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Mr LaboratoryRat
Confederation of DuckTape Lovers
46
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
HED-GP raises a few questions. The Tranquility capabilities has improved but the battles are increasing %-wise more.
My opinion is that the problem lies not in the server capabilities or code but in the abundance of isk that provides the backbone of such hugh easy (super) capital use. ((super) capitals are a exponential factor to counter (HP/required & power wise)
It is a well know fact that corp/alliance have (super) capitals fundings and/or reimbursements and that the sov-system is based around structures that haves hitpoints. Thus the more recources availeble to threat or to use at these structures, the more power a corp/alliance has. (recources in numbers and/or recources for these numbers (the last attracts the first (comfort/ease))
But what if happens if an corp/alliance or coalition joint income is gradually or exponentialy becomming higher by degree of taking more space? The natural hunger for power, the "ungoing capital cold war" and just common sence translates this in gradually or exponentialy investments in (super) capitals. Which leads to the fact that some pieces of the pie has become too spacejewbig that there is no Yang anymore. This is what almost happend in HED-GP, if CFC backed out and this is the underlaying point what PL & co tried to prove.
Even worse, the above is exacly what will happen to any smaller corp/Alliance or coalition that interferes with the bigger pieces of the pie. A thrilling and dynamic 0.0 is going to be extinct without changes and Tranquility will become the bigger version of the Chinese server. Personaly, i am missing the old eve, the 2006-7-8 EVE. Personaly i find eve politic's 0.0 scene aperape* in the bu* and it influences the 0.0 gameplay significantly downwards. Time dialation is a very good implenmentation but it does not work if the tap doesnt get fixed leaking into the almost overflowing bucket...
By my opinion got this development speed up by some game mechanics that were not good by desighn or not used as intended (the most common known ones: anomalies, technetium, increasing populairity rentlordship ect etc "jadii jadii jadii jaaa") and are still seeping in today's EVE by the "butterfly affect". The thin balance got unevened by negative interferance and i hope to see some positive interferance into EVE to make it right versus the playerbase.
It is a good thing that times have changed and there is being listend more to the playerbase but i think it is time to finaly adres this "red head stepchild" that are leading us to were we are now.
To my opinion, i rather see a fix for this sooner than later and i hope my opinion gives a good insight for fixing it.
My Two Cents, |
Kryptik Kai
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
6820
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:08:00 -
[2] - Quote
Hrm...so... nerf everywhere? "Shiny.-á Lets be bad guys." -Jayne Cobb |
Bernie Nator
4U Services Inc. Upholders
917
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:10:00 -
[3] - Quote
Hey, can you keep the whining down? Some of us are trying to have fun in places that aren't null sec. |
Bloodmyst Ranwar
Dark Miresa
27
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
Here's a simple suggestion.
Change Moon Mining mechanics. (Only for Blobsec)
Your friendly neighbourhood hero Bloodmyst Ranwar XOXOXOXO |
Aiwha
Infinite Point Nulli Secunda
695
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:13:00 -
[5] - Quote
Posting in another stealth grrrN3PL thread. We're winning the war if it says so on CAOD! -á
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Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
977
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:23:00 -
[6] - Quote
Aiwha wrote:Posting in another stealth grrrN3PL thread.
It's GrrrEVERYONE seeing as anyone who put the effort into it can buy a cap or a supercap. Keeping it is another story tho. |
Angelica Dreamstar
Epic Boo Bees
289
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:25:00 -
[7] - Quote
What's the point of the * in aperape* exactly? Create a new, pretty, female character! Make the name count! Join the epic boo bees! (RP,PvE/PvP,wardecs,new players!) You're at it from day 0! |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2377
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:32:00 -
[8] - Quote
It's not really a "Nullsec money problem". It was going to head this way regardless of what nullsec income looked like. Ultimately more caps are produced in a week than will likely die in an entire year, and skillpoints continue to accumulate as long as you don't quit. This drives prices down, which drives availability up, and because of the whole SP thing... well it's not hard to get into a Carrier.
You come at this assuming that most carriers are handed out to noble space poors by a rich alliance. Really loaner caps are more of an edge case thing, and generally are used to replace existing caps that went boom. I can't speak for anyone in the other blocks, but I purchased my ships by running incursions for a week in lowsec. Assuming a base of 80-100m/h running L4's I could buy another one in uh 17 hours.
So assuming I mission for 3 hours a day, I can buy a new carrier once a week. Supercaps are a little different, but you also don't have to replace them very often.
Basically capitals are cheap as hell. The only cost worth talking about of getting into one is time investment.
EDIT: We had a "Get a free carrier!" program which was widely touted but only used by a grand total of like 20 dudes. Most people just buy their own. |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2377
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:48:00 -
[9] - Quote
Aiwha wrote:Posting in another stealth grrrN3PL thread.
Don't know where you are getting that from, as a general rule the people that want to kill you at the moment think nullsec income is skewed in favor of "Living in empire but playing in null" which we don't particularly like.
The second argument is supercap/cap proliferation which was coming down the pipe no matter how costly you make them. Also anyone advocating the removal of my cargo Thanatos can get bent.
I break from the goon traditionalist goal in that I'd love to see more specialized caps added to the game. Some of my ideas are dumb like "The mega dictor that warp disrupts entire grids" and others are more interesting like the covert carrier for raiding back pockets of hard to reach sov with cloaky assholes (good reps, no triage, ability to jump to covert cynos, no fighters, big SMA/FHA, basically a flying mobile starbase for sneaky assholes). |
Bloodmyst Ranwar
Dark Miresa
27
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:55:00 -
[10] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Aiwha wrote:Posting in another stealth grrrN3PL thread. It's GrrrEVERYONE seeing as anyone who put the effort into it can buy a cap or a supercap. Keeping it is another story tho.
I would say it's more like "GrrrEVERYONE is getting over the lame null sec play of I have a sweet passive income off Moon Mining, therfore can afford to buy caps and subcaps."
Change Moon Mining mechanics..... oh wait I already said this.
Also, the agreement (whatever it's called) that PL and CFC have in terms of not not being able to utilise siphon units on each others moons amongst many other "hurting each others income rules." Just means all these Billions of ISK lost in these major battles is significantly reduced due to agreement. Can't remember where I read this, an article that was recently pos |
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Thead Enco
Killing is Business Get Off My Lawn
85
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Posted - 2014.01.23 00:57:00 -
[11] - Quote
Snorting "Anthrax" is bad mmkay
"Any man who must say 'I am the king' is no true king."
Tywin Lannister-á |
Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
979
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Posted - 2014.01.23 01:16:00 -
[12] - Quote
Bloodmyst Ranwar wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Aiwha wrote:Posting in another stealth grrrN3PL thread. It's GrrrEVERYONE seeing as anyone who put the effort into it can buy a cap or a supercap. Keeping it is another story tho. I would say it's more like "GrrrEVERYONE is getting over the lame null sec play of I have a sweet passive income off Moon Mining, therfore can afford to buy caps and subcaps." Change Moon Mining mechanics..... oh wait I already said this. Also, the agreement (whatever it's called) that PL and CFC have in terms of not not being able to utilise siphon units on each others moons amongst many other "hurting each others income rules." Just means all these Billions of ISK lost in these major battles is significantly reduced due to agreement. Can't remember where I read this, an article that was recently posted on the mittani site.
You do realize you can grind the ISK for a carrier/dread in high-sec with no moons right? If you got time, the sky is the limit for anyone in the game. The "balancing" factor of cost was the biggest error ever. As long as income is available, the cost of producing something can always be grinded. High sec has a tendency to pop onec in a while in the top of eve-kill with sub caps worth more than some pretty good fit cap. If you can put billions on an incursion ship, there is nothing stopping you from putting that much isk on a cap inseatd.
Well except having to go to low/null/WH to board it... |
Bloodmyst Ranwar
Dark Miresa
27
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Posted - 2014.01.23 01:25:00 -
[13] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Bloodmyst Ranwar wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Aiwha wrote:Posting in another stealth grrrN3PL thread. It's GrrrEVERYONE seeing as anyone who put the effort into it can buy a cap or a supercap. Keeping it is another story tho. I would say it's more like "GrrrEVERYONE is getting over the lame null sec play of I have a sweet passive income off Moon Mining, therfore can afford to buy caps and subcaps." Change Moon Mining mechanics..... oh wait I already said this. Also, the agreement (whatever it's called) that PL and CFC have in terms of not not being able to utilise siphon units on each others moons amongst many other "hurting each others income rules." Just means all these Billions of ISK lost in these major battles is significantly reduced due to agreement. Can't remember where I read this, an article that was recently posted on the mittani site. You do realize you can grind the ISK for a carrier/dread in high-sec with no moons right? If you got time, the sky is the limit for anyone in the game. The "balancing" factor of cost was the biggest error ever. As long as income is available, the cost of producing something can always be grinded. High sec has a tendency to pop onec in a while in the top of eve-kill with sub caps worth more than some pretty good fit cap. If you can put billions on an incursion ship, there is nothing stopping you from putting that much isk on a cap inseatd. Well except having to go to low/null/WH to board it...
Well of course you can grind the ISK to pay for these hulls, however this takes "time". However, Moon Mining is a "passive" income which yields massive profits.
If the mechanics of Moon Mining was change it could also "potentially" limit the amounts of systems these large alliances currently hold. Just think 1 Month your system\constallation\region has decent Moons to mine from, the next month they are useless or not-so-profitable. It may also give the oppotunity for the smaller alliances/corps to actually consider getting a look into sov space without the prospect of being renter pets. |
Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
979
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 01:31:00 -
[14] - Quote
Bloodmyst Ranwar wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Bloodmyst Ranwar wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Aiwha wrote:Posting in another stealth grrrN3PL thread. It's GrrrEVERYONE seeing as anyone who put the effort into it can buy a cap or a supercap. Keeping it is another story tho. I would say it's more like "GrrrEVERYONE is getting over the lame null sec play of I have a sweet passive income off Moon Mining, therfore can afford to buy caps and subcaps." Change Moon Mining mechanics..... oh wait I already said this. Also, the agreement (whatever it's called) that PL and CFC have in terms of not not being able to utilise siphon units on each others moons amongst many other "hurting each others income rules." Just means all these Billions of ISK lost in these major battles is significantly reduced due to agreement. Can't remember where I read this, an article that was recently posted on the mittani site. You do realize you can grind the ISK for a carrier/dread in high-sec with no moons right? If you got time, the sky is the limit for anyone in the game. The "balancing" factor of cost was the biggest error ever. As long as income is available, the cost of producing something can always be grinded. High sec has a tendency to pop onec in a while in the top of eve-kill with sub caps worth more than some pretty good fit cap. If you can put billions on an incursion ship, there is nothing stopping you from putting that much isk on a cap inseatd. Well except having to go to low/null/WH to board it... Well of course you can grind the ISK to pay for these hulls, however this takes "time". Moon Mining is a "passive" income which can yield massive profits (When in such a large alliance who own vast amounts of space). If the mechanics of Moon Mining was changed it could also "potentially" limit the amounts of systems these large alliances currently hold. Just think 1 Month your system\constallation\region has decent Moons to mine from, the next month they are useless or not-so-profitable. It may also give the oppotunity for the smaller alliances/corps to actually consider getting a look into sov space without the prospect of being renter pets.
What would prevent those oh so cute small entity from being crushed if they do not accept aligning themself with the bigger power? Moon mining don't even generate that much money anyway if you take into account the size of those alliance. It's not like each player has his very own moon to mine for income. |
James Amril-Kesh
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
8755
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 01:38:00 -
[15] - Quote
You do realize that moon mining isn't worth nearly as much as it used to be? Pretty much nobody is using it to buy themselves caps. The real cash cow in nullsec is renter fees. My EVE Videos |
Bloodmyst Ranwar
Dark Miresa
27
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 01:40:00 -
[16] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote: What would prevent those oh so cute small entity from being crushed if they do not accept aligning themself with the bigger power? Moon mining don't even generate that much money anyway if you take into account the size of those alliance. It's not like each player has his very own moon to mine for income.
Why would a those Larger Alliances even bother with a system owned by a small Corp/Alliance with **** moons? There are bigger fish to fry. Not to mention, moon survey probing will have to be done regularly to scout which onces have the decent minerals. Yes, I'm proposing the mineral types on moons change over "x" amount of time.
Also, of course everyone is looking to make a quick Billion. But not everyone is greedy, it's always an option for that smaller corp/alliance to move to a different system whose moons may be profitable for them, but no so much for the larger ones to even bother about. |
Frostys Virpio
Lame Corp Name
979
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 01:43:00 -
[17] - Quote
Bloodmyst Ranwar wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote: What would prevent those oh so cute small entity from being crushed if they do not accept aligning themself with the bigger power? Moon mining don't even generate that much money anyway if you take into account the size of those alliance. It's not like each player has his very own moon to mine for income.
Why would a those Larger Alliances even bother with a system owned by a small Corp/Alliance with **** moons? There are bigger fish to fry. Not to mention, moon survey probing will have to be done regularly to scout which onces have the decent minerals. Yes, I'm proposing the mineral types on moons change over "x" amount of time. Also, of course everyone is looking to make a quick Billion. But not everyone is greedy, it's always an option for that smaller corp/alliance to move to a different system whose moons may be profitable for them, but no so much for the larger ones to even bother about.
Putting up tower and reaction is probably way too much of a pain in the ass for any entity large or small to want to ever mess with depleting moons. |
Ivan Krividus
Straightedge and Compass Industrial The Crimson Tower
146
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 01:44:00 -
[18] - Quote
OP is just a fancy way of complaining about sov mechanics
not saying i disagree though |
Tauranon
Weeesearch Greater Western Co-Prosperity Sphere
648
|
Posted - 2014.01.23 01:48:00 -
[19] - Quote
There is nothing wrong with strategic build up, so long as the forces are willing to use it, because only using it will get rid of it (and using it consumes minerals, which keeps the mineral market from being saturated). It is plain that both sides in the current conflict are willing to deploy.
If you want to live in null without worrying about the force required to hold sov, you have 3 options depending on the size of your group.
Rent. Gypsy. Live in NPC null.
Rent gives you perma respawning content and most entrants to your systems will be blue, gypsy lets you ignore sov boundaries in your quest for deadspace loot (and with all the renter and deployed entity spaces, its really not _that_ hard to find thinly held territory where you'll be ignored for periods of time), and living in NPC null is hard (and most people won't make as much isk), but there will alway be other small gangs about, and you don't have to pay anyone or be aligned with anyone.
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ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
2783
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Posted - 2014.01.23 01:54:00 -
[20] - Quote
Quote:3. Ranting is prohibited.
A rant is a post that is often filled with angry and counterproductive comments. A free exchange of ideas is essential to building a strong sense of community and is helpful in development of the game and community. Rants are disruptive, and incite flaming and trolling. Please post your thoughts in a concise and clear manner while avoiding going off on rambling tangents.
16. Redundant and re-posted threads will be locked.
As a courtesy to other forum users, please search to see if there is a thread already open on the topic you wish to discuss. If so, please place your comments there instead. Multiple threads on the same subject clutter up the forums needlessly, causing good feedback and ideas to be lost. Please keep discussions regarding a topic to a single thread.
Thread closed. ISD Dorrim Barstorlode Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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