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AskariRising
ROGUE SPADES EoN.
17
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Posted - 2013.10.23 21:50:00 -
[1] - Quote
Golem is already immune most ewar, and already had great damage projection at ~222KM. Now its projection with cruise missiles will be what? 350KM? why? we cant target anything that far. The Golem also already tanks better than the other marauders, making the bastion bonuses redundant.
People complained the Golem was rediculous when using dual XL ASB's... what will it be like now? 15k per second?
The Golem just doesnt get much benift from the new Bastion mode except a ridiculous shield tank, which is sad considering the uninspired bastion transformation and hideous redesign it was vandalized with. |
Solutio Letum
Terpene Conglomerate
199
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Posted - 2013.10.23 21:57:00 -
[2] - Quote
Ok listen i know you because i just posted in your last thread. the GM is gonna have to lock one or both for spamming if it keeps going... you talked about the same thing in both |
Bischopt
Arbitrary Repossession
289
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Posted - 2013.10.23 22:41:00 -
[3] - Quote
AskariRising wrote:
People complained the Golem was rediculous when using dual XL ASB's...
Those silly people, rediculous isn't even a thing. |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
609
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Posted - 2013.10.23 23:11:00 -
[4] - Quote
AskariRising wrote:Golem is already immune most ewar, and already had great damage projection at ~222KM. Now its projection with cruise missiles will be what? 350KM? why? we cant target anything that far. The Golem also already tanks better than the other marauders, making the bastion bonuses redundant.
People complained the Golem was rediculous when using dual XL ASB's... what will it be like now? 15k per second?
The Golem just doesnt get much benift from the new Bastion mode except a ridiculous shield tank, which is sad considering the uninspired bastion transformation and hideous redesign it was vandalized with.
Where are you doing your math, and what modules are you using? Cause it's f'd up. I have pretty high skills for missiles and with bastion, I get 208km. Further more, the Golem is merely immune to tracking disruption. Jams, damps, and TPs still effect is quite severally.
Golem probably has the weakest tank outside of Duel ASB fits, and even the Vargur outperforms with duel ASB.
Targeting range, not needed. Ewar, totally needed. Bastion tank, awesome for solo pve, expecially for torp fits which take higher damage from npcs due to range. Range bonus, doesn't help cruise, but really helps torps, if even a little. |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
609
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Posted - 2013.10.23 23:17:00 -
[5] - Quote
Alternately, I will state that bastion mode suits the Golem better than it does any other Marauder due to not having to worry about tracking. |
Arthur Aihaken
The.VOID
386
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Posted - 2013.10.23 23:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
It's bordering on hideous now... I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |
Icarus Able
Traverse Holdings Setting The Universe on Fire
133
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Posted - 2013.10.23 23:52:00 -
[7] - Quote
Um Torps? THe increase in tank allows you to fit Torps and have good range with midslots spare for TPs to make up for the worse Damage application. |
Arthur Aihaken
The.VOID
386
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Posted - 2013.10.23 23:55:00 -
[8] - Quote
Icarus Able wrote:Um Torps? THe increase in tank allows you to fit Torps and have good range with midslots spare for TPs to make up for the worse Damage application. Exactly! And the +25% range bonus on Bastion combined with the 37.5% web bonus makes torpedoes deadlier than ever! Oh, wait... I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |
AskariRising
ROGUE SPADES EoN.
18
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Posted - 2013.10.24 03:39:00 -
[9] - Quote
Solutio Letum wrote:Ok listen i know you because i just posted in your last thread. the GM is gonna have to lock one or both for spamming if it keeps going... you talked about the same thing in both
yea but the topics were different. i was going to post them both in the same one but they arent the same issue. one is about the 250km targeting range limit and the othe is about the bastion mode not really adding anything to the golem |
AskariRising
ROGUE SPADES EoN.
18
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Posted - 2013.10.24 04:06:00 -
[10] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Icarus Able wrote:Um Torps? THe increase in tank allows you to fit Torps and have good range with midslots spare for TPs to make up for the worse Damage application. Exactly! And the +25% range bonus on Bastion combined with the 37.5% web bonus makes torpedoes deadlier than ever! Oh, wait...
it doesnt increase range by that much though. you cant hit anything at 100km, though idk if itd be necessary. the web would have been nice though i wouldve liked it to have been a range bonus |
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AskariRising
ROGUE SPADES EoN.
18
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Posted - 2013.10.24 04:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote:AskariRising wrote:Golem is already immune most ewar, and already had great damage projection at ~222KM. Now its projection with cruise missiles will be what? 350KM? why? we cant target anything that far. The Golem also already tanks better than the other marauders, making the bastion bonuses redundant.
People complained the Golem was rediculous when using dual XL ASB's... what will it be like now? 15k per second?
The Golem just doesnt get much benift from the new Bastion mode except a ridiculous shield tank, which is sad considering the uninspired bastion transformation and hideous redesign it was vandalized with. Where are you doing your math, and what modules are you using? Cause it's f'd up. I have pretty high skills for missiles and with bastion, I get 208km. Further more, the Golem is merely immune to tracking disruption. Jams, damps, and TPs still effect is quite severally. Golem probably has the weakest tank outside of Duel ASB fits, and even the Vargur outperforms with duel ASB. Targeting range, not needed. Ewar, totally needed. Bastion tank, awesome for solo pve, expecially for torp fits which take higher damage from npcs due to range. Range bonus, doesn't help cruise, but really helps torps, if even a little.
i have level 5 missile skills and my max is 222km with standard cruise and 166km with t2 cruise. add the bastion mode and a couple rigs and youll be about 350km
golem is naturally immune to tracking distruption, its also immune to ecm and damps if you use fof missiles lol. and the fact that missile and ASB's dont use cap means neuts dont effect you as much. TP's against a golem are useless since its sig radius is already the largest of all BS's
so i dont see any benefit from bastion other than for using torps, but i say cruise does it better still |
Zan Shiro
Alternative Enterprises
244
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Posted - 2013.10.24 09:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
AskariRising wrote:
so i dont see any benefit from bastion other than for using torps, but i say cruise does it better still
I would say the bastion animation but if it doesn't change from what I have seen....its meh too.
I personally am eyeing other marauders. Besides better bastion animations they get actual performance boosts. Which is funny...I celebrated the day ccp said no more BS 5 for caps. I though cool...don't have to redo a BS 5 it since I am caldari bs 5 (I got it for widow). Now with these changes there I am going looks like another racial bs 5, doh.
The ++ber range not helping golem. Even if there was no 250km grid limit....firing at 300 km's is pointless. If a decent number of gun bs' in fleet that target will be popped with too many missiles still in the air.
Torp range while better...I'd still take kronos in bastion. Probably why I will train for it (and the animation is the best imo....looks and functionality win win really).
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Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
564
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Posted - 2013.10.24 09:51:00 -
[13] - Quote
Arthur Aihaken wrote:Icarus Able wrote:Um Torps? THe increase in tank allows you to fit Torps and have good range with midslots spare for TPs to make up for the worse Damage application. Exactly! And the +25% range bonus on Bastion combined with the 37.5% web bonus makes torpedoes deadlier than ever! Oh, wait...
The Golem never needed a web bonus, never has, and never will be.
TP's are the Golems Tracking Computers, fit 2 - 3 of them and be happy, no webs needed.
PS: I don't know what rigs you use on your golem, so maybe your range with torps is not quite as incredible as mine, but right now my Golem can fling torps at targets almost 70km away. Yes, Javelin Torps. But I digress, I wanted to say, unless Webs get a range boost to 70km using them on a Golem that doesn't have Mach like speed is simply not worth it. Stupidity should be a bannable offense.
Also This --> https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=216699 Please stop making "afk cloak" threads, thanks in advance. |
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
Republic Military Tax Avoiders
311
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Posted - 2013.10.24 09:55:00 -
[14] - Quote
Icarus Able wrote:Um Torps? THe increase in tank allows you to fit Torps and have good range with midslots spare for TPs to make up for the worse Damage application. ^ this http://clip2net.com/clip/m214363/1382608334-clip-86kb.png 1. Land in the middle of Angel Sanctum ......... Profit! Note that +25% missile velocity from Bastion allows to swap 1 of usual range rigs to damage application one. Opinions are like assholes. Everybody's got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks. |
zbaaca
POD Based Lifeforms DarkSide.
56
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Posted - 2013.10.24 10:16:00 -
[15] - Quote
torps with bastion and 2 range rigs kinda become what they should while javs get 84.2 km . rage 46.8. but i really dont see how module benefits cruise fits. without it i have 116 km on precision. it give insane tank. so with pith b med sb +2 t2 invuls and em ward i have about 1k omni def and become almost cap stable. for now only blaster kronos looks worst of all. Bugs are opportunities to cause unprecedented amounts of destruction. --Zorgn
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Dyexz
Comrades in Construction
2
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Posted - 2013.10.24 11:33:00 -
[16] - Quote
Debora Tsung wrote:Arthur Aihaken wrote:Icarus Able wrote:Um Torps? THe increase in tank allows you to fit Torps and have good range with midslots spare for TPs to make up for the worse Damage application. Exactly! And the +25% range bonus on Bastion combined with the 37.5% web bonus makes torpedoes deadlier than ever! Oh, wait... The Golem never needed a web bonus, never has, and never will be. TP's are the Golems Tracking Computers, fit 2 - 3 of them and be happy, no webs needed. PS: I don't know what rigs you use on your golem, so maybe your range with torps is not quite as incredible as mine, but right now my Golem can fling torps at targets almost 70km away. Yes, Javelin Torps. But I digress, I wanted to say, unless Webs get a range boost to 70km using them on a Golem that doesn't have Mach like speed is simply not worth it.
1 Target Painter + 1 Webbifier is more effective than 3 Target painters together, ofc only if your target is within your web range. |
Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
564
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Posted - 2013.10.24 11:36:00 -
[17] - Quote
Dyexz wrote: ofc only if your target is within your web range.
That's the whole point, why would I try and slowboat to my target when I can hit it from were I am now?
It'll be dead before arrive anyways. Stupidity should be a bannable offense.
Also This --> https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=216699 Please stop making "afk cloak" threads, thanks in advance. |
AskariRising
ROGUE SPADES EoN.
19
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Posted - 2013.10.24 11:48:00 -
[18] - Quote
Debora Tsung wrote:Dyexz wrote: ofc only if your target is within your web range. That's the whole point, why would I try and slowboat to my target when I can hit it from were I am now? It'll be dead before arrive anyways.
which is why a bonus to web range wouldve been more useful.
they should add a racial bonus to the bastion mode. then maybe each ship would get something actually tailored to it specifically instead of the cookie cutter bonuses that dont apply as equal benefit to all marauders |
Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
564
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Posted - 2013.10.24 11:59:00 -
[19] - Quote
AskariRising wrote: which is why a bonus to web range wouldve been more useful.
they should add a racial bonus to the bastion mode. then maybe each ship would get something actually tailored to it specifically instead of the cookie cutter bonuses that dont apply as equal benefit to all marauders
Yeah, also I want my Marauder to have a speed of 1km/s, have 20k raw shield HP + T2 resists...
Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't complain if I got that for my golem, but I also believe the time for Web bonuses on Marauders is "long" past.
The Golem just doesn't need any Web bonus at all. It does just fine without it and while the other Marauderrs would certainly benefit from the Web Bonus even more than the Golem, they can do without the web bonus as well, despite what Dinsdale and some other guys in the marauder thread are claiming constantly and repeatedly without end.
EDIT: Oh wait, I forgot. That thing with the bastion mode specially tailored to the ship it's used on. not a bad idea, I'd like that. It'd diversify the 4 marauders from each other without turning them into an entire new class of ship, I support ship diversity. Tho I do not support ship redundancy. Stupidity should be a bannable offense.
Also This --> https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=216699 Please stop making "afk cloak" threads, thanks in advance. |
flapie 2
Planetary Traders Union
10
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Posted - 2013.10.24 12:39:00 -
[20] - Quote
AskariRising wrote:its also immune to ecm and damps if you use fof missiles lol.
This part cause the next part:
AskariRising wrote:so i dont see any benefit from bastion
Find the fails, cause if you don't find any you need to check your brain for memory leaks.
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Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
610
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Posted - 2013.10.24 12:48:00 -
[21] - Quote
Dyexz wrote:Debora Tsung wrote:Arthur Aihaken wrote:Icarus Able wrote:Um Torps? THe increase in tank allows you to fit Torps and have good range with midslots spare for TPs to make up for the worse Damage application. Exactly! And the +25% range bonus on Bastion combined with the 37.5% web bonus makes torpedoes deadlier than ever! Oh, wait... The Golem never needed a web bonus, never has, and never will be. TP's are the Golems Tracking Computers, fit 2 - 3 of them and be happy, no webs needed. PS: I don't know what rigs you use on your golem, so maybe your range with torps is not quite as incredible as mine, but right now my Golem can fling torps at targets almost 70km away. Yes, Javelin Torps. But I digress, I wanted to say, unless Webs get a range boost to 70km using them on a Golem that doesn't have Mach like speed is simply not worth it. 1 Target Painter + 1 Webbifier is more effective than 3 Target painters together, ofc only if your target is within your web range.
Not at all...
Webs don't make the ship bigger.
Now, if you said web and TP is better than 2 TP maybe. But then again probably not. You must remember... webs have a much shorter range than TPs. So while you're not webbing anything but frigs and the occational cruiser.. I can TP everything |
Debora Tsung
The Investment Bankers Guild
564
|
Posted - 2013.10.24 13:00:00 -
[22] - Quote
Joe Risalo wrote: Not at all...
Webs don't make the ship bigger.
Now, if you said web and TP is better than 2 TP maybe. But then again probably not. You must remember... webs have a much shorter range than TPs. So while you're not webbing anything but frigs and the occational cruiser.. I can TP everything
YOU!
You can't do that! Common Sense is not allowed in here!!!
Not without enough insults to get your post deleted. Stupidity should be a bannable offense.
Also This --> https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=216699 Please stop making "afk cloak" threads, thanks in advance. |
Joe Risalo
State War Academy Caldari State
610
|
Posted - 2013.10.24 13:26:00 -
[23] - Quote
Debora Tsung wrote:Joe Risalo wrote: Not at all...
Webs don't make the ship bigger.
Now, if you said web and TP is better than 2 TP maybe. But then again probably not. You must remember... webs have a much shorter range than TPs. So while you're not webbing anything but frigs and the occational cruiser.. I can TP everything
YOU! You can't do that! Common Sense is not allowed in here!!! Not without enough insults to get your post deleted.
Sorry...
Putting my head back in ass at this time.. |
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ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
2468
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Posted - 2013.10.25 05:09:00 -
[24] - Quote
Quote:3. Ranting is prohibited.
A rant is a post that is often filled with angry and counterproductive comments. A free exchange of ideas is essential to building a strong sense of community and is helpful in development of the game and community. Rants are disruptive, and incite flaming and trolling. Please post your thoughts in a concise and clear manner while avoiding going off on rambling tangents.
Quote:16. Redundant and re-posted threads will be locked.
As a courtesy to other forum users, please search to see if there is a thread already open on the topic you wish to discuss. If so, please place your comments there instead. Multiple threads on the same subject clutter up the forums needlessly, causing good feedback and ideas to be lost. Please keep discussions regarding a topic to a single thread. Thread closed. ISD Dorrim Barstorlode Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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