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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 53 post(s) |
Rob Crowley
State War Academy
65
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 14:46:00 -
[391] - Quote
Raven Solaris wrote:And I just realised something, will the Gnosis get a +5 to Virus Strength?
Edit - What about the Echelon? The Echelon doesn't really need a bonus cause its Sansha codebreaker has much stronger stats than even a T2 analyzer. |
Kor'el Izia
56
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 14:47:00 -
[392] - Quote
Current exploration system has you doing one minigame(scanning) and then rolling dice(module) in order to get loot, but you'll get it if you have patience and cunning.
Next system will have you do one minigame(scanning), followed by another minigame(hacking) followed by a wild goose chase with exploding gooses(can spew), ultimately leaving you with less loot than what you worked hard for to get.
Second system is more bearable if the gooses don't explode. |
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CCP Bayesian
829
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 14:57:00 -
[393] - Quote
Kor'el Izia, there are also no NPCs in the sites (except where they haven't been updated) and we've doubled the loot in them as well as adding some good rare items. EVE Software Engineer Team Prototyping Rocks |
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Naomi Hale
Children of New Eden
125
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 14:57:00 -
[394] - Quote
Solkara Starlock wrote:What I mean that it doesn't make sense is that if someone hacks into a computer or mainframe or whatever, the result of a succesfull hack is access to that computer or mainframe. Not triggering some exploding mechanic. That sounds more like triggering a defensive system to protect the content. I was working under the assumption that we were hacking an airlock release, delivery bay or access panel, and success exposed the contents to vacuum, blowing it out into space, failure locked the hatch and the system kicking you out.
I think we'd have little luck hacking a computer bigger than our ships, also blueprints and datacores are physical objects (disks, usb sticks, hard-drive etc), they need cargo space, we aren't copying the data to our ship's computer, are we?
But like I said, that was my assumption of what was occurring, it could be wrong.
I choose to believe what I was PROGRAMMED to believe! |
Kor'el Izia
56
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 15:05:00 -
[395] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:Kor'el Izia, there are also no NPCs in the sites (except where they haven't been updated) and we've doubled the loot in them as well as adding some good rare items.
That is correct, you doubled them back to the level we had before, what a solo explorer could expect to get. Had you not doubled the loot it would've been half of what we have today.
Edit: With regards to the NPC's you swapped them for the hacking game as far as I see, which is an obstacle keeping you from the loot. Some obstacles are good, if they are in relation to the loot |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E. Aegis Solaris
1927
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 15:18:00 -
[396] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:Sven Viko VIkolander wrote:I've read these threads, read countless reviews and watched many youtube trials, and I've yet to find anyone that actually likes the loot spew (ofc, maybe you can find just a few somewhere). No one, so far as I've seen, likes twitch games, needless clicking, randomness, etc. Yes, you've made improvements in the right direction, but it seems like the overwhelming consensus here is the best direction is to remove the loot spew, focus on the hacking game to make it more strategy-based, and find another way to make it optionally co-op. That said, I'm very positive about the new exploration sites. Why? Because when I watch videos of people running them, they have limited time to check dscan, pay attention to local, and they spend a long time in space, etc. Thanks, I just went through and tallied up the responses in the past five pages to see what the spread was of people recounting their feelings towards this feature. I counted posts that talked about the scattering specifically as it exists today and ignored replies or speculation (and dev posts). I got: Negative: 6 Positive: 6 Neutral: 5 At least from my sense of the feedback we've come along way from the original very negative impressions. This is why we need actual polls built into the forums. http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
Elena Morin'staal
Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
4
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 15:19:00 -
[397] - Quote
I might be a minority, but I like the new hacking/spew mechanics.
Hacking makes it less percentage based than before, as I can try and avoid firewalls and the like, as opposed to just sitting there until the module gets a success.
As for spew, it has good and bad parts. I like the idea - you've hacked open the pressurized cargo bay, and the vacuum of space pulls everything out. I even like that you can't get everything that spews - BUT, and its a big but, you have to be able to either get enough to make it worthwhile, or at least let the pilot choose what to go after. I don't like a mechanic where I click containers at random and try to get as much junk as possible and hope I get a good can. But I do like a system where I see the spew, and make a beeline straight to something that looks juicy.
I'd rather be able to try and get 80% of good loot by cherry picking than it being pot luck. I don't mind junk loot, but it should be after you've tried to get something good - you then use up whatever time is left to cram as much in as possible.
So far, with the changes, I do like where its going. Just with I could find more relic sites in Heimatar on Sisi.... all I find a Data :D |
Raven Solaris
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
218
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 15:23:00 -
[398] - Quote
Elena Morin'staal wrote: As for spew, it has good and bad parts. I like the idea - you've hacked open the pressurized cargo bay, and the vacuum of space pulls everything out. I even like that you can't get everything that spews - BUT, and its a big but, you have to be able to either get enough to make it worthwhile, or at least let the pilot choose what to go after. I don't like a mechanic where I click containers at random and try to get as much junk as possible and hope I get a good can. But I do like a system where I see the spew, and make a beeline straight to something that looks juicy.
I'd rather be able to try and get 80% of good loot by cherry picking than it being pot luck. I don't mind junk loot, but it should be after you've tried to get something good - you then use up whatever time is left to cram as much in as possible.
So far, with the changes, I do like where its going. Just with I could find more relic sites in Heimatar on Sisi.... all I find a Data :D
Only way to "cherry pick" currently is to cargo scan the hackable containers and then go for containers that should have what you want.
Shiny blueprints in there? Go straight for data cans. Armour plates? Materials (or Parts, or both, not sure yet.) etc.
It's fairly easy to get what you want now, but I still can't say I enjoy zooming in and rapidly clicking on tiny boxes. |
blink alt
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
57
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 15:39:00 -
[399] - Quote
Enjoying the role bonus on the covops now. The rewards being tweaked back quite a bit also feels fine. However, with the loot being tweaked backed and the difficulty of the puzzles generally increased at the same time makes it pretty tough to feel good about. Never failed so many puzzles. Hope it continues to get tweaked. |
Ali Aras
Valkyries of Night Of Sound Mind
296
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 15:50:00 -
[400] - Quote
Elena Morin'staal wrote: As for spew, it has good and bad parts. I like the idea - you've hacked open the pressurized cargo bay, and the vacuum of space pulls everything out. I even like that you can't get everything that spews - BUT, and its a big but, you have to be able to either get enough to make it worthwhile, or at least let the pilot choose what to go after. I don't like a mechanic where I click containers at random and try to get as much junk as possible and hope I get a good can. But I do like a system where I see the spew, and make a beeline straight to something that looks juicy.
I'd rather be able to try and get 80% of good loot by cherry picking than it being pot luck. I don't mind junk loot, but it should be after you've tried to get something good - you then use up whatever time is left to cram as much in as possible.
You can pick containers based on name ('scrap' vs. 'data'), and there's been IME enough time to pick between them. http://warp-to-sun.tumblr.com -- my blog |
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Seth Asthereun
Oscura Simmetria Yulai Federation
17
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 16:04:00 -
[401] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:Freighdee Katt wrote:Sheena Tzash wrote: To me I feel that if your being some master hacker who is trying to get the goodies from inside an encrypted vault you wouldn't want the results to be splashed all over space.
You wouldn't see someone hack into a bank and set it up so that all the money inside the bank vault would be blasted into the sky - yeah its done the job of getting the loot but its in such an ineffective method and most likely means that you lose a good amount of the loot you've worked hard to get.
This. Bayes, you keep asking for people to 'splain it to you like you're five years old, as if it's some big mystery while people find the loot spew mechaninc annoying and stupid. Andreus said all that needs to be said about it in his earlier post. Others have repeated his same points in different words. It's all been said, and people have been saying it all since this mechanic was first proposed, over and over and over. You obviously put a lot of work into implementing this, and it sucks when people don't say nice things about something you worked hard on. But you can't say you weren't warned that people would hate it. Obviously we're now the point where you're personally attached to the mechanic, so there is not really any point in complaining about it anymore, or trying to explain to you why it sucks. You'll just keep figuring out ways to not get why people dislike it, because you think it's cool, and you don't want to think about scrapping or majorly reworking something you worked hard on and thought people would love. Actually this feature has primarily been developed by CCP Prime. I came up with, helped design and made the hacking mechanics for the vast majority of this release. Obviously we act collaboratively in lots of aspects but I'm not here to defend my baby if that's what you're implying. I just happen to be the person on the team who is on the forums the most so end up being a spokesman for the team. I'm prompting people to explain in their own words why they think something isn't fun in case they have new insights. Making the assumption that I know why they don't like something when they haven't said would be arrogant. It also prompts people to add more constructive detail. Nothing about acting like a five year old or being to stupid to know that people are saying similar things.
I can explain why i don't like it in 3 points:
-Beacuse it's repetitive and everytime the same. You can return that the pattern changes every time and that you are adding encyptors etc etc, but will still be the same, and each site is losing his uniqueness.why archeology has became the same of hacking? Is it true that as it is on tranquillity now is not much better and doesn't offer a lot of distinction but it's till more then the new method. As written some post above "hacking" is a tool to access somekind of "mainframe" and then through this do something that is certainly not making cans explode. And well archeology is..... no longer archeology, you can remove the skill and give us the sp back
-Because it should be an "expansion" not a BETA. But it seems that most of the content of this patch is a "we are sorry we can't do it in time for the release" and it is a behaviour that i can't stand. You can mess up with things when you have a real new solution not one that is "en train de" as you did with AI, with 5% resistence bonus, with exploration..
-Because I personally expected a better job with exploration, with increasing depth both in probbing and new sites but all i got seems more an ipad game than a part of EVE online. |
Liltha
Lost My Way Enterprises
13
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 16:08:00 -
[402] - Quote
I've have been sitting here trying to think how best to explain what it is that I really dislike about the spew mechanic as it stands that would make me want to pass up these sites if it goes live as it stands. I would like to start by stating you have done a lot to make it less head bangingly annoying to deal with but it still has a long way to go.
The single biggest issue I've had so far is that it's hard with the size of the objects themselves on screen to pick out and click on what I want in a hurry, complicated further by the fact that eve as a 3d environment is difficult for me to work in, the overview works much better normally for interacting with spatial objects. Another issue I've had is that sometimes it is difficult to tell exactly when you loot the can unless you are watching to cargo button (there is a delay between looting and the icons setting back to green it seems).
I can deal with the feelings I may have missed a key can in the spew and the mass of crap loot that cans often give as it sounds like you are trying to make cherry picking a little easier, I can even deal with the annoyance of having to click in X number of cans to equal the loot I got out of the old method. But the way it currently interfaces is just a pain, please strongly consider either adding the cans to the overview or maybe make a scanner work like the current asteroid scanners and make a list of the cans. |
Palal
Go For Broke
7
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 16:12:00 -
[403] - Quote
Tried in lowsec today. Got a relic site with 5 containers + 1 npc flying around it.
- I was only successful in opening 2 of the containers with 90/30. - Got 2 carbon,2 metal scraps and other worthless crap. ie 1 electronic part. - 2 skill books - caldari encryption methods, minmatar encryption methods.
Basically again - a giant waste of time.
On several of the puzzles I cleared the board with only protection nodes left.. :( How does anyone defeat a half dozen firewalls/etc?
I mean it should winnable right? Not just fluky luck?
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Veyer Erastus
Red-dormice
13
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 16:29:00 -
[404] - Quote
Palal wrote:Tried in lowsec today. Got a relic site with 5 containers + 1 npc flying around it.
- I was only successful in opening 2 of the containers with 90/30. - Got 2 carbon,2 metal scraps and other worthless crap. ie 1 electronic part. - 2 skill books - caldari encryption methods, minmatar encryption methods.
Basically again - a giant waste of time.
On several of the puzzles I cleared the board with only protection nodes left.. :( How does anyone defeat a half dozen firewalls/etc?
I mean it should winnable right? Not just fluky luck?
Well, it's not so hard to win if you do it in rigged bonused ship with t2 analyzer. Implants help also. But if you don't - then yeah. Hacking is now for specialized pilots, not just sticking module on a ship. |
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
1540
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 16:34:00 -
[405] - Quote
Veyer Erastus wrote:
Well, it's not so hard to win if you do it in rigged bonused ship with t2 analyzer. Implants help also. But if you don't - then yeah. Hacking is now for specialized pilots, not just sticking module on a ship.
Eh being specialized for it only increases the chance of surviving it. It is still primarily luck based. Like I said earlier, the hacking system is difficult in the same sense that winning the lottery is difficult.
CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE-á/ Dynamic New Eden |
Liltha
Lost My Way Enterprises
13
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 16:40:00 -
[406] - Quote
Veyer Erastus wrote:Palal wrote:Tried in lowsec today. Got a relic site with 5 containers + 1 npc flying around it.
- I was only successful in opening 2 of the containers with 90/30. - Got 2 carbon,2 metal scraps and other worthless crap. ie 1 electronic part. - 2 skill books - caldari encryption methods, minmatar encryption methods.
Basically again - a giant waste of time.
On several of the puzzles I cleared the board with only protection nodes left.. :( How does anyone defeat a half dozen firewalls/etc?
I mean it should winnable right? Not just fluky luck?
Well, it's not so hard to win if you do it in rigged bonused ship with t2 analyzer. Implants help also. But if you don't - then yeah. Hacking is now for specialized pilots, not just sticking module on a ship.
I realize he is talking about low sec sites here, but doesn't it strike you as a bit wrong that you would need to have hacking 5+implants+rigs just to do sites? I mean it's not like he tossed a hacking modules on his cruiser he obviously was using a cov ops frig to do the sites. Face it new pilots aren't likely doing combat sites, if you take away profession sites what is there for the newer pilots in exploration? |
Maximus Andendare
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
239
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 16:43:00 -
[407] - Quote
CCP Bayesian wrote:Sven Viko VIkolander, absolutely we're keenly aware that this part of the feature has had lots of negative reactions and will be watching the statistics we get back about use very closely. It really just seems that the success or failure of the hack should determine whether you get inside "cleanly" or whether the contents go flying off in space, and you collect what you can as a consolation prize.
Scenario 1: Hacker is successful at getting the goods. Present him or her with a loot window. Profit.
Scenario 2: Hacker is unsuccessful at getting the goods. Present loot scatter mechanic as the penalty. (Less) profit.
^^ This totally should be the way this plays out. The GAME is the hacking, not the loot scattering. I think you guys are somehow stuck on the idea that the loot scatter is game-like, when in actuality its the hacking that is the main shining point of the new hacking system. The loot scattering (from some lore-based emergency protection mechanic of the container) would provide the explorer with loot, albeit not as much, while the "good" hackers take most of it. This system rewards players who specialize into--and work at being good at--the hacking skills and exploration parts of the game. It certainly makes the most sense.
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Maximus Andendare
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
239
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 16:45:00 -
[408] - Quote
Palal wrote:I mean it should winnable right? Not just fluky luck? Tying the loot scatter to whether the hacker is successful or not would solve both of the problems. Unlucky hackers get a consolation prize (from whatever they can grab from the scatter) and the successful hacker is rewarded for his or her work.
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Omnathious Deninard
The Scope Gallente Federation
1097
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 16:54:00 -
[409] - Quote
Liltha wrote:Veyer Erastus wrote:Palal wrote:Tried in lowsec today. Got a relic site with 5 containers + 1 npc flying around it.
- I was only successful in opening 2 of the containers with 90/30. - Got 2 carbon,2 metal scraps and other worthless crap. ie 1 electronic part. - 2 skill books - caldari encryption methods, minmatar encryption methods.
Basically again - a giant waste of time.
On several of the puzzles I cleared the board with only protection nodes left.. :( How does anyone defeat a half dozen firewalls/etc?
I mean it should winnable right? Not just fluky luck?
Well, it's not so hard to win if you do it in rigged bonused ship with t2 analyzer. Implants help also. But if you don't - then yeah. Hacking is now for specialized pilots, not just sticking module on a ship. I realize he is talking about low sec sites here, but doesn't it strike you as a bit wrong that you would need to have hacking 5+implants+rigs just to do sites? I mean it's not like he tossed a hacking modules on his cruiser he obviously was using a cov ops frig to do the sites. Face it new pilots aren't likely doing combat sites, if you take away profession sites what is there for the newer pilots in exploration? I am doing null sec sites with only a T2 analyzer in a tengu. There is a trick to doing the sites which I will go in to detail about right now.
Do not try to hack any nodes you don't have to. Keep multiple paths open at all times. Hack all Restoration nodes immediately. Do not hack Virus suppressor nodes until you have to and/or have the tools to destroy them. Do not open any data caches until you are 2 nodes away from it. Every 3 nodes click D-Scan. Ideas For Drone Improvement Repourpose Deep Space Scanner Probes |
Veyer Erastus
Red-dormice
13
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 17:14:00 -
[410] - Quote
Brooks Puuntai wrote:Veyer Erastus wrote:
Well, it's not so hard to win if you do it in rigged bonused ship with t2 analyzer. Implants help also. But if you don't - then yeah. Hacking is now for specialized pilots, not just sticking module on a ship.
Eh being specialized for it only increases the chance of surviving it. It is still primarily luck based. Like I said earlier, the hacking system is difficult in the same sense that winning the lottery is difficult.
Well, no. If you have 50 virus strength you will squash any 50hp nodes without taking damage and 80hp ones taking damage ones. With all mentioned you will have more then 100 coherence. With this you can pretty much squash EVERY node before reaching the end even without utility.
Liltha wrote: I realize he is talking about low sec sites here, but doesn't it strike you as a bit wrong that you would need to have hacking 5+implants+rigs just to do sites? I mean it's not like he tossed a hacking modules on his cruiser he obviously was using a cov ops frig to do the sites. Face it new pilots aren't likely doing combat sites, if you take away profession sites what is there for the newer pilots in exploration?
As it stand because how inherently important strength is there is big gap between low-mid and high skill level pilots. But that's not bad at all. Bad is the fact you have only 2 tries. Right now on tranq you can have very low skill and just keep spinning around container waiting for hack. What you risk is your life - you can get ganked. It is just. And i believe same should be applied here. You can try hacking as many times, but you risk getting ganked while you play the game. |
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Raven Solaris
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
218
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 17:20:00 -
[411] - Quote
Veyer Erastus wrote:Brooks Puuntai wrote:Veyer Erastus wrote:
Well, it's not so hard to win if you do it in rigged bonused ship with t2 analyzer. Implants help also. But if you don't - then yeah. Hacking is now for specialized pilots, not just sticking module on a ship.
Eh being specialized for it only increases the chance of surviving it. It is still primarily luck based. Like I said earlier, the hacking system is difficult in the same sense that winning the lottery is difficult. Well, no. If you have 50 virus strength you will squash any 50hp nodes without taking damage and 80hp ones taking damage ones. With all mentioned you will have more then 100 coherence. With this you can pretty much squash EVERY node before reaching the end even without utility.
You can't get 50 strength, only 40, so those 50hp anti-virus nodes with 40 strength are actually pretty nasty. |
Liltha
Lost My Way Enterprises
13
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 17:21:00 -
[412] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:Liltha wrote:Veyer Erastus wrote:Palal wrote:Tried in lowsec today. Got a relic site with 5 containers + 1 npc flying around it.
- I was only successful in opening 2 of the containers with 90/30. - Got 2 carbon,2 metal scraps and other worthless crap. ie 1 electronic part. - 2 skill books - caldari encryption methods, minmatar encryption methods.
Basically again - a giant waste of time.
On several of the puzzles I cleared the board with only protection nodes left.. :( How does anyone defeat a half dozen firewalls/etc?
I mean it should winnable right? Not just fluky luck?
Well, it's not so hard to win if you do it in rigged bonused ship with t2 analyzer. Implants help also. But if you don't - then yeah. Hacking is now for specialized pilots, not just sticking module on a ship. I realize he is talking about low sec sites here, but doesn't it strike you as a bit wrong that you would need to have hacking 5+implants+rigs just to do sites? I mean it's not like he tossed a hacking modules on his cruiser he obviously was using a cov ops frig to do the sites. Face it new pilots aren't likely doing combat sites, if you take away profession sites what is there for the newer pilots in exploration? I am doing null sec sites with only a T2 analyzer in a tengu. There is a trick to doing the sites which I will go in to detail about right now. Do not try to hack any nodes you don't have to. Keep multiple paths open at all times. Hack all Restoration nodes immediately. Do not hack Virus suppressor nodes until you have to and/or have the tools to destroy them. Do not open any data caches until you are 2 nodes away from it. Every 3 nodes click D-Scan.
Yeah learning those tricks myself, however I would like to note that a tengu with a t2 analyzer means you have higher coherance and the same virus strength as the person having issues with the sites.
Now I don't really think you need to be super specialized to do basic sites, but it does seem to make it much more luck based at those skill levels, so it can be daunting/frustrating for newer explorers in a way the old system never was. My comment though was mostly in response to the notion that one needs to be specialized to do profession sites which seems like it would be wrong to lower skills characters.
Also something that occurs to me, doesn't it seem like the +5 virus strength bonus from the scanning frigs is largely useless? I have yet to come across nodes that weren't in round numbers like 10, 20, etc. Is there a situation I'm missing where 25 vrus strength is actually useful over 20? |
Tsubutai
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
208
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 17:40:00 -
[413] - Quote
Liltha wrote:Also something that occurs to me, doesn't it seem like the +5 virus strength bonus from the scanning frigs is largely useless? I have yet to come across nodes that weren't in round numbers like 10, 20, etc. Is there a situation I'm missing where 25 vrus strength is actually useful over 20? At least some nullsec and lowsec sites have defensive nodes with 50 or 70 coherence. |
Liltha
Lost My Way Enterprises
13
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 17:43:00 -
[414] - Quote
Tsubutai wrote:Liltha wrote:Also something that occurs to me, doesn't it seem like the +5 virus strength bonus from the scanning frigs is largely useless? I have yet to come across nodes that weren't in round numbers like 10, 20, etc. Is there a situation I'm missing where 25 vrus strength is actually useful over 20? At least some nullsec and lowsec sites have defensive nodes with 50 or 70 coherence.
Ah okay I kept coming across nodes with 60 or 70, hadn't thought about it being one less click on the 70 one, dumb me on that one.
I'd love to test more but the area of space I'm in still has blood raiders spawning on failure or sitting at the site when I get there, and my poor buzzard cannot seem to take down a blood raider cruiser. |
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CCP RedDawn
C C P C C P Alliance
339
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 17:45:00 -
[415] - Quote
Some more updates:
I've lowered the Coherence of all the Defensive Software in the first two difficulty tiers so it should be a lot easier now. I have however, upped the Coherence of the Core a little bit in the first two tiers as it was slightly too easy.
I've also just finished a small tutorial video for the new hacking mechanic which should be viewable soon.
Team Prototyping Rocks |
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Liltha
Lost My Way Enterprises
13
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 17:51:00 -
[416] - Quote
CCP RedDawn wrote:Some more updates:
I've lowered the Coherence of all the Defensive Software in the first two difficulty tiers so it should be a lot easier now. I have however, upped the Coherence of the Core a little bit in the first two tiers as it was slightly too easy.
I've also just finished a small tutorial video for the new hacking mechanic which should be viewable soon.
Good that should help some on the lower end of skills. |
Azurielle Silestris
Midnight Elites United Federation of Commerce
1
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 19:35:00 -
[417] - Quote
Maximus Andendare wrote:CCP Bayesian wrote:Sven Viko VIkolander, absolutely we're keenly aware that this part of the feature has had lots of negative reactions and will be watching the statistics we get back about use very closely. It really just seems that the success or failure of the hack should determine whether you get inside "cleanly" or whether the contents go flying off in space, and you collect what you can as a consolation prize. Scenario 1: Hacker is successful at getting the goods. Present him or her with a loot window. Profit. Scenario 2: Hacker is unsuccessful at getting the goods. Present loot scatter mechanic as the penalty. (Less) profit. ^^ This totally should be the way this plays out. The GAME is the hacking, not the loot scattering. I think you guys are somehow stuck on the idea that the loot scatter is game-like, when in actuality its the hacking that is the main shining point of the new hacking system. The loot scattering (from some lore-based emergency protection mechanic of the container) would provide the explorer with loot, albeit not as much, while the "good" hackers take most of it. This system rewards players who specialize into--and work at being good at--the hacking skills and exploration parts of the game. It certainly makes the most sense.
You're not the first one to propose the idea. However I think the coders feel a little too entitled towards their pet project. |
Azurielle Silestris
Midnight Elites United Federation of Commerce
1
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 19:40:00 -
[418] - Quote
Sheena Tzash wrote:Raven Solaris wrote: Edit - What about the Echelon?
Yeah, I've been meaning to wipe the dust of that old thing... Well.. when it actually becomes USEFUL ;)
Echelon needs a probe launcher or some massive coherence/virus bonus. It is meant to be an overspecialized novelty ship...
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Omnathious Deninard
The Scope Gallente Federation
1097
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 19:51:00 -
[419] - Quote
Azurielle Silestris wrote:Sheena Tzash wrote:Raven Solaris wrote: Edit - What about the Echelon?
Yeah, I've been meaning to wipe the dust of that old thing... Well.. when it actually becomes USEFUL ;) Echelon needs a probe launcher or some massive coherence/virus bonus. It is meant to be an overspecialized novelty ship... The Purloined Sansha Data Analyzer has a Virus Strength of 40 and a Coherence of 80. And that is before skills. That ship will be a hacking monster if it has a guard fleet. Ideas For Drone Improvement Repourpose Deep Space Scanner Probes |
Freighdee Katt
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
162
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 19:54:00 -
[420] - Quote
Sven Viko VIkolander wrote:But no point debating about this, numbers later on won't lie. The numbers vindicated most of Retribution, we'll see if they vindicate exploration in Odyssey, which I certainly hope they do for low sec esp. etc. It depends on what numbers they look at. It's not like anyone will unsub over loot spew. They likely will get a nontrivial number of returns or new subs by virtue of the fact that it's "an expansion" and it will get some media coverage and account for some new ad buys. People might stay for reasons that have nothing to do with exploration, and that's always good. If they just count new subs, then it will almost certainly come out as a "win" no matter how the actual content is perceived in the end.
I assume they can track how many instances of what types of explo sites people run before and after the patch. It's certain there will be a big uptick in explo activity right after the patch drops. If it settles at a higher level than it was before the expansion, then that's at least something. And no matter what people say about it here, if there is any overall uptick in explo activity, it will certainly be proclaimed a win, even if it's just a very low level of activity getting somewhat less low. If the numbers are small enough now, it's pretty easy to add a small number to a small number and get a "200% improvement!"
Whatever numbers they look at though, none of them will tell you what those same numbers would have been with everything else in Odyssey the same, but minus the loot spew. We're never going to see that number, because that permutation is never going to be tested.
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