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Atamos
High Aces Persona Non Gratis
1
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Posted - 2012.10.11 00:58:00 -
[1] - Quote
Over the past few weeks i've been thinking along with CCP's idea for Nerfing T3 Cruisers.
An idea i was thinking along with some friends is The T3 Cloaks.
The current system is where they can fit covert ops cloak and warp cloaked and if in null sec they have a nullifer and covert ops cloak.
Possibly a new idea is that the T3 should have a bonus like the black ops ships,
Example is a black ops has the following bonus Multiplies the cloaked velocity by 125% per level.
Maybe the T3 should have a similar bonus that goes on the covert Subsyetem of the ship But they would be able to use covert jump portals still.
I personally would think it would balance the T3s a bit. |
Astroniomix
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
264
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Posted - 2012.10.11 03:55:00 -
[2] - Quote
What part of the T3 do you want to "fix" with this idea.
Because atm cloaky T3s feel pretty balanced.
Most of them can get decent tanks but get pretty poor dps (except certian proteus setups) and recon cruisers still outperform t3s in their primary specialization. |
King Rothgar
Black Watch Guard Gl0rious Bastards
314
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Posted - 2012.10.11 05:28:00 -
[3] - Quote
I think the t3's are well balanced with other classes overall. They are inferior to the recons for the EW support role and inferior to logi at any range beyond 6-7km. The only thing they genuinely beat are HAC's but then again they also cost 3x as much so one would expect that. And it isn't as one sided as some might claim, there are situations where a HAC is indeed superior.
All that said, the t3's are heavily restricted in what they can do due to poorly thought out subsystems. For the legion, the energy neut subsystem is completely useless due to poor slot layout. The covert and drone subsystems are equally useless due to poor bonuses. On the proteus, if you don't have the scrambler range bonus subsystem, you are fail. So out of all the electronic subsystems, only one actually makes any sense. As for the tengu, anyone ever seen a blaster, rail or ECM tengu? I haven't.
I think your real complaint is the interdiction nullifier + covert ops cloak. I agree it's a bit overpowered. I'm not sure what to do about it but deleting those two subsystems from the game isn't a good option. Perhaps more severe penalties on the interdiction nullifier subsystem. The Troll is trolling. |
Roime
Shiva Furnace Dead On Arrival Alliance
1326
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Posted - 2012.10.11 06:04:00 -
[4] - Quote
How to rebalance T3s:
- buff HAC EHP and speed, maybe dps in some cases. - buff fleet command ships that are not Damnations - command link bonus: 3% -> 1.5% - give active gang links a signature radius bloom - fix Tengu powergrid
Gallente - the choice of the interstellar gentleman |
Monikis
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.10.11 06:17:00 -
[5] - Quote
King Rothgar wrote:As for the tengu, anyone ever seen a blaster, rail or ECM tengu? I haven't.
I think your real complaint is the interdiction nullifier + covert ops cloak. I agree it's a bit overpowered. I'm not sure what to do about it but deleting those two subsystems from the game isn't a good option. Perhaps more severe penalties on the interdiction nullifier subsystem.
Cloaky T3s have horrible DPS. A lot of frigates get more DPS than a cloaky T3. The reason t3s are OP is their huge tanks and small sigs. As for Tengus, ECMgus are fairly common in armour fleets (at least in wormholes), and I have seen t3s used as logi as well. |
Roime
Shiva Furnace Dead On Arrival Alliance
1326
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Posted - 2012.10.11 07:51:00 -
[6] - Quote
Monikis wrote: Cloaky T3s have horrible DPS. A lot of frigates get more DPS than a cloaky T3. The reason t3s are OP is their huge tanks and small sigs. As for Tengus, ECMgus are fairly common in armour fleets (at least in wormholes), and I have seen t3s used as logi as well.
There aren't any frigs that do more damage than a cloaky Proteus, only a few cruisers reach the same levels and even some BCs do less.
Which is probably the main reason it's considered the cloaky T3.
ECMgus are mainly in fleets because the pilots can't fly armor T3s, they are usable but a Falcon is still better at pure jamming, like all the recons are better at reconing than T3s.
Logi T3s don't have a range bonus like real logis, which limits their viability a lot. And this is fine imo, T2s should be better at their specialized roles.
Gallente - the choice of the interstellar gentleman |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
444
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Posted - 2012.10.11 12:41:00 -
[7] - Quote
cloaky + interdiction nullifier is OP. They allow practically safe transports across 0.0. T3 should be able to fit either covert or interdiction nullifier, not both. |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc Mordus Angels
621
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Posted - 2012.10.11 15:33:00 -
[8] - Quote
If you want to reduce the effectiveness of the nullifier, it does need a balance.
The interdiction bubble is one of the game absolutes right now, and the nullifier on T3s is about the only thing it can't own.
Have all interdiction fields suffer a 5% failure rate, where ships have a chance of completely ignoring it. (For the T1 fields, make it 10% or more)
In exchange, the nullifier would have a 5% fail rate against T2 bubbles (Tech 1 is not seriously trying, don't forget this is a tech 3 ship)
This clearly favors the bubble user, but it errors in the favor of explosions. Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata) Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
444
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Posted - 2012.10.11 16:26:00 -
[9] - Quote
Nikk Narrel wrote:The interdiction bubble is one of the game absolutes right now, and the nullifier on T3s is about the only thing it can't own.
what does that mean? Use T3 if you want to safely bring your stuff from A to B. T3 exclusive position in regard of bubbles doesnt make them balanced in any way. |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc Mordus Angels
621
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Posted - 2012.10.11 16:43:00 -
[10] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:Nikk Narrel wrote:The interdiction bubble is one of the game absolutes right now, and the nullifier on T3s is about the only thing it can't own. what does that mean? Use T3 if you want to safely bring your stuff from A to B. T3 exclusive position in regard of bubbles doesnt make them balanced in any way. I think the bubbles being an absolute with no other counter is what inspired the nullifier in the first place.
Why should a bubble be this perfect with no counter module? Even a point is balanced by a stab. (Webifiers are their own worst enemy, making enemies go to warp)
That said, the T3 nullified with a cloak is nearly a pinata waiting to be popped if anything goes wrong. It is betting everything on stealth. Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata) Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
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Astroniomix
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
265
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Posted - 2012.10.11 16:44:00 -
[11] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:cloaky + interdiction nullifier is OP. They allow practically safe transports across 0.0. T3 should be able to fit either covert or interdiction nullifier, not both. What about jump freighters/black ops/blockade runners with a mwd and a cloak fitted/anything fast?
Saying something is op simply because it can "move freely" is a bit silly. Sure it can move about easily, but it isn't going to do a whole lot once it gets there. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
444
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Posted - 2012.10.11 16:52:00 -
[12] - Quote
Astroniomix wrote: What about jump freighters/black ops/blockade runners with a mwd and a cloak fitted/anything fast?
jump freighters? How are they relevant for T3 discussion? They dont move through gates/space but jump instead like any other ship with jump drive - as long there are NO BUBBLES on them! T3 dont give a f*ck, click warp, cloak -> done. Like everything else too, if bubble on ship -> no warp.
Astroniomix wrote:Saying something is op simply because it can "move freely" is a bit silly. Sure it can move about easily, but it isn't going to do a whole lot once it gets there. its not silly, there shouldnt be a way to travel nearly uncatchable. If you want this degree of safety use some ship with jump drive. |
Jin alPatar
Entertainment 7wenty
4
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Posted - 2012.10.12 21:54:00 -
[13] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote: its not silly, there shouldnt be a way to travel nearly uncatchable. If you want this degree of safety use some ship with jump drive.
Your argument is based on there not being any absolutes. But if you 'fix' the nullifiers you 'break' the bubbles.
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Jessy Berbers
Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Disturbed Acquaintance
27
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Posted - 2012.10.12 22:20:00 -
[14] - Quote
Havent you nullsec zealots not done enough to EVE yet? |
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