 cruiser good (other than large weapon/t2 large weapon and MJD skill if you decide to go for it)
T1 Battleship vs T2 cruiser will give BS the win for least SP needed AND least isk lost on destruction |
Ahed Sten
31
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Posted - 2015.06.21 07:53:22 -
[438] - Quote
This thread was past it's expiration date two months ago when I first saw it, how the hell is it still on page 1 and why do people continue to waste their time? OP has obviously made some undeniable truths very clear for the rest of you naysayers.
You're right, OP. Battleships are terrible ships and you should never, ever fly one. They serve no purpose in this game whatsoever, they're outclassed by everything from Frigates to Supers and they're a total waste of skill points. You totally hit the nail on the head with your astute observations, and I support your decision to never train or fly any of them! Thumbs up!
*Sneaks off to do fun battleship stuff in a battleship with other battleships.*
...
You know that OP is bad.
Everyone that has read this knows that OP is bad.
OP probably even knows that OP is bad but can't admit it.
Now can we please stop publicizing the OP and his bad ideas? |
Gimme Sake
State War Academy Caldari State
189
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Posted - 2015.06.21 09:56:47 -
[439] - Quote
I do surely plan to train them especially for PVP. I find most of the battle cruisers less worth to train that battleships. Probably this sort of threads are started by frigate pilots who can't imagine piloting a ship moving at speeds lower than 10000 m/s.
"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
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Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
1249
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Posted - 2015.06.21 17:38:09 -
[440] - Quote
Quote: Truth should be redundant. I never said battleships aren't best at any role. You sir are full of malarkey.
Quote:battleships are worthless
Its OK, you don't have to read what you wrote; we did.
Accounts may not be used for business purposes. Access to the System and playing EVE is intended for your personal entertainment, enjoyment and recreation, and not for corporate, business, commercial or income-seeking activities.-á
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Webvan
All Kill No Skill
10155
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Posted - 2015.06.21 21:46:59 -
[441] - Quote
Ahed Sten wrote:Now can we please stop publicizing the OP and his bad ideas? One of the best threads on BS supremacy for some time. Thanks, OP!
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16256
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Posted - 2015.06.22 11:58:07 -
[442] - Quote
Ahed Sten wrote:This thread was past it's expiration date two months ago when I first saw it, how the hell is it still on page 1 and why do people continue to waste their time? OP has obviously made some undeniable truths very clear for the rest of you naysayers.
You're right, OP. Battleships are terrible ships and you should never, ever fly one. They serve no purpose in this game whatsoever, they're outclassed by everything from Frigates to Supers and they're a total waste of skill points. You totally hit the nail on the head with your astute observations, and I support your decision to never train or fly any of them! Thumbs up!
*Sneaks off to do fun battleship stuff in a battleship with other battleships.*
...
You know that OP is bad.
Everyone that has read this knows that OP is bad.
OP probably even knows that OP is bad but can't admit it.
Now can we please stop publicizing the OP and his bad ideas?
Ironically this thread has seen new pilots take up flying battleships and provided a good many tips and fits for people to try out.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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Ahed Sten
40
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Posted - 2015.06.22 15:32:34 -
[443] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Ahed Sten wrote:This thread was past it's expiration date two months ago when I first saw it, how the hell is it still on page 1 and why do people continue to waste their time? OP has obviously made some undeniable truths very clear for the rest of you naysayers.
You're right, OP. Battleships are terrible ships and you should never, ever fly one. They serve no purpose in this game whatsoever, they're outclassed by everything from Frigates to Supers and they're a total waste of skill points. You totally hit the nail on the head with your astute observations, and I support your decision to never train or fly any of them! Thumbs up!
*Sneaks off to do fun battleship stuff in a battleship with other battleships.*
...
You know that OP is bad.
Everyone that has read this knows that OP is bad.
OP probably even knows that OP is bad but can't admit it.
Now can we please stop publicizing the OP and his bad ideas? Ironically this thread has seen new pilots take up flying battleships and provided a good many tips and fits for people to try out.
Hmm, good point. |
Sespria Secantus
Hedion University Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2015.06.23 03:29:39 -
[444] - Quote
Ugh huh, I missed the part about that low risk with that high insurance payout. I have Amarr BS lev 5, so I'm thinking about ratting in a Baddon. Still trying to figure out what to use the Geddon for IMO. |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16278
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Posted - 2015.06.23 05:21:40 -
[445] - Quote
Sespria Secantus wrote:Still trying to figure out what to use the Geddon for IMO.
Curse on steroids.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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Valkin Mordirc
1153
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Posted - 2015.06.24 18:06:31 -
[446] - Quote
Sespria Secantus wrote:Ugh huh, I missed the part about that low risk with that high insurance payout. I have Amarr BS lev 5, so I'm thinking about ratting in a Baddon. Still trying to figure out what to use the Geddon for IMO.
Marauder murderer.
#DeleteTheWeak
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Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
1115
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Posted - 2015.06.24 19:15:21 -
[447] - Quote
I've read the entire thread. I've done a lot of thinking on it. I have the solution to this problem. All ships should be auto ballanced to equalize pilot skills in all circumstances.
If pilot A has better guns and more skills than pilot B, then pilot A's damage output should be throttled down so the mathematical damage of each ships guns is equivalent. Ibis vs Mega.... the ibis civilian blasters get an appropriate damage and range boost to auto balance them against the megathron opponent. Shields, armor, cap..... all get auto balanced to the ship you are engaged with. For multiple ships the various stats will be equalized across fleets. If all else fails and Pilot A is just better at eve than Pilot B then A's damage will be reduced further on the fly and B's tanking ability will get a boost on the fly. All fights will end in ties. There will be no losers.
Benefits: 1 - no losers 2 - no ouchy feelings 3 - no need to buy insurance 4 - no losing ships 5 - risk aversion removed from the game 6 - everyone can fly the best ships and implants 7 - super pilots can stop whining about docking 8 - you don't have to bother fitting a tank 9 - you only need to fit 1 gun (and it doesn't even matter which) 10 - Pheonix will become relevant
Downsides: 1 - won't be able to complete missions 2 - only income will be PI, mining, moon goo and scamming 3 - no more faction or meta module drops 4 - there may be some lag as the servers continuously rescale everything on the fly |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
1077
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Posted - 2015.06.25 01:44:39 -
[448] - Quote
Sounds like a very well thought out plan. Total balance and fair play for all.
I would still fly a battle ship though. With names like 'Typhoon', 'Armageddon', 'Megathron', etc, it would still feel like I won |
Sespria Secantus
Hedion University Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2015.06.25 03:00:22 -
[449] - Quote
Valkin Mordirc wrote:Sespria Secantus wrote:Ugh huh, I missed the part about that low risk with that high insurance payout. I have Amarr BS lev 5, so I'm thinking about ratting in a Baddon. Still trying to figure out what to use the Geddon for IMO. Marauder murderer.
Thought so, I'm starting to get the feeling that training for this Paladin is a waste of SP. If you to take it anywhere outside HS to try and do C4's, it just seems like local spikes waaaaay up all of a sudden. Even in WH that was pretty quiet (checked with scouting alt), it doesn't stay quiet for long. The marauders are nothing but gank magnets. Would love to try and do WH's in a couple of Baddons, but the cap recharge rate on those ships even with 5 cap mods/rigs is beyond pathetic.
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Webvan
All Kill No Skill
10306
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Posted - 2015.06.25 04:50:40 -
[450] - Quote
Sespria Secantus wrote:Thought so, I'm starting to get the feeling that training for this Paladin is a waste of SP. If you to take it anywhere outside HS to try and do C4's, it just seems like local spikes waaaaay up all of a sudden. Even in WH that was pretty quiet (checked with scouting alt), it doesn't stay quiet for long. The marauders are nothing but gank magnets. Would love to try and do WH's in a couple of Baddons, but the cap recharge rate on those ships even with 5 cap mods/rigs is beyond pathetic.
Don't fly alone and/or unskilled? If you backtrack through the thread, there are vid links of marauders (Paladin included) just decimating cruiser fleets. Even MJD escapes after annihilating a good many cruiser ganker attempts. Of course, if you fit like the OP, forget it
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