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Solusar
Amarr Auctoritan Syndicate Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2006.10.09 13:59:00 -
[31]
IAC hired Snigg to help with the defense of their outpost systems. Do you really think we are stupid enough to fire on those that our allies have hired to help in defending the outpost? Im afraid that is your job not ours. This attempt to drag CVA's name through the mud gets 0 out of 10.
Outside of the area of this conflict Snigg and CVA continue to happily shoot each other.
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Kiriz Zule
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2006.10.09 14:21:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Butter Dog
Originally by: mazzilliu
Originally by: Mynas Atoch
In the ensuing battle, Ortoz's command ship was destroyed, however he was able to succesfully flee in his escape pod. The surviving pirates retreated to safespots in system and despite repeated attempts by ISS covert ops pilots to scan and locate them, were able to stay one step of the ISS scouts. Further calls for the survivors to surrender were also rebuffed.
We went to a safe to wait for our corpmates to refit using the loot scooped from the gate after you ran.
Curious. I am looking at CONCORD documentation which clearly states that they won the engagement by any measure you care to take - ISK destroyed or ships kills.
I also hear whispers over GalNet that your fire control was poor, and despite your potential DPS being higher they still destroyed four of your battleships and a command ship, for the loss of three battleships.
Whispers.....
Our 'concord documentation' shows 9 kills(3 BS) and 5 losses(1 CS, 3 BS). If you have any concord documents showing that our losses are understated, send it to me in an evemail and I will make sure its posted.
Other facts about the engagement... We jumped in on the ISS gate camp, who were all at their optimal. When the shooting was done, controlled the batttlefield. ISS ran to the next system, yes tactically sound, but only because if ISS stayed and duked it out it would have been a slaughter.
Last I checked, people don't warp out because they are winning the fight.
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Lister Black
The Praxis Initiative Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.10.09 14:31:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Kiriz Zule Last I checked, people don't warp out because they are winning the fight.
Knowing when to retreat so as to minimize your losses, especially after having inflicted a major blow against your enemies, is just as indicative of a battle won as anything else.
We were fighting with similar numbers, true, but your side had the upper hand, skill-wise (our CONCORD eve-mails show most of your losses sporting tech 2 gear, whilst most of our pilots were limited to tech 1 equipment). To stay after bringing down your command ship would have been a gamble as to how many extra losses we would have suffered. It's true, perhaps we could have won, nobody can really know, but the fact remains that we came out of that battle having lost significantly less than you, and in the end that's the only real measure of victory in any engagement. ---------------------------- "Unshrink you?! Well that would require some sort of a REbigulator, which is a concept so ridiculous it makes me want to laugh out loud and chortle..." -Prof.Frink |
Shamis Orzoz
SniggWaffe
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Posted - 2006.10.09 14:32:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Shamis Orzoz on 09/10/2006 14:33:21
Originally by: Kiriz Zule Our 'concord documentation' shows 9 kills(3 BS) and 5 losses(1 CS, 3 BS).
We lost 4 bs's and 1 claymore. That's how it goes when you jump into an enemy fleet outnumbered. They did a good job getting rid of me too...shame I was fitted for the iac lagfest or I'd have tanked their pesky fleet.
Hopefully we bring enough ammo next time we visit your space. Last time we actually ran out from all the kills. And 80% of those were people who were actually pursuing us not these miners you speak of.
Shamis
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Mynas Atoch
Caldari ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.10.09 14:40:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Kiriz Zule
Originally by: Butter Dog
Originally by: mazzilliu
Originally by: Mynas Atoch
In the ensuing battle, Ortoz's command ship was destroyed, however he was able to succesfully flee in his escape pod. The surviving pirates retreated to safespots in system and despite repeated attempts by ISS covert ops pilots to scan and locate them, were able to stay one step of the ISS scouts. Further calls for the survivors to surrender were also rebuffed.
We went to a safe to wait for our corpmates to refit using the loot scooped from the gate after you ran.
Curious. I am looking at CONCORD documentation which clearly states that they won the engagement by any measure you care to take - ISK destroyed or ships kills.
I also hear whispers over GalNet that your fire control was poor, and despite your potential DPS being higher they still destroyed four of your battleships and a command ship, for the loss of three battleships.
Whispers.....
Our 'concord documentation' shows 9 kills(3 BS) and 5 losses(1 CS, 3 BS). If you have any concord documents showing that our losses are understated, send it to me in an evemail and I will make sure its posted.
Other facts about the engagement... We jumped in on the ISS gate camp, who were all at their optimal. When the shooting was done, controlled the batttlefield. ISS ran to the next system, yes tactically sound, but only because if ISS stayed and duked it out it would have been a slaughter.
Last I checked, people don't warp out because they are winning the fight.
please don't do this kb thing .. one of your guys didn't post a loss before leaving .. checking our kb one of ours didn't either .. big deal. You had greater weight of fire in your fleet than we had in ours (fleet BS v roving mixed gang; T2 v T1 fittings). We were warping out when spiked, because we could. When enough had, we all did to the rally point, thence to warp in on you again. We were too slow reorganizing, so dropped back to our next firing position, the gate in the next system, where we prepared to do the same again, only with a lot less EWAR on both sides. Meanwhile we hunted you in the origianl engagement system and would have continued hit and runs all night if we could.
Unfortunately, I was attacked in my Achilles Heel .. my Rules of Engagement ... not a problem you will experience often ... and reluctantly required to grant you safe passage ... not a problem you will experience again!
Myn
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Silvestri
FIRMA Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2006.10.09 14:41:00 -
[36]
ok...this is turning into a flamefest....I hope this thread get's locked...I'm an opportunist....like ISS...but right now we need help so Snigg is involved..no hard feelings towards IAC for the grudge you guys have I hope...I hope we're above that.... survival of the fittest....lol.
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Ange1
Gallente The Establishment Establishment
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Posted - 2006.10.09 14:50:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Crovan The Establishment? How many merc contracts should we expect to see the Nyx participate in?
The Establishment has always advertised it services for a price. Since we have only accepted one contract since we built the Nyx, it's so far participated in - one contract
The Establishment is at your service...
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maGz
The Priory
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Posted - 2006.10.09 14:53:00 -
[38]
Originally by: DHB FooFighter Edited by: DHB FooFighter on 09/10/2006 12:21:58 oh and if your really that chuffed about us flying with pirates then don't check which alliance The Priory now belongs to
Huh we are piwates? I always thought we played this game to mine ____________
The Priory Killboard |
Rasitiln
Minmatar SniggWaffe
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Posted - 2006.10.09 15:16:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Rasitiln on 09/10/2006 15:21:22 As of the end of last night our contract is over.
It was interesting to not be shooting CVA but I dont expect any kind of standings other than -10 in the future between us.
Mr Crovan, I'd suggest you respect CVA a bit more, and run your mouth a bit less. --------
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dralid
Vortex. Maelstrom Alliance
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Posted - 2006.10.09 15:52:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Rasitiln Edited by: Rasitiln on 09/10/2006 15:21:22 Mr Crovan, I'd suggest you respect CVA a bit more, and run your mouth a bit less.
Coming from a pirate who would sell his mother to the highest bidder just to have some means to provide in his own entertainment ... and CVA flies next to them ... sigh ... -- Do YOU know, the Whirlwind? HERE |
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Niding
Polaris Project
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Posted - 2006.10.09 16:00:00 -
[41]
Its been presented before, but seems to NOT make an impression.
Is CVA NOT supposed to assist an ally that is attacked/under siege?
Its been mentioned countless of times now, but IAC is CVA allies, and with this comes the obligation to assist if under hostile fire.
This cant be hard to understand?
If you dont help an friend in need, the friendship is of little value.
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Kiriz Zule
Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2006.10.09 16:01:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Mynas Atoch
Originally by: Kiriz Zule
Originally by: Butter Dog
Originally by: mazzilliu
Originally by: Mynas Atoch
In the ensuing battle, Ortoz's command ship was destroyed, however he was able to succesfully flee in his escape pod. The surviving pirates retreated to safespots in system and despite repeated attempts by ISS covert ops pilots to scan and locate them, were able to stay one step of the ISS scouts. Further calls for the survivors to surrender were also rebuffed.
We went to a safe to wait for our corpmates to refit using the loot scooped from the gate after you ran.
Curious. I am looking at CONCORD documentation which clearly states that they won the engagement by any measure you care to take - ISK destroyed or ships kills.
I also hear whispers over GalNet that your fire control was poor, and despite your potential DPS being higher they still destroyed four of your battleships and a command ship, for the loss of three battleships.
Whispers.....
Our 'concord documentation' shows 9 kills(3 BS) and 5 losses(1 CS, 3 BS). If you have any concord documents showing that our losses are understated, send it to me in an evemail and I will make sure its posted.
Other facts about the engagement... We jumped in on the ISS gate camp, who were all at their optimal. When the shooting was done, controlled the batttlefield. ISS ran to the next system, yes tactically sound, but only because if ISS stayed and duked it out it would have been a slaughter.
Last I checked, people don't warp out because they are winning the fight.
please don't do this kb thing .. one of your guys didn't post a loss before leaving .. checking our kb one of ours didn't either .. big deal. You had greater weight of fire in your fleet than we had in ours (fleet BS v roving mixed gang; T2 v T1 fittings). We were warping out when spiked, because we could. When enough had, we all did to the rally point, thence to warp in on you again. We were too slow reorganizing, so dropped back to our next firing position, the gate in the next system, where we prepared to do the same again, only with a lot less EWAR on both sides. Meanwhile we hunted you in the origianl engagement system and would have continued hit and runs all night if we could.
Unfortunately, I was attacked in my Achilles Heel .. my Rules of Engagement ... not a problem you will experience often ... and reluctantly required to grant you safe passage ... not a problem you will experience again!
Myn
Yes, it is unfortunate that the KB has been brought up, as both sides appear to have had incorrect totals, perhaps ask your former associate Butter Dog to stop posting on your behalf and this thread might not have gone down this path...
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Garreck
Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2006.10.09 16:36:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Crovan
Aralis, I have great personal respect for you, but your answer is a dodge.
And your accusation is a smoke-screen. Resorting to smear tactics so soon in a conflict? One wonders about the current state of morale in MC...
Toughen up, merc. Get behind Seleene and your comrades and do what you're paid to do.
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Halca
Candy Hearts
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Posted - 2006.10.09 16:59:00 -
[44]
If anything this whole affair is an indictment in favour of CVA. They are strong enough in their friendships that they will suspend actions against known enemies in order to assist. It's called loyalty, something a mercenary company knows little about.
-Halca out ^.^
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Mitchman
Omniscient Order
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Posted - 2006.10.09 18:23:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Aralis We are here to help our allies. And they have hired mercenaries. In their space we follow their rules. Why mercenaries should find hiring mercenaries odd I have no idea.
TouchF.
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Rawthorm
Gallente The Establishment Establishment
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Posted - 2006.10.09 19:05:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Crovan The Establishment? How many merc contracts should we expect to see the Nyx participate in?
We are Mercs and the Nyx has participated in at least 2 contracts I belive.
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Ange1
Gallente The Establishment Establishment
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Posted - 2006.10.09 19:07:00 -
[47]
I prefer the term "Businessmen" myself
The Establishment is at your service...
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Crovan
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.10.09 19:30:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Rawthorm
Originally by: Crovan The Establishment? How many merc contracts should we expect to see the Nyx participate in?
We are Mercs and the Nyx has participated in at least 2 contracts I belive.
Apologies. It would seem that my ability to convey tongue-in-cheek has been a bit impaired by the heavy fighting this weekend. I am aware of The Establishments contracts, however, your token phrase also belies a different nature ;).
Farjung FanBois, Charter Member
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Superbus Maximus
Gallente Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2006.10.09 20:13:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Crovan This absolute nonsense about S******dly being mercenaries is the kind of trash that gives mercs in this cluster a bad name. Their piracy is well known (obviously ISS saw them as such). To be honest, as I stated last night to those present, I am flattered that IAC thinks they need half a dozen alliances to take on two, one of whom sports, at best, 200 pilots.
Surely Rage and Terror will be mercs next? Perhaps the Pirate Coalition? The Establishment? How many merc contracts should we expect to see the Nyx participate in?
Aralis, I have great personal respect for you, but your answer is a dodge. Clearly CVA is willing to accept the moral standard of the Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate in saying that these pirates are legitimate mercenaries. Aiding an ally is one thing, and is a noble act in itself, however violating one's honor then shrugging it away in an argument that sounds as if you are convincing yourself as much as everyone else is an entirely different matter.
Lol your definition of merc is all wrong, Merc is anyone who does a millitary operation for money we got paid hence we are mercs, and I can rember the day when contraband were ebil pirates.
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shadyfox99
Caldari Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2006.10.09 20:31:00 -
[50]
Those of you who think SNIGG is not a merc corp are wrong. We have taken many merc contracts in the past. I remember contracts agaist G, PA, and working for CA at one point.
I DO believe that a certain corp in the mercenary coalition used to pirate A LOT as well. Oh thats right, it happened to be SHARKS. Infact they even pirated during their down time while still in MC.
Mr.Crovan, I suggest you look into YOUR corp's history before coming onto GALnet and bashing other corps.
I can also assure you that CVA and SNIGG have a very wonderful past (and future im sure) of shooting each other.
Oh, I almost forgot the Interstellar Starbase Syndicate. It was a good fight, lets leave it at that.
Originally by: HostageTaker
Use your brain and use your main! OMFG I just rhymed!
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Mitchman
Omniscient Order
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Posted - 2006.10.09 22:25:00 -
[51]
I think someone in this thread needs to get off their high horse and realize that not all mercs suck on a roid between contracts. Actually, I think Seleene needs to shut them up as they are only making MC look bad.
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krissi79
FATAL REVELATIONS Lotka Volterra
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Posted - 2006.10.09 22:41:00 -
[52]
As a long time flyer around the curse and catch , seeing a iss fleet of pvpers is like finding a officer spawn , so congrats snigg.......
as for the timing , thats another matter
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Crovan
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.10.10 04:10:00 -
[53]
Edited by: Crovan on 10/10/2006 04:14:03 This is all rather amusing really. I think the best part is Snigg getting so very defensive when the initial question was to CVA. Frankly, I don't care whether Snigg are pirates or mercs or otherwise, from a personal standpoint. What got to me is that CVA would fly with a corp infamous for piracy. I have actually gotten some decent explanations from the more level-headed CVA pilots, and for that I am appreciative.
As for the merc/pirate debate, I heard from some ISS pilots today that Snigg swore revenge for ISS doing what they saw as defending their trade lanes, and demanding 200 million ISK to avoid having 10 BSes killed. Sounds an awful lot like ransom to me. So you are simultaneously pirates and mercs? Just asking really. Like I said, I couldn't really care less. Red is red, no matter what their justification for being there.
Again, I am glad to hear that CVA apparently do have their heads screwed on reasonably straight on this. I thank those who took the time to respond thoughtfully and not shoot off at the mouth, or make claims as to what my simple questions do to the reputation of the Coalition. I have a great deal of respect for those who hold to their ideas, even if I might personally starkly disagree.
Addendum: shadyfox99 - Having spoken to people who have been in the Sharks for a very long time, I have gleaned that FRICK has not engaged in piracy since before it's forming of the MC alongside BDCI. If you could provide some proof of your claim on a private channel, I would be more than interested to see it.
Farjung FanBois, Charter Member
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shanda captison
ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.10.10 04:20:00 -
[54]
Edited by: shanda captison on 10/10/2006 04:21:40 Think it would be an idea to take it down from a high political level and down to the actual pew pew, the offical kill figures and what happened in the battle in question this is all to the best of MY knowledge.
ISS Kills: 1 Mega 1 Temp 2 Scorp 1 Claymore 1 Rifter
ISS Losses 2 Scorp 1 Domi 2 Thorax 1 Cyclone
We setup on the gate, snigg jumped in on us.
Yes they did hold the field.
We felt it was the right decision to withdraw as if we d stayed, they would have tipped the balance in their favour.
After we regrouped it was a mistake that we didnt turn around and warp back straight away.
We then setup on the system next door awaiting sniggs arrival.
They didnt come in for whatever reason.
We tried to find their safe spotted fleet by sending back in the cov ops (wasnt prepared to commit the fleet from our superior position on the gate) with no success.
Ordered by XO to withdraw.
However all the pre flaming aside it was a very good fight indeed and much fun was had by all .
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Karlemgne
Red Navy Faction Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2006.10.10 06:20:00 -
[55]
Interesting that a self avowed anti-pirate alliance now flys with snig.
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Superbus Maximus
Gallente Sniggerdly
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Posted - 2006.10.10 06:45:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Crovan Edited by: Crovan on 10/10/2006 04:14:54 Edited by: Crovan on 10/10/2006 04:14:03 This is all rather amusing really. I think the best part is Snigg getting so very defensive when the initial question was to CVA. Frankly, I don't care whether Snigg are pirates or mercs or otherwise, from a personal standpoint. What got to me is that CVA would fly with a corp infamous for piracy. I have actually gotten some decent explanations from the more level-headed CVA pilots, and for that I am appreciative.
As for the merc/pirate debate, I heard from some ISS pilots today that Snigg swore revenge for ISS doing what they saw as defending their trade lanes, and demanding 200 million ISK to avoid having 10 BSes killed. Sounds an awful lot like ransom to me. So you are simultaneously pirates and mercs? Just asking really. Like I said, I couldn't really care less. Red is red, no matter what their justification for being there.
Again, I am glad to hear that CVA apparently do have their heads screwed on reasonably straight on this. I thank those who took the time to respond thoughtfully and not shoot off at the mouth, or make claims as to what my simple questions do to the reputation of the Coalition. I have a great deal of respect for those who hold to their ideas, even if I might personally starkly disagree.
Addendum: shadyfox99 - Having spoken to people who have been in the Sharks for a very long time, I have gleaned that FRICK has not engaged in piracy since before the forming of the MC alongside BDCI. If you could provide some proof of your claim on a private channel, I would be more than interested to see it.
Actually that was a joke we do it any ways just because we can
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Del369
Caldari Office linebackers Blood of the Innocents
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Posted - 2006.10.10 11:07:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Karlemgne Interesting that a self avowed anti-pirate alliance now flys with snig.
interesting that people still comment on threads without reading up on the content first
I want to die quietly in my sleep just like my dear old grandma, and not screaming in terror like her passengers!! |
Gaven Lok'ri
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2006.10.10 12:15:00 -
[58]
Something that should be considered is why CVA is anti-pirate.
As far as the defence of Amarr is concerned, FIX are just as much pirates as SNIGG. The reasons that they shoot neutrals are irrelevant, the fact that they shoot neutrals destabilizes a region just as much as if they were doing it for income.
Therefor FIX, and even MC when it is operating under NBSI, are just as great a threat to stability as SNIGG could ever be.
CVA did the only thing it could do, came to the aid of an ally which stands as a bastion of civilization in 0.0 against the pointless carnage that the barbarians of 0.0 revel in.
And as the CVA have said, if SNIGG show their faces in CVA patrolled space in the future, they will still be shot as destabalizing influences on the Amarrian empire and its expansion into 0.0 under the CVA.
Deus Vult! PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Crovan
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.10.10 12:41:00 -
[59]
Edited by: Crovan on 10/10/2006 12:41:29
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri Something that should be considered is why CVA is anti-pirate.
As far as the defence of Amarr is concerned, FIX are just as much pirates as SNIGG. The reasons that they shoot neutrals are irrelevant, the fact that they shoot neutrals destabilizes a region just as much as if they were doing it for income.
Therefor FIX, and even MC when it is operating under NBSI, are just as great a threat to stability as SNIGG could ever be.
CVA did the only thing it could do, came to the aid of an ally which stands as a bastion of civilization in 0.0 against the pointless carnage that the barbarians of 0.0 revel in.
And as the CVA have said, if SNIGG show their faces in CVA patrolled space in the future, they will still be shot as destabalizing influences on the Amarrian empire and its expansion into 0.0 under the CVA.
This does help me understand, and you have my thanks for such a thoughtful reply that seeks to actually clear up the issue.
After hearing some sound reasoning for tolerating the group that has been made their temporary wingmates, I have to say that I was mistaken in my initial assumption that CVA may have done something worthy of the loss of my respect. All I really needed were some well-reasoned answers, and instead I was personally insulted. I suppose I should forgive that, however, given that it has been a long few days for all of us involved in this conflict.
This is the second time I have been involved in a conflict with CVA, and I have to say it makes me smile a little every time I hear that they are coming.
Farjung FanBois, Charter Member
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SkottE
SkottE Technologies
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Posted - 2006.10.10 13:20:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri Something that should be considered is why CVA is anti-pirate.
As far as the defence of Amarr is concerned, FIX are just as much pirates as SNIGG. The reasons that they shoot neutrals are irrelevant, the fact that they shoot neutrals destabilizes a region just as much as if they were doing it for income.
Therefor FIX, and even MC when it is operating under NBSI, are just as great a threat to stability as SNIGG could ever be.
CVA did the only thing it could do, came to the aid of an ally which stands as a bastion of civilization in 0.0 against the pointless carnage that the barbarians of 0.0 revel in.
And as the CVA have said, if SNIGG show their faces in CVA patrolled space in the future, they will still be shot as destabalizing influences on the Amarrian empire and its expansion into 0.0 under the CVA.
I belive this has answered the entire topic... _________________________________________ Want to build Tech2 equipment and ships? Take a look here to find out! |
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