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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
10719
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Posted - 2014.07.21 10:07:00 -
[1] - Quote
So, CCP. Let's recap. Back in February you released a devblog regarding your supposed need to own alliance logos and extend free usage to players, expecting this to be acceptable to players. Well it wasn't. After two months of stonewalling on the subject you suspended alliance logo submissions entirely. Your most recent word on the subject was almost three months ago.
I'm just curious, really, what your lawyers have been doing this entire time and why you still haven't been able to adopt or even consider alternative solutions. Why you've left alliances in the dark for months. Why you've gone completely cold and ignored us on this subject. So this is a little reminder. We're still waiting for you to make up your mind. No, this isn't it at all. Make it more... psssshhhh. |
Schmata Bastanold
Black Rebel Rifter Club The Devil's Tattoo
2207
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Posted - 2014.07.21 10:19:00 -
[2] - Quote
Lalalalala! I cannot hear you over the sound of how awesome Crius is! Eve Online Overview Wizard: Forum thread Homepage
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Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility
3635
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Posted - 2014.07.21 10:21:00 -
[3] - Quote
Those little pictures can mean a lot to people. A shared identity is an important part of a social group, and logos represent the identity. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
10720
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Posted - 2014.07.21 10:49:00 -
[4] - Quote
...A character that I sold just liked my post. I gotta say that was kind of creepy. No, this isn't it at all. Make it more... psssshhhh. |
TigerXtrm
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
813
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Posted - 2014.07.21 10:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
Have alliance logo's ever not been owned by CCP since their inception? Or is this just another bunch of useless raging because something became known that has been like that forever?
CCP's legal reasons for having to own the content in their game are pretty straight forward. My YouTube Channel - EVE Tutorials & other game related things! |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
10720
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Posted - 2014.07.21 11:00:00 -
[6] - Quote
TigerXtrm wrote:Have alliance logo's ever not been owned by CCP since their inception? They weren't previously, no.
TigerXtrm wrote:CCP's legal reasons for having to own the content in their game are pretty straight forward. They're pretty wrong. CCP doesn't need ownership of alliance logos. What they need is a universal, assignable, irrevocable, royalty-free license to use them. That gives them everything they want ownership for, except for the desperate grab of other people's intellectual property and ability to deny them their rights as copyright holders. No, this isn't it at all. Make it more... psssshhhh. |
Nora Pandemonium
The Scope Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.07.21 13:27:00 -
[7] - Quote
TigerXtrm wrote:Have alliance logo's ever not been owned by CCP since their inception? Or is this just another bunch of useless raging because something became known that has been like that forever?
CCP's legal reasons for having to own the content in their game are pretty straight forward.
The whole point is that ccp is trying to claim ownership over something they can not claim ownership of in many countries.
As a german citizen any kind of artwork I create is protected by copyright laws and by law i am not able to transfer ownership of my intellectual property. The only thing I can do is give someone a license to use my artwork. These licenses can be in many different forms.
The version James stated is good enough for ccp to have everything they need and leaves people the option to use their own Logos to sell merchandise with their own alliance Logo without ccp having any word in it, which judging by how things went so far is something ccp is against and they so far have failed to deliver a reasonable argument why they actually want to claim pps intellectual property (which again is not even possible in many cases), instead of just being fine with a free license for the Logos that allows them to use them however they please. |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
3811
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Posted - 2014.07.21 13:34:00 -
[8] - Quote
The problem comes from them being international. Conforming to a single law is not a problem, but once you start talking about legalities in various countries, things get more complex. An MMO needs to be a bit careful with how they deal with it. Personally I'd just allow more shapes, more layers, and more colours in the designer, as well as the ability to move shapes about, and then let the artsy type go to town. With some pretty primitive layers I've seen people do some amazing stuff with Forza designs, and since it's not an uploaded image it's not subject to the same laws. The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list. Chrysus Industries - Savings made simple!
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De'Veldrin
Black Serpent Technologies The Unthinkables
2607
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Posted - 2014.07.21 13:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:CCP doesn't need ownership of alliance logos. What they need is a universal, assignable, irrevocable, royalty-free license to use them.
Oddly, that's what I thought the basically had under the old system?
MAMBA is recruiting. -áWhen other folks are whining about a lack of content, we go out and create it. The case of Shrodinger's Hotdropper |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
10733
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Posted - 2014.07.21 21:19:00 -
[10] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:The problem comes from them being international. Conforming to a single law is not a problem, but once you start talking about legalities in various countries, things get more complex. An MMO needs to be a bit careful with how they deal with it. Personally I'd just allow more shapes, more layers, and more colours in the designer, as well as the ability to move shapes about, and then let the artsy type go to town. With some pretty primitive layers I've seen people do some amazing stuff with Forza designs, and since it's not an uploaded image it's not subject to the same laws. This is not an excuse, especially considering copyright laws in some countries prohibit exactly what CCP is doing (e.g. Germany, where ownership can't be transferred). No, this isn't it at all. Make it more... psssshhhh. |
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
3915
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Posted - 2014.07.21 23:08:00 -
[11] - Quote
Part of the problem is that alliance logos are not always used as-is, rather CCP can adjust them, which makes the in-game ones a derived work. CCP has to own the derived works to prevent others from using them, or to dictate licensing terms.
The in-game logos belonging to CCP isn't really something people care about, but they do care about CCP having rights to the submitted images and all derived works. |
Nora Pandemonium
The Scope Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2014.07.21 23:18:00 -
[12] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:The problem comes from them being international. Conforming to a single law is not a problem, but once you start talking about legalities in various countries, things get more complex. An MMO needs to be a bit careful with how they deal with it. Personally I'd just allow more shapes, more layers, and more colours in the designer, as well as the ability to move shapes about, and then let the artsy type go to town. With some pretty primitive layers I've seen people do some amazing stuff with Forza designs, and since it's not an uploaded image it's not subject to the same laws.
The whole discussion came up when ccp tried to limit the use of player created logos for their own merchandise. Sure you could go ahead and just implement a system like you mention there, but:
If the logo has been drawn by hand or in any other programm before it has been put together in some ingame tool, guess who does have the ownership of that intellectual property? I-Šll give you a litle hint, it is not ccp. Just because you change the process from transfering the image directly or implementing a low quality tool to replicate a logo i have created it does not magically change ownership.
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CCP Falcon
7763
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Posted - 2014.07.22 00:30:00 -
[13] - Quote
James Amril-Kesh wrote:So, CCP. Let's recap. Back in February you released a devblog regarding your supposed need to own alliance logos and extend free usage to players, expecting this to be acceptable to players. Well it wasn't. After two months of stonewalling on the subject you suspended alliance logo submissions entirely. Your most recent word on the subject was almost three months ago.
I'm just curious, really, what your lawyers have been doing this entire time and why you still haven't been able to adopt or even consider alternative solutions. Why you've left alliances in the dark for months. Why you've gone completely cold and ignored us on this subject. So this is a little reminder. We're still waiting for you to make up your mind.
For now, the alliance logos that are in game will remain there, however we won't be accepting any new submissions.
In terms of a resolution to the issue, we'll be looking at it as part of a rehash of corporations and alliances in an upcoming release.
There's no timeframe for this release as of yet, and the situation can be considered as unchanged as of now.
Since there's already a multitude of threads open on this, this one is being locked.
Keep discussion in this thread.
CCP Falcon || Community Manager || @CCP_Falcon
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