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George Wilkes Hill
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Posted - 2011.06.09 02:52:00 -
[1]
Edited by: George Wilkes Hill on 09/06/2011 02:56:51 "...During a presentation, developers from CCP went into some depth explaining EVE's single-shard server structure (which is actually a network of proxy-servers all tied to a supercomputer, collectively known as Tranquility) which serves every EVE player. While EVE and DUST are built on different graphical engines, EVE on CCP's own Carbon engine (which is being used on CCP's other in-the-works MMO, World of Darkness), the back-ends of both games use Carbon, and both back-ends are tied to the same server shard. DUST isn't just "linked" to Tranquility -- it runs on it. Through DUST, the PlayStation Network is directly connected to the massive server shard."
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/117/1173953p1.html
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Xenuria
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:10:00 -
[2]
Originally by: George Wilkes Hill Edited by: George Wilkes Hill on 09/06/2011 02:56:51 "...During a presentation, developers from CCP went into some depth explaining EVE's single-shard server structure (which is actually a network of proxy-servers all tied to a supercomputer, collectively known as Tranquility) which serves every EVE player. While EVE and DUST are built on different graphical engines, EVE on CCP's own Carbon engine (which is being used on CCP's other in-the-works MMO, World of Darkness), the back-ends of both games use Carbon, and both back-ends are tied to the same server shard. DUST isn't just "linked" to Tranquility -- it runs on it. Through DUST, the PlayStation Network is directly connected to the massive server shard."
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/117/1173953p1.html
**** JUST GOT REAL!
inb4 massive **** storm!
Anonymous is going to have a flopping field day with this. PSN tied directly to Tranq... PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF
AHHAHAHAHAHHAHHAA awww man... CCP has bent over and grabbed their ankles and is patiently awaiting forced penetration. "Sorry, Your Sov Options are Unavailable due to a PSN Outage."
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:13:00 -
[3]
So? ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:13:00 -
[4]
FPS games have to be played at sub 80ms ping to be fun.
Speed of light is a constant.
Fail.
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Wa'roun
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:17:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Constantinus Maximus
Speed of light is a constant.
There is a theory that this may not be true, based on measurements over the decades from the first time it was measured to the present.
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Tyreal
Gallente Devouring the Teaboar
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:22:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Wa'roun
Originally by: Constantinus Maximus
Speed of light is a constant.
There is a theory that this may not be true, based on measurements over the decades from the first time it was measured to the present.
[Citation needed]
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Xenuria
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:22:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Xenuria on 09/06/2011 03:26:12 Edited by: Xenuria on 09/06/2011 03:23:27
Originally by: Tippia So?
Ok since you have a history of not understanding things like Vexor Fits or Well anything above a 4th grade level let me explain this to you in a way you will understand.
PSN = A big warehouse with passwords, credit card number and account information inside it. The Doors to this warehouse are not secured (locked) very well and can easily be busted into.
When Dust comes out the "warehouse" will be connected to the EVE Servers. They will be connected by a tunnel. So imagine a Tunnel between two buildings one is easy to get into the other is actually secure.
The security of the EVE "warehouse" dose not matter because there is a "tunnel" connecting the Easy to break into warehouse with the not so easy to break into warehouse.
Due to the 1to1 Shareing between these "warehouses" the Hackers don't even need to break into the more secure warehouse or use the tunnel because all the good stuff is copied to the warehouse with the soggy wooden doors.
Do you understand now?
The more I think about it that might have been still beyond your ability to understand. When I wake up tomorrow I will work on making a picture with lots of colors so you can see what I am talking about. "Sorry, Your Sov Options are Unavailable due to a PSN Outage."
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:28:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Xenuria Ok since you have a history of not understanding things like Vexor Fits or Well anything above a 4th grade level let me explain this to you in a way you will understand.
You mean like having to explain to you why EHP is EHP, and you not understanding how resists work? Yeahà you have never been right about anything whatsoever, nor have you been able to explain anything (because you've not understood what it is you're explaining) and this is no exception.
Quote: PSN = A big warehouse with passwords, credit card number and account information inside it. The Doors to this warehouse are not secured (locked) very well and can easily be busted into.
When Dust comes out the "warehouse" will be connected to the EVE Servers. They will be connected by a tunnel.
Source? And so what? The data on the EVE servers cannot be accessed just because it's connected it PSN.
Quote: The security of the EVE "warehouse" dose not matter because there is a "tunnel" connecting the Easy to break into warehouse with the not so easy to break into warehouse.
Incorrect.
Quote: Due to the 1to1 Shareing between these "warehouses" the Hackers don't even need to break into the more secure warehouse or use the tunnel because all the good stuff is copied to the warehouse with the soggy wooden doors.
One problem with your hypothesis: the sharing you talk about won't happen.
Quote: Do you understand now?
I understand that you know as little about this as about Vexors and EHP. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
HeIIfire11
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:31:00 -
[9]
What's not to know about EHP? Link please that should be a good read!
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Surfin's PlunderBunny
Minmatar The Python Cartel. The Defenders of Pen Island
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:31:00 -
[10]
Soggy wooden doors?
Originally by: Xenuria
I don't need a LICENSE to take a photoshooped image and lay it on top of the game client and make pretend my character is naked.
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Xenuria
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:33:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Xenuria Ok since you have a history of not understanding things like Vexor Fits or Well anything above a 4th grade level let me explain this to you in a way you will understand.
You mean like having to explain to you why EHP is EHP, and you not understanding how resists work? Yeahà you have never been right about anything whatsoever, nor have you been able to explain anything (because you've not understood what it is you're explaining) and this is no exception.
Quote: PSN = A big warehouse with passwords, credit card number and account information inside it. The Doors to this warehouse are not secured (locked) very well and can easily be busted into.
When Dust comes out the "warehouse" will be connected to the EVE Servers. They will be connected by a tunnel.
Source? And so what? The data on the EVE servers cannot be accessed just because it's connected it PSN.
Quote: The security of the EVE "warehouse" dose not matter because there is a "tunnel" connecting the Easy to break into warehouse with the not so easy to break into warehouse.
Incorrect.
Quote: Due to the 1to1 Shareing between these "warehouses" the Hackers don't even need to break into the more secure warehouse or use the tunnel because all the good stuff is copied to the warehouse with the soggy wooden doors.
One problem with your hypothesis: the sharing you talk about won't happen.
Quote: Do you understand now?
I understand that you know as little about this as about Vexors and EHP.
Yeah.. I guess I was right about having to put this in colorful picture form before you would be able to understand it. "Sorry, Your Sov Options are Unavailable due to a PSN Outage."
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Pesky LaRue
Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:37:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Xenuria Edited by: Xenuria on 09/06/2011 03:26:12 Edited by: Xenuria on 09/06/2011 03:23:27
Originally by: Tippia So?
Ok since you have a history of not understanding things like Vexor Fits or Well anything above a 4th grade level let me explain this to you in a way you will understand.
PSN = A big warehouse with passwords, credit card number and account information inside it. The Doors to this warehouse are not secured (locked) very well and can easily be busted into.
When Dust comes out the "warehouse" will be connected to the EVE Servers. They will be connected by a tunnel. So imagine a Tunnel between two buildings one is easy to get into the other is actually secure.
The security of the EVE "warehouse" dose not matter because there is a "tunnel" connecting the Easy to break into warehouse with the not so easy to break into warehouse.
Due to the 1to1 Shareing between these "warehouses" the Hackers don't even need to break into the more secure warehouse or use the tunnel because all the good stuff is copied to the warehouse with the soggy wooden doors.
Do you understand now?
The more I think about it that might have been still beyond your ability to understand. When I wake up tomorrow I will work on making a picture with lots of colors so you can see what I am talking about.
I'm a network security architect with over 15 years experience in the field - can you explain to me (without using analogies about tunnels and the like, no need to dumb it down for me) exactly how you believe the data is at risk? .
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Wa'roun
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:37:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Tyreal
Originally by: Wa'roun
Originally by: Constantinus Maximus
Speed of light is a constant.
There is a theory that this may not be true, based on measurements over the decades from the first time it was measured to the present.
[Citation needed]
Linkage
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Mina Sulva'r
Amarr
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:37:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Mina Sulva''r on 09/06/2011 03:38:10
Originally by: Wa'roun
Originally by: Constantinus Maximus
Speed of light is a constant.
There is a theory that this may not be true, based on measurements over the decades from the first time it was measured to the present.
Yeah, I always figured that if a massive gravity well (a black hole) could trap light so it cant escape, then a even a "relative" small gravity well, of say the Earth, would slow down and bend light. Which had me then thinking that maybe the old light were seeing from the early (farthest away) galaxies are just from our own galaxie(s) that have been twisted and bent so much by the gravity wells its passed thru, that were really seeing our own photons, which is why the universe seems infinite and speeding up (like standing in front of a mirror while holding a mirror in front of you, it goes on theoretically forever).
YOu know, Im sure I watched a show on how photons from the core of the sun takes 30k years to reach the surface, thats not constant. If it was that would make the sun 30k light years across.
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TonyCandthejets
Gallente Aliastra
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:38:00 -
[15]
Originally by: HeIIfire11 What's not to know about EHP? Link please that should be a good read!
This was some time ago. I tried to explain how resists have a direct effect on EHP and tippia wasent going to have any of it. I was a little harsh this was before I knew that tippia was on the spectrum.
Now I just smile and nod and hope I can find a better more easy to understand way of explaining things to her.
She has her good days and her bad days. Sometimes she is completely lucid and coherent and other times not so much. Team Blue |
Borameir
Gallente Aliastra
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:39:00 -
[16]
Security in this depends on how PSN can access CCP servers and CCP's own efforts. I've not been keeping tabs on how CCP's tech works, but it really sounds like a simple interface to access information perhaps no access to change information is necessary. In this case PSN's integration shouldn't cause a big security risk. ______________ In the beginning God created balls, then man played with them. This became known as Sports. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:39:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Tippia on 09/06/2011 03:46:09
Originally by: Xenuria Yeah.. I guess I was right about having to put this in colorful picture form before you would be able to understand it.
Seeing as how you don't understand it yourself ù or, rather, seeing as how you make up your own make-believe world where things happen that don't happen in the real world (again, see that old Vexor) ù you should probably leave that job to someone who actually understands these things, and maybe you'd learn somehting.
And no: TQ is not sharing any data with PSN for the simple reason that PSN has no need for, no use for, and no understanding of that data.
Originally by: HeIIfire11 What's not to know about EHP? Link please that should be a good read!
Have fun. Try not to die laughing at Xenuria's attempts at explaining how EHP has nothing to do with resists, and, confusingly, how EHP that came from resists were somehow "more EHP" than EHP that came from just plain old HP buffer. (S)he even went so far as to claim that less EHP was better than more EHP, if that lesser amount was resist-based. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
George Wilkes Hill
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:40:00 -
[18]
Originally by: George Wilkes Hill Edited by: George Wilkes Hill on 09/06/2011 02:56:51 "...During a presentation, developers from CCP went into some depth explaining EVE's single-shard server structure (which is actually a network of proxy-servers all tied to a supercomputer, collectively known as Tranquility) which serves every EVE player. While EVE and DUST are built on different graphical engines, EVE on CCP's own Carbon engine (which is being used on CCP's other in-the-works MMO, World of Darkness), the back-ends of both games use Carbon, and both back-ends are tied to the same server shard. DUST isn't just "linked" to Tranquility -- it runs on it. Through DUST, the PlayStation Network is directly connected to the massive server shard."
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/117/1173953p1.html
This is what this thread is about not the speed of light.
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Andreus Ixiris
Gallente Mixed Metaphor
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:42:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Xenuria PSN = A big warehouse with passwords, credit card number and account information inside it. The Doors to this warehouse are not secured (locked) very well and can easily be busted into.
When Dust comes out the "warehouse" will be connected to the EVE Servers. They will be connected by a tunnel. So imagine a Tunnel between two buildings one is easy to get into the other is actually secure.
The security of the EVE "warehouse" dose not matter because there is a "tunnel" connecting the Easy to break into warehouse with the not so easy to break into warehouse.
Due to the 1to1 Shareing between these "warehouses" the Hackers don't even need to break into the more secure warehouse or use the tunnel because all the good stuff is copied to the warehouse with the soggy wooden doors.
Do you understand now?
The more I think about it that might have been still beyond your ability to understand. When I wake up tomorrow I will work on making a picture with lots of colors so you can see what I am talking about.
You understand absolutely nothing about how electronic security works. Please stop posting. ----- Andreus Ixiris CEO, Mixed Metaphor
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Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:42:00 -
[20]
Originally by: George Wilkes Hill
Originally by: George Wilkes Hill Edited by: George Wilkes Hill on 09/06/2011 02:56:51 "...During a presentation, developers from CCP went into some depth explaining EVE's single-shard server structure (which is actually a network of proxy-servers all tied to a supercomputer, collectively known as Tranquility) which serves every EVE player. While EVE and DUST are built on different graphical engines, EVE on CCP's own Carbon engine (which is being used on CCP's other in-the-works MMO, World of Darkness), the back-ends of both games use Carbon, and both back-ends are tied to the same server shard. DUST isn't just "linked" to Tranquility -- it runs on it. Through DUST, the PlayStation Network is directly connected to the massive server shard."
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/117/1173953p1.html
This is what this thread is about not the speed of light.
Well it appears that in CCP's world light takes the same time to travel from the US as it does from AU or Russia.
Show me a playable FPS with 250ms+ pings.
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Barkaial Starfinder
Minmatar The Kairos Syndicate Transmission Lost
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:43:00 -
[21]
This thread is based on a distortion of the truth, so I must abstain.
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George Wilkes Hill
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:44:00 -
[22]
Edited by: George Wilkes Hill on 09/06/2011 03:44:29
Originally by: Barkaial Starfinder This thread is based on a distortion of the truth, so I must abstain.
How is it based on a distortion of truth? I simply read this article while trying to find some news about Dust from e3 and I found this on IGN. I don't see how there is any distortion in my original post.
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HeIIfire11
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:46:00 -
[23]
Originally by: TonyCandthejets She has her good days and her bad days. Sometimes she is completely lucid and coherent and other times not so much.
Oh I know all about that Either way it is always entertaining having a discussion with Tippia.
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Xenuria
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:46:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Pesky LaRue
Originally by: Xenuria Edited by: Xenuria on 09/06/2011 03:26:12 Edited by: Xenuria on 09/06/2011 03:23:27
Originally by: Tippia So?
Ok since you have a history of not understanding things like Vexor Fits or Well anything above a 4th grade level let me explain this to you in a way you will understand.
PSN = A big warehouse with passwords, credit card number and account information inside it. The Doors to this warehouse are not secured (locked) very well and can easily be busted into.
When Dust comes out the "warehouse" will be connected to the EVE Servers. They will be connected by a tunnel. So imagine a Tunnel between two buildings one is easy to get into the other is actually secure.
The security of the EVE "warehouse" dose not matter because there is a "tunnel" connecting the Easy to break into warehouse with the not so easy to break into warehouse.
Due to the 1to1 Shareing between these "warehouses" the Hackers don't even need to break into the more secure warehouse or use the tunnel because all the good stuff is copied to the warehouse with the soggy wooden doors.
Do you understand now?
The more I think about it that might have been still beyond your ability to understand. When I wake up tomorrow I will work on making a picture with lots of colors so you can see what I am talking about.
I'm a network security architect with over 15 years experience in the field - can you explain to me (without using analogies about tunnels and the like, no need to dumb it down for me) exactly how you believe the data is at risk?
I am only basing this off of what was linked in the OP. I assumed the information was accurate because it is comming from CCP.
"the back-ends of both games use Carbon, and both back-ends are tied to the same server shard. DUST isn't just "linked" to Tranquility -- it runs on it. Through DUST, the PlayStation Network is directly connected to the massive server shard. "
A direct link especially in terms of an MMO or any other service that depends on synchronization of data to function, usually implies a 1to1 shearing of information.
They could do it a number of ways.
They could keep all the important data on the tranq server and only offer it up to the PSN when it is requested/needed for gameplay or service functionality. The data would only be temporarily stored on the PSN. This methods although safer is very impractical as a networking person I am sure you can imagine what all those information sharing requests from thousands of players would do to the already easily crashed tranq server.
What they will probably end up doing for the sake of avoiding the above listed shortfalls is Synchronize both services/servers with all the needed information. This means information like EVE online Authentication data would have a permanent home on the PSN Infrastructure. I do not know what your backround is but from what I have experienced in my line of work that is typically how you would go about merging Infrastructures. Having a 1to1 sharing is the ONLY way they can have seamless integration of things like Chat channels and transactions without latency.
"Sorry, Your Sov Options are Unavailable due to a PSN Outage."
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Barkaial Starfinder
Minmatar The Kairos Syndicate Transmission Lost
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:47:00 -
[25]
Originally by: George Wilkes Hill Edited by: George Wilkes Hill on 09/06/2011 03:44:29
Originally by: Barkaial Starfinder This thread is based on a distortion of the truth, so I must abstain.
How is it based on a distortion of truth? I simply read this article while trying to find some news about Dust from e3 and I found this on IGN. I don't see how there is any distortion in my original post.
The "news" are distorted, not talking about your post.
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Quality Poaster SEEEEE
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:48:00 -
[26]
Posting in yet-another Xenuria responding to Xenuria thread.
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Pesky LaRue
Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:49:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Xenuria
Originally by: Pesky LaRue
Originally by: Xenuria Edited by: Xenuria on 09/06/2011 03:26:12 Edited by: Xenuria on 09/06/2011 03:23:27
Originally by: Tippia So?
Ok since you have a history of not understanding things like Vexor Fits or Well anything above a 4th grade level let me explain this to you in a way you will understand.
PSN = A big warehouse with passwords, credit card number and account information inside it. The Doors to this warehouse are not secured (locked) very well and can easily be busted into.
When Dust comes out the "warehouse" will be connected to the EVE Servers. They will be connected by a tunnel. So imagine a Tunnel between two buildings one is easy to get into the other is actually secure.
The security of the EVE "warehouse" dose not matter because there is a "tunnel" connecting the Easy to break into warehouse with the not so easy to break into warehouse.
Due to the 1to1 Shareing between these "warehouses" the Hackers don't even need to break into the more secure warehouse or use the tunnel because all the good stuff is copied to the warehouse with the soggy wooden doors.
Do you understand now?
The more I think about it that might have been still beyond your ability to understand. When I wake up tomorrow I will work on making a picture with lots of colors so you can see what I am talking about.
I'm a network security architect with over 15 years experience in the field - can you explain to me (without using analogies about tunnels and the like, no need to dumb it down for me) exactly how you believe the data is at risk?
I am only basing this off of what was linked in the OP. I assumed the information was accurate because it is comming from CCP.
"the back-ends of both games use Carbon, and both back-ends are tied to the same server shard. DUST isn't just "linked" to Tranquility -- it runs on it. Through DUST, the PlayStation Network is directly connected to the massive server shard. "
A direct link especially in terms of an MMO or any other service that depends on synchronization of data to function, usually implies a 1to1 shearing of information.
They could do it a number of ways.
They could keep all the important data on the tranq server and only offer it up to the PSN when it is requested/needed for gameplay or service functionality. The data would only be temporarily stored on the PSN. This methods although safer is very impractical as a networking person I am sure you can imagine what all those information sharing requests from thousands of players would do to the already easily crashed tranq server.
What they will probably end up doing for the sake of avoiding the above listed shortfalls is Synchronize both services/servers with all the needed information. This means information like EVE online Authentication data would have a permanent home on the PSN Infrastructure. I do not know what your backround is but from what I have experienced in my line of work that is typically how you would go about merging Infrastructures. Having a 1to1 sharing is the ONLY way they can have seamless integration of things like Chat channels and transactions without latency.
so, to paraphrase one of the Devs from a few weeks back - "that's a lot of words to say you don't understand what's going on and are just over-reacting?"
Thanks for clearing that up. .
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George Wilkes Hill
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:49:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Barkaial Starfinder
Originally by: George Wilkes Hill Edited by: George Wilkes Hill on 09/06/2011 03:44:29
Originally by: Barkaial Starfinder This thread is based on a distortion of the truth, so I must abstain.
How is it based on a distortion of truth? I simply read this article while trying to find some news about Dust from e3 and I found this on IGN. I don't see how there is any distortion in my original post.
The "news" are distorted, not talking about your post.
All of that information came directly from CCP as stated in the article. Maybe you just perceive distortion when there is none. And if there is it is not apparent in this article as that information was given from CCP themselves.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:50:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Xenuria I am only basing this off of what was linked in the OP.
You mean that quote that didn't actually say anything about data being shared?
Quote: A direct link especially in terms of an MMO or any other service that depends on synchronization of data to function, usually implies a 1to1 shearing of information.
No, it does not. You're overinterpreting a claim that isn't there, made by a journalist that doesn't actually know much about either of the two networks. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Pesky LaRue
Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel
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Posted - 2011.06.09 03:51:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Xenuria I am only basing this off of what was linked in the OP.
You mean that quote that didn't actually say anything about data being shared?
Quote: A direct link especially in terms of an MMO or any other service that depends on synchronization of data to function, usually implies a 1to1 shearing of information.
No, it does not. You're overinterpreting a claim that isn't there, made by a journalist that doesn't actually know much about either of the two networks.
anytime an explanation or justification includes phrasing like "usually implies", you know it's shaky. .
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