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Let's talk about the FONT

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Rhaegor Stormborn BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 78	Posted - 2011.10.01 01:48:00 - [31] - Quote Terrible.
Rhaegor Stormborn BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 78	Posted - 2011.10.01 01:50:00 - [32] - Quote CCP Guard wrote: There's a special test server feedback thread on the font right here in case you are interested :) We are giving you feedback. We give it to you all the time. But in true CCP fashion you will completely ignore our feedback and go forward with your terrible new font as you are a fearless bunch.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries 179	Posted - 2011.10.01 02:04:00 - [33] - Quote Alice Katsuko wrote: Ideally, the end-user should be able to select the font size. Not many games provide this ability, however. Even if we do not receive the option to change font size in the UI itself, the new font is a huge improvement over the old for most purposes, if only because it is now possible to distinguish the the characters 0O8B6&. I play EVE on a fairly low resolution screen, and still have trouble distinguishing those characters in the existing font. Yes this is a thing which most players probably would sign. Alice Katsuko wrote: The current font only really works well in item description boxes. So even if the font is released as is, it will still be a good thing. Not gonna agree because there are some issues with the font width and spacing. Many windows should have narrow version of current new font or totally different font. Or then there should be option to choose smaller font to all windows or at least option to stick with old font. There is limited amount of space in the screen and if many windows become much wider than they are now, that space tends to run out. The issue is worst on 4:3 lcd screens, but remains on widescreens also. Spacing issues come clear when you try to read wallet or market. Numbers should have pretty much same width or it becomes rather hard to tell which row is about millions and which row is about billions. Even the difference wouldn't be really bad, I bet people make much more accidental "errors" when dealing with amounts which aren't written with fixed width numbers. Alice Katsuko wrote: From what I recall, CCP has had issues in the past where introducing scaling font size would break overview tabs and such. I assume that the UI will be adjusted to accommodate the new font. Perhaps, but if it means bigger windows and less screen space - it doens't really solve the problem this new font is about to create. Alice Katsuko wrote: Keep in mind that the new font is a work in progress. It has been released to the test server precisely so that players can provide feedback. Yep... I keep my hopes up but you know what they say about sisi... feedback... and release... Forum fix for firefox and chrome Get working images and colored text Classic forum style 2.25final
Rhaegor Stormborn BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 78	Posted - 2011.10.01 04:44:00 - [34] - Quote Grey Stormshadow wrote: [Yep... I keep my hopes up but you know what they say about sisi... feedback... and release... Never any changes from Sisi to release. Ever. Despite many bug reports and negative feedback.
Phoebus Raszamar Valkyria Epsilon 1	Posted - 2011.10.01 04:52:00 - [35] - Quote Psychophantic wrote: I hope it's optional. I hope so. One thing that intimidates me is not being able to understand what I should be able to understand - or at least, people telling me what I can or cannot understand. Somebody save me.
Psychophantic 43	Posted - 2011.10.01 05:00:00 - [36] - Quote Phoebus Raszamar wrote: Psychophantic wrote: I hope it's optional. I hope so. Well they made CQ optional and it's something you don't even have to use. This ugly font will be staring me in the face every single day, making me resize overview, fleet, watchlist, drone and chat windows just to incorporate it. Can only hope.
Phoebus Raszamar Valkyria Epsilon 1	Posted - 2011.10.01 05:06:00 - [37] - Quote Psychophantic wrote: Well they made CQ optional and it's something you don't even have to use. This ugly font will be staring me in the face every single day, making me resize overview, fleet, watchlist, drone and chat windows just to incorporate it. Can only hope. Lol, I feel like such a useless contributor, but you're stating my thoughts exactly. Hello, my perfectionist twin. One thing that intimidates me is not being able to understand what I should be able to understand - or at least, people telling me what I can or cannot understand. Somebody save me.
J Kunjeh 78	Posted - 2011.10.01 05:09:00 - [38] - Quote Grey Stormshadow wrote: I'll just leave this thread here as it will be subject to some discussion when SiSi content hits the "fan"... ...so if you would like to be active citizen and leave your opinion before that major ***-storm... feel free to :) So, you do realize that SiSi is a TEST environment right? And that CCP does in fact accept feedback so they can, you know, fix stuff before it goes to TQ? Admittedly, they have a spotty record of paying attention to that kind of feedback, but I'm willing to bet your chances are good if you go through the proper steps and channels of communication. Just sayin'... "The world as we know it came about through an anomaly (anomou)"* (The Gospel of Philip, 1-5)-a
BLACK-STAR 104	Posted - 2011.10.01 05:28:00 - [39] - Quote CCP confuses feedback with critique and end up going through with it anyway despite what playerbase says. CCP has not edited the UI at all over this new font, so different fonts or text sizes isn't going to have an affect on current UI. Like I said, a drop box and make the feature optional would be easier for everyone and ofc it's not asking much, neither hard to do. so this all said and from what I hear from all around, ppl rather keep the current font -- but please make the new font optional if you're truly going forward with it as you will anyway, CCP. [img]http://www.imgbox.de/users/S7AR/star.png[/img]
Rhaegor Stormborn BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 79	Posted - 2011.10.01 05:30:00 - [40] - Quote J Kunjeh wrote: Grey Stormshadow wrote: I'll just leave this thread here as it will be subject to some discussion when SiSi content hits the "fan"... ...so if you would like to be active citizen and leave your opinion before that major **-storm... feel free to :) So, you do realize that SiSi is a TEST environment right? And that CCP does in fact accept feedback so they can, you know, fix stuff before it goes to TQ? Admittedly, they have a spotty record of paying attention to that kind of feedback, but I'm willing to bet your chances are good if you go through the proper steps and channels of communication. Just sayin'... FEARLESS**

Xercodo Xovoni Directorate 75	Posted - 2011.10.01 05:36:00 - [41] - Quote wha!!!! i cant see anything form tinypic :( The Drake is a Lie
Wa'roun Quantum Cats Syndicate 8	Posted - 2011.10.01 06:20:00 - [42] - Quote I have always been amazed that a game that came out in 1998 (and still going strong enough for 13 years) has a better UI and selection of how to move it, change it, and change multiple font types, has a better UI than Eve Online that came out in early 2000s. I suppose CCP has the underlying code to blame (?)...Python was it?
DarkAegix Acetech Systems 56	Posted - 2011.10.01 06:25:00 - [43] - Quote The new font doesn't look as slick or shiny, but I'll deal with it.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries 180	Posted - 2011.10.01 07:47:00 - [44] - Quote J Kunjeh wrote: Grey Stormshadow wrote: I'll just leave this thread here as it will be subject to some discussion when SiSi content hits the "fan"... ...so if you would like to be active citizen and leave your opinion before that major ****-storm... feel free to :) So, you do realize that SiSi is a TEST environment right? And that CCP does in fact accept feedback so they can, you know, fix stuff before it goes to TQ? Admittedly, they have a spotty record of paying attention to that kind of feedback, but I'm willing to bet your chances are good if you go through the proper steps and channels of communication. Just sayin'... Yep... and I've left my feedback to the official sisi font feedback thread also. This topic is here mainly to direct more attention to the issue now when it is still in stage where changes can be made and feedback can be responded. Not everyone using the forums have sisi client installed or read sisi subforums. However they can weight all the pros/cons mentined by other posters and look at the image to get pretty good feeling how their client would look with current font CCP is offering. If people think that the new font is perfect, somewhat perfect, good, nice or awesome - I urge them to go an leave thumbs up to the official sisi thread "Sisi update - New font, ship spinning, new captains quarters etc. " If people think that the new font needs some tweaking or improvements - I urge them to leave note to the official sisi thread "Issues thread for the new font on SiSi " as CCP Guard kindly pointed already. In the end having new font is mostly a good thing and people have been asking it for long time. However it would suck that major patch with 3 CQ's and spinner would end up to mostly negative feedback about issues with font. That is why this topic is up now and here. After reading the stuff around the forum the general feedback about current sisi font is at the moment more positive than negative. However there have been also rather many who feel that there are stuff to improve. This is open communication - works both ways. I'm not here to lynch CCP :) Forum fix for firefox and chrome Get working images and colored text Classic forum style 2.25final
Roime Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 3	Posted - 2011.10.01 09:12:00 - [45] - Quote Designing a font that has the same footprint as the old one, but making it more legible while still having a special sci-fi vibe is certainly not easy. I play on 1900x1200 and the current font size is just fine, I'd prefer the ui chrome to be as small and thin as possible... the current font also looks quite stylish imho, it just has some serious readibility issues due to similar (identical?) glyphs that do need to be solved. ( I think there are different font sizes in this comparison http://i56.tinypic.com/4vn1ms.jpg, in the overview the new font is 12pt, old one 10pt)
Mystic5hadow Red Federation RvB - RED Federation 28	Posted - 2011.10.01 11:06:00 - [46] - Quote I don't like this new font at all, looks almost like a slimmed down Comic Sans to me. I like the current font on TQ, I just wish some of the letters were more easy to differentiate between. I'd hate for what we have now to be replaced with what's on Sisi.
Rhaegor Stormborn BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 79	Posted - 2011.10.01 12:15:00 - [47] - Quote I don't even think anyone asked for a complete font revamp. We asked that we can tell zeros and ohs apart. Add a dot to the middle of the curent zero and call it a day. Why does CCP have reinvent the wheel with everything? Why overdo everything?
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries 184	Posted - 2011.10.01 16:04:00 - [48] - Quote Rhaegor Stormborn wrote: I don't even think anyone asked for a complete font revamp. We asked that we can tell zeros and ohs apart. Add a dot to the middle of the curent zero and call it a day. Why does CCP have reinvent the wheel with everything? Why overdo everything? It is an interesting question to ask. Forum fix for firefox and chrome Get working images and colored text Classic forum style 2.25final
Zey Nadar Aliastra Gallente Federation 7	Posted - 2011.10.01 18:42:00 - [49] - Quote DarkAegix wrote: The new font doesn't look as slick or shiny, but I'll deal with it. But at least its readable.
Alexandra Alt Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 18	Posted - 2011.10.01 18:50:00 - [50] - Quote Grey Stormshadow wrote: 1000 words in photo speak more than 10 words in a forum. Remember to read the red box in left... I'm not using bazooka quite yet and had something nice to say also .) I think this screenshot is amazing feedback, all that can be used to fix the current font and improve it further. I think the new font is good, it will need sometime to get used to it, but that's about it, you just need to get used to it and fix this little quirks and everything will be fine :)

Shahirahh Orgasana University of Caille Gallente Federation 4	Posted - 2011.10.01 19:54:00 - [51] - Quote I like this new font... I've been praying for SOMEthing bigger and more readable than the current one. I don't mind if the UI windows have to be made a little larger to accommodate it. I agree that there are some issues with certain letters (O/Q) being too similar, and spacing of numeric digits, but I can live with that. I still wish CCP would gut the current UI code and rebuild it to allow user-specified fonts, or at the very least, user-specified font sizes, in every window. But I'll take what I can get at this point.
J Kunjeh 78	Posted - 2011.10.01 21:38:00 - [52] - Quote Rhaegor Stormborn wrote: I don't even think anyone asked for a complete font revamp. We asked that we can tell zeros and ohs apart. Add a dot to the middle of the curent zero and call it a day. Why does CCP have reinvent the wheel with everything? Why overdo everything? Actually, many of us have indeed asked for a totally revamped font. It's mostly about it being so damned hard to read, it's too small. The bits you mention are bonuses, to me. "The world as we know it came about through an anomaly (anomou)" (The Gospel of Philip, 1-5)-a
Rhaegor Stormborn BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 82	Posted - 2011.10.02 00:58:00 - [53] - Quote Sounds like some people need glasses, or are playing on 15" laptops. New font is way too large.
DarkAegix Acetech Systems 57	Posted - 2011.10.02 01:01:00 - [54] - Quote Rhaegor Stormborn wrote: Sounds like some people need glasses, or are playing on 15" laptops. New font is way too large. Bingo. I'm surprised by the amount of people who can't read the existing font.
Psychophantic 53	Posted - 2011.10.02 01:46:00 - [55] - Quote Rhaegor Stormborn wrote: Sounds like some people need glasses, or are playing on 15" laptops. New font is way too large. Hi, I play EVE on my 19" laptop at 1920x1200 resolution / Hi, I bought a 21" LCD cause it had a TrueHD sticker on it and I have difficulty seeing the current font. Rather than lower my resolution to a level that's acceptable to me I will petition CCP to create a new font that is larger and easier for me to read. Paypal donation to someone who creates a workaround to use the old font.
o mf g Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 6	Posted - 2011.10.02 01:57:00 - [56] - Quote I WOULD GO WITH TIMES NEW ROMAN edit: edit 2: nevermind
Rhaegor Stormborn BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 82	Posted - 2011.10.02 02:08:00 - [57] - Quote Psychophantic wrote: Paypal donation to someone who creates a workaround to use the old font. Why should anyone have to make a work around? If a player can do it, which I imagine somone will, CCP can, and should. This new font should be optional, as Incarna should have been. Less fearless, more fearful.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries 189	Posted - 2011.10.02 17:27:00 - [58] - Quote Rhaegor Stormborn wrote: Psychophantic wrote: Paypal donation to someone who creates a workaround to use the old font. Why should anyone have to make a work around? If a player can do it, which I imagine somone will, CCP can, and should. This new font should be optional, as Incarna should have been. Less fearless, more fearful. After reading the dev replies in official issues thread it is really hard to believe that there would be anything but some cosmetic changes. Anyways I feel that I've said everything I felt need to say related to this issue and don't want to repeat myself any longer. Time will tell the rest. If rim around my head starts to squeeze too much - I can always go back to wow and shoot trolls with magic missiles.) Forum fix for firefox and chrome Get working images and colored text Classic forum style 2.25final
Aethlyn 40	Posted - 2011.10.02 19:09:00 - [59] - Quote New font needs getting used to it but it's not that bad overall. Don't have any issues reading it, except capitals Q and O which look really almost identical except only 1 or 2 pixels. "Best" solution would most likely be some free TTF selection, but don't expect that happen, especially considering all fonts have to match the UI elements, etc. (as in space), due to many UI parts being unable to be scaled properly without some major rewrites (if at all). Looking for more thoughts? Read my blog or follow me on Twitter.
o mf g Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 7	Posted - 2011.10.02 19:12:00 - [60] - Quote Aethlyn wrote: New font needs getting used to it but it's not that bad overall. Don't have any issues reading it, except capitals Q and O which look really almost identical except only 1 or 2 pixels. "Best" solution would most likely be some free TTF selection, but don't expect that happen, especially considering all fonts have to match the UI elements, etc. (as in space), due to many UI parts being unable to be scaled properly without some major rewrites (if at all). There's a bit of irony in not being able to read a legible font, yet, picking up on the difference between 1 and 2 pixels.


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