Got through about 1/2 of the posts here, and I think many of you need to get on EFT and try some new loadouts, using the new stats, before you rant and rave about the proposed rebalancing.

The real problem with Gallente ships has been the combined high PG reqs of both hybrid guns and armor plates, which made balancing gank vs tank difficult. In addition, after the previous across-the-board speed rebalancing, Gallente ships were running a bit too slow, due to the speed/agility penalty from armor plates and armor rigs.

The proposed reduction in PG reqs for hybrid guns means that many of the Gallente blaster ships will be able to fit a full rack of higher grade guns, while maintaining the same amount of tank - ie. instead of electron blasters, you can now fit ion blasters. This is equivalent to giving a massive damage buff to both blasters and railguns. For example, upgrading from T2 medium electron blasters to T2 medium ion blasters, is a 60% boost in damage. Railguns get an additional 10% damage buff, on top of the ability fo upgrade to higher grade guns - from the old T2 350mm rails to the new T2 425mm rails, we're talking about a 50% boost in damage. So, what are you complaining about?

However, the PG reduction is even better than a simple damage buff. Why? Because you can also opt to keep the same gank, and use the extra PG to upgrade your tank instead.

For example, the PG req for an 400mm plate is 30, whereas the PG req for an 800mm plate is 200. In many cases, due to the high PG of the hybrid guns, Gallente ships have been a bit short on PG for the 800mm plate and thus forced to use the 400mm plate. Now, with the lower PG of the guns, you will be able to upgrade many ships to the 800mm plate, which has 100% more armor HP than the 400mm plate. So, armor tanking gets a bit of love out of this hybrid rebalance, too.

But, we don't stop here. Currently, if you want a beefer armor tank, you might opt to use two (2) 400mm plates, or one (1) 800mm plate + RC/PDS module or ACR rig (to boost the PG). The reduction of the gun PG reqs means that you will be able to fit the single 800mm plate, without a PG upgrade, to get the identical tank. This effectively frees up either a low slot or a rig slot - which can be used for an additional damage mod/rig, a tanking mod/rig, or even a speed mod/rig. Yeah, baby!

Next, the buff to Gallente ship max velocity/agility helps to take the edge off of the armor plate penalty. For example, the Incursus (new speed 344 m/s) is now only a hair slower than the Rifter (353 m/s), and likely more agile. With faster tracking blasters, the upgraded Incursus just might be the new FOTM for solo PvP frigs... hmm.

And, finally, the substantial reduction in cap use of the hybrid guns reduces the need for cap rechargers, cap boosters, nosferatus, and CCC rigs. Again, we''re talking about freeing up mod/rig slots which can be used to improve gank, tank, or speed.

After 35 pages i really think the only possible solution will be .

After 35 pages i really think the only possible solution will be

=> minmatar with hybrids and gallente with projectiles.


The minmatar playstile (Shield&Speed) would perfetly fit with blasters. fast in hit hard and hide again. While gallente (Armor Tank) definitly likes the control of aerea from projectiles. Easy fix.

Whoever had the idea giving short range weapons to armor tanks should be hung, drawned and quartered.
To be fair, in the beginning Ships like the Thorax had a function like the cynaball nowadays but that is long long in the past....

+1 for giving Aretha Franklin a shotgun...

Then let them make new lore, cant they say that some gallente engineer have designed a new superior propulsion system for gallente ships that make them faster but less agile than minmatar ships?

Hello all. Sorry for not replying more. I've been a tad busy. We're trying to get these changes to SISI so we can start playing around with them. Once this is on SISI, please post more feedback in the test server feedback forums.

Here are some responses to your concerns.

"Hail boost is too much"
Possibly... I might change it to a 25% falloff penalty instead of removing it completely.

"Tech II ammo needs to be rethought"
I agree that we need to take a better look at this. What I did was just reacting to some issues that I found to be very obvious when comparing them to tech 1 ammo.

"Eagle is terrible, Deimos is terrible, Rokh is terrible, Proteus is terrible... etc."
Keep posting specific examples. We can't fix everything at once, but hearing the problems from you helps us prioritize what needs to be looked at.

"Reduce hybrid ammo size"
That's a pretty good idea. I'll look into it.

"Armor rigs should not reduce speed"
Possibly... I definitely considered it and haven't completely dismissed it.

"This isn't enough, we need bigger boosts to damage"
That is entirely possible but I believe this is a good starting point.

What approach? You don't jump a Gallente blasterboat outside of blaster range and try to approach a Minmatar ship. It isn't going to happen because the Minmatar ship is usually fast enough to keep its distance.

You jump the blaster boat within blaster range, get it? There is no approach, and thus no issue in your hand.

Yea I find it psychologically fascinating how CCP still keeps buffing the OTHER ammo in the dev blog thats supposed to be about buffing gallente..

The ammo thats in the most need of fixing is the T2 BLASTER ammo, CCP. Remove the tracking penalty. Pretty please.

"Eagle is terrible, Deimos is terrible, Rokh is terrible, Proteus is terrible... etc."
Keep posting specific examples. We can't fix everything at once, but hearing the problems from you helps us prioritize what needs to be looked at.

"Armor rigs should not reduce speed"
Possibly... I definitely considered it and haven't completely dismissed it.

"This isn't enough, we need bigger boosts to damage"
That is entirely possible but I believe this is a good starting point.

I approve of getting it to SISSI to start testing it. With regards to specifics for the Deimos:

It's too large. 160m signature radius as it slowly charges it's enemies means not much will fail to hit it.
It's too slow. It goes half the speed of a Vagabond and has 25% of the range. Comparing ships and even the Eagle goes faster then it - before you add plates or anything else.
It's bonuses should be looked at. With less cap going to the guns is the MWD bonus all that neccesary? I would suggest either the much maligned web bonus OR an overheat bonus OR a warp core stab point ala blockade runners for leaving when the stars don't line up.

First, thanks for a response and reading our thoughts!!!

To respond directly to your response though...

Tech 2 changes are nice (across the board), even if they will shake up the LP Store markets some as a few faction ammo types will become second rate. Those aren't really a hybrid fix though, as has already been pointed out, as much as a general "T2 Ammo kinda sucks" fix for many of the non-used ammo types.

Regarding specific ship setups and how they can be fixed, these are directly related to the core philosophy behind the use of blasters, and this is exactly what people are complaining about. Blasters need a reason to be used, as their lack of weapon damage types combined with range, capacitor usage, and targeted hulls (slow, fat, armor tanked, and lacking the slots to make for a manageable tank/buffer while increasing damage via magstabs to the levels necessary) just do not make a compelling reason to use them over something else. You can fix armor rigs, nudge gallente ships faster, etc... but there needs to be a compelling reason to use a weapon system for it to actually be used.,,, else you end up nudging and nudging until the system just becomes overpowered and invalidates other weapon systems.

The nuclear option COMBINED with enough tracking to fight at 500m with traversal seems like the one niche where Blasters can excel. Crank up the damage to where Gallente ships can really excel in ONE area better than all others, and a real use will exist (even if it isn't what many are looking for). Today I have real reasons to fly Amarr, Minmatar, and Caldari hulls in a variety of combat situations. For those of us who love Gallente, all we ask is that Gallente get given a real reason to fly their hulls (beyond running missions in drone boats). Preferably, whatever it is that is provided, some of us would ask that it doesn't invalidate the existing paradigms that are in place for other races' ships and their corresponding weapon systems.

The best deimos fix is already on tranquility. it is called adrestia. perfect blaster boat, perfect hybrid fix

now compare adrestia with deimos and it will be clear why it is perfect.

The best deimos fix is already on tranquility. it is called adrestia. perfect blaster boat, perfect hybrid fix

now compare adrestia with deimos and it will be clear why it is perfect.

Either that or the proteus. 900dps with 180k EHP, or 400dps with 400k ehp. Basically those two ships are the only blaster ships ive flown that work.

I'm sure that someone already noted it here (did not read whole thread).
My vision of blaster boats: they are agile (definitely need boost), high dps (maybe current dps is ok) and tracking ships (definitely need boost).

Agility, not speed, is important for blaster ships. if you can gain speed faster than other that mean you can faster get it scramble/web range or leave disruptor range. Leave speed for minmatar. Agility is for gallente.
5% better agility is not enough.

Your speed gain should be like dash, and you should have change moving vector fast. Much quicker that other ships, because it's "all or nothing" type.

Important tactical range is from 0 up to 24km. Taking in mind scramble and web range it becomes 10-24km that blaster boats has troubles in. Using agility and acceleration blaster boat should cover ~8-10km of that range faster than minmatar or amar ships.

That way minmatar pilot knows that he has ~4 km safe range if he gets to close, agile ship could burs towards him and scram/web him. In other side galente pilots know that if minmatar are to far for burst (minmatar would get his speed before galente could reach him) he always could use his agility, turn fast and burst in opposite direction and get out of disruptor range.

I'd like an extra mid slot instead of utility high "power core multiplier" sub: +1 low +1 mid (instead of high and not being hard point)

So I could fit mwd+scram+web+cap inj instead of having to choose between either web either scram, the point on pvp with this little babe is to have the long range scram so no way I change the sub ! -but you can add an extra mid.

It doesn't fix the Hybrid issue, but I think this is an elegant solution to the Gallente ship issue.

+1 from me, though that dash potential would need to be significant and would also need to be counterbalanced with chasing potential, as Gallente ships would align crazy fast when pursuing or running between systems... especially if used in a pack where Lachesis could be your tacklers and ships fit a nano setup with a shield buffer so they can free up their lows for gank and speed (with even more insane align potential).