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DroneKing Aideron
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2012.12.28 21:14:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hello All,
I am looking to really master drones, not only for pvp but for mining also. I have asked people online there thoughts but I wanted to make sure I am on the right track.
Are drones really a valid option for pvp? Can they dish out decent damage?
What specific ships should I focus on mastering in order to make sure I don't get blown out of the sky?
Thank you for all and any advice.
The object of war is not to die for your country but to make the other bastard die for his. DroneKing |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
300
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Posted - 2012.12.28 21:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
They can dish out decent damage if you have your target scrammed and webbed.
However, drones have a number of drawbacks
- It's hard for them to apply full damage to a fast target. Even though the drone is faster they land, shoot, get out of range, MWD on again etc - Drones die very easily, leaving you without dps - It's slow to get drones out of the bay and onto a target - this is especially important in frigate pvp, where often the first guy to heat his guns and shoot wins in close matches. The 5 seconds to get your drones out of the bay and onto the target is easily the margin that leads to defeat - It's hard to get good drones to fight t2 gallente/caldari ships. The shield tanked ones have low EM, and EM drones are terrible. - There are only a handful of ships that can be considered pure droneboats - most still significantly rely on a weapon system as well to apply dps. - In pve, I hear that drones get murdered with the new AI changes (not sure, don't pve)
As far as ships - the amarr have the closest pure drone ships in the game - dragoon, arbitrator, curse/pilgrim. The gallente ships doctrine tends more to hybrids + drones. |
Maire Gheren
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
34
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Posted - 2012.12.28 21:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
They're valid and they can dish out a passable amount of damage. not as much as blasters, but you can make things go boom with them. They can be countered by destroying the drones, but there are ways to counter other weapon systems too.
Start out by trying to master the Tristan. A Tristan has 5 drones and 2 hybrids that don't have damage bonuses, and people say it does less damage than the other two frigates with 3 bonused blasters. Get a bunch of Tristans and look for trouble to see how you do. The new Gallente drone destroyer might be a good option to try, or maybe the Amarr drone destroyer even. Vexor after that. But for learning PvP you want to use Tristans because you can have those exploded out from under you and giggle, which is important because your first few times out you're going to do really foolish things that get you blown up. Plus, they're smaller so you can speed tank or kite and run through gate camps. I figure your tactic is probably going to be to throw a bunch of drones at someone, then keep alive and pester the target until they fall over dead, and try to keep them from having time and ability to just swat all your drones. |
Shadow Adanza
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
31
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Posted - 2012.12.28 21:40:00 -
[4] - Quote
You just have to remember to deploy them.
-is famous for forgetting to deploy drones in drone boats- Hey! You're no zombie! |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow C.L.O.N.E.
1038
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Posted - 2012.12.28 21:42:00 -
[5] - Quote
You don't control drones, drones control you.
Not even kidding, you're going to have to deal with travel limitations that the heavier drones have, or drop sentries and try to keep the target in their optimal. Also they are destructible so you need to micro manage them. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
DroneKing Aideron
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1
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Posted - 2012.12.28 21:46:00 -
[6] - Quote
So from what I am hearing Drones are a waste of time or offer minimal DPS?
So basically I would do better to master blasters and maybe try drones on the side but not solely focus on just them as my main DPS otherwise I will get dropped.
The object of war is not to die for your country but to make the other bastard die for his. DroneKing |
masternerdguy
Inner Shadow C.L.O.N.E.
1038
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Posted - 2012.12.28 21:49:00 -
[7] - Quote
DroneKing Aideron wrote:So from what I am hearing Drones are a waste of time or offer minimal DPS?
So basically I would do better to master blasters and maybe try drones on the side but not solely focus on just them as my main DPS otherwise I will get dropped.
Drones work fine, you can do things with them you can't do with any other weapon system. They are extremely versatile.
But they have drawbacks that will never go away. Things are only impossible until they are not. |
Bridgette d'Iberville
Better Killing Through Chemistry
94
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Posted - 2012.12.28 22:01:00 -
[8] - Quote
DroneKing Aideron wrote:So from what I am hearing Drones are a waste of time or offer minimal DPS?
So basically I would do better to master blasters and maybe try drones on the side but not solely focus on just them as my main DPS otherwise I will get dropped. Sadly, I don't think you can petition for a name change either. LOL
Seriously though. drones aren't that bad in some situations, but since you are posting in Warfare & Tactics where the primary purpose is discussing PVP, then yes, drones are not very good. Lighting a cyno to your heart... |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate Samurai Pizza Cats
301
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Posted - 2012.12.28 22:03:00 -
[9] - Quote
DroneKing Aideron wrote:So from what I am hearing Drones are a waste of time or offer minimal DPS?
So basically I would do better to master blasters and maybe try drones on the side but not solely focus on just them as my main DPS otherwise I will get dropped.
Blasters still suck - the larger your ship the more they suck. They have terrible range, and fixed damage types. Pvping in a gallente frig for example, you'll come across two races of t2 frigs (caldari and gallente) that you do very little damage to due to native resists.
If you like the concept of fighting with high dps at close range, I suggest autocannons - selectable damage type, decent falloff, capless guns.
If you prefer kiting, missile boats are great - especially with the recent buffs they even have bonus'd selectable damage types (caracal and kestrel) and can't be td'd etc. Against, capless so getting neuted isn't an issue.
Finally, if you want your guns to use cap - lasers. Scorch gives you amazing range and damage across a variety of ships. But at least if you are going to fly a ship that is vulnerable to neuts, get that awesome close range damage projection with scorch. Does have a fixed damage type, but at least one one races of t2 frigs are a PITA instead of two.
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Maire Gheren
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
35
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Posted - 2012.12.28 22:05:00 -
[10] - Quote
They have their advantages. The damage isn't "minimal", its just not exactly raw facemelting doom. Tristan doesn't have any damage bonuses, and it was designed to be on par with the Merlin, Punisher, etc as the "tough to kill fighting frigate" alongside the "this is my boomstick" DPS frigates (Tormentor, Incursus, Kestrel) and the "T1 interceptor" frigates (Atron, Condor, Executioner). The tactics are going to be pretty alien from what most people are used to, but that's not always a bad thing. |
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Super Chair
Project Cerberus Caldari State Capturing
384
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Posted - 2012.12.28 23:26:00 -
[11] - Quote
chatgris wrote:DroneKing Aideron wrote:So from what I am hearing Drones are a waste of time or offer minimal DPS?
So basically I would do better to master blasters and maybe try drones on the side but not solely focus on just them as my main DPS otherwise I will get dropped. Blasters still suck - the larger your ship the more they suck. They have terrible range, and fixed damage types. Pvping in a gallente frig for example, you'll come across two races of t2 frigs (caldari and gallente) that you do very little damage to due to native resists. If you like the concept of fighting with high dps at close range, I suggest autocannons - selectable damage type, decent falloff, capless guns. If you prefer kiting, missile boats are great - especially with the recent buffs they even have bonus'd selectable damage types (caracal and kestrel) and can't be td'd etc. Against, capless so getting neuted isn't an issue. Finally, if you want your guns to use cap - lasers. Scorch gives you amazing range and damage across a variety of ships. But at least if you are going to fly a ship that is vulnerable to neuts, get that awesome close range damage projection with scorch. Does have a fixed damage type, but at least one one races of t2 frigs are a PITA instead of two.
Blasters are actually quite good. The new moa can kill a 1600 plated rupture that has a medium neut fit before the moa is neuted out (the new moa has no utility highslot for a nos, and i don't roll with cap boosters on mine). A merlin can kill some destroyers 1v1 or at the very least gives the destroyer a run for its money. Merlin also has a good enough capacitor that a single small neut will not cap you out before you kill your target in frig 1v1's. Caldari shield blaster boats are everything a blasterboat should be, high dps due to lowslots becoming available for mag stabs and tracking enhancers, and enough midslots to fit tackle and a good shield tank with a prop mod. You also have the option of getting some obscene tanks by sacrificing a web for an invul on the moa.
Project Cerberus is recruiting for the US Timezone, click here |
Deen Wispa
Justified Chaos
418
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Posted - 2012.12.28 23:56:00 -
[12] - Quote
DroneKing Aideron wrote:So from what I am hearing Drones are a waste of time or offer minimal DPS?
So basically I would do better to master blasters and maybe try drones on the side but not solely focus on just them as my main DPS otherwise I will get dropped.
Drone boats are fine. Tristan is a very competitive ship and stands a chance against any other t1 frig. I fly in Vexors more than Thoraxes and have taken multiple 3v1 engagements and lived to tell about it. Everybody and their mom flies a TD so drone boats are an excellent counter.
And if you're in FW, drone boats are excellent counters to defensive plexers who won't fight you but comes in a griffin or Blackbird thinking they can perma jam you to death and force you to leave. York Craft *cough* :) Gallente FW Blog http://iamsheriff.com/blog Recruitment Status: On C'est La Eve :) |
Reuqh Dew
The Forsworn Protectorate Imperial Protectorate
31
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Posted - 2012.12.29 15:13:00 -
[13] - Quote
As mentioned before, drones have some drawbacks. Biggest one is that they can be popped pretty fast, so you have to keep an eye on their HP and call in the drones that are taking damage. This works really well in scram range.
The big advantage in my opinion is that you can focus more on tank, and still have great damage. My dual rep Vexor for example has all it's lows and rigs dedicated to tanking, and it still does 500+ paper dps with mixed drones. |
Zarnak Wulf
In Exile.
855
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Posted - 2012.12.29 16:33:00 -
[14] - Quote
The Gallente Drone boats are the best plex ships in my eyes right now. The Tristan, Algos, and Vexor. My fits are all similar
High: Smallest tier Rail guns Nuet if utility high available Mid: AB Scram Web or web x 2 Low: Largest armor buffer you can fit Rigs: Armor rigs
The Tristan or Algos can control range and survive long enough to get to their happy spot. AC Thrasher? Hold them at 7km while your rails and drones kill them. Incursus? hold them at 6km and apply the nuet. My Tristan has killed in 1v1Dramiels, DD, thrashers, hookbills, brawler slicers, comets, Firetails, catalyst, dual repped incursus, and just about any other T1 frigate out there.
The Vexor is an SFI killer. A dual prop SFI will not escape an AB Vexor with dual webs. Nor will a 460m isk cynabal with a 100mn AB and federation web. |
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings Damu'Khonde
549
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Posted - 2012.12.29 16:41:00 -
[15] - Quote
Quote:- It's hard for them to apply full damage to a fast target. Even though the drone is faster they land, shoot, get out of range, MWD on again etc - Drones die very easily, leaving you without dps - It's slow to get drones out of the bay and onto a target - this is especially important in frigate pvp, where often the first guy to heat his guns and shoot wins in close matches. The 5 seconds to get your drones out of the bay and onto the target is easily the margin that leads to defeat - It's hard to get good drones to fight t2 gallente/caldari ships. The shield tanked ones have low EM, and EM drones are terrible. - There are only a handful of ships that can be considered pure droneboats - most still significantly rely on a weapon system as well to apply dps. - In pve, I hear that drones get murdered with the new AI changes (not sure, don't pve)
-Any target that's fast enough to avoid drone DPS is also fast enough to avoid gun/missile DPS. -Drones can be killed rather decently by frigates...but ships that rely on drones for primary DPS get hitpoint bonuses and enough space for backup flights. -You can pull out your drones before you even lock the target. -And most non-frigate missile/gunboats rely on drones just as droneboats also use other weapon systems. |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
301
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Posted - 2012.12.29 17:54:00 -
[16] - Quote
I am a drone who.re from way back. Tbh, about all I use are, Hob II's Ogre II's ECM Drones
Hobs are a great all around light drone. Great for PvE or PvP.
Ogre's are just plain nasty, but really only common in BS fleets. A 10 man BS fleet dropping 50 Ogre II's though... They add over 310 DPS to anything I load them in.
ECM Drones! Love them. They change fights and save ships. I use them a lot!
That said: I don't depend on my drones as my primary *anything*. I use them like a secondary fitting, or secondary DPS platform. Which is, what they are, imo. |
Maire Gheren
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
45
|
Posted - 2012.12.30 03:07:00 -
[17] - Quote
RavenPaine wrote:That said: I don't depend on my drones as my primary *anything*. I use them like a secondary fitting, or secondary DPS platform. Which is, what they are, imo. Tristan has two turrets, the bonus for which is not damage, and bandwidth for five light drones with three spares. At that point, drones are kind've your primary damage source. |
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
301
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Posted - 2012.12.30 06:12:00 -
[18] - Quote
Maire Gheren wrote:RavenPaine wrote:That said: I don't depend on my drones as my primary *anything*. I use them like a secondary fitting, or secondary DPS platform. Which is, what they are, imo. Tristan has two turrets, the bonus for which is not damage, and bandwidth for five light drones with three spares. At that point, drones are kind've your primary damage source.
I admit, I have very little experience with Frigate class ships. So this is something I did not know. Good point, and good to know in case I ever try them. |
Aurelius Valentius
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
318
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Posted - 2013.01.02 19:40:00 -
[19] - Quote
A jack-of-all-drones, master of none, yet often times better than a Master of dr-One-s... ok ok... fine, yea I said it, you want to make something out of it? go ahead are you feeling luck?... *draws his 4000mm Mining Lazor*... Make my day.
Drone and Fighters, while being useful aren't all that, they are augmentation to ships (well most) rather than main stay... for instance your mining skills and drones (mine are max) will never equal a 3rd lazor on you ship, or 4th... they do add a nice bit, but solo mining in an ORCA with 5 drones, isn't done for lack of skills, it's because it doesn't bloody work mate... it's a slow show.
I know what has hit you, Gallente Fevor... the idea that your ship can sit out there, far from danger, (like Darth Vader on his big space ship) and command the hoards of drones [or you work for homeland security, and run preditors] while they unleash death and release the ISK of the universe to you waiting but remote hands... tis a dream we all had... but then it comes to pass.
... they don't work that way, no more than when/if you undo a bra and expect beer to be on tap, they don't work that way... not for the lack of trying or possible genetic manipulation... but for now, today, it's a bust... har har.
Go back to your simple ways of EVE and guns, and ships and missiles and then drones as a side... you will be happier, we will all laugh less, EVE shall be again what it is supposed to be... Look at all the Macks in local...impressive...very impressive...I see you have fashioned a new exhumer...much like you father's...your skills as a miner are now complete...indeed you are powerful as CCP Devs have foreseen. -á318 people are totally baffled. |
Maire Gheren
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
67
|
Posted - 2013.01.02 20:25:00 -
[20] - Quote
It's not necessarily that. There are plenty of people who like drones who accept that they are going to be doing the other Gallente thing of jumping into a ridiculous brawl face first while they use them. They just like drones. Maybe a Griffin touched them inappropriately once. Its valid. There's a thread or two going right now about how effective a Tristan is to fight with. |
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LordSpock
Vherokior Death Squad
44
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Posted - 2013.01.03 10:14:00 -
[21] - Quote
I always thought the pilgrim is a very decent ship in PvP. Three guesses what it relies on |
GenesisMike
Tri-gun C0NVICTED
53
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Posted - 2013.01.04 04:37:00 -
[22] - Quote
Gila........ |
Zoe Panala
Blobcats
86
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Posted - 2013.01.04 05:13:00 -
[23] - Quote
LordSpock wrote:I always thought the pilgrim is a very decent ship in PvP. Three guesses what it relies on
1 Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator? 2 Medium Energy Neutralizer II? 3 Covert Ops Cloaking Device II?
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LordSpock
Vherokior Death Squad
45
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Posted - 2013.01.04 10:05:00 -
[24] - Quote
Zoe Panala wrote:LordSpock wrote:I always thought the pilgrim is a very decent ship in PvP. Three guesses what it relies on 1 Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator? 2 Medium Energy Neutralizer II? 3 Covert Ops Cloaking Device II?
Yeah.....try killing a ship with those solo..... |
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