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BigEdMan2
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Posted - 2005.02.05 18:57:00 -
[1]
Edited by: BigEdMan2 on 05/02/2005 18:58:03 Edited by: BigEdMan2 on 05/02/2005 18:57:24
New Skill ( Dual Training)
Hi all, What do you all think of the following suggestion? Lets see a Dual Training skill option added. This would allow anyone who has studied Dual Training to train in two skills at one time.
This would allow for faster training. But just like in the real world, you would suffer the effects of all-night studying.
Dual Training bonus: Train two skills at once. And get a + 1 to Intelligence for all nontraining related in game actions\interactions (while Dual Training).
Dual Training penalty: Suffer a -1 to Perception, Charisma, Memory for all nontraining related in game actions\interactions (while Dual Training).
With Dual Training you would select your training option as you normally would. But you could then select a second training option and select Dual Train to level X (xd xh xm xs).
The bonus/penalty balance could be tweaked for in game performance. Please post your feedback, Ed
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RollinDutchMasters
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Posted - 2005.02.05 19:01:00 -
[2]
.... You dont know that attributes affect NOTHING in game aside from your skill training?
Originally by: Sochin CCP has provided you with the tools you need to avoid crime. You're just too lazy/stupid to use them.
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Tisti
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Posted - 2005.02.05 19:03:00 -
[3]
Why not just give out Elite learning skills..
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Fever103
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Posted - 2005.02.05 19:54:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Tisti Why not just give out Elite learning skills..
Tisti, man - we already have enough Advanced Learning Skills. I mean it was pain in the ass to train them all to L4.
I see your point that Advanced Learning skill would be nice - so it would increase training time multiplier. But, Elite Memory, Intel etc., is not feasable IMo.
I think that at this time we have more significant issues then "Skill Training"
I do belive that Noobs must be allowed to train faster somehow - I dont know how - but EVE's Survival depends on it. So I am sure Devs will come up with some kind of a scheme to make it possible.
But, for older Players, I am not sure - I would love to have a really fast training - many a time I feel like time is a wasting when I train certain skills. i am still trying to get myself to train caldari BS to L5 it will take me almost 30 Days.
Support Dead Space Ownership Idea! |
BigEdMan2
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Posted - 2005.02.05 19:57:00 -
[5]
Edited by: BigEdMan2 on 05/02/2005 19:58:38
Originally by: Tisti Why not just give out Elite learning skills..
You seem to be missing the point. I'm not talking about giving anything out. Just a new training option. Your character should suffer some kind of efficiency penalty while dual training.
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Sheraad
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Posted - 2005.02.06 02:21:00 -
[6]
If you want to train stuff faster, just ask to that all training receive a flat, across-the-board speed increase.
If you propose that training two skills simultaneously would give you fewer sp/hour overall, then why the absolute hell would anyone ever do it?
The only use I can imagine for being able to split your sp/hour over simultaneous skills is for going on holiday and being absolute dead-set on training several short skills instead of one long one.
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DrunkMiner
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Posted - 2005.02.06 18:44:00 -
[7]
instead of playing with attributes it should just effect skill training time aka default training time is 1.0, but you would have to split that so 2 skills running at 0.5 taking twice as long as they would normally take.
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Question2
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Posted - 2005.02.07 01:25:00 -
[8]
Which would mean that you would get the exact same training time as if you just trained one skill...
FACT : CCP will do ANYTHING,yes even kill babies,to make you spend more time on eve.
Leanring 2 skills at once = less time players need to play eve to get better,thus,CCP wont do it.
If CCP could make us keep playing eve even if a level 1 rank 1 skill would take a month to train,they would GLADLY make it take a month to train.
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Apollokiev
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Posted - 2005.02.07 01:38:00 -
[9]
Meh I just got new skill Sort by Type finaly my items will be in order
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DrunkMiner
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Posted - 2005.02.07 12:28:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Question2 Which would mean that you would get the exact same training time as if you just trained one skill...
FACT : CCP will do ANYTHING,yes even kill babies,to make you spend more time on eve.
Leanring 2 skills at once = less time players need to play eve to get better,thus,CCP wont do it.
If CCP could make us keep playing eve even if a level 1 rank 1 skill would take a month to train,they would GLADLY make it take a month to train.
Dude you seem to have a missed the point of mine if you had read what i wrote you would understand its not a shorter time but infact a longer time by twice as much
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99thProphet
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Posted - 2005.02.07 22:54:00 -
[11]
Edited by: 99thProphet on 07/02/2005 23:06:28 Uhm, guys. Last time I checked the skills were represented by books. Being that people cannot read two books at one time, this would be quite difficult. Also, in order to train two charactors at the same you must pay for two accounts. This is most likely because of the offline training feature which their machines keep track of. I would think this would have some kind of effect with the eve population growing. With creating an adittional account you are financing server time...
aahhh enough with the babble! Ofcourse it would be nice but it will never happen.
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Jalia Kovac
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Posted - 2005.02.07 23:28:00 -
[12]
Originally by: DrunkMiner Dude you seem to have a missed the point of mine if you had read what i wrote you would understand its not a shorter time but infact a longer time by twice as much
But what's the point? You'd wait for the time taken to train two skills before you received any benefits to either of them.
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BlueSmok
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Posted - 2005.02.08 00:18:00 -
[13]
I can see this idea working, if you were penalized 50% of stats for dual training. But I doubt many would use it, unless you want to set a really long long skill training time and take six months off to get batteship skill to 5 and scrapmetal processing to 5 at the same time...
*Laws to suppress tend to strengthen what they would prohibit. This is the fine point on which all the legal professions of history have based their job security. Bene Gesserit Coda |
StarDragon
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Posted - 2005.02.08 08:18:00 -
[14]
I think it sounds like a real cool idea just to think of the penalty's etc...
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Tisti
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Posted - 2005.02.08 09:38:00 -
[15]
Well.. Just so you know.. Thats what boosters are ment to do..(not ingame yet) So there will be no such skill
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Captain Tycho
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Posted - 2005.02.08 18:00:00 -
[16]
Originally by: DrunkMiner
Originally by: Question2 Which would mean that you would get the exact same training time as if you just trained one skill...
FACT : CCP will do ANYTHING,yes even kill babies,to make you spend more time on eve.
Leanring 2 skills at once = less time players need to play eve to get better,thus,CCP wont do it.
If CCP could make us keep playing eve even if a level 1 rank 1 skill would take a month to train,they would GLADLY make it take a month to train.
Dude you seem to have a missed the point of mine if you had read what i wrote you would understand its not a shorter time but infact a longer time by twice as much
yes but some one might train 2 30day skills which would take 60days so the guy could stop his sub for 2 months so CCP wont make as much money
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Vigilant
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Posted - 2005.02.08 22:27:00 -
[17]
Well...I guess I will say it... If ya want to train to Skills....do like most...Buy another Account...Yeah it sucks...I know, cause I have Two....but its the only way...
And CCP loves us for it...
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Lucian Alucard
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Posted - 2005.02.09 01:40:00 -
[18]
if you require having the advance learning skills for memory and Intel at 4 as well as learning 5 and an Advanced Learning skill in there that lowers training time by another 2% per trained level at 5 befor this skill is then sure. But the penalty should be a 30% increase in training time for any two skills to be trained at the same time.
Please stop being a third rate flamer,I am tired of reactivating my account just to kick your ass. |
Evisicator
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Posted - 2005.02.09 04:42:00 -
[19]
Why are you guys so dead bent on some plenalty?
I mean there is no other skill in game that has negatives effects for having/learning them.
Why not just have the preqs. the nice insane ALL learning skill lvl 5. that way you have donated like 2-3 months or more depending on if you just trained ALL learning skills to lvl 5 before learning anything else, before yoou could get dual training.
I'm sorry but I can learn more than 2 things at a time and retain knowledge without any plenaties so why can't my fictional character.
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Mephistophilus
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Posted - 2005.02.09 11:35:00 -
[20]
ffs NO!
noobs get a bonus already with the advance learning they are able to do things alot sooner than all the old time players did
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Missa
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Posted - 2005.02.09 15:59:00 -
[21]
Dual training would = dual EXP gain in any other RPG. ..I trust you can understand how it would be impossible to balance out a skill like this unless it was in some way worse than single skill training. If you say could only train each of the 2 skills at 40% the speed of training 1 skill then maybe we would be starting somewhere with a balance. --Missa New Siggy to Come Soon(tm) |
Steven Dynahir
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Posted - 2005.02.11 09:20:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Steven Dynahir on 11/02/2005 09:20:22 Hmm..
Dual Training
Allows training of two skills simultaneously. Penalty for training two skills simultaneously is -30% skill point generation loss.
Each level of Dual Training reduces penalty by 25%.
SigPl/HQ&Log Coy/MNB(C)/KFOR |
Talos Munjab
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Posted - 2005.02.11 13:35:00 -
[23]
if your going to ask for a new traing skill how about this. skill linking
required skills learning lv5 one attribute skill to lv5
lv1 allows the linking of 2 lv1 skills together lv2 allows the linking of 2 lv3 of lower skills to be linked lv3 " " lv5 or lower lv4 " lv8 or lower lv5 any lv skills
the skill allows you to train 2 skills either in parrallel at half speed or one after the other at normal speed, personally i like the second one. your thoughts?
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Ithildin
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Posted - 2005.02.11 13:58:00 -
[24]
Or... here's a better and less complicated idea:
Primary skill training: 70% Secondary skill training: 30%
No skill required. No skill point loss. No skill point gain/exploit. Easier to customize when you want a skill to be complete. For instance: Primary: Shield Operations level 4 ; 1 day, 1 hour, and 10 minutes Secondary: Caldari Battleship level 5 ; 56 days, 2 hours, 34 minutes, and 1 second
Or: Primary: Engineering level 5 ; 2 days, 7 hours, 14 minutes, and 4 seconds Secondary: Engineering level 5 ; 2 days, 7 hours, 14 minutes, and 4 seconds --
If TC causes you discomfort that you feel is unwarranted or may be outside TC's current contract - contact me, please. |
Question2
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Posted - 2005.02.11 17:17:00 -
[25]
Fact : Anything that will make us learn skills faster is not going in,unless CCP can find a way to make the time investment effective only if you plan on playing for like,3 years after that.Which is precisely what adv learning 5 is already.CCP cant go any further withojut making it 10+ years to regain your time investment.
More time spent training skills = more cash CCP makes,hence,anything that lessens it is bad for CCP.
Anything that allows you to train 2 skills at once,etc,etc and in the end has the exact same time as currently training them right after another wont do anything.Seriously.
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Talos Munjab
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Posted - 2005.02.12 02:27:00 -
[26]
yes but with my idea your not gaining any time, your not losing any either your just allowing ppl to be able to link 2 skills so that over night training of the shorter skills is easier. all the proposels i have seen do not take the lv system into account.
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ollobrains
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Posted - 2005.02.12 10:47:00 -
[27]
then what is needed is more intermediate expansions of the middle ranking skills - perhaps new categories dunno what but something to give the middle of the game more meat.
I ntoed they are going to make changes to heavy weapons / perhaps the skills could be expaned there or with this dual skills idea how about dual implants ? or implant upgrades that act like skills expansion ie 10 days for implant to become fully operational. Or implant learning ie buy implant that when you sleep teaches you a skill - could cover the dual skill learning issue by making it a time realise aspect ?
Just some bridging ideas to throw around
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Jalia Kovac
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Posted - 2005.02.13 00:50:00 -
[28]
Okay, does this sum up the current theories here?
Train two skills simultaneously. Another advanced learning skill allows for additional secondary skill point accumulation.
Hard to stop exploitation. If a Dual Training skill allowed a 5% bonus per level from your primary training to be moved into a secondary train, it would be easy to train skills with your best stat combinations in primary and your worst always in secondary.
Considerable amount of code rewriting and very thorough testing needed to implement.
Any two skill training system allows the possibility to double the amount of time a player can suspend an account and not have to pay to train. This benefits CCP how? Can't see this happening kids.
Train two skills simultaneously with skillpoints divided arbitrarily between them both. No penalty to skill point accumulation.
The benefit is what? That you can go away and not play EVE for twice as long? The penalty of course is that you wait longer for either skill to complete so you don't even get the usefulness of the first trained skill as early as you would have by training one skill alone. Crazy talk.
Train two skills simultaneously with skillpoints divided arbitrarily between them both. Penalty to overall skill point accumulation.
See above. Oh and add "this is pure insanity" to it.
Unless there's a actual bonus to overall skillpoint development involved in a dual training system, the whole thing looks ONLY like an exercise in being able to NOT play for longer while still training. I'm positive CCP don't want to encourage that and I'm hoping most players don't want that either.
Personally, I hate the idea of dual training. I guess that shows. The "I forgot how to use my drones but now I can suddenly use cruise missiles" approach to reshuffling skills also irks me.
I feel like the current skill system is pretty balanced. You get rewarded for mapping out a career path and following it over time. Those in the longest have the most skill points, read "experience". That's kind of like real life isn't it?
I also believe that the longer you play the more skill points you will have invested in skills that are less often used which also contributes to balance.
We can train offline. Isn't that a blessing in itself?
Newer players also have the benefit of being able to train Advanced Learning skills as soon as they are ready (and have the cash). This gives them a distinct advantage compared to the veterans.
No, you'll never catch the up to those who first signed up. Yes, you can gain parity because there's always a core set of skills you can focus on and be as good as them at (the number and levels of skills is finite after all). Yes, I think this is the way it should be. It strikes me as fair that those who took the greatest risk and have invested the most time and money by playing from the early days of EVE *should* be rewarded for their efforts.
Oh, and although I was involved late in the beta my character is not a veteran. I have six months in.
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Amaron Ghant
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Posted - 2005.02.13 11:40:00 -
[29]
It's fine the way it is. One of the few areas of Eve i'll ever say that about.
Roids are a Menece I tell you, hunt then down I say, hunt them down!!
Amaron Ghant the Mad Caldari Miner |
Celestiana
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Posted - 2005.02.17 22:26:00 -
[30]
Why not just implement skill queuing? That way you can train your 2 noob skills overnight without having to get up @ 3am?
I would love to put 2-3 skills in a queue before leaving on holiday.
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