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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Haulin Gneiss
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2011.11.03 00:45:00 -
[571] - Quote
same goes for random explorers. I'm just here for the data.....why you got to kill me? |
Taedrin
Kushan Industrial
136
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Posted - 2011.11.03 01:01:00 -
[572] - Quote
I never left my morals at the door when I entered this game, thank you very much.
However, EVE is just a game and the ruthless, cutthroat nature of this game is just one of it's many appeals. |
MeestaPenni
Mercantile and Stuff
31
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Posted - 2011.11.03 01:15:00 -
[573] - Quote
Mag's wrote:So I guess you never play games like BF3 or CoD?
You ever spawned in EvE with all your stuff still intact?
Specious argument.
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ACY GTMI
Veerhouven Group The Veerhouven Group
24
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Posted - 2011.11.03 01:29:00 -
[574] - Quote
Kaylen Vimanis wrote:Not read all the 28 pages of content mainly because i cba.
But consider that; while playing any type of game, not just EVE that perhaps people use gaming as a release from RL. Sometimes people want to shoot easy targets or steal from players passively focusing their frustration on the target they have in front of them at that moment.
Please consider Castle Wolfenstein then. Eve has more than enough players with the same emotional needs. Better yet, consider taking control of your life.
One of the things I like about Madonna is her religion. One of the tenets is something like "You cause everything that happens to you." So, once again, take control of your life, or at least try. |
Qansh
Triskelion Ouroboros
21
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Posted - 2011.11.03 01:36:00 -
[575] - Quote
"Your move... Not bad, but you suck." "What?" "Your mother wears army boots." "Dude!" "Hey, don't get upset. It's just a game." "See the board? That's the game." "Your tears are delicious." "Yeah, right." "Hey, look over there!" "What?... Dude, you stole one of my pieces." "Yeah. I posted about it in C&P too." "Give me the piece back." "No. It's part of the mechanics. It was just sitting there." "This is Conquest, Dude. You can't do that." "HTFU." "Screw this!" "Ha-ha. I win." "OK, fine, but is it OK if I never trust you again?" "It's just a game, Dude. Let's go grab a beer." "It was just a game GÇö could have been just a game." "Don't take it personally." "How do I take it, since there was no game? There was an agreement to have a game. I remember that." "That's the game, bud. I get to screw you over." "But only when we agree on a game within the game. Is that it?" "Yeah." "So, we'll never agree on anything like 'how it's supposed to be' while in this larger game? Right?" "Well, if you're a doofus you can try." "Is the game really over?" "What?" "Is the game really over to go get that beer? Or are you just going to pee in it?... Well? Don't just sit there smiling. Say something." "Ha. You're catching on, bud." "OK, fine, and you not being an asshat begins where... ?" "Oh, I don't know. Maybe when you get me in your corporation." "... I've just figured something out." "What?" "The game is trust GÇö silly, I know... Anyway, I think I'll skip that beer, man. Thanks, though." "Sure... Later, bud." "Yeah. Later." |
Jita Alt666
451
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Posted - 2011.11.03 01:53:00 -
[576] - Quote
Qansh wrote:"Your move... Not bad, but you suck." "What?" "Your mother wears army boots." "Dude!" "Hey, don't get upset. It's just a game." "See the board? That's the game." "Your tears are delicious." "Yeah, right." "Hey, look over there!" "What?... Dude, you stole one of my pieces." "Yeah. I posted about it in C&P too." "Give me the piece back." "No. It's part of the mechanics. It was just sitting there." "This is Conquest, Dude. You can't do that." "HTFU." "Screw this!" "Ha-ha. I win." "OK, fine, but is it OK if I never trust you again?" "It's just a game, Dude. Let's go grab a beer." "It was just a game GÇö could have been just a game." "Don't take it personally." "How do I take it, since there was no game? There was an agreement to have a game. I remember that." "That's the game, bud. I get to screw you over." "But only when we agree on a game within the game. Is that it?" "Yeah." "So, we'll never agree on anything like 'how it's supposed to be' while in this larger game? Right?" "Well, if you're a doofus you can try." "Is the game really over?" "What?" "Is the game really over to go get that beer? Or are you just going to pee in it?... Well? Don't just sit there smiling. Say something." "Ha. You're catching on, bud." "OK, fine, and you not being an asshat begins where... ?" "Oh, I don't know. Maybe when you get me in your corporation." "... I've just figured something out." "What?" "The game is trust GÇö silly, I know... Anyway, I think I'll skip that beer, man. Thanks, though." "Sure... Later, bud." "Yeah. Later."
What?
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Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
1781
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Posted - 2011.11.03 02:12:00 -
[577] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I'd say folks that play just because they enjoy kicking over someones sandcaslte for the fun of it would likely do the same thing in RL if the lack of consequense in Eve was also part of the RL. If they wouldn't then they don't understand that the two actions are basically the same. You destroy someones work product from the only thing we have in life, time because you find taking something away from another and inflicting pain in itself enjoyable. I would bet if you could get away with it in RL you'd do the same thing in RL. There is one major difference between you and I. I know this is a game and play it accordingly.
Issler Dainze wrote:Someone in an early post pointed out quite elequently that Eve is different than a FPS because the only goal in an FPS is to kill other players and there is no real cost of death. There is also no persisted items of value like we have in Eve. Ahh so a game where you are shooting people has no moral basis. I'm glad it's so easy to pick and choose, when to hold up the moral high ground card.
Issler Dainze wrote:It's funny you fear RL consequence to your in game actions. Maybe if you think being an "asshat" is no big deal you might want to ask how it would get someone upset enough to share their opinion of your actions in a very difficult to misunderstand in RL manner. I don't fear it and actually didn't say I did. I also don't much care what they think. If they want to play the victim and feel offended, then that's there issue to deal with not mine.
Issler Dainze wrote:You might claim that folks that take "not playing well with others" in a game as a serious breach of RL morality are "crazy" but I'd remind you a big piece of the folk we share this space marble with consider just the "thought" of an immoral act as the same as having done it.
What is moral is a very tricky subject and I believe impossible to define as an absolute but I do know that if I do something to someone for fun that I wouldn't like happening to me I might need to rethink why I'm doing it.
Issler Whereas I play a game and you don't seem to be able to differentiate between actions in that and those of RL.
MeestaPenni wrote:You ever spawned in EvE with all your stuff still intact?
Specious argument.
Much like the moral and ethical one, in regards to actions within a game.
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Ann133566
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
9
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Posted - 2011.11.03 02:24:00 -
[578] - Quote
People seem to lose sight of the fact that EVE is a game. Like all games there has to be winners and losers, and instead of playing against dumb AI mechanics we are playing against other people which are smarter (usually) and rend to avoid risks.So if I have a chance to catch someone of guard or being in a place they shouldn't you can hardly blame me or anyone else taking full advantage.
On the subject of killmails, I think it's time we had a look at them and the effect it's having on the game. Personally I like the general idea, but perhaps they should be limited to null sec or WH space, or even just factional warfare. |
Qansh
Triskelion Ouroboros
22
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Posted - 2011.11.03 02:48:00 -
[579] - Quote
Ann133566 wrote:So if I have a chance to catch someone of guard or being in a place they shouldn't you can hardly blame me or anyone else taking full advantage. I think that's fine, but I also think there's a trade-off in that one shouldn't expect the other person to ever just "drop the game" and supposedly relate in friendly terms to the person who ripped him off. In simple conversation, sure, but that person will have set the tone of what to expect from him in-game. He chose not to bring his possibly decent RL-outlook into the game and so-be it. If losing that possible trust is no big deal (which in the majority of cases it surely isn't) then I don't see a problem. The predator gets some loot and the victim gets to know what to expect from him the next time.
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Chelone
Outside The Asylum
4
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Posted - 2011.11.03 04:06:00 -
[580] - Quote
Ambassadeur Ur-Shulgi wrote:There is an Easy fix to peoples lack of morals in the game. Fix the bounty system. To do this CCP needs to do the following.
1. You have to apply for a bounty hunter licence, a Corp licence, making everyone in your corp a bounty hunter. Everyone in your corp needs to have positive sec status.
2. As soon as you shoot someone in low sec you get Negative standing and automaticly become wanted. Bounty corps can shoot these people anywhere and concord wont get involved they also dont lose sec status if they do so. Also if they shoot back at the bounty hunters in highsec concord responds ( this is a serious thing, locking people who kill others out of highsec) If you get a negative status you are kinda screwed untill you can turn your sec status around.
3. The victim also has the Option to Contract a bounty to a bounty corp.. making it even more lucrative to hunt the offender. when going into the bounty system ingame. Bounty hunter corps show up and can be contacted and contracted through the game placing a lucrative bounty on the offender.
#1 and #2 won't work, since pirates can just have an alt in a bounty hunter corp. Then it's no different than the current system of easy bounty abuse.
#3 could work I guess. You're kind of requiring trust of a bounty corp then... and trust and Eve don't mix too well.
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Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
36
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Posted - 2011.11.03 04:38:00 -
[581] - Quote
Mag's wrote:There is one major difference between you and I. I know this is a game and play it accordingly.
To each its own. Game is an game is an game. Tho feeling from your action is "REAL", unless you take it on different level and then you dont play this game as an game you actually dont play you calculate.
Mag's wrote:Ahh so a game where you are shooting people has no moral basis. I'm glad it's so easy to pick and choose, when to hold up the moral high ground card.
Well game you describe / fps / can be played against bots and be about same fun. You play with people for competition, on somewhat leveled field. You dont kill for the sake of killing you are killed and kill and if possible improve your strategy/tactics. Unless its deathmatch free for all when you actually dont require people to have the same level of "fun" you can as easily play against bots.
Mag's wrote: don't fear it and actually didn't say I did. I also don't much care what they think. If they want to play the victim and feel offended, then that's there issue to deal with not mine.
If "you" chose to play an sociopath, someone with skill and experience to be executed on spot even before kids because he is to dangerous to wait for other opportunity, its your issue to deal with not mine. Think about it.. / disclaimer : It isnt oriented against you and you alone, its oriented to the kind people of EVE who "extract tears and have childish fun doing it."
Mag's wrote: Whereas I play a game and you don't seem to be able to differentiate between actions in that and those of RL.
viz first respond.
MeestaPenni wrote:You ever spawned in EvE with all your stuff still intact?
Specious argument.
Much like the moral and ethical one, in regards to actions within a game. [/quote]
As per second respond.. / difference is indeed in game .
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Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
641
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Posted - 2011.11.03 04:45:00 -
[582] - Quote
I ganked a couple miners today. It was p fun. The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
Michael Holmes Holmes
0verload. IMPERIAL LEGI0N
3
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Posted - 2011.11.03 04:57:00 -
[583] - Quote
I love how the griefers just tend to run the debate in circles because they can't seem to admit that acting like a bully in game is no better than acting like one out of game.
I don't think anyone will debate that EVE is a kill or be killed game, nor will we say that you should not engage in PVP when you want to, what we are saying is that you probably should cool it on the personal insults against the players.
Is that too much for you griefers to process? Do you need us to spell it out any more plainly?
We don't care if you kill other players, just don't be a jerk about it and "extract tears" because that turns the whole event from being about blowing up internet spaceships to harassing the other player.
I guess you are cool with that though...because you are all dark and evil and nobody understands your pain.
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Thorn Galen
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
152
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Posted - 2011.11.03 05:05:00 -
[584] - Quote
Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:I love how the griefers just tend to run the debate in circles because they can't seem to admit that acting like a bully in game is no better than acting like one out of game.
I don't think anyone will debate that EVE is a kill or be killed game, nor will we say that you should not engage in PVP when you want to, what we are saying is that you probably should cool it on the personal insults against the players.
Is that too much for you griefers to process? Do you need us to spell it out any more plainly?
We don't care if you kill other players, just don't be a jerk about it and "extract tears" because that turns the whole event from being about blowing up internet spaceships to harassing the other player.
I guess you are cool with that though...because you are all dark and evil and nobody understands your pain.
Michael, what you should understand by now is that by posting your feelings about it, you are giving griefers exactly what they want. Every time you complain about it, or make remarks about it, you give them tears. Best defence is to reverse it, play their own game. No tears = delicious reactions from Griefers.
Personally, I know a few griefers who are total b*stards ingame, but that's where it stops. In real life they are like most other normal, fully functional, approachable and friendly people. It's just this game, it allows one to blow off steam, in whatever manner you feel most comfortable with. Griefers find great satisfaction with destruction and tears. As far as I am concerned, it's the easy way out, if you get my meaning. In my opinion, it is far more difficult being a decent human being ingame than it is being a griefer. Why? because you have to survive the griefers.
Without griefers, this game would be 50% boring.
Just smile and wave and keep doing that even if the worst happens.
The universe is an ancient desert, a vast wasteland with only occasional habitable planets as oases. We Fremen, comfortable with deserts, shall now venture into another. - STILGAR, From the Sietch to the Stars. |
Ann133566
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
10
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Posted - 2011.11.03 05:12:00 -
[585] - Quote
Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:I love how the griefers just tend to run the debate in circles because they can't seem to admit that acting like a bully in game is no better than acting like one out of game.
I don't think anyone will debate that EVE is a kill or be killed game, nor will we say that you should not engage in PVP when you want to, what we are saying is that you probably should cool it on the personal insults against the players.
Is that too much for you griefers to process? Do you need us to spell it out any more plainly?
We don't care if you kill other players, just don't be a jerk about it and "extract tears" because that turns the whole event from being about blowing up internet spaceships to harassing the other player.
I guess you are cool with that though...because you are all dark and evil and nobody understands your pain.
I can understand where you're comming from and somewhat sympathise with the lone miner in a retriever in high-sec getting suicide ganked because he was just unlucky enough to be there. But EVE has never pretended to be anything other than a sharks game where the scumbag is more likely to be successful than the nice guy. I can only tell you this: It's a mistake to take this game too seriously or invest emotionally in it. It is after all a game, being good or bad at it proves nothing in the real world and if you get upset or over excited about something in the game, you really have to re-examine your life. |
Michael Holmes Holmes
0verload. IMPERIAL LEGI0N
3
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Posted - 2011.11.03 05:26:00 -
[586] - Quote
Perhaps I am injecting a bit too much anger into my posts, I don't mean to and have very little reason to be upset as I have not yet been a victim myself.
I just fear that if this problem grows any larger, that I may have just started playing a game that is doomed to fail. I can't imagine that this game will survive much longer if the griefers make more and more players so annoyed that they quit.
I really think this game is amazing and part of that is the risk involved, but I don't think it needs to go as far as it does.
When I hear some folks on this topic talk about how they are playing the villain and that gives them license to act as they will to the other players, I just can't help but think that a good villain in a story is the one that is complicated and interesting, not the one that acts like a angry teenager who wants attention.
Maybe I am just not the right kind of player for this game, but I won't let that stop me from trying to have fun with my internet spaceships, despite the griefers best efforts. |
Barbara Nichole
Cryogenic Consultancy Black Sun Alliance
39
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Posted - 2011.11.03 06:19:00 -
[587] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:I ganked a couple miners today. It was p fun.
did they laugh at your lack of chin and huge cheeks? [IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/OldST.jpg[/IMG] |
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
249
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Posted - 2011.11.03 06:22:00 -
[588] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:I ganked a couple miners today. It was p fun.
I'm very glad to see folks active in the forums but this has been something I have say..
Please, just back away from the character creator!!
Issler
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Gank Award MC
Gank Award Nomination Committee
2
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Posted - 2011.11.03 06:25:00 -
[589] - Quote
To hell with morality!
Click the link in my sig for an event of total immorality.... 6 BILLION reasons to screw miners. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=299031 |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
641
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Posted - 2011.11.03 06:53:00 -
[590] - Quote
Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:I love how the griefers just tend to run the debate in circles because they can't seem to admit that acting like a bully in game is no better than acting like one out of game. Oh boy are you dumb. I blew up a couple miners today but I didn't go outside and beat up the neighbor's kids. Stop trying to enforce rl morality in a freaking internet spaceship game. The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
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Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
36
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Posted - 2011.11.03 07:46:00 -
[591] - Quote
Ladie Harlot wrote:Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:I love how the griefers just tend to run the debate in circles because they can't seem to admit that acting like a bully in game is no better than acting like one out of game. Oh boy are you dumb. I blew up a couple miners today but I didn't go outside and beat up the neighbor's kids. Stop trying to enforce rl morality in a freaking internet spaceship game.
Dont take it too personally ...
You do it because its yours internal agenda. You/your alliance got certein advantages from what you do... And even if they dont i dont see you as an person who would do it just to humiliate your prey afterwards, unless the person afterwards start the word fight than its kind of self defense.
If you read through this thread you will find some interesting "ideas, explanations" not necessarily true to every "ganker, extractor of tears" but certainly for some.
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Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
1786
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Posted - 2011.11.03 07:57:00 -
[592] - Quote
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Stuff...... What?
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
1786
|
Posted - 2011.11.03 08:05:00 -
[593] - Quote
Michael Holmes Holmes wrote:I love how the griefers just tend to run the debate in circles because they can't seem to admit that acting like a bully in game is no better than acting like one out of game.
Is that too much for you griefers to process? Do you need us to spell it out any more plainly?
We don't care if you kill other players, just don't be a jerk about it and "extract tears" because that turns the whole event from being about blowing up internet spaceships to harassing the other player.
I guess you are cool with that though...because you are all dark and evil and nobody understands your pain.
Process this: Game=/= RL.
CCP Zulu..... Forcing players to dock at the captain's quarters is a form of what we actually wanted to get through, which is making Incarna a seamless part of the EVE Online experience. |
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
36
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Posted - 2011.11.03 10:12:00 -
[594] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Stuff...... What?
Freud .. interesting guy if you ask me. The only reason why i am ****** up psycho emo idiot.
anyway RL is different than game..
so once you play game you are different person or are you dead ?? or what ?
Reasons why you do stuff are the same, if same rules apply to real life you would do the same, killing innocent for no personal gain just to have fun ..
edit.
by innocent i mean people you never met therefore you have no personal opinion/view on them
second edit.
also have fun is only reason why one should live.. therefore i am not an judge of mass murderes or rapist or whatever they do what they feel and for that they have my respect. |
Roime
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
9
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Posted - 2011.11.03 10:19:00 -
[595] - Quote
Mag's wrote:Process this: Game=/= RL.
So why did you play again?
It is interesting to see how that mental construct is used as some kind of protection. It's not related only to EVE, but many people seem to think that somewhere between a keyboard, cpu and modem is a line separating "Real Life" from... what, Virtual World? Fantasyland? Alternative Reality? 7th Dimension, where your acts upon other people become non-acts :D
"I might write like an angry bastard on the forums, but I'm actually pretty chill in RL"
Process this: the game is just a part of your RL.
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Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Fatal Ascension
233
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Posted - 2011.11.03 10:29:00 -
[596] - Quote
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Mag's wrote:Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Stuff...... What? Freud .. interesting guy if you ask me. The only reason why i am ****** up psycho emo idiot. I refuse to accept Freud. If I do acept his teachings, then I have to admit I fly a virtual ***** through virtual space because I want to sleep with my mother.
The truth is I fly a virtual ***** through virtual space because I want to impress hot chicks(or are probably gonna be virtual as well).
Also, this game is NOT part of my RL. Its not real. Not one can actually be hurt unless they are so emotionally invested that they allow it(which is a problem in and of itself)
I am not a ganker, griefer, or scammer, but I don't think less of other people for doing it, and occasionally even share some of the tricks I have picked up reading various forums. Its a game, and outsmarting the other guy is part of it.
Sadly, victims frequently show up to the battle of the wits in space completely unarmed. Sounds like a personal deficiency, myself, being dumb enough not to prepare for the fight you know is coming your way. o/`-á Lord, I want to be a gynecologist.. KY, rubber gloves, and a flashlight.-á o/` |
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
36
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Posted - 2011.11.03 10:33:00 -
[597] - Quote
Tallian Saotome wrote:Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Mag's wrote:Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Stuff...... What? Freud .. interesting guy if you ask me. The only reason why i am ****** up psycho emo idiot. I refuse to accept Freud. If I do acept his teachings, then I have to admit I fly a virtual ***** through virtual space because I want to sleep with my mother. The truth is I fly a virtual ***** through virtual space because I want to impress hot chicks(or are probably gonna be virtual as well). Also, this game is NOT part of my RL. Its not real. Not one can actually be hurt unless they are so emotionally invested that they allow it(which is a problem in and of itself) I am not a ganker, griefer, or scammer, but I don't think less of other people for doing it, and occasionally even share some of the tricks I have picked up reading various forums. Its a game, and outsmarting the other guy is part of it. Sadly, victims frequently show up to the battle of the wits in space completely unarmed. Sounds like a personal deficiency, myself, being dumb enough not to prepare for the fight you know is coming your way.
You are in it for an challenge, thats perfectly acceptable.
Your view on Freud teaching are misguided, i would suggest to read some of his stuff, however i find it something hard to read.
But what challenge can an "even perfectly tanked hulk" be to an gank maelstrom ? even full fleet would not safe him unless they suicide gank said Maelstrom |
Alpheias
Euphoria Released HYDRA RELOADED
122
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Posted - 2011.11.03 10:36:00 -
[598] - Quote
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Mag's wrote:Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Stuff...... What? Freud .. interesting guy if you ask me. The only reason why i am ****** up psycho emo idiot.
Well, I am glad we got that covered. That you are the ****** up psycho emo idiot, and not me because I enjoy blowing people up in a internet spaceship game.
All because of Freud... I'd kill kittens and puppies and bunnies I'd maim toddlers and teens and then more |
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
36
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Posted - 2011.11.03 10:39:00 -
[599] - Quote
Alpheias wrote:Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Mag's wrote:Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:Stuff...... What? Freud .. interesting guy if you ask me. The only reason why i am ****** up psycho emo idiot. Well, I am glad we got that covered. That you are the ****** up psycho emo idiot, and not me because I enjoy blowing people up in a internet spaceship game. All because of Freud...
Unnecessary comment. But if it made you happy. |
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Fatal Ascension
233
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Posted - 2011.11.03 10:40:00 -
[600] - Quote
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:You are in it for an challenge, thats perfectly acceptable. Your view on Freud teaching are misguided, i would suggest to read some of his stuff, however i find it something hard to read. But what challenge can an "even perfectly tanked hulk" be to an gank maelstrom ? even full fleet would not safe him unless they suicide gank said Maelstrom The challenge comes from catching someone, not dealing the damage. Your right, you aren't gonna survive a gank squad, so why be there for them to catch you?
Mine aligned(I used to put warp off BMs off of either and and align back and forth), and watch out for known gankers or suspicious behaviour. I suggest a system with few or no people in it. When in doubt, go hide.
All the things that the people telling you guys to toughen up to do, they all work, and make the game more fun.
Humans are hardwired to win, period. Gankers are following that hardwiring, and ignoring the layer of social acceptability because in eve, well, we have a difference set of social rules, and that does not violate them.
Quit trying to impose your social mores on other people society, I think is the message that should be taken from this. Eve has its own culture, and ganking is part of it.
Your immortal, you can't actually be hurt very much o/`-á Lord, I want to be a gynecologist.. KY, rubber gloves, and a flashlight.-á o/` |
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