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The Maelstrom and Abaddon Look Amazing, But are They?

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Darth 'Revan	Posted - 2011.05.10 02:42:00 - [1] Alright first off, a disclaimer: I am a nub. I have maybe only 3mil sp, and realize I should just focus on flying my Hurricane. Which, I will. However, I am curious about a few BSs. I was wondering what any of you could tell me about The Maelstrom and Abaddon. And the Typhoon and Armageddon. Currently I fly a Hurricane, and have had a Geddon sitting in my hangar for awhile now. So basically: 1) From what I understand the Abaddon and Maelstrom are not very good PvP ships. Is this true? Under what circumstances is this not true? 2) Can you recommend and explain some good fits for them if they are good at PvP (at least under certain circumstances)? 3) As I understand it both the Typhoon and Armageddon are quite versatile BSs. What are some good fits you can recommend? 4) When and where (if ever) do any of these ships shine?
Patty Patrick Patterson	Posted - 2011.05.10 02:54:00 - [2] -1/10
Centus Commander	Posted - 2011.05.10 03:07:00 - [3] Originally by: Patty Patrick Patterson -1/10 -10/100 Now to OP, Maelstrom and Abby can be very good pvp ships, same with Geddon and 'Phoon
Darth 'Revan	Posted - 2011.05.10 03:10:00 - [4] Originally by: Patty Patrick Patterson -1/10 -1/10? How about some actual help there huh buddy?
Patty Patrick Patterson	Posted - 2011.05.10 03:36:00 - [5] You cannot get troll.
Jack Abramof	Posted - 2011.05.10 06:43:00 - [6] Originally by: Patty Patrick Patterson You cannot get troll. you 're 10 years old or something ? what about going back to WoW forums, plenty of people like you there. Forums are made to help people, if you have nothing constructive to say, you can stfu. Thank you.
souldrinkers	Posted - 2011.05.10 08:16:00 - [7] meal and abaddon are good for fleet pvp. Bs are just too slow for solo pvp most of the time and will get ecmed to death by cruiser fleets. also the cost of losing a fitted bs is rather high (200mill+) they both run lvl 4 mission well with proper support skills, about 5mill i think is what you should be looking at unless you have skilled for them specifically as for fits, in large scale pvp its eather RR & EHP or sniper/pos bashing for them both. all of the above is a general statement, there are fits that let you do all sorts of strange things with them but they are eather skill intensive of expensive.
Duchess Starbuckington	Posted - 2011.05.10 08:46:00 - [8] Quote: 1) From what I understand the Abaddon and Maelstrom are not very good PvP ships. Is this true? Under what circumstances is this not true? If this isn't a troll, I'd really love to know where you heard this rubbish. _________________________________ ROCKET STATUS: FIX IN PROGRESS...
Vile Coyote	Posted - 2011.05.10 10:01:00 - [9] Originally by: Jack Abramof Originally by: Patty Patrick Patterson You cannot get troll. you 're 10 years old or something ? what about going back to WoW forums, plenty of people like you there. Forums are made to help people, if you have nothing constructive to say, you can stfu. Thank you. And the constructive part of your post is... ? Oh I get it. Mentionning Wow. Constructive troll. Or not. To the OP, your questions are a bit vague. Looks like you're browsing for a ship that looks good, then looking at its characteristic. Try the other way around : define what you need and find the best ship for it. Also with 3M SP just forget about the Typhoon, and be aware that any BS requires solid support skills to work.
Headerman Minmatar Element 115. Raiden.	Posted - 2011.05.10 11:13:00 - [10] Edited by: Headerman on 10/05/2011 11:16:00 Originally by: Darth 'Revan Alright first off, a disclaimer: I am a nub. I have maybe only 3mil sp, and realize I should just focus on flying my Hurricane. Which, I will. However, I am curious about a few BSs. I was wondering what any of you could tell me about The Maelstrom and Abaddon. And the Typhoon and Armageddon. Currently I fly a Hurricane, and have had a Geddon sitting in my hangar for awhile now. So basically: 1) From what I understand the Abaddon and Maelstrom are not very good PvP ships. Is this true? Under what circumstances is this not true? 2) Can you recommend and explain some good fits for them if they are good at PvP (at least under certain circumstances)? 3) As I understand it both the Typhoon and Armageddon are quite versatile BSs. What are some good fits you can recommend? 4) When and where (if ever) do any of these ships shine? Ok i will bite, cause i like typing.... The Abaddon and Maelstrom are both pretty generic high end BSs (same with the Hyperion and Rokh). They are so generalised that they can be good in just about any PVE situation. In PVP though they are best when in a fleet of others like them (as in all have the same/very similar fits). Collective DPS/Alpha can be amazingly high. A buffer tanked Tier 3 BS (Mael) is great when it has a full rack of T2 1400 artillery, shield buffer tanked and coupled with many other such Maelstroms. Same goes for the Abaddon. With their drone bays as well, any small ship will have a hard time getting into them, especially if the abaddon/Mael fleet has alot of support from smaller ships. The Phoon is blessed with a nice PG and CPU as well as some amazing DPS bonuses. Torps/ACs or both were made for the phoon, as were heavy neuts, shield tanking or armour tanking. The Phoon is so versatile (including its huge drone bay), so fast (fastest T1 non faction BS there is) and so versatile, there is no 'standard fit' for it. Add either shield or armour tank, some damage mods, and some guns/torps and some neuts and u are good to go. Not sure about the geddon, except that large pulse lasers work great on it. The phoon shines in small gang PVP warfare, where high DPS is needed. Armour tank it, fit 5 x 800mm ACs, 3 heavy neuts, some damage mods, a web, a warp disrupter, MWD and a cap booster and you would own just about any small numbered fleet/solo pilot coming through the gate. Also, a typical Maelstrom fleet fit is: [Maelstrom, New Setup 1] Gyrostabilizer II Gyrostabilizer II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Power Diagnostic System II Large Shield Extender II Photon Scattering Field II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Quad LiF Fueled I Booster Rockets Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, EMP L 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, EMP L 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, EMP L 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, EMP L 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, EMP L 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, EMP L 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, EMP L 1400mm Howitzer Artillery II, EMP L Large Core Defence Field Extender I Large Core Defence Field Extender I Large Core Defence Field Extender I And lots of drones to suit. Also, if you decide to get a Maelstrom for PVE once you get to some L4's (make sure you train up alot of engineering skills first, for nice shields and cap capacity and recharge (so important)), it will have to be active tanked, as its natural active tank bonus and 6 mids make for an amazingly good tanking ability, easily enough for any L4 once you fine tune it.

Azhpol Gallente Casa Del Wombat	Posted - 2011.05.10 11:23:00 - [11] I just have to ask... How is it possible for a char with only 3mil SP to fly both amarr and minmatar battlecruisers? I call troll, but a decent one. ----------------------------------------------- I don't post on an alt, I post on my forum main!
8uggsy	Posted - 2011.05.10 11:26:00 - [12] As the guy above me tried to explain to you, depends on what you need it. If you want Minnie<-> Ammar crosstraining then Typhoon,Tempest - Apocalypse, Abadon are you'r things. To elaborate: 1. On maelstrom you need shield skills either way so ... no good, 2. from this 4 bs's (all armor tanked) only Abadon doesnt worth put a Remote Armor repaier, in the rest you can go Typhoon, Tempest 2 RR, Apoc 1. 3. Try to go Amar-Minnie BS skill at lvl 4, then train for T2 AC's(utocanons) and T2 Beams, after either train BS at lvl 5 or Arty - Tachyons at T2, still this skills you HAVE to train. Apoc is a supreme short medium range BS - with Scorch-Beams you have a optimal of 61 km (max skilled) and with good skills it's cap stable at 45%(without RR and MWD) On big fleets in 0.0 with you'r 3 mil SP you will be better in a Interdictor (moustly paid from alliances wallets) For empire wars rr BS's are kings
Ghost Nightmare Red Federation RvB - RED Federation	Posted - 2011.05.10 14:11:00 - [13] Abaddon and Maelstrom excel at station games. Abaddon can have insane EHP and still deal over 1000 DPS Maelstrom can have insane active shield tank and deal over 1200 dps. I'm inclined to say if I fit my Maelstrom like I fit my Nightmare, it would outclass it. It takes alot of firepower to drop an Abaddon or a Maelstrom, in my opinion the Abaddon is better, since it handles extreme DPS better, with the Maelstrom once you are past its tanking threshold it will melt.
Darth 'Revan	Posted - 2011.05.10 19:37:00 - [14] Originally by: Duchess Starbuckington Quote: 1) From what I understand the Abaddon and Maelstrom are not very good PvP ships. Is this true? Under what circumstances is this not true? If this isn't a troll, I'd really love to know where you heard this rubbish. Sadly I am not a troll, just a nub. My alliance leader himself told me that they were bad, with over 5 years under his belt. But, I think he already knew I was a new-ish player and would likely be doing solo PvP more often. I also think he was just trying to get me to use the Geddon like most others in their BS fleet.
Darth 'Revan	Posted - 2011.05.10 19:40:00 - [15] Originally by: Azhpol I just have to ask... How is it possible for a char with only 3mil SP to fly both amarr and minmatar battlecruisers? I call troll, but a decent one. I can't yet fly Minmatar BSs, but I can fly up to tier 3 Caldari BSs and Tier 3 Amarr BSs. That doesn't mean I can fly them well though. It is possible because most of my skill points are allocated in Spaceship Command and Gunnery I think.
Darth 'Revan	Posted - 2011.05.10 19:42:00 - [16] Alright so far most of you seem to be saying that the Abby and Mael are good PvP ships, just not for soloing. Right? Also, thanks for the fit suggestions, if anyone else has more to add please do.
Telvani Crouching Woman Hidden Cucumber	Posted - 2011.05.10 22:56:00 - [17] BS arn't great for solo, if you have to domi/phoon is the way to go Mael is one of the best active tanking BS in game, and without a doubt the best T1 1000-3000 DPS tank while dealing 1.2K with good projection and damage selection. Baddon is one of the best fleet BS in game, if not THE best, over 200k eHP while dealing close to 1000 in a close range fit, with good RR efficiency due to high resists. So yes they are good PVP BS, I'd go as far as saying both in the top 5, only issue is both lacking a heavy neut, further reducing solo effectiveness.
Patty Patrick Patterson	Posted - 2011.05.10 23:00:00 - [18] I have to change my initial rating, since you managed to completely dupe most of the morons in this thread. 6/10 Not very convincing, but you got legit replies
Darth 'Revan	Posted - 2011.05.11 01:37:00 - [19] Originally by: Patty Patrick Patterson I have to change my initial rating, since you managed to completely dupe most of the morons in this thread. 6/10 Not very convincing, but you got legit replies Okay, I'm only going to acknowledge you this once. Especially since I suspect you are simply trying to troll me. I am a noob. If you really don't believe it go look up my character name in the people/places thing and look at my character age. Only been playing for about 3 months. If you really don't believe it fine, and if you are just trying to troll me just leave.
Force Kon	Posted - 2011.05.11 04:06:00 - [20] To the OP, the first post actually had some degree of constructive advice tho he failed to explain it properly and this reply was what he probably should have said. Originally by: Vile Coyote To the OP, your questions are a bit vague. Looks like you're browsing for a ship that looks good, then looking at its characteristic. Try the other way around : define what you need and find the best ship for it. Also with 3M SP just forget about the Typhoon, and be aware that any BS requires solid support skills to work. Your question(s) cover too much ground for possible debate here to effectively answer any or all of them at the same time. The problem with inexperience is the lack of knowlege of game mechanics. Dont think of ships as a complete entitiy, they are merely a platform for your modules. Learn the mechanics of the game and how the modules work, what modules are availble and everything will be much clearly to you. If someone tells you "Typhoon is good in pvp" its like the old saying "Give a man a fish..." Just because battleships are the biggest non capital ship you should assume you should set your goal on one as early as possible. Hopefully you will be part of a fleet and its strong fleet compositions that win fights, not idividuals. A 100 dps battleship is useless against a 400 dps hurricane.

Tosser Galore	Posted - 2011.05.11 07:01:00 - [21] . GREAT pvp ships, tank and melt. Abaddon shines and the maelstrom is just a lethal heap of garbage (with solar sails) and mad shield tank. Train to use the ships well not just to get into the seat... Don't ever try to sit in a pvp maelstrom, unless you have maxed out active shield (and passive) tanking and winmatar bs to V Of course you will need a couple mil in drones also, for both ships. Baddon likewise is very skill intensive. Amarr takes lot of SP to really shine (lol pun) Else you will be gimped. 'DISCLAIMER. People who will post in thread saying you will do fine in a BS with sup par (or below skills).
Lady Go Diveher	Posted - 2011.05.11 12:00:00 - [22] I've undocked my Maelstrom against a station camping cane / cane / Megathron camping force, before. Took out the Mega and couldn't quite cycle my dissy down quick enough to point one of the cane's before it ran like a ***. All the while, deliberately holding my shields at around 25% to toy with them. It's a ing beast of a T1 ship. The only proper T1 counter is alpha strikes ... and guess which ship excels at that? The abaddon ... also win, and looks like sex. If you're not a giant troll, then your leader is a frikking idiot. Leave whatever half-**ed PVP group you're with and go learn it properly. No-one with 3mil SP should be near thinking about PVP battleships. Can you even T2 your cane, yet? Fake edit: Your corp killboard is proof positive that you're with a bunch of fail. Get out, or become it. I'm actually being cruel to be kind.
Swynet	Posted - 2011.05.11 13:18:00 - [23] Originally by: Patty Patrick Patterson -1/10
Darth 'Revan	Posted - 2011.05.11 19:53:00 - [24] Originally by: Lady Go Diveher I've undocked my Maelstrom against a station camping cane / cane / Megathron camping force, before. Took out the Mega and couldn't quite cycle my dissy down quick enough to point one of the cane's before it ran like a ***. All the while, deliberately holding my shields at around 25% to toy with them. It's a ing beast of a T1 ship. The only proper T1 counter is alpha strikes ... and guess which ship excels at that? The abaddon ... also win, and looks like sex. If you're not a giant troll, then your leader is a frikking idiot. Leave whatever half-**ed PVP group you're with and go learn it properly. No-one with 3mil SP should be near thinking about PVP battleships. Can you even T2 your cane, yet? Fake edit: Your corp killboard is proof positive that you're with a bunch of fail. Get out, or become it. I'm actually being cruel to be kind. I can T2 my cane, almost entirely just finishing up now. Also, MY CORP is fail-ish. I said my alliance leader told me this, and his corp has amazing stats. Like I said, in his defense, I think my alliance leader was simply trying to get me to use the geddon. Plus he knows I am a nub so likely thought I'd be soloing or something. AND IF YOU READ MY FIRST POST I intend to just keep flying my Hurricane. I'm only CURIOUS about these BSs. I do appreciate your post though.
Azhpol Gallente Casa Del Wombat	Posted - 2011.05.12 07:44:00 - [25] Ok, I'll revise my call of troll. But if you get into any BS with 3mil sp and someone locks you, your toast, period. Don't even think about BS til you can fly your cane in any configuration that might get called for, or that you think might be effective/fun to fly. I made the mistake of thinking that solid BC skills = solid BS skills when I was around your total SP worth, and thought I was pwn moving from a myrm to a domi, but in the end, my myrm was out performing the domi in every area, even tank, because BS need crazy high skills. Side note, for 0.0, in its current form, you want maels or scorps as most useful BS. They seem to be the most consistently welcome in large fleet actions, and smaller fleets usually seem to be BCs or AHACS. Seems to be the smaller the fleet, the smaller the hull you want to be in, so get you a AF or inty and join you some 10-20 man roams. By the time you remember that there is more to do than run around in those small groups your skills should have improved enough that your options are HUGE! Well, bigger anyway ----------------------------------------------- I don't post on an alt, I post on my forum main!
Dark Voynix Gallente Garoun Investment Bank	Posted - 2011.05.12 09:08:00 - [26] Edited by: Dark Voynix on 12/05/2011 09:12:23 honestly, when i had 3m sp decided to move from frigates to cruisers and you are already in hurricane and looking for bs's? Any ship will be crappy without shills ,and almost any ship need almost perfect core skills ( cap, fitting, tanking). Ill give you a non asked advice: stick into hurricane untill your core and tank skills are perfect and until you can use t2 weapons and use complete t2 fitting. Those skills improve all ships you will ever use, no matter the size or race. Just after that look for other ships. btw back on topic, Bs's are quite well ballanced. Some of them are more all-rounded, some other have specific uses, but almost all of them have its uses. thoe ship you mentioned are good ships, but they can be better or worse than some other depending on situations. Do you mean solo pvp? small gang in low sec? large fleets in 0.0 ? camping station or what?
Dorn Val	Posted - 2011.05.12 12:45:00 - [27] I recently finished Large Energy Weapons 5 -trained it before I started training battleships and I've been in the game for over a year. You need to slow down...


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